EPTBaneling Detonation Logic - Page 5
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Chriamon
United States886 Posts
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HyDRa
Sweden70 Posts
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Atnas
Sweden38 Posts
Anyway, I've used this and it has helped, but the best way to counter it seems to be stimpaks. This makes all of the units run like hell (even quicker or just as quick as upgraded banelings) and thus kite them, especially with marauders slowing. It's not perfect, but it's absolutely doable. My banelings were even on creep but couldn't do much about it- and my hydras, even on creep, couldn't catch up quick enough to make the moust of the "free hits". Perhaps if I had used them to flank it would've worked better, but it's tough to hide so many banelings! | ||
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YKK
United States13 Posts
On May 10 2010 12:31 codewarrior wrote: I just checked this out again. All zerg ground units can have "unburrow" on autocast (with the exception of Drones and Infestors). They will automatically unburrow when an enemy unit or building comes into attack range. Each unit remembers its "auto-unburrow" setting for its entire lifetime. Setting your Roaches to auto-unburrow interferes a tiny bit with burrowed movement: when you stop giving them movement commands while burrowed, they'll pop out if anything hostile is nearby. Whoa, I'm so glad I checked this thread again! Thanks man! I'm definitely going to play around with burrowing a lot more! | ||
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omninmo
2349 Posts
On May 09 2010 22:42 TheGreenMachine wrote: Yep just tested, banelings who are told to move will explode on death doing the same damage they would normally do. Definitely changing the way im handling banelings. Awesome thread! great OP.. and to the guy i quoted are you a reference to the Tairy Greene Machine? If so I applaud. | ||
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SiegeFlank
United States410 Posts
Banelings certainly make bio ball a hard unit comp to play, but I wouldn't call them overpowered yet. Terran just has to be really good at conrolling his army and being absolutely certain that his marines are shielded by his marauders (using natural walls from terrain or structures helps a lot with this too). If you can at least take out the banelings, your marines can generally clean up whatever zerg has left. I also find that tanks are very useful in the midgame against banelings, because you can detonate them long before they reach your army. | ||
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Blacklizard
United States1194 Posts
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puril
United States43 Posts
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Chrion
United States31 Posts
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chiss
Australia27 Posts
Just to add a little bit. Many Terrans say this is 'overpowered'. No, this is not overpowered, this is just strong against Bio. No one is forcing you to build MMM. The biggest reason this is so powerful is because SC2 promotes being lazy with control groups, and virtually every Terran puts everything into one control group. If you were to split your armies into 2 smaller groups of Marauders and 3 smaller groups of Marines. You would be able to counter Banelings FAR more effectively. It turns into the 2 Marines, 1 Zealot kiting game. | ||
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JaspluR
Australia174 Posts
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Quesadilla
United States1814 Posts
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slowmanrunning
Canada285 Posts
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Hasudk
Denmark78 Posts
Now, I'm not saying Burrow is useless, because it's certainly not. However, I am suggesting that you NEVER Detonate while Burrowed. I dont have access to the beta myself, but it seems that you are missing a key point here. If you unburrow something like 4 or 5 banelings in the middle of a MM cluster, the banelings will push the MM's away to make room for themselves (like forcefields do). So now splash will hit fewer units because the units are only surrounding the banelings instead of also being on top of them. An ugly attempt at an illustration X = Baneling O = MM Burrowed OOO OOO OOO Unburrowd OOO OXOO OOO When the baneling is burrowed it will hit all 9 MMs, but when it is unburrowed, one of the MM is pushed to the side, and therefor wont get hit by the splash. So detonating banelings while burrowed CAN THEORETICALLY be more cost effective, if you are can figure out how many it takes to kill the target and not detonate anymore than that. Of course this might not always be possible in the real world. =) | ||
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Lighioana
Norway466 Posts
On May 10 2010 12:36 On_Slaught wrote: As a terran I must say I do not approve of this thread... LOL I'm sorry for but MMM shouldn't be the magic bullet that works every time. And since when you're supposed to require no micro? | ||
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chiss
Australia27 Posts
On May 11 2010 17:57 Hasudk wrote: I dont have access to the beta myself, but it seems that you are missing a key point here. If you unburrow something like 4 or 5 banelings in the middle of a MM cluster, the banelings will push the MM's away to make room for themselves (like forcefields do). So now splash will hit fewer units because the units are only surrounding the banelings instead of also being on top of them. An ugly attempt at an illustration X = Baneling O = MM Burrowed OOO OOO OOO Unburrowd OOO OXOO OOO When the baneling is burrowed it will hit all 9 MMs, but when it is unburrowed, one of the MM is pushed to the side, and therefor wont get hit by the splash. So detonating banelings while burrowed CAN THEORETICALLY be more cost effective, if you are can figure out how many it takes to kill the target and not detonate anymore than that. Of course this might not always be possible in the real world. =) You bring a good point, but infact this is not the case. I will talk about the Motherships Temporal Rift or whatever its called, to explain why. Imagine my opponent is Protoss and creates a Black Holey Rift thing with his Mothership, but for some reason accidently places it on his group of 10 Zealots. And then accidently runs another 50 Zealot into it. If i move FIVE Banelings into the Rift, as soon as the Rift is over, EVERY SINGLE ZEALOT WILL DIE. Why? Because units 'unstacking' is not instant, and for a split second, all 60 Zealots and 5 Banelings are EXACTLY ontop of each other, and in this moment, Banelings will all Detonate automatically. The same thing happens when unburrowing. | ||
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willeesmalls
United States477 Posts
Any move u make to draw baneling fire is so obvious the zerg will move past it. It really doesn't matter how many groups u separate your army into. If the banelings explode next to a control group of infantry units they've done their job. Try stimming and kiting against fungal growth and creep speed. Best bet is probably to position siege units well to snipe banelings, but If they're too close to your units you eat the damage anyway. Edit: What are the alternatives to bio? Banshee/raven? Thor/hellion? Hellion are light too, so if 3 banelings manage to get in you lose a clump of hellions. | ||
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Chrion
United States31 Posts
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Hasudk
Denmark78 Posts
You bring a good point, but infact this is not the case. I will talk about the Motherships Temporal Rift or whatever its called, to explain why. Imagine my opponent is Protoss and creates a Black Holey Rift thing with his Mothership, but for some reason accidently places it on his group of 10 Zealots. And then accidently runs another 50 Zealot into it. If i move FIVE Banelings into the Rift, as soon as the Rift is over, EVERY SINGLE ZEALOT WILL DIE. Why? Because units 'unstacking' is not instant, and for a split second, all 60 Zealots and 5 Banelings are EXACTLY ontop of each other, and in this moment, Banelings will all Detonate automatically. The same thing happens when unburrowing. =) I see. I stand corrected then. Guess that's what happens when you can't actually test your theories. /gief beta or release. =) | ||
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Ceadless
Korea (South)12 Posts
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