Made a video trying to make mutas stack and moving shot etc. I didn't get into using patrol or hold or stop. Mostly just attack and move.
(window mode and low graphics settings)
It's not the same but still somewhat achievable. Things I noticed: -They will stack up really well when you spam click within 2-3 muta distance away, doesn't make a difference if you have a lord grouped or use a mineral patch to stack as far as I could tell.
-They stop when they shoot. There were times (and you can see in the video) where I seemed to shorten this stop and do a somewhat moving shot, but it's still an obvious deceleration.
-Mutas seem to fire more easily when clumped (not stacked on top of each other) when compared to BW.
-The old way of clicking passed a unit and then clicking it really fast doesn't seem to work anymore.
-When you click them outside of the 2-3 muta range, they spread apart really fast.
-What I found to work better was to spam click really close to the group and keep the movements and attacks within that range, very hard to do and get used to. Takes even more intensive focused micro than ever before.
Yeah that's the game on low look so unpolished. Muta stacking in the game is iffy i haven't messed with it yet but i don't see too much benefit in tiring to get them stacked like that the power in sc1 of muta stacking is the ability to 1 or 2 shot a unit essentially snipe off units taking minimal dmg i don't see that happening currently.
On February 18 2010 23:37 beetlelisk wrote: Have you tried checking if there are any magic boxes? Do units always clump or do they sometimes keep a formation?
What is that circle of blue triangles btw? It shows up once you add something to your mutas group (1:45)
that is the sensor tower's range. I guess you can see your enemies sensor towers in the fog of war (so they are not super cheap)
I could not for the life of me get muta stacking working properly or just basic effective hit and run tactics. So far, they handle completely different from original SC and have been almost %95 useless every situation I make them, they're way too expensive for their effectiveness. It's funny how in zvz in sc2 if my opponent goes muta I auto win, hydralisks are such a hard counter it's not even funny.
EDIT: Watched the video by charlie murphy, and they handle as bad as they look, a big ineffective mess that constantly splits up. Hopefully blizzard gets in on this, otherwise I can easily see mutas going the way of the scout, without any special abilities or the ability to morph into something new they are outclassed by too many other units.
i noticed that if you stack them by mass clicking and then shift queue movement, they dont spread out as much, maybe someone can figure out an efficient way to utilize this?
Mutas are pretty good if you super fast tech to them versus protoss.
in 1:1 ratios mutas can take stalkers down canons seem to shoot slower and shields work differently now too, so they die faster.
Been a couple games now where I just harrass the shit out of protoss who just expanded, while i'm expanding and teching hydra and expanding again.
It's a whole lot easier chasing down probes or zeals and hitting them while they run, its like the mutas predict they will stop when they shoot so they get right over or in front of the unit they are gonna hit so they don't stop and not shoot like in BW. < did that make sense?
That wasn't very pleasant to watch, they've kind of lost their elegance when they dance around. I really do wonder if there is anything Blizzard can do about this problem, they said they had to break the engine last time heard. They tend to split up a lot in this build, and it looks like a task just to keep them together.
It definitely seems like there's a 1 second delay with every click similar to when you try to muta micro in BW on bnet. So maybe that's why it doesn't work the same way?
On February 20 2010 18:21 CharlieMurphy wrote: in 1:1 ratios mutas can take stalkers down canons seem to shoot slower and shields work differently now too, so they die faster.
Cannons die faster? they have +25 shields, +25 hp and +1 armor. They die quite a bit slower. The shield change is simply that shields no longer take bonus damage from everything, which doesn't matter at all in this case.
ok the first step is to figure out if you can follow a unit and shoot at it without decelerating. If that can't be done, then you can bet muta micro won't be possible. If it is possible on the other hand, we have hope =)
Altho I'm not sure it'd be good to have such a super unit in a game. The only reason mutas aren't imbalanced in BroodWar is the fact that you can only effectively use 11 of them at a time...
On February 20 2010 18:02 alffla wrote: wtf its crazy how fast buildings die in sc2 llol like 12 mutalisks can just take down all those buildings in a few seconds -.-
yeah but getting 12 mutas out now takes far longer and requires a much more econ heavy build cus of the higher geysir count you need and thus leaves you wide open for getting stomped while you tech to them.
On February 20 2010 18:21 CharlieMurphy wrote: Mutas are pretty good if you super fast tech to them versus protoss.
in 1:1 ratios mutas can take stalkers down canons seem to shoot slower and shields work differently now too, so they die faster.
Been a couple games now where I just harrass the shit out of protoss who just expanded, while i'm expanding and teching hydra and expanding again.
It's a whole lot easier chasing down probes or zeals and hitting them while they run, its like the mutas predict they will stop when they shoot so they get right over or in front of the unit they are gonna hit so they don't stop and not shoot like in BW. < did that make sense?
yes it did.
So far I gotta say I'm pretty disappointed about micro in general in sc2, seems like MBS, automining and macro were not the things to be worried about.
Damn after watching that video my thought was that mutas from bw had a better attack/move than sc2. i hope im wrong and sc2 meets my expectations,i wanna play it so badly.
EPT
