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On October 21 2014 21:36 Big J wrote:
@Other: Added a screenshot for ZvZ walling. In that version you don't need a creep tumor, though it takes some time until the creep reaches everywhere. Also parts of the wall can easily be rearranged differently and you can put queens/spine in it instead. Just wanted to show that you can full wall if you really want/need to with only 3buildings. (same goes for other races as well)
Thank you for thinking of ZvZ d:
As long as the creep reaches the choke it's fine, you can always place a tumor instead of inject if you want to reach it faster, it's when you have to place a tumor to even have a chance to reach the choke that it's problematic. It's nice to be able to do an emergency wall too
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Played the map once vs a clanmate, seems pretty solid, although the terrain is a big confusing. the main problem I see is that the 3rd is still pretty hard to take. There are just too many paths that you can be attacked from, so either make the high ground 3rd closer to the nat, or make the other base choker.
The second thing which is problematic is the main mineral line. it does not have any spaces in between, only on the sides, which is annoying in PvT since normally you wall both sides of the mineral line to limit reaper mobility in your base, but by doing so on this map you make for a perfect dropping spot. I don't think it's super important, but also there is no real reason for it to be different from the standard.
Replay if you want: http://drop.sc/387748
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On October 22 2014 00:06 moskonia wrote:Played the map once vs a clanmate, seems pretty solid, although the terrain is a big confusing. the main problem I see is that the 3rd is still pretty hard to take. There are just too many paths that you can be attacked from, so either make the high ground 3rd closer to the nat, or make the other base choker. The second thing which is problematic is the main mineral line. it does not have any spaces in between, only on the sides, which is annoying in PvT since normally you wall both sides of the mineral line to limit reaper mobility in your base, but by doing so on this map you make for a perfect dropping spot. I don't think it's super important, but also there is no real reason for it to be different from the standard. Replay if you want: http://drop.sc/387748
Thanks a lot. I'll be fixing both!
But not today, changing the side-third bases is going to take quite some effort. (uff)
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The base layout has similarities to Cloud Kingdom, but the attack paths are very different.
Expanding past the natural seems quite difficult, let alone getting up to 4+ bases.
I like the hill just in front of the natural's opening, but it needs a lot of testing. I am not sure if that hill is to give defenders or attackers the advantage, as I can theorize it going both ways.
For example, I can see tanks sieged up behind the hill being a huge pain for zergs.
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Big update to the side 3rd base:
- it has moved closer to the naturals
- mineral line repositioned to emphasize that effect
- offensive ramps leading up to these bases changed from 4x to 3x
- defensive ramps leading up to these bases changed from 3x to 2x
- the 4oc & 10oc bases have been moved closer to these third bases
Fixed the main mineral line.
The aggressive 3rd base has been moved a hex closer to the natural
Change overview
+ Show Spoiler +
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Can you safely park an overlord in the air space between main and natural?
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On October 22 2014 19:56 OtherWorld wrote:
Can you safely park an overlord in the air space between main and natural?
No. In general the distance has to be treated a bit like a 4p map. An overlord cannot safely reach the hiding spot over the natural because it takes like 3:30 to get there and 3:15 is when the first marine pops from a 1rax. (most maps do like 3:00 I think). But then again, that also makes it a little safer against 2rax due to the distance. 
What you can do is park the overlord behind the main base, if you get there, like against reaper play. Maybe I should alter the spot with the natural, so that you can watch drone counts in ZvZ. Good food for thought!
Edit: What do you think of this:
A building to hide your overlord above that is reachable in 3:15 and allows your overlord a retreat in front of the natural if a marine is out and about. While the more popular CC first and reaper first still allow you to reach the hiding spot at the natural from there on.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/qka5I8n.jpg)
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On October 24 2014 04:39 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2014 19:56 OtherWorld wrote:
Can you safely park an overlord in the air space between main and natural? No. In general the distance has to be treated a bit like a 4p map. An overlord cannot safely reach the hiding spot over the natural because it takes like 3:30 to get there and 3:15 is when the first marine pops from a 1rax. (most maps do like 3:00 I think). But then again, that also makes it a little safer against 2rax due to the distance. What you can do is park the overlord behind the main base, if you get there, like against reaper play. Maybe I should alter the spot with the natural, so that you can watch drone counts in ZvZ. Good food for thought!
Yeah it's always good to have the ability to park an overlord there. I was mainly thinking about ZvZ where the marine problem doesn't happen, although 3:30 may also be considered problematic in ZvP to scout the kind of expand with the overlord. Not a big deal though, you can always drone scout if you really want the intel.
edit : just saw your edit, can you really park an ovie there? It seems tiny, but if you actually can, then yes it's a pretty nice addition I think (and you did it in a very aesthetical way too)
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On October 24 2014 04:48 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2014 04:39 Big J wrote:On October 22 2014 19:56 OtherWorld wrote:
Can you safely park an overlord in the air space between main and natural? No. In general the distance has to be treated a bit like a 4p map. An overlord cannot safely reach the hiding spot over the natural because it takes like 3:30 to get there and 3:15 is when the first marine pops from a 1rax. (most maps do like 3:00 I think). But then again, that also makes it a little safer against 2rax due to the distance. What you can do is park the overlord behind the main base, if you get there, like against reaper play. Maybe I should alter the spot with the natural, so that you can watch drone counts in ZvZ. Good food for thought! Yeah it's always good to have the ability to park an overlord there. I was mainly thinking about ZvZ where the marine problem doesn't happen, although 3:30 may also be considered problematic in ZvP to scout the kind of expand with the overlord. Not a big deal though, you can always drone scout if you really want the intel. edit : just saw your edit, can you really park an ovie there? It seems tiny, but if you actually can, then yes it's a pretty nice addition I think (and you did it in a very aesthetical way too)
There's regular Terrain beneath it, I just hide it with a Doodad.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/IW9rKg7.jpg)
The thing with sending the first Overlord is that the map just behaves a little bit like a 3p map in that regard. Still better, because the first Overlord still reaches the natural way before a second overlord reaches "the other base" you scout if the first one doesn't find the opponent. But yeah, you either drone scout extra, or play blind for a little bit in any matchup.
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wooow this rules, good changes.
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Why dont you like the North? No grass on the North side.
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did you put one little blood splat next to the statue? =D
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On October 24 2014 15:13 Hexe wrote:
Why dont you like the North? No grass on the North side.
They didn't want to copy the South and having a huge square plaza sounded more epic than dirty nature!
On October 24 2014 19:13 Isarios wrote:
did you put one little blood splat next to the statue? =D
You are probably looking at one of the two red birds that circle above the statue. The green in the South has blue birds. They aren't very easy to identify in those static screenshots at that zoomlevel.
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Northern Ireland281 Posts
Hey man this is a beautiful map.. for me the city style maps always look awesome, but this one is very very nice indeed
I can't really comment on balance since my terrible platinum league brain justs tries to count how many tumours it'll take me to link my third, and then figure out which direction my roaches should shuffle, and thats about the end of it lol.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/0TDS0Th.jpg)
