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@patch
zealot pump is an issue in pvt. Well, I think it is an easy to execute strategy that is one part of why pvt is harder for terran in midgame. It crushes any terran who is not proficient. When that level of play on both sides get better, this might become the equivalent of 5 hatch hydra in broodwar pvz. It's a strong ever-present strategy that limits the crazy options terran has, This makes it a little stronger: you might have to build 2 instead of 3 more gateways to go from normal production to all 100% chronoboosted zealots.
In the early game I agree with the change. People almost always make stalkers just because they can control space as well as they really aren't that much weaker directly (as opposed to sc2 stalker lolol)
Infestor change is neat. Looks dead on the mark. Think about the casting value: "AND he's moving up to NEURAL he's MOVING UP he's MOVING UP *pop* *pew pew pew* OH MY GOD THE SNIPE ON THE INFESTORS"
scv cooldown, sure. It did feel like a long time.
Nerve jammer, sure. that actually makes more applicable, such as hugging your marines or a bunker with a nerve jammer versus lings or zealots(!). As always, in pvt if protoss blinks in during a charge (I think the blink in is pretty weak actually), you can nerve jammer (or emp) the stalkers.
psi storm ok. I keep getting the feeling hydras might be too fast with speed. They feel like stim maruaders with lower dps.
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On February 02 2013 03:07 Kabel wrote:
>>>New patch up on EU<<<
Protoss
Zealots build time has been reduced from 42 to 36 seconds. (It is 38 in normal SC2. But keep in mind that chrono boost is weaker now. Hopefully will early Zealots be more viable in both PvT, PvZ and PvP as a way to apply early pressure.)
No comment, need to see it in action.
Psi storm dmg incrased from 112 to 129. Cost 100 energy instead of 75. Amulett research has been added to the Templar Archives, which increases the starting energy for HT from 50 to 75. The reason for this is to make storm less spammy but more powerful.
Conceptually I am pleased by higher damage Storms.
Terran
Calldown SCV cooldown decreased from 60 to 50 seconds.
Good, this cooldown felt much too severe.
Nerve Jammer now affects enemy units only. (The energy cost is still at 125.)
I like this but I still think you're going to need a good way to differentiate them by player in TvT.
Vikings splash upgrade has been temporarily modified. It now works in a slightly different way. The reason for this is that I encountered some gameplay problems. I will discuss this with XiA and see if any possible solutions can come for the next patch.
Modified how? I guess I'll just have to check this one out in-game.
Zerg
Infestors can no longer cast Neural parasite while burrowed. To compensate for this, Infestors are "benign" for 1.5 seconds when they unburrow. This means that they are not auto-attacked by the enemy. There is a small window of time for a Infestor to unburrow near the enemy army and cast Fungal, Plague or Neural parasite without being hit. As usual, the Infestor will be benign while it is channeling Neural parasite. The reason for all this is that it was very easy to spam neural parasite. Move your army burrowed under your zerglings and hydras and cast neural on all enemy tanks. The enemy can not even focus fire the hidden Infestors.
*Sighs*. I really wish there had been a better way to do this. Perhaps give the Infestor collision while burrow-moving so other units can't stand on top of it to block target firing?
Zerg creep heals 1.5 Hp per second now when Zerg units are out of combat. (Earlier it was 2 HP per second)
Fair enough, a bonus is still a bonus.
Transfuse heal 75 HP instead of 100.
I like this number better for the energy cost, yeah.
Burrow research cost increased to 150/150 from 100/100. Zerg units can still move while burrowed.. (Not lurkers and banelings though)
I don't mind a slightly higher cost, but I think instead you might want to consider splitting burrow and burrow-movement into two separate researches and dropping burrow to Hatch tech. Now that HotS has Hatch tech burrow research, BOTH BW and SC2 have set a precedent for it that we no longer match up with. However Starbow does have the burrowed movement, which does factor in. But if we made that a second tier research that shows up "under" the burrow research at Lair (just like upgrades at the Evo Chamber) we could split the cost between them and allow players to have more options.
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This might actually make the infestor stronger. Move close to group of terran units, unburrow, cast plauge without being fired upon, burrow, GET OUT OF THERE!!!!
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Three decent replays with the new patch:
TvP http://drop.sc/301356
TvZ http://drop.sc/301357
PvZ http://drop.sc/301358
All three games raises concerns for me. -_-
@Laertes
That would be very appreciated! I will get a new update for the MOD up tomorrow since I missed a couple of things. I will also adjust a few things in the map files. Hopefully I will have time to do all that tomorrow. Otherwise I will send you everything on sunday!
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The Psi Storm change, we'll have to see, but not bad to try.
Infestor change. 
It'll be odd having infestors pop-up from underground but be ignored while other unburrowing units are not, but so long as you can focus fire on them as soon as they have unburrowed, it might be a fair way of handling the situation.
EDIT:On February 02 2013 05:48 Xiphias wrote:
This might actually make the infestor stronger. Move close to group of terran units, unburrow, cast plauge without being fired upon, burrow, GET OUT OF THERE!!!!
Oh goodness, yes! Well fungal too! Pre-plague, I can now unburrow, fungal (probably twice) and roll banelings into them.
They better not have manually clumped up their marines for neat movement.!
On February 02 2013 03:07 Kabel wrote:
Transfuse heal 75 HP instead of 100. Good, I always said it was strong enough at 75, healing slightly more over 50 energy than SC2 Transfusion does.
Zerg creep heals 1.5 Hp per second now when Zerg units are out of combat. (Earlier it was 2 HP per second)
O_O
So you DID have it at (or in fact ABOVE) the rate of protoss shield regeneration!!
Above it and now you are only dropping it to the same rate! I do not understand. Yes, it is only while on creep and out of battle for 10 seconds (clarify for me whether it is 10 seconds as with toss shields), while protoss do not need to be on creep, or near psi from pylons, but zerg also (very slowly) regenerate normally, so I think we can make do with less than 1.5.
I was expecting either 0.5625 per game second (twice the normal life regeneration rate for zerg; also the same rate as replenishing energy), or maybe 1 per second.
Blizz chose this (1 life per second) for HotS mutalisks. I haven't really seen it used but I wouldn't be surprised if they actually chose a good number on their first go for a change!
Still, I'm glad you went with just changing the rate, but don't be too disappointed if you find yourself dropping it further at some point! I'm fine with everyone trying this of course, I just expect you'll want to lower it again later.
Burrow research cost increased to 150/150 from 100/100. Zerg units can still move while burrowed.. (Not lurkers and banelings though)
Good! Everyone was complaining about this!!!!
*Shifty sideways glances*
>.>
<.<
>.>
No, I have no idea where this came from either. I like having burrow for that price again but I wonder if it'll be too cheap for burrowed movement, but I feel like making a separate upgrade for that would be boring and it would get ignored much more often then. If this change turns out to be too strong, please just revert the cost rather than considering separating burrowed movement from the technology.
Ha! I'll have to watch them now then, as I am too curious about it to resist!
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I'm going to emphasise now that Rift reeaally should use energy, as in the mid-late game, protoss can have so much energy on each nexus that they could definitely afford Rift costing at least 50 energy. It is so much easier to defend far off-bases by being able to use Rift, potentially as well as warp-ins, that the need for cannons is TOO low and the benefit from attempting to harass (so not a full-out attack) a toss base is marginal at best.
Apparently, terran (at least going mech) need another way to spend gas.
Nullifers and Void Shell mostly don't seem so good until you suddenly find them proving very useful and cost-efficient.
I at least think it's strong enough to stay, but I'm wondering if Nullifiers should cost more or have different costs. We need to keep an eye on it but it's hard to see from that replay because one player was already very far ahead.
Are those blind points (such as behind the mineral line and turrets at 5 and 11 o'clock) on the TvP map intentional?
Maybe (might just be better to make the third a bit closer, but without the rocks that would be quite close, no?), just maybe the third base should be as is but with weaker rocks/a different building. I suppose you don't want it too weak though so toss can go for the standard wall-offs there and worry about the rocks only later.
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I played last night and had a really good time. Thanks to everyone who chatted with me and played with me for showing me the ropes  . I am deeply confused by Blizzard's reluctance to trade the Colossus out and put the Reaver back in the game - I don't think I ever had as much fun in a WoL game as I did last night Reaver-dropping and using shuttles to micro Reavers in battle.
I did want to ask one thing about BlueStorm - is it intentional that Stalkers cannot path down the ramp into the center aisle from the natural? I asked and someone said that they thought Zealots and Stalkers should fit but not Archons.
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On February 02 2013 17:10 AmericanUmlaut wrote:I played last night and had a really good time. Thanks to everyone who chatted with me and played with me for showing me the ropes . I am deeply confused by Blizzard's reluctance to trade the Colossus out and put the Reaver back in the game - I don't think I ever had as much fun in a WoL game as I did last night Reaver-dropping and using shuttles to micro Reavers in battle. I did want to ask one thing about BlueStorm - is it intentional that Stalkers cannot path down the ramp into the center aisle from the natural? I asked and someone said that they thought Zealots and Stalkers should fit but not Archons.
Well in the original blue storm, zealots, marines and zerglings, and I believe vultures, but dragoons were not.
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- It looks like the miss percentage can occur downhill (seen in the PvZ, hydras attacking a nexus down a ramp), but you apparently saw this.
- Infested Creep says it improves the attack rate but it actually increases the damage.
I just thought I'd remind people (^_^") of the change since I didn't notice it mentioned (maybe it was in a Kabel post and I missed that one). This might affect strength vs opposing units with over 0 armour and I wonder whether this is a good or a bad thing.
- Terran's push in the TvZ looked pretty weak based on timings, maybe Nerve Jammer should last more than 12 seconds, say 20-25? If you can destroy it and without too much difficulty (I thought you could, from outside of the field, that is), maybe it should last this long (or even longer)?
- Just a reminder that we're not seeing the Baneling Nest used but it is there and I wish it to stay, so don't remove it and don't forget about it!
- Maybe you can keep your way of dealing with unburrowing Infestors being able to freely (aside from focus fire) cast Plague and Fungal (and Neural) by nerfing Fungal! Topsy-turvy way of thinking?
Sure, but it's going to happen, oh yes it will...keeeheeeheee. You will see. ^_^
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@Burrow movement
At 100/100 cost, Zerg could move their entire army of Zerglings & Hydras into the enemy base at 8 minutes. (Which Johnny demonstrated) It is a cheaper form of the overlord drop but with more flexibility. That is why I increased it to 150/150, since I think it gives too much for the cheap price of 100/100.
@Maps
I will shift maybe 1 or 2 of the maps and then make some small adjustments to Blue Storn. Terranlover has given me his approval.
@Rift
The reason I doubt to give Rift a energy cost is because its "hard" to keep track of the energy. P has 3 Nexuses selected at hotkey 5. He Chrono boosts two of his gateways. T attack his third base. He want to use Rift. Turns out that the energy that was drained from chrono boost came from his third nexus. He can thereby not Rift. This happend due to a random event that P did not control. Unless of course P uses different hotkeys on each Nexus.. Hmm..
I will get an other small update up today
@Breaking Terran positions
At times it seems like P can just A-move into sieged Siege tanks + Vultures. At other times, as in the replay posted above, P can NOT break Terran contains. Waves of poor Protoss armies are sent in and everything just melt. Maybe P must rely even more on spellcasters? Hmm..
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I think the energy management is just like larva and resource management, especially the first though.
He wants to make units, but oh, he just made a round of drones from every hatchery, right before he saw the attack coming. Cancelling the eggs won't get the larvae back. GG!
As is, protosses are (mostly) finding it a hard time to keep track of the energy by actually spending it.
I think you're giving protoss an unnecessary luxury, encouraging laziness.
@Burrow movement...wait so for 100/100 NOT separate from the 100/100 of burrow (i.e. the same 100/100) you want it to be cheaper and more flexible than drops??
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@Burrow movement
I mean that the 100/100 for burrow + move while burrowed is very cheap for such a strong ability. I can either split the upgrade into two parts - one at hatchery tech that allows burrow. One at lair tech that allows burrow movement. But it requires a bit of work. So I went for the lazy solution and increased it to 150/150 at Lair tech. (Instead of 100/100 at Lair tech)
But what would be better for the game? Two upgrades or one more powerful upgrade? Should it be more "fun" if Zerg could burrow at hatchery tech? Baneling traps early game gogogogo?
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Oh, well you were the one that changed it from 150/150 back to 100/100 WITH movement. :S
I'm completely in favour of just reverting the cost.
Ohh, it was 150/150 at hatchery and is now 100/100 but only at Lair, I didn't remember that change.
Hmm, well I personally think we should play around with burrow at hatchery for the moment, so I say revert.
If that proves to be too strong, then maybe have a 100/100 burrow at hatchery tech and then 50/50 or 100/100 burrowed
movement at Lair, but first try 150/150 at Hatchery again, I say.
What made you revert it? Did you see anything extremely strong? Too hard to detect the armies moving in early on (which was an issue with burrowed movement rather than burrow itself)
I still say revert and let it play out a little longer, but my only dislike about splitting the abilities was that it was nice to encourage people to get burrow for the burrowed movement play, because without it I feel like people might skip burrowed movement in favour of saving 100/100.
I fancy the chance that if separated, 50/50 for the movement alone would just feel too cheap but 50/50 for normal Burrow (and then 100/100 for the movement at Lair) makes hatchery burrow feel too cheap and almost not a choice so much as just stupid to ignore, so I imagine if they're separated you'd end up wanting them to both be 100/100.
Choices, choices!
On a different note, I only just realised that Queens only have 5 anti-air range rather than 7 now. I suppose that's fine (quite possibly a good change) though, but it was a funny surprise.
I was thinking "wouldn't it be funny if cliffs were glitched and the queens started hitting the Tanks on the cliff (Blue Storm, Chronopolis vs Jay TvZ) with 7 AA range instead of their 5 vs ground, only to hover over both icons and react with o_O.
As well as the 100 life which I'll continue to be a nuisance about mentioning >:D, hydralisks WITH A SPEED UPGRADE weren't really meat to have a creep bonus.
It's true that this takes them only to around what they have on creep in SC2, but firstly, you've reduced speeds by "10%" (I swear the attack rates and speeds were not all reduced from your previous numbers by the exact same percentages) and secondly, they may be too fast on creep in SC2 anyway, it's just that in that game, they're too weak instead, as well as too slow OFF creep. They needed to just give them a standard 30% bonus, make the base speed 2.5 and have them be slightly less fast on creep: 3.25 instead of 3.375.
That would have made them the same as banelings too, making it more familiar and easier for "n00bs" to remember.
So, in conclusion, maybe the speed upgrade should only increase it by about 20%, from 2.07 (or change it to 2.083333 for neatness) up to 2.5, which makes 3 on creep.
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On February 02 2013 19:24 Kabel wrote:
@Breaking Terran positions
At times it seems like P can just A-move into sieged Siege tanks + Vultures. At other times, as in the replay posted above, P can NOT break Terran contains. Waves of poor Protoss armies are sent in and everything just melt. Maybe P must rely even more on spellcasters? Hmm..
I don't think that says much at all about Protoss's ability to break seige lines. Protoss in that game was taking really bad engagements all game by attacking from the best possible angle for the tanks to do maximum damage instead of flanking, kept sending small groups of units into seige range (or even rallying them into seige range), where they were killed without doing any damage at all, and charged in (as I recall) several times with only part of his army instead of massing his entire force. Oh, and he played without Observers until the game was practically over, so he lost huge numbers of units to mines unnecessarily. The result was what I think should happen - Terran inflicted very disproportionate damage despite a supply disadvantage, and Protoss was only able to win because of a huge economic lead.
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How about moving burrow to hatchery tech, and burrow movement could be automatically granted to all zerg units when you build a Hive (or Nydus, perhaps). That way you can have early burrowed banes [and drones], but not have to worry about Infestors burrowing in and Neural-parasiting until Hive tech. I'd really like to salvage the Neural while burrowed mechanic. The whole benign business rubs me the wrong way. Also, I agree having burrow movement so early overlaps with drops too much.
If i had to choose from what you asked, though, I'd make it two separate, quick, cheap upgrades: Burrow requiring Spawning Pool, movement requiring Nydus. 100/50/40 and 100/100/40 costs, respectively.
and I completely agree with Mr. Umlaut above.
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Mr. Umlaut was my father's name, you can call me American  .
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This idea I am proposing is more of a fix than a novelty.
Terran has more upgrades of protoss and zerg.
Protoss has forge:
1 upgrade attack, 2 defense (armor and armor shield)
cybernet core: 1 attack and 1 armor for air units
Zerg has evolution chamber
2 upgrade attack (melee and range ground units) and 1 defense (armor).
spire: 1 attack and 1 armor for air units.
Terrans is partyculary:
Has engineebay:
1 ugrade attack, 1 for armor (for Infantry)
Has armory:
2 upgrade attack (vehicle and ship), 2 for armor (for vehicle and ship)
As we can see, protoss and zerg have 5 aggiornatenti. Terran has 6.
Protoss and zerg, can research all ground units upgrade, by means of 1 construction t 1 (evolution chamber/forge).
suggest this:
Engineebay now has 3 upgrade (and other 3 for costructions)
-Infantry Weapons research (same cost/bt)
-Vehicle Weapons research (same cost/bt)
-Infantry Armor and Vehicle Plating research (change cost to 150/150 maybe increased bt).
Now armory has only 2 upgrade:
-Ship Weapons research
-Ship Plating research
Armory now, only serves to unlock goliath, marines shield, and upgrade > level 1.
If armory feels empty, then change the require of the vessel, from ghost academy to armory.
This could also facilitate mixed compositions (bio / mech). I want players to be free to be able to use what they want in every mu, and I think this is what you want you .
I'd like to see even fast +1 vehicle weapon, for harass harverster and one shot zerglings with 2 vultures.
Edit
At times it seems like P can just A-move into sieged Siege tanks + Vultures. At other times, as in the replay posted above, P can NOT break Terran contains. Waves of poor Protoss armies are sent in and everything just melt. Maybe P must rely even more on spellcasters? Hmm..
Hallucination on enemy units could help to break the lines of defense of the Terran.
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BUG REPORT
TvP http://drop.sc/301356
At 25:28 Gossen makes 10 hallucinations of zealots. When they die, he gains supply, 2 for each dead Illusory Zealot, at one point putting him at 207/200 supply. After this moment, and for the rest of the game, Gossen has 20 supply being used up by nothing.
Immediately after the fight (26:00), combining units owned and being produced:
78 Probes (78)
4 Obs (4)
18 Zeal (36)
11 Stalk (22)
1 Reav (4)
1 W.Pris (2)
3 Null (9)
3 Arb (12)
6 HT (12)
Total: 179 supply, yet Gossen is at 199/200
So yea, Hallucination is bugged. Makes it completely unusable and broked.
Edit: i just reproduced the bug. It happens both when the hallucinations are destroyed and when the hallucinations time out.
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>>> New patch up on EU <<<
Bug fixes and aesthetically improvements. (Thanks XiA!)
Only a few balance changes:
Hydralisk 90 HP instead of 100.
Mutalisks and Corsairs no longer considered "light." (This makes Stalkers slightly better vs them)
Scourge & Corsair movement speed increased slightly. (They have the same speed value) Corsairs in small numbers can now fight better vs mutalisks, due to the small speed boost. Shoot, back away, shoot, back away )
Rift costs 50 energy and has 60 seconds cooldown. (Earlier it was free to cast but had a 120 second cooldown)
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EPT
