The latest (v0.941) version should work fine with release. Just open it with the map editor and press "Test Document". The map will be published and new features will be added when I finally get some free time.
Added "coach mode". This is aimed at further helping newer players improve their macro. By checking the checkbox on the difficulty selection dialog, you will be notified when you are not making Probes/Scvs as P/T or if you have idle larva and creep tumors as Zerg. These have not (yet) been implemented as Victory objectives and exist solely as a helping tool.
Balance Fixes
No more than two commands can be queued for Proberto to prevent extensive waypoint usage by players using the "Very Easy" and "Easy" difficulty settings.
Added a few turrets to the left of the Terran base to prevent "sneaky" attacks/drops.
Known Problems
The timer window for remaining time has an ugly purple background. This is a Galaxy Editor bug and should be fixed in the next patch.
More bugs could have been caused by the latest patch which I did not see. If you find any please report them! As always I still need feedback regarding balance, possible ways to abuse and suggestions to make the map better.
**Multitasking Trainer v0.93**
Initial Zerg Hatcheries now spawn with 3 larvae instead of 4.
Macro energy settings now load normally when loading custom settings banks.
Players can no longer use Mass Recall to recall the probe out of the area.
A "natural" expansion has been added. It is only allowed for Zerg players by default, if you play a differet race and wish to have an expansion go to Custom Difficulty, load the preset bank you want to play and then select "Allow Exansion" form the "Time and Minerals" tab.
The objective for not exceeding the energy limit now applies to multiple Queens/Nexi/Orbital Commands.
**Multitasking Trainer v0.92**
A couple of small bug fixes
**Multitasking Trainer v0.91**
Macro energy limits now fixed for all races. Some Difficulty tweaks were made. I think that now all the difficulty settings are fairly balanced. Some small bug fixes.
**Multitasking Trainer v0.9**
-Major changes:
Two new difficulty settings have been added: Very Easy and Impossible.
A new feature has added added to allow the player to completely customize the map's difficulty as well as save and load custom difficulty settings.
Added a new objective that forces the player to keep his macro mechanics (Orbital command/Nexus/Queen) energy below a certain amount.
The executor now has to be saved multiple times in Normal difficulty and above.
Several possible drop/harass attacks have been added that occur in random times and locations.
-Minor changes:
It may look the same but the map's triggers have been (almost) completely rewritten to allow for full customization. This should also reduce some lag issues.
The preexisting difficulty settings have been slightly tweaked.
The player can no longer use nukes to kill the Terran.
The player can no longer use patrol commands on the probe.
Since the beta will be closing soon, I wanted to release the map as soon as possible to get it tested. There are definitely going to be a few bugs in there so make sure to report anything suspicious! For the same reason as above, there are a few features that are included in this version but are incomplete. Make sure to read the Future Changes section to see what's coming.
Latest version: Multitasking Trainer v0.941. Download here
To run the map just open it with the Galaxy Editor (located in the SC2 install directory along with sc2.exe) and run it from there (Ctrl+F9). If you are on MacOsX download MapCraft! To be able to watch replays you can either launch the map from the editor or just put the map in the maps directory (should be someting like My Documents\StarCraft II Beta\Maps\)
This is a remake of the old Hotkey Trainer map for bw that I found so incredibly useful for practicing my multitasking and warming up.
The Concept
For those that don't know the original map, here's how it works: On the bottom left side of the map is your starting position and right above that is a terran base. Your purpose is to create an army and destroy the enemy base. The terran will attack and/or drop you at several points in time depending on the difficulty setting. There is also a neutral unit at the island on the right side that you have to rescue and bring back to your base.
The tricky part is that in the top right side of the map you control a probe that is constantly being chased by a zergling. So you need to manage your base, defend the attacks and save the neutral unit, all while microing the probe to keep it from dying. This is a great way to practice not only your early game scouting but also your multitasking and hotkey usage.
There is also a mineral cap that you must not exceed or you loose the game, a set number of probes that you are allowed to loose and a time limit in which you have to complete the mission.
Features
So here are a few stuff I have added to the map:
Race selection: You are able to select the race that you want to play in the start of the game. There is currently a problem with having the UI that matches the race selected. You can read more about it in the Known Issues section.
Difficulty Selection: You can choose between five difficulty settings, each having a different time and mineral limit, amount of hits the probe can take before dying and attack waves that are sent from the opponent. You can also create your own custom difficulty setting.
Coach Mode: As of v0.94 a new feature has been added: Coach Mode displays a notification every time you are not building workers out of your main building (until a set amount of workers) if you play as Terran or Protoss, or if you have idle larva and Creep Tumors if you play as Zerg. I hope this will help played keep their macro consistent while practicing.
Known Issues
There is no way (that I know of) to change the race of the UI after the game has started. Here is a very easy way to fix it your self however if you intend on practicing only one race: Open the map using the editor. Go to map->Player properties. Change the race for Player 1 to whatever you want. Save the map and you're done
The timer that displays the remaining time has an ugly purple background. This is a Galaxy editor bug that I can not fix. We just have to wait for Blizzard to fix it.
Why do I have to micro a probe despite playing a different race?
Well, it is much easier to balance the map if the unit being chased is the same. Probes are a good choice because by tweaking the shield regen rate it is very easy to change how difficult it is to keep them alive.
Future Changes
First of all, let me tell you that an expansion location has not been added yet simply because I did not have the time to test it enough. It would actually be much harder to keep the map balanced than most of you think! Still, it should be coming one way or an other in the future.
You will notice some red little boxes in the custom difficulty dialogs that give a difficulty rating for each setting. My plan is to create a rating system that calculates the difficulty of all the settings and provides a final rating indicative of how hard the custom settings are. This, combined with a detailed Victory screen and a score that does not depend on the settings but the actual player's performance (like units lost, time and lives left, avg floating minerals etc) should be enough to turn this thread to an e-peen measuring contest like the ones we all love...
I did not have enough time to test the map extensively so in combination with the feedback that will be posted, some minor changes to the preset difficulty settings may be made in the following days.
How can I watch the Replays to check my APM?
On June 01 2010 00:31 ArmyAnt wrote: The replays can be viewed if you launch the map from the editor with Ctrl+TCtrl+F9 as test document. Then when you finished playing it you can view the replay from Battle.net ordinarily.
On June 01 2010 01:33 spamm wrote: Or put the map into game folder: ..\StarCraft II Beta\Maps\ "To run the map just drag it onto the Starcraft 2 shortcut on your Desktop."
Tips
Custom difficulty settings are saved on MyDocuments/Starcraft2 beta/banks. If you make a setup you like, share it!
If you find Normal difficulty too hard but don't want to play on fast speed just play on easy and manually set the game speed to faster
To save the Executor you need to bring him into the black beacon-like area above your main building
Use Ctrl+F keys to save the location the probe spawns to avoid the panic that occurs every time a probe dies.
The zergling's speed is such that it won't allow it to catch up to your probe when moving in a straight line but it will be able to land a hit when the probe makes a sharp turn either by a manual command or by the use of a waypoint. To avoid being hit control the probe during turns and issue a few move commands at increasing angles so that the probe turns smoothly.
The probe should start regenerating shields one turn (assuming you are moving it the whole length of the island) after it gets hit. So if it does get hit, focus your attention on for the next couple of turns to allow it to regenerate.
Normal difficulty should give even platinum players a run for their money. Don't try beating hard unless you have confidence in your skills.
If you do try the hard difficulty prepare for fast reapers and get detection at some point after the first attack occurs
I hope this helps people improve! Please post here with any comments, bugs, suggestions etc. This is the first map I have ever made so all feedback will be greatly appreciated.
You sir, are awesome EDIT: I havent played the map yet, however wouldnt it be really tough keeping a scout alive against a ling, seeing how fast they are now? Why not a zeal like it was in the BW hotkey trainer?
This sounds cool, but how can I play it? I downloaded the file and put it in the maps folder (c:\users\me\documents\starcraft II beta\maps) but it doesn't show up when I try to make a custom game on Bnet =/
Edit: just tried dragging it onto the SC2 shortcut as OP suggested, it says it can't open the map. Meh, maybe this only works with the English version...
Some input, on moving the probe around from the beginning; shouldn't we be focused on our build order completely from the beginning, and start the probe running on 10 supply or something, or perhaps we must send a scout to a region which will start the probe running.
I didn't get very far, due to not being able to read the dialogs (map isn't localized). But I found that running the probe around is significantly more difficult when it is being chased by a ling (vs another worker or zealot as is the scenario during most early game scouting in my experience). I only tried a couple of times, but I was unable to save the probe for any significant amount of time even while focusing only on the probe.
On May 12 2010 22:31 FuRong wrote: This sounds cool, but how can I play it? I downloaded the file and put it in the maps folder (c:\users\me\documents\starcraft II beta\maps) but it doesn't show up when I try to make a custom game on Bnet =/
Edit: just tried dragging it onto the SC2 shortcut as OP suggested, it says it can't open the map. Meh, maybe this only works with the English version...
Huh? That's strange, I was always able to run custom maps by dragging them on the SC2 shortcut. If this doesn't work use the map editor to open the map and run it from there. See the OP for more details.
On May 12 2010 22:35 Chriamon wrote: Very nice.
Some input, on moving the probe around from the beginning; shouldn't we be focused on our build order completely from the beginning, and start the probe running on 10 supply or something, or perhaps we must send a scout to a region which will start the probe running.
I didn't get very far, due to not being able to read the dialogs (map isn't localized). But I found that running the probe around is significantly more difficult when it is being chased by a ling (vs another worker or zealot as is the scenario during most early game scouting in my experience). I only tried a couple of times, but I was unable to save the probe for any significant amount of time even while focusing only on the probe.
On May 12 2010 22:38 danl9rm wrote: not sure how anyone can keep a probe alive vs a zergling. ling are faster than probes and don't stutter or hesitate anymore like they used to.
I have edited the zergling's move speed and acceleration (I think) so that it moves slightly slower than a probe. This way it will eventually hit you if you use waypoints but it won't if you actually control the probe during turns.
Do people with non EU clients have localization issues? (all text is replaced with Param/blabla) I thought I had fixed that, please confirm and I will upload a new version as fast as possible.
I have edited the zergling's move speed and acceleration (I think) so that it moves slightly slower than a probe. This way it will eventually hit you if you use waypoints but it won't if you actually control the probe during turns.
why punish the use of waypoints? i thought that even pros use waypoints on their scout probe, so that they can more easily multitask
Problems: Choboling is a hax0r. He is faster than in BW (in BW lings had the same speed as a probe) and now doesn't hesitate to cut corners (in BW he would follow the probe exactly on it's path) which makes keeping a probe alive impossible with reducted hp/shields.
When I kill the Orbital Command, I lose because I didn't rescue Tassadar. Player should probably be warned to rescue tassadar before killing the terrans, or change it so we can complete objectives in which ever order we choose to.
On May 12 2010 22:56 mijones wrote: why punish the use of waypoints? i thought that even pros use waypoints on their scout probe, so that they can more easily multitask
Well, you see, the way sc 2 works with infinite waypoints and stuff, if the zergling's speed is such that it will never hit you with the use of waypoints then there would be no point in the map. People would just queue 100 waypoints and never worry about the probe again.
I've tried to make the map in such a way that setting a couple of waypoints while doing something important won't really hurt you: You will get hit once, probably not twice cause the ling stopped in order to attack you the first time and if you micro the probe for a while it will regenerate.
On May 12 2010 22:57 Latham wrote: Problems: Choboling is a hax0r. He is faster than in BW (in BW lings had the same speed as a probe) and now doesn't hesitate to cut corners (in BW he would follow the probe exactly on it's path) which makes keeping a probe alive impossible with reducted hp/shields.
Actually it's the opposite, it's much slower than a ling in sc2.
I've put a lot of time into balancing the whole "probe being chased" thing. Please post any suggestions on how to improve it but keep in mind that this map is aimed at helping people improve. If you were able to beat it the first time you played it without breaking a sweat then there wouldn't be a point would there?
Good map. just gave it a go. took a few goes to work a strat out on normal. In the end i chose to not play my normal race (P) vs the AI's terran army.. its just abit too much micro needed so instead i went with terran and nuked the front and walked in think that needs to get fixed, somehow make the AI smart enough to check for nukes, because that trivialises it a tiny bit.
On May 12 2010 23:26 Csirac wrote: Good map. just gave it a go. took a few goes to work a strat out on normal. In the end i chose to not play my normal race (P) vs the AI's terran army.. its just abit too much micro needed so instead i went with terran and nuked the front and walked in think that needs to get fixed, somehow make the AI smart enough to check for nukes, because that trivialises it a tiny bit.
I agree that it would be a nice-to-have, however, it doesn't take away from meeting the purpose of the map. Since the purpose is to improve your multitasking, it is up to the player to co-operate with meeting that objective. I'm sure there could be many ways you could exploit a win, but you wouldnt gain anything by doing so.
On a practical level, you lose the game if you achieve the objectives by cheating; you win the game if you improve your multitasking through the use of this map. Objectives are there just to help achieve the primary goal.
PS: by 'cheating' I mean doing a premeditated action(s) that would let you achieve the objectives without needing to improve your multitasking
the ling is way too fast :/ its not so much about multitasking more about having the probe move in nice circles. as someone already said, the ling cuts corners and hits the probe almost without any problem.
i played on normal mode because i dont want to play on ease (it says speed is fast and i dont want to play on different speeds then standard ladder speed, that would mess up timings).
besides that, i love that map and want to play it more as soon as the ling is a bit slower. (will be incredible hart to beat that map anyways xD)
Request - could you please post the exact differences between difficulty levels, including scripted events, tweaks, etc? I presume that the Terran functions via scripted events only as the AI difficulty levels are currently locked.
On May 12 2010 23:18 stet_tcl wrote: Well, you see, the way sc 2 works with infinite waypoints and stuff, if the zergling's speed is such that it will never hit you with the use of waypoints then there would be no point in the map. People would just queue 100 waypoints and never worry about the probe again.
Is it possible to impose your own limit on the # of waypoints?
I thought the point of having a probe being chased was to remind you not to forget about looking at it, and then punish you if you forget to look at it to give it more waypoint commands. I'm thinking that the way it's currently implemented is causing you to have to pay too much attention to it.
I agree that the method you're using now is probably the best possible way to do it - but only if you're not able to put your own limit on the number of waypoints.
Thanks again though, I've been waiting for a SC2 version of the map for soo long. So happy right now.
why don't you make it so the zling can't catch the probe using waypoints, but every so often it changes direction or does something random, so if you're not paying attention your probe will die.
The point isn't to put all your focus on the scouting, and put less effort into macro, but the other way around.
On May 12 2010 23:25 yema1 wrote: How does one make a waypoint?
Just with shift+right click to tell units where to go in advance.
Fun map, really cool idea. But, atm all my attention has to be on the probe. Dunno if that's attended, it's just a bit tiring having to move a probe around for 15 minutes. Ofc, it's fine I guess for improving your multitasking.
The way the probe atm works perfectly, if you control your probe and do SMOOTH turns then the ling will never hit it, this pretty much eliminates the ability of waypointing to get around actual multitasking. If you're arguing that way pointing isnt working and that it should, you're missing the point :/ The ling speed is perfect. (on normal, im not sure what the difference between normal/hard is in regards to ling speed, if there is any difference at all).
TBH i doubt anyone below gold league would be able to finish the map on normal in under a few goes. (unless u play it many many times, by then itll become instinct to flick back to the probe lol)
I think the probe demands just a tiny bit too much attention, but not sure if there is a way around it. Im guessing the idea is to build your base using hotkeys and being very fast when you are in your base. And also being aware whats going on without actually seeing your base.
This thing is a great tool for my anger management for sure, I feel I am about to explode each time I do this.
On May 13 2010 00:32 crappen wrote: I think the probe demands just a tiny bit too much attention, but not sure if there is a way around it. Im guessing the idea is to build your base using hotkeys and being very fast when you are in your base. And also being aware whats going on without actually seeing your base.
This thing is a great tool for my anger management for sure, I feel I am about to explode each time I do this.
You're concentrating too much on the probe. Run it from corner to corner, while its running you have around 2-3 seconds to go back to your base and quickly build your base and u flick back to your probe which by this time its about to take the corner and u guide it smoothly around to the next corner which gives u anohter few seconds. and rinse and repeat. if you cant do this then the map is perfect for you because thats the whole purpose of it
On May 13 2010 00:36 Weasel- wrote: What does it mean "save" the executor, I had him sitting right next to my nexus when I killed the orbital command and it told me I didn't save him
I have the same problem, i bring him over but it keeps failing me on this??
On May 13 2010 00:36 Weasel- wrote: What does it mean "save" the executor, I had him sitting right next to my nexus when I killed the orbital command and it told me I didn't save him
I have the same problem, i bring him over but it keeps failing me on this??
Ah ha! I looked at regions in the editor, it shows the save location is to the left of your base in the circle.
How do you keep the probe alive? I don't use waypoints and always keep it moving, but the Zergling still catches up periodically and gets a hit off. Is there a trick to it i'm missing?
I'm currently moving from corner to corner of the square of land you're on, using a couple of extra clicks on each corner to smooth out the turn. Where am i going wrong?
First: How the hell do I save the Executor (or whatever it was?) Should i send a flying unit to him? Second: If you kill the Orbital Command and still havent saved the guy you lose, Bug?
On May 13 2010 02:48 Sl4ktarN wrote: First: How the hell do I save the Executor (or whatever it was?) Should i send a flying unit to him? Second: If you kill the Orbital Command and still havent saved the guy you lose, Bug?
You just send a dropship over there.
I've played it so far on easy. Great map. Played as toss. I am going to try it on medium and hard and see how it is, but one idea for changing it might be to change the high templar guy. It doesn't seem to require too much multitask to just send a ship over there and get him. Then again having to build a ship might be hard on the higher difficulties when you need units to fend off attacks. Again though, excellent map!
I would love to see an expansion.... That should be implemented in the next version. Add a place for me to expand so its not always just one base vs one base.
If you can beat this consistently on Medium or Hard, you should be given an endorsement on your driver's license that says you're allowed to text and drive.
Ok most others probably know this already but the reason you need to make smooth turns is not because the probe decelerates, but because the pathing on the zergling is good enough to cut corners - everytime you make an angle of about 120 degrees or less he will gain a little bit.
Also, the probe begins to decelerate before it reaches the point you clicked.
So far I can only survive until about the ten minute mark :p
Just Awsome idea! Didnt play Brood since years... and started to play SC2 since few weeks and actually my macro and micro sux and my multi task is now AWFULL. i just wanted to tell you THANKS for this map just GJ!
i failed once in normal, then tryed in easy mode and Suceed. This map isnt impossible and doesnt need 200 apm to be cleared. Indeed the speed of the gling is enought slowed to be managed (cause normal glign cant be dodge) and of course another probe will be easely dodge with shift click so there is no use to do it with other probe . i take a break ( yeah this killed me) and try this is normal mode now sup
PS: Big up to the creator of this map i hope he ll continue to work on it and others micro maps. if you need help for testing i ll be proud to help you
Nice, thank you very much for the map. I never cared much for my multitasking / apm in sc1 as I mostly played buddies/for fun. I am however hoping to play ladder more in SC2 so this will hopefully help me with multitasking. I was able to beat it on easy but have failed 5 times on normal (my last attempt I lost my last probe ~12 minutes as I attacked the enemy base). Will get back at it later :D.
I would say make easy slightly easier but not sure how. Reducing ling speed may make it too easy.
On May 12 2010 23:46 iDfyU wrote: i played on normal mode because i dont want to play on ease (it says speed is fast and i dont want to play on different speeds then standard ladder speed, that would mess up timings).
Thanks for reminding me, I forgot to add this to the Tips section. Just play on easy and set the game speed to faster manually through the game's Options.
On May 12 2010 23:46 Shaithis wrote: Request - could you please post the exact differences between difficulty levels, including scripted events, tweaks, etc? I presume that the Terran functions via scripted events only as the AI difficulty levels are currently locked.
Here you go: (I'm only adding the exact details that are not given in the game. I may be forgetting some stuff but I'm too lazy to check right now ^^) + Show Spoiler +
Easy: -The terran has much fewer units in his base and never attacks. -Probe has 5 shields and 20 hp. -Zergling moves slightly slower than it does on Normal (~2.77 if I'm not mistaken) Normal: -One attack comes at around 5 minutes and a drop in your mineral line a bit later. -Probe has 5 shields and 10 health. Hard: -The terran base has more units. -Two reapers attack at around the normal 10 rax reaper timing. -An attack wave comes at the same time as it does in Normal but with more stuff. A drop also happens but with more possibilities including cloaked banshees. -Dropped units also stim. -Probe has 5 shields and 5 health. -Zergling moves slightly faster (still slower than a probe)
On May 13 2010 03:05 Dr.Frost wrote: I would love to see an expansion.... That should be implemented in the next version. Add a place for me to expand so its not always just one base vs one base.
I thought about that a lot but I don't think there is any reason to give players an expansion (besides it would make it harder to keep minerals low) with the exception of zerg players. If enough people think zergs need a second base I'll do it.
EDIT: I have updated the OP with some tips and some more stuff.
Someone posted that the map is not properly localized. Could people with a non EU client please post if text is displayed properly and if not on what client? That would be of great help!
Obviously you don't wan't to kill the zergling or it negates the point of the map but what prevents us from sending over an air unit to kill the zergling? anything? going to try this now
Love the map, it is such a distilled form of practice for an abstract concept, very impressive. Props to the initial creator and the obvious work you put in for this version.
An idea for all those struggling with the probe, perhaps rather than adjusting ling speed, just make the island it runs around bigger in easy mode, this will allow more time to go back to the base etc in between turns. I personally don't have the map editor to know how hard this would be, but i expect creating/destroying destructible rocks or something to allow more space would make sense. Thanks for the map, looking forward to improvements and future maps =)
Excellent map, played on normal and I initially was having a hard time keeping probe alive, got much better on my 3rd try. I decided to all in the base of Terran with 5:00 mintues left and failed, just gotta make more units and hit near the end.
Initially I felt the ling was to quick, but I think any slower (at least on normal) would negate the purpose of the map. That being said, maybe 4 difficulty settings would be nice? Something in between normal and easy, make normal hard and have the high setting as extreme. Just some thoughts.
Even on easy its quite difficult. You actually have to use almost all of the 20 minutes building to get a substantial enough force to defeat the cpu.
This map is quite difficult because of the constant attention you need to keep the probe alive. I think it would be more convenient if the probe area didn't have any obstructions so that the path is simple and rectangular.
I actually think that this map will help me tons as it forces me to always look at the minmap to track the progress of the probe while macroing.
Thanks for the map and I hope you add other features too!
Trying to beat easy with no mouse on laptop, not going well.
The only problem I see in this map is that it emphasizes keeping the probe alive over macro and build orders, but that's not really a huge problem. It definitely helps train and mulittasking.
Edit 2: K, got a mouse and played it on normal. I think I won but at the end it says I didn't save the executor when I got a prism over there, picked him up, and put him in my base. Am I supposed to fly him somewhere?
On May 13 2010 09:00 Sydero wrote: Are we meant to control the probe by the mini map or on the actual map?
There are so many obstacles where the probe is so that controlling it with minimap is risky. You're supposed to keep an eye on the probe almost all the time and go quickly back to base to do what is needed there whenever there is something to do, which is similar to a real game situation (microing units while still building in base, and if you need to change view to base queue up a few seconds of orders on what you are microing).
Bug: Sometimes when I'm playing on normal mode the zergling won't chase my probe after I lose and get a new one. I think maybe I'm moving it away before it has sight of me. Maybe have the zergling patrol the whole box rather than just 1 attack move to prevent it getting stuck?
Thanks for making the map. My multitasking is really my weakest area in SC2, so this is quite helpful. Beat it my first try on easy but only with my very last probe alive with very low HP. Good work!
Another good addition might be to fail the player if their orbital command/queen/nexus gets too high on energy, great map. beat it very easily on easy, but i have trouble macroing a large enough army on Medium.. or im not microing the battle enough..
Thanks again, this map is great fun! On my first try I failed on easy and though I may never beat it. Got that on my 2nd try then failed a bunch on Normal. Once I finally got the hang of jumping around I was consistently making it the 15 minutes, but could not kill the enemy. Finally I found the right unit composition to do it. Great practice, and no doubt it will aid me in my multitasking. Couple more runs at Normal and I will give Hard a shot.
I cannot keep my probe alive on hard for the life of me I can get past the reapers and that first terran attack, but the macro afterwards keeping my minerals down while microing the probe is tough especially when you get supply blocked
Now i've got the hang of how to stop the probe from slowing down i'm doing pretty good, just beat Normal with 30 seconds to spare and 127 apm average!! Considering i normally have less than 80 in game thats a damn fine improvement if i do say so!
Thanks for making this, its a great tool and i'm already feeling like a much faster player.
Make zergling speed and accelaration slower, it attacks the probe even without waypoints if you mess even a bit when turning... Also I think, that even waypoints shouldn't be punished, as you don't won't to control your probe manually when the big battles occure. And make easy with faster speed or game speed to be choosable.
Should put a zealot (just like the BW ver), instead of a ling. At least on easy and normal. I would definitely keep the ling on hard mode. Thanks for making this UMS! Definitely fun and much better than the BW ver!
it attacks the probe even without waypoints if you mess even a bit when turning
Nope, you just need to practice your turns. I've managed to survive the whole game without losing the first probe on normal mode.
I would recommend a natural base for atleast us zergs. Playing on one base is so slow and boring, and I dont even know how to do it. I do build another hatchery beside my base, but I really need the mass minerals. As zerg I dont have problems with keeping the economy down as long as I use larva.
I tried this on a ranked match, and oboy I lost so terrible, got supply capped and couldnt even get my first queen out, simply gg'ed right there.. jesus I really need this so thanks for the effort.
On May 13 2010 19:08 crappen wrote: I would recommend a natural base for atleast us zergs. Playing on one base is so slow and boring, and I dont even know how to do it. I do build another hatchery beside my base, but I really need the mass minerals. As zerg I dont have problems with keeping the economy down as long as I use larva.
I tried this on a ranked match, and oboy I lost so terrible, got supply capped and couldnt even get my first queen out, simply gg'ed right there.. jesus I really need this so thanks for the effort.
It's not hard to add a natural in your own on the map editor. I've done it to my copy.
For the love of god, please get rid of the rock at the bottom right. I've beaten this on hard mode and I can say with out a doubt the worst part is that Fing rock.
For those of you who have no clue what I'm talking about. Your probe can get stuck on the rock and not move, doesn't take a vet of this game to realize if your probe does not move for even 1/2 a second it's dead.
Not an option but ideally I want something to force scouting. (Perhaps make scouting part of the next level of difficulty)
My vote is for more advanced AI so you can't mass and attack walk. Also randomize the events but give signs on how to predict them. Make it so you have to scout. For example, make it so the medvacs come and land from some direction (immune medvacs) rather than a set location. Or perhaps make it so you have to move the unit you pick up into 1 of 5 locations that you can only know if you have done proper scouting.
Oh god. This just shows how awful I am at scouting. Hence why I only do it once in the beginning and once in the middle. After that, I just rely on obs...
I guess I will let everyone know when I actually beat easy moad. x_x
I a-moved my army into the enemy base, then suddenly got defeated cause I did not save the Executor. I have researched ventral sac for my overlord, so I was gonna pick him up that way.
Do I need to pick up the executor first, then engage the army?
Wow, it is quite challenging. I believe the hardest part is that since I put so much concentration on my probe, it slows down the building process a bit. Like maybe 70% probe, 30% building.
I like it very much. Hopefully I'll be able to get past making an army and then losing soon.
This is really great. I just beat it on normal difficulty with Zerg.
Controlling that probe is immensely hard, but definitely possible to do flawlessly. I really like it that way, too--make it any easier and the amount of multitasking required would diminish dramatically. As for the guy complaining about the rock in the bottom right, I went underneath it every time and almost never had a problem. If you're careful and control it correctly, I don't think there's any chance the probe will get stuck on the rock. Or, alternatively, you could just go above the rock and avoid it altogether.
I just tried it, the probe demanded so much attention from me it made things hard for me even on easy ;/ I couldn't figure where he had his siege tanks placed ;/ kept sending forces till i ran out of minerals/time lol ;c
Is it possible to somehow get the replays to work? I think it would be really cool to be able to check them for weaknesses in one's play when multitasking.
Other than that, great map, thanks a bunch!
Edit: Btw., I don't think easy mode should be easier. I'm not a very good player, APM less than 100, somewhere in the higher middle of gold league atm, and I beat it after a couple of tries and even beat normal now. If you find easy hard, I think you really need this map. As it is. ;-)
I finished medium 1 base zerg on my 3rd try, just massing roaches was enough to beat that level.. however the hard one is really freaking hard imo.
the reapers come just as my first pair of zerglins spawns, before my queen.. and so far (2 tries) I have not been able to get sufficient detection+army to even defent the last attack, and I am yet to charge forward against the enemy.. is this level really possible? :D I guess you could always build some static defense since the enemy ís a predictable computer, but that feels like cheeting to me.
The probe decelerates at each point when you create a full patrol waypoints path. Also, the 5 shields means you get one free shot every time the zergling reaches you, and yeah, sharp corners are bad, this is a bit extreme though, you wouldn't normally run away from zerglings in his base, his workers won't catch up with you if you just create some loopy waypoints...
On May 14 2010 03:36 AWEadam wrote: I think for some reason this does not work with the latest patch (patch 12), at least it doesn't for me. Anyone else have the same problem?
On May 14 2010 03:05 mrproper wrote: The probe decelerates at each point when you create a full patrol waypoints path. Also, the 5 shields means you get one free shot every time the zergling reaches you, and yeah, sharp corners are bad, this is a bit extreme though, you wouldn't normally run away from zerglings in his base, his workers won't catch up with you if you just create some loopy waypoints...
TL;DR I lost easy
LIke someone said earlier though, this isn't meant to be realistic. The probe is being chased by a zergling that you can't waypoint to get away from so that it requires your attention. It's supposed to increase your multitasking as a whole, not just make you better at scouting. Early game scouting doesn't even always require much micro.
To be completely honest id rather see the probe micro being easier and the base management part being more difficult (harder macro/defensive/offensive tasks). As it is right now I spend 90% of my time watching the probe because the ling cuts corners so well. The amount of attention the probe requires in this is more than any BW multitasking map I have played, and completely disproportional to the amount of probe multitask required in game.
Very challenging map, doesn't work with the new patch however as has been stated already. Gives a 'Unable to load map' message when trying to start it.
So apparently blizz made some changes with the new patch that caused the map to stop working.
I uploaded a new version that should work fine, however I still have no idea what caused it to stop in the first place so if you find any issues please let me know!
hah nice map now I'm so gosu at running my probe in circles in my opponents base. My plan is to hypnotize him with the probe and then have him press ALT F4.
Beat easy mode pretty fast and now working on normal. It is actually pretty hard to keep the probe out of trouble as waypoints doesn't seem to work. My problem on normal though is getting the army to kill the orbital command in time. Hopefully I will beat it eventually
I've got a problem. As a german I'm used to the hotkey-pattern 'qwert asdfg yxcv escape'. How can I change the hotkey pattern on that map since the hotkeys used in this version are the ones from the english client?
On May 14 2010 22:58 ioldarnech wrote: hah nice map now I'm so gosu at running my probe in circles in my opponents base. My plan is to hypnotize him with the probe and then have him press ALT F4.
Haha, good one. ;-)
But seriously, to the people who say the probe demands too much attention: Obviously we wouldn't spend this much time microing a lone probe in an actual game. But the probe micro required to beat this map forces us to do our whole base building, management and defense quickly and efficiently. To me, this is the useful thing about this map. It made me aware of a whole range of efficiency issues from building placement to hotkey use, and made me try to figure out ways to do all these little things more quickly. The overly demanding probe makes the need to be quick much more immediate than it is in an actual game.
On May 14 2010 23:12 Pebble wrote: I've got a problem. As a german I'm used to the hotkey-pattern 'qwert asdfg yxcv escape'. How can I change the hotkey pattern on that map since the hotkeys used in this version are the ones from the english client?
Maybe your hotkeys were somehow reset by the patch? I also used the grid system I always use when playing this map (also German client of course). Everything was normal. Also, the patch notes said something about German hotkey changes. You should check your hotkey settings.
I think they actually have a built in system to practice multitasking in this way - where you have to build a base, destroy an enemy, and scout micro to win. I'm not sure what its called, but its the real game.
Great map! I think it would be great to try to allow the map to mimic 1v1 play. What I mean by this is by adding an expansion location, I, a zerg player, can go through my "usual" build order while juggling a probe + attacks. Also, I personally find it impossible to reach the mineral cap on just one base and I think that having an expansion would make the mineral cap objective one to be concerned about.
The probe seems way too finicky - sometimes, even when manually clicked around a corner, it will decelerate enough to take hits. Being unable to micromanage your army at all because of the babysitting Proberto needs seems to take away from the multitasking of the map, as well. Is it possible you could make the island smaller and actually reward smart movement? As is, there's a bunch of obstacles on it.. but none of them actually affect the Zergling, so because the Zergling's turn acceleration is still better than the Probe's, you can't even do anything fancy.
I understand that you don't really want waypoints being used, but waypointing really mimics the actual play experience better, because SC2's unit AI is good enough that even fine micro doesn't work indefinitely the way it can in sc1, where units have noticable pauses trying to do things.
On May 15 2010 03:42 Stiver wrote: Should have a strip where you have to get a creep tumor to make a path from one side of the map to the other in a certain amount of time.
If you want an expansion, just load the map in the editor and just make a mineral line yourself. When inside the Editor, press 'U' and the minerals should be there iirc.
I think you definitely should add an expansion, perhaps as a separate mode. It's really hard to move beyond 1 base play while still keeping solid macro up and micro up, so an expansion would be indispensable for improving this part of the game.
It would probably be best to have a separate modes (or even maps) for 1 base and 2 base play, though. For 2 base, there should be a longer time limit and a much larger enemy force to destroy (perhaps taking multiple waves of units to defeat.) 2 base mode would be as much as a test of endurance as a test of large scale mechanics. You could even make a 3 or 4 base version as the ultimate test sometime down the road.
suggestion:Sorry if anyone mentioned this already, but is it possible to have an objective to keep macro energy (queen energy, orbital command, chrono boost) under a certain amount? (ie: must keep energy under 75 or 100)
Ive beat medium setting on 3rd try. I tried hard but probe kept dying, i dont think its possible with such low shield to keep probe alive. Maybe im doing something wrong. ON medium i had enough shield so that i would be able to take a hit then have some distance from me and the zerglign to regen shields but on hardest mode the 5 shield doesnt seem to be enough. Is there some trick to moving the probe at angles or something?
have you thought about changing the probe chase "minigame" to something more fun but equally demanding? the thing with game/map design is that people are more motivated by rewards then by punishment, which you should use. my idea is to give you a reaper/marauder/stalker or something to kill zealots/mass-probes/something and for every kill the amount of enemys in the terran base gets smaller. that would do a few things for the fun of the map: - you get to kill stuff all game long instead of trying to survive - you get rewareded for your multitasking but can opt not to do it for a while, making the end goal harder - you are training micro while multitasking - you have to make decisions about what is more important at this second, killing more units or having better macro. thats the same decision you have to make in real games
if you are really fancy you might even make the "minigame" a choice so we can train the micro we really need to practice right now
On May 15 2010 07:40 ubreakubuy wrote: Ive beat medium setting on 3rd try. I tried hard but probe kept dying, i dont think its possible with such low shield to keep probe alive. Maybe im doing something wrong. ON medium i had enough shield so that i would be able to take a hit then have some distance from me and the zerglign to regen shields but on hardest mode the 5 shield doesnt seem to be enough. Is there some trick to moving the probe at angles or something?
the probe shield is the same on hard as normal? Im finding it very difficult to get a zerg army that can deal with those tanks in time on hard.
i think there could be some kind of score system, that would show upon defeat/victory.
if you want some ideas on a formula, i can give them to you.
i've only beaten easy w/ protoss (able to do it without losing any probes atm), but medium difficult just kicks my ass as well.
perhaps 2 more difficulties. One in between medium and easy that has everything minus the drops and waves. (i went into battle with 8-10 immortals, and i couldn't micro them properly, with doing the probe thing) and my army got wiped out. i dunno it there was am emp or anything, but they couldnt take on a few tanks and marauders. also, i cant watch the replay or get the apm info either (via sc2 gears). i know this will most likely change, but i would still like to see how well i am doing, and if there are any increases in anything over time.
On May 14 2010 23:12 Pebble wrote: I've got a problem. As a german I'm used to the hotkey-pattern 'qwert asdfg yxcv escape'. How can I change the hotkey pattern on that map since the hotkeys used in this version are the ones from the english client?
Maybe your hotkeys were somehow reset by the patch? I also used the grid system I always use when playing this map (also German client of course). Everything was normal. Also, the patch notes said something about German hotkey changes. You should check your hotkey settings.
Haha, now I have the same (or a similar) problem. Hotkeys are set to standard and I can't switch to grid, although it says grid in the Options and in the variables.txt, it isn't set to grid ingame. Great.
I don't think it has a lot to do with this map though.
Nice, I enjoyed it, and realized how bad I suck at multitasking. But really, good Idea, and its frustrating enough. Just a note though - the fact that if you fly too close to the place where the probo-guy is, and the ship gets destroyed is understandable, but wouldn't it be better to change it to some kind of no-fly zone, because sometimes this can get a bit too punishing, if you're going void rays or something. Also yes, please give us an expansion. having only 2 assimilators is painful, and it takes ages for me to get enough gas for what I need. Also, the zergling is tiny little bit too fast imo. even if I multitask good enough, it still hits me because it runs a bit faster than me. Otherwise the map is clearly 5/5. GJ.
I do wonder why it isn't a probe chasing the probe. In games it seems to be probe on probe much more often. This being a much more realistic time-frame of micro vs macro. Though I understand it would be much less work and is probably counter intuitive to the goal of the trainer, I do think the dmg output of a probe would be much more aligned to easy mode.
I've found that the part of kiting Zergling is that, to which i pay all of my attention, since it hits the probe on every shift+move turn (even if the angle is around 150). So it disrupts all micro on army. But if u micro the probe manually - it never gets hit.
I like the idea of the map but the probe is just way too much. It gives nearly no time to manage your army in any proper way. And due to deceleration and flawless follow the 90% of time is dedicated to managing your probe... which is really skewed.
Also getting warp gates as Protoss is pretty detrimental.
hmmm hella good idea but keeping the probe away from the fast ling is very difficult. even when i did control the probe directly, I was having a hard time not getting hit by the ling.
it is very good that way points are not used since that would be too easy. but the ling speed is too much. haha but maybe i just suck.
Interesting how when you waypoint, even if its a straight line, the "proberto" (haha) will decelerate ever so slightly, giving the zergling a chance to catch up. So to those who thought they weren't doing smoother waypoints, it has nothing to do with that. The probe really just requires us to reissue a command every 2-3 seconds, you can do fairly sharp turns and not get attacked if you're manually controlling it. Once i realized this, the probe never died since then.
As pointed out, its not designed to simulate scouting or keeping a probe alive. I think it's to macro building production as a few units are in combat. Great map, definitely helped me drastically with multitasking.
Awesome map. Has helped a ton! Working on hard now >.< I really don't think the probe is too much at all. It's fairly easy to control you only really need to pay attention to it during corners. Still very tough, though. Keep it up! Expanding would be awesome.
Might I suggest instead of the probe/zergling thing, you have a marauder with shells and we have to micro a zealot away from us? That's definitely possible without being extremely hard. Once the zealot dies, another one spawns. Or if the marauder dies, the scenario in the top right happens like it does now. Otherwise, the map is good as it is. I'd throw something else instead of "saving random dude in the corner", because that's simple as long as you know what your race's dropship is, and if you can micro your "army" while making your base, you should have no problem sending a dropship over. mineral limits need to be lowered, it's way too easy to spend money.
On May 16 2010 09:04 Silvus wrote: Thank you, I've had a lot of fun with this.
I do wonder why it isn't a probe chasing the probe. ...It would be much less work and is probably counter intuitive to the goal of the trainer, I do think the dmg output of a probe would be much more aligned to easy mode.
Answered your own question, though I think probe on probe might be okay for a "Very easy" mode perhaps, otherwise keep it imba! :D
This map has definitely helped me a ton. Great job really. Easy setting was was doable even on first try. Normal already took me a couple of tries until i finally beat it for the first time (and i could feel my multitasking improve durng the process) Hard setting ... well ... i got raped every single time so far. One thing always gets me wether its the attacks, that i fail to micro my probe or that i forget to spend my minerals during a fight while microing the probe at the same time.I think it will take me a loooong time before i will be able to get through that. Just out of curiosity: has anybody here as been able to beat hard setting playing as terran so far? (And if yes what build did you use)
Feature Request: can you please, if possible, add an APM counter? I'd love to see the APM counter that you see in the Replay dropdown on this map, so I can monitor how my APM is improving from the use of this map.
This is one of the best trainers for an RTS game ive played, I highly recomend it if you want to improve your game. Beat it yesterday on easy setting, its a little easyer then the BW hotkey trainer.
LMAO Defeat: That was sneaky man? Thats hardwork to kill the ling on hard. You should make it so that the terran will all in and kill you if you weren't macroing properly.
That ling is fast. The SCBW version had a zealot which was slower than workers...:/.
My apm during this is exactly the same as during ladder games. Feels a lot more stressful though. T_T I abused broodlords to win on normal. Muta/Bane/Ling and Roaches both failed hard. I don't wanna try hard. That can't be good for your mental health.
On May 16 2010 14:02 rabbitXIII wrote: does anybody know how to get the replays to work? do i need to put the SC2map file in a certain directory?
You need to open the map in map editor, then ctrl+f9 (or the little arrow SC2 button on the top left) and play it like that. Then the replay will work.
Now I see why I suck so bad at SCII, so far. I have a horrible time doing buildings and saving the probes. My hotkey knowledge and click speed and accuracy is horrendous. Let alone doing a battle if I can get that far. And warpgates grrrrrr. Even on easy. I can't imagine hard. I'll keep working at it a couple of tries per day.
Neat map, I just don't like being restricted to build orders to counter what the computer is going to do, but I suppose it works just to build up mechanics
If it wasn't for the probe, I could do this no problem. I can't keep the damn probe alive, it's absolutely insane. Is there any good methods for getting distance on that little zergling bastard?
On May 18 2010 02:30 Asta wrote: My apm during this is exactly the same as during ladder games. Feels a lot more stressful though. T_T I abused broodlords to win on normal. Muta/Bane/Ling and Roaches both failed hard. I don't wanna try hard. That can't be good for your mental health.
How are you checking your APM? I can't load replays of this and SC2gears won't analyze them either.
Okay I beat it on normal, but it was much harder than easy. I don't know how I am going to beat it on hard because I only had 10 seconds to spare on normal. However, I'm still winning with units combinations that I don't typically use when playing a real game. For example, I find the easiest way to destroy the CC is to nuke the front portion of the enemy base and then just fly in mass Banshees to quickly snipe the CC.
Seems really hard to micro a regular unit composition while attacking the base all the while trying to micro that probe away from the ling.
Easy mode is easy enough... (no need to make it easier imo)
Just focus on the probe and go back to the base a few times to make pylons and warpgates. Hotkey everything, produce a sh-t load of units and a move. Works every time (on easy that is
Now working on normal (got to the end of the game, but was expecting reapers and banshees to show up, instead of a marauder force )
On May 18 2010 04:33 Decko wrote: If it wasn't for the probe, I could do this no problem. I can't keep the damn probe alive, it's absolutely insane. Is there any good methods for getting distance on that little zergling bastard?
Don't use waypoints...
Try to make squares as large as you can and in the corners, make the turn gradually (consisting of small angle variations for the probe). If you do not turn more than about 30-45 degrees at a time, the zerg will not catch you (on easy and normal that is).
However, if you do the same thing with waypoints it often does catch it...
Basically, you have to do your base-stuff in the time the probe goes from one side to the other...
You can use waypoints to get some additional time, but your probe will get some damage (and you need to keep better attention on it for some time until it regenerates).
Would be cool if someone makes a YouTube Video for this map. maybe on hard mode o.O'' This could be included in the first post and as a result get more people to download and play the map. Just an idea.
On May 18 2010 10:02 zak wrote: that's it I am flying over some mutas and protect my probe
Already tried it, don't waste your time: the any air unit that is flown anywhere near the probe region is instantly removed from the map (not even placed back at your hat--it's completely gone). Also you can't build pylons in the area--they instantly die as well (so you can't wall your probe in somewhere).
I succeeded on normal after 3 tries, haven't done hard yet. I feel like the rescue portion would be improved if some small force with missile turrets had to be defeated, requiring dropped troops to be deployed and then brought back as well. For the sake of multitasking...
I've just realized that my computer is too slow to let me do all the shit necessary to beat Easy mode. I'm 1.8GHz and when I click on an SCV it has to be where I clicked in .5 seconds or else it says I didn't click on it. That's not good for trying to select a single SCV for building something.
This was ridiculously fun, great tool to improve multitasking and apm. You should definitely make a map focused on BO and countering strategies/unit composition (if it's possible lol).
Wow, first time Ive seen my apm so high, was averaging 200 and spiking to 300. Not alot for most of you I suppose, but i'm normally in the 40-50s. And that was only for beating easy. Can't imagine was normal would be like.
yeah i found this fairly easy with terran and protoss (normal mode)... but zerg was more difficult for me because i found that i lacked gas - (which in ladder - would be supplemented by expansions and minerals spent that way).... which frustrated me too often for me to continue playing it.
On May 19 2010 16:20 Foooky wrote: yeah i found this fairly easy with terran and protoss (normal mode)... but zerg was more difficult for me because i found that i lacked gas - (which in ladder - would be supplemented by expansions and minerals spent that way).... which frustrated me too often for me to continue playing it.
I beat normal mode with zerg first and much more easily than with terran. I just flew mutas in there, killed a turret and a few marines and was done with it. Terran (tanks and marauders w/ stim and medivac) required much more attention/micro.
On May 18 2010 10:02 zak wrote: that's it I am flying over some mutas and protect my probe
Already tried it, don't waste your time: the any air unit that is flown anywhere near the probe region is instantly removed from the map (not even placed back at your hat--it's completely gone). Also you can't build pylons in the area--they instantly die as well (so you can't wall your probe in somewhere).
So you have to actually control the probe
Why would you try to exploit to win a map who's sole purpose is to train you to be a better player?
Apparently there is a minor issue, your able to set the probe to patrol in a ring around the map, he will then only get hit once in a while, spaced far enough apart that his shields regen. So essentially its set and forget
On May 20 2010 08:42 Altourus wrote: Apparently there is a minor issue, your able to set the probe to patrol in a ring around the map, he will then only get hit once in a while, spaced far enough apart that his shields regen. So essentially its set and forget
This sounds like an amazing tool for my friends to pratice with; many of them just don't understand the concept of multitasking or how important speed is. I'll check it out and forward it on to them. Nice work!
having watched your success on hard mode (congratz btw) it looked rather relaxing. when i try it for protoss it gets way more hectic as i have to actually center my screen onto my base to build supply and warp in units. but awesome training map! good work there...
imagine buying a home trainer bicycle thingy, setting it to auto pedal and complain you dont lose any weight while watching the telly sitting on the couch... some people just dont make any sense at all :D
On May 20 2010 21:34 torfteufel wrote: having watched your success on hard mode (congratz btw) it looked rather relaxing. when i try it for protoss it gets way more hectic as i have to actually center my screen onto my base to build supply and warp in units. but awesome training map! good work there...
imagine buying a home trainer bicycle thingy, setting it to auto pedal and complain you dont lose any weight while watching the telly sitting on the couch... some people just dont make any sense at all :D
Ah, it's still definitely hectic, because if I forget a single step, it seems to make all the difference in the end. At first I truly thought beating hard mode with zerg was impossible, especially with all those siege tanks and roaches taking 2 supply now. But after many attempts, multitasking the probe and my base became second-nature. What I suggest for Protoss is sticking to gateways and queing up units. If you're concerned about the rate of production, I think building more gateways for the sake of easier macro would definitely be worth it. In protoss late game, sometimes I prefer Gateways because it's easier to queue units from 10 gateways off 3-4 bases, giving me time to concentrate on scouting, micro, harassment, simcity, etc. But it's probably much better practice to use Warpgates in the end, since that is more difficult to multitask and will probably make you better overall.
Hurray! Uploaded version 0.9 containing a ton of changes. Read the op for details.
Biggest change is that difficulty settings are now completely customizable. I do however fear that people will end up removing any restriction they find too hard in order to get the satisfaction that they beat the map and that will result in the opposite effect of what was intended. What do you guys think? Are people aware that with great power comes great responsibility or are restrictions necessary to help people improve even if they get frustrated?
Anyway, have fun and keep the feedback coming, it's actually really hard for a single person to test all possible situations
Edit: Would a mod be kind enough to update the thread title to [UMS] Multitasking Trainer v0.9 so that people know that a new version is out?
Hm.. How exactly are you supposed to keep Queen energy down? I always seem to slowly gain more energy than I spend, unless if I'm just not timing it good enough.
On May 21 2010 10:03 Draconicfire wrote: Hm.. How exactly are you supposed to keep Queen energy down? I always seem to slowly gain more energy than I spend, unless if I'm just not timing it good enough.
Creep Tumor?
The new "custom" difficult is awesome. So much work. Thanks for the new version.
You must consider that Mule cost double energy than Larvae/crono for the Hard difficult.
On May 21 2010 10:03 Draconicfire wrote: Hm.. How exactly are you supposed to keep Queen energy down? I always seem to slowly gain more energy than I spend, unless if I'm just not timing it good enough.
Creep Tumor?
The new "custom" difficult is awesome. So much work. Thanks for the new version.
You must consider that Mule cost double energy than Larvae/crono for the Hard difficult.
Crap! I wanted to adjust the energy limits for Terran but I completely forgot. It will be fixed within the day, thanks for pointing it out.
Mm, finally beat it after 3 tries. Felt the zergling vs probe speed needs to be tweaked a bit; it's annoying that the zergling is slightly faster than the probe. If you don't cut every angle around obstacles perfectly it still catches up and gets a hit or two in, even if your probe never stops moving once.
The initial rush on normal feels a bit overdone, as well.
On May 20 2010 21:34 torfteufel wrote: having watched your success on hard mode (congratz btw) it looked rather relaxing. when i try it for protoss it gets way more hectic as i have to actually center my screen onto my base to build supply and warp in units. but awesome training map! good work there...
imagine buying a home trainer bicycle thingy, setting it to auto pedal and complain you dont lose any weight while watching the telly sitting on the couch... some people just dont make any sense at all :D
Ah, it's still definitely hectic, because if I forget a single step, it seems to make all the difference in the end. At first I truly thought beating hard mode with zerg was impossible, especially with all those siege tanks and roaches taking 2 supply now. But after many attempts, multitasking the probe and my base became second-nature. What I suggest for Protoss is sticking to gateways and queing up units. If you're concerned about the rate of production, I think building more gateways for the sake of easier macro would definitely be worth it. In protoss late game, sometimes I prefer Gateways because it's easier to queue units from 10 gateways off 3-4 bases, giving me time to concentrate on scouting, micro, harassment, simcity, etc. But it's probably much better practice to use Warpgates in the end, since that is more difficult to multitask and will probably make you better overall.
i was thinking about not upgrading to warpgates so i have an easier time. but then again as i have written in my first comment, its a training map and i would definitely not do that laddering. sure i can probably screw with the map to be able to beat it, but that is beside the point :D (hometrainer much?) my next step will be using the f5-f8 hotkeys as i am currently not using them playing (man they are soooo far away)
btw. awesome update!!! cant stress enough how cool you are making this map...
On May 21 2010 10:03 Draconicfire wrote: Hm.. How exactly are you supposed to keep Queen energy down? I always seem to slowly gain more energy than I spend, unless if I'm just not timing it good enough.
A solution to this problem is to build a second Hatchery. This is also what I do in multiplayer games to make up a bit for my horrible macro
Uploaded version 0.91 that fixes macro energy limits for all races as well as some minor bugs.
Biggest change imo are the difficulty settings. Since I managed to get some time to playtest the map, I think that the settings are now pretty decent and should cover a wide range of skill.
Uploaded v0.92 fixing just a couple of small bugs i left out in the last version and correcting the descriptions for default difficulty settings. This will probably be the last small version change in a while. Hopefully next update will add some cool new stuff.
He gets the right number of larvae by manually spawning them with each reset, I assume the same could be done after race selection.
um, nope. He gets the right number of larva by restarting the game. If you manually spawn each of them, they arent attached to the hatchery, and using the hatchery's "select larva" button will not select them.
On May 25 2010 03:24 Chriamon wrote: um, nope. He gets the right number of larva by restarting the game. If you manually spawn each of them, they arent attached to the hatchery, and using the hatchery's "select larva" button will not select them.
I was basing my comments on:
Hatcheries only seem to start with three larva if they are created during map initialization. This is not the case in this map since the player has to choose his race first. The only way I found around it was to apply the queen's "Spawn larva" effect on the hatchery which ends up givng it 4 larva instead of 3. I don't think however that this will affect a zerg payer's build order in any way; if it does please tell me and I'll try to fix it.
I've never played the map, especially not as Zerg, but it would seem to me that having to manually select larvae for the three drones isn't a huge deal and even better practice.
Does this mean that the select larvae button doesn't work for the build order tester?
EDIT:I see, the build order tester has been updated since I last looked at the triggers. That is what you meant about resetting.
On May 26 2010 00:33 barraf wrote: By the way, if you play hard as protoss and build 10-gate against fast reapers you need to waste one boost in thin air or you lose for exceeding 50.
Not that it would really matter anyway, but when people go 10 pylon 10 gate they usually chrono as soon as they have 25 energy to get the 9th and 10th probes out faster ^^
Biggest change is the addition of an expansion. It is only enabled for Zerg by default. If you play a different race you can enable it through the custom difficulty settings. Read the OP for details.
I haven't had a lot of time to test the map extensively for balance so please take the time to post your opinions! Does one attack come too early/ late? Is one limitation too hard/easy compared to the rest?
Also, please note that it's much harder to control the difficulty with an expansion present. If you take the expo too early, the Terran forces may seem too easy, if you take it too late they may seem too hard etc.
Some input, on moving the probe around from the beginning; shouldn't we be focused on our build order completely from the beginning, and start the probe running on 10 supply or something, or perhaps we must send a scout to a region which will start the probe running. .
I like the idea, the greatest would be imo : 1)you have to send a scouting worker into a certain zone in the map (i.e. the enemy base) before a fixed time limit. 2)when the scout stops running or get killed you start to have sex with the probe and the zergling for the rest of the game.
edit : of course big thanks to the OP for his work this is serious shit
Good job for the map, it is really more interesting with the expo spot. My only problem with this map is that I can't watch replay to see my Apm I tryed many times it says unable to open map even when i drag the map on the shortcut its not working,
The point isn't for the probe to be a realistic scout, I mean you can focus on your build order vs ai, or in the build order tester, the focus is for you to get better at multi tasking constantly, macro + building stuff + keeping your build order ok all while managing your probe... i mean for a truly realistic setting play real games =). The easiest part of the map for me is the first few minutes cause there isn't that much to do back at base that I cant do really quickly, it's when I have to start warping in units, etc that I need to be careful with my probe.
anytime you pick a race, you get have the possibility to get the overlay/sounds of a different race.
by this i mean, when i pick protoss, i got the terran overlay, along with the error sounds (not enough minerals, more supply depo). this happened a 2nd time, but instead of terran, i got zerg as protoss.
still enjoying the game though. ty for all the updates
On May 27 2010 06:11 hellsan631 wrote: anytime you pick a race, you get have the possibility to get the overlay/sounds of a different race.
by this i mean, when i pick protoss, i got the terran overlay, along with the error sounds (not enough minerals, more supply depo). this happened a 2nd time, but instead of terran, i got zerg as protoss.
still enjoying the game though. ty for all the updates
On May 27 2010 05:38 trancey_ wrote: If i play protoss the terran advisor voice and probe icons and so on will display. Also wtf i don't even win on easy mode, seriously wtf!
it would be awesome to display the apm at the end of a round also
The overlay problem is something I don't know how to fix (if it's even possible) but if you read the OP under the "Knows Issues" section you will see that there is a very easy way to fix this. Be warned that if you don't have an EU client you may have to fix localization after you edit the map. Instructions on doing so can be found here.
Regarding APM, I would love to be able to have it displayed but I don't think Blizzard has implemented a way to do this
This is a cool idea and I'm excited to use it, APM definitely needs improvement as I have never seen myself average over 100, usually closer to 30-50.
The map has a lot of issues though before I can really see it helping me at all. To begin with, the options that are presented are pretty nonsensical... What is Param/Value/A bunch of random numbers supposed to mean? There's 9 different options and I have no idea what they do.
Also, I could be wrong on this and just doing something incorrectly.. but um, isn't that zergling faster than the probe? He catches up every time. Also in a real game, I know for a fact they are faster, you aren't going to be able to outrun a zergling so what is the point? Why don't you just make it an SCV, that would make more sense anyway.
Uhm how am i supposed to keep the probe alive? If i use waypoints it slows down and gets hit, but i cant just focus on it all the time, and more especially you are not supposed to do that ingame anyway, since awypoints work vs other workers and zealots, so the difficulty is a bit exagarated here imho.
On May 28 2010 21:56 Warri wrote: Uhm how am i supposed to keep the probe alive? If i use waypoints it slows down and gets hit, but i cant just focus on it all the time, and more especially you are not supposed to do that ingame anyway, since awypoints work vs other workers and zealots, so the difficulty is a bit exagarated here imho.
THe point isn't to get used to microing a scout vs workers and zealots. The point is to get used to focusing on something other than ur base, and still getting your macro done. You pretty much stay on the probe, use hotkeys to macro, and pop back into your base to build new buildings and such.
I dont know where to post it but... can someone try to create impossible micro, micro-tournaments and impossible units. Their are all bw ums maps ports.
I beat it with the other races, but not yet with Terran even though that's my main race. I just don't have the time to Line up my Siege tanks just right...
I was going to Nuke their line for easy mode, but I guess you're not allowing that?
Great Great Great map. This is so good. Plz add nukes!!
edit: Just decided to make Thor's to do my A-move worked well. Man, Terran gets high on minerals off of 1 base. + Show Spoiler +
This game has Multiplayer 1v1 seeming so Stress free to me. I'm like 100/Diamond which has me at rank 35. I'm fairly low apm at like 80, but playing this helps me keep my head clear durring a game. This is comming from a guy who literally started out as Copper and spent a LOT of time in Silver. THANK YOU so much <3
Could someone publish this on the EU servers? I would like to play this online, and at the same time see which of my friends are online. I'd publish it myself but the retarded map editor wont let me log onto my B.net account from it -.-.
cursor how did you beat it as Z on normal? When I usually attack the number of tanks/marauders rip everything i send apart. Lings/blings/roaches/hydras all die to tank fire and maras with medivacs.
On May 29 2010 22:14 Latham wrote: Could someone publish this on the EU servers? I would like to play this online, and at the same time see which of my friends are online. I'd publish it myself but the retarded map editor wont let me log onto my B.net account from it -.-.
cursor how did you beat it as Z on normal? When I usually attack the number of tanks/marauders rip everything i send apart. Lings/blings/roaches/hydras all die to tank fire and maras with medivacs.
Version 0.93 is already up on EU but I don't think it works right now T_T. I'm slowly trying to fix it but I don't have enough time right now... If anyone has any tips please go ahead!
Awesome map. I have around ~100 apm but I'm having tons of trouble even on easy. I'm trying to really stick to my build order and be on the screen with the probe to hand move it around as much as possible. I feel like this recreates the actual game conditions as much as possible. Like other people have said it would be cool to be able to view your apm but I only wanna see mine after I'm done to see if I'm actually improving and to test my apm with different races and builds.
I am a diamon player which always rank around 10 after every reset and i find your map is super useful for training. Multitasking is what Starcraft alway about, macro your base, harass, defend against harass, micro your army, get map control, scout...
I have just downloaded the 0.93 version and it have everything, but the micro your army part.
I play the map on hard and i find it is really hard and make me try over and over again for about 18hours before i get it done.
I think it gonna be a nice extra if the 0.95 version having: - APM meter , show your APM. - Add a micro army island: Make the Executor island half of what it is now. The other half gonna have an neutral Army vs another army. You have to micro your army to win. The map gonna require you to do it a couple of time depend on the difficulty setting.
It would be sick if it was multiplayer and you could play another person having to micro at their base doing all the same crazy stuff. If you can add in an apm meter plz put in the option to turn it off and only view the apm after it's done. I'm wondering how people are viewing the reps? I've tried dragging on dropping and viewing the reps logged into battle.net and it says it can't open them.
No. The replays can be viewed if you launch the map from the editor with Ctrl+T as test document. Then when you finished playing it you can view the replay from Battle.net ordinarily.
On June 01 2010 00:31 ArmyAnt wrote: No. The replays can be viewed if you launch the map from the editor with Ctrl+T as test document. Then when you finished playing it you can view the replay from Battle.net ordinarily.
That is correct! Apparently, you can watch the replay normally if you launch the map from inside the editor (it's located in the same folder as the sc2 executable). Ctrl+T however creates a new trigger, Ctrl+F9 is used to test the map (at least in my version?).
On June 01 2010 00:31 ArmyAnt wrote: The replays can be viewed if you launch the map from the editor with Ctrl+T as test document. Then when you finished playing it you can view the replay from Battle.net ordinarily.
Or put the map into game folder: ..\StarCraft II Beta\Maps\ "To run the map just drag it onto the Starcraft 2 shortcut on your Desktop."
How are people beating this with zerg? I'm a diamond zerg with 100 apm but I can't beat it on normal. I've tried one base and two base baneling and roach. I've even tried baneling dropping the command center and that's the closest I've gotten but so many ov's get shot down. Maybe I just need better micro with the ov's?
hello, i really want to try this but since i'm using macosx i can't open the file by drag&drop and we don't have galaxy editor (yet?) outhere - is there any other way to launch it ?
On June 01 2010 02:25 Marou wrote: hello, i really want to try this but since i'm using macosx i can't open the file by drag&drop and we don't have galaxy editor (yet?) outhere - is there any other way to launch it ?
I have edited the zergling's move speed and acceleration (I think) so that it moves slightly slower than a probe. This way it will eventually hit you if you use waypoints but it won't if you actually control the probe during turns.
why punish the use of waypoints? i thought that even pros use waypoints on their scout probe, so that they can more easily multitask
It is not a punishment for using waypoints the purpose of the map is to help with multitasking. If I can do 10 things at once then doing less in the actual game (ie you would be using waypoints to minimize the multitasking)
On June 09 2010 13:16 thezergk wrote: does anyone know how to do this on a mac? whwnever i try to open it with the launcher it logs me onto bnet which doesnt work
Open the map via map editor, then click the SC button on the far right. Did you try this already?
On June 09 2010 13:16 thezergk wrote: does anyone know how to do this on a mac? whwnever i try to open it with the launcher it logs me onto bnet which doesnt work
Open the map via map editor, then click the SC button on the far right. Did you try this already?
On June 09 2010 13:16 thezergk wrote: does anyone know how to do this on a mac? whwnever i try to open it with the launcher it logs me onto bnet which doesnt work
It has been posted countless times in the thread AND it's in the OP ^^
On June 09 2010 15:47 Inori wrote: Any tips on beating it on Hard as Protoss? I manage to survive attack waves and drops, but I fail at cracking the base.
Bunches of immortals possibly? I beat it with those. On easy mode, though.
On June 09 2010 15:47 Inori wrote: Any tips on beating it on Hard as Protoss? I manage to survive attack waves and drops, but I fail at cracking the base.
Just beat it on hard with protoss, in detail 9 pylon and 13 gate (constantly chronoing nex), get a zealot asap for the 2 reapers(dont bother chronoing gateway tho), add another gate and gas, constant zealots, add a cyber core, get warpgate asap and constantly produce zealots get the 2nd gas, add 2-3 sentry whenever u have the gas, add robo bay + citidal when u can, cut probes at about 25-28ish (for refrence you should have about 2 and a half bars when u select all the probes on minerals), get zealot legs and a prism, when the attack comes use guardian shield and make sure your sentries are close enough to zealots for it to benefit them, then send your dudes back to your workers to get rdy for drops, get an obs after the prism cos i swear i got nuked the first time but it never happened again :\...
from here on out just produce pure zealot + sentry and get rdy to add another 2-3 gates since now that you're cutting workers and you econ is maxed you will get an influx quite quickly, and do the obvious saving the templar over and over again, with about a minute left i had a fairly big army of zealot + sentry, send your probes to a-move his base and just as they get in front (they will absorb first round of the tank fire, yay!) a-move zealots + sentry and guardian shield, make sure once the majority of his army is dead you force-attack the cc in time, and make sure u chrono boost even tho you're not producing any units any more.
hope this helps ^^;;
edit: now to kill myself trying to do it on insane, i hope its actually possible and whoever made the map isnt just fuckin with me,
edit2: okay macro limit of 35 is pretty silly on impossible, you cant even open 9 pylon and chrono after its done without going over (which is std opening for 90% of protoss's -_-;
Anyone who has done this on impossible as protoss (or hell, any race), please make a vid of it! I'm keen to see if it is actually possible (dumb question considering difficulty is called 'impossible', i know) or if I'm just wasting my time T-T.
On June 09 2010 13:16 thezergk wrote: does anyone know how to do this on a mac? whwnever i try to open it with the launcher it logs me onto bnet which doesnt work
didn't see an answer to this, but you can use MapCraft to load this map on a mac.
Anyone who has done this on impossible as protoss (or hell, any race), please make a vid of it! I'm keen to see if it is actually possible (dumb question considering difficulty is called 'impossible', i know) or if I'm just wasting my time T-T.
Watching that made me nauseous, but it was worth it for your rage at the end, haha. The only thing I could suggest while watchnig it is less sentries and more stalkers.
I can beat it on normal and i know ill be able to beat it on hard in a few more tries. Impossible looks difficult just because of the size of the army thats in the terran base.
rofl anyone who was just watching my stream knows i get so close to beating impossible. on my last try, i would have won but i misclicked my warp prism so it was in range of one viking and i noticed it just a second too late so it died. but i killed the orbital command with 9 seconds left. just needed one more rescue of tassadar -_-
Fun game but I think the only thing I have a problem with it is that you are too vague on what to do with the executor. The beacon is way off on the left side and to be honest, I had no idea it existed until I opened it in the map editor. Something simple as in pinging the executor on the right island then pinging it to the beacon would help. I was frustrated when I had everything right but the temp was next to my Nexus instead of the beacon.
Wow..this map is very impossible..I can't even beat it on easy. It's annoying because you have to tech up to drop ships to rescue that stupid high templar, I focus on keeping that probe alive, when the terran attacks me I don't have enough units to defend it seems. Haven't gotten very far with it..Any tips on multitasking? TT very frustrating map when a high level diamond can't do it
Great map though, going to play it until the beta is back up and basically nothing but it..My multitasking is just horrible when it comes to keeping a probe alive .. WTB Bisu's multitasking (Bisu of 2 years ago, not this year ^^
On June 12 2010 11:15 NuKedUFirst wrote: Wow..this map is very impossible..I can't even beat it on easy. It's annoying because you have to tech up to drop ships to rescue that stupid high templar, I focus on keeping that probe alive, when the terran attacks me I don't have enough units to defend it seems. Haven't gotten very far with it..Any tips on multitasking? TT very frustrating map when a high level diamond can't do it
Great map though, going to play it until the beta is back up and basically nothing but it..My multitasking is just horrible when it comes to keeping a probe alive .. WTB Bisu's multitasking (Bisu of 2 years ago, not this year ^^
I was able to beat easy on my second attempt (mostly due to the first attempt being "wait, what do I do?"), and normal on my 4th, 5th & 6th. No offense, but your ranking is mostly irrelevant to the actual gameplay of this map...
Keep trying! Use more hotkeys... Use the camera save functions (Ctrl F5, F6, etc), IF you think they will help...they might not help you, but then again they might, so maybe give them a try. You'll note that the probe always respawns in the same location after you let it die. I use a camera hotkey to that spawn location, so that when my probe dies, I can [QUICKLY] look back at my base, place maybe one building, then tap the camera recall hotkey and go back to the probe spawn instantly. Then simply select the probe and move it.
Keeping the probe alive: Use the whole area for the probe to run from the ling, i.e. don't keep making turn after turn after turn in a small area. The ling will not catch up to the probe, at least on easy, when they are running/chasing in a straight-line path. Make sure when you move the probe, don't use waypoints (i.e. shift+rally) for the probe. It's well-proven that the probe will slow down when using rally points, hence why you actually have to manually turn the probe using several move commands to stay ahead of the ling. If you do this, while using the whole area, the ling will be far enough behind that your probe's shields will regen by the time it is hit again, and not lose any actual HP (only shields).
Also, when you get a new probe, make sure to issue the move command first; that is, hotkey the probe once it's already running away from the ling. I also find that, depending on where the probe was killed, it's better to let the ling catch up a bit. For example, if I was killed in the bottom right corner, and the respawn is bottom left, running straight up or diagonally up-right would give the ling a very short distance to close. So, I let it approach the probe to keep the move paths in a straight line, so every time I turn the probe, the lings catchup time is maximized after/if it even hits my probe.
Also, if you don't have enough units? Just make more. I know, that sounds stupid. But, you have minerals to mine...you have to spend them and keep them under a certain level. Alternatively, consider the possibility that perhaps it's not a matter of not having enough units, but not having the right units Try varying your unit mixtures. Are you casting enough spells? I'm not sure what race you're using, but say we're doing Toss...are you using guardian shields? Forcefields? Blink? Etc etc. Consider also that you probably will have enough time to get an attack upgrade (two if you double-forge...I mean, you do get an absurd amount of minerals and have to keep them under a certain amount, right?) , or armor, etc. Maybe two of each, double-forge. It's not exclusively about multitasking, you still need to have good unit positions, and pick your battle targets wisely...
Some of these things sound simple in concept, and are things that will probably make you go "well no shit, DUHRRR". But it's really easy to forget about some of these concepts when you're in a higher-intensity micro/macro situation with so much going on at once, especially if you aren't familiar with the pace. Consciously remind yourself to keep up the basics. And make sure to do so!
If it's too hard, then keep playing it.....it's a trainer, so go train!
I am playing on Mac OS X and when I open it in mapcraft it says unable to open map. Is there something I can do about this or do I just need to get a life for the duration of the Beta's downtime?
On June 12 2010 14:11 EnderPR wrote: I am playing on Mac OS X and when I open it in mapcraft it says unable to open map. Is there something I can do about this or do I just need to get a life for the duration of the Beta's downtime?
It's not working for me either
Not sure if I'm doing something wrong though.. just won't load the map.
On June 12 2010 05:06 Liquid`NonY wrote: rofl anyone who was just watching my stream knows i get so close to beating impossible. on my last try, i would have won but i misclicked my warp prism so it was in range of one viking and i noticed it just a second too late so it died. but i killed the orbital command with 9 seconds left. just needed one more rescue of tassadar -_-
oh wow i dismissed it as impossible. I'm beating if before you >
can someone explain again how to watch replays? i stored the map in the /maps directory and when i double click a replay it game loads to 100% and then freezes on the loading screen. how do i access the in-game replay system when bnet 2.0 is down?
On June 02 2010 17:25 DeCoup wrote: Yeah you can watch replays as long as you store the map in /Maps You can just access the replays from the in-game replay system fine if you do this.
One thing though, for some reason, I can't use .93 even through the SCII Editor. I always get the following message: Unable to load file (Core: file not found): ComponentList.SC2Components
On June 12 2010 17:41 Inori wrote: Finally beat it on hard as protoss without using probes. By the time I attack I have about 100 food army: 3-4 Immortals 2-3 Sentries rest Zealots
I time it so I attack as soon as Charge upgrade finishes which is about 1.30 mins before end of the game.
Ofc all this means crossing fingers and hoping no banshees will come. No idea how to win this map with them.
Impossible here I come! :<
you'll need that army but maybe 4-5 immortals and like 90 seconds earlier. and you'll have more things attacking you :o
I'm very happy there is finally some serious discussion about the harder settings
As I've posted before, I haven't had enough time to play the map as much as I want to get a really good feel to its balance (and I still don't >:[ ) and there is always the fact that I can only judge according to my skill level... So I would really appreciate some feedback from you guys on difficulty settings as well as new features you'd like to see.
But before you do that please note the following:
If you are going to post about difficulty, please try to write about your skill level -preferably mention both what league you were in the beta as well as which setting you can beat in the map. It will help a lot.
The way the difficulty levels are intended to work is:
Very Easy: For beginners. Easy: Gold and below level players Normal: High Plat- Low Diamond Hard: High Diamond Players ~C+ and upwards on iccup Very Hard: Gosus (I was sooo happy to learn that the map has been giving Nony a hard time :D)
I want the map to be actually hard in terms of multitasking and crisp execution of your build, not based on luck or gimmicky build orders. In my opinion Hard mode succeeds in this (I just play it with a normal 3 gate robo) but does Impossible? I have thought about adding ~30 seconds to both, do you think I should?
Also, two new features are being added to the map: It checks if you are forgetting to make workers (up to a certain worker number), if you are not making creep tumors in time nad if you have more than a set number or lava sitting. I have not decided yet if these should be added to the objectives (ie don't have your main building idle for more than 60 seconds total until you have 30 workers"), be optional objectives, or just cause notifications to appear ("you are not making workers/next creep tumor available in xx seconds"...) with no relation to victory conditions. Opinions?
Platium player here, I managed to beat normal quite easily, but hard is tough. Surviving the initial attacks is easy enough, but actually having enough time to mass up to take out the base while managing the probe and rescuing the executor is very challenging.
Also, I came across a glitch where I couldn't select the executer, so I couldn't rescue him.
I have thought about adding ~30 seconds to both [Very Hard and Impossible], do you think I should?
...
Also, two new features are being added to the map: It checks if you are forgetting to make workers (up to a certain worker number), if you are not making creep tumors in time nad if you have more than a set number or lava sitting. I have not decided yet if these should be added to the objectives (ie don't have your main building idle for more than 60 seconds total until you have 30 workers"), be optional objectives, or just cause notifications to appear ("you are not making workers/next creep tumor available in xx seconds"...) with no relation to victory conditions. Opinions?
Yes, I don't feel there is enough time to get the unit composition/upgrades I need in Very Hard/Impossible.
I do like the worker and creep tumor notification, and agree they should not be related to victory conditions.
I was about to make lots of threads about multitasking, how I can get better, the fact that I have a LOT of problems in maintaining macro whilst scouting.
This one map answers pretty much answers all my concerns.
I'm concerned, that I beat Easy without any particular build order. (Beating Easy is big news for me, I'm silver/gold league). Did standard 13 gate stuff, no problem, and from then on it got a bit random.
I got a robo facility pretty quickly, to rescue the dude, and then decided to run with it, and spammed collossi at the same time as shit loads of z&s&s.
However, I understand from your post that you think 'Hard' succeeds in eliminating lucky build orders.
One suggestion though, I find the beginning a little too random. At the beginning (like first 5 seconds), there's not even stuff for the pros to do, so, is there any way of delaying proberto being chased by even 5 seconds? That's enough time to split workers and hotkey main base, which is probably what everyone does.
Anyway, thanks a lot - it's perfect training and whilst the beta is between phases, the timing for me really couldn't be better. Look forward to improving and tackling the higher difficulties.
On June 13 2010 06:50 Karmoon wrote: I was about to make lots of threads about multitasking, how I can get better, the fact that I have a LOT of problems in maintaining macro whilst scouting.
This one map answers pretty much answers all my concerns.
I'm concerned, that I beat Easy without any particular build order. (Beating Easy is big news for me, I'm silver/gold league). Did standard 13 gate stuff, no problem, and from then on it got a bit random.
I got a robo facility pretty quickly, to rescue the dude, and then decided to run with it, and spammed collossi at the same time as shit loads of z&s&s.
However, I understand from your post that you think 'Hard' succeeds in eliminating lucky build orders.
One suggestion though, I find the beginning a little too random. At the beginning (like first 5 seconds), there's not even stuff for the pros to do, so, is there any way of delaying proberto being chased by even 5 seconds? That's enough time to split workers and hotkey main base, which is probably what everyone does.
Anyway, thanks a lot - it's perfect training and whilst the beta is between phases, the timing for me really couldn't be better. Look forward to improving and tackling the higher difficulties.
Cheers.
Splitting workers has a negligible effect anyway. There are a few threads on this. Hotkeying your main can come later...
Personally, I like the fact that the beginning is random, since it trains your multitasking regardless of the exact timing that you expect...If you beat easy, that's good. I think a gold level player should be able to take easy (given that the player is a solid gold-level, one that belongs there and didn't just ace 5 n00bs in placement matches.) As I recall reading somewhere in this thread, the ling speed is actually slower on easy/very easy (possibly normal? I don't recall, it's been a while since I did normal or below...) than the higher levels.
If you're concerned that you beat easy, easily, don't be. I mean, it is EASY . Do normal! So if you're finding it too easy, on easy, move up :D I think the challenge is pretty rewarding once you move up to the next level.
On June 13 2010 04:20 stet_tcl wrote: [*] The way the difficulty levels are intended to work is:
Very Easy: For beginners. Easy: Gold and below level players Normal: High Plat- Low Diamond Hard: High Diamond Players ~C+ and upwards on iccup Very Hard: Gosus
FWIW, I kind of saw the split a little differently. Perhaps I just put a little less stock in the skill levels of plat/diamond players, given how ridiculously easy those leagues were for me, and the "current" (read: before beta shutdown) state of the AMM system... The game definitely gets more challenging...the jump from easy to normal is pretty appropriate. The jump for normal to hard is pretty appropriate too...what I mean is that the skill gaps between easy (high bronze-silver, imo) and normal (high silver-gold?) seem appropriate. The jump between normal & hard (high gold-LOW level diamond) seems fitting, and the jumps past that (high level diamond, and beyond to proleague status) to impossible seem pretty good.
On BNet though, I find that the copper/silver leagues to be almost indistinguishable in terms of opponent skill (having 0-5'ed one reset to see how accurate the AMM was, and how easy or hard it was to move between leagues). Gold is kind of the "middle child" of the leagues...I came across people who definitely belonged in a higher...metal, and people who definitely belonged in a lower one. Rarely did I find somebody who I thought "Yea, this is a 'gold' level player".
So, to me, here's the breakdown (of course, I'm not the mapmaker! Just my comment on difficulty of the game, vs difficulty of the actual leagues, in my experiences...a preface: I found the poll option of '750 + games' in the thread "how many games did you play during phase 1 of beta" to be too low of a maximum poll option, so I did have a lot of experience playing and experimenting through the various leagues. This is just my opinion though.)
Very Easy: Low/mid? silver and below. Easy: Mid silver to low gold. (Assuming gold is kind of an amalgamation of silver and platinum players who never really got placed in their appropriate league...which is how it seemed to me.) Normal: Low gold to mid platinum. Hard: Mid platinum-mid diamond Very hard: Mid-High diamond Impossible: Proleague, I assume.
So if you're finding it too easy, on easy, move up :D I think the challenge is pretty rewarding once you move up to the next level.
I'm high diamond, macro limit of 35 as protoss is really dumb on impossible, the standard build litterally loses because u usually dont chrono boost until the pylon finishes, lol.
So, I'm one of these Mac users... I can load various maps in MapCraft, but not this map. So there's something about this map that makes us Mac users unable to use it... And it's sad, cause it's a good map and now I have to boot up my slow goddamn PC to be able to play this map Just some feedback
The thoughts of a very low level player on this wonderful tool
Race: Terran
League: Low Silver (Haven't played the original SC nor any RTS for the last 10 years for that matter), so yes, I'm a big n00b ^^ Highest difficulty passed: Easy, currently stuck on Normal
Comments The first time I played Very Easy I thought it was impossible. There was no way for me to micro the probe while still macroing up my base. However, after a couple of tries it became easier to do this, and I think after like 5 tries I beat Very Easy. I just went MMM and it worked for me. After beating it a couple of times I moved on to the next difficulty level. Easy was something more difficult. I again needed some tries to get used to the faster gameplay, but again I managed to beat it after like 5 tries. This time I used Banshees with cloaking to attack the enemy Command Centre. After beating Easy a couple of time I moved on to normal. And Normal is were I’m stuck since. Keeping my probe alive is no problem anymore, neither is building up my base or macroing my economy. Rescuing the Tasador three times seems like a walk in the park. However, the time limit seems the big deal breaker for me. I never manage to get enough units to destroy the enemy Command Centre. Or maybe it’s I’m not microing my units enough. What strategy do you guys use as Terran? I beat Easy every time I play, but I can’t for the life of me figure out how to beat Normal. Any advice is appreciated!
Ideas for improvement Keeping my probe alive is no problem. Neither is rescuing the Tasador, nor is building up my base. The biggest problem I seem to have right now is to multitask while I'm attack with my army or when I'm being attacked. During “combat-time” I always forget either to keep my mineral count low, or to keep my energy low, or to keep my probe alive, or to macro my base. However, I find it very difficult to train this, since only around 10% or so of the total playing time is “combat-time”. So maybe add a new mode where you are given an army large enough to attack the enemy base, but you may never let your probe die once, or something along those lines? I hope you understand the problem I have, since the way the trainer works now, I have to play through the entire scenario again just to see my attack fail once more. Anyway, it’s probably the best tool out there to train multitasking, and I’m playing it a lot to become better at it! Thanks for making such a wonderful tool!
This map is extremely hard as zerg, a general roach/hydra army won't be able to break their siege tank line. Seems that the only option is to tech up to broodlords/ultras but the time limit ensures that i wont have enough time to mass up a decent amount to win. The mineral limit also prevents me from getting a FE as i will end up with not enough larva to burn away my minerals.
On June 13 2010 19:13 fierypower wrote: This map is extremely hard as zerg, a general roach/hydra army won't be able to break their siege tank line. Seems that the only option is to tech up to broodlords/ultras but the time limit ensures that i wont have enough time to mass up a decent amount to win. The mineral limit also prevents me from getting a FE as i will end up with not enough larva to burn away my minerals.
iirc correctly people have beaten the hard difficult with just zerglings...
I'm trying to use mapcraft as well, but can't get it to work. Is there a step-by-step I should be using? At the moment I've just been selecting the files and pressing launch, but to no avail
I really like this map, it's good if u want to train when Bnet is off but i find Hard really really hard(:D) to beat because the base of computer is so well defended(many tanks, viking/turret). It's not that hard to keep probe alive, rescue the hero, and still be good at macro(i am 2000+ plat or 1000 diamond) even on impossibile but what makes me mad is attacking the base. It's quite easy till normal ( i was playing terran ) but i still had to siege tanks to take down meat in front of the tanks otherwise i would just get demolished by those 4-5 tanks behind marine/maruder army. But i actually find it too little time to beat it at hard but i will try more today and give some feedback
Edit. i almost cannot imagine breaking it with zerg
The thoughts of a very low level player on this wonderful tool
Race: Terran
League: Low Silver (Haven't played the original SC nor any RTS for the last 10 years for that matter), so yes, I'm a big n00b ^^ Highest difficulty passed: Easy, currently stuck on Normal
Comments The first time I played Very Easy I thought it was impossible. There was no way for me to micro the probe while still macroing up my base. However, after a couple of tries it became easier to do this, and I think after like 5 tries I beat Very Easy. I just went MMM and it worked for me. After beating it a couple of times I moved on to the next difficulty level. Easy was something more difficult. I again needed some tries to get used to the faster gameplay, but again I managed to beat it after like 5 tries. This time I used Banshees with cloaking to attack the enemy Command Centre. After beating Easy a couple of time I moved on to normal. And Normal is were I’m stuck since. Keeping my probe alive is no problem anymore, neither is building up my base or macroing my economy. Rescuing the Tasador three times seems like a walk in the park. However, the time limit seems the big deal breaker for me. I never manage to get enough units to destroy the enemy Command Centre. Or maybe it’s I’m not microing my units enough. What strategy do you guys use as Terran? I beat Easy every time I play, but I can’t for the life of me figure out how to beat Normal. Any advice is appreciated!
Ideas for improvement Keeping my probe alive is no problem. Neither is rescuing the Tasador, nor is building up my base. The biggest problem I seem to have right now is to multitask while I'm attack with my army or when I'm being attacked. During “combat-time” I always forget either to keep my mineral count low, or to keep my energy low, or to keep my probe alive, or to macro my base. However, I find it very difficult to train this, since only around 10% or so of the total playing time is “combat-time”. So maybe add a new mode where you are given an army large enough to attack the enemy base, but you may never let your probe die once, or something along those lines? I hope you understand the problem I have, since the way the trainer works now, I have to play through the entire scenario again just to see my attack fail once more. Anyway, it’s probably the best tool out there to train multitasking, and I’m playing it a lot to become better at it! Thanks for making such a wonderful tool!
After the games comes out there should be a save function so you will be able to specifically train any part of any map available. As the things are now - either learn how to make your own maps or try being creative with the ones you have. microing your units in an imaginary battle before the attacks comes is a fine alternative imo. Or using the unit tester map but with your attention divided between a probe somewhere and an actual battle.
The thoughts of a very low level player on this wonderful tool
Race: Terran
League: Low Silver (Haven't played the original SC nor any RTS for the last 10 years for that matter), so yes, I'm a big n00b ^^ Highest difficulty passed: Easy, currently stuck on Normal
Comments The first time I played Very Easy I thought it was impossible. There was no way for me to micro the probe while still macroing up my base. However, after a couple of tries it became easier to do this, and I think after like 5 tries I beat Very Easy. I just went MMM and it worked for me. After beating it a couple of times I moved on to the next difficulty level. Easy was something more difficult. I again needed some tries to get used to the faster gameplay, but again I managed to beat it after like 5 tries. This time I used Banshees with cloaking to attack the enemy Command Centre. After beating Easy a couple of time I moved on to normal. And Normal is were I’m stuck since. Keeping my probe alive is no problem anymore, neither is building up my base or macroing my economy. Rescuing the Tasador three times seems like a walk in the park. However, the time limit seems the big deal breaker for me. I never manage to get enough units to destroy the enemy Command Centre. Or maybe it’s I’m not microing my units enough. What strategy do you guys use as Terran? I beat Easy every time I play, but I can’t for the life of me figure out how to beat Normal. Any advice is appreciated!
Ideas for improvement Keeping my probe alive is no problem. Neither is rescuing the Tasador, nor is building up my base. The biggest problem I seem to have right now is to multitask while I'm attack with my army or when I'm being attacked. During “combat-time” I always forget either to keep my mineral count low, or to keep my energy low, or to keep my probe alive, or to macro my base. However, I find it very difficult to train this, since only around 10% or so of the total playing time is “combat-time”. So maybe add a new mode where you are given an army large enough to attack the enemy base, but you may never let your probe die once, or something along those lines? I hope you understand the problem I have, since the way the trainer works now, I have to play through the entire scenario again just to see my attack fail once more. Anyway, it’s probably the best tool out there to train multitasking, and I’m playing it a lot to become better at it! Thanks for making such a wonderful tool!
After the games comes out there should be a save function so you will be able to specifically train any part of any map available. As the things are now - either learn how to make your own maps or try being creative with the ones you have. microing your units in an imaginary battle before the attacks comes is a fine alternative imo. Or using the unit tester map but with your attention divided between a probe somewhere and an actual battle.
Ok, that sounds fair enough, thanks for the fast response! I'll just wait for the save function, and until then I got enough to work on to improve my game anyway. This trainer will keep me busy for the next few weeks, so thanks again for creating this awesome tool!
However, does anybody got some advice on beating Normal as Terran? What units did you build and build order did you use? Thanks in advance!
Ok, that sounds fair enough, thanks for the fast response! I'll just wait for the save function, and until then I got enough to work on to improve my game anyway. This trainer will keep me busy for the next few weeks, so thanks again for creating this awesome tool!
However, does anybody got some advice on beating Normal as Terran? What units did you build and build order did you use? Thanks in advance!
Its not only you Nielsje_8! Im struggling on Normal with Protoss. Again i seem to be able to keep the probe alive, defend against the harrass/drop, get the Tassador, but cannot get enough units to get past those sieged tanks. I deffinitely think that its my micro letting me down, however can't help feel that I need to get more Immortals out or something. Always seem to struggle against Siege Tanks. Any other Toss players playing this just gone mass Immortal or any other ideas?
Ok, that sounds fair enough, thanks for the fast response! I'll just wait for the save function, and until then I got enough to work on to improve my game anyway. This trainer will keep me busy for the next few weeks, so thanks again for creating this awesome tool!
However, does anybody got some advice on beating Normal as Terran? What units did you build and build order did you use? Thanks in advance!
Its not only you Nielsje_8! Im struggling on Normal with Protoss. Again i seem to be able to keep the probe alive, defend against the harrass/drop, get the Tassador, but cannot get enough units to get past those sieged tanks. I deffinitely think that its my micro letting me down, however can't help feel that I need to get more Immortals out or something. Always seem to struggle against Siege Tanks. Any other Toss players playing this just gone mass Immortal or any other ideas?
I hiiiighly doubt its your micro letting you down, on hard i just a-moved my army to victory to beat it...
We seem to have the same problem, Barroo. Good to know it's not just me ;-)
40 tries on Normal as a Terran, and up until now all my strategies failed: Banshees failed, Mech failed, MMM failed, mass Marines failed. But I will beat this, no matter how many tries it will take me! Maybe anybody got any advice on beating this as a Terran?
On a side note, anybody knows how to watch replays? After the last patch I can't seem to watch replays by opening it with the Blizzard Launcher.
OMFG, I finally know where to put that fucking executor. Don't know how many times I've actually beaten this but lost because after killing of the command center.
On June 13 2010 09:49 Ftrunkz wrote: Some feedback:
I'm high diamond, macro limit of 35 as protoss is really dumb on impossible, the standard build litterally loses because u usually dont chrono boost until the pylon finishes, lol.
yeah this is kinda weird but there are other things that make you do non-standard things. like i have to build a warp prism. i have to defend against drops. i know the reapers are coming, but after they're dead, i dont have to worry about defense until the marauder attack. but this map doesn't have to follow standards from multiplayer in order to work on multitasking. also, it's probably good that the artificial setup makes you do non-standard things because it forces you to invent your own build order specifically for that map. so it's a lesson on optimizing build order under certain conditions and multitasking.
Is it even possible to beat the hard level as terran? I can defend the reapers, keep my probe alive, and rescue the executor 5 times, but how do you kill the base in that time limit?
On June 13 2010 22:45 Newguy wrote: Is it even possible to beat the hard level as terran? I can defend the reapers, keep my probe alive, and rescue the executor 5 times, but how do you kill the base in that time limit?
Can beat this map now on normal as toss, took me about 5 tries before my first clear. My army consists of zelots with charge and usually around 5 immortals, attacking when I reach 100 food. I haven’t bothered getting warpgate any of the times since I haven't needed it. Looking forward to doing this on hard
On June 13 2010 09:49 Ftrunkz wrote: Some feedback:
I'm high diamond, macro limit of 35 as protoss is really dumb on impossible, the standard build litterally loses because u usually dont chrono boost until the pylon finishes, lol.
yeah this is kinda weird but there are other things that make you do non-standard things. like i have to build a warp prism. i have to defend against drops. i know the reapers are coming, but after they're dead, i dont have to worry about defense until the marauder attack. but this map doesn't have to follow standards from multiplayer in order to work on multitasking. also, it's probably good that the artificial setup makes you do non-standard things because it forces you to invent your own build order specifically for that map. so it's a lesson on optimizing build order under certain conditions and multitasking.
Pretty much this, when I know an attack is coming I just pop a few bunkers down, kinda exploits it but the traditional build orders do not work. Also, saving that HT is kind of a pain when you are forced to get drop ships.
I go 10 overlord 12 pool Spine Crawler + lings + queen as soon as pool finished to kill reapers.
Then I tech to lair as soon as my queen pops (to get overlord upgrades asap). The problem however, is that I don't have enough units to fend of the attack that comes next. Mass Spine Crawlers work, but they become useless when you have to attack.
Oh man im feeling so good right now. Finally cleared this on normal and now gonna start working on hard. Should be fun. Although I will prob try to clear it with the other races on normal first.
On June 14 2010 00:02 Nightbiscuit wrote: Anyone know how to beat it on impossible as Zerg?
I go 10 overlord 12 pool Spine Crawler + lings + queen as soon as pool finished to kill reapers.
Then I tech to lair as soon as my queen pops (to get overlord upgrades asap). The problem however, is that I don't have enough units to fend of the attack that comes next. Mass Spine Crawlers work, but they become useless when you have to attack.
Probably mass units. I played hard on zerg and able to defend against reaper then marauders. But I always lose when I try attacking with my mass units. Maybe anyone got tips playing with Zerg?
Didn't find Hard that bad as P just by spamming chargelot/sentry/immortal out of 2gate/1robo (mid diamond generally on ladder). Pretty much just a moved the terran base other than focusing a couple of siege tanks after the infantry was cleaned up before attacking the CC directly. Impossible seems pretty ridiculous though ><
Hey any tips for terran, I do have some little multitasking skill but the problem is the time limit. I thought that going mass marauder will be the shit but unfortunately it's not.
Feedback -Reapers "just appear" giving not much time to react - would be better if there were cliffs around and they would jump up and walk to the mineral lines instead of appearing -Can't use traditional build orders - MUST get dropships to rescue that HT etc. -Attacks seem huge -Terran is very hard to do this map,
On June 14 2010 03:24 metaldragon wrote: Watching nonys stream and he gets the the end o impposible but im not sure what possible army composition can take out the CC fast enough.
Kill turrets and use DT???
Nony killed the CC yesterday with Immortals/sentries/zealots. His warp prism died in the last second though so he didn't rescue the last templar.
edit: oh wow. he would have done it right then if he had 10 more seconds.
On June 14 2010 03:50 Liquid`NonY wrote: lol yeah just ran out of time with like 4 sentries 4 zealots 6 immortals and the immortals were in range of the OC killing it -_-;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
Can we see a VOD of you coming close to beating or actually beating impossible? I want to see your leet multitasking!
when i beat it i will provide a link. i have gotten really really close 3 times now. 1 time i killed the OC with 8 seconds left but my warp prism died on its last run because of a misclick. 2 other times, i was doing fine on minerals/macro energy/rescues/probe and i was definitely going to kill the OC, but i was just a little bit too slow (one of these, the OC had ~200 health left when ~5 immortals were attacking it. one more round of immortal fire and i would've won)
Props for making the best ums that is related to skill in rts history :> Didn't play sc1 version of this, but doubt it was any cooler than this already is. Just when I thought I figured how to beat this as zerg, finding strat (well very simple in basics) that worked in hard, impossible just brought me back down to zero. How sneaky is that to suddenly upgrade terran's upgrades from 1-1 to 3-3 in last difficulty? Or whatever they were, truly made lings so much less effective
Unfortunate that this can't be completely balanced since different races have a bit differently good army compositions to beat that tank camp in this sort of timing push. I have to assume toss has the best chance to bruteforce in with this time, possibly zerg can match this with perfect macro into timed huge swarmpush. What I find the most annoying is the zerg's capability in getting dropship so much slower. I know the actual drop will go faster since you can have new over waiting at executor's spawn, but still it really eats the multitasking when it's necessary to do most of the dropping while you are about to make the attack. Oh well, rant about nothing, I can't see how to make this better and undoubtly zerg has its benefits on this map also.
Has any non starcraft / warcraft player beat this on normal / hard? I am gonna try to be able to beat hard before beta is back.. First time I played I couldnt even last like 20 seconds but after like 100 SC2 games in the beta I can do pretty good on normal till 6:30
On June 14 2010 09:20 Liquid`NonY wrote: when i beat it i will provide a link. i have gotten really really close 3 times now. 1 time i killed the OC with 8 seconds left but my warp prism died on its last run because of a misclick. 2 other times, i was doing fine on minerals/macro energy/rescues/probe and i was definitely going to kill the OC, but i was just a little bit too slow (one of these, the OC had ~200 health left when ~5 immortals were attacking it. one more round of immortal fire and i would've won)
if someone beats it before me im gonna be like =[
It's has been done quite a while ago (3 weeks) this guy has really low apm too... If you use the same probe path as him it gives you a lot more time to macro your base.
On June 14 2010 09:20 Liquid`NonY wrote: when i beat it i will provide a link. i have gotten really really close 3 times now. 1 time i killed the OC with 8 seconds left but my warp prism died on its last run because of a misclick. 2 other times, i was doing fine on minerals/macro energy/rescues/probe and i was definitely going to kill the OC, but i was just a little bit too slow (one of these, the OC had ~200 health left when ~5 immortals were attacking it. one more round of immortal fire and i would've won)
if someone beats it before me im gonna be like =[
It's has been done quite a while ago (3 weeks) this guy has really low apm too... If you use the same probe path as him it gives you a lot more time to macro your base.
lol? should i even reply to this? #1 he's playing zerg so it's not even comparable. #2 he's playing an easier mode so it's definitely not comparable. the one im playing has more attacks, maybe more enemy upgrades (he never clicks an enemy unit so i dunno), more units in the terran base, requires 6 rescues of tassadar, and has a macro energy cap of 35. more time to macro his base? like because he doesn't have to use warpgates? 1szzzzzzz lololol
On June 14 2010 09:20 Liquid`NonY wrote: when i beat it i will provide a link. i have gotten really really close 3 times now. 1 time i killed the OC with 8 seconds left but my warp prism died on its last run because of a misclick. 2 other times, i was doing fine on minerals/macro energy/rescues/probe and i was definitely going to kill the OC, but i was just a little bit too slow (one of these, the OC had ~200 health left when ~5 immortals were attacking it. one more round of immortal fire and i would've won)
if someone beats it before me im gonna be like =[
It's has been done quite a while ago (3 weeks) this guy has really low apm too... If you use the same probe path as him it gives you a lot more time to macro your base.
lol? should i even reply to this? #1 he's playing zerg so it's not even comparable. #2 he's playing an easier mode so it's definitely not comparable. the one im playing has more attacks, maybe more enemy upgrades (he never clicks an enemy unit so i dunno), more units in the terran base, requires 6 rescues of tassadar, and has a macro energy cap of 35. more time to macro his base? like because he doesn't have to use warpgates? 1szzzzzzz lololol
Aight aight calm down, I only watched your stream for like 5 minutes... I didn't see the mode you selected or what you customized in yours.
On June 14 2010 13:54 mols0n wrote: Has any Terran been able to beat this in Difficult? I can't seem to find the right unit composition to break through the enemy tanks
i only beated it in normal, with mass marauders, but on hard that doesnt work for me yet
I must be multitask-retarded, because I can't beat it on anything other than easy as terran. On normal I just lose so many units from computer's attacks that I can't macro enough until my final push.
I was mid-high rank diamond in beta too <_< That stupid probe is so annoying.
On June 14 2010 15:20 Sadistx wrote: I must be multitask-retarded, because I can't beat it on anything other than easy as terran. On normal I just lose so many units from computer's attacks that I can't macro enough until my final push.
I was mid-high rank diamond in beta too <_< That stupid probe is so annoying.
2 siege tanks + bunker on mmm wave 3 siege tanks on drop wave
cover your base with racks/ factories infront, then place tanks near cc
On June 14 2010 09:20 Liquid`NonY wrote: when i beat it i will provide a link. i have gotten really really close 3 times now. 1 time i killed the OC with 8 seconds left but my warp prism died on its last run because of a misclick. 2 other times, i was doing fine on minerals/macro energy/rescues/probe and i was definitely going to kill the OC, but i was just a little bit too slow (one of these, the OC had ~200 health left when ~5 immortals were attacking it. one more round of immortal fire and i would've won)
if someone beats it before me im gonna be like =[
It's has been done quite a while ago (3 weeks) this guy has really low apm too... If you use the same probe path as him it gives you a lot more time to macro your base.
On June 14 2010 10:59 Powster wrote: Has any non starcraft / warcraft player beat this on normal / hard? I am gonna try to be able to beat hard before beta is back.. First time I played I couldnt even last like 20 seconds but after like 100 SC2 games in the beta I can do pretty good on normal till 6:30
I'm a non-SC player and I have problems beating it on very easy with Terran let alone Normal.
Proberto is the bane of my SC2 existence.
Love this map though. Just wish I had time to play it a little more.
On June 14 2010 10:59 Powster wrote: Has any non starcraft / warcraft player beat this on normal / hard? I am gonna try to be able to beat hard before beta is back.. First time I played I couldnt even last like 20 seconds but after like 100 SC2 games in the beta I can do pretty good on normal till 6:30
I'm a non-SC player and I have problems beating it on very easy with Terran let alone Normal.
Proberto is the bane of my SC2 existence.
Love this map though. Just wish I had time to play it a little more.
Dont worry about it, it's a learning process. I started off not being able to beat very easy.. then you start grapsing concepts of the game and learn your timing. Learn how to deal with the pressure. Within a week I've got to normal but just currently struggling on keeping the probe alive but after my exams I'll give it a good whack .
On June 12 2010 14:11 EnderPR wrote: I am playing on Mac OS X and when I open it in mapcraft it says unable to open map. Is there something I can do about this or do I just need to get a life for the duration of the Beta's downtime?
Place the map file into the "Maps" folder. Filepath is something like "Documents/Blizzard/StarCraft2/Maps". Then open it with Mapcraft and it should run.
I can beat it on normal as terran now and do fairly well on hard, I think once I play it a few more times I can win on hard as terran, but impossible might not even be possible as terran since they have too many tanks for marauder balls to fight, and slow pushing simply isn't an option.
Newguy, could you tell me your strategy as Terran on Normal please? I can't seem to figure out how to amass an army to destroy the enemy Command Centre, or at least I can't do it within the time limit. I usually tech up to 3 tanks and 8 marines for the waves and drops (which are no problem at all), but after that it always ends up the same: my army gets destroyed and is too small to do enough damage to the enemy. Any advice?
Indeed in theory it sounds like pure marauder might be the winning strat here. Tanks + mass vikings in air mode (in impossible there's actually ~10 vikings nullifying any air attempts) simply can't be beaten with any other units since I don't think you can accumulate enough tanks to overcome his armysize in that time (in hard+) and air is totally out of question due to amount of vikings/turrets. Marines are also too crappy dmg takers since you can't even bring medics to fight. Anyhow, while attacking, bringing drones to fight is definately good idea. You're usually attacking when there's 1:30 or less left of time, and you aren't going to do any good with the minerals gathered in the end, so just turn those ~30 collectors into decent meatshield for your marauders.
It's actually quite boring how no race has chance to think of using air units. Sure, it definately throws the suicide zerg drops out of the window but it also throws every possible air unit out of the mix. In impossible there's no chance in any theory to bring a single air unit to fight, so there really is no much strategic elements there when it's clear you're forced to do 1-3 basic ground units in masses with all races.
And I understand asking for complete diversity is stupid, sorry for another rant
ok here is my problem. I want to watch the replay of me playing on the UMS, for example lets say i just beat the UMS in normal, but i want to watch that replay, ok fine i do the procedure like i always do with all replays open directly or just drag to shortcut etc etc, but for some reason i cant watch the ums replays to check my APM because its saying some error about a mod.. i tried to place the map in the mod folder, map folder in pretty much every folder, tried to open the replay trough the editor and nothing, is there some way i can watch the replay of the UMS so i can check the apm plz? ty in advance
I've had a really hard time trying to make a function that calculates a difficulty factor for attack waves depending on the unit numbers and types and the time they occur...
So, after several hours of trying to remember how Mathematica works and tons of interpolations I think I finally have it!
Useless post, I know, I just had the need to tell someone, this has been giving me trouble for quite some time. :D
I only had time to try a couple runs last night - set to Hard. Is the "max macro energy" for queens on a "per queen" basis? Either I got really distracted in my second run, or it is adding the energy of the queens together. Can anyone confirm what it does for zerg?
If it is the combined energy for multiple queens, the max should not be set to 50, otherwise you insta-fail when your 2 queens are vomiting in sync.
On June 15 2010 22:04 DalaiLameR wrote: Just finished "impossible" as Terran
lol was it really close? since it gave you defeat message and your time has run out but you also get victory message
looks like you dropped tanks in back to kill the OC?
congrats
weird that macro energy is 75 for terran. afaik, there's no reason to save it beyond 50. but you get 25 energy of time in case you are slow. protoss has incentive to save energy, like after i build the number of probes i want, i'd rather save all my energy for robotics, but i have to waste two boosts on warp gate research or something, just to keep it below 35. and of course, there's only 10 energy worth of time as a buffer. imo the energy cap for terran should be 55-60. if using a boost asap every time was actually useful, i wouldn't mind a cap of 30 on nexus.
Yeah, i literally killed the OC in the very last second.
I teched to cloakbanshees while defending my main with 2 tanks, turrets and bunkers. Adding many Barracks and producing only banshees. Then floating the barracks first and sneaking the cloakbanshees in the back of the main and killing the OC.
Congrats to you too, just watched your VOD
I think terran has an easier time completing impossible due to their strong basedefense and their easy macromechanic. i really think it should be 65max or even lower (zerg and toss go +10 energylimit), since you really have so much more time.
Anyone claiming zerg has easy time with macro rule really isn't thinking straight. In this timelimit, there's no room for fckups like "oops forgot to re-larva, let's just do few tumors". Of course it depends if you find some sneaky way past bruteforce like Dalai did, then there might be room to macrofailing as zerg too, until proven I doubt it Still thinking 2hat 2queen is the way to go, and I don't see much luck in succeeding if you end up making tumors with that. While queen energy cap is 40 (+15), you have no chance to come back from failing any seconds like p/t do. You know, P can strategically use first at 34, but next time can still be used at 25. If zerg uses one at 32, he can in theory reduce this to 30-31 with perfect macro per round, but still coming back from one 10energy fail often ends up becoming fatal mistake.
I'm totally all ears for successful attempts with stuff like 4hat 5queen though And grats to nony&dalai.
wow really impressive, I've been trying this alot and getting owned, I thought about hallucination but never remembered to actually try it congrats:-)
thx. i did a lot of stupid stuff with hallucinate before i hallucinated zealots. first i did colossi, no idea why. they stood over my other units so they werent soaking up damage from tanks anyway AND they got killed by vikings. then i did archons for a while but i think they were getting held up on attacking vikings. i never had time to watch the battle very much. plus they took up a bunch of room. so i think zealots are probably best
Anyone claiming zerg has easy time with macro rule really isn't thinking straight. In this timelimit, there's no room for fckups like "oops forgot to re-larva, let's just do few tumors".
Is it intended to send your probe on a whole long journey on waypoints? That's just plain stupid... playing as usual and on the other hand you click dozens of waypoints for your Proberto
On June 16 2010 01:35 otscho wrote: Is it intended to send your probe on a whole long journey on waypoints? That's just plain stupid... playing as usual and on the other hand you click dozens of waypoints for your Proberto
not that awesome at all, imo
You can't use waypoints, as your probe will slow down slightly for every waypoint, giving the zergling time to land a hit, so you have to constantly give your probe normal move commands.
I sent my probe on a circuit.. approximately every round Proberto takes some beating... but shield regens fast. Sometime it dies anyways as I have to click accurately.
On June 16 2010 02:58 otscho wrote: I sent my probe on a circuit.. approximately every round Proberto takes some beating... but shield regens fast. Sometime it dies anyways as I have to click accurately.
on easier modes this will work but on harder modes it wont
of course, using patrol does not slow down the probe's speed but the map doesn't allow proberto to patrol
On June 16 2010 02:58 otscho wrote: I sent my probe on a circuit.. approximately every round Proberto takes some beating... but shield regens fast. Sometime it dies anyways as I have to click accurately.
on easier modes this will work but on harder modes it wont
of course, using patrol does not slow down the probe's speed but the map doesn't allow proberto to patrol
I'm afraid NonY is right. You don't get punished for using waypoints on easier settings.
Next order of business when i get the time to work on the map again is to find a way to limit the number of available waypoints for the probe. People would just be wasting their time if they queued waypoints of course but I think it's better I prevent them from doing so anyway ^^
Whaa, did it as zerg finally. Must brag, since no other zerg has showed this done yet. As can be seen from the timeframe, it wasn't exactly totally tight, eventhough attack really got me off my probe control. Proberto had 4 lives @ 1:30 left...
So yeah, constructive criticism about how to tweak impossible a bit: add 2 turrets to left side of the map. That might very well make this map impossible to beat, for t/z dunno, but now drop/banshees seem sort of slightly abusive way to do it, which the lack of turrets allow.
I think the fact that NonY is posting so much here really bodes well for this map. If he thinks its a good way to spend the "downtime"... maybe its a real good way to keep yourself sharp. Run a couple of these a day.
I have a very difficult time beating it on normal. Maybe that's because I'm Terran. (`50% success rate) I find Protoss the easiest on normal, but I don't think I'm ever going to try hard. You guys are insane on hard/impossible. Real nice though. Real nice.
Whaa, did it as zerg finally. Must brag, since no other zerg has showed this done yet. As can be seen from the timeframe, it wasn't exactly totally tight, eventhough attack really got me off my probe control. Proberto had 4 lives @ 1:30 left...
So yeah, constructive criticism about how to tweak impossible a bit: add 2 turrets to left side of the map. That might very well make this map impossible to beat, for t/z dunno, but now drop/banshees seem sort of slightly abusive way to do it, which the lack of turrets allow.
Finally beat it on impossible as P. I used a different strategy than Nony, as his is harder to pull off than mine.
I did 1 zealot to hold the reapers using building placement to block them from killing any probes. I then made 2 robo's, 1 warp prism, then only immortal. eventually i get a support bay and shuttle speed. after the AI's final drop I load up and go straight for the CC.
On June 15 2010 04:03 SainT.Foreverr wrote: ok here is my problem. I want to watch the replay of me playing on the UMS, for example lets say i just beat the UMS in normal, but i want to watch that replay, ok fine i do the procedure like i always do with all replays open directly or just drag to shortcut etc etc, but for some reason i cant watch the ums replays to check my APM because its saying some error about a mod.. i tried to place the map in the mod folder, map folder in pretty much every folder, tried to open the replay trough the editor and nothing, is there some way i can watch the replay of the UMS so i can check the apm plz? ty in advance
Do a search on TL.net for "SC2Gears". IMO, the absolute #1 best APM/replay tool out there...little complicated at first to figure out how to access replays (add folder, list replay source, etc), but the instructions are pretty clear if you don't find it intuitive.
(Actually, I'll link you to the relevant thread so you don't have to find it...I'm a nice guy.) SC2Gears thread on TL
On June 16 2010 08:17 dw wrote: Finally beat it on impossible as P. I used a different strategy than Nony, as his is harder to pull off than mine.
I did 1 zealot to hold the reapers using building placement to block them from killing any probes. I then made 2 robo's, 1 warp prism, then only immortal. eventually i get a support bay and shuttle speed. after the AI's final drop I load up and go straight for the CC.
Finished with 1 second left.
Props to Ouga for doing it as zerg.
Yeah that'd (probably) lose to cloaked banshees. They're pretty rare though. I think I only encountered them twice
On June 16 2010 08:17 dw wrote: I did 1 zealot to hold the reapers using building placement to block them from killing any probes. I then made 2 robo's, 1 warp prism, then only immortal. eventually i get a support bay and shuttle speed. after the AI's final drop I load up and go straight for the CC.
Finished with 1 second left.
Yeah that'd (probably) lose to cloaked banshees. They're pretty rare though. I think I only encountered them twice
Actually IMO cloak banshees are sort of easiest ones to handle - they come so late (like 1:30 left) that you can just ignore them if your technique is to do this with drops or banshees. I had banshees coming on my "kill", but just ignored them and went for the drop instead. I might have had more issues if it was MM drop actually, since 3-3 ups really make them tough to kill when there's 2 medics and they manage to stand next to wall so lings alone can't beat them in almost any numbers. I feel these can't be completely ignored though, since tank drops, late thor drop and mm drops all come at like 02-03min left.
On June 16 2010 07:59 AWEadam wrote: Would you be willing to share what your basic strategy/end unit composition was?
I'd throw rep since it'd be better than 1000 words, but suppose you can't view replays of this map? At least says "unable to load map" or something to me when I try.
But I can say pretty accurate BO and strat since I feel I tweaked the bo to pretty close to perfection until 4:30 push. Skip 4/5 of incoming jizz if you don't care about early game. BANEDROP IS THE KEY
15pool, 16hat 15->18 6lings, they spawn 1-3s before reapers are in. I probably could've slammed pool better, I always put it right next to hat on its right. Thus reapers usually came from left side, and I did my best to do some surround on them. About 50% of the time I got them bugged and lost 0 drones, but if even one got thru, it was usually 2-4 dead, never more tho. While lings popped, did 2 gas, queen, cancelled other gas, 19/18 over. New queen from same hat when first is up. Then just drones until 36/36. @ about 22-25/28 I did 2nd gas, @ 26-28/28 evo chamber. First 100 gas to lair, 2nd 100 gas to +1 melee. Make sure to have 2nd gas instantly mining gas. You want to make sure you have the 200/200 available when lair finishes, and start droptech instantly, to have decent timing window to do the executor drops. I start my droptech @ 7:10 left. After droptech, next gas to lingspeed, and then finally to overspeed. Timings are sick precise, I actually have +1 and lingspeed ready about 5sec prior to mm push/thor drop.
From 36/36 I'll do overs til x/68, and purelings. I have those 6 lings from prior, so I'll end up having (68-33)*2=70 lings if it goes perfectly. 20 of them are enough for the thor, I pick first ones there. I also have one lingscout so I know exactly when MM come, at the maxrange possible. Suppose ovie could do it too.
So the mm push is just countered by surrounding him with those ~40-50 lings. Usually I have some lings still popping when push comes. I'm pretty sure you can't push them back with lings alone without that +1, that medic alone keeps them up too long since lings would do 2dmg instead of 3 to 3armor mm. Also to be noticed, droptech is ready just before push comes so preferably one exe should've been saved at least when push is countered.
After that, it's around 4:00 to do the rest. I like to keep 5 ovies patrolling on top of executor spawn, to make him clickable asap to use less time in making him go into ovie. Last executor in theory could be done with before 1:00 left, which gives decent time to do the last attack.
I kinda feel Z has no good counter to beat those 3-3 upped units straight up, or well I just chose to try do it with banes. For like 20 tries I thought drop wasn't possible due to vikings, but hell ovies have so much hp that if you bring all your 15-20 ovies enough will survive. After all 20 banes is enough to take down the CC. I make the banenest @ 68/68, and just try to load them to make the drop from left side of the map when there's like 1:00 left and as many banes as possible, I had about 40 on successful try. In theory ofc those 20 would be enough, but it's hard to predict what ovies will go down to their antiair You don't really need much extra defense after the push/thor have been taken out.
I believe with good control you could do this without dropping, but still with banes. That just requires tons of lings, all drones and greatly sharing them among the field while banetrain goes straight to CC. Just sucks that few tank hits on banes can fail the whole try
On June 16 2010 08:17 dw wrote: I did 1 zealot to hold the reapers using building placement to block them from killing any probes. I then made 2 robo's, 1 warp prism, then only immortal. eventually i get a support bay and shuttle speed. after the AI's final drop I load up and go straight for the CC.
Finished with 1 second left.
Yeah that'd (probably) lose to cloaked banshees. They're pretty rare though. I think I only encountered them twice
Actually IMO cloak banshees are sort of easiest ones to handle - they come so late (like 1:30 left) that you can just ignore them if your technique is to do this with drops or banshees. I had banshees coming on my "kill", but just ignored them and went for the drop instead. I might have had more issues if it was MM drop actually, since 3-3 ups really make them tough to kill when there's 2 medics and they manage to stand next to wall so lings alone can't beat them in almost any numbers. I feel these can't be completely ignored though, since tank drops, late thor drop and mm drops all come at like 02-03min left.
Hmm that's weird that they came that late. Maybe a bug? I never saw them that late.
Hmm that's weird that they came that late. Maybe a bug? I never saw them that late.
The MM push comes @ 4:30, and has been handled with at like 4:00 right? I don't think any of the last harrasses absolutely have to be dealt with if they come after that? Even the 2nd thor drop, which probably comes out fastest, probably is there at 2:30-3:00 or so? As zerg I'd prolly be able to just transfer drones to expo to overcome this and thor would just shoot down lair and and gases. Other options are nuke (megarare), banshees (rare), mm drop and tank drop, but they don't come too early either. Seeing I pretty much could survive without income from last 2:00, I don't think handling them is absolutely necessary. Still worth taking down ofc, but imo playing expecting banshees costs too much compared to how often they come / how it's still possible to survive without antiair when they do. Ofc didn't play this as T/P to know is the income from <2:00 absolutely vital - would think banshee strat also relies mainly on units produced prior to 2:00. Not to mention, banshee strat definately has so much minerals that can afford to make towers, and I guess making obs with few stalk/sentries isn't much of a defense either. I didn't feel like making 2 spores made much sense against harrass that would only come 1/10 games.
I suppose thusfar only strat that involves straight up fight is yours, and might very well be that no one has thought of way to do working push as T/Z. I don't think any of the drop/air strats need resources from the last 1:30, since only toss can warp in last sec units - my drop can't wait to get the last reinforcements in.
Banshees are really rare indeed ... i got them only 1-2 times.
@ time mine always came @ 3min left or so.
That's different though, imo all waves come faster in "easier" modes. In that aspect impossible isn't all that bad Difficulty in impossible is that 2 waves come at same time @ 4:30 or so, but that automatically delays the 3rd wave a bit imo. In hard I guess MMM comes more like at 6:30 or even sooner? I know I always made spores on hard, because they felt like coming too fast to be ignored.
Cloacked banshees are too strong, I just give up when they come, we need too many things to counter them which are not needed for the other drops (or nuke ).
By the way I can't look at my replays, I want to check my apms ! :/ Is there a way to do it (not using map editor) ?
I can't beat this on hard for the life of me, I'm sure I could do it if I practiced a build that works well for this specific situation, it just seems absurd.
Noob question... how do you select a peon before creating any batiment ?
Playing this map, I saw that I lost a huge amount of time selecting a single probe from the mineral lines. Here is how I did it : - centering screen on the main batiment (5 5, as I put a shorcut to it in 5) - Drawing a little rectangle, hoping to get only one probe.
But sometimes I got 2 probes at once, or I had to wait for a probe to go in my rectangle and then I loose the runnig probe .
So my solution was to assign a shortcut to a mining probe (I used 2), in order not to loose any time selecting it. But is it viable on a real game, when you have to keep 1 and 2 for your armies ?
On June 20 2010 21:41 Heziva wrote: Noob question... how do you select a peon before creating any batiment ?
Playing this map, I saw that I lost a huge amount of time selecting a single probe from the mineral lines. Here is how I did it : - centering screen on the main batiment (5 5, as I put a shorcut to it in 5) - Drawing a little rectangle, hoping to get only one probe.
But sometimes I got 2 probes at once, or I had to wait for a probe to go in my rectangle and then I loose the runnig probe .
As Inori said you'll get better at it with practice. Keep in mind that if you select two probes and issue an order to build something to both only one will go. So when you select more than one probe by mistake it's always better in terms of speed to order both to build (since only one will go) rather than deselecting one or something.
So my solution was to assign a shortcut to a mining probe (I used 2), in order not to loose any time selecting it. But is it viable on a real game, when you have to keep 1 and 2 for your armies ?
Why not use 3? ^^ Many good players used to have a 'builder' probe hotkeyed in Bw, if it suits you I don't see why not do it in sc2.
On June 20 2010 21:41 Heziva wrote: So my solution was to assign a shortcut to a mining probe (I used 2), in order not to loose any time selecting it. But is it viable on a real game, when you have to keep 1 and 2 for your armies ?
Hotkeys are there so you can use them in whatever way you can find it helpful. In this case you should definitely hotkey the running probe and one working probe. It's nice have a system of hotkeying buildings and units but it's also nice to be flexible and to alternate hotkeys and use different schemes.
It's almost irrelevant what keys you use for what you need. Sure it's better to use some keys that you'll easier find without looking but if you get used to some key it doesn't matter if the PROs use some other because you have the same result.
And one more thing, hotkeys are about control. When you need a full control over something hotkey it. Dumb example : say you are a noob, and the only key you are able to press without totally losing yourself is 1. When you scout keep your scouting probe on 1. If you have some army and want to attack get your army on 1. You made your warp prism and want to drop something get your warp prism on 1. This is exaggerated scenario but i hope you get my point.
Obviously in hotkey trainer you have several simultaniously equally important tasks so you need 5-7 hotkeys.
I don't know if this has been said already, but in version 0.93 - the only one I've played so far - there's a bug with Tassadar: if you have overlords hanging above his spawn area, he will stay neutral so you can't pick him up. You have to fly away with your overlords and return and only then he will say his "Khassar de templari" so you can pick him up. Pretty confusing and frustrating in the midst of total chaos.
But that's just a detail. Overall this map is great, well balanced, and - although a little frustrating at times - it's fun! Good job, keep it up!
On June 29 2010 05:16 Migi wrote: I don't know if this has been said already, but in version 0.93 - the only one I've played so far - there's a bug with Tassadar: if you have overlords hanging above his spawn area, he will stay neutral so you can't pick him up. You have to fly away with your overlords and return and only then he will say his "Khassar de templari" so you can pick him up. Pretty confusing and frustrating in the midst of total chaos.
I haven't messed around with it, but that could be a game bug rather than a map bug. If a new unit spawns next to one of your units, it can't be "acquired" by it until you move out and back into capture range.
The way to get around this is to place your first overlord on a patrol over tassadar (e.g., back and forth across tassadar's circle) and place subsequent overlords off to the side. The patrolling overlord will recapture fresh tassadars as they respawn.
On June 29 2010 05:16 Migi wrote: I don't know if this has been said already, but in version 0.93 - the only one I've played so far - there's a bug with Tassadar: if you have overlords hanging above his spawn area, he will stay neutral so you can't pick him up. You have to fly away with your overlords and return and only then he will say his "Khassar de templari" so you can pick him up. Pretty confusing and frustrating in the midst of total chaos.
A bug or not, I overcame it by putting all ovies on patrol above that spot. A bit to side and back to spawnpoint, enough to make him go allied from neutral. Also ovie moves a bit towards beacon after you make npc go into ovie due to patrolling. Thus I'd like to think I countered the bug by making my life easier
edit: meh, 5h idle window and somehow I was beat in solving the prob :p
lots of stuff is broken with the phase 2 beta. (UI and ling it seems so far). hopefully someone is working on fixing these issues, and maybe even publishing! This is like my favorite map ever!
Update compatible with patch 16 should be out later today
On June 29 2010 05:16 Migi wrote: I don't know if this has been said already, but in version 0.93 - the only one I've played so far - there's a bug with Tassadar: if you have overlords hanging above his spawn area, he will stay neutral so you can't pick him up. You have to fly away with your overlords and return and only then he will say his "Khassar de templari" so you can pick him up. Pretty confusing and frustrating in the midst of total chaos.
This is actually a feature. The templar becomes allied with a "unit enters region" trigger so it's normal to have to move your overlord to get him. Don't forget that this is a Multitasking trainer so having to give an extra command or two is never a bad thing...
All problems (that I'm aware of) caused by Patch 16 (including the Zergling and Probe not being able to attack, messed up pulldown items etc) have been fixed.
Added "coach mode". This is aimed at further helping newer players improve their macro. By checking the checkbox on the difficulty selection dialog, you will be notified when you are not making Probes/Scvs as P/T or if you have idle larva and creep tumors as Zerg. These have not (yet) been implemented as Victory objectives and exist solely as a helping tool.
Balance Fixes
No more than two commands can be queued for Proberto to prevent extensive waypoint usage by players using the "Very Easy" and "Easy" difficulty settings.
Added a few turrets to the left of the Terran base to prevent "sneaky" attacks/drops.
Known Problems
The timer window for remaining time has an ugly purple background. This is a Galaxy Editor bug and should be fixed in the next patch.
More bugs could have been caused by the latest patch which I did not see. If you find any please report them! As always I still need feedback regarding balance, possible ways to abuse and suggestions to make the map better.
Awesome, thanks for the fast fix. This map is really great for multitasking while trying to perfect an opening to mid-game build. I can't imagine what impossible difficulty must be like. Coach mode is a really great feature too. Keep up the great work! I'd love to see more maps like this, perhaps against other races with standard opener/rush timings to practice against.
Great map man! Just a fast question: I keep losing everytime because I exceed macro energy cap but I cannot see any indicator of it, can someone explain to me what is it? Thank you! :D
however, the timer ui still appears to have a pink/blue background.
also, since there are no more replays saved for custom games that aren't published, how about some sort of apm indicator or notification upon victory/defeat of the map, so you can record progress and keep track of it.
and perhaps publish it to the US/EU servers if possible?
On July 15 2010 07:59 Ingruz wrote: Great map man! Just a fast question: I keep losing everytime because I exceed macro energy cap but I cannot see any indicator of it, can someone explain to me what is it? Thank you! :D
Its the energy on your nexus/orbital/queen, you got to keep it below a certain level (to make sure you arent forgetting to use your macro mechanic, like chronoboost i.e.)
On July 14 2010 03:10 z01 wrote: I'd love to see more maps like this, perhaps against other races with standard opener/rush timings to practice against.
Me too! As I've said before I don't have the time needed to implement something like that but I would appreciate any help provided
On July 16 2010 07:02 hellsan631 wrote: ty for all the fixes.
however, the timer ui still appears to have a pink/blue background.
also, since there are no more replays saved for custom games that aren't published, how about some sort of apm indicator or notification upon victory/defeat of the map, so you can record progress and keep track of it.
and perhaps publish it to the US/EU servers if possible?
Read the thread please Pink background is a Blizz bug, apm indicator is impossible afaik and detailed victory screen is in the works.
I don't think there would be any use in publishing the map right now, I will as soon as the game is released.
On July 20 2010 16:53 TzTz wrote: Version 0.941 the Zergling won't attack the Probe... It's too easy that way...
TzTz are you absolutely sure you have v0.941? It works normally for all the people I've asked... If you are indeed running 0.941 could you post or PM me some more details like the version of SCII you are running, your operating system, difficulty settings etc.. It would help a lot in identifying the problem.
I've encountered some problems while hitting the SHIFT key. I'm playing protoss, so it's quite cruical for my probes to set some waypoints (Build - back to minerals). The whole game lags as soon as I hit shift - this also happens when I'm pressing ALT to get the lifebars. When the lag stops, my running probe is (alomst) dead.
How do you load it? It used to work by droping the map on top of the SC2(BetA) Icon, now for obvious reasons this wont work, so how can i make it work?
On August 19 2010 07:53 stet_tcl wrote: Sorry everyone, I've had so much work these days I haven't even been able to test the map on the release version TT
I promise, I'll make a release version and publish it (at least on EU) as soon as possible.
Ark0 you should still be able to load it from the editor logically.
That's so nice of you, looking forward to the release version
Man Im a pretty okay Platinum player. Just tried it 3 times on easy-mode.
Its so much harder than I expected. I found it pretty hard 0.o I dont think a lower player could handle it. Anyway I beat it very closely, but could just a move my army in the Terran base and not micro it properly.
it's just a blank map, and if i try to 'test document', it just says that i got no forces, and it's a tie... :/
any help on that? or i'm i just a complete idiot for not understanding how to open this... ???
I think you might have the wrong link for the multitasking trainer. Here's the one I used : http://www.sc2mapster.com/maps/multitasking-trainer/ . The OP said something about using Mapcraft if you're on a Mac, but I can't offer any help on this aspect =/.
From doing a run I am getting a feeling I am learning some bad habits from this. Like queuing up too much and not constantly making SCVs to prevent myself from getting too many minerals.
Basically I am gaming this map to complete it, doing stuff I wouldn't really do normally.
But I guess the more I practice the easier I will be able to play like normal and still make the objectives.
But that zergling vs probe seems unfair even if they are modded. Doesn't help that this makes my hand sweat so much that I gotta micro a towel in RL to handle it :D
My hands hurt from playing it so much, finally beat very easy after 4 tries, i'm on to easy now, i love this map. it's just what i needed to get into a habit of doing things and not sitting around.
Fantastic and Funny!! Im upper gold and took me 4 tries on the easyest to win. After that I feel as if my brain is gonna explode. And I laugh, its so funny, the probe chased by a zergeling
My experience is that not using waypoints but manually turning the probe has better outcome. I played zerg and lots of hydras worked well against the terran. My main problem was that I couldnt spend my money w 2 hatches+qeens and didnt have enough gas for hydras. I tried spamming Overlords and Hatcheries which worked.
My only suggestions at this level: I think an even easier diffculity for lower level players would be great.
Hope I will be able to do it on a harder diff settings but it seems soo impossible..... Well see....
hello..i managed to win it on the 1st trial on very easy..my apm is around 185 :D and i do not have battlenet since i am unable to play on it i post about this problem here but no one seems to knows the problem i wonder if i am able to play battlenet, what could be my rank..gold? plat? xD
As a zerg, I can't place buidlings on the creep south of the mineral line of the main hatchery. Is there a special trigger preventing me from placing stuff there?
Is there any way for non-EU people to see the text? It's all replaced by "param/value/etc" for me I've tried a number of different versions and they all have this problem. I've also tried changing my own localization to EU but that doesn't seem to work either.
I figured out that the three options you have at the start are for each of the races, and then I guess the ones under that are difficulty level... So I guess it's not a big deal.
One suggestion I have would be to not allow the player to become supply blocked. Its very easy for someone, when multitasking to become supply blocked, while its easier to avoid on this scenario due to the mineral cap its still something that can happen, and even if your supply blocked for a couple seconds in a match its very easy to fall behind. Other than that the map seems great probe micro seems very intensive but i suppose thats the point :p
this is great, on the first couple of trials (and in ladder matches) on very easy my apm was about 40. After some training i managed on easy with an APM of 70 and now I am struggling with normal, my APM is getting over 80. I wonder whats your APM at various diffculities... I also want to note that this apm is on this actual map, my ladder match apm is only slightly raising from around 40 to 50.
Queepp42, you should try that tool, might work: http://www.sc2mapster.com/assets/sc2-localizer/ I fixed that issue by editing the SC2Map file using Ladik's MPQ Editor and copying enGB.SC2Data folder to enUS.SC2Data and by adding a <DataComponent Type="text" Locale="enUS">GameText</DataComponent> entry to the ComponentList.Sc2Components file. I guess that's what the sc2-localizer does, but I haven't tried it.
btw, if there's any Linux user that runs Sc2 with WINE (which I doubt), this map crashes (maybe not for everyone). I managed to fix it by removing all references to the style ABChoiceBackButtonText in the GameStrings.txt (enXX.SC2Data/LocalizedData/) with a sed -e 's/<s val="ABChoiceBackButtonText">\(.*\)<\/s>/\1/g' GameStrings.txt command and repacking that modified GameStrings in the map file using Ladik's MPQ Editor
So now that the retail is out, how can I watch my replay in order to determine my APM? I tried using test map in the publisher but there was no replay in the recent folder afterwards.
Wow, I'm totally getting this because I can use it for practice. I tried practicing with the BW map back in BW but honestly I found it overwhelming and frustrating more than anything. Assuming that the easier difficulty settings on this one will allow a newb to pull through, I'll be able to gradually build up my skill =).
Map keeps crashing my SC2, doesn't matter if I try to run it from the editor or via Multiplayer in SC2. I also tried several versions of the map (0.941, 0.95 & 0.951). I have the CE (UK import), if that's any problem.
I hope someone can help me fix that issue.
Thx
[edit] Forgot some info: Map loads properly, but after I clicked a button when I have to chose my race - tried Terran & Protoss - SC2 crashes. [/edit]
Wow, this tool is going to improve my game soooo much more! Thank you so much for making it!
Edit: Just reading through the comments. Why do so many people think this map is about microing the probe? Its about developing the skill to macro while you are away from your base microing something else, in this case a simple probe vs ling.
Suggestions: I would also like to see a natural expo, so people can practice expanding with this same pressure.
Second suggestion is for a complete noob level where there is no probe micro at all, but the mineral/energy restrictions of the harder modes so that total noobs can simply practice pure macro mechanics before moving on to macroing while you micro.
A few nights ago, i tried to run this map. I could not read any of the options because of parsing errors. I did a quick search in this thread, but did not see any similar issues. Any ideas.
On September 17 2010 02:39 kuebk wrote: Having a problem with the map, it loads up to 3/4 and nothing. All I can do is to kill a SC2 process. :<
EDIT: After very very very long loading it finally loaded up but as soon as I entered the game I got dropped.
On September 17 2010 08:41 l1mb0 wrote: Used to work great for me but for the last 5-10 days it doesn´t. It loads about 3/4 of the map and then after a long wait I get dropped.
Great otherwise, anyone having this problem apart form the guy above me?
This is the problem I've been encountering when trying to publish the map... It worked fine offline but the published version always got stuck at 3/4.
It would be extremely strange if it suddenly started doing it offline too though :O
For the people that are having localization problems (Pram/Value) its probably because you downloaded one of the test versions instead of the last stable one (0.941).
I do intend on fixing these problems and publishing the map but things are very hectic IRL so it will probably take a while. I also have a lot of features and improvements I want to implement but seeing how things are going right now I don't think they will be coming anytime soon
Wow, you have already done a lot for us m8, get on with your RL, its real and you deserve it, you have done a hell of a lot for us ^_^
I was more than anything idiot proofing myself, maybe I was doing something silly and I didnt know. Thanks though for response and for amazing map )) I just just a bit weirded out cuz It used to work before >.<!
On September 17 2010 08:41 l1mb0 wrote: Used to work great for me but for the last 5-10 days it doesn´t. It loads about 3/4 of the map and then after a long wait I get dropped.
Great otherwise, anyone having this problem apart form the guy above me?
This is the problem I've been encountering when trying to publish the map... It worked fine offline but the published version always got stuck at 3/4.
It would be extremely strange if it suddenly started doing it offline too though :O
For the people that are having localization problems (Pram/Value) its probably because you downloaded one of the test versions instead of the last stable one (0.941).
For the loading issue, i've found that deleting the map cache works. So something is error-ing out with the local map "bank" when it loads.
the only issue i have with the map is the proberto, i just think at lower difficulties it shud be a zealot chasing rather then a zergling cuz a ling is practically as fast as a probe
On September 20 2010 09:09 PlaGuE_R wrote: the only issue i have with the map is the proberto, i just think at lower difficulties it shud be a zealot chasing rather then a zergling cuz a ling is practically as fast as a probe
the ling speed changes each difficulty.
in the easier modes, the lings is slower then the probe. on hard is when he becomes only slightly faster i believe.
This is an amazing map, I use it a lot. I'm wondering, are there plans to update it for the newest patch? I don't seem to be able to watch replays of it anymore Also, I think you should publish it or even submit it to their map contest. This map is way better than most of them out there. Thanks again, and keep up the great work!
On September 29 2010 00:47 Tiax;mous wrote: I haven't played this after last patch but have you checked "Documents\StarCraft II\Replays\Unsaved" folder ?
Yes, and that's how I used to watch them. Ever since patch 1.1 though, I just get the error message "The mod data loaded does not match the mod data which was originally used to play this game."
Really nice map, really nice concept; thanks for the effort =) I did, however, notice what i think is a bug. When i group the kiting probe on 1 my gateways 5, nexus on 4 then sometimes when i switch between them the map mixes up the control groups i.e. 4 wich was just my nexus is now my nexus plus kiting probe. 5 wich was just my warp gates is now my warp gates plus kiting probe.. some bug with the probe :s
On October 07 2010 16:12 FlyInMyEye wrote: Is the latest version worikg for 1.1?
I've been able to run it by dragging the map onto the SCII shortcut. Can't watch replays, though, and if I try and edit the default race then the text gets all screwed up. Seems to be some explanations for why earlier on in the thread but futzing blindly in the tool didn't let me fix it.
awesome map, I use it to warm up before playing on ladder and it helps me a great deal to get my mind up to the necessary speed.
I've completed the objectives on normal move several times and I will soon try the harder mode. my average APM at the end of a normal mode game is 60. this is entirely effective APM, I do not do any spamming. I was wondering what average APM do you guys have when finishing on normal mode? the map keeps me so busy that I do not have time do do any spamming , in a ladder game my APM gets closer to 100 because there I also have the time to spam .
I expect that my effective APM will increase on the harder mode.
This could be the hardest thing ever. Seriously, I hate arbitrary stuff like this, but it is super challenging and demands significant dedication for those of us who macro well and can micro fine, but rarely have to do both.
Was it just me or can you not queue Proberto? I have been beating Normal without queueing because it seemed to screw up when I tried that. I macro and attack in like 10-15 seconds bursts. Woof.
Starting the game with camera moving towards proberto felt wrong, so I did two changes to it for myself: - do not center camera on proberto at start - automatically give proberto a waypoint to top left of his square
This allows me to start the game with the usual procedures of making workers mine, queueing new worker and assigning a hotkey to main building.
I had to give proberto the first waypoint or he would take too many hits for my skills.
good job. I just mastered very easy and easy, looking forward to the next levels. @painprophet: I dont know my APM, because it doesnt save the replays. But I guess it is not higher than in normal games, because there is only early game and a bit midgame. My APM in the early game usually is very low, because I dont spam. It really gets high in mid and lategame.
This is way too hard if its ment to be able to win especially with zerg (larva/queen). You should try make it a bit easier so it wont be complete frustration to play. People can still get their multitasking better without killing their whole families after a couple of tries.
tips: make the probe be able to have more waypoits or make it faster.
On October 26 2010 02:41 Orion-TF wrote: This is way too hard if its ment to be able to win especially with zerg (larva/queen). You should try make it a bit easier so it wont be complete frustration to play. People can still get their multitasking better without killing their whole families after a couple of tries.
tips: make the probe be able to have more waypoits or make it faster.
On October 26 2010 02:41 Orion-TF wrote: This is way too hard if its ment to be able to win especially with zerg (larva/queen). You should try make it a bit easier so it wont be complete frustration to play. People can still get their multitasking better without killing their whole families after a couple of tries.
tips: make the probe be able to have more waypoits or make it faster.
You, sir, have completely missed the point.
No my lord I have not missed the point. The point is to get better at multitasking, but if you get frustrated and irritated by playing you would not play it often because its irritating ----> therefore make it less frustrating.
Hi guys, I'm new here in the forum and I'm having a strange problem on normal mode, after rescuing the high templar the first time I can't do it a second, the messenge "this ability can only target friendly units" appears, any clue to what is happening? I want to keep practicing and improving my game but this "bug" or whatever is kinda bugging me(haha the bug is bugging... ok I stopped). Just for the record, I send all my overlords to the high templar location as their spawning location so I just click and load, don't know if the problem is there. Tough it doesn't make much sense to me.
On October 27 2010 10:38 Aurus wrote: Hi guys, I'm new here in the forum and I'm having a strange problem on normal mode, after rescuing the high templar the first time I can't do it a second, the messenge "this ability can only target friendly units" appears, any clue to what is happening? I want to keep practicing and improving my game but this "bug" or whatever is kinda bugging me(haha the bug is bugging... ok I stopped). Just for the record, I send all my overlords to the high templar location as their spawning location so I just click and load, don't know if the problem is there. Tough it doesn't make much sense to me.
I havnt played this map in a long time, but theres a certain range where you cant keep your overlords in the spawn for the high templar or else he wont spawn. I dont know if they fixed that bug and you're talking about a different one. Try using the same overlord to do all the dropping, its how the other races do it anyways
Wow. Epic map. Beat it on Easy on my second try, it was very difficult (I'm Silver though). Gonna try Normal soon when I have the heart for it. I bet my APM was like, twice that of my ladder games
Haha just beat it on very easy....that was more challenging than i thought. I think it is definitely help move faster around the map. Not sure how much of this will translate to game movement but i can definitely see the benefits.
Thank you, this map is so useful for my ridiculous scouting skills!
I can beat normal level constantly now, not tried hard yet. I'm using my "standard" 3 gate robo, the only thing I needed to change is to go a little more heavy with zealots and research charge.
I'm i gold level protoss (19-13) but diamond in random 2v2, 3v3 and 4v4.
When I'll try hard I'll edit this post (500 minerals max is scaring for my 3 warpgates).
Edit: I actually always sacrifice my first Proberto so that i can "create probe/start mining/set hotkeys" as soon as possible. Poor first Proberto :°(
A suggestion for future versions would be to get a summary at the end of the game, APM, workers created, time used etc. so you can try to beat the time you did earlier.
Have finished very easy, and easy, but it was hard, and I couldn't pay much attention to my attack, just had to a move and micro a litle while I sent my probe on the long distance from side to side
Great map. I am spending last 3 days only practicing this map instead of laddering, since i decided i want to improve my macro as fast as i can. Practicing on Normal with a few tweaks, some + some - .
I find this map much harder (hence more effective) for zerg. But it is said that zergs macro is a bit harder so that might be it. But if i was a T i would prefer to have it a bit harder, for example, microing a reaper and killing few zerglings over and over again.
I am playing this map with avg 130-150+ apm as zerg, which is great for me considering that there is no spam involved.
Also i am doing different builds, and using this map to smooth them out etc.
Can't wait to get into laddering again, tomorrow, and see if i can notice an improvement in my macro
On November 09 2010 19:32 Gotmog wrote: Great map. I am spending last 3 days only practicing this map instead of laddering, since i decided i want to improve my macro as fast as i can. Practicing on Normal with a few tweaks, some + some - .
I find this map much harder (hence more effective) for zerg. But it is said that zergs macro is a bit harder so that might be it. But if i was a T i would prefer to have it a bit harder, for example, microing a reaper and killing few zerglings over and over again.
I am playing this map with avg 130-150+ apm as zerg, which is great for me considering that there is no spam involved.
Also i am doing different builds, and using this map to smooth them out etc.
Can't wait to get into laddering again, tomorrow, and see if i can notice an improvement in my macro
There must be a little bit of spam going on because I can finish the map on Hard mode as Zerg with 70~ish APM.
Stet_tcl : the map is awesome, and I find it's perfect for working on macro and warming up. More than half the time I play the map, though, I find that I can't rescue the executor more than once while playing as Zerg. After he's been dropped off the first time by an Overlord, I can select him but he won't respond to any of my commands. This bug prevents me from winning the map a lot of times, which is a little annoying!
There must be a little bit of spam going on because I can finish the map on Hard mode as Zerg with 70~ish APM.
Stet_tcl : the map is awesome, and I find it's perfect for working on macro and warming up. More than half the time I play the map, though, I find that I can't rescue the executor more than once while playing as Zerg. After he's been dropped off the first time by an Overlord, I can select him but he won't respond to any of my commands. This bug prevents me from winning the map a lot of times, which is a little annoying!
I have only had this problem when i have an overlords near the executor when he spawns, if you move the overlord out of sight then back again you gain control of the executor.
There must be a little bit of spam going on because I can finish the map on Hard mode as Zerg with 70~ish APM.
Stet_tcl : the map is awesome, and I find it's perfect for working on macro and warming up. More than half the time I play the map, though, I find that I can't rescue the executor more than once while playing as Zerg. After he's been dropped off the first time by an Overlord, I can select him but he won't respond to any of my commands. This bug prevents me from winning the map a lot of times, which is a little annoying!
I have only had this problem when i have an overlords near the executor when he spawns, if you move the overlord out of sight then back again you gain control of the executor.
Ahhh - that solves that annoyance. Cheers, bud.
Question - Is it meant to be that way? Or is that a bug?
On November 09 2010 19:32 Gotmog wrote: Great map. I am spending last 3 days only practicing this map instead of laddering, since i decided i want to improve my macro as fast as i can. Practicing on Normal with a few tweaks, some + some - .
I find this map much harder (hence more effective) for zerg. But it is said that zergs macro is a bit harder so that might be it. But if i was a T i would prefer to have it a bit harder, for example, microing a reaper and killing few zerglings over and over again.
I am playing this map with avg 130-150+ apm as zerg, which is great for me considering that there is no spam involved.
Also i am doing different builds, and using this map to smooth them out etc.
Can't wait to get into laddering again, tomorrow, and see if i can notice an improvement in my macro
There must be a little bit of spam going on because I can finish the map on Hard mode as Zerg with 70~ish APM.
Stet_tcl : the map is awesome, and I find it's perfect for working on macro and warming up. More than half the time I play the map, though, I find that I can't rescue the executor more than once while playing as Zerg. After he's been dropped off the first time by an Overlord, I can select him but he won't respond to any of my commands. This bug prevents me from winning the map a lot of times, which is a little annoying!
Really ? In a straight up game ? Could i get a replay possibly ? I find it hard to believe that you can get away with that low apm without some map abuse
P.S Not calling you out or anything, just wondering how
I jus tried this game out i thought i would be cool and do hard cause im a pro :D i got wreched so bad haha but its really awesome and addicting thanks for makiing this up!
Love the map, I've noticed that while training in this map over the past hour since discovery from a stream then applying it in 1 custom game vs a random person that my macro and my scouting has greatly improved. Kudos to you sir for making a great map such as this and I plan on using it many many more times to come. =)
made it on very easy but it wasnt that easy I average 70-80 apm on laddergames and I have no chance on doing this on normal. It's the frigging probe that keeps dieing on me
I managed to win the Easy mode with Zerg so far. Took another try to figure out the HT had to go on that circular thing, I had destroyed the OC and failed anyway because the HT was in my base but not on the right spot (come on!).
Anyway, what I've noticed, after playing this map my screen settings are reset. I have to go back to Options to change it back to Fullscreen (windowed) because it has been reset to Fullscreen.
On November 09 2010 19:32 Gotmog wrote: Great map. I am spending last 3 days only practicing this map instead of laddering, since i decided i want to improve my macro as fast as i can. Practicing on Normal with a few tweaks, some + some - .
I find this map much harder (hence more effective) for zerg. But it is said that zergs macro is a bit harder so that might be it. But if i was a T i would prefer to have it a bit harder, for example, microing a reaper and killing few zerglings over and over again.
I am playing this map with avg 130-150+ apm as zerg, which is great for me considering that there is no spam involved.
Also i am doing different builds, and using this map to smooth them out etc.
Can't wait to get into laddering again, tomorrow, and see if i can notice an improvement in my macro
There must be a little bit of spam going on because I can finish the map on Hard mode as Zerg with 70~ish APM.
Stet_tcl : the map is awesome, and I find it's perfect for working on macro and warming up. More than half the time I play the map, though, I find that I can't rescue the executor more than once while playing as Zerg. After he's been dropped off the first time by an Overlord, I can select him but he won't respond to any of my commands. This bug prevents me from winning the map a lot of times, which is a little annoying!
Really ? In a straight up game ? Could i get a replay possibly ? I find it hard to believe that you can get away with that low apm without some map abuse
P.S Not calling you out or anything, just wondering how
Can't believe you accused me of lying like that! How dare you!
Kidding..
I couldn't get the replays to open when I played it offline, so I played the online version through the custom games. For some reason, my mouse was skipping about so it made it much harder to play than it should be.
Anyway - here's a replay. I messed up in a few ways, though. Firstly - forgot to build an extra gas geyser to get Overlord drops quicker, so I narrowly missed out on the final rescue of the executor. Secondly - I totally forgot about the third attack wave (it came really, really late) and let them kill my entire drone line before noticing, meaning I had a lot less Zerglings than usual - totally dumb mistake.
Either way, the CC went down on the last second and that final drop was seconds away from being completed. I could have recorded a win for you, but I want to go ladder.
I would really love a "Restart" button instead of the "Defeat" window. This way I can just get back into the game and not having to go through all the loading screens.
On November 22 2010 16:17 PET wrote: I would really love a "Restart" button instead of the "Defeat" window. This way I can just get back into the game and not having to go through all the loading screens.
Agreed! There are many tweaks that this map needs. Did the developer of this map stop development? Can anyone else pick up development?
thanks so much for this! Just started playing it today, already went up from easy to normal although I can't beat that consistently yet. Really helps immensely in my Ladder games, I find that I have lots of time to spare even when I do all my stuff! Love it!
Wow I just came back to the map after a long abstinence... What do you build to break that siegetank defense? I massed units on normal including immortals, spent my money, constantly produced probes, but I just can't get through those tanks...
On October 27 2010 10:38 Aurus wrote: Hi guys, I'm new here in the forum and I'm having a strange problem on normal mode, after rescuing the high templar the first time I can't do it a second, the messenge "this ability can only target friendly units" appears, any clue to what is happening? I want to keep practicing and improving my game but this "bug" or whatever is kinda bugging me(haha the bug is bugging... ok I stopped). Just for the record, I send all my overlords to the high templar location as their spawning location so I just click and load, don't know if the problem is there. Tough it doesn't make much sense to me.
That's because the Executor is not your unit. It only becomes your unit when you put a own unit next to it. Befor that you obviously can't use the load command on it. So just fly next to the templar and then pick him up.
I downloaded this back at release, and couldn't come close and eventually forgot all about it. Well, I came back to it today and beat Medium on my first try, my APM averaging at 60-70. It was delicious. And I guess this is further proof that I should really mount an all-nighter so I can get out of Bronze.
If you load this map up on "play vs AI" in the singleplayer tab, you can use features like quick save, pause and restart. This can help with practice by allowing you to keep repeating sections you need help with.
This map is awesome! I would recommend all gold and platinum level players try this out to up their game. After only a few times playing through this I'm finding I'm able to pay attention to way more things at once in my ladder play. Superb work OP.
One thing I would greatly appreciate is a restart button with units respawning and resources being reset instead of a defeat screen (so you don't have to reload), and the option to restart at any time (for when you mess up your BO or make some other stupid mistake). I know this would require a lot of annoying coding but it would help immensely in getting more practice in.
What is the normal way to micro the probe away from the zergling? Should I move it on the main screen or should I move him by clicking on the mini map? Mini map allows me to do more in the main town, but not sure if I am practicing it right, and I should be manually moving him in the main screen then using hot keys to do everything else in the my town, or a mixture of both.
I just want to make sure I am practicing this the best and most efficient way.
^ - I'm double tapping the hotkey and setting a command + Way point I find that I have a fair amount of time to do stuff doing it that way But I am doing it on easy :3
That is what I was thinking I should be doing. But it was easier to just click on hotkey for probe and shift-click on mini map to set a new way point. But I did not think easier was the best way I should be doing it. Thanks for replying with your method.
ridiculously hard and EFFECTIVE map. I'm high-level gold and have failed on easy... twice. After reading the descriptions i cant wait to abuse the practice potential of this map. THANK YOU!
On November 29 2010 04:00 Jimbonic wrote: What is the normal way to micro the probe away from the zergling? Should I move it on the main screen or should I move him by clicking on the mini map? Mini map allows me to do more in the main town, but not sure if I am practicing it right, and I should be manually moving him in the main screen then using hot keys to do everything else in the my town, or a mixture of both.
I just want to make sure I am practicing this the best and most efficient way.
this gets at one of the major problems i have with this map. you SHOULD be watching your probe. you SHOULD be able to park him and ignore him during critical moments of your play. in other words, queing up way points is not necessarily bad, its just not ideal.
i understand that this is a worst case scenario to increase apm, but i think it leads to flawed fundamentals. one thing that you are punished for is putting pressure on with your army because the enemy starts out so fortified you just loose units if you even peak at them, which would never happen.
i like the idea of this map but as it is right now i don't see it helping low level players out that much (there are much more basic things they need to figure out first rather than just playing faster) and the higher level players are just not going to get much out of this either.
i don't know, overall i'm just throughly unimpressed. i like the effort don't get me wrong, but the simulation you're creating is not helpful to any caliber of player that i can think of. i think verbal notifications that emulate a coach sitting over a player's shoulder talking him through a computer opponent would accomplish what you have set out to do more successfully. of course i have no idea how you would go about creating a map like this so i'm of little help.
sorry i'm really not trying to rag on your project, just give a little constructive criticism. maybe it really is helping a lot of players out, i just don't see that from my perspective.
On November 29 2010 04:00 Jimbonic wrote: What is the normal way to micro the probe away from the zergling? Should I move it on the main screen or should I move him by clicking on the mini map? Mini map allows me to do more in the main town, but not sure if I am practicing it right, and I should be manually moving him in the main screen then using hot keys to do everything else in the my town, or a mixture of both.
I just want to make sure I am practicing this the best and most efficient way.
this gets at one of the major problems i have with this map. you SHOULD be watching your probe. you SHOULD be able to park him and ignore him during critical moments of your play. in other words, queing up way points is not necessarily bad, its just not ideal.
i understand that this is a worst case scenario to increase apm, but i think it leads to flawed fundamentals. one thing that you are punished for is putting pressure on with your army because the enemy starts out so fortified you just loose units if you even peak at them, which would never happen.
i like the idea of this map but as it is right now i don't see it helping low level players out that much (there are much more basic things they need to figure out first rather than just playing faster) and the higher level players are just not going to get much out of this either.
i don't know, overall i'm just throughly unimpressed. i like the effort don't get me wrong, but the simulation you're creating is not helpful to any caliber of player that i can think of. i think verbal notifications that emulate a coach sitting over a player's shoulder talking him through a computer opponent would accomplish what you have set out to do more successfully. of course i have no idea how you would go about creating a map like this so i'm of little help.
sorry i'm really not trying to rag on your project, just give a little constructive criticism. maybe it really is helping a lot of players out, i just don't see that from my perspective.
You just can't do it, that's why you're complaining.
Anyways, great map, I can finally do it on normal and since I get fast internet back again soon, hopefully this is gonna get be above gold/silver. Also, is it cheating if I only build stalkers for a defense and then attack with chargelot/ht/stalker? It's the only thing I can do with my limited skill without letting the probe die.
On December 02 2010 00:17 napp wrote: this gets at one of the major problems i have with this map. you SHOULD be watching your probe. you SHOULD be able to park him and ignore him during critical moments of your play. in other words, queing up way points is not necessarily bad, its just not ideal.
i understand that this is a worst case scenario to increase apm, but i think it leads to flawed fundamentals. one thing that you are punished for is putting pressure on with your army because the enemy starts out so fortified you just loose units if you even peak at them, which would never happen.
i like the idea of this map but as it is right now i don't see it helping low level players out that much (there are much more basic things they need to figure out first rather than just playing faster) and the higher level players are just not going to get much out of this either.
i don't know, overall i'm just throughly unimpressed. i like the effort don't get me wrong, but the simulation you're creating is not helpful to any caliber of player that i can think of. i think verbal notifications that emulate a coach sitting over a player's shoulder talking him through a computer opponent would accomplish what you have set out to do more successfully. of course i have no idea how you would go about creating a map like this so i'm of little help.
sorry i'm really not trying to rag on your project, just give a little constructive criticism. maybe it really is helping a lot of players out, i just don't see that from my perspective.
Not really constructive criticism when you dont understand the point of the map. Its not supposed to substitute for an actual human opponent, and give you a reasonable situation to play the game in. There is AI to do that. Whats its supposed to do is improve your multitasking ablity, your macro ability, and having you tighten up your build orders, along with being creative and having to invent a new build.
I started out on this map and was in low plat/gold (when diamond was high out there). I had around 40 apm. Now, i have an actual, non spam, of around 130 apm, and can beat a lot of great diamond players. This map helped me a ton, but it took a lot of time to work through it.
Is this map is still being worked on? It would be helpful if there were timestamps in the changelog .
Anyway if it's still live, there's a couple of things that would be nice to track for "coach mode". Being able to keep track of OC/Nexus energy as well as production structures that are not making units would be nice. I guess Zerg might want to know about queen energy as well (yes there are cases where players will want to save energy to transfuse but they're the exception, and the point of this map is to practice multitasking).
On December 06 2010 11:20 kingkira wrote: is this going to be updated?! although it seems like it wouldn't need to be updated but did the creator just disappear?
On December 15 2010 10:17 ZeroTalent wrote: Is this map is still being worked on? It would be helpful if there were timestamps in the changelog .
Anyway if it's still live, there's a couple of things that would be nice to track for "coach mode". Being able to keep track of OC/Nexus energy as well as production structures that are not making units would be nice. I guess Zerg might want to know about queen energy as well (yes there are cases where players will want to save energy to transfuse but they're the exception, and the point of this map is to practice multitasking).
Luckily I am still alive , unfortunately, I have stopped working on improving the map since it was taking up a huge chunk of my time that I can not spare right now. (I have to serve my freaking military service soon T.T and I'm working my ass off to put some money aside for when that happens)
I'd hate to see this fall into oblivion since I think it has helped a lot of people so I'll be trying to find someone to help me with keeping the map updated, fixing bugs and adding improvements. I have a ton of ideas on how to make this map an even better tool and I'm really sad I can't implement them right now.
So if you have some reasonable knowledge on how the map editor works (you don't have to be pro or anything, I knew next to nothing when I started making this apart from some small knowledge on programming) and think you can tolerate my awful code please contact me and we'll see if we can bring this back to life again!
On December 21 2010 01:24 stet_tcl wrote: I'd hate to see this fall into oblivion since I think it has helped a lot of people so I'll be trying to find someone to help me with keeping the map updated, fixing bugs and adding improvements. I have a ton of ideas on how to make this map an even better tool and I'm really sad I can't implement them right now.
So if you have some reasonable knowledge on how the map editor works (you don't have to be pro or anything, I knew next to nothing when I started making this apart from some small knowledge on programming) and think you can tolerate my awful code please contact me and we'll see if we can bring this back to life again!
YGPM, especially since it looks like many of the coach metrics can't be figured out from regular replay files >_>.
i like the idea of this map but as it is right now i don't see it helping low level players out that much (there are much more basic things they need to figure out first rather than just playing faster) and the higher level players are just not going to get much out of this either.
I want to thank the maker of this map, it helps a lot. I know what unit composition I should get at every moment of a game but my apm is just too low to be able to macro efficiently while keeping track of my scouting lings, of my army etc...
This map allowed me to work hard on my apm and macro skills. And I keep working on it, I think it could be used at any level once you understand the basics/mechanics of the game.
What many people don't understand here is that between a bronze and a plat player, no one can tell which has the best understanding of the game. I am silver and sometimes a bronze player beats me. And sometimes I roflstomp a diamond player. Not being diamond only means that you are lacking one of the fundamental skills, you can have 100apm, crazy macro but totally forget to scout and you're done.
So, I believe this map can surely help any player at any level below diamond, and can probably help many diamond players.
Man, after using this map playing ladder games seem too slow without a little probe to be moving around constantly. Excellent map that has helped me improve my apm from 30 to about 90. Along with the micro map, and some day9 dailies i went from bronze to diamond.
Spoiler alert: it sounds like the OP doesn't have the bandwidth to keep the multitasking trainer up to date. I'm going to give it a shot, though I will probably wait until 1.2 is official so that I don't waste a bunch of work. He has a wishlist for the map, and I have my own, so we will be working through it. I may also try to make a separate multitasking map that tries to simulate different multiplayer battle conditions (early harass, defending 3rd/4th bases, etc.)
This is my first foray into SC2 hackery but I did already solve Rock Band 2, so it's nice to be back in the tools business.
Amazing map indeed. Helps me (bronze level player) a lot with practicing the multitasking part of playing Starcraft II. I already have fast fingers (I can type approx 250-300 chars per minute without making mistakes), but still practicing to make use of that in Starcraft II. This map helps me a great deal to improve my multitasking skills.
@ZeroTalent: It may be a good idea to start out with solving some bugs? For example: one thing I stumbled upon is that the map doesn't punish you when the energy of one of your queens exceeds the limit (which is 99 on Easy mode). It would be great if it did, because at the moment, missing larvae injects is one of my main weaknesses.
Edit: Did a bit of additional testing and it looks like Queen energy checking works fine as long as you have only one Queen. With 2 or more Queens it doesn't work anymore.
Oh wow, most exciting few minutes I had in SC2 for a while now =D Huge fan of the map.
By the way, after I downloaded the original and testing it in the editor simply didn´t work for me, I looked it up in custom games. Ziah and zen have 2 posted there (EU servers), not sure which I have played. Eitherway, big thanks to TL, the OP and the mapmaker xD
Edit:Did I really just revive a necro? Well, it is a good one, bump!
On December 20 2010 19:15 Maelthorn wrote: W-why do I have a .95 version...? Confused...
Also, I have an APM of 90 and I'm high Gold and I play terribly. If the game gets to the 20 minute mark, I generally have around 3000 minerals.
Where the hell is this APM coming from? I don't feel like I click a lot...
You'd be suprised at how fast you are actually playing when you get good at this map. I had 30 apm in gold and with this i jumped to 80apm in a game (I had like 120 apm while using the trainer).
On January 05 2011 10:09 MechaniX_ wrote: Does it work for Mac?
As I wrote in an above post, I managed to look it up after Creating a Custom Multiplayer game within regular Starcraft2. So if you are able to play Sc2, you might find it therein too. Good luck!
Well, this hasn't been updated for awhile now, has it. Will we ever see v1.0 I wonder. This is a really great map, but it's still kind of unfinished, and there is room for a lot of features to be added. I really hope that the guy who made this map will pick it up again and continue developing it
On January 09 2011 18:47 zingmars wrote: Well, this hasn't been updated for awhile now, has it. Will we ever see v1.0 I wonder. This is a really great map, but it's still kind of unfinished, and there is room for a lot of features to be added. I really hope that the guy who made this map will pick it up again and continue developing it
I'm trying! But the OP seems to have sadly gone into hiding. I would really rather pick up the existing trainer rather start from scratch.
Just tested it, hard stuff for a casual but really usefull. I´m the kind of player who nows in theorie how and what to do but lagging in speed so thx a lot sir !
i love playing this map i can feel myself getting better at the game day by day. only thing that i would like to see more of perhaps is consequences for getting supply blocked and not making worker units constantly. yes this will make it just that much more difficult but i see this more as a tool rather than a game. and having this would make your macro just that much better. just an idea.
Some input, on moving the probe around from the beginning; shouldn't we be focused on our build order completely from the beginning, and start the probe running on 10 supply or something, or perhaps we must send a scout to a region which will start the probe running.
How much do you focus on "build orders" before 10 food?
This is awesome! I never realized how bad I was until playing with this training map. This will either make me a lot better or cause me to just give up and go back to playing 1st person shooters.
On February 01 2011 04:25 BoxedLunch wrote: this map would be cool if the probe could queue up more than one waypoint.
as is, it's kinda bad
If you're fast enough you shouldn't need to queue up waypoints at all. The map is designed to be challenging - if it was easy it wouldn't provide any benefits. You need to get faster at macroing to be able to finish this map. If you are finding it too hard to play without queuing then that should give you some indications of what you need to work on.
i dont understand why iam not allowed to use at least 2-3 waypoints on the easy setting, i can beat it without it but i have that ingame so i dont see a reason why i shouldnt be able to use it in the trainer. I also think that you shouldnt be allowed to build certain buildings - if my money gets to high i just can spam spinecrawlers but i am not allowed to get another macro hatch? that felt kinda odd besides that its a great map.
On February 01 2011 04:25 BoxedLunch wrote: this map would be cool if the probe could queue up more than one waypoint.
as is, it's kinda bad
Well, the point is to work on multitasking; that is, switching between your base and a different spot on the map. Preventing you from queuing up multiple way points forces you to keep looking back at the probe.
Just beat this on normal on my 20th try X_X as zerg. Something I think should be changed or give a warning is that mutalisks can't fly to the middle of the map or they die automatically X_X. I did this for 10 times before realizing what was happening. Ended up just massing upgraded lings to finish it.
Cool map, hard as shit. Especially for a noob like me. Any chance you'll add a function to set when the chase begins (like at 9 supply)? Doesn't multitasking begin after you send your worker out to scout?
It would be great to introduce a mode, in which the running away of the probe is replaced by something a little more micro intensive, for example kiting zealots with marauders or so.
Christ. I cant make the way points work. So had to do without waypoints. At least it was the very easy one, wasnt very easy for me . Attacking, macroing and keeping probe alive without waypoints is a bitch.
Sure you can gain the equivelant skill in regular games, but most newbs myself included tend to "avoid" multitasking whenever we can ingame, cause we know we suck at it. This map is incredibly useful since it focus's purely on that. Multitask or lose ^^
I think this is a great trainer and has really forced me to macro without focusing on micro.
On the macro aspect though...just wanted to know how using this trainer compares to playing against the AI?? For example, against the AI you actually build more than 1 base so macro is more 'realistic' cos you think about expanding, managing multiple bases etc....as opposed to the trainer where u just look at one base.
Or am I just meant to see the trainer vs AI as testing different aspects of our skills??
During the beta gap I practiced a couple of times on this and really felt like I had improved a lot by the time I managed to beat the map (probably on an easyish difficulty). Now that I've had more experience with SC2 I'm intrigued to see how well I'll do at this now....
this map is great and i normally warm up with it. just 1 little thing.... please implement a "do it again" and "quit the map" button at the end, so we dont hve to restart it every time....
this map is awesome, some things i think would be cool
-have to micro 2 probes -be able to choose build orders like yabot, also opponent build orders -instead of a probe- muta/banshee/phoenix harass a mineral line -restart button
On March 27 2011 05:23 ineffablepwnage wrote: is there a way to hotkey locations in this (ie f5)? i normally use those to look at my base and its throwing me off.
If you play this map offline, you might have to set up your custom keybindings again (i.e. create a local profile).
I'd also love to see a restart button. Also, is the proberto area bugged? At the southern path of the plattform, proberto sometimes goes nuts and takes a weird path. Can you add an additional challenge to the map that enhances map awareness? A smallish ping that pops up every now and then in random places, the challenge would be that you have to select it in the 3 seconds it exists - you can miss 3 times else you lose.
Well since the map title says "multitasking" the probe microing shouldn't be easier. It's more than enough that you can have 1 queued waypoint for the probe.
Overall I love that map, it really helps to get you started before going into ladder:p
I want to set the layout UI permantently, so I follwed the instructions in the thread by setting the race for player one under map->player properties. When I start the map all of the text values are then changed to "param/value/<hex values>". Any ideas how this can be fixed?
On March 27 2011 05:23 ineffablepwnage wrote: is there a way to hotkey locations in this (ie f5)? i normally use those to look at my base and its throwing me off.
If you play this map offline, you might have to set up your custom keybindings again (i.e. create a local profile).
Its easier to just copy the Hotkey folder you have in your Account/randomNumberFolder/Hotkey outside the Account folder. You can then just go into hotkey and find your account profile there.
Verry good map. I encountered a bug. I have the bad habit of spam buttons. After the launch of a party (Zerg) I had two who appeared Hatch, 2 prod and 12 workers. (Not having read all the pots lack of time I do not know if it is already noted) http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/816304Screenshot20110427141042.jpg
I have a suggestion that you make a map like this, but make it where its just a normal melee game between you and another player and both players have to keep their probes alive...
Winner is the one who keeps his prove alive and kills his opponent. Would be cool yeah?
I just got this today and i thought my mechanics were decent ... I was terribly terribly mistaken. This is the one of the best practice maps i have ever seen and my apm has already gone up by at least 50% and i feel like I'm not spamming I'm actually having decisive clicks. Also, Really helps you watch that mini map =D. OP you are my savior =P
edit: seems to work ok on my first try though loading it in the editor seems to create alot of warnings, anyone done a clean up /update on this recently?
Just practiced. Holy crap it's difficult. I'm only bronze so very easy is a mindf**k for me. I think I'm already becoming a faster player after about only 2 hours of play. I'm totally going to use this for practice.
hey I was practicing on this map today and I encountered this bug all of a sudden decided to shre it with the makers here. I restarted the game after losing once in the normal mode and the game started kinda late, the ling was already attacking my probe, but then I saw that it wasnt just one probe and 3 were spawned instead. also 2 timers were on the screen. Still a very good map.
On June 01 2011 12:15 Tengo_Hambre wrote: is there any way to get this map to support your in-game hotkeys?
(I assume you mean custom hotkeys) from the previous page:
On April 03 2011 01:50 crappen wrote: Its easier to just copy the Hotkey folder you have in your Account/randomNumberFolder/Hotkey outside the Account folder. You can then just go into hotkey and find your account profile there.
just beat it on very easy which was my first game overall. Impressed with the skill required to handle it.The terran base wasnt hard to beat, just a-moved some stalkers in there. was really late before i noticed siegetank-presence. My focus was 90% of the time on the probe-micro which was the hardest part by far. Dont think i had more than 500 minerals overall through the game. upper gold on eu ladder, btw.
the game said i lost though, but i suppose it was because I didnt unload tassadar from the warp prism? I did get him though. wasnt that hard.
I could really use a natural tbh.
edit: idiot me just noticed the natural.. gg.
edit edit: wait no im not an idiot, it really needs a natural!
On June 09 2011 01:52 Lassepetri wrote: the game said i lost though, but i suppose it was because I didnt unload tassadar from the warp prism? I did get him though. wasnt that hard.
Depending on the version, you have to unload tassadar into the circle in your base.
Also, there is an expo depending on the version and if you choose zerg or not (I think there is one that is zerg only in some versions).
On June 09 2011 01:52 Lassepetri wrote: the game said i lost though, but i suppose it was because I didnt unload tassadar from the warp prism? I did get him though. wasnt that hard.
Depending on the version, you have to unload tassadar into the circle in your base.
Also, there is an expo depending on the version and if you choose zerg or not (I think there is one that is zerg only in some versions).
Okay then i am a slight idiot. Hadnt noticed whereever it said i had to drop tass on the circle.
However i still think everyone should have the ability to expand. since you have 20 minutes its very unnatural to not expand in order to work in some mechanics as well. Id love to be able to constantly build workers, but since its 1base situation all the way through, its just not very intuitive to go over max saturation.
On June 01 2011 12:15 Tengo_Hambre wrote: is there any way to get this map to support your in-game hotkeys?
Related to this question, I am not sure everyone is aware that this map has been uploaded on Bnet (at least on EU), the OP does not make that perfectly clear. Just search for 'Multitask trainer' and you should be able to find a 0.951 version up there. If you run it on Bnet and not through the editor, your custom keys should work...
Thank you for making this! With that said, I need some help. I am probably missing something super obvious, but I can only rescue the templar once. Do I need to rescue him, drop him off on the island, pick him up, and bring him back three times? I've played this 5 times now on normal, and can't seem to figure it out D:<
since the fine gentlemen above told me how to do the tassadarthing, i just flew a warprism to him, picked him of and dropped him off at the circle. and boom, the objective was done. No further actions needed
Hey, I'll have 4-5 days without internet and I was wondering what to do without sc2 !! Now I know, I'll work on my multitasking with this incredible map !
Thank you a lot !
I hope after 20-30hours on this, my multitasking will be slightly better
Those reapers come out faster than terran can get a tech lab. Not sure if this is intentional but just thought i would point it out Edit* Just realized that the time varies
I cant ever beat those two reapers as terran anybody have any tips? I survive but i lose to many workers for the game to be salvagable.
On June 18 2011 07:41 OneofDays wrote: Hey, I'll have 4-5 days without internet and I was wondering what to do without sc2 !! Now I know, I'll work on my multitasking with this incredible map !
Thank you a lot !
I hope after 20-30hours on this, my multitasking will be slightly better
Lol, I doubt you will actually play 20-30 hours such a boring map. It's wonderful for multitasking but come on, 20-30 hours of it eh?
I need to find a way to bind shortkeys on permanent building, temporal buildings such as Assimilator, Cybernetic Core etc. especially at the early stage because without it I 've got that feeling that if it was a real game, I would lose because of doing things too late. Can someone suggest something? How do you cope with all these things? It would be really appreciated. )) At the moment I am trying to bind Nexus to 1, probe to 2, then later all gates to 3, Robo/Stargate 4. Then, Main army to 5, casters to 6 (HTs), Airforces to 7 but this is more like a challange to me at the moment. I am really currious
AND BTW to Author of this map ... Simply THANK YOU for this map. I couldn't realised so many things I needed to focus on, for instance I used to forget to spend Nexus energy. I couldn't figure out why I was loosing on Easy because of that, LOL. It took a bit to get it ;p
This map teaches me kind of discipline during the game. OK, I've started winning on Very Easy only but I started winning controlling base and probe at the same time being more and more like routine than challenge. That push on probe is awesome. I am happy I could not use waypoints because I eventually found a way how to multitask probe with a base.
Wow, this is quite amazing. Silver zerg here, just found this and tried it out for awhile. With an apm of 160 I just about managed very easy, and then it's pretty much always focused on the probe, with just tapping to buildings to keep money low and ofcourse queens to inject. The actual battle was just 1a stuff while still microing the probe. Tried it on "easy" aswell and got owned by drops, but I'll definitely add this in to my daily playtime. Hopefully I'll eventually be able to manage the higher difficulties, as this made me realize how bad my multitasking really is. Thank you for this, creator!
I had the executor in the back of my base, and suddenly when I destroyed the orbital command on easy I got "fail to save the executor or something died in battle" . Is it some bug or what killed him? I had no drops at the back because nothing else was shooting my buildings there etc.
On October 08 2011 02:35 eYeball wrote: I had the executor in the back of my base, and suddenly when I destroyed the orbital command on easy I got "fail to save the executor or something died in battle" . Is it some bug or what killed him? I had no drops at the back because nothing else was shooting my buildings there etc.
He needs to be on the circular area in front of your main base, not just in your base.
I have beaten it with all tree races on easy, now i am moving on to normal difficulty.
As protos it is easy because you can build immortals, with is both good for the initial attack and the drop. And you can use them to tank the siege fire when attacking in the end. I used charge zealots + immortals for the final army composition. (basically 1a into the base)
But what do you do as terran ?. I have tried pure bio, and also marine tanks. Both die to fast when i go into the choke area. Have any of you any if you have any suggestions ? Perhaps bio with upgrades ?
because i can't multitask well enough i keep losing everytime Is it possible to implement some restart command so we can try again and again without having to get out of the map and get back everytime?
Very enjoyable - I'm a Bronze League player who is starting to push up in the world, and I was pretty sure my macro game is the thing that needs the most work. It was really interesting to play this and then to play a game straight afterwards and see how much help it really was.
If I can learn to play with that level of macro and not needing to be constantly babysitting my base production, and not get caught out with a push, I'm sure it'll be a very sharp jump in skill. Perfect little game to work towards good macro skills.
Does anyone know of any production drills out there to perfect?
The video posted is a 'Terran Macro Drill' which I found when I first started the game. The basic skills I learnt to ensure I spent all my money in an ordered and precise way were invaluable. I'd love it if anyone had any similar guides/videos/advice that was along those lines too?
Very good trainer, kept me from being like a huuuurrr duuuuurrrr I'm a horse.
Bugs that I have found during my tests; when I destroyed the orbital command, the game ends as a lose and gives me a msg of the "Executor was not saved". And this happened on every time I launched and kill the orbital.
Anywho; very good idea, just need some polishing here and there.
would you mind the probe platforms for me and an opponent on say metalopolis too? It would be a lot more fun if I could play the map against my friends in practice. The probe micro always makes the game a lot more serious. The wave options and templar is nice too, but obv that would eat a lot of space. Just wondering if you could make 2 platforms on top right and Bot left of meta, so during practice games we got extra stuff to do.
Anyways, love the map, have played it quite a few times
I would really like a total noob-mode where you have say infinite probe lives (or very many).
Another way to approach the "Probe problem" would be adjusting the probe micro area (e.g. on easy to medium not so many obstacles etc). A third possible way to adjust this would be to make the camera pan over to the probe once it has been killed and select it to bring the attention back to the player (at least for lower difficulties).
Bugs that I have found during my tests; when I destroyed the orbital command, the game ends as a lose and gives me a msg of the "Executor was not saved". And this happened on every time I launched and kill the orbital.
Out of interest, do you actually save the Executor?
I have some trouble with destroying the opponents CC. I can do it with just a few probe losses, but i never manage to break the enemy. I start with 3 Rax, than i tec up to starport, an build up an MMM Army, which allway get destroyed when i attack.
What i'm doing wrong? Can probably someone upload a Replay in which he defeat normal, oder even better hard? To check out how you're doing that^^
I'm diamond terran but evidently suck hard because it took me maybe ten attempts to finish normal difficulty I'm wondering if APM, EAPM are calculated correctly? I have much lower than on ladder but subjectively it should be higher
@polybios: APM, EAPM are calculated correctly. You have lower APM in your ladder games, because you do not move around a Probe that much. But perhaps you could use a Medivac or a Viking from time to time to check for hidden expansions (all matchups) or Proxy Pylons (TvP).
Has this project been abondoned? If not, does anyone know how to add restart button for when you lose or at the start of the game? It doesn't seem like the OP is still interested in updating but, but it can't be that hard, right? Build order tester and darglein's all have restarts.
yea sorry to help in this necro but this is one of my favorite sc2 maps. I do this all the time whenever I don't feel like losing on ladder. Its amazing mechanics practice and a good way to warm up. No idea why no one has continued with this idea of high skill cap mechanics-based trainer map.
I used to use this all the time but I recently loaded it up and when the game starts there is only one set of mineral patches. Someone should really fix this really no point if its just one base.
I'm surprised this has gone neglected for so long. It was a good practice tool. I'm messing with it now even though no current builds work on it. A newer version in time for HotS would be widely appreciated I'm sure.
For those of you who do not use the Multitasking trainer, I advise that you start! It's something I've personally used to hone my multitasking and I highly recommend this custom map.
As of today, the only thing you can do is open this map in the Starcraft II Editor and "test document". But this mode is very limited, because if you have custom settings or custom hotkeys, you can't play with them unless you manually reconfigure everything. Or at least, that's how it seems to me =(
I've tried uploading it, both public and private, onto battle.net but nothing shows up.
If someone has the time and knowledge to fix this one up, it would be amazing.
On October 28 2012 16:42 kyruru wrote: As of today, the only thing you can do is open this map in the Starcraft II Editor and "test document". But this mode is very limited, because if you have custom settings or custom hotkeys, you can't play with them unless you manually reconfigure everything. Or at least, that's how it seems to me =(
I've tried uploading it, both public and private, onto battle.net but nothing shows up.
If someone has the time and knowledge to fix this one up, it would be amazing.
here is a fix-
1. Do a Test Document like normal. 2. Leave the game. 3. You will be at the bnet login screen, login to bnet. 4. Alt Tab back to the editor and hit Test Document again.
You are now logged in and using your hotkeys etc. Have fun. You must do this exactly as I posted for it to work.
I want to use this map to train my up-and-coming high school team.
Does an updated and functional version of this exist anywhere on battlenet itself as a custom map? Or will I need to give them instructions on how to download/install/fix so it works correctly?
A great map, thanks for whoever worked on it originally!
On July 09 2013 08:43 Snout wrote: I want to use this map to train my up-and-coming high school team.
Does an updated and functional version of this exist anywhere on battlenet itself as a custom map? Or will I need to give them instructions on how to download/install/fix so it works correctly?
A great map, thanks for whoever worked on it originally!
I am sorry to "necro" this thread, but I updated this map.
> A newer version in time for HotS would be widely > appreciated I'm sure.
I did that.
Features: - Basic features by stet_tcl - Updated for new replay features like STRG+R (Ludaking) - Expansion (NeoBlade) - Support for all HOTS-units and upgrades (NeoBlade) - More space (NeoBlade) - Bugfix: Proberto got stuck (NeoBlade)
You should search for "NeoMT" withing the Arcade. It should be available on all servers (EU, NA and so on).
If you want a "real" expansion (not a Gold Base), you should use CUSTOM.
Hey Neo, thanks a lot for updating this thread with your updated version of the map, much appreciated. I randomly decided to check the link today and was pleasantly surprised. You gave this map exactly what it needed, cheers.
Features/Changes/Bugfixes: - Now available: Normal and gold expansion for all races - Added Geyser at gold expansion - Added Hellbats on map - Added Hellbats in CUSTOM - Added WidowMInes on map - Bugfix: Fixed coach "Larva" (Viper, SwarmHost) - Added expansion for all Races - Bugfix: "Stimpack unkown" to "Stimpack" - AI now trains Banshees and MM - Added Depots for additional Supply - Added SCVs - Geyser: 1.500 => 5.000 - Changed "BadZealot" to "Choboling" - Bugfix: One Banshee is attacked, all will cloak - Changed description (Loading Screen, Body) - Added WidowMines in Eco-Line to prevent Run-By-Wins - Changed the Banks to "NeoMTnormal" - Increased "Mission Time" for all levels - Changed integer: Save the Executor (e.g. 2 times EASY) - Refactoring: Renamend Regions and Points ("Point 1" to "START Proberto") - More Minerals (AI): 1.500 => 3.000 - Map is too hard for lower leagues => Slowed down production
On July 18 2014 22:53 NeoBlade wrote: Big changes are incoming in the next few days.
Features/Changes/Bugfixes: - Now available: Normal and gold expansion for all races - Added Geyser at gold expansion - Added Hellbats on map - Added Hellbats in CUSTOM - Added WidowMInes on map - Bugfix: Fixed coach "Larva" (Viper, SwarmHost) - Added expansion for all Races - Bugfix: "Stimpack unkown" to "Stimpack" - AI now trains Banshees and MM - Added Depots for additional Supply - Added SCVs - Geyser: 1.500 => 5.000 - Changed "BadZealot" to "Choboling" - Bugfix: One Banshee is attacked, all will cloak - Changed description (Loading Screen, Body) - Added WidowMines in Eco-Line to prevent Run-By-Wins - Changed the Banks to "NeoMTnormal" - Increased "Mission Time" for all levels - Changed integer: Save the Executor (e.g. 2 times EASY) - Refactoring: Renamend Regions and Points ("Point 1" to "START Proberto") - More Minerals (AI): 1.500 => 3.000 - Map is too hard for lower leagues => Slowed down production
Two bugs so far : - In the "Coach" tab, I can't increase the number of workers. It starts at 61, I can't increase, and if I decrease to 60, I can't increase it back to 60 - I did a custom game where the only things I changed was 5 executors to save, and lower ling speed. I was dropped with 2 tanks and ~8 marine marauder at 2:45 (I had 11 SCVs)
Both bugs are in the original map. I can't do anything about it because all variables regarding this look like:
Control Box Values [3][0] Control Box Values [8][0] Control Box Values [9][0] Control Box Values [12][0] Control Box Values [17][0] Control Box Values [19][0]
I have not the first goddam clue, what is done and where it's done.
You can solve this matter by doing a simple thing:
- CUSTOM - Find "LOAD" on the right sight - "Load Preset Easy"
Change everything you like. You will be attacked after 7:12 I guess. You can deactivate this attack, too.
What does Geyser: 1.500 => 5.000 and More Minerals (AI): 1.500 => 3.000 mean? The income for AI increase, that's all?
Yes. Original version: AI did not produce anything. Now it does.
Please post more questions, if you have any.
Best regards, Neo
PS: Please test my other maps, too! Arcade: Search for "NeoMT" => Daybreak, Polar Night, Altzerzim
EPT
(man they are soooo far away)
![[image loading]](http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/9638/screenshot002em.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imagehost.org/0666/Unbenannt.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://starcraft2.ingame.de/wiki/images/6/67/2011-12-13_04_time-minerals.jpg)
