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ouch... hot bid is now on the hot seat for some interrogation. what should we do now? waterboard him or sodomize? maybe we should consult kerrigan what the overmind did to her?
jokes aside, if theres any credible information about a lag problem, i am strongly against ppl with Chinese IP from qualifying.
i am Chinese myself, but i know that if some poor dude did all that hardwork to qualify only to lag out (or have very high latency which screws up their muta harass and pretty much dooms a zerg), theres gonna b a whole crap load of flame wars. given China has been on the receiving end of criticism on anything and everything recently, things are gonna turn racist faster than paris hilton can drop her panties.
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youre an idiot please dont post here
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wufan just cant represnet chinese starcraft players
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Yeah seriously dybydx, lurking wouldn't do you any harm.
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I initially thought that this MUST be an april fools, but since it seems you're serious here goes...
To be fair, I've had as much problems with connections from russia or other eastern european countries as i've had with china and I'm on (arguably) one of the best ISPs in the world(100 Mbit fibre in Sweden).
While I can understand a desire to make the tourney as lag-free as possible it really doesn't make sense to ban an entire country when first of all not the entire country in question has the problem and second of all the problem isn't isolated to that country.
While it would be more work why couldn't you just test the top 48 individually in a game with observers? It would be some extra work but I'd say the tradeoff of not having to ban the most populous country in the world would be worth it.
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i think connection problems were quite bad with eastern europeans couple years ago but the last two years with iccup and such, their isps have improved alot.
china still lags and to be fair i can see a sort of reasoning behind this but you should just ban china from participanting all together instead having a situation now where the potential winner or whoever have to face the fact that they had an easy road.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
we are currently working on alternative solutions, but right now we absolutely must focus on the viability and quality of the broadcasts in this tournament
its regretable, but currently its necessary. it certainly isn't racist or anything ridiculous like that. You guys need to understand that we are stretched very thin running TSL as it is, and we don't have enough time to spare to work out the numerous problems players have connecting with players in china in a case-by-case manner.
Coordinating a large amount of players is a difficult task in and of itself, and we do have a schedule to keep.
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in fact,it isn't all chinese ips have the problem of lag
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Has this anything to do with the Great 'Fire'Wall of China?
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the great firewall of china has opened up a lot since 2002, and is a lot more free. I played with many players from China on my USA ISP, and the games are fine.
Starcraft isn't a game that requires that quick of an response from computer to computer.
It should work fine streaming.
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I would be sad if this affects the future decisions of the chinese when they plan to invite foreigners for their tournaments. c'mon atleast let their top players represent the country.
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the firewall in china only blocks sites that are blacklisted. the list is maintained manually. since battle.net does not involve itself with anything political or obscene, it hasnt been on the blacklist.
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i could agree with these decision if this was some no name tournament with 2$ prize pool... but in such a tournament to ban all chinese players......... makes no sense! pj, legend, f91, super, jaystar, rushgoon........... it is not a real tournament without them... i can't belive you didn't think about it before!
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I don't think it'd be too much trouble to get a US player + European player + your 2 obs and test the lag for anyone in China or any developing country. There are only a dozen or two of them likely to qualify anyway.
Banning Chinese players is both under and overinclusive. I played 2 games against F91 with no lag at all, but had to set higher latency (all games using the iccup launcher LAN setting) when playing against people from Australia, Vietnam, and Romania. There are plenty of pros with good connections in China, and plenty of people outside China that get horrible latency to the US/Europe.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
sigh
China CONSTANTLY has events with tons of money where foreigners are for the most part excluded. Sometimes they invite 2-4 euro/americans or allow "us" to play in their qualifiers. They do this because they have their own leagues where professional teams, broadcasting and money is all on the line. We as "foreigners" FINALLY get something that we have been drooling over while watching koreans/chinese indulge in what we all want for ourselves and you guys are going to bitch?
Fact: Most chinese have connection problems with non Chinese.
Fact2: This problem is compounded with MORE people in the game IE casters, recorders, refs etc.
Fact3: Some chinese FLAT OUT cannot be in the same game as foreigners because they dont have the connection of a PJ/Lx/F91 etc.
So when they hit a foreigner in the playoff do we reroute the entire tourney? Do we DQ one of the players? Do we disallow casters? Do we make the foreigner suffer through the lag with 5k at stake? No. We dont. That isn't fair. It's illogical and unnecessary.
Can we for once have a foreigner event where it is truly a matter of what foreigner is going to make themselves rich? I am tired of having the chinese exclude us from events / leagues and then when we have one of our own their delegates start bitching about fairness and equality.. common? I am sorry but logistically they have historically been a nuisance. Aside from that they have been perfectly fine ignoring foreigners for the most part.
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wow, that might be the best post i've ever seen from incontrol :o
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
On April 03 2008 16:45 littlechava wrote:
wow, that might be the best post i've ever seen from incontrol :o its a change fromOn April 03 2008 14:53 {88}iNcontroL wrote:should be nice  On April 03 2008 11:52 {88}iNcontroL wrote:
hawt et al
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There aren't going to be that many games broadcast; hosting a test game to check lag doesn't take more than a minute. If you only do it for the chinese players who qualify it's basically no hassle for anyone. If they don't lag in a test game, they have no greater chance of being dropped than any other foreigner.
I'm not chinese and i don't feel particularly strongly about this, it just seems like this was a very arbitrary and lazy choice, and half the people in favor of it are just happy to not face certain chinese players.
PS
The PGL is irrelevant if this about lag. It doesn't claim to be international anyway.
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all the talk about proxies and chinese pro's connections is kinda suspect. media played a clanwar against some chinese players bly set up and every single game lagged, we had to switch players half a dozen times because alot of the lag was just unplayable.
the blanket decision may seem kinda unfair, but doing it on a case by case basis is only marginally better, if at all. you have to decide how much lag is too much(which will lead to controversy in itself), because i doubt any of them will have no lag at all. then the ones who do have to be replaced will be even more pissed cuz they wasted the time qualifying and cant play. the admins then have to go through the hassle of getting the replacements on top of having to test all the chinese players in the first place (and it would be a decent investment of time, because quite a few chinese players could qualify and quite a few would have unplayable lag)
pgl and the other chinese leagues are relevant, simply because it means theres less reason to go out of the way to accommodate the chinese. in the first news post it says koreans arent allowed because they already have their own leagues, this is to give foreigners something big and important and rewarding to play in. the chinese already have other things like that as well so why bend over backwards to try to fit them in here.
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EPT
