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On December 26 2008 18:54 Geo.Rion wrote:
people are ignoring the importance of the PL Ace matches vs high caliber opponents, which is a much greater responsability and pressure on the player than a ro16 or whatever.
Flash got his spot mainly because of the PL and beacause he was seeded/qulified for the SLs. he had a very easy road in MST and GOM up to now. He didn't beat/own any good player. His most important win was against Free, and if you saw that match you agree that Free lost it not FLash won. You don't need to win a SL to get top 3. God...
All of you sould appreciate things like crushing mechanic builds on Destination, (most of the zergs cannot handle the same level terran's mech on Desti, and not only there) figuring out the RIGHT way to add queens in zvt, simoltenaous guardian defiler attack etc... Games like those really give hope for the zerg fans, that the race can reinvent himself and be dominant or at least equal with the other 2 (I guess nobody denies that Zergs are nowhere near the Ts an Ps). Games like against Bisu arent these kind. There you just watch and say, God damit, this guy is good, he wins because he's unstopable, he's everywhere. But the builds i mention can be learned by the good players and use them as a viable option. 2hatch/3hatch muta into lurker is becoming useless really. most of terran builds are designed to crush these and abuse the timing windowses.
There are almost 2 weeks till the next PR, JD might got no1, but only if the other contenders are doing poorly. Few games doesnt indicates putting anybody 1st, even if he plays like a god. But there will be more games. For JD, for Stork, for Flash and for Bisu too. Wait to see those and after that start to argue about 1st place or whatever.
Jaedong play is incredible, if there is hype about it, what are your arguments against that? Wait till he actually plays enough to show if he's really that good.... haters... How can you dislike JD? he's the only top zerg player, you have to show some support for it even if you're not his fan. Imagine an all Zerg seimfinal, PL dominated by Zergs, than a good toss player would have 1 infinite number of supporters, because he's the hope to equalize the pro-scene once again.
TBH, the only reason I'm even bothering to argue is because when random really good player plays well in the proleauges, have a lot of success, do something really well, people just shrug and move on.
Yet when Jaedong do it, suddenly he is god. And then all the failures before that get conveiniently forgotten.
It's really the double standard which erks me. I have nothing against Jaedong, and I found his game against Bisu to be very entertaining.
On December 26 2008 17:04 Darth Peter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2008 13:01 baubo wrote:On December 26 2008 09:48 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 26 2008 08:51 Sentenal wrote:On December 25 2008 20:21 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
How is my post absurd? Did you watch the games? did you see that I wrote "if he continues to play this well" ...
You do realize that jaedong was once the best player on earth right? You realize his potential? Then why argue.
He does not have to prove that he can win leagues, coz we know he can. He only has to prove that he is back in shape.
I dont say that he's clearly better than Bisu. However im saying that if he's back in shape he is probably better or atleast very close in terms of skills, so for one person to think that he was better would not be wierd at all, maybe just abit biased. Thats why your post was absurd. You do realize that Bisu was once the best player on Earth, right? And I'm not talking current events. I'm talking Pre-Jaedong, Pre-Flash. The first half of 2007 was Bisu's time. It just seems like, if Jaedong plays like how people expect him to play (as in, great), then he should be ranked #1, because that is his throne that he once held, and only lost it due to poor play. But hes back now, and his throne should be returned to him. Like I said in an earlier post, as if the #1 spot is his right if he plays well. Whats my point about bringing up Bisu's first reign? Well, the throne of #1 was someone else's before Jaedong. It was someone else's before Bisu. Simply put, no one has some right to be ranked #1 if they play great. You do have to play great to be #1, there is no question there. But you have to prove that the people already ahead of you are overall worse than you are. JD beat Bisu in a PL game, but that doesn't mean in the grand sceme of things, that Jaedong is better. He might be, I don't know (my fanboyism says no, but I won't go there). Jaedong needs to get results again, he needs to start climbing back up. He needs to pave the road to #1 on the bodies of those in his path. Basically, he needs to keep raping people in PL, and he needs to bulldoze his way in induvisual leagues. Maybe Jaedong will be #1 again, but I really doubt it will be this next month. There are too many people in between him and #1. It depends both on what Jaedong can do, and also what the play of those ahead of him do. In order for Bisu to take #1 from Stork this past month, Bisu needed to both dominate, and have Stork not. And thats what happened. Something similar, though on a grander scale (8 to 1 is a long jump) would have to happen here again for Jaedong to be #1. Top 5 is reasonable. Top 3 is pushing it, but not impossible. Being #1 this next month is next to impossible. I replied in this fashion because people said he had to prove himself in induvidual leagues to be even top3. I dont think that is the case if he keep showing PL performance like he did vs SKT1. Why shouldn't he have to prove himself in the starleagues? Bisu didn't make his comeback in the PR and in public sentiment until he started owning both the OSL(where he lost to the eventual champion in a very close series) and the MSL. Every other player on the PR 1-9 right now has had more starleague success recently than Jaedong. What makes Jaedong so special that simple PL play should vault him into a top 3 or top 5 position? Yeah,Flash had definitely more Starleague succes than him. Being in both Starleagues and sucking every zerg's dick is a great succes. You mean he's still in Gom? Well,he didn't beat any significannt player there yet iether,only Fantasy. If he beats Bisu, that's another thing. So Flash is mostly no3 because of his PL performance. Starleagues don't matter jack shit. It matters if you play more,and beat good players. According to your logic,every Starleague winner should be no1 or no2. Well,July was only no4,although he won the OSL. Why? Because his opponents sucked,simple as that. I think games themselves should matter more than titles.
Well, if you think starleagues don't really matter, then I guess I have no argument.
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On December 26 2008 19:11 baubo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2008 18:54 Geo.Rion wrote:
people are ignoring the importance of the PL Ace matches vs high caliber opponents, which is a much greater responsability and pressure on the player than a ro16 or whatever.
Flash got his spot mainly because of the PL and beacause he was seeded/qulified for the SLs. he had a very easy road in MST and GOM up to now. He didn't beat/own any good player. His most important win was against Free, and if you saw that match you agree that Free lost it not FLash won. You don't need to win a SL to get top 3. God...
All of you sould appreciate things like crushing mechanic builds on Destination, (most of the zergs cannot handle the same level terran's mech on Desti, and not only there) figuring out the RIGHT way to add queens in zvt, simoltenaous guardian defiler attack etc... Games like those really give hope for the zerg fans, that the race can reinvent himself and be dominant or at least equal with the other 2 (I guess nobody denies that Zergs are nowhere near the Ts an Ps). Games like against Bisu arent these kind. There you just watch and say, God damit, this guy is good, he wins because he's unstopable, he's everywhere. But the builds i mention can be learned by the good players and use them as a viable option. 2hatch/3hatch muta into lurker is becoming useless really. most of terran builds are designed to crush these and abuse the timing windowses.
There are almost 2 weeks till the next PR, JD might got no1, but only if the other contenders are doing poorly. Few games doesnt indicates putting anybody 1st, even if he plays like a god. But there will be more games. For JD, for Stork, for Flash and for Bisu too. Wait to see those and after that start to argue about 1st place or whatever.
Jaedong play is incredible, if there is hype about it, what are your arguments against that? Wait till he actually plays enough to show if he's really that good.... haters... How can you dislike JD? he's the only top zerg player, you have to show some support for it even if you're not his fan. Imagine an all Zerg seimfinal, PL dominated by Zergs, than a good toss player would have 1 infinite number of supporters, because he's the hope to equalize the pro-scene once again. TBH, the only reason I'm even bothering to argue is because when random really good player plays well in the proleauges, have a lot of success, do something really well, people just shrug and move on. Yet when Jaedong do it, suddenly he is god. And then all the failures before that get conveiniently forgotten. It's really the double standard which erks me. I have nothing against Jaedong, and I found his game against Bisu to be very entertaining. Show nested quote +On December 26 2008 17:04 Darth Peter wrote:On December 26 2008 13:01 baubo wrote:On December 26 2008 09:48 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 26 2008 08:51 Sentenal wrote:On December 25 2008 20:21 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
How is my post absurd? Did you watch the games? did you see that I wrote "if he continues to play this well" ...
You do realize that jaedong was once the best player on earth right? You realize his potential? Then why argue.
He does not have to prove that he can win leagues, coz we know he can. He only has to prove that he is back in shape.
I dont say that he's clearly better than Bisu. However im saying that if he's back in shape he is probably better or atleast very close in terms of skills, so for one person to think that he was better would not be wierd at all, maybe just abit biased. Thats why your post was absurd. You do realize that Bisu was once the best player on Earth, right? And I'm not talking current events. I'm talking Pre-Jaedong, Pre-Flash. The first half of 2007 was Bisu's time. It just seems like, if Jaedong plays like how people expect him to play (as in, great), then he should be ranked #1, because that is his throne that he once held, and only lost it due to poor play. But hes back now, and his throne should be returned to him. Like I said in an earlier post, as if the #1 spot is his right if he plays well. Whats my point about bringing up Bisu's first reign? Well, the throne of #1 was someone else's before Jaedong. It was someone else's before Bisu. Simply put, no one has some right to be ranked #1 if they play great. You do have to play great to be #1, there is no question there. But you have to prove that the people already ahead of you are overall worse than you are. JD beat Bisu in a PL game, but that doesn't mean in the grand sceme of things, that Jaedong is better. He might be, I don't know (my fanboyism says no, but I won't go there). Jaedong needs to get results again, he needs to start climbing back up. He needs to pave the road to #1 on the bodies of those in his path. Basically, he needs to keep raping people in PL, and he needs to bulldoze his way in induvisual leagues. Maybe Jaedong will be #1 again, but I really doubt it will be this next month. There are too many people in between him and #1. It depends both on what Jaedong can do, and also what the play of those ahead of him do. In order for Bisu to take #1 from Stork this past month, Bisu needed to both dominate, and have Stork not. And thats what happened. Something similar, though on a grander scale (8 to 1 is a long jump) would have to happen here again for Jaedong to be #1. Top 5 is reasonable. Top 3 is pushing it, but not impossible. Being #1 this next month is next to impossible. I replied in this fashion because people said he had to prove himself in induvidual leagues to be even top3. I dont think that is the case if he keep showing PL performance like he did vs SKT1. Why shouldn't he have to prove himself in the starleagues? Bisu didn't make his comeback in the PR and in public sentiment until he started owning both the OSL(where he lost to the eventual champion in a very close series) and the MSL. Every other player on the PR 1-9 right now has had more starleague success recently than Jaedong. What makes Jaedong so special that simple PL play should vault him into a top 3 or top 5 position? Yeah,Flash had definitely more Starleague succes than him. Being in both Starleagues and sucking every zerg's dick is a great succes. You mean he's still in Gom? Well,he didn't beat any significannt player there yet iether,only Fantasy. If he beats Bisu, that's another thing. So Flash is mostly no3 because of his PL performance. Starleagues don't matter jack shit. It matters if you play more,and beat good players. According to your logic,every Starleague winner should be no1 or no2. Well,July was only no4,although he won the OSL. Why? Because his opponents sucked,simple as that. I think games themselves should matter more than titles. Well, if you think starleagues don't really matter, then I guess I have no argument.
Okay, I didn't mean that,I explained myself wrong. I just wanted to say,that beating Bisu in a televised game,no matter the league sohuld mean more than beating Rock twice in a Starleague.
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I dont know what is whith that much commentating, JD beat Bisu, the best player on Earth, he beat best SKT Terran and single handed Shine and owned almost every Z he encounters. His results are not in vain, he should go up in PR, if Bisu losses to Flash and one other match in PL he will be on a negative strike...
Quod erat demonstrandum
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If there are no important BoX series in any starleague for a month, should the PR just be set on hold?
In times like that you have to use your brain, analyze the games and figure out who is the strongest pro-gamer at this moment.
Babou, same thing would happen if flash, bisu or stork slumped and then suddenly started owning in pro-leage, even savior or any other pre-top tier gamer. That's coz people know their potential. They have proven it before. Gamers have a history you know and you have to take that into consideration when you make the PR.
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On December 26 2008 21:38 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
If there are no important BoX series in any starleague for a month, should the PR just be set on hold?
In times like that you have to use your brain, analyze the games and figure out who is the strongest pro-gamer at this moment.
Babou, same thing would happen if flash, bisu or stork slumped and then suddenly started owning in pro-leage, even savior or any other pre-top tier gamer. That's coz people know their potential. They have proven it before. Gamers have a history you know and you have to take that into consideration when you make the PR.
very true + flash did the same thing, goin` up to #3 spot just for PL results
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On December 26 2008 19:11 baubo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2008 18:54 Geo.Rion wrote:
people are ignoring the importance of the PL Ace matches vs high caliber opponents, which is a much greater responsability and pressure on the player than a ro16 or whatever.
Flash got his spot mainly because of the PL and beacause he was seeded/qulified for the SLs. he had a very easy road in MST and GOM up to now. He didn't beat/own any good player. His most important win was against Free, and if you saw that match you agree that Free lost it not FLash won. You don't need to win a SL to get top 3. God...
All of you sould appreciate things like crushing mechanic builds on Destination, (most of the zergs cannot handle the same level terran's mech on Desti, and not only there) figuring out the RIGHT way to add queens in zvt, simoltenaous guardian defiler attack etc... Games like those really give hope for the zerg fans, that the race can reinvent himself and be dominant or at least equal with the other 2 (I guess nobody denies that Zergs are nowhere near the Ts an Ps). Games like against Bisu arent these kind. There you just watch and say, God damit, this guy is good, he wins because he's unstopable, he's everywhere. But the builds i mention can be learned by the good players and use them as a viable option. 2hatch/3hatch muta into lurker is becoming useless really. most of terran builds are designed to crush these and abuse the timing windowses.
There are almost 2 weeks till the next PR, JD might got no1, but only if the other contenders are doing poorly. Few games doesnt indicates putting anybody 1st, even if he plays like a god. But there will be more games. For JD, for Stork, for Flash and for Bisu too. Wait to see those and after that start to argue about 1st place or whatever.
Jaedong play is incredible, if there is hype about it, what are your arguments against that? Wait till he actually plays enough to show if he's really that good.... haters... How can you dislike JD? he's the only top zerg player, you have to show some support for it even if you're not his fan. Imagine an all Zerg seimfinal, PL dominated by Zergs, than a good toss player would have 1 infinite number of supporters, because he's the hope to equalize the pro-scene once again. TBH, the only reason I'm even bothering to argue is because when random really good player plays well in the proleauges, have a lot of success, do something really well, people just shrug and move on. Yet when Jaedong do it, suddenly he is god. And then all the failures before that get conveiniently forgotten. It's really the double standard which erks me. I have nothing against Jaedong, and I found his game against Bisu to be very entertaining.
How about good players who are slumping, and while slumping they start playing well in the proleague? They're not hyped then? Of course, if JD was playing like he did in January, and doing well in Proleague, everyone would just shrug. You don't seem to realize how important it is if he's actually back in form.
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Leta is in fire ! Why he isn't in the top 10 ? :o
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On December 26 2008 21:38 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
If there are no important BoX series in any starleague for a month, should the PR just be set on hold?
In times like that you have to use your brain, analyze the games and figure out who is the strongest pro-gamer at this moment.
Babou, same thing would happen if flash, bisu or stork slumped and then suddenly started owning in pro-leage, even savior or any other pre-top tier gamer. That's coz people know their potential. They have proven it before. Gamers have a history you know and you have to take that into consideration when you make the PR.
No, but at least it shouldn't be a big jump like many are thinking. Top 3? No chance.
On December 26 2008 20:31 Darth Peter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2008 19:11 baubo wrote:On December 26 2008 18:54 Geo.Rion wrote:
people are ignoring the importance of the PL Ace matches vs high caliber opponents, which is a much greater responsability and pressure on the player than a ro16 or whatever.
Flash got his spot mainly because of the PL and beacause he was seeded/qulified for the SLs. he had a very easy road in MST and GOM up to now. He didn't beat/own any good player. His most important win was against Free, and if you saw that match you agree that Free lost it not FLash won. You don't need to win a SL to get top 3. God...
All of you sould appreciate things like crushing mechanic builds on Destination, (most of the zergs cannot handle the same level terran's mech on Desti, and not only there) figuring out the RIGHT way to add queens in zvt, simoltenaous guardian defiler attack etc... Games like those really give hope for the zerg fans, that the race can reinvent himself and be dominant or at least equal with the other 2 (I guess nobody denies that Zergs are nowhere near the Ts an Ps). Games like against Bisu arent these kind. There you just watch and say, God damit, this guy is good, he wins because he's unstopable, he's everywhere. But the builds i mention can be learned by the good players and use them as a viable option. 2hatch/3hatch muta into lurker is becoming useless really. most of terran builds are designed to crush these and abuse the timing windowses.
There are almost 2 weeks till the next PR, JD might got no1, but only if the other contenders are doing poorly. Few games doesnt indicates putting anybody 1st, even if he plays like a god. But there will be more games. For JD, for Stork, for Flash and for Bisu too. Wait to see those and after that start to argue about 1st place or whatever.
Jaedong play is incredible, if there is hype about it, what are your arguments against that? Wait till he actually plays enough to show if he's really that good.... haters... How can you dislike JD? he's the only top zerg player, you have to show some support for it even if you're not his fan. Imagine an all Zerg seimfinal, PL dominated by Zergs, than a good toss player would have 1 infinite number of supporters, because he's the hope to equalize the pro-scene once again. TBH, the only reason I'm even bothering to argue is because when random really good player plays well in the proleauges, have a lot of success, do something really well, people just shrug and move on. Yet when Jaedong do it, suddenly he is god. And then all the failures before that get conveiniently forgotten. It's really the double standard which erks me. I have nothing against Jaedong, and I found his game against Bisu to be very entertaining. On December 26 2008 17:04 Darth Peter wrote:On December 26 2008 13:01 baubo wrote:On December 26 2008 09:48 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 26 2008 08:51 Sentenal wrote:On December 25 2008 20:21 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
How is my post absurd? Did you watch the games? did you see that I wrote "if he continues to play this well" ...
You do realize that jaedong was once the best player on earth right? You realize his potential? Then why argue.
He does not have to prove that he can win leagues, coz we know he can. He only has to prove that he is back in shape.
I dont say that he's clearly better than Bisu. However im saying that if he's back in shape he is probably better or atleast very close in terms of skills, so for one person to think that he was better would not be wierd at all, maybe just abit biased. Thats why your post was absurd. You do realize that Bisu was once the best player on Earth, right? And I'm not talking current events. I'm talking Pre-Jaedong, Pre-Flash. The first half of 2007 was Bisu's time. It just seems like, if Jaedong plays like how people expect him to play (as in, great), then he should be ranked #1, because that is his throne that he once held, and only lost it due to poor play. But hes back now, and his throne should be returned to him. Like I said in an earlier post, as if the #1 spot is his right if he plays well. Whats my point about bringing up Bisu's first reign? Well, the throne of #1 was someone else's before Jaedong. It was someone else's before Bisu. Simply put, no one has some right to be ranked #1 if they play great. You do have to play great to be #1, there is no question there. But you have to prove that the people already ahead of you are overall worse than you are. JD beat Bisu in a PL game, but that doesn't mean in the grand sceme of things, that Jaedong is better. He might be, I don't know (my fanboyism says no, but I won't go there). Jaedong needs to get results again, he needs to start climbing back up. He needs to pave the road to #1 on the bodies of those in his path. Basically, he needs to keep raping people in PL, and he needs to bulldoze his way in induvisual leagues. Maybe Jaedong will be #1 again, but I really doubt it will be this next month. There are too many people in between him and #1. It depends both on what Jaedong can do, and also what the play of those ahead of him do. In order for Bisu to take #1 from Stork this past month, Bisu needed to both dominate, and have Stork not. And thats what happened. Something similar, though on a grander scale (8 to 1 is a long jump) would have to happen here again for Jaedong to be #1. Top 5 is reasonable. Top 3 is pushing it, but not impossible. Being #1 this next month is next to impossible. I replied in this fashion because people said he had to prove himself in induvidual leagues to be even top3. I dont think that is the case if he keep showing PL performance like he did vs SKT1. Why shouldn't he have to prove himself in the starleagues? Bisu didn't make his comeback in the PR and in public sentiment until he started owning both the OSL(where he lost to the eventual champion in a very close series) and the MSL. Every other player on the PR 1-9 right now has had more starleague success recently than Jaedong. What makes Jaedong so special that simple PL play should vault him into a top 3 or top 5 position? Yeah,Flash had definitely more Starleague succes than him. Being in both Starleagues and sucking every zerg's dick is a great succes. You mean he's still in Gom? Well,he didn't beat any significannt player there yet iether,only Fantasy. If he beats Bisu, that's another thing. So Flash is mostly no3 because of his PL performance. Starleagues don't matter jack shit. It matters if you play more,and beat good players. According to your logic,every Starleague winner should be no1 or no2. Well,July was only no4,although he won the OSL. Why? Because his opponents sucked,simple as that. I think games themselves should matter more than titles. Well, if you think starleagues don't really matter, then I guess I have no argument. Okay, I didn't mean that,I explained myself wrong. I just wanted to say,that beating Bisu in a televised game,no matter the league sohuld mean more than beating Rock twice in a Starleague.
Yes and no. Sure, beating Rock doesn't seem impressive, but you say that like it's some sort of automatic when FBH and Jaedong both lost to crap players in GOM. So there is something to be said for being consistent against weak opponent in a BoX series. That's why you can't rank someone like Kal or Sea high, as they can look like a world-beater in one game and an absolute noob in the next.
On December 27 2008 05:19 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2008 19:11 baubo wrote:On December 26 2008 18:54 Geo.Rion wrote:
people are ignoring the importance of the PL Ace matches vs high caliber opponents, which is a much greater responsability and pressure on the player than a ro16 or whatever.
Flash got his spot mainly because of the PL and beacause he was seeded/qulified for the SLs. he had a very easy road in MST and GOM up to now. He didn't beat/own any good player. His most important win was against Free, and if you saw that match you agree that Free lost it not FLash won. You don't need to win a SL to get top 3. God...
All of you sould appreciate things like crushing mechanic builds on Destination, (most of the zergs cannot handle the same level terran's mech on Desti, and not only there) figuring out the RIGHT way to add queens in zvt, simoltenaous guardian defiler attack etc... Games like those really give hope for the zerg fans, that the race can reinvent himself and be dominant or at least equal with the other 2 (I guess nobody denies that Zergs are nowhere near the Ts an Ps). Games like against Bisu arent these kind. There you just watch and say, God damit, this guy is good, he wins because he's unstopable, he's everywhere. But the builds i mention can be learned by the good players and use them as a viable option. 2hatch/3hatch muta into lurker is becoming useless really. most of terran builds are designed to crush these and abuse the timing windowses.
There are almost 2 weeks till the next PR, JD might got no1, but only if the other contenders are doing poorly. Few games doesnt indicates putting anybody 1st, even if he plays like a god. But there will be more games. For JD, for Stork, for Flash and for Bisu too. Wait to see those and after that start to argue about 1st place or whatever.
Jaedong play is incredible, if there is hype about it, what are your arguments against that? Wait till he actually plays enough to show if he's really that good.... haters... How can you dislike JD? he's the only top zerg player, you have to show some support for it even if you're not his fan. Imagine an all Zerg seimfinal, PL dominated by Zergs, than a good toss player would have 1 infinite number of supporters, because he's the hope to equalize the pro-scene once again. TBH, the only reason I'm even bothering to argue is because when random really good player plays well in the proleauges, have a lot of success, do something really well, people just shrug and move on. Yet when Jaedong do it, suddenly he is god. And then all the failures before that get conveiniently forgotten. It's really the double standard which erks me. I have nothing against Jaedong, and I found his game against Bisu to be very entertaining. How about good players who are slumping, and while slumping they start playing well in the proleague? They're not hyped then? Of course, if JD was playing like he did in January, and doing well in Proleague, everyone would just shrug. You don't seem to realize how important it is if he's actually back in form.
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't.
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On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't.
well you should. great players back in form are great again.
If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3?
Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3.
When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog.
from an objective point of view that is.
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On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is.
In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them.
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On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them.
If he makes both the MSL and OSL, and I say IF, then not only has he beaten both Bisu and Flash, but he is in both leagues, something that Jangbi, Free, and Best have failed to do. But that's an if, so it's rather pointless to argue about it now.
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On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them.
And what if Flash loses to Bisu and gets eliminated from Gom after losing to the first good player he meets? You would just let him at no3 because he went farther in Gom than Jaedong? Also. Free and Jangbi and Best are all great players,but they are not even close to the top-form Jaedong. Only Flash can be. But it seems Flash is not on his peak,unless he beats Bisu. Flash loses to the good players he faces,and that is no shame,but the old Flash would never do that. The old Flash woul dhave just own everybody who opposes him. Otherwise let's see. Jangbi Free and Best are already eliminated from either the MSL or the OSL. That's certainly not a great achivement. Otherwise Free has been losing some games lately+ Show Spoiler +,and was not carrying the Wstars on his back like JD did. Jangbi is also good,but tell me with a straight face that he's currently more impressive than Jaedong.A problem with Janbi is that he played only four games since the last PR,and lost half of them. Based on the few amounts of games,you could say that we can't drop him yet because we didn't see him play that much this month. And Best. I can't realy say anything about Best,I just can't. He has one of the best Proleague record,he advanced in the Gom despite having to play his weakest matchup and against one of the strongest Zergs of all,and he won. He is on a 6 game winstreak. Only point against him is that he was already knocked out of the MSL. Maybe he deserves to stay above Jaedong,and be a few spots higher. I have all respect for FBH,but when we are in a Protoss era,you really need godly T v P to achieve anything,and he still seems to lose to nearly every protoss he faces. It doesn't help much that he was already knocked out of the OSL,and he is eliminated from leagues by Zergs and Terrans too,like Bogus,and I don't know who the hell eliminated him from the OSL,but if my memory serves well,it wasn't a protoss. So looking at these facts,I don't understand why top 3 would be unreachable. I mean by the current situation,Flash,Jangbi and Best should still be above him. But there is still a lot till the next PR. If Flash loses to Bisu,Jangbi loses to Pepe(it can happen),and loses more PL games, and Best,IDK,perhaps he cannot be overtaken,well Jaedong deserves to be no3. Now that I look at it better,perhaps JD doesn't deserve no 3 yet,but I think 4 or 5 is realistic.
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On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them.
Jaedong didnt't win 2-3 PL games, in fact he won 5 in a raw, but the important is that he crushed 2-3 high caliber opponents in a very short time. Flash is "consistent" against noobs and terrans, yet he failed to beat the top class players he met, JD and Stork. Yet again there is a HUGE diference between someone beating a medicore player and facing Bisu on an Ace match. (Or someone who was preparing only to snipe the ace (Shine)). And there will be many games till the new PR. JD has to pass his MSL until than, and the skill level of the others will be tested as well. To be above Flash, Jangbi, Free, FBH, Best. Well that's not a big deal, his PL stat is better even with his "slump" period included than FBH', Jangbi's and Free's. And all those players barely met those many high caliber opponents that JD met in a week. OK, a bit exageration there, but you get the point. Starleauges. FBH is out of 2 Leauges, Jangbi out of 1, Best out of 1, Jangbi out of one, Free out of one. The only player who is in all of the leagues is Flash. BUT, many of these players yet have to play very soon in order to remain in the respective Leagues.
Now look one by one, just stats, and let's not watch the games, cuz they are clearly favoring JD. These are speculations of course. Let's accept that JD will pass his MSL and win every PL games. Dont forget that he's the Ace player of the no1 PL team. Forgg isn't an option for quite some time.
Flash: He's favorite against Bisu, not because he's a better player but because his playstyle counters Bisu's very well. Both Flash and Bisu admitted this in their interviews. IF he loose to Bisu: he's out of GOM, got the 2nd spot to qualify in MSL and is seeded in OSL. His PL stat is better than JD's but when they met JD won (2 times in a raw). No question here, JD should be higher, 2 PL wins doesnt equalize the fact that you lost in the most recent direct encounter. One of the ace players of the KTF team (the better one though), ranked somewhere around 8th rank.
EDIT: sry he isnt seeded for OSL, he has to pass a semi-decent player in january to qualify.
Best: Seeded in OSL out of MSL and he passed his GOM round. PL stat better than JD's. One of the many ace options for the SKT1 ranked somewhere on the middle of the table. He played almost this good last month, he got 7th place. He should move a lot higher, if we dont count the play quality (but we certanly do otherwise) he should be above JD with a rank or even.
Free: out of 1 L, worse PL stat, one of the ace options (the better one though) of the 7th ranked (i guess) W Stars team. Close to JD but uner him.
FBH: recent encounters favor him, but he's out of 2 leagues and he's in the MSL which is a toss battlefield so he has almost no chanse to get even that far as he did last time. Or who knows, but he's still out of 2 Leauges, eliminated by weak players and his PL stat is weaker than JD's. One of the ace options for the 2nd ranked Khan. Under JD.
Jangbi: the other ace option for Khan, out of 1 SL seeded for MSL, and has to pass his GOM round (against the worst player still in GOM), PL stat lower than JD's. JD should be higher.
So how the hell can you say NO WAY? He might even surpass Bisu and Stork if they loose all of their games til next PR. Stork lost way too many till now anyway. And Bisu has to face the most dangerous opponent for him, if he cannot defeat him, it might have psichological effect and Bisu might loose his confidence. but otherwise he's clearly no1. Even with the ace loss, and if he looses to Flash ina close series and wins every other match, he's still no1.
And you forget about Leta. He should be very high next month, depending on the others' achievements
SRy for this long post, but you didnt read it anyway i guess
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On December 27 2008 16:47 Geo.Rion wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them. Jaedong didnt't win 2-3 PL games, in fact he won 5 in a raw, but the important is that he crushed 2-3 high caliber opponents in a very short time. Flash is "consistent" against noobs and terrans, yet he failed to beat the top class players he met, JD and Stork. Yet again there is a HUGE diference between someone beating a medicore player and facing Bisu on an Ace match. (Or someone who was preparing only to snipe the ace (Shine)). And there will be many games till the new PR. JD has to pass his MSL until than, and the skill level of the others will be tested as well. To be above Flash, Jangbi, Free, FBH, Best. Well that's not a big deal, his PL stat is better even with his "slump" period included than FBH', Jangbi's and Free's. And all those players barely met those many high caliber opponents that JD met in a week. OK, a bit exageration there, but you get the point. Starleauges. FBH is out of 2 Leauges, Jangbi out of 1, Best out of 1, Jangbi out of one, Free out of one. The only player who is in all of the leagues is Flash. BUT, many of these players yet have to play very soon in order to remain in the respective Leagues. Now look one by one, just stats, and let's not watch the games, cuz they are clearly favoring JD. These are speculations of course. Let's accept that JD will pass his MSL and win every PL games. Dont forget that he's the Ace player of the no1 PL team. Forgg isn't an option for quite some time. Flash: He's favorite against Bisu, not because he's a better player but because his playstyle counters Bisu's very well. Both Flash and Bisu admitted this in their interviews. IF he loose to Bisu: he's out of GOM, got the 2nd spot to qualify in MSL and is seeded in OSL. His PL stat is better than JD's but when they met JD won (2 times in a raw). No question here, JD should be higher, 2 PL wins doesnt equalize the fact that you lost in the most recent direct encounter. One of the ace players of the KTF team (the better one though), ranked somewhere around 8th rank. EDIT: sry he isnt seeded for OSL, he has to pass a semi-decent player in january to qualify. Best: Seeded in OSL out of MSL and he passed his GOM round. PL stat better than JD's. One of the many ace options for the SKT1 ranked somewhere on the middle of the table. He played almost this good last month, he got 7th place. He should move a lot higher, if we dont count the play quality (but we certanly do otherwise) he should be above JD with a rank or even. Free: out of 1 L, worse PL stat, one of the ace options (the better one though) of the 7th ranked (i guess) W Stars team. Close to JD but uner him. FBH: recent encounters favor him, but he's out of 2 leagues and he's in the MSL which is a toss battlefield so he has almost no chanse to get even that far as he did last time. Or who knows, but he's still out of 2 Leauges, eliminated by weak players and his PL stat is weaker than JD's. One of the ace options for the 2nd ranked Khan. Under JD. Jangbi: the other ace option for Khan, out of 1 SL seeded for MSL, and has to pass his GOM round (against the worst player still in GOM), PL stat lower than JD's. JD should be higher. So how the hell can you say NO WAY? He might even surpass Bisu and Stork if they loose all of their games til next PR. Stork lost way too many till now anyway. And Bisu has to face the most dangerous opponent for him, if he cannot defeat him, it might have psichological effect and Bisu might loose his confidence. but otherwise he's clearly no1. Even with the ace loss, and if he looses to Flash ina close series and wins every other match, he's still no1. SRy for this long post, but you didnt read it anyway i guess
I think that the only way JD could get above Stork is if Stork loses to Backho with 2-0,and loses every PL gamestill next PR.Bisu can no way be denied top spot. Even if he loses to Flash,that's not a good reason to drop him. I remember raga4ka wrote,that in that case,Stork should be no1,because he has a chance. That has no sense,Stork was clearly inferior to Bisu this month,even lost in a direct match,and he would be above Bisu only because of speculations,because he didn't even win that bo 3 yet? I think Bisu's no1 this month is clear.
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On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't.
From an objective standpoint, Racial Diversity is a good thing.
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On December 27 2008 17:03 Darth Peter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 16:47 Geo.Rion wrote:On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them. Jaedong didnt't win 2-3 PL games, in fact he won 5 in a raw, but the important is that he crushed 2-3 high caliber opponents in a very short time. Flash is "consistent" against noobs and terrans, yet he failed to beat the top class players he met, JD and Stork. Yet again there is a HUGE diference between someone beating a medicore player and facing Bisu on an Ace match. (Or someone who was preparing only to snipe the ace (Shine)). And there will be many games till the new PR. JD has to pass his MSL until than, and the skill level of the others will be tested as well. To be above Flash, Jangbi, Free, FBH, Best. Well that's not a big deal, his PL stat is better even with his "slump" period included than FBH', Jangbi's and Free's. And all those players barely met those many high caliber opponents that JD met in a week. OK, a bit exageration there, but you get the point. Starleauges. FBH is out of 2 Leauges, Jangbi out of 1, Best out of 1, Jangbi out of one, Free out of one. The only player who is in all of the leagues is Flash. BUT, many of these players yet have to play very soon in order to remain in the respective Leagues. Now look one by one, just stats, and let's not watch the games, cuz they are clearly favoring JD. These are speculations of course. Let's accept that JD will pass his MSL and win every PL games. Dont forget that he's the Ace player of the no1 PL team. Forgg isn't an option for quite some time. Flash: He's favorite against Bisu, not because he's a better player but because his playstyle counters Bisu's very well. Both Flash and Bisu admitted this in their interviews. IF he loose to Bisu: he's out of GOM, got the 2nd spot to qualify in MSL and is seeded in OSL. His PL stat is better than JD's but when they met JD won (2 times in a raw). No question here, JD should be higher, 2 PL wins doesnt equalize the fact that you lost in the most recent direct encounter. One of the ace players of the KTF team (the better one though), ranked somewhere around 8th rank. EDIT: sry he isnt seeded for OSL, he has to pass a semi-decent player in january to qualify. Best: Seeded in OSL out of MSL and he passed his GOM round. PL stat better than JD's. One of the many ace options for the SKT1 ranked somewhere on the middle of the table. He played almost this good last month, he got 7th place. He should move a lot higher, if we dont count the play quality (but we certanly do otherwise) he should be above JD with a rank or even. Free: out of 1 L, worse PL stat, one of the ace options (the better one though) of the 7th ranked (i guess) W Stars team. Close to JD but uner him. FBH: recent encounters favor him, but he's out of 2 leagues and he's in the MSL which is a toss battlefield so he has almost no chanse to get even that far as he did last time. Or who knows, but he's still out of 2 Leauges, eliminated by weak players and his PL stat is weaker than JD's. One of the ace options for the 2nd ranked Khan. Under JD. Jangbi: the other ace option for Khan, out of 1 SL seeded for MSL, and has to pass his GOM round (against the worst player still in GOM), PL stat lower than JD's. JD should be higher. So how the hell can you say NO WAY? He might even surpass Bisu and Stork if they loose all of their games til next PR. Stork lost way too many till now anyway. And Bisu has to face the most dangerous opponent for him, if he cannot defeat him, it might have psichological effect and Bisu might loose his confidence. but otherwise he's clearly no1. Even with the ace loss, and if he looses to Flash ina close series and wins every other match, he's still no1. SRy for this long post, but you didnt read it anyway i guess I think that the only way JD could get above Stork is if Stork loses to Backho with 2-0,and loses every PL gamestill next PR.Bisu can no way be denied top spot. Even if he loses to Flash,that's not a good reason to drop him. I remember raga4ka wrote,that in that case,Stork should be no1,because he has a chance. That has no sense,Stork was clearly inferior to Bisu this month,even lost in a direct match,and he would be above Bisu only because of speculations,because he didn't even win that bo 3 yet? I think Bisu's no1 this month is clear.
I agree with most of it, but i dont think that anything is impossible on the Power rank. On the kespa rank yes, but the Power rank is supposed to show who is the strongest player right now and hopefully the past month. If Bisu shows bad performance and others show better, they should be on top. However i doubt he will show bad performance.
Leta is playing really good lately yes, he's 22-5 the last 27 games, thats insane!
I really like upmagics play lately too;)
I think putting FBH above BeSt was wrong this month and for next month i think maybe Sea, Kal and FBH(his tvp) should step up their game or they'll find themselves off the PR next month. There are alot of good players out there trying to get on it!
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On December 27 2008 20:09 AnOth3rDAy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 17:03 Darth Peter wrote:On December 27 2008 16:47 Geo.Rion wrote:On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them. Jaedong didnt't win 2-3 PL games, in fact he won 5 in a raw, but the important is that he crushed 2-3 high caliber opponents in a very short time. Flash is "consistent" against noobs and terrans, yet he failed to beat the top class players he met, JD and Stork. Yet again there is a HUGE diference between someone beating a medicore player and facing Bisu on an Ace match. (Or someone who was preparing only to snipe the ace (Shine)). And there will be many games till the new PR. JD has to pass his MSL until than, and the skill level of the others will be tested as well. To be above Flash, Jangbi, Free, FBH, Best. Well that's not a big deal, his PL stat is better even with his "slump" period included than FBH', Jangbi's and Free's. And all those players barely met those many high caliber opponents that JD met in a week. OK, a bit exageration there, but you get the point. Starleauges. FBH is out of 2 Leauges, Jangbi out of 1, Best out of 1, Jangbi out of one, Free out of one. The only player who is in all of the leagues is Flash. BUT, many of these players yet have to play very soon in order to remain in the respective Leagues. Now look one by one, just stats, and let's not watch the games, cuz they are clearly favoring JD. These are speculations of course. Let's accept that JD will pass his MSL and win every PL games. Dont forget that he's the Ace player of the no1 PL team. Forgg isn't an option for quite some time. Flash: He's favorite against Bisu, not because he's a better player but because his playstyle counters Bisu's very well. Both Flash and Bisu admitted this in their interviews. IF he loose to Bisu: he's out of GOM, got the 2nd spot to qualify in MSL and is seeded in OSL. His PL stat is better than JD's but when they met JD won (2 times in a raw). No question here, JD should be higher, 2 PL wins doesnt equalize the fact that you lost in the most recent direct encounter. One of the ace players of the KTF team (the better one though), ranked somewhere around 8th rank. EDIT: sry he isnt seeded for OSL, he has to pass a semi-decent player in january to qualify. Best: Seeded in OSL out of MSL and he passed his GOM round. PL stat better than JD's. One of the many ace options for the SKT1 ranked somewhere on the middle of the table. He played almost this good last month, he got 7th place. He should move a lot higher, if we dont count the play quality (but we certanly do otherwise) he should be above JD with a rank or even. Free: out of 1 L, worse PL stat, one of the ace options (the better one though) of the 7th ranked (i guess) W Stars team. Close to JD but uner him. FBH: recent encounters favor him, but he's out of 2 leagues and he's in the MSL which is a toss battlefield so he has almost no chanse to get even that far as he did last time. Or who knows, but he's still out of 2 Leauges, eliminated by weak players and his PL stat is weaker than JD's. One of the ace options for the 2nd ranked Khan. Under JD. Jangbi: the other ace option for Khan, out of 1 SL seeded for MSL, and has to pass his GOM round (against the worst player still in GOM), PL stat lower than JD's. JD should be higher. So how the hell can you say NO WAY? He might even surpass Bisu and Stork if they loose all of their games til next PR. Stork lost way too many till now anyway. And Bisu has to face the most dangerous opponent for him, if he cannot defeat him, it might have psichological effect and Bisu might loose his confidence. but otherwise he's clearly no1. Even with the ace loss, and if he looses to Flash ina close series and wins every other match, he's still no1. SRy for this long post, but you didnt read it anyway i guess I think that the only way JD could get above Stork is if Stork loses to Backho with 2-0,and loses every PL gamestill next PR.Bisu can no way be denied top spot. Even if he loses to Flash,that's not a good reason to drop him. I remember raga4ka wrote,that in that case,Stork should be no1,because he has a chance. That has no sense,Stork was clearly inferior to Bisu this month,even lost in a direct match,and he would be above Bisu only because of speculations,because he didn't even win that bo 3 yet? I think Bisu's no1 this month is clear. I agree with most of it, but i dont think that anything is impossible on the Power rank. On the kespa rank yes, but the Power rank is supposed to show who is the strongest player right now and hopefully the past month. If Bisu shows bad performance and others show better, they should be on top. However i doubt he will show bad performance. Leta is playing really good lately yes, he's 22-5 the last 27 games, thats insane! I really like upmagics play lately too;) I think putting FBH above BeSt was wrong this month and for next month i think maybe Sea, Kal and FBH(his tvp) should step up their game or they'll find themselves off the PR next month. There are alot of good players out there trying to get on it!
I think FBH has to be on the Power Rank because his only loss this month was against Best,who's pvt I think I don't have to introduce. His TvT is very good and his T vZ is deadly. There is no reason to drop him off the PR,he does the exact same thing as last month.
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On December 27 2008 20:43 Darth Peter wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 20:09 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 17:03 Darth Peter wrote:On December 27 2008 16:47 Geo.Rion wrote:On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them. Jaedong didnt't win 2-3 PL games, in fact he won 5 in a raw, but the important is that he crushed 2-3 high caliber opponents in a very short time. Flash is "consistent" against noobs and terrans, yet he failed to beat the top class players he met, JD and Stork. Yet again there is a HUGE diference between someone beating a medicore player and facing Bisu on an Ace match. (Or someone who was preparing only to snipe the ace (Shine)). And there will be many games till the new PR. JD has to pass his MSL until than, and the skill level of the others will be tested as well. To be above Flash, Jangbi, Free, FBH, Best. Well that's not a big deal, his PL stat is better even with his "slump" period included than FBH', Jangbi's and Free's. And all those players barely met those many high caliber opponents that JD met in a week. OK, a bit exageration there, but you get the point. Starleauges. FBH is out of 2 Leauges, Jangbi out of 1, Best out of 1, Jangbi out of one, Free out of one. The only player who is in all of the leagues is Flash. BUT, many of these players yet have to play very soon in order to remain in the respective Leagues. Now look one by one, just stats, and let's not watch the games, cuz they are clearly favoring JD. These are speculations of course. Let's accept that JD will pass his MSL and win every PL games. Dont forget that he's the Ace player of the no1 PL team. Forgg isn't an option for quite some time. Flash: He's favorite against Bisu, not because he's a better player but because his playstyle counters Bisu's very well. Both Flash and Bisu admitted this in their interviews. IF he loose to Bisu: he's out of GOM, got the 2nd spot to qualify in MSL and is seeded in OSL. His PL stat is better than JD's but when they met JD won (2 times in a raw). No question here, JD should be higher, 2 PL wins doesnt equalize the fact that you lost in the most recent direct encounter. One of the ace players of the KTF team (the better one though), ranked somewhere around 8th rank. EDIT: sry he isnt seeded for OSL, he has to pass a semi-decent player in january to qualify. Best: Seeded in OSL out of MSL and he passed his GOM round. PL stat better than JD's. One of the many ace options for the SKT1 ranked somewhere on the middle of the table. He played almost this good last month, he got 7th place. He should move a lot higher, if we dont count the play quality (but we certanly do otherwise) he should be above JD with a rank or even. Free: out of 1 L, worse PL stat, one of the ace options (the better one though) of the 7th ranked (i guess) W Stars team. Close to JD but uner him. FBH: recent encounters favor him, but he's out of 2 leagues and he's in the MSL which is a toss battlefield so he has almost no chanse to get even that far as he did last time. Or who knows, but he's still out of 2 Leauges, eliminated by weak players and his PL stat is weaker than JD's. One of the ace options for the 2nd ranked Khan. Under JD. Jangbi: the other ace option for Khan, out of 1 SL seeded for MSL, and has to pass his GOM round (against the worst player still in GOM), PL stat lower than JD's. JD should be higher. So how the hell can you say NO WAY? He might even surpass Bisu and Stork if they loose all of their games til next PR. Stork lost way too many till now anyway. And Bisu has to face the most dangerous opponent for him, if he cannot defeat him, it might have psichological effect and Bisu might loose his confidence. but otherwise he's clearly no1. Even with the ace loss, and if he looses to Flash ina close series and wins every other match, he's still no1. SRy for this long post, but you didnt read it anyway i guess I think that the only way JD could get above Stork is if Stork loses to Backho with 2-0,and loses every PL gamestill next PR.Bisu can no way be denied top spot. Even if he loses to Flash,that's not a good reason to drop him. I remember raga4ka wrote,that in that case,Stork should be no1,because he has a chance. That has no sense,Stork was clearly inferior to Bisu this month,even lost in a direct match,and he would be above Bisu only because of speculations,because he didn't even win that bo 3 yet? I think Bisu's no1 this month is clear. I agree with most of it, but i dont think that anything is impossible on the Power rank. On the kespa rank yes, but the Power rank is supposed to show who is the strongest player right now and hopefully the past month. If Bisu shows bad performance and others show better, they should be on top. However i doubt he will show bad performance. Leta is playing really good lately yes, he's 22-5 the last 27 games, thats insane! I really like upmagics play lately too;) I think putting FBH above BeSt was wrong this month and for next month i think maybe Sea, Kal and FBH(his tvp) should step up their game or they'll find themselves off the PR next month. There are alot of good players out there trying to get on it! I think FBH has to be on the Power Rank because his only loss this month was against Best,who's pvt I think I don't have to introduce. His TvT is very good and his T vZ is deadly. There is no reason to drop him off the PR,he does the exact same thing as last month.
yes but he should EDIT: NOT be top 6 with such a weak matchup.
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On December 27 2008 21:39 AnOth3rDAy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2008 20:43 Darth Peter wrote:On December 27 2008 20:09 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 17:03 Darth Peter wrote:On December 27 2008 16:47 Geo.Rion wrote:On December 27 2008 12:37 Sentenal wrote:On December 27 2008 11:50 AnOth3rDAy wrote:On December 27 2008 09:44 baubo wrote:
On a personal level, I do. But from an objective standpoint, I don't. well you should. great players back in form are great again. If jaedong plays like he did vs SKT1, if he destroys Kal etc. I know its alot of "ifs" but still. IF that happens, how can you say he cannot be top 3? Its not a huge leap of skill between #5 and #3. When jaedong is on fire almost everyone is an underdog. from an objective point of view that is. In order for JD to go from being #8 to #3, that would mean that he would have to jump over Flash, Jangbi, free, FBH, and Best. And then the only justification for JD jumping over them would be 2-3 PL wins. And that would also be when nearly everyone above him are all doing well in PL, and still in GOM. So, like I've said 100 times this post, JD needs to win alot more games to get more justification to jump over all of them. With that I agree,although he definitely should be in top 10. Jaedong didnt't win 2-3 PL games, in fact he won 5 in a raw, but the important is that he crushed 2-3 high caliber opponents in a very short time. Flash is "consistent" against noobs and terrans, yet he failed to beat the top class players he met, JD and Stork. Yet again there is a HUGE diference between someone beating a medicore player and facing Bisu on an Ace match. (Or someone who was preparing only to snipe the ace (Shine)). And there will be many games till the new PR. JD has to pass his MSL until than, and the skill level of the others will be tested as well. To be above Flash, Jangbi, Free, FBH, Best. Well that's not a big deal, his PL stat is better even with his "slump" period included than FBH', Jangbi's and Free's. And all those players barely met those many high caliber opponents that JD met in a week. OK, a bit exageration there, but you get the point. Starleauges. FBH is out of 2 Leauges, Jangbi out of 1, Best out of 1, Jangbi out of one, Free out of one. The only player who is in all of the leagues is Flash. BUT, many of these players yet have to play very soon in order to remain in the respective Leagues. Now look one by one, just stats, and let's not watch the games, cuz they are clearly favoring JD. These are speculations of course. Let's accept that JD will pass his MSL and win every PL games. Dont forget that he's the Ace player of the no1 PL team. Forgg isn't an option for quite some time. Flash: He's favorite against Bisu, not because he's a better player but because his playstyle counters Bisu's very well. Both Flash and Bisu admitted this in their interviews. IF he loose to Bisu: he's out of GOM, got the 2nd spot to qualify in MSL and is seeded in OSL. His PL stat is better than JD's but when they met JD won (2 times in a raw). No question here, JD should be higher, 2 PL wins doesnt equalize the fact that you lost in the most recent direct encounter. One of the ace players of the KTF team (the better one though), ranked somewhere around 8th rank. EDIT: sry he isnt seeded for OSL, he has to pass a semi-decent player in january to qualify. Best: Seeded in OSL out of MSL and he passed his GOM round. PL stat better than JD's. One of the many ace options for the SKT1 ranked somewhere on the middle of the table. He played almost this good last month, he got 7th place. He should move a lot higher, if we dont count the play quality (but we certanly do otherwise) he should be above JD with a rank or even. Free: out of 1 L, worse PL stat, one of the ace options (the better one though) of the 7th ranked (i guess) W Stars team. Close to JD but uner him. FBH: recent encounters favor him, but he's out of 2 leagues and he's in the MSL which is a toss battlefield so he has almost no chanse to get even that far as he did last time. Or who knows, but he's still out of 2 Leauges, eliminated by weak players and his PL stat is weaker than JD's. One of the ace options for the 2nd ranked Khan. Under JD. Jangbi: the other ace option for Khan, out of 1 SL seeded for MSL, and has to pass his GOM round (against the worst player still in GOM), PL stat lower than JD's. JD should be higher. So how the hell can you say NO WAY? He might even surpass Bisu and Stork if they loose all of their games til next PR. Stork lost way too many till now anyway. And Bisu has to face the most dangerous opponent for him, if he cannot defeat him, it might have psichological effect and Bisu might loose his confidence. but otherwise he's clearly no1. Even with the ace loss, and if he looses to Flash ina close series and wins every other match, he's still no1. SRy for this long post, but you didnt read it anyway i guess I think that the only way JD could get above Stork is if Stork loses to Backho with 2-0,and loses every PL gamestill next PR.Bisu can no way be denied top spot. Even if he loses to Flash,that's not a good reason to drop him. I remember raga4ka wrote,that in that case,Stork should be no1,because he has a chance. That has no sense,Stork was clearly inferior to Bisu this month,even lost in a direct match,and he would be above Bisu only because of speculations,because he didn't even win that bo 3 yet? I think Bisu's no1 this month is clear. I agree with most of it, but i dont think that anything is impossible on the Power rank. On the kespa rank yes, but the Power rank is supposed to show who is the strongest player right now and hopefully the past month. If Bisu shows bad performance and others show better, they should be on top. However i doubt he will show bad performance. Leta is playing really good lately yes, he's 22-5 the last 27 games, thats insane! I really like upmagics play lately too;) I think putting FBH above BeSt was wrong this month and for next month i think maybe Sea, Kal and FBH(his tvp) should step up their game or they'll find themselves off the PR next month. There are alot of good players out there trying to get on it! I think FBH has to be on the Power Rank because his only loss this month was against Best,who's pvt I think I don't have to introduce. His TvT is very good and his T vZ is deadly. There is no reason to drop him off the PR,he does the exact same thing as last month. yes but he should be top 6 with such a weak matchup.
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Not giving FBH his spot in power rank for using bc's in almost every TvZ would be criminal!
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EPT
