On December 21 2008 14:48 Guybrush wrote: He could be considered for power rank, but he still needs to do stuff in individuals first.
are u sayin` that Leta doesn`t deserve a spot on the PR atm ?
Not if he continues to win. Hes qualified for only OSL ro16 right now, but if he goes 0-3 in his OSL group, and get raped by those punks in his surviovor group sure then he doesnt deserve a spot there no matter how hot his proleague record is.
4 days until his survivor group . If he stomps his survivor group effortlessly, sure he should be there.
he won 8 match than lost a game that didnt count and he's on a wining streak since than. How the hell could you exclude him? Flash got 3th spot mainly for his PL achievments, not because he caught the 2nd qualifing spot in his MST group.
Yeah,and then what about FBH,and Sea? They never won a Starleague,and probably never will. FBH got eliminated in the OSL offline prelims,is "only" in the ro 16 of MSL,probably will get raped by the first better protoss player out there,and he sits is happily on the 6th place of the PR. Why? And what if Leta will be 0-3 in a group against Stork,Jaedong and Flash for example? Look,I'm all for the singles results,but beating everyone in the PL says a lot,and being in the OSL says even more. So what if he is "only" in the OSL? Usually progamers concentrate on only one individual league. Like look. Best is not in both of them. FBH neither. Jangbi,Free,nope. Sea-not even a single league. So the majority of players on PR are only in one league. So I think no matter if he gets destroyed in the OSL,which I am almost sure that won't happen,he still deserves a spot because his awesome performance this month and last month. + Show Spoiler +
And also,I think that slowly the time comes for Mind to be ranked again. He is just soooo good in TvP and TvT,and his T v Z is really good too.
On December 21 2008 20:54 Geo.Rion wrote: he won 8 match than lost a game that didnt count and he's on a wining streak since than. How the hell could you exclude him? Flash got 3th spot mainly for his PL achievments, not because he caught the 2nd qualifing spot in his MST group.
This, and Leta is now #1 in PL with some really impressive wins. I don't think he always play standard, he can cook up some daring strategies when he wants to (f.e vs Bestgod on Medusa in OSL).
Now I don't particularly disagree with Sea being #10, I think he's a great player. But I do have a problem with FBH sitting at #6, which is way high for someone his calibre IMO. He just does'nt cut it as a top player even though he really shines in TvZ. Since most of these players are based on their PL-performance Leta deserves that spot and I really hope you throw him in there next time around. Otherwise great power rank as always!
There are some errors in your posts. 1. Flash places highly because hes in all leagues(GOM,MSL,OSL), performing ok in PL, and shows overall strength in every matchup. 2. Sea is qualified for top32 in MSL. And thirdly the "usually progamers concentrate on only one individual league" is just plainly incorrect. What the hell do you base such an assumption on ?
Leta has far too few matches against zergs, and dragon-class protosses to know if hes just a one-MU wonder running hot. He looked impressive against Luxury, but that's only one game. And the only time he faced a dragon(BeSt) he got trounced. Sea and FBH can be compared Leta, but their games have stuck out more than him IE SeavsIris, SeavsJD were both really impressive perfomances. FBH vs JD was an excellent perfomance by FBH, and hes been quite awesome vs Z lately in addition to that. You could say the same about Letas overall TvT play lately too, but none of his recent games can be compared to the three matches I mentioned there. However Sea, FBH, and Leta are very close; they're all top 5 terrans atm, and right now Im thinking Sea, might be the first of them to drop out of top 5 as his results havent been looking good as usual lately.
I agree about Mind though. He has been pretty awesome and should be on the rank, though not higher than Flash. Mind has been looking convincing lately overall, and beaten Protosses on some tough TvP maps too. His beastly performances vs free, s2, and Stats were all impressive. He looks really solid now.
On December 21 2008 22:52 Guybrush wrote: Romanian invasion lol
There are some errors in your posts. 1. Flash places highly because hes in all leagues(GOM,MSL,OSL), performing ok in PL, and shows overall strength in every matchup. 2. Sea is qualified for top32 in MSL. And thirdly the "usually progamers concentrate on only one individual league" is just plainly incorrect. What the hell do you base such an assumption on ?
Leta has far too few matches against zergs, and dragon-class protosses to know if hes just a one-MU wonder running hot. He looked impressive against Luxury, but that's only one game. And the only time he faced a dragon(BeSt) he got trounced. Sea and FBH can be compared Leta, but their games have stuck out more than him IE SeavsIris, SeavsJD were both really impressive perfomances. FBH vs JD was an excellent perfomance by FBH, and hes been quite awesome vs Z lately in addition to that. You could say the same about Letas overall TvT play lately too, but none of his recent games can be compared to the three matches I mentioned there. However Sea, FBH, and Leta are very close; they're all top 5 terrans atm, and right now Im thinking Sea, might be the first of them to drop out of top 5 as his results havent been looking good as usual lately.
I agree about Mind though. He has been pretty awesome and should be on the rank, though not higher than Flash. Mind has been looking convincing lately overall, and beaten Protosses on some tough TvP maps too. His beastly performances vs free, s2, and Stats were all impressive. He looks really solid now.
Only terran except Flash left in GOM, and just slayed a dragon(Kal) there.
Sea was in both leauges when he got his rank. And the "concentrate on one leauge" isnt quit nonsense, based on past events. Players didnt won OSL+MSL in the same season, there was a rule in SKT that they are allowed only in 1 league etc. They can't practice for everything in the same time. They might try though... Flash tried last season...
And Leta's TvZ untested. That might be but Flash's TvZ isn't too good nowadays either, and he still earned 3th spot and nobody complained.
I think Mind isnt impressive at all. The game against Stats was awesome to watch but only cuz he fucked that up so hard he had to make a great comeback. You CAN NOT use a game against an SKT zerg on a terran-mech friendly map as an argument that somebody is good. But that's just me, Mind is showing results
On December 21 2008 22:52 Guybrush wrote: Romanian invasion lol
There are some errors in your posts. 1. Flash places highly because hes in all leagues(GOM,MSL,OSL), performing ok in PL, and shows overall strength in every matchup. 2. Sea is qualified for top32 in MSL. And thirdly the "usually progamers concentrate on only one individual league" is just plainly incorrect. What the hell do you base such an assumption on ?
Leta has far too few matches against zergs, and dragon-class protosses to know if hes just a one-MU wonder running hot. He looked impressive against Luxury, but that's only one game. And the only time he faced a dragon(BeSt) he got trounced. Sea and FBH can be compared Leta, but their games have stuck out more than him IE SeavsIris, SeavsJD were both really impressive perfomances. FBH vs JD was an excellent perfomance by FBH, and hes been quite awesome vs Z lately in addition to that. You could say the same about Letas overall TvT play lately too, but none of his recent games can be compared to the three matches I mentioned there. However Sea, FBH, and Leta are very close; they're all top 5 terrans atm, and right now Im thinking Sea, might be the first of them to drop out of top 5 as his results havent been looking good as usual lately.
I agree about Mind though. He has been pretty awesome and should be on the rank, though not higher than Flash. Mind has been looking convincing lately overall, and beaten Protosses on some tough TvP maps too. His beastly performances vs free, s2, and Stats were all impressive. He looks really solid now.
Only terran except Flash left in GOM, and just slayed a dragon(Kal) there.
First of all the Romanian invasion joke was already shot a lot of times and it gets tiring and boring. Secondly,just look at the stats. The last two seasons,only three players played well in every tournament. Flash,Bisu,and Stork. Other than that,people are usually achieve results in only one league. When ForGG won the MSL,he and Jaedong didn't qualify for the OSL. Best is nver in the MSL,because he keeps getting eliminated in the Offline prelims,Kal wasn't in OSL either in the last two seasons,and I can go on and on with examples. If a person at least qualifies for the ro 16 in a league,he is usually eliminated at that time from the other Starleague. But this conversation about the leagues has no point whatsoever,because Leta is still in the MST,and he was not eliminated from there. So at this moment,Leta has the best record in Proleague,reached the group stages of OSL and is still in the MSL too. And till the group stage of the OSL there is still like 20-30 days,and by that time,the new PR should be released,so if Leta gets his ass handed to him in the OSL group stages,that will be taken into account on another Power Rank.
The guy who posted below you said "Sea - not even a single league". I corrected him and said Sea is still playing in MSL.
The other point still stands. Players dont "give up" some leagues to concentrate on others. Sure their play might be worse if they have a tight schedule and alot of matches, but they'll always try to play as good as possible in tournaments. The T1 rule was just the T1 coach trying to blame individual tournaments for his players poor performances in PL. He was under heavy pressure from the sponsor, and had to do a eyecatching change in policy to make a point to them that the bad performances had a reason.
Flashs TvZ isnt really a object of discussion as it's his TvP, and TvT that keeps him on 3rd. I'd still say hes way more proven TvZ than Leta though.
Mind is playing fucking good, watch his matches. Comebacks are impressive, way moreso than riding a lead from early game to finish. I wont comment any further on that.
On December 21 2008 22:52 Guybrush wrote: Romanian invasion lol
There are some errors in your posts. 1. Flash places highly because hes in all leagues(GOM,MSL,OSL), performing ok in PL, and shows overall strength in every matchup. 2. Sea is qualified for top32 in MSL. And thirdly the "usually progamers concentrate on only one individual league" is just plainly incorrect. What the hell do you base such an assumption on ?
Leta has far too few matches against zergs, and dragon-class protosses to know if hes just a one-MU wonder running hot. He looked impressive against Luxury, but that's only one game. And the only time he faced a dragon(BeSt) he got trounced. Sea and FBH can be compared Leta, but their games have stuck out more than him IE SeavsIris, SeavsJD were both really impressive perfomances. FBH vs JD was an excellent perfomance by FBH, and hes been quite awesome vs Z lately in addition to that. You could say the same about Letas overall TvT play lately too, but none of his recent games can be compared to the three matches I mentioned there. However Sea, FBH, and Leta are very close; they're all top 5 terrans atm, and right now Im thinking Sea, might be the first of them to drop out of top 5 as his results havent been looking good as usual lately.
I agree about Mind though. He has been pretty awesome and should be on the rank, though not higher than Flash. Mind has been looking convincing lately overall, and beaten Protosses on some tough TvP maps too. His beastly performances vs free, s2, and Stats were all impressive. He looks really solid now.
Only terran except Flash left in GOM, and just slayed a dragon(Kal) there.
First of all the Romanian invasion joke was already shot a lot of times and it gets tiring and boring. Secondly,just look at the stats. The last two seasons,only three players played well in every tournament. Flash,Bisu,and Stork. Other than that,people are usually achieve results in only one league. When ForGG won the MSL,he and Jaedong didn't qualify for the OSL. Best is nver in the MSL,because he keeps getting eliminated in the Offline prelims,Kal wasn't in OSL either in the last two seasons,and I can go on and on with examples. If a person at least qualifies for the ro 16 in a league,he is usually eliminated at that time from the other Starleague. But this conversation about the leagues has no point whatsoever,because Leta is still in the MST,and he was not eliminated from there. So at this moment,Leta has the best record in Proleague,reached the group stages of OSL and is still in the MSL too. And till the group stage of the OSL there is still like 20-30 days,and by that time,the new PR should be released,so if Leta gets his ass handed to him in the OSL group stages,that will be taken into account on another Power Rank.
And that's exactly why Flash, Stork and Bisu are top 3. Because they perform in both individuals, and in PL to a certain degree.
Yeah, which is why I said his games in the MST group will determine whether or not he should be included in the rank. What Im interested to see is if he'll be able to keep up his PL level of play the deeper he goes in the individuals. If he can manage that then sure hes certainly PR material - maybe even top 5 if he proves his TvZ vs competent zergs, and takes games now and then from the dragons. His problem now is that we dont know enough about his TvZ, and he hasnt beaten a dragon yet this season.
On December 21 2008 22:52 Guybrush wrote: Romanian invasion lol
There are some errors in your posts. 1. Flash places highly because hes in all leagues(GOM,MSL,OSL), performing ok in PL, and shows overall strength in every matchup. 2. Sea is qualified for top32 in MSL. And thirdly the "usually progamers concentrate on only one individual league" is just plainly incorrect. What the hell do you base such an assumption on ?
Leta has far too few matches against zergs, and dragon-class protosses to know if hes just a one-MU wonder running hot. He looked impressive against Luxury, but that's only one game. And the only time he faced a dragon(BeSt) he got trounced. Sea and FBH can be compared Leta, but their games have stuck out more than him IE SeavsIris, SeavsJD were both really impressive perfomances. FBH vs JD was an excellent perfomance by FBH, and hes been quite awesome vs Z lately in addition to that. You could say the same about Letas overall TvT play lately too, but none of his recent games can be compared to the three matches I mentioned there. However Sea, FBH, and Leta are very close; they're all top 5 terrans atm, and right now Im thinking Sea, might be the first of them to drop out of top 5 as his results havent been looking good as usual lately.
I agree about Mind though. He has been pretty awesome and should be on the rank, though not higher than Flash. Mind has been looking convincing lately overall, and beaten Protosses on some tough TvP maps too. His beastly performances vs free, s2, and Stats were all impressive. He looks really solid now.
Only terran except Flash left in GOM, and just slayed a dragon(Kal) there.
First of all the Romanian invasion joke was already shot a lot of times and it gets tiring and boring. Secondly,just look at the stats. The last two seasons,only three players played well in every tournament. Flash,Bisu,and Stork. Other than that,people are usually achieve results in only one league. When ForGG won the MSL,he and Jaedong didn't qualify for the OSL. Best is nver in the MSL,because he keeps getting eliminated in the Offline prelims,Kal wasn't in OSL either in the last two seasons,and I can go on and on with examples. If a person at least qualifies for the ro 16 in a league,he is usually eliminated at that time from the other Starleague. But this conversation about the leagues has no point whatsoever,because Leta is still in the MST,and he was not eliminated from there. So at this moment,Leta has the best record in Proleague,reached the group stages of OSL and is still in the MSL too. And till the group stage of the OSL there is still like 20-30 days,and by that time,the new PR should be released,so if Leta gets his ass handed to him in the OSL group stages,that will be taken into account on another Power Rank.
And that's exactly why Flash, Stork and Bisu are top 3. Because they perform in both individuals, and in PL to a certain degree.
Yeah, which is why I said his games in the MST group will determine whether or not he should be included in the rank. What Im interested to see is if he'll be able to keep up his PL level of play the deeper he goes in the individuals. If he can manage that then sure hes certainly PR material - maybe even top 5 if he proves his TvZ vs competent zergs, and takes games now and then from the dragons. His problem now is that we dont know enough about his TvZ, and he hasnt beaten a dragon yet this season.
If you look back at last year's proleague, Leta has beaten pretty much every Protoss who matters. >Stork, >Kal twice, >BeSt once, >Bisu once. I don't see how people say he hasn't been tested TvP. (of course Bisu wasn't playing as well back then)
oh god now i remember that game on blue storm, bisu played like a noob, i remember getting so fucking pissed off he lost to some nobody's 2fac. leta had a pimp scv move but bisu just played really poorly, look at how much worse his control was just 5 months ago:
On December 22 2008 01:17 DamageControL wrote: Isn't sea out of the msl?
But he is IN the OSL. Anyways, Sea's problem is the one of the worst kind; psychological. When he got knocked out of MSL his sweaty face was... well, he had "fuck, maybe I'm not cut to achieve anything at all in any individual league" written all over. All he needs is one breakthrough, but he just doesn't seem able to overcome this psychological bump.
On December 22 2008 01:17 DamageControL wrote: Isn't sea out of the msl?
But he is IN the OSL. Anyways, Sea's problem is the one of the worst kind; psychological. When he got knocked out of MSL his sweaty face was... well, he had "fuck, maybe I'm not cut to achieve anything at all in any individual league" written all over. All he needs is one breakthrough, but he just doesn't seem able to overcome this psychological bump.
EPT
