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Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL)
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On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL)
Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself
Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings
Stephano vs Keen 2-0
Stephano vs Morrow 2-0
Stephano vs Puma 2-0
Stephano vs MKP 1-2
Stephano vs Rain 2-1
Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0
Stephano vs Polt 2-1
Stephano vs Rain 2-0
Stephano vs Heart 2-1
Stephano vs Ryung 2-0
Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close.
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hmmm... let's think
who has gotten Ro8 twice in a row in GSL, recently coming very close to defeating the best Zerg on the planet in PvZ, his worst matchup?
NANIWA obv!
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On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close.
Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games.
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On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL)
I agree, NaNiwa is probably more deserving of the "best foreigner" title, but most of this is quite hyperbolic. It's a very close battle, in my opinion.
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On July 18 2012 10:44 VediVeci wrote:
I don't understand why people act like getting to GSL Ro8 makes Naniwa a better player, when Stephano hasn't played in Code S. If Naniwa had made it in code S and Stephano hadn't then sure, that's something, but given the strength of competition at foreign tournaments these days, it's ridiculous to say that just because you don't play in Code S, you can't be the best foreigner.
I think what most people are saying is that since NaNiwa plays in GSL and Stephano plays in foreign tournaments the two can't be compared, but that getting to GSL Ro8 twice in a row is more impressive than anything Stephano has done, therefore the title should go to NaNiwa.
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On July 18 2012 13:41 JJH777 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 13:38 mahO wrote:On July 18 2012 10:36 zanga wrote:
Why even compare? It makes no sense.
When stephano gets two Code S ro8 in a row we can start comparing apples and apples. It's not easy when youre alone against all the koreans in Seoul and "everyone" are trying to make you lose...
NANIWA > *
(also, Zerg is pretty good at the moment btw, you decide if thats relevant) Lol, I mean, I have a great deal of respect for Naniwa as a player, but the matches he played in GSL (seen them all) arent even close to elect him as best foreigner, they werent an amazing showcase of dominance, really faaar from it, they were good decisions and mind games, and also some luck involved, still, amazing player for sure, but... On the other hand, the few confrontations between Stephano and top tier koreans were much more convincing, especially in the potential showed, and reactions, and please dont think I'm saying because I'm french, I'm not even fond of Stephano, and I'm probably the less nationalist french in my country. For me, Stephano, by far, if he keeps training, you guys will have an answer in the next 3 months, and polls like this one wont be necessary at all. I mean guys like Nestea were saying instantly that Stephano was the best foreigner after results from him at the time, and now he doubled that, they just recognized talent. I dont even imagine what it would be like if Stephano was training with a korean teamhouse schedule... It's impossible to look dominant in GSL. The people who won the last 2 MVP and DRG always looked very mortal in pretty much every match. That's why simply getting back to back ro8s is put in such high regard. There are very few players who can do that.
Of course, I just meant his play in general, but also, his "regular" play might be more solid than what he showed in GSL, since he always looked very nervous (and I dont fucking blame him ahah), but what I mean is I didnt a really mind blowing 30 min long macro game of him vs a top tier korean when both traded equally etc. I've seen that with Stephano like 10 times, this is my point, maybe it will happen and then i'll shut up, but for me, Naniwa didnt show the true "boss-mode" decision making and management versus an incredibly high level opponent. I'm pretty sure he's capable of it, but Stephano often times showed perfect decisions in very stressful, important and long high level matches, and this is what makes me prefer him over Naniwa. And obviously, I didnt watch every games casted of Naniwa in the last year so I might be wrong, Stephano just seems more stable as the foreigner hope, he kinda never disappoints
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HuK.. in my opinion he is the foreigner with the most total wins
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On July 18 2012 14:28 JJH777 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close. Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games.
Yeah, obviously, any zerg would take games off MKP, beat Ganzi, Rain, Ryung, Heart, Puma, Keen, Morrow 2-0 for most of them, because of the queen buff, I mean it's obvious that his 28 queens opening made him massacre very very well known and respected GSL players. I mean shit, anyone could do that with a 5 ranged queen right.
How stupid was that coment, seriously, these are the very top korean terrans that travel out of Korea, because they know they have a shot at earning money in the most competitive tournaments on the planet, they are not fucking around, and you still want to disregard the repeated 2-0s, what the hell did Stephano do to you when you were little?
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On July 18 2012 14:39 Zebrapudding wrote:
HuK.. in my opinion he is the foreigner with the most total wins
He hasn't been doing well recently. He was even beaten by a fairly unknown 14 year old in his MLG qualifiers.
On July 18 2012 14:42 mahO wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:28 JJH777 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close. Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games. Yeah, obviously, any zerg would take games off MKP, beat Ganzi, Rain, Ryung, Heart, Puma, Keen, Morrow 2-0 for most of them, because of the queen buff, I mean it's obvious that his 28 queens opening made him massacre very very well known and respected GSL players. I mean shit, anyone could do that with a 5 ranged queen right. How stupid was that coment, seriously, these are the very top korean terrans that travel out of Korea, because they know they have a shot at earning money in the most competitive tournaments on the planet, they are not fucking around, and you still want to disregard the repeated 2-0s, what the hell did Stephano do to you when you were little?
To be fair it was a pretty huge nerf to Terran in TvZ.
The fact that they travel from korea means that they're jet lagged, which is not a good thing for their play either.
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I think it might actually be SaSe talent-wise.
But NaniWa has been putting up the best results consistently. Track record means a lot in this game.
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On July 18 2012 14:42 mahO wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:28 JJH777 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close. Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games. Yeah, obviously, any zerg would take games off MKP, beat Ganzi, Rain, Ryung, Heart, Puma, Keen, Morrow 2-0 for most of them, because of the queen buff, I mean it's obvious that his 28 queens opening made him massacre very very well known and respected GSL players. I mean shit, anyone could do that with a 5 ranged queen right. How stupid was that coment, seriously, these are the very top korean terrans that travel out of Korea, because they know they have a shot at earning money in the most competitive tournaments on the planet, they are not fucking around, and you still want to disregard the repeated 2-0s, what the hell did Stephano do to you when you were little?
First of all you did nothing to address the fact that only 3 of those players are Code S and one of those 3 is the player he lost to. Second yes the queen nerf did make that big of a difference. Did you watch any of the GSTL matches before the last few weeks?.... A lot of the absolute best Terrans got manhandled by tons of mediocre zergs. Only in the past few weeks has is started to look normal again.
Yugioh for example someone most people wouldn't even put in like top 10 or even top 15 zergs beat MarineKing after the patch. The patch had a huge effect for the first few weeks to a month or two after the patch.
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On July 18 2012 14:44 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:39 Zebrapudding wrote:
HuK.. in my opinion he is the foreigner with the most total wins He hasn't been doing well recently. He was even beaten by a fairly unknown 14 year old in his MLG qualifiers. Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:42 mahO wrote:On July 18 2012 14:28 JJH777 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close. Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games. Yeah, obviously, any zerg would take games off MKP, beat Ganzi, Rain, Ryung, Heart, Puma, Keen, Morrow 2-0 for most of them, because of the queen buff, I mean it's obvious that his 28 queens opening made him massacre very very well known and respected GSL players. I mean shit, anyone could do that with a 5 ranged queen right. How stupid was that coment, seriously, these are the very top korean terrans that travel out of Korea, because they know they have a shot at earning money in the most competitive tournaments on the planet, they are not fucking around, and you still want to disregard the repeated 2-0s, what the hell did Stephano do to you when you were little? To be fair it was a pretty huge nerf to Terran in TvZ. The fact that they travel from korea means that they're jet lagged, which is not a good thing for their play either.
Not to every terran, some were less "helion dependant", some were, sure, but that doesnt mean it can reverse a situation so that a supposed "not GSL caliber Stephano" could rape 50% of the terrans we've seen in Code A & S for the last year, and the other 50%? Well he didnt play them yet...
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On July 18 2012 14:55 JJH777 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:42 mahO wrote:On July 18 2012 14:28 JJH777 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close. Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games. Yeah, obviously, any zerg would take games off MKP, beat Ganzi, Rain, Ryung, Heart, Puma, Keen, Morrow 2-0 for most of them, because of the queen buff, I mean it's obvious that his 28 queens opening made him massacre very very well known and respected GSL players. I mean shit, anyone could do that with a 5 ranged queen right. How stupid was that coment, seriously, these are the very top korean terrans that travel out of Korea, because they know they have a shot at earning money in the most competitive tournaments on the planet, they are not fucking around, and you still want to disregard the repeated 2-0s, what the hell did Stephano do to you when you were little? First of all you did nothing to address the fact that only 3 of those players are Code S and one of those 3 is the player he lost to. Second yes the queen nerf did make that big of a difference. Did you watch any of the GSTL matches before the last few weeks?.... A lot of the absolute best Terrans got manhandled by tons of mediocre zergs. Only in the past few weeks has is started to look normal again.
Yes, MKP is a Code S terran, he is also often considered as the best player on the planet when he's on a good day. So yeah, Stephano is such a noob to loose 2-1 to that guy, pfff, why would he even go to Korea seriously?
About GSTL, I guess Life, and Symbol, are mediocre, you keep getting deeper and deeper, yeah it's all because of the queens man... It determins the entire match up at the moment etc etc. Marines should get a +20hp buff etc etc. Keep up the bullshit mate, i'm out, pointless debate with an anti-zerg / anti-Stephano for some reason.
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On July 18 2012 14:56 mahO wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:44 Euronyme wrote:On July 18 2012 14:39 Zebrapudding wrote:
HuK.. in my opinion he is the foreigner with the most total wins He hasn't been doing well recently. He was even beaten by a fairly unknown 14 year old in his MLG qualifiers. On July 18 2012 14:42 mahO wrote:On July 18 2012 14:28 JJH777 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close. Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games. Yeah, obviously, any zerg would take games off MKP, beat Ganzi, Rain, Ryung, Heart, Puma, Keen, Morrow 2-0 for most of them, because of the queen buff, I mean it's obvious that his 28 queens opening made him massacre very very well known and respected GSL players. I mean shit, anyone could do that with a 5 ranged queen right. How stupid was that coment, seriously, these are the very top korean terrans that travel out of Korea, because they know they have a shot at earning money in the most competitive tournaments on the planet, they are not fucking around, and you still want to disregard the repeated 2-0s, what the hell did Stephano do to you when you were little? To be fair it was a pretty huge nerf to Terran in TvZ. The fact that they travel from korea means that they're jet lagged, which is not a good thing for their play either. Not to every terran, some were less "helion dependant", some were, sure, but that doesnt mean it can reverse a situation so that a supposed "not GSL caliber Stephano" could rape 50% of the terrans we've seen in Code A & S for the last year, and the other 50%? Well he didnt play them yet...
Didn't zergs have something ridiculous like 20 straight wins in GSTL? Yeah it was pretty bad.
And again. They were jet lagged. So was probably Stephano, but some are better at dealing with it than others. As they're not playing in optimal conditions against each other it's also hard to tell who's the favourite.
I dunno. I'm just a bit of a Naniwa fan since the whole "I don't care about the money, I just want to be the best, and therefore I'll go alone to Korea and train until I am".
Stephano is the complete opposite, which is why he won't go to the GSL and actually prove (imo) how good he actually is.
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On July 18 2012 15:02 mahO wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:55 JJH777 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:42 mahO wrote:On July 18 2012 14:28 JJH777 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:21 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 18 2012 14:13 power-overwhelming wrote:
Naniwa. Stephano's zvp is being hyped here too much. Starcraft has 3 races last time I checked. His zvz and zvt still isn't close to code S level. If he was in GSL I doubt he'd make it out of first group stages. The not-so-famous koreans would still beat him. Only top tier korean he has beaten recently is MC and that is a zvp, not to mention their last series MC won. Naniwa has proven himself in pvp, pvt, and pvz.
The stephano hype is just fueld by foreigner hope/ anti-korean bandwagons that jump for joy at any opportunity a foreigner wins a tourny, and in this case, it's more so stephano than naniwa (since naniwa is glued to GSL) Seriously once again people are just rabbling without checking the facts. I dont understand this is starcraft 2 we got some of the most amasing stat tools available to us so why not use it so you dont look like a fool when you try to express youself Stephano´s last 10 ZvT matches in Lan tournament settings Stephano vs Keen 2-0 Stephano vs Morrow 2-0 Stephano vs Puma 2-0 Stephano vs MKP 1-2 Stephano vs Rain 2-1 Stephano vs Ganzi 2-0 Stephano vs Polt 2-1 Stephano vs Rain 2-0 Stephano vs Heart 2-1 Stephano vs Ryung 2-0 Thats 9 wins 1 lose and most of them are code S. Stephano´s ZvT lvl is as high as any other top zerg. Matter infact the only one he havent beat is MKP. And the last 2 times they meet it has been so close. Most of them are Code S.... Sure if by most you mean 3/10 and he lost to one of those. Also how many of those are post queen buff? ZvT is only just now starting to get balanced again. Any Terrans he beat within a few weeks to a month of that buff are pretty meaningless games. Yeah, obviously, any zerg would take games off MKP, beat Ganzi, Rain, Ryung, Heart, Puma, Keen, Morrow 2-0 for most of them, because of the queen buff, I mean it's obvious that his 28 queens opening made him massacre very very well known and respected GSL players. I mean shit, anyone could do that with a 5 ranged queen right. How stupid was that coment, seriously, these are the very top korean terrans that travel out of Korea, because they know they have a shot at earning money in the most competitive tournaments on the planet, they are not fucking around, and you still want to disregard the repeated 2-0s, what the hell did Stephano do to you when you were little? First of all you did nothing to address the fact that only 3 of those players are Code S and one of those 3 is the player he lost to. Second yes the queen nerf did make that big of a difference. Did you watch any of the GSTL matches before the last few weeks?.... A lot of the absolute best Terrans got manhandled by tons of mediocre zergs. Only in the past few weeks has is started to look normal again. Yes, MKP is a Code S terran, he is also often considered as the best player on the planet when he's on a good day. So yeah, Stephano is such a noob to loose 2-1 to that guy, pfff, why would he even go to Korea seriously? About GSTL, I guess Life, and Symbol, are mediocre, you keep getting deeper and deeper, yeah it's all because of the queens man... It determins the entire match up at the moment etc etc. Marines should get a +20hp buff etc etc. Keep up the bullshit mate, i'm out, pointless debate with an anti-zerg / anti-Stephano for some reason.
Terrans are 9-23 in GSTL dude... With the majority of the Terran wins being very recent when the metagame is finally starting to even out. Look at the TSL4 KR qualifier brackets... Tons of zergs beat great Terrans including MarineKing. Also yes I do consider Life pretty overrated but he isn't who I'm referring to. People like Byul beat some of the best terrans in GSTL. The queen nerf made a huge difference. Also I am anything but anti-zerg lol. I am a huge Nestea fan and have constantly argued zerg is UP until recently.
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On July 18 2012 09:47 tredogz wrote:
IDRA .. . all the way!
I still believe,
grack i love you...
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Naniwa makes it to ro8 two times in a row..*claps*
Jinro made it to ro4 two times in a row, what now bitches.
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On July 18 2012 15:25 Gexs wrote:
Naniwa makes it to ro8 two times in a row..*claps*
Jinro made it to ro4 two times in a row, what now bitches.
I thought it meant 'right now'. Jinro was the best back then, but it was quite a while ago to be honest.
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EPT
