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Overall it is cool to see new units and I am excited for the changes in metagame. However my main concern is the skill cap for protoss. Protoss is a lot easier to play than Terran or Zerg, and this is a fundamental problem with SC2. I think it is fairly common knowledge that Protoss are easier to play, so hopefully there will not be too much argument there. I am not talking about balance with the Protoss I am talking about the overall skill it takes to use the race.
Both Terran and Zerg new units seem cool once they get figured out and balanced. Terran is getting some units that can stand up to things in the late game, and zerg new units take skill to use. However I see Protoss getting a 22 range ship and a "harass" unit that with one click renders an entire mining base useless for a while? It does not take any skill to sit back on 3 ships with 3 screens of range while a deathball waits for his opponent to come to him. Also, making the protoss harass that easy, while zerg and terran need to sacrifice units to kill a couple workers at at a time seems silly, and only pushes the same fundamental problem that already exists.
I see the Protoss continuing to be a lot easier to play, which is fundamentally bad. Since they will always balance for the top end, this makes the balance very hard to attain for everyone else.
Also, Terran really needed AA for their mech. I think this was really common knowledge in the community, so it vexes me how Terran are ending up with the same AA situation during mech play.
Zerg stuff looks very cool, but will need a lot of beta games to get it all balanced.
If I had to guess what the best overall effect will be, it would be that TvT is going to be a hell of a lot more fun to watch. For that particular match up, I am very excited about the changes.
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Make carriers microable like carriers in broodwar and keep them in.
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Hi all,
What is the new HotS info? Please could someone post a link to where they get this info?
Thanks.
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I was hoping for some good protoss units, but blizzard doesnt agree. All its missing is some super upgrade for the tempest to make it shoot from my base to the enemy base...T and Z get some usable units, while protoss gets the short end of the stick.
Mineral lock? rlly? with good scout it wont even reach the enemy base, just look at how players spread the overlords and observers on the map. Nice one blizz, we need to pay some 30-40 euros for some lol units.
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individualy units are great! but then if we look at ball of death in pro games, zerg's buff will basically kill everything else
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As I thought when i first saw hots. terrible.
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I dont like it for the most parts actually, as all the new abilities make it to micro intensive and make the game evolve into some kind of new warcraft 3 -.-
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On June 18 2012 02:08 Iron_ wrote:
Overall it is cool to see new units and I am excited for the changes in metagame. However my main concern is the skill cap for protoss. Protoss is a lot easier to play than Terran or Zerg, and this is a fundamental problem with SC2. I think it is fairly common knowledge that Protoss are easier to play, so hopefully there will not be too much argument there. I am not talking about balance with the Protoss I am talking about the overall skill it takes to use the race.
Both Terran and Zerg new units seem cool once they get figured out and balanced. Terran is getting some units that can stand up to things in the late game, and zerg new units take skill to use. However I see Protoss getting a 22 range ship and a "harass" unit that with one click renders an entire mining base useless for a while? It does not take any skill to sit back on 3 ships with 3 screens of range while a deathball waits for his opponent to come to him. Also, making the protoss harass that easy, while zerg and terran need to sacrifice units to kill a couple workers at at a time seems silly, and only pushes the same fundamental problem that already exists.
I see the Protoss continuing to be a lot easier to play, which is fundamentally bad. Since they will always balance for the top end, this makes the balance very hard to attain for everyone else.
Also, Terran really needed AA for their mech. I think this was really common knowledge in the community, so it vexes me how Terran are ending up with the same AA situation during mech play.
Zerg stuff looks very cool, but will need a lot of beta games to get it all balanced.
If I had to guess what the best overall effect will be, it would be that TvT is going to be a hell of a lot more fun to watch. For that particular match up, I am very excited about the changes.
you are way over exaggerating things here
the whole idea of the new protoss units is too move food away from the deathball which is a good thing
and you really comparing the oracle to medivac/muta harrass?
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"Cosmos Belgium. June 13 2012 07:29. Posts 878 PM Profile Report Quote #
Reaper is worse than before (How is that even possible?) Carrier was better than tempest and warhound doesn't shot air. The rest seems cool."
As if terran is in need of more anti air.
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about the ones complayning against the protoss new units:
1) the Oracle is a harass unit, it has no real dmg skill, the forcefield on the mineralscan be killed in secs if you don't forget your base and it costs a really lot of gas (it's 200 gas now, so it's not likeyou would build 10 of them and get your opponent out of minerals for 15 mins)
2) the Tempest has a long range but it's DPS is REALLY small as it takes a lot to shoot and he is painfully slow, some ppl here are sayingthat he could be able to stay on a corner of the map and atack the mineral line freely while the enemy doesn't have flying units, but rushing a tempest with 22 range would be like rushing a carrier with the interceptor speed upgrade, if you do'nt have at least 2 bases before the tempest comes to the "corner of the map and 'harass' your mineral line with 1 shot every 4 secs" you mostly like deserve to lose for not scouting/ not teching thing/ not killing the protoss with about 800 less gas in the army or on something else.(cuz he needs the stargate, the fleat bacon, the tmpest AND the upgrade to have 1 tempest with 22range out on the field)
about the terran, i think only on beta we will be able to see if the new units are really good or not, when ppl start to hit some cool timings and that anti-mech unit seems pretty cool in my opinion, at it can atack normally and if there's amech unit close it will basically shoot an extra hit(PS: only worried about stalkers getting even more countered by terrans, but hopefully it should change the metagame for something well balanced.
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tempest ok
viper ok
permit to change match up
but oracle and ultralisk charge = imba
no need that
but it's alpha, wait and see
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A lot of the animation needs to be improved or simply revamped. Of course it's still in development but if any of the new units are like they are now in the final version, I would be severly disapppointed. I hope there will be some major changes in the units because it seems like the new game will be too different from traditional starcraft and be less fun to play.
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On June 13 2012 10:42 mbr2321 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2012 08:27 Roflhaxx wrote:
They give terran extremely imba mines but at the same time they remove the ability for banelings to burrow!? I didn't see any notes with regards to the removal of banelings burrowing.
Its a reference to the Baneling Burrow Movement speed being removed.
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Moderately Negative for me.
It's primarily down to one reason, that I'm sure most people can agree on, and that is the Colossi. I play Toss, but I hate this unit with a passion because of what its mechanics do to the PvP match up. I'm hoping that the new units will make PvP less of a "war of the worlds" game.
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They are making the game more and more noob friendly, i mean thats cool and all but this is a competetive sport, if it becomes any more nooby, idk.... T_T;
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The problem with judging what I've seen so far is that it's still in Alpha, approaching closed beta, and nowhere near release. About all I can say is that I dislike the oracle -- it just seems like it isn't quite needed.
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protoss new units just seem....so....bad...
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I dont like how their solution to many things is just to add range.
First in wol
Ultras suck give them range
Roaches suck, give them range
Vr too good, take away range
Immortals suck give them range
phoenix suck, give them more range
queens not good enough, give them range
now in hots
Reaper to 7 range
Warhound antimech big range
tempest more range
Does giving units more range really fix the fundamental problem of units in sc2 clumping too tightly? The only difference is that more of them can shoot at a target when they are clumped.
I personally dont like units like the marauders, vikings, collossus, archons, warhounds and corruptors in sc2 cos they are pretty boring units that are just good. Corruptors not good, but its still boring.
Imo the game should of moved more in the direction of stalkers, hydras, upgraded roaches, in the game where boring amove units can be upgraded for more versatility or harass. Just a flat out base range upgrade is pretty boring. Upgrades add a nice dynamic to the game , like roach speed/burrow and siege mode but something like the warhound is just feels gimmicky like mass thor or mass marauder where you know its going to work.. but its still lame.
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On June 13 2012 10:42 mbr2321 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2012 08:27 Roflhaxx wrote:
They give terran extremely imba mines but at the same time they remove the ability for banelings to burrow!? I didn't see any notes with regards to the removal of banelings burrowing.
Baneling buwwor move was cancelled... but not the burrow itself...
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Can't wait to see the evolution of the game continue. I love the ultralisk and hydralisk changes, as well as the overall increase in map control units like the mothership cores recall, and the mines, the swarm host. I wish they would leave the carrier though.
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EPT
