If you read their blogs (or even the last news post) you'd see that they did talk to Blizzard and are already aware of the community's concerns about MBS and that they'd try to find an alternative to make macro challenging, however if they can't they're willing to get rid of MBS.

Anyways, good job guys! Makes me glad to be a part of this community (even if it's a very small part

)

BlackStar

Netherlands3029 Posts

March 14 2008 15:22 GMT

#62

Thank you for showing Blizzard how to abuse MBS.

I really wonder if MBS will hurt micro just as much as macro.

Macro is the first thing you learn a new player because it's easiest to learn and gives the most improvement in the least time/effort.
With MBS this will be even more true. And more units still have the same strength over less units with more micro.
If micro was a more powerful skill to learn then beginner games would be more micro oriented. Now they are macro oriented. One player just has more units.
I wouldn't be surprised that games on the low level will all be attack moving of huge armies into the enemy. Until both players macro perfectly and they have to beat each other by showing more skill in other areas.

Until then, putting all your skill in macro pays off the most.

Gokey

United States2722 Posts

March 14 2008 16:03 GMT

#63

On March 14 2008 23:32 LuisMl8 wrote:
MY ENGLISH IS NOT GOOD SO DON'T GET ME WRONG

I WANT TO KNOW IF YOU LET BLIZZARD KNOW YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT MBS,
EVERYONE HERE IS HAPPY ABOUT YOU WON 3-0, BUT THAT'S NOT THE REAL MATTER HERE,
I SUPPOSED YOU WENT THERE TO TALK TO BLIZZARD WHAT MOST OF THE PPL ARE
THINKING ABOUT THAT MBS MAKES MACRO SO EASY, NOT ABOUT I WON 3-0
WE ALREADY KNOW YOU WILL WIN

I LIVE ON DOMINICAN REPUBLIC I CAN'T TRAVEL CUZ I DONT HAVE VISA
BUT IF I HAVE THE CHANCE LIKE YOU DO, TO TALK AND PLAY WITH BLIZZARD'S WORKERS, I WILL LET THEM KNOW WHY WE ARE WORRIED ABOUT MBS

AND NOT PLAYING GAME TO SHOW UP HOW SKILLED ARE YOU IN SC2,
I HOPE YOU TALK TO THEM ABOUT IT AND A NOT ONLY TALKING
YOU CAN PUT SOME OF THEM BEHIND YOU WHILE YOU ARE PLAYING SC2
AND THEM CHANCE TO SC1 TO MAKES THEM REALIZE WHAT ARE YOU TAKING ABOUT

THANKS FOR YOUR TIME

lol, it's just humorous to me that you type THANKS FOR YOUR TIME in all caps (along with everything else)

anyway, good points though

I really hope that blizzard saved the replays of the tourney to ANALYZE how other people (especially skilled players like from teamliquid), are playing and "breaking" the game. Really, although the producers and designers at blizzard are awesome at what they do, they generally seem pretty noobish when it comes to competitive gaming... they need fresh gosu players to break their cycle of circle-jerking in designing SC2

downtoearth

Norway24 Posts

March 14 2008 16:52 GMT

#64

the thing is that blizzard seems to think the stuff from wc3 is good for sc2. if they could just apply the good stuff from sc1 if posssible. like the muta control. the muta issue really bugs me. i'm not even a zerg player...but that kind of thing has to reflect the rest of the micro opportunities through out the game? i hope i'm wrong.

DanceSC

United States751 Posts

March 14 2008 17:07 GMT

#65

On March 15 2008 01:52 downtoearth wrote:
the thing is that blizzard seems to think the stuff from wc3 is good for sc2. if they could just apply the good stuff from sc1 if posssible. like the muta control. the muta issue really bugs me. i'm not even a zerg player...but that kind of thing has to reflect the rest of the micro opportunities through out the game? i hope i'm wrong.

I agree with you, and you know what, wc3 in my opinion was crappy. So many skills lost due to the "auto" part of the game. They substituted alot of micro and macro for good graphics, or so it seemed.
I know SC2 wont be that way, to start they didn't limit you to only 5 workers mining at the same time...

What made sc1 so good was every thing that you could do, a thing that i missed going from warcraft 2 to warcraft 3 was the building blocking. I play starcraft over warcraft because of that. maybe i dont know what im talking about, but i hope that blizzard keeps some of the old glitches in. (obby over the missle turret, manner pylons, vesp geyser moving... )

SayaSP

Laos5494 Posts

March 14 2008 17:40 GMT

#66

Ballin

darktreb

United States3016 Posts

March 14 2008 18:02 GMT

#67

Why don't people wait until TL people actually play another team that actually has decent macro (for all the claims of macro being "too easy" it sure seemed like none of the other teams figured this out) before juding MBS?

It's kind of funny - everyone is using MBS as an example of why macro is too easy, as if TL was allowed to use it, and their opponents weren't.... If everyone would return to a more OBJECTIVE viewpoint, maybe we'd realize how flawed the argument against MBS is in this article. I'm not saying MBS is necessarily good, I'm just saying that the observations from this article (which is very good overall) do not serve as anything more than pretty tenuous arguments against MBS. Nice job phrasing it in a way that makes it feel convincing though ... a debate teacher would surely love how that was done.

Last Romantic

United States20661 Posts

March 14 2008 18:06 GMT

#68

They did save all the reps, AFAIK.

I was pretty lazy in some of them, tbh :x

downtoearth

Norway24 Posts

March 14 2008 18:08 GMT

#69

people have to be able to speculate. it's not easy to wait for something objective. if we don't speculate during the prosess, the important aspect of making a hypothesis will be terminated and we will have alot more to answer when we get the game ready.

OnCoke

Romania49 Posts

March 14 2008 18:25 GMT

#70

Thank you. Both of you. For taking the time to write such an detailed article, for representing TL so well, for keeping us updated with what's going on with SC2, for helping Blizzard better balance SC2 so that everybody gets a better game, for your personal insights. Great job and although not everybody takes the time to say they appreciate it, i'm sure they really do.

semioldguy

United States7488 Posts

March 14 2008 18:37 GMT

#71

On March 15 2008 01:03 Gokey wrote:
I really hope that blizzard saved the replays of the tourney to ANALYZE how other people (especially skilled players like from teamliquid), are playing and "breaking" the game. Really, although the producers and designers at blizzard are awesome at what they do, they generally seem pretty noobish when it comes to competitive gaming... they need fresh gosu players to break their cycle of circle-jerking in designing SC2

All the replays, of every game, were automatically saved to the computers we played on.

edit: they are also working on making Muta control like it was in the original. In the original it was a bug however so it is taking some time for them to figure out how to do it since the code is much better now.

Kennigit

Canada19447 Posts

March 14 2008 20:12 GMT

#72

On March 15 2008 03:02 darktreb wrote:
Why don't people wait until TL people actually play another team that actually has decent macro (for all the claims of macro being "too easy" it sure seemed like none of the other teams figured this out) before juding MBS?

It's kind of funny - everyone is using MBS as an example of why macro is too easy, as if TL was allowed to use it, and their opponents weren't.... If everyone would return to a more OBJECTIVE viewpoint, maybe we'd realize how flawed the argument against MBS is in this article. I'm not saying MBS is necessarily good, I'm just saying that the observations from this article (which is very good overall) do not serve as anything more than pretty tenuous arguments against MBS. Nice job phrasing it in a way that makes it feel convincing though ... a debate teacher would surely love how that was done.

At Blizzcon tons of TL people (who automatically all have good macro :/ ) played against each other. Pretty much everyone agreed that MBS made it too easy. If you read part one of this report Dustin Browder agrees that it is an issue and does current make it easy because there is nothing to fill it....This isn't a debate...if you derail this thread any further you will feel the burn.

jkillashark

United States5262 Posts

March 14 2008 21:20 GMT

#73

Fantastique fantastique.

prOxi.swAMi

Australia3091 Posts

March 14 2008 22:58 GMT

#74

September 13 2004 22:42. mensrea wrote:
- DO NOT POST ANYTHING IN ALL CAPS IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE SCREAMING LIKE A RAVING LUNATIC AND WE WILL BE FORCED TO TREAT YOU LIKE ONE AAAAAHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

-TLNET TEN COMMANDMENTS

funkie

Venezuela9374 Posts

March 15 2008 00:56 GMT

#75

TEAMLIQUID

FIGHTING
CARAJO!

Not_Computer

Canada2277 Posts

March 15 2008 05:02 GMT

#76

The following made me LOL.

Intimidation had already been infused without having said a single word. Excellent. That’s just how it should be.

The easy button, cause I would totally take a pic like that if I could.

On March 14 2008 14:31 mikeymoo wrote:
Haha you hold the easy button like a pokeball.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, I am secretly a pokemon master.

and

insert all caps OMG MBS WTF BBQ post

You two really look awesome. No wonder all the other teams cowered in fear. Great post & coverage!