SK Planet Proleague table and results at Liquipedia
The Test
This is the make or break period for Starcraft 2 in Korea. We can all agree, Brood War and SC2 fans alike, that the hybrid Proleague was an abomination and probably should never be mentioned again. Unfortunately for CJ Entus, a team that had a history of futility in the playoffs and finally won the big one last season, their championship victory will be remembered as the season that had 50% of the chairs empty during the finals. The SC2 fans didn't enjoy watching players who were still very much works in progress, and the Brood War fans didn't enjoy watching their game get butchered with most of the players focusing solely on SC2 and neglecting the game they played for the past decade.
Here we are in the first full SC2 season of Proleague, and it may very well tell us if there's any chance for SC2 in Korea. GomTV has made massive strides since 2010, and one can hope they will be able to lead the way alone. However, it would be infinitely helpful for SC2 in Korea if the fans who followed Brood War for over a decade could be won over. Proleague was the final evolution of esports, where enjoying a game turned into passion for a player, and passion for a player turned into loyalty to a team. With some of the oldest and best supported teams in StarCraft history, and an insane $250,000 in total prize money on the line, this Proleague will be the ultimate test.
Round 1 Team Rankings
by Fionn
With eight teams competing for the championship, it's time for a preseason power ranking to see how the teams stack up. There's a lot of uncertainty involved, since you never know what KeSPA player will suddenly 'get it' and start playing SC2 like a beast (hi, Bogus!). By the time we get to the sixth and final round, these rankings might be upside down for all we know. But going off the information we have right now, here are the rankings going into Round One of the new Proleague.
8. KeSPA Eighth Team
Team Eight was going to be last place even before it was announced that Jaedong would be teaming up with Stephano over at the Unholy Alliance club house. Outside of Jaedong and BaBy, they had no depth and almost no hope of really competing in a league that can only be won by having five players you can count on every single night. With Jaedong gone, they are now down to seven players, with only Baby having any sort of impact so far in the SC2 scene. We all love Terminator's ID, but his games in Code A haven't been the most impressive, and when he's your second strongest player, you're in trouble.
Airforce Ace have been the ultimate underdogs since their inception, but with them finally bowing out of Proleague, T8 will be taking their place. Baby could be strong enough to be an ace if he can start being more consistent in SC2, but it will be almost impossible to carry this team on his shoulders alone. For T8 to even make the playoffs this season would be worthy of a Final Edit article on how this team is still standing.
They have no sponsor, just lost the face of their franchise, and half their team retired this off season. Led by their captain Jaehoon, we will have to see if the pesky underdogs can fight off the seven other teams trying to stuff them into a coffin. The one year hourglass is running as KeSPA looks to make StarCraft II work in Korea and find a sponsor for their self-funded team.
7. KT Rolster
Honestly, if it wasn't for Jaedong leaving T8, it would have been a closer race for last place. KT, besides Flash, has been awful since moving to SC2. No one except for Flash has done anything of note in SC2, and he has been pretty much the only player you've seen play Starcraft 2 outside of the hybrid Proleague for his team. Crazy-Hydra has had his own flashes of brilliance in the MvP Invitational, showing that he can be a strong #2 behind Flash if he gets his act together, but then he failed to make Code A by falling to Startale's Brain in the second round of the qualifiers.
Luckily for KT, they have time and a big roster that should get better with time. Stats, Action, Wooki, Mind, Acacia, and Motiveshould get better as the season goes along. Stats, Action and Wooki should become strong members of KT's core and give them a strong line-up that can contend against anybody. KT, by the end of the season, should be fighting for a playoff spot if everything comes together.
Right now, it's a lot of hope and not a lot of results. Flash will do his part, already looking like one of the best KeSPA players, but the rest of the team will need to catch up to help them get into the playoffs. Out of all their players except for Flash and Crazy-Hydra, watch out for Wooki. Stats might have been the #2 behind Flash in Brood War, but Wooki might overtake him for that spot soon enough.
6. CJ Entus
Yes, CJ won the title last season, but if you look at how well they did in the SC2 portion of the hybrid proleague, it wasn't anything amazing. herO[jOin] carried their Protoss line to a 58% winning percentage, but their Zergs could only a muster a 47% win rate with EffOrt carrying, and their Terrans had an awful 30% in SC2. The Brood War side of the league really helped them out, with the heroic efforts of herO playing a huge part in winning the championship.
Looking at their roster, there is a lot of potential, but not a lot of results so far. herO, their ace for the first season, has failed to qualify for GSL since his impressive Proleague/WCS Korea efforts, and hasn't made a lot of noise since. Effort, the player that everyone expects to carry this team to great heights, failed to qualify for GSL and hasn't been setting the world on fire like a lot of people thought he would. Their Terran line of Leta, sKyHigh, Horang2, Snow and Bbyong haven't done much outside of Bbyong, who is CJ's only player in Code S and in the second round of Code A.
Everything can change in this new season, but right now CJ Entus isn't as scary or consistent as the five teams above them in SC2. They don't have a Bogus, Rain, Soulkey, or Roro who has actually impressed in Code S and proved they can beat the best in the world. Effort should be that player for CJ, but he fell in the Code A qualifiers to Stars' Bravo in the semifinals. herO has shown that he can beat top end talent when he's playing well, but he's also been 2 - 0'ed by TheBest in the most recent Code A qualifiers.
5. STX Soul
Bogus, man. Bogus is the main reason why STX is in the top five, and he has been the best Terran so far in the transition period for KeSPA. Getting to the semifinals of Code S in his debut season, Bogus (now known as Innovation), turned a lot of heads with his timing attacks and insane micro. STX isn't solely about their ace, though. Behind Bogus they have players like Mini, Trap, Modesty and their former ace Calm who have either shown some good play in SC2, or, in Calm's situation, expected to show some good play very soon.
The two players that will need to be at their best for STX to battle for the championship are hyvaa and Last. Hyvaa made the finals of the MvP Invitational and did well in the tournament, but floundered in his first Code A appearance against Genius. Last, who got 4th place in the first SC2 OSL, actually could have won the entire shebang if he didn't get reverse swept by Rain before getting reverse swept again by MC in the third place match. Last and hyvaa are the 2nd and 3rd strongest players currently on STX, but can they be counted on to perform in the clutch?
4. Samsung Khan
Samsung is loaded with a ton of good players already in SC2. JangBi, possibly the most impassioned KeSPA player about SC2, is getting better at the game and should by season's end, be one of the stronger Protosses. Stork, while not having a ton of results, has shown solid play so far in his SC2 career and will be a valuable weapon in their arsenal. RorO, who showed such brilliant play early on in the KeSPA transition, might not be doing the greatest lately, but is still one of the better KeSPA SC2 pros and will be more than likely their ace early on in the season. Reality, the first KeSPA pro to turn heads when they switched over to SC2, has been quiet since making his name in WCS Korea, but is another player who can be counted on to contribute. Even Kop and Shine (not TSL's Shine) have been able to show some strong games in SC2 and will add even more depth to their team.
My pick for breakout player from Khan this season will be TurN. Since his games in Brood War, I thought when he finally switched over to SC2 that he would be one of the biggest winners. His televised record of 2-5 isn't the prettiest, but I see him as a guy who will be one of the better bio-oriented Terrans in the upcoming season. Bogus had an awful 1-8 record before finally breaking out to be the strongest KeSPA so far in the switch, so don't count out Turn. Keep your eyes on this guy throughout the season and watch him become one of the most exciting players in the world. If you are a MarineKing fan, Turn is the bandwagon you want to jump on now.
3. Woongjin Stars
Stars was actually the strongest team in last season's Frankenstein season. They had a staggering +19 map score differential, the best in the league by six wins, but still missed the playoffs with a massive choke in the end part of the season. With a 11-10 overall record, they placed 5th and outside the playoffs, creating a situation where possibly the strongest team wasn't able to compete for the championship.
Heading into the season they bring in line-up with five strong players: Soulkey, ZerO, sOs, Flying and Light. Soulkey was heralded as the strongest KeSPA SC2 player when there were no official matches going on and all the players were practicing on ladder, but it's only been recently when he had his break out in last season's Code S. sOs was statistically one of the best SC2 players in last season's hybrid Proleague, but didn't have the best showing in his first Code S season, going out in the Ro32. Zero is a player that should and more than likely will become one of the better Zergs in the league, and he could even become the ace if he develops as fast as some people think he will. Flying is a very good Protoss that can challenge sOs for the Protoss ace spot.
The biggest wild card for Stars will be their Terrans with Light and Bravo. Ryu Won, the coach that helped MMA win two GSL titles, is on Stars now and that will help the Terrans the most on the Stars lineup. Bravo made it into Code A, but wasn't able to get past MC in the first round. Light, who seemingly didn't even try to qualify for Code A, was 5-1 in the SC2 side of Proleague last season and could be Ryu Won's new project if things go his way. MMA was the best player in the world with Ryu Won behind him, but has fallen to the bottom of the ladder without his coach.
Light (or even Bravo) with Ryu Won? Now that's a combination that could be deadly if it works out. Stars might not jump out at you as a title contender, but they are certainly the hipster pick to take the championship. They have great coaching, strong players, and a whole lot of potential.
2. SK Telecom T1
They not only have the strongest player in the entire league with Rain, but their depth is becoming pretty staggering. Fantasy, who has said that SC2 actually fits him better than Brood War, is rapidly improving every time he sets forth in the booth, and he's already in the second stage of Code A looking for his first appearance in Code S. Behind the two headed monster of Rain and Fantasy, you have the MvP Invitational champion in n.Die_soO, macro monster Best, and the man with the afro, ParalyzE, who hasn't had a big breakout yet, but who should do well just on the strength of his great hair.
The biggest question mark for SKT is none other than Bisu, the former ace of SKT before Rain took over his life six months ago. Since proclaiming that with forcefields in SC2 that it would be impossible for Protoss to lose, he has had no success in SC2 with his massive sentry army composition. He isn't as bad as he was when starting out, but he is still lagging behind most of the KeSPA players who switched.
Anyone who has watched Bisu throughout his career knows that he has the talent to excel in SC2, but he just - for whatever reason - hasn't been able to get there just yet. For SKT to win the title, they will need Bisu to at least become a regular member in their line-up. He doesn't need to be the super ace that he has been for the past few years in Proleague with the emergence of Rain, but he must become some sort of threat. Be a specialist on a single map or strong against a single race, Bisu's role for SKT will be one of the main stories to follow this season.
Oh, also, Boxer is the head coach.
1. The Unholy Alliance -
Wow, now this is going to be fun. Before the announcement of Jaedong to EG, I actually had them 2nd behind SKT for mainly travel reasons, but the incoming of Jaedong on this team pretty much makes it impossible to pick against them. The main factor why they might not be the best, even with the most experienced players of anyone in Proleague, would be due to the traveling that will occur for most of the team throughout the year. We all know EG and Liquid love to try and spread their wings to as many foreign tournaments as possible, so that could be a major problem when most of the Proleague games are on the weekend.
Still, let's look at their roster they can throw out if they're all in the same place: TaeJa, HerO, Stephano, JYP, Jaedong, PuMa, Sea and then one of their strong foreigners like IdrA, HuK, or ThorZaIN if they like. In a league that is all about having a strong core, when this team is all together, they should dominate the other teams. KeSPA is still trying to catch up to the more experienced ESF players, so the Unholy Alliance will have an advantage especially in the early months of the season. By the end everything could be flipped upside down, but the player line-up is too star studded to bet against.
It's scary how good this team could dominate in the first few months of the league if even half of their main roster can stay in Korea. With Hero, Taeja, Sea, Zenio, JYP, Jaedong and Puma more than likely staying in Korea for the duration of the Proleague season except for foreign tournaments, you can expect those players to be the heart of the team with Stephano and Idra making cameo appearances every so often.
There is a lot that can go wrong with this newly formed team, but if things even go somewhat right, they will be in the finals come the end of the year. Prepare yourselves, Proleague, you just unleashed a monster into your tournament.
Time will tell which players can improve to catch up (since you need 5). And it would be great if some BW fans came along, but doubtful as the choices of esport titles increases. Now, with the news of likely no english broadcast (it is tomorrow, afterall) but a foreigner team, seems so odd and such a slap in the face that someone like myself simply isn't very interested anymore (as i didn't follow pro BW, so no real nostalgia).
Nice write-up as always and good luck to the the unholy alliance, represent foreigners well to KR....but i'm going to watch IPL.
On December 07 2012 08:24 InoyouS2 wrote: Not too hyped about this PL to be perfectly honest, it's all about BW fandom and selling personality.
Yeah BW fandom... okay :r
Anyways, like you guys said at the start of the article... it's pretty difficult to rank the teams right now, but it was a nice read. KT will show that they are not 7th place material...
I'm really hoping that EG-TL does really well but the Kespa players have shown remarkable improvement in the past few months alone and undoubtedly will continue to improve. Hopefully EG-TL can reach the finals!
i actually didnt realize that the ESF teams were excluded until i read this. honestly, to me, its like discussing the special olympics after the olympics is finished. i want to see the ESF teams compete as well. the only good thing about this is that foreign teams have a chance at winning the whole thing. oh, and we get to see all the kespa players, which will be amazing to see their progress.
Also, T1 doesn't depend so much on Bisu this time around. With Sun and Soo being able to beat practically anyone, T1 even without Bisu is more deep and well-rounded this time around than a few recent BW seasons.
Lol completely unhyped for this league. Don't know (or care) about any of the teams other than EG-TL. If they don't sort the no English commentary fiasco out, I couldn't force myself to follow this league. Hope they do.
One of the best things about this Proleague is the new maps, some of them seem like they could produce some interesting matches Now I just need to pick my Fantasy Proleague team :p
I'm surprised to see stx so far down the list. Bogus might be one of the best terran in the world, but I do agree they lack some depth. Great write up!
wait, wait, hold up. is this community now part of the strongest team in the history of sc2? can we wipe out every team in the world? do i start to like eg for the first time since tasteless left? wait, wait, hold up...
Until I read through number one, I was like hmm where is EG? After I read the entire article, i was like "oh nvm." Bisu better come back and take down EG-TL!!
On December 07 2012 08:45 bkrow wrote: Any insight on who is selecting lineups for EG-TL? Do they have a designated coach/manager?
EG very recently hired one and there's Hwanni acting as head coach presumably picking the lineups he's experienced at with Fnatic.
Think EG-TL are too highly rated, I don't think the foreigners except Stephano will contribute to anything at all.. STX and SKT1 on paper have a really strong core of players been doing well in the GSL so they're my top 2.
EG-TL might have more experience under their belt, but korean broodwar vets are known for being crafty and resourceful. Also, there are more replays of EG-TL players floating on the net than the majority of kespa players. I think kespa not only has home court advantage, but also control the x-factor. In a high pressure tournament with many unknowns, EG-TL will have to dig down deep and stay true to their game amidst the chaos. If they win the mental game, they take the first season crown. Personally, I don't see that happening, even if they do have a handful of local firepower. EG-TL will finish top 4 and lose in playoffs. Just like the San Antonio Spurs
Sleeper pick: STX Soul Unix's favorite to win: WOongjin Stars
TL-EG is gonna be 8-6tplace by the time this is all over, easily. Ppl said the same shit about T8, this is even worse because TL-EG won't even be half as commited as the rest
On December 07 2012 08:45 bkrow wrote: Any insight on who is selecting lineups for EG-TL? Do they have a designated coach/manager?
EG very recently hired one and there's Hwanni acting as head coach presumably picking the lineups he's experienced at with Fnatic.
Think EG-TL are too highly rated, I don't think the foreigners except Stephano will contribute to anything at all.. STX and SKT1 on paper have a really strong core of players been doing well in the GSL so they're my top 2.
Seeing how IdrA recently 2-0'd RorO, it seems silly to say that players like him, Thorzain and DeMuslim won't contribute.
I still wouldn't put the odds in favour of them vs Aces, but I would not be shocked to see them crush the bottom line players.
I like the optimism and definitely sounds arguments, but I don't see EG/TL breaking past 3rd. I really hope they prove me wrong but I just find it hard to put them over certain kespa teams with just GOBS more of experience (you can argue it doesn't matter, or eg/tl has more experience at certain things).
How cool would it be if tl-eg won the proleague??? its like a dream that is completely unattainable coming true. Even for the regular forum posters here its cereal
One of the great things about this PL season, is the chance to see the BW players adapt and improve as the season evolves. Some unlikely heroes will arise and maybe some gods slain.
I am so fucking amped for this! I think EG-TL is going to kill it in the beginning for sure! But like everyone else is saying anything is possible....Since its so long the KeSPA players might be able to catch up towards the end of the season!
Damn, I can't believe The Unholy Alliance is actually ranked NR1.
I guess it is to be expected in a way, here we have a quantifiable and well known team, against a largely unknown and untested value. The lineup of The Unholy Alliance is top notch, Taeja, HerO and Stephano are title contenders, Puma and JYP are tried and tested veterans, Jaedong and Sea have potential, Thorzain, IdrA and HuK where former title contenders, they still are very good foreign players and with the training in Korea they could maybe reach new heights.
Zenio feels like he has slumped for a long time, hopefully he does better and hopefully he goes to the team house and trains, he left oGs because he didn't feel comfortable playing in a team house, I don't see him improving if he doesn't join in the team practice at the house.
Overall, the lineup is more solid then an Battlecruiser's Hull and pack's as much punch as a Yamato cannon.
However I can't shake the feel that the power ranking might be totally wrong and that, secretly the KesPA teams have toiled away and have basically evaporated the lines between them and the Code S Koreans.
It might be that, on the opening day, The Unholy Alliance will have one big, nasty surprise in store for them.
I have to agree with the PR so far because, well the Unholy Alliance is a much better known variable then the other teams and their players at this moment, but I still can't shake the feeling that it could be totally wrong and in reality the UH might be more close the middle of the rankings.
Time will tell, and fortunately we don't have long to wait.
On December 07 2012 08:50 Pokebunny wrote: Damn, foreign teams ranked #1 in the biggest korean league in the world... would be amazing if it actually unfolded that way.
Except that "foreign team" will not use foreign player all that much. And of course "biggest korean league in the world" minus (almost) all the best koreans.
Their korean line-up is by far strong enough to take down any team, especially in all-kill rounds, Stephano is just icing on the cake (and one of the three best players in the team), Jaedong and Sea also could become really good and they're showing potential I think.
On December 07 2012 08:50 Pokebunny wrote: Damn, foreign teams ranked #1 in the biggest korean league in the world... would be amazing if it actually unfolded that way.
Except that "foreign team" will not use foreign player all that much. And of course "biggest korean league in the world" minus (almost) all the best koreans.
Minus a lot of the top Koreans, but they do have the best Protoss and the best Terran and one of the best Zergs in Stephano.
Super-pumped for this, but to be honest I'll only watch it if there's an English stream (live for preference, I'm in Australia so time-zone is good for me). I've been spoiled by GSL, so quality english commentary is pretty much a must.
Worst-case scenario I'd be pretty happy if they just sent all the replays to somebody like Husky (although better would be getting Apollo + somebody to cast them). I'd prefer delayed commentary to bad commentary.
Will they change game in-between the rounds or will they play wol during the whole league? I mean, it will probably hard to get it hyped up if it's wol games 3 months after hots was released.
On December 07 2012 10:34 chukolna wrote: if the "unholy alliance" is in top 3 this season ( which will be the easiest for them to actually do something ) i will be surprised
On paper they're legit. So it all depends on if they can get it together when it's crunch time.
Taeja should be the best Terran in Proleague. Stephano is a question mark, but the few times he's played in Gom events he's more than held his own (even if you think they were screwing around a bit last wknd he still made them earn the win; which is more than anyone else on the World Team can say).
I think Hero and JYP are above average as far as Proleague Protosses are concerned too (Hero being a contender for 2nd best behind Rain).
So like the power ranking says; a strong core.... on paper.
Coaching could trip them up; do we even know who it's going to be? Preparation will be another big hurdle for them, since the Proleague map pool is very different from GSL / MLG / IPL / Ladder with half the map being Kespa maps.
Especially with travel they may just end up falling behind when it comes to playing on those maps. But again that'll depend no the quality of their coaching (and practice regime too).
Also, they still have the problem eSF players had at the WCG prelims - lots of information available for opponents; little information about opponents.
On December 07 2012 10:57 CloudMage wrote: The rest of the KT team shouldn't effect the rank since Flash will just all-kill every other team ;P
Proleague isn't a winners league format like GSTL, so one player can only do so much. I like proleague style better though i think, especially for fantasy (not the SKT terran). The fantasy league for GSTL was to dependant on getting a couple super good players and the other didn't really matter as much. This format gets rid of the proverbial "I have DongRaeGu, and therefore I am better than you since you don't have DongRaeGu".
PL is going to be vicious, I am looking forward to a bit more KeSPA face time for players. I am woefully ill equipped to do some of this fantasy stuff. I am glad to see the unholy alliance in number one, I think that depth will be the biggest issue facing the other PL teams.
WOW CJ no. 6 seriously? Also Fionn has some serious hate for the hybrid format lol... it certainly was kind of stupid to force players to practice two games, but it really pretty fun to watch from a spectator view point. herO, effort and bbyong have come a long way since the last proleague, CJ should be ranked 4th at the very least.
Also SK Telecom T1 ranked 2nd also does not make sense... Rain is definitely THE best KeSPA pro atm, but the rest have yet to prove themselves (super hyped for the new Fantasy under Boxer's personal training tho :D)
Still, let's look at their roster they can throw out if they're all in the same place: TaeJa, HerO, Stephano, JYP, Jaedong, PuMa, Seaand then one of their strong foreigners like IdrA, HuK, or ThorZaIN if they like.
On December 07 2012 08:50 Pokebunny wrote: Damn, foreign teams ranked #1 in the biggest korean league in the world... would be amazing if it actually unfolded that way.
But the players were not the best in SPL.... you know, now it's the era of ESF
Yes he's won the most money but he hasnt been playing like the best protoss. Mvp is the only terran to make a GSL finals this year, did it twice, won 1, and is rank 1 GSL points. Several protoss are vying for the title of best toss atm
Bogus is the best Terran going around right now (not ever, that would be MVP for WoL, Flash for Broodwar and Fantasy for HotS ) and Rain is the best Protoss.
As an oldtimer of SC:BW it really hurt watching the last SC:BW Proleague tournament, and with that said the new season looks like it will be freaking epic and I'm really looking forward to it!
EG-TL is one of those things that never normally happen but now that it has it gonna crush face. Such an epic story of two rivals teaming up to take on the all-powerful koreans!
On December 07 2012 10:34 chukolna wrote: if the "unholy alliance" is in top 3 this season ( which will be the easiest for them to actually do something ) i will be surprised
I agree, I'd love nothing more for EG-TL to take it all, but these guys are real pros.
I hope EG-TL can actually perform as well as they should, considering they have the SC2 experience under their belt. As time goes on, the Kespa teams will catch up to them...
I was really impressed that EG-TL was ranked #1 and felt that therefore maybe they actually could win it all, but then I noticed that Fionn wrote it, which means the Unholy Alliance is cursed -.-' EG-TL Curse.
Yeah, I really think EG-TL is going to dominate this season. I mean, they have just have years of experience over the KeSPA teams and not to mention some of the strongest SC2 players of all time, battle-proven and ready to go.
But I really hope Bisu gets his shit together and goes on to start raping again.
I still feel bad for Team 8. They'll get annihilated horribly =/ How are they going to get a sponsor?
EG-TL might be good on paper but there's so many unknowns that go into being a new team in a new league with half the guys flying over to stay in Korea for a bit, that I think this is pretty premature. I also believe that the Kespa teams are going to improve faster than EG-TL will.
SKT/Woojing and STX all look strong. The unholy alliance better start of strong they will need it for later on. Specialy SKT to me seems to have the potential yet again to dominate ProLeague.
People far underestimating Team 8. I hate seeing SKT hyped so high, would like if there was more suprise to how well they do. Putting KT so low is a mistake too. TBH really confused by these ranking. EG-TL hasn't had any time to mold as a team like the rest of PL.
The Stars are shine this season. oh yeah baby how long I've been waiting for this. Pretty sure the zergline is going to be unstoppable (well, hopefully even fokins) and they are gonna be backed up with sOs and the almighty new Nalra, Flying. And then let's not forget about Bisang and Light. I've got nerdchills.
Watch KT blast through the unholy alliance, haters..
I honestly doubt The Unholy Alliance will do well at all, all star teams who look stacked on paper usually crumble, SKT is as much as I hate it, easily the strongest team of the proleague.
On December 07 2012 14:52 wwJd)El_Mojjo wrote: Hmm, why are there almost no code s-players in pl? Are they not allowed to participate or...? Am I missing something here? oO
Qualifiers are just ridiculously hard. They're starting to filter in to Code A and S, but every one has to knock out a regular to get there, and they're still learning the game.
On December 07 2012 14:52 wwJd)El_Mojjo wrote: Hmm, why are there almost no code s-players in pl? Are they not allowed to participate or...? Am I missing something here? oO
Qualifiers are just ridiculously hard. They're starting to filter in to Code A and S, but every one has to knock out a regular to get there, and they're still learning the game.
If actual foreigners would be playing for Unholy Alliance with good English cast, I could see myself tuning in. But ESF pros beating Kespa pros with Korean commentary... that's some old school brood war shit, which I actually enjoyed at the time. I just don't think it's the case anymore with e-sports coming this far.
" Writers: Fionn" Oh how did I know that ... oh yea... "scary how good this team could dominate in the first few months of the league if even half of their main roster can stay in Korea. With Hero, Taeja, Sea, Zenio, JYP, Jaedong and Puma more than likely staying in Korea for..." Oh but HuK ? NOPE, no mention. :D H8'tR Fionn.
Bisu never proclaimed that it would be impossible for protoss to lose in sc2 since they have forcefields, he stated that if forcefields existed in broodwar he would never lose a game
On December 07 2012 18:28 EonuS wrote: Bisu never proclaimed that it would be impossible for protoss to lose in sc2 since they have forcefields, he stated that if forcefields existed in broodwar he would never lose a game
bu he sure made stupid amount of sentries in one of his game lol.
now look at it, the "poor lowely" foreigners + esf players are now the scaiest fuckers in proleague. The elephants should fear them.
There was a real threat that kespa players would walk in and take over sc2 and return the foreign scene back to the corner like it sat in during BW. Now, we have a really strong team that could not only stand up for itself, but dominate.
This is some of the most exciting times for starcraft. I feel bad for anyone that stopped watching sc2.... its just begun.
I had EG-TL in first place too, their core is super amazingly strong. Makes me remember just how fucking hard GSTL is, where even this unholy alliance might be overshadowed by teams like LG.IM and Startale.
My personal storyline? The elephants have tried to conquer during WCS Korea and HerO ripped them all to shreds. Now they let him step into their territory. How will it end?!?!? The only player in the entire league who might be favored against him is Rain.
I find it kinda weird that there is a foreing proteam in this tournament. I mean, a lot of the BW pros still suffer from mediocre games in SC2, while the TL-EG players have played the game for a much longer time. I wouldn't be surprised to see them doingr eally well.
On another note, WHAT in all the fucks are these maps?! I just took a look at the new ones... they don't make sense WHATSOEVER. They just... completely go against SC2 gameplay. WTF. One of them doesn't have an entrance to your base except for destructible rocks? DB did you design that shit yourself?
Take a look at the maps people, your brain will explode. You have NEVER seen stuff like that. I have no words for this.
WHO MADE THESE? What in every fuck where they thinking? Take three bases on Arkanoid without your opponent having a way into your base? Like... WHAT The other maps are no better either. Prepare to forget everything you ever thought you knew about the game.
Does anyone know if these games will be played on the latest version of WoL?
So no seeker upgrade, infestor range to 8, and 70 egg health? Rather useless wrist-slap compared to the proper changes in HotS beta, but I want Flash to get everything he can.
On December 07 2012 20:14 DemigodcelpH wrote: Does anyone know if these games will be played on the latest version of WoL?
So no seeker upgrade, infestor range to 8, and 70 egg health? Rather useless wrist-slap compared to the proper changes in HotS beta, but I want Flash to get everything he can.
On December 07 2012 20:00 DarkLordOlli wrote: Take a look at the maps people, your brain will explode. You have NEVER seen stuff like that. I have no words for this.
WHO MADE THESE? What in every fuck where they thinking? Take three bases on Arkanoid without your opponent having a way into your base? Like... WHAT The other maps are no better either. Prepare to forget everything you ever thought you knew about the game.
I will any of these maps over ever seeing Daybreak again.
I like how Stephano ended up being in the list with Koreans and then you have foreigners (And Zenio is just mentionned at the head).
On December 07 2012 20:04 ineversmile wrote: This article is propaganda. There's just no way that the EG-Liquid team should be ranked that high. They're middle-of-the-pack.
They play the game for a long time now. They show more results than the KespA players. I'm all for KT to win but... Yeah they are the strongest.
But SKT is scary. Just because of the new map and Boxer. Boxer was always the guy that studied the map 100% and found glitches, scary sport or stuff like that (remember that marine behind the mineral line after landed a barracks in the main of... damnit.. A protoss player that i forgot the name).
With the new map not really balanced (like they always have been in PL) i feal that SKT will have another edge.
I got STX as my sleeper team and Dear as my sleeper player. That being said, I don't think they will take down SKT in this upcoming match but I think they can do quite well otherwise.
On December 07 2012 20:00 DarkLordOlli wrote: Take a look at the maps people, your brain will explode. You have NEVER seen stuff like that. I have no words for this.
WHO MADE THESE? What in every fuck where they thinking? Take three bases on Arkanoid without your opponent having a way into your base? Like... WHAT The other maps are no better either. Prepare to forget everything you ever thought you knew about the game.
Terran just two raxes every game. no way to scout it. (exept TaeJa, he will build exclusivly CC for the first ten minutes of the game) Then float you barracks over the small cliff to your opponent and everything is fine. Only building bunkers will be hard to pull off... Or will will be 20 minutes no rush...
On December 07 2012 20:00 DarkLordOlli wrote: Take a look at the maps people, your brain will explode. You have NEVER seen stuff like that. I have no words for this.
WHO MADE THESE? What in every fuck where they thinking? Take three bases on Arkanoid without your opponent having a way into your base? Like... WHAT The other maps are no better either. Prepare to forget everything you ever thought you knew about the game.
They were thinking one thing for sure : adapt BW maps. They may have thought one more thing : bring some diversity.
And your comment on Arkanoid is kinda weird... Does Daybreak ring any bells ?
Finally, I'm fully prepared to forget everythiin I thought I ever knew about the game. It shows it's refreshing and breaking a metagame which is in place for some time now. Which is imo a good thing.
Then, I'll tend to say that pitchforks should wait for some games being played on it before actually criticize. I know you can theorycraft with the maps' dispositions, but if I learned one thing on the internet these last years, it's that 99% of theorycrafting is just plain bs (it's still my and only my opinion. I'm not pretending it's universally true).
This is gonna be great I feel like the The Unholy Alliance could easily dominate, but there is possibility for teams like SK T1 to really shine through. I'm also looking forward to some more unknown players really breaking out with SC2 like Bogus.
Looking very much forward to this! Will be very interesting to see how the unholy alliance performs, but I think they will need Taeja back top-top shape, to again become unstoppable.
On another note, can anyone say approximately how long will the opening ceremony / pre-show be before games start? I'm sort of tight on time, so I'd like to time my day so I can catch some games without watching some pre-show thingie. TY!
On December 07 2012 23:33 JKM wrote: Looking very much forward to this! Will be very interesting to see how the unholy alliance performs, but I think they will need Taeja back top-top shape, to again become unstoppable.
On another note, can anyone say approximately how long will the opening ceremony / pre-show be before games start? I'm sort of tight on time, so I'd like to time my day so I can catch some games without watching some pre-show thingie. TY!
Maybe 5-10 minutes after the start of the broadcast, the first game will begin.
On December 07 2012 23:33 JKM wrote: Looking very much forward to this! Will be very interesting to see how the unholy alliance performs, but I think they will need Taeja back top-top shape, to again become unstoppable.
On another note, can anyone say approximately how long will the opening ceremony / pre-show be before games start? I'm sort of tight on time, so I'd like to time my day so I can catch some games without watching some pre-show thingie. TY!
Maybe 5-10 minutes after the start of the broadcast, the first game will begin.
Thank you! Lovely they're so quick about it, long pregame shows tend to be tedious and boring (unless they're ceremonies including wacky players ).
I hope Thorzain will be one of the ones that will play instead of HuK and Idra.. -.- But anyway I like this "unholy Alliance" :D Its going to be epic, especially when EG has JD and stephano(second JD), OMG :D + Taeja and herO. Epic.
Well done write-up As much of a primer as could be hoped for given how hazey our experience is with even the kespa players we have gotten to see so far, let alone the ones that we haven't.
I concur with EG-TL being the favorite, though I hadn't thought of the travel concerns. Still, it's theirs to lose.
Brood war fans /think tournaments are dumb because there are no elephants /get excited about a tournament with few of the best koreans in it.
Was surprised to see Unholy Alliance at No.1, but really on paper they've got the best stats. The BW stars are pretty unproven at this stage, and those teams with pros who have shown some promise (Flash, Rain) are deservedly rated higher. But there's many more years of cumulative experience in the UH team, and top players like Taeja, Stephano and HerO should see the team through to a few months of wins.
On December 07 2012 20:00 DarkLordOlli wrote: Take a look at the maps people, your brain will explode. You have NEVER seen stuff like that. I have no words for this.
WHO MADE THESE? What in every fuck where they thinking? Take three bases on Arkanoid without your opponent having a way into your base? Like... WHAT The other maps are no better either. Prepare to forget everything you ever thought you knew about the game.
They were thinking one thing for sure : adapt BW maps. They may have thought one more thing : bring some diversity.
And your comment on Arkanoid is kinda weird... Does Daybreak ring any bells ?
Finally, I'm fully prepared to forget everythiin I thought I ever knew about the game. It shows it's refreshing and breaking a metagame which is in place for some time now. Which is imo a good thing.
Then, I'll tend to say that pitchforks should wait for some games being played on it before actually criticize. I know you can theorycraft with the maps' dispositions, but if I learned one thing on the internet these last years, it's that 99% of theorycrafting is just plain bs (it's still my and only my opinion. I'm not pretending it's universally true).
Wut. There's literally no entrance to your base. Every path is cut off by destructible rocks. Not sure what you're trying to say but you can pretty much forget everything you ever thought you knew. And that's retarded. And let me tell you RIGHT this second why they're doing this: so BW players don't get absolutely slaughtered by people like Rain, Bogus and the EG-TL guys who know the SC2 metagame better than anyone else. This way none of that matters because nobody will know what the flying fuck is actually going on. Well fucking played KeSPA. For example, Arkanoid. Tell me how you're supposed to scout. You can't even fucking know what your opponent is doing or where he is until you scan/get an observer or overlord in their base OR destroy the 5 million destructible rocks on the map. What the fuck is the point of a game when you can't scout? What does that have to do with skill? You just 4 gate warp prism every game as protoss because it's the one gamble that catches most enemy builds?
Sure it's gonna be refreshing and all but it's got no place in what's supposed to be a serious and prestigeous SC2 tournament. Not unless you can FUCKING SCOUT YOUR OPPONENT.
On December 08 2012 00:19 RouaF wrote: I'd be surprised if EG-TL actually wins it like predicted in this article. Time will tell.
ive come to think fionn is a bit biased, so i'll wait for the actual results :p
fionn is also a bit cursed he destroyed hyun's chance of winning last gsl because he said hyun would win in the middle of the series when hyun was up 3-2 vs sniper naturally sniper dominated the moment fionn posted it was over
On December 08 2012 01:49 rice_devOurer wrote: I have a feeling that Araknoid will result in air rushes, luck in breaking the right rocks, or LOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG macro games.
It doesn't even matter because it's just a gamble map, no skill involved whatsoever. Who gambles right wins.
On December 07 2012 20:00 DarkLordOlli wrote: Take a look at the maps people, your brain will explode. You have NEVER seen stuff like that. I have no words for this.
WHO MADE THESE? What in every fuck where they thinking? Take three bases on Arkanoid without your opponent having a way into your base? Like... WHAT The other maps are no better either. Prepare to forget everything you ever thought you knew about the game.
They were thinking one thing for sure : adapt BW maps. They may have thought one more thing : bring some diversity.
And your comment on Arkanoid is kinda weird... Does Daybreak ring any bells ?
Finally, I'm fully prepared to forget everythiin I thought I ever knew about the game. It shows it's refreshing and breaking a metagame which is in place for some time now. Which is imo a good thing.
Then, I'll tend to say that pitchforks should wait for some games being played on it before actually criticize. I know you can theorycraft with the maps' dispositions, but if I learned one thing on the internet these last years, it's that 99% of theorycrafting is just plain bs (it's still my and only my opinion. I'm not pretending it's universally true).
Wut. There's literally no entrance to your base. Every path is cut off by destructible rocks. Not sure what you're trying to say but you can pretty much forget everything you ever thought you knew. And that's retarded. And let me tell you RIGHT this second why they're doing this: so BW players don't get absolutely slaughtered by people like Rain, Bogus and the EG-TL guys who know the SC2 metagame better than anyone else. This way none of that matters because nobody will know what the flying fuck is actually going on. Well fucking played KeSPA. For example, Arkanoid. Tell me how you're supposed to scout. You can't even fucking know what your opponent is doing or where he is until you scan/get an observer or overlord in their base OR destroy the 5 million destructible rocks on the map. What the fuck is the point of a game when you can't scout? What does that have to do with skill? You just 4 gate warp prism every game as protoss because it's the one gamble that catches most enemy builds?
Sure it's gonna be refreshing and all but it's got no place in what's supposed to be a serious and prestigeous SC2 tournament. Not unless you can FUCKING SCOUT YOUR OPPONENT.
You know, people complain about lack of innovation or stagnation in map design. KesPA put out new maps to try out and people still complain. No wonder why there is a stagnation in the first place.
There's a saying that don't judge the book by its cover. The same hold true here, don't judge a map only by a preview picture until it is tested that it is good or not. Many people who watched the game played on it during the show match between STX and SKT said that it bring a refreshing game play to a stagnate meta game so at least it has a potential.
On December 08 2012 01:49 rice_devOurer wrote: I have a feeling that Araknoid will result in air rushes, luck in breaking the right rocks, or LOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG macro games.
It doesn't even matter because it's just a gamble map, no skill involved whatsoever. Who gambles right wins.
Scan / Overlord / Observer.
It's not that hard for top players to adjust to maps quick. Just look at how Bomber did during Trials of the Xel Naga. He would've steamrolled the tournament if the live audience there weren't morons.
You sir have somehow got me interested in SC2. I was reading Ver's schebang about patchzergs which dishearteningly implies that SC2 is being designed so that white guys have an assured shot at beating Koreans ... if they play Zerg. The reason being, white fans don't for the most part care about how good the Koreans are, just that a foreigner gets a spot in the top 8.
I realize it was great being a fan a few years ago, because since they were all Korean, I followed (or despised) the players' character and teams, not just the fact that they were a token upset. Sadly, the ESF players are largely just a panel of similar Korean faces to me, no personal story to enjoy (unless I do year's worth of digging).
But even if it's not BW they're playing anymore, I will fulfill my part-time promise, to entertain a following for proleague for the sake of personal stories and connections. Its different, but its still Jaedong and Fantasy and BOXER COACHING (I whimpered in delight when I read that) .... except now the board's been slanted so Idra has a fighting chance (LOL!). Oh and foreigners too, which is always nice. They're living a dream I'm sure many of us have entertained (I sure have).
So BW peeps, pinch your nose and dive in. SKT HWAITING! [and now I've got a sick SKT shirt, life rocks]
I don't think LG-EG can be considered favorites in the PL, as it will be quite easy for other teams to research their replays and observe them streaming, and then develop a proper counters in the league games.
On December 08 2012 06:56 Odoakar wrote: I don't think LG-EG can be considered favorites in the PL, as it will be quite easy for other teams to research their replays and observe them streaming, and then develop a proper counters in the league games.
B teamers scrubbing dishes while watching IdrA's stream with clipboards, I can see it now.
I think they built EG liquid up too much. sure they have a lot of great players. But the Kespa teams practice all the time with top top level people. They spend their time creating builds and such. I see no reason why it would be a Korean top 4. It probably will
On December 08 2012 10:01 Purpletrain wrote: I think they built EG liquid up too much. sure they have a lot of great players. But the Kespa teams practice all the time with top top level people. They spend their time creating builds and such. I see no reason why it would be a Korean top 4. It probably will
When Hero, TaeJa and Stephano get there, it will be a different story.
On December 08 2012 13:59 betaman wrote: Overhyped much?
They were missing their three best players. I had KT winning 4-1/4-0 with maybe JD taking their only win. Taeja and Hero will be the heart of the team if they want to be anywhere near the top of the league, and Jaedong will need to improve to give them a constant trio. Stephano is just an added piece/wild card when he ever makes guest appearances.
Just you wait, man. The monster is going to unleash any second now.
On December 08 2012 13:59 betaman wrote: Overhyped much?
They were missing their three best players. I had KT winning 4-1/4-0 with maybe JD taking their only win. Taeja and Hero will be the heart of the team if they want to be anywhere near the top of the league, and Jaedong will need to improve to give them a constant trio. Stephano is just an added piece/wild card when he ever makes guest appearances.
Just you wait, man. The monster is going to unleash any second now.
I hope so but Taeja and Stephano are the teams "monsters" and Stephano isnt going to be there that much. Hero is only sporadically brilliant in my opinion. Cannot see the rest of the team winning many games.
Honestly it was a pretty optimistic move to put EGTL as rank 1 on the ranking, The lineup today was indeed a more "b-team-ish" line up with Zenio and JYP being perhaps the weakest players on EGTL, but no matter how good Taeja, HerO and Stephano plays they will give EGTL 3 wins, who is gonna win the last game? Those 3 players winning all their matches is an optimal situation, let alone them winning all the 3 matches against every team, and Stephano showing up to play. It`s really easy to post stuff like "who the hell wrote this?" after a 4-0 that didn't go in favor of the predictions though.
If the "B-teamer" of EGTL doesn't step their game up, the rest of the PL season will probably look like this. Regular season is not an all-kill format which I believe with players like Taeja and Stephano will perform well at. The BW pros will only get better as the time goes on and I don't see the same happening for players who have already been playing for 2 years plus.
I felt this was a little too optimistic but didn't want to go against the group, but I guess logic wins out over emotion once again. Then again, it was just one match, so let's see what happens next time.
Pretty accurate ranking here, CJ won the previous PL based mostly on their SC2 performance but are ranked near bottom while EG-TL both combined have only reached a 2nd place in an all-kill formataeja and are rank 1.
KT at #7 and EG-TL at #1 is hilarious. I only just saw this preview but I'd have said this regardless.
KT is an established team that has a core of multiple championship winners, great camaraderie and staff. Oh and they also have the best RTS player alive heading their roster.
EG-TL is a ragtag group of big-name mercenaries thrown together into a new environment (not unlike team 8) that is collectively unproven. The training environment, management, player commitment and availability have me thinking this team will be doing well to remain competitive, let alone dominant. They have maybe three players who can hold their own for a while at least.
To think a foreigner team can go into Proleague and be a heavy favourite to make the finals is such hubris. It's hard enough beating players from the Korean team houses when they're on foreign soil in mass game, (almost) 0 prep tourneys (MLG/DH). Now to go and play them in their own booths and league that they've been accustomed to for years, albeit in a new game, is going to be ridiculously tough. Added in the preparation time the Kespa players thrive on, the complete dominance of the MvP invitational, the superior training environments and dedicated coaching staff....
On December 08 2012 20:25 Scarecrow wrote: KT at #7 and EG-TL at #1 is hilarious. I only just saw this preview but I'd have said this regardless.
KT is an established team that has a core of multiple championship winners, great camaraderie and staff. Oh and they also have the best RTS player alive heading their roster.
EG-TL is a ragtag group of big-name mercenaries thrown together into a new environment (not unlike team 8) that is collectively unproven. The training environment, management, player commitment and availability have me thinking this team will be doing well to remain competitive, let alone dominant. They have maybe three players who can hold their own for a while at least.
To think a foreigner team can go into Proleague and be a heavy favourite to make the finals is such hubris. It's hard enough beating players from the Korean team houses when they're on foreign soil in mass game, (almost) 0 prep tourneys (MLG/DH). Now to go and play them in their own booths and league that they've been accustomed to for years, albeit in a new game, is going to be ridiculously tough. Added in the preparation time the Kespa players thrive on, the complete dominance of the MvP invitational, the superior training environments and dedicated coaching staff....
Yeah IMO this is like an individual Power ranking more than anything
I didn't think the Alliance would really be #1, they have the most well known players as far as SC2 results go, but this is ProLeague, it's a whole different beast than they're used to.
Hopefully this first match was a shot in the arm for EG-Liquid and they really prepare well for their next match to compensate.
It's been proven time and time again, money can't buy results, it takes time, hard work and commitment, and a lot of the EG players just mess around as if it were a frat house...
This is something the foreigners should stop doing, and the teams and managers should start forcing the players to train, or to leave.
Are you referring to the number of copout remarks and excuses sprinkled throughout the article? Probably should have taken all those things into account when raking the teams.
EG-TL 0-4 i lol'd... and then cringed... and then wished I had seen it...
Why is it so hard to find a stream / vod link for this? I found it on the "upcoming events" schedule, but there's no stream link... but there is one, right above it, for the oGaming vs Triumph e-Sports - Bo9 $100... derp.
Ok, it's not THAT hard to find it, but for someone just getting into the esports scene, it's hardly straight-forward. Every advertisement for the NFL has the date, time, and channel on which you can view the game they're talking about... because they want you to watch.... seems like that info should be on any advertisement for SC2 proleague as well. <shrug>
On December 09 2012 06:05 iiant14ii wrote: can someone explain to me where the fuck i can watch this sk pro league. i cant even find a home website for them
Well EG-Liquid didn't exactly use their best players. They used Zenio, JYP, Thorzain, and Jaedong, while leaving Huk and Puma for the end so they didn't even get to go.
I just now read this and i think this ranking is too bold and biased . Regardless of the first 2 days results and last season's hybrid Proleague , placing KT and CJ a playoffs regulars 7 and 6 and EG - TL at number 1 was lol worthy . Ten years of experience will show it's magnitude . Just having skilled players won't necessarily make you the number one team .
If you swich STX and Woongjing, the four highest teams in this preview are the four lowest in the actual PL ranking. And it is true the other way around of course, the four best teams in this ranking are the four teams in the bottom of the actual ranking.