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SQ Leaderboard by Region - Page 18

Forum Index > News
393 CommentsPost a Reply
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Firekidt
Profile Joined March 2011
United States28 Posts
October 31 2011 01:12 GMT
#341
This implies that all builds are fine-tuned to never have money floating. Although this is more or less the case for Terran and Protoss, Zerg doesn't follow this MO. The most common ZvT build, 2-3 hatch Muta, usually involves periods of time when gas and minerals are floating anywhere from 600 to 1000 of both minerals and gas. This isn't bad play, but the optimal method of having a relevant amount of Mutalisks.

The same can be said for making Broodlords, corrupters in ZvP, and Infestor builds.
"Shut up your terran"
KurtSib
Profile Joined June 2011
United States4 Posts
October 31 2011 01:15 GMT
#342
On October 30 2011 20:21 ikona wrote:
Doesnt such small sample size defeat the purplse of this analisys though?

I mean you can get different sets of last 30 games from the same player that provide wildly different results all day.

So what is this data for exactly?


So you're talking about sampling error, which is a fair criticism. We have some evidence, though, to suggest that sampling error is not a major factor in these results.

Take the Euro/US players. That both of those players' SQ values were not significantly changed between their US 30 and their Euro 30, suggests that the SQ values don't vary greatly from 30-game set to 30-game set. Now that's still only 60 games, but the lack of variation between the sets of 30 is rather suggestive.

Again, it isn't proof that the sample size is robust, but it is a good indication.
aztrorisk
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States896 Posts
October 31 2011 01:37 GMT
#343
can somebody clearify?

SQ = average income/average unspent minerals

am I correct?
A lock that opens to many keys is a bad lock. A key that opens many locks is a master key.
SoKHo
Profile Joined April 2011
Korea (South)1081 Posts
October 31 2011 01:46 GMT
#344
On October 31 2011 10:37 aztrorisk wrote:
can somebody clearify?

SQ = average income/average unspent minerals

am I correct?


No, read the original thread and there is an exact equation for it.
"If you don't understand my silence, you won't understand my words"|| Big Nal_rA fan boy!! Nal_rA, Bisu, Huk, MC, Hero fighting! SKT1---->
Sableyeah
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands2119 Posts
October 31 2011 01:54 GMT
#345
This is truly an impressive post. Interesting to see.
BoA | Sunny | HyunA | ChoA | Hyemi // Preoccupied with a single leaf, you won't see the tree. Preoccupied with a single tree and you will miss the entire f0rest - Takuan Soho
JeffVader
Profile Joined February 2011
United States79 Posts
October 31 2011 02:19 GMT
#346
On October 30 2011 15:59 tgun wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 30 2011 12:32 JeffVader wrote:
Wouldn't Terran's SQ naturally be higher simply because they can queue units up in their production facilities?

I'm not trying to take away from this excellent analysis by the way .


If you're aiming to purely increase your SQ then yes; however, since everyone in Ladder games (at least at the top level) isn't queing things up or spending just for the sake of spending, it shouldn't be a factor.


Thanks. Very good point.
As if you could kill time without injuring eternity.
HorussTv
Profile Joined June 2010
Mexico34 Posts
October 31 2011 02:24 GMT
#347
Such a good article, more statistics but this one is specially interesting, gives you a lot to think of.
zergtat
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Hong Kong853 Posts
October 31 2011 02:25 GMT
#348
very interesting article and findings. I would love to see more from you man!
Z: SEn P: White-Ra T: Polt
darklordjac
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada2231 Posts
October 31 2011 02:26 GMT
#349
DeMuslim :O very impressive
Grovbolle
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Denmark3819 Posts
October 31 2011 09:07 GMT
#350
On October 31 2011 07:27 KurtSib wrote:
Why no t-values?

I'm not totally versed in stats. My major, bio, mostly flirts with them. Still, I wonder why did you choose exclusively two-tailed t-tests?

As I say, I'm far from expert, so take my questions as questions if you take them at all.


Because when one doesn't have a clear assumption that it is okay to use a 1-tailed t-test one should always use the more "foolproof/safe" 2-tailed test.
Also he provides p-values, which is all that is needed to asses whether or not H0 can be supported.
Lies, damned lies and statistics: http://aligulac.com
jjhchsc2
Profile Joined December 2010
Korea (South)2393 Posts
October 31 2011 11:01 GMT
#351
cant wait for these results!
Lee Ssang/ Lee Shin/ Kim Jung Woo/ Kim Min Chul/Jun Tae Yang/Park Soo Ho/Lee Jung Hoon/Choi Sung Hoon/ Moon Sung Won/Park Ji Soo/ Lee Ho Joon/ Jang Min Chul/ Kim Seung Chul/SaSe/IdrA/Ret Fighting! BW4Life
ForgottenOne
Profile Joined August 2010
Romania236 Posts
October 31 2011 13:14 GMT
#352
It's nice to see my average SQ close to Sheth's, my min SQ in low Masters and my high SQ about Ret's average. Now I know I don't need to macro better and instead I should actually start learning some timings and maybe to control my units...
Born free, as free as the wind blows...
xenofox
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada43 Posts
October 31 2011 14:18 GMT
#353
Amazing write-up! Hope to see more soon!
UnkoSeigen
Profile Joined October 2011
Japan1 Post
October 31 2011 18:13 GMT
#354
I just made an account just to say this is an awesome report!
KurtSib
Profile Joined June 2011
United States4 Posts
October 31 2011 18:16 GMT
#355
On October 31 2011 18:07 Grovbolle wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 31 2011 07:27 KurtSib wrote:
Why no t-values?

I'm not totally versed in stats. My major, bio, mostly flirts with them. Still, I wonder why did you choose exclusively two-tailed t-tests?

As I say, I'm far from expert, so take my questions as questions if you take them at all.


Because when one doesn't have a clear assumption that it is okay to use a 1-tailed t-test one should always use the more "foolproof/safe" 2-tailed test.
Also he provides p-values, which is all that is needed to asses whether or not H0 can be supported.


Why doesn't that assumption exist for the Idra ladder vs. Idra tournament comparison?
VediVeci
Profile Joined October 2011
United States82 Posts
October 31 2011 18:33 GMT
#356
I may have missed it earlier in the comments but has anyone explored whether SQ is a good predictor for the outcome of a game? There are clearly limitations to using it as a prescriptive indicator given that it doesn't take into account micro or tactical/strategic decision making but I'd be interested in seeing how frequently the person with the higher SQ wins the match. Doing this and observing differences in results in different match ups could also give evidence as to whether SQ is an equal indicator of skill across all races (If TvT the higher SQ player wins 67% of the time, PvP they win 53% of the time it's probably a more useful metric for judging Terrans etc). More data is probably needed to do this but I think looking at SQ in head-to-head match-ups could help people determine how important SQ is.
LetoAtreides82
Profile Joined January 2011
United States1188 Posts
October 31 2011 19:28 GMT
#357
Can't wait to see the Korean stats.
The spice must flow
GiygaS
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada1043 Posts
October 31 2011 20:03 GMT
#358
Someone should figure out how to pull this data from a replay. I haven't fiddled around with reps myslef, but I'm sure it's possible with enought time.
AKA gigyas, gigas, giygas khan, giyga khan, giyga...
vinautomatic
Profile Joined June 2010
United States65 Posts
October 31 2011 21:18 GMT
#359
This math gave me a headache.
aka nAi. and Oem)CyRaX
imbecile
Profile Joined October 2009
563 Posts
October 31 2011 21:49 GMT
#360
On October 29 2011 18:58 zul wrote:
GoODy in front of IdrA in a Statistic about macro abilitys. Who would have thought that


Just shows that queuing is an incredible tool to keep up your macro while yo u need to attend to other things.

Also a good explanation why terrans tend to gave the best SQs, and protoss the worst:

All terrran production is queued, so it is easiest for them to have constant production and cushion slip-ups.

Most protoss production is from Warp-ins. Not only can't it be queued, it also requires direct vision and attention on the battlefield and sometimes rewards not spending and build up warpgate count.

The zerg larva production is in between in how much player attention and involvement it requires. While there aren't queues to keep up the production times for you, stockpiling larva can make up for previous slip-ups to a degree.

In short, it is easiest to be efficient with terran production, as long as you know when, what and how many structures to build. The efficient automatic use and allocation of production slots more than makes up for temporarily tying resources into the queue. Terran production is most forgiving with the timing of the production button presses.
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