Sweet Summer Mafia

On June 07 2024 12:32 rsoultin wrote:
-_- The baby is up so so early today geez.

On June 07 2024 13:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:

This, Trfel, is why i gave town points for rsoultin.
It would be very easy read for mafia to make (even on a partner), just because "happy to play = town", which ofc is bullshit.

Now based on MY view of your "relationship with rsoultin in mafia games", she might have even made that read as mafia.

On June 07 2024 15:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:

yes, agreed.

I think i know who you are.

On June 07 2024 17:05 Mocsta wrote:
*filter starts*

Hi
On plane about to take off.
I'm surprised by quant of posts and even more so that peoples essence is bringing back such strong memories. Pretty cool.

Have skim read. Trfel stood out to me as sentiment over a few posts felt forced / overly processed%. Not sure if that's his meta though. Certainly not a scum claim. Also felt a little similar with rsoultin.

On June 07 2024 19:27 Trfel wrote:
Yeah idk. The more I think about this (plus his previous post where he says he doesn't like Vivax) the more I am suspicious.

If Kelsi3r doesn't know what AlphaZero's point about scott31337 means with regards to scott31337's alignment, that should lead to there being less reason to townread AlphaZero (and also anyone else) for this reasoning, no? Of course you don't always have to agree with someone's reasoning to think it makes them look towny, but it certainly helps. Furthermore, I could understand it better if he just said that it made AlphaZero look better, since they were the first to clearly lay out that line of thinking. But to add on that rsoultin looks good, purely for agreeing, when Kelsi3r himself doesn't even know if the point means anything for scott31337's alignment? Seems out of place.

And to add, the only person he said he didn't like, Vivax, also commented on this kind of idea. Vivax didn't put scott31337's posts in contrast like AlphaZero did, but he (rightfully) pointed out that one of scott31337's posts in question didn't make a ton of sense. It wasn't exactly the same idea, but it was somewhat similar, and this was (presumably) enough to make AlphaZero say that Vivax looks town. Kelsi3r seems to have ignored this entirely, however?

New top suspect, I think.

On June 07 2024 22:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:

Thinking HF.

On June 07 2024 22:37 Mocsta wrote:

I retracted later

On June 07 2024 22:38 marvellosity wrote:

No, you said he improved. So the original posts must remain. What were they?

On June 07 2024 22:53 Mocsta wrote:

Twas reading his filter

Nothing comes to mind in the same way which aligns with my retraction to be fair. I suspect it was related to his flow in the early game. I found it disjointed when read as a thread.

On June 07 2024 23:03 sandroba wrote:
Trfel so far seems overly friendly and lighthearted in his tone, and employing an overuse of smiley faces which should definitely be criminalized in this town. It's different from the past 2 games we played where he was town.

On June 07 2024 23:07 Mocsta wrote:

Lol

Talk about gaslighting

Call me mafia and ignore *my* questions to elucidate

Wonder who is more likely to gaslight between town and mafia.....

On June 07 2024 23:14 AlphaZero wrote:


Careful, that could be considered a mild nitpick Marv.

On June 07 2024 23:18 sandroba wrote:
So far I like rayn and trfel as town.

On June 08 2024 00:25 marvellosity wrote:

So what was the point of your comment on Trfel?!

On June 08 2024 00:34 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Noone masoned me and ism sad because i think everyone has posted.

On June 08 2024 01:18 marvellosity wrote:
I actually agreed with sand’s take on kelsier (sort of as a response to Scott here)

When I read mocstas vote on kelsier “you’re being intentionally obtuse”, I just thought well that’s a townie trait if ever I heard one

On June 08 2024 02:30 rsoultin wrote:
also tbc truffle looks good now <3 doesn't mean i don't want credit pfft

marv i like that seems like the easiest read ever but whatevs, the pounce on sandy gave my good vibes even if he later got the dumbs and backed off over a kelsier townread

On June 08 2024 07:15 rsoultin wrote:


fair i suppose, what do you think of him now?

On June 08 2024 02:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Well at least i found one true town in rsoultin.
Best read so dar.

On June 08 2024 07:37 marvellosity wrote:

Based on your well known excellent read of her, as you yourself mentioned?

On June 08 2024 03:03 raynpelikoneet wrote:

I mean i really really hate this post.

On June 08 2024 07:46 Trfel wrote:
Talk to me marvellosity, I'm pretty sure raynpelikoneet and I are seeing the same thing.

Unless we aren't, in which I guess I'm just really stupid. But still talk to me, because I still have an issue with your post. Just, you know, talk to raynpelikoneet too I guess.

On June 08 2024 07:47 AlphaZero wrote:


Do you really not get it?

On June 08 2024 07:48 Trfel wrote:
I just put it in the post right above? #503?

On June 08 2024 07:40 Trfel wrote:
The argument isn't really about rsoultin's filter, it's that rsoultin's last post at the time in question was about halfway down page 8 of the thread.

I don't understand what you are expecting her, or anyone for that matter, to say, at that point in the thread when there is so little actual information to work with?

On June 08 2024 07:56 Trfel wrote:
I mean I guess it depends on your standards for post quality by mid page 8. To me, there wasn't a ton worth deeply analyzing, just the scott31337 thing and maybe a small raynpelikoneet thing if you care about that.

On June 08 2024 08:00 AlphaZero wrote:


I think it’s just Rayn that thinks that 😜

On June 08 2024 04:07 Trfel wrote:
Having second thoughts about marvellosity. I think I do actually want to pursue this after all.So marvellosity agreed with me that Kelsi3r's logic didn't make sense, but then still includes Kelsi3r in the "town" category because Mocsta said he was being obtuse and that's a town trait?

Reading through marvellosity's filter, I do still like that he acknowledged my point on Kelsi3r, and I like his line of questioning to Mocsta about his read change on me (Trfel). But he hasn't done really anything else of substance? It looks like his top suspects are scott31337 and Mocsta, and other than putting scott31337 at the bottom of his list post, he hasn't even mentioned him.

Just feels uncharacteristically disjointed. I don't get the impression that he is looking for mafia, and I don't get the impression that he cares enough about his (few) thoughts to remember them later.

On June 08 2024 04:20 Trfel wrote:
Yes but he didn't do anything?

His mafia reads are scott31337, who he didn't even mention, and Mocsta, who he did ask a question or two to. It doesn't look like uninvested town marvellosity to me, it looks like he doesn't actually care about finding mafia.

Even uninterested town marvellosity would remember his thoughts for later. He wouldn't have many thoughts, but he would still care about the thoughts he did have.

On June 08 2024 04:36 raynpelikoneet wrote:
slam town btw

On June 08 2024 05:17 raynpelikoneet wrote:

fuck it i actually think Oats is town here.

On June 08 2024 07:04 rsoultin wrote:
ehhhh nah i'm still not feeling marv. it would be super fun to lynch a scum marv throwing shade at me, but i can't get over that breezy playful tone

On June 08 2024 08:25 AlphaZero wrote:
Phew I have put in some work today.

On June 08 2024 08:26 AlphaZero wrote:
Now I just need to figure out trfel if he joins the circle town could be unstoppable.

On June 08 2024 08:20 Trfel wrote:
I guess you're describing Vivax's tinfoily-ness?

I mean yeah, posting an unsubstantiated townread isn't the most compelling, but to be honest I thought it was common for people to have little/no explanation for early townreads?

Like I don't see anything amazing in Vivax's filter, it's kinda meh imo. I do like that he commented on AlphaZero dropping his scumread on scott31337 (I don't agree that this is what AlphaZero did, but I think it's reasonable for Vivax to think and believe this and I think it shows that he's paying attention, even if imo he got it wrong). I don't really understand how he can townread marvellosity so easily, and imo he could definitely have more quality/content. I'm not seeing much reason to lynch him though, his posting is a little underwhelming but not coming across as mafia motivated to me.

By all means do your thing, if you have more specific things I should look at I'm happy to take a look at them and I definitely could be missing stuff. I'm just not seeing it at a glance.

---

It's just an impression I got, I could absolutely be wrong. Maybe it was just rsoultin being really vocal. Don't really care enough to check.

---

Sorry Vivax, hope you feel better soon

---

@marvellosity, I definitely could be wrong, that's just my attempt to understand your perspective. Even if I'm not very good at it I don't see an alternative to trying?

Also about Mocsta, are you referring to this?

On June 08 2024 08:33 AlphaZero wrote:


Yea, especially when it’s pointed out.

On June 08 2024 08:43 Mocsta wrote:

It's possible the lack of attraction is association with me

On June 08 2024 08:49 AlphaZero wrote:
Scott not considering the game state with my vivax read and what it means about my alignment is the second scummiest thing that happened this game.

The first being Scott’s opening posts.

Town circle activate!

On June 08 2024 09:10 Trfel wrote:
Not really sure what to say.

I don't know what to think of scott31337, he looks suspicious but I feel like I've mislynched him a million times and I'm not sure if this game is any different I was trying to mess with him to change something and let me get a read on him but it didn't really work. Maybe I should see if the discrepancies in his posts are mafia motivated? I guess that makes sense?

Idon't think the early thing about masons/whisperers/whatever had much mafia motivation. It's clumsy, but honestly it strikes me more as clumsy than scummy.

I actually kinda liked scott31337's post on AlphaZero. Not that I agree with it, but I think it's a reasonable perspective for scott31337 to have as town? I don't know why he would do this as mafia, I guess I doubt he'd have the confidence? I could definitely be wrong, but like, scott31337 brought up an original argument. That's pretty neat. Even if it's (imo) a bad argument, I'm still pleasantly surprised

So yeah, I kinda don't want to lynch scott31337. Could absolutely be wrong, it's far from the worst lynch ever, but I don't find the arguments super compelling given the context.

---

Don't really want to lynch sandroba either unless something changes, either in his play or in my read. His play hasn't been super inspiring or anything imo, but I don't think that makes him mafia. Maybe if we keep waiting and this doesn't change I could start to see it but we haven't even been playing for 24 hours, I don't think it's reasonable to hold him to super high standards at this time. If he did something scummy that'd be different, but a lack of super towny stuff doesn't make him mafia imo.

---

I guess I'll just wait and hope that either people re-evaluate Kelsi3r or I'm wrong (which is pretty likely tbh, I have no idea how to find mafia on day 1 especially, my reads tend to be more accurate when flipped upside down). So maybe it's a good thing that no one agrees XD

On June 08 2024 09:15 rsoultin wrote:
or easy lynchbait

On June 08 2024 09:16 rsoultin wrote:
so like, in the world of you and az...viva and scott are both scum

i mean i guess it's possible but such an early buss feels strange?

On June 08 2024 09:18 rsoultin wrote:
i mean nothing's easier than policy lynching plus catching someone on a so-called objective inconsistency

On June 08 2024 09:20 rsoultin wrote:


i mean sure but you were ready to lynch him two seconds before az called scott so like...what changed?

On June 08 2024 09:22 rsoultin wrote:


az's gotcha moment

On June 08 2024 09:24 rsoultin wrote:
okay obviously i need to explain

isn't the crux of the push on scott

1) he opened with setup discussion = mafia = policy lynch
2) he asked how masons are towny then explained how masons are towny = objectively inconsistent

On June 08 2024 09:22 marvellosity wrote:

When was I??

On June 08 2024 10:21 rsoultin wrote:


lol same regarding rayn

well az reminds me of another player whose scum game consists of buddying top townies (and by this i mean the 'good players' the community here generally listens to) and crawling so far up their asses he goes under the radar. idk that this is the same player but the interchange with marv is giving me those vibes. tbc marv is good, but i guess i mean the people who have the most pull if people are reading them town

now i don't know that az's the same person or not so that's not reason enough to scumread him at all. but his view of the game also isn't aligning with mine on several fronts so those two things together earns him the rayn tier of i don't fucking know. i'm hoping if he's town that'll become clear in further discussion lol ><

On June 08 2024 10:51 Trfel wrote:
My main worry with Kelsi3r is that I worry I just bullied him out of the thread. Which wasn't my intention at all, but I could see the possibility of him taking it that way.

I don't really think any other lynch makes sense right now though?

I'm conflicted/unsure about Oatsmaster, a lot of people think he is town though. I'm hesitant to lynch scott31337. I think die_meatbaby, Alakaslam, sandroba, marvellosity, and Vivax would benefit from more time. Mocsta too, but I think it's a little easier to read him.

It's a combination of Kelsi3r looking really suspicious and no one else looking like a sensible lynch target. Lynching scott31337 wouldn't be the worst thing in the world I guesssss but it would be very far from ideal imo.

---

What part do you want me to explain? People haven't talked about suspecting AlphaZero very much so far. Most of what people have shared is that they are inclined to think they are town, tbh. So I think it's pretty ambitious to expect people's minds to change that dramatically, that quickly. Like, it takes time for discussion to happen and for people to share ideas. Also, it's typical to lynch a less active/involved player on Day 1, it's not a rule, it's just much more common. AlphaZero doesn't fit that mold. Those things combined make me think that realistically, AlphaZero is extremely unlikely to be lynched today, so with the deadline coming up, I'd rather start to focus on people who are more realistic targets.

On June 08 2024 12:58 Mocsta wrote:
awww man, i dont even understand why im not fitting in
woe is me

i haven't engaged with vivax because i find his playstyle really polarising which is not conducive to scumhunting.. to be fair with vivax i really need other people to make cases that i can then internalise

scott thats a fair call. i do have on my agenda to review now that he has more content which is what i was waiting for..
i was left underwhelmed with his posts when i caught up but did get a spider sense tingle from it. (i.e. underwhelmed beucase of stringing together BS)

the player that makes me uncomfortable in the pit of my stomach is AZ, so hes my top scum read.. again. i dont have it as an agenda to push today for reasons i have already stated and are unchanged.

will do a deep dive review on scott later today and i want to re-read sandroba

people i am not open to lynching today are:
oats, trfel, rsoultin, rayn, marv..

i didnt include az as if there was a wagon i would be all over that.

On June 08 2024 17:35 marvellosity wrote:

Sorry if I missed it previously, but what is your case beyond the ick?

On June 08 2024 15:37 Trfel wrote:
But that doesn't make sense

On June 08 2024 15:52 Trfel wrote:
I guess I just can't get over this Oatsmaster thing. Everyone says he's town, I've looked as hard as I can and I've explained my thoughts and no one says anything? I get that I'm probably just being bad but it's hard for me to be less bad if people don't help me understand their perspective?

Like I put in the effort to explain where I am coming from, I'd really appreciate a bit of help on this one. How should I be approaching this, if my current approach isn't good?

On June 08 2024 17:03 Trfel wrote:
I'm actually strangely okay with not lynching scott31337? Which kinda shocks me, I never thought I'd see the day. I'm confused about how he puts Oatsmaster in the "do not lynch today" category and just a bit later is throwing shade on Oatsmaster and is disappointed in (I think) raynpelikoneet and sandroba townreading Oatsmaster. Not very significant but it's the main thing that sticks out to me at this point?

Raynpelikoneet post #177 is confusing me, in my tired state I am having a hard time understanding what he is referring to. Also I'm a little confused why he strongly disagreed with me about Kelsi3r and then I pushed back and he said he agreed? I didn't really say anything new, just tried to rephrase it to make it more clear, I guess I'm
just surprised that that actually made a difference tbh. No real reasons to suspect him though.

Raynpelikoneet said he was going to be busy today so he would need to figure things out early but idk if he did that? He seemed mostly uninterested in the scott31337 stuff and back and forth on the Kelsi3r stuff. I don't actually know who he thinks is mafia, which is very much against what I expect from raynpelikoneet (regardless of alignment).

Honestly that might be worth some thinking. Raynpelikoneet with one of the longest, if not the longest, filters in the game, and seemingly no scumreads? I'm confused, but I'm not so confident in raynpelikoneet being town anymore. Actually pretty suspicious.

Mocsta and marvellosity look okay enough for now I think. Unfortunately I am not a Vivax whisperer, would love to understand all these incredible reads he has but I am not seeing what he is getting at. Oh well, what can I do

On June 08 2024 17:43 Mocsta wrote:
Not you.
Have read your filter and like how you picked yourself up from all the mason/neighbour discussion in particular examining multiple players which from your situation I assume.tonbe more town likely than mafia.

I'm slightly concerned kelsi3r could be a bad townie vote > mafia.. just because the way the wagon is building is a bit odd.. limited buy in (even though majority so far) and also no resistance.. it's possible wagons will take off in final two hours so meh??

On June 08 2024 17:48 Mocsta wrote:
well you've been building that since yesterday

We are both here. Let's chat

My head space has been outputted in past couple posts. Where do we go from here?

Btw. I believe people do change however you used to read me pretty good and go against grain to back me. I'm not scum calling you or being butthurt. More confused than anything hopefully chat helps that both ways.

On June 08 2024 17:55 Mocsta wrote:
ohh haha.. well I know there was a game I was mafia and took you to the end so that's fair

Funny how objective reality distorts through each user!

Copy copy

I know what Scott asked me and that I didn't answer directly

If I had mayor vote. I would drop AZ

If I could lead a wagon I would consider kelsier/dmb

If I wanted to take a gamble I would drop Rayn.

I have to read sandroba / slam although I haven't been concerned by them to date

I have not seen anything else I want to sheep at this point although recognize my current cred means I need to 🐑

On June 08 2024 18:11 Mocsta wrote:
for real.. my vote is in kelsier mate
.that's a disappointing response form you.
I extended an olive branch too

On June 08 2024 17:43 Mocsta wrote:
Not you.
Have read your filter and like how you picked yourself up from all the mason/neighbour discussion in particular examining multiple players which from your situation I assume.tonbe more town likely than mafia.

I'm slightly concerned kelsi3r could be a bad townie vote > mafia.. just because the way the wagon is building is a bit odd.. limited buy in (even though majority so far) and also no resistance.. it's possible wagons will take off in final two hours so meh??

On June 08 2024 12:58 Mocsta wrote:
awww man, i dont even understand why im not fitting in
woe is me

i haven't engaged with vivax because i find his playstyle really polarising which is not conducive to scumhunting.. to be fair with vivax i really need other people to make cases that i can then internalise

scott thats a fair call. i do have on my agenda to review now that he has more content which is what i was waiting for..
i was left underwhelmed with his posts when i caught up but did get a spider sense tingle from it. (i.e. underwhelmed beucase of stringing together BS)

the player that makes me uncomfortable in the pit of my stomach is AZ, so hes my top scum read.. again. i dont have it as an agenda to push today for reasons i have already stated and are unchanged.

will do a deep dive review on scott later today and i want to re-read sandroba

people i am not open to lynching today are:
oats, trfel, rsoultin, rayn, marv..

i didnt include az as if there was a wagon i would be all over that.

On June 08 2024 18:33 Mocsta wrote:
all can. It's a personality driven thing my dude

On June 08 2024 18:28 Mocsta wrote:
None of those apply to me

Ignoring mason neighbour thing since he has since fully dropped it

Rest of filter looks like active hunting to me

I don't care he buddies to me. As town or Mafia it fits how the thread has shaped.

I think he pulled up some interesting posts. He has no such limited cred can't start a wagon either so that's pretty much max output he can do as a townie.

Would he do that as mafia? I genuinely don't think so.

On June 08 2024 19:05 Mocsta wrote:
you know there was a post before you said.. it works both ways.. scum marv is too smart to do that as well

same with the fit in comment.. scum mocsta definitely wouldnt throw that out there

i hear what you are saying, doesnt change both need to fit in. for me the weighting is a bit stronger cos i have a big ego

On June 08 2024 19:16 Mocsta wrote:
different type of dominance trait. regardless. i dont think this helps solve the game

if you are genuinely curious can talk about it more post game.

On June 08 2024 19:33 Trfel wrote:
Thanks for taking the time. I guess I didn't even see a ton of Oatsmaster bringing up the same things, I can try and look again though.

@marvellosity, I think Mocsta is easier to read than several other players this game due to a combination of activity and unique thoughts. He's been present and involved and has been very willing to provide his own take, which often differs from that of everyone else and the thread consensus. I think this gives a lot of extra information with which we can figure out his alignment more easily.

Also, someone asked about die_meatbaby's meta, I'm far from an expert but I would say her play matches my expectations close enough. That doesn't mean she is town or mafia necessarily, but this is the kind of play I was expecting. With the Vivax focus, paranoia of influential players, hesitance to commit to early reads, etc.

Kinda confused about what these last 2-3 pages were about but I'm too lazy/sleepy to go to my computer and actually figure it out, oh well Too lazy to visit the links Mocsta brought up about scott31337, can someone tell me if it makes sense or not?

Happy to talk about most anything, but prefer to talk about Kelsi3r or Oatsmaster.

On June 08 2024 19:56 AlphaZero wrote:
Couple of thoughts after Mocsta interactions

- it seems to me like he is drawing conclusions and then making really terrible justifications for them rather than acting with a curious and open mind to determine alignments

- it seems to me he is cautious and almost apologetic when pushing me, despite being his 2nd? Largest scum read. Tracks as mafia lynching town, not as town who thinks they have got a lead on mafia.

- his reasoning and justifications are awful and nonsensical.

the problem I am having is I do t know why he would play like this as either alignment.

- option 1 he is tying himself up into knots because he is pushing mafia agenda

-option 2 he is town and he legitimately thinks these things.

I view option 1 more likely through my lens of how the game should be played, and what is reasonable to expect from town and mafia.

It seems trfel thinks the other option would be more likely.

I’d just like to get some more thoughts itt about this.

On June 08 2024 19:58 marvellosity wrote:

I think this is a nigh on perfect summary. Well done

On June 08 2024 20:00 Oatsmaster wrote:

It’s not that he’s calling you town specifically. It’s just a complete nonsensical train of thought from a town player to open the way vivax did and then try to appear random and “townie” by throwing out random townreads

On June 08 2024 20:03 Trfel wrote:
Maybe I'm being stupid but what I meant was more that Mocsta has provided more information with which to get a read on him, one way or another. As in, there shouldn't be many null reads on Mocsta imo, the information is there, just up to people to interpret it. I feel like his posting is polarizing, depending on how you interpret it it is solidly town or solidly mafia, but just hard to get a null interpretation.

On June 08 2024 20:13 Oatsmaster wrote:

Stop stealing my ideas

On June 08 2024 08:38 Mocsta wrote:
aawwwwww

Mate. I probably shouldn't have posted my first post
Game started at 10 for me and earliest chance I had to read was 4 sitting on plane

In short hectic mad day and I was so excited to make intro post for first time.in maybe 6years.. I see the length of the game and was like wtf I dont have time.to do this before take.off and lose reception.

Quickly skim and rsoultin and trfel.poats were the ones where my mind just disconnected from. Could not engage

So put it out there to just have out it out there

I wouldn't say the post content was forced because it's how I felt at that moment, although the sentiment that I needed to post something , yes was forced

It's also part of why I retracted once I landed and read thoroughly

On June 08 2024 20:18 marvellosity wrote:

This is his explanation for the stuff I picked up on with regards to your early posting.

I understand that people make mistakes (especially early) but do I buy this? Is it the right sort of mistake? Is it the sort of mistake town makes?

It’s not carelessness, it’s a characterisation of your posts as forced/contrived.

It’s difficult tbh.

On June 08 2024 20:30 AlphaZero wrote:


If this is the case Rso is an order of magnitude more likely than Rayn in a Scott/mocsta/ xxx world

On June 08 2024 20:34 Trfel wrote:
Hmm, honestly I didn't view this as a mistake. Maybe that's my error. But a lot of people expressed a similar sentiment regarding my early posting, unless I am missing something I don't think his claim itself was unreasonable at all.

There is the part where he wasn't able to back it up with evidence upon request. It's a little strange, heck I bet I could go into my filter and fabricate the explanation in question, but I actually think it's maybe more likely to come from town. Possibilities:
- Mocsta is town, and due to a few combined factors (plane flight/setting change, me posting more and him getting a more meaningful read on me which quite possibly colors his perception of previous posts), didn't read the earlier posts the same way
- Mocsta is mafia, and instead of forcing an explanation, gave it up. Like, if it was me and I was mafia there, I'm 10000% giving a forced explanation there, even if I can't remember what I was initially thinking I'm gonna make something up. I would never back down there. Maybe Mocsta is just a different player from me but I don't actually see the mafia motivation for this? The claim is too vague and easy to provide fake reasoning for, honestly if he's mafia I think he took a much harder route by backing down from it.

On June 08 2024 20:36 AlphaZero wrote:


You can add slam in there too somewhere I think.

On June 08 2024 20:39 Trfel wrote:
Raynpelikoneet, rsoultin, sandroba, maybe even AlphaZero?

And sure, Mocsta said it was a mistake, but I disagree

I think it's more likely that his perspective changed, causing him to interpret the same posts in a different way. I mean if you want to call that a mistake then sure, I wouldn't say that though.

On June 08 2024 20:50 AlphaZero wrote:


Why do you sound disappointed by that?

On June 08 2024 20:52 rsoultin wrote:
Cause now i have to try and convince someone objectively scummy =/= scum and thats exhausting

On June 08 2024 20:57 Trfel wrote:
I guess even if they said different things, I interpreted the things people said to be coming from the same place/caused by the same things. Specifically, I was playing at a band concert and thus was on my phone and it was the start of the game and I was joking around and messing with people instead of actually playing the game. Eventually, I got home to my computer and there was more to talk about, and so this changed. People pointed out different things about the initial playstyle, but unless you can explain why some of those claims are more or less valid than others, I am not sure what you are getting at.

On June 08 2024 21:00 Mocsta wrote:
last post before date night.. life with kids gotta priortise! rsoultin must understand surely!

i have accepted your interpretation, although disagree in particular about a closed mind. i reckon you are confirmation biased here, i mean, yes i have been firm on you up to past couple pages, yet, at least in my mind have been open about discussing points. disagreeing about a conclusion is not the same as close minded because without anything new introduced, why would the outcome change?

i can understand my push on you is unusual. im pretty sure i would find it weird too. i'm very certain my pushes on you are all in response to people, again, i think thats significant. we made
'peace' yesterday and i wasn't intentionally trying to break it. im very certain oats was pushing for my az reasoning so i said fuck it

wont know until flips mate. although yes, im not an analytical player at the best of times so im ok with you stating this. doesnt make me mafia though unless its being used to push mafia agenda,, now this, i dont see you substantiate and again you would need flips to support.

i suppose one thing i ON'T like here in option 1 is.. you dont call me mafia.. you say im pushing mafia agenda

ironicaly i didnt realise this when i wrote about mafia agenda above btw.. i still think the purpose of this post aligns with town piecing together puzzles so its not a negative for me. i think it more points out subconsciously you know option 2 is true, and just dont want to admit it outloud.. its ok mate. i went through the same with you

for the record im equally active as mafia and town. i have *never* been called up for 'moc-logic' as mafia, again, i cant expect you to acknowledge or recognise that.. i guess the only thing i can ask here is.. what is my tone saying across these posts to you and marv. internally i feel mentally the same responding start of day and now, so hopefully you see that too

On June 08 2024 21:08 Trfel wrote:
Sure? I think it depends on the situation though, no? Like it's possible that there are things in the details that are off and maybe it means something, and it's possible that there aren't?

I'm sorry I'm not trying to be obnoxious, I just don't actually understand what you are getting at.It seems that your point is that this post doesn't have basis?

On June 08 2024 21:09 marvellosity wrote:

Yes but let’s leave it for now.

On June 08 2024 21:13 Trfel wrote:
I don't want to lynch raynpelikoneet today anyway. He already said his activity is limited this cycle, it seems extremely stupid to come up with reasons to suspect him after he has to leave and then lynch him before he gets a chance to respond. Like, why would we do that?

If someone could please say something that makes sense, I'd really appreciate it, this past hour has driven me absolutely insane.

On June 08 2024 21:15 Trfel wrote:
Was more talking to others than you, and also the two paragraphs weren't related, sorry if that came off more aggressively than I meant.

On June 08 2024 21:25 Trfel wrote:
If someone asks me about something I'm most likely going to respond. You're going to have to deal with it.

On June 08 2024 22:43 marvellosity wrote:
So I’ve reread kelsier. Didn’t take long tbh.

Like it’s obviously not great that he didn’t do much. But I’m struggling to get excited about Trfel’s AZ/rsoultin angle in much the same way Trfel didn’t come with me on Mocsta.

Tonally the dgaf is somewhat town.

Bit crapshooty. Need more please

On June 08 2024 22:43 marvellosity wrote:
So I’ve reread kelsier. Didn’t take long tbh.

Like it’s obviously not great that he didn’t do much. But I’m struggling to get excited about Trfel’s AZ/rsoultin angle in much the same way Trfel didn’t come with me on Mocsta.

Tonally the dgaf is somewhat town.

Bit crapshooty. Need more please

On June 08 2024 22:54 Trfel wrote:
I guess I have a hard time matching Kelsi3r's attitude with his productiveness. If he got irritated or frustrated and left that's somewhat understandable, for some reason that's not the interpretation I have though? Maybe I am being biased here though.

On June 08 2024 23:00 Trfel wrote:
Like, he says "you need to drop this"....

If he's not going to play, why do I need to drop it, right?

"You're being obnoxious" and then afk is much more understandable.

Also accusing me of lying, right after pointing out things I did that he thought were towny, and right before leaving... Like if I am lying, then I am mafia, and he should want to get me lynched?

I just can't put together a mindset that makes it make sense. Any one thing, sure, but not the overall picture.

On June 08 2024 23:04 Trfel wrote:
For #2, I thought about that, it's maybe possible but I have no idea how I'd verify this. I don't think it's dramatically different from scott31337's other games. More like, same but better, as opposed to a major contrast.

#1 is subjective and depends on 8+ year old memory so it's very difficult to explain. But he made a list post, even if most of it was "this person is playing like they do as town so they are town" or "this person is playing like they do as mafia so they are mafia." And he actually looked at AlphaZero's filter and made a conclusion from it. That's pretty special, above the level I was expecting.

On June 08 2024 23:02 marvellosity wrote:

This is a fair point

On June 08 2024 23:59 Vivax wrote:
Tinfoil theory: It's rayn, Slam and marv because rayn and slam so far have had suspicions on marv when nobody else had and they want to annoy him with the soft busses.

On June 09 2024 00:07 Oatsmaster wrote:
##unvote
I’ll let vivax play

On June 08 2024 23:59 Mocsta wrote:
One tidbit with rsoultin

My last game here I think was with her and I was mafia and buddied her. Maybe she forgot? But I'm like surprised she has ignored all the chatter on me and tunneled sandroba

Like I recall that game her being both super collaborative and also quite paranoid. I'm not seeing any of that this game. I don't believe sporadic activity is a satisfactory answer

Rsoultin, what is your read on me ?

I'm not claiming a meta read here as it's a one off experience..

On June 09 2024 02:02 rsoultin wrote:


scott looks like scummy town cause i like where his fucking head's at and oddly enough the bullshit about the setup is so not compelling to me at all

it's like you guys want to ignore the entire filters of people to nitpick one or two things to 'make' someone scum or 'make' someone town instead of taking into account overall play, and i guess that's where i differ from everyone else

kelsier got mad. he could've gotten mad as scum or town just as genuinely. look at the rest of the filter and tell me how you can townread that guy

meanwhile scott's at least doing his own thing over there while everyone's shitting kittens. he was seeing the game a lot closer to the way i was

On June 09 2024 02:07 rsoultin wrote:


because i literally asked him who he wanted to lynch and i wasn't in his pile?

On June 09 2024 02:12 rsoultin wrote:


Eh fuck off

On June 09 2024 03:33 Vivax wrote:
I realize marv could take that as offensive but I wouldn‘t bring such a joke towards marv, just rayn cause I presume he‘d laugh it off.

Gonna put Oats on ignore now I realize he‘s just here to be a fun killer and manipulate me with shit like that.

God that infuriates me.

On June 09 2024 04:51 Oatsmaster wrote:
Marv do you still think Scott is the lynch today?

On June 09 2024 05:06 Vivax wrote:
I literally go red and start fuming it's like I'm allergic to bull

On June 09 2024 05:46 scott31337 wrote:


This is defintely on my mind as well...



What kind of rainbows would you like to see?



This was something I noted as well, and one of the reasons I would like to lynch Kelsi3r for the time being. He has not posted since you wrote this message either.



The timing was AZ going after me and changing his vote to someone else. This would be better read in context (post link) instead of filter. I still am lost about the "Vivax read" stuff.



What town agenda is this from? It's extremely rare you find two mafia D1. And I know I'm town. Like to me posting this is just muddying the waters and shitting in it.

On June 09 2024 08:55 Grackaroni wrote:
Day One Vote Count

Kelsi3r (7): Mocsta, scott31337, Trfel, rsoultin, Oatsmaster, Vivax, Oatsmaster, die_meatbaby
scott31337 (3): sandroba, marvellosity, AlphaZero, Vivax
raynpelikoneet (0): Oatsmaster
Vivax (0): Oatsmaster, AlphaZero
Mocsta (0): Vivax
Trfel (0): scott31337

Not Voting (3): Alakaslam, raynpelikoneet, Kelsi3r

With 7 votes, Kelsi3r is currently set to be lynched!

The deadline is Sunday, Jun 09 2:00am GMT (GMT+00:00), which is in

On June 09 2024 09:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Im sorry i thought i had some time today, i dont.
##vote Kelsi3r

On June 09 2024 09:09 rsoultin wrote:
my shitty meta paranoid reason for not liking rayn this game is he always seems to find something i've said that's just too stupid to possibly come from town when he's town!rayn and my subjective perception is he doesn't do this as much as scum

but also if i mislynched rayn d1 while he's gone i'd feel like shit :/

On June 09 2024 09:18 Mocsta wrote:
one underlying issue i have with scott is that

when he was getting heat and i backed him, he made some posts that soft buddied to me.. which i thought was completely reasonable if town.

my issue therefore is that, as my read with AZ has shifted and evolved, hes not paid attention (publicly at least) to it.. no comments or impact on scotts AZ read is very weird to me.

now scott says hes completely up to date, so its been read, and apparently not relevant - so again. i find this super super weird and struggling to identify how town would do that.

On June 09 2024 09:23 scott31337 wrote:



This is a reasonable post until you get to the last paragraph.

Are you seriously going this way?

On June 09 2024 10:18 scott31337 wrote:



What the fuck is this?

I mean, scott31337 is player number 4, Kelsi3r is player number 10, we could compromise and lynch player number 7, so raynpelikoneet? XD

On June 09 2024 10:23 Mocsta wrote:
yeah but can lynch kelsi3r without you switching wagons??

On June 09 2024 10:25 marvellosity wrote:
Why is rayn not voting with me and sand? And me specifically?

On June 09 2024 10:34 scott31337 wrote:


Who are the other two mafia besides me in your/Marvellosity's world?

On June 09 2024 10:34 scott31337 wrote:


Who are the other two mafia besides me in your/Marvellosity's world?

On June 09 2024 10:40 Mocsta wrote:
hes tried

i genuinely dont think thats a fair assessment.

On June 09 2024 10:44 Vivax wrote:


At most he‘s been berating the approach of a bunch of town imo. Him ponting out the rsoultin part doesn‘t help anyone in getting Scott lynched.

If you want to be convincing you have to speak directly. Not walk past people and ramble (I‘m a bit of a hypocrite on this one cause I may have too much faith in them listening)

On June 09 2024 10:44 scott31337 wrote:




There's way more involved than that.

I'm here for any more questions.

On June 09 2024 10:58 scott31337 wrote:


I really want you to be town and I need a town friend tomorrow - Are you?

On June 09 2024 11:08 scott31337 wrote:
Think strategically as town

Who will they shoot

Usually the wisest - or the one who's on to the mafia track

I'll chat more tomorrow

On June 09 2024 11:21 AlphaZero wrote:


I don’t think so. I think mafia lynched the town wagon. Explains why I couldn’t get any traction and the weird votes without explanation on kels.

On June 09 2024 11:22 Oatsmaster wrote:

Nah if he’s mafia it’s ez

On June 09 2024 11:36 die_meatbaby wrote:

explain pls

On June 09 2024 11:39 scott31337 wrote:


This could be wifom but could be realistic

Rsoul was townie leaning still to me.

I'm unsure what else to say until D2 to be honest.

On June 09 2024 11:39 scott31337 wrote:


This could be wifom but could be realistic

Rsoul was townie leaning still to me.

I'm unsure what else to say until D2 to be honest.

On June 09 2024 11:45 die_meatbaby wrote:


I am not "surefire" convinced that scott is town. I just think that he is less likley mafia and that on d1 mafia pushed two town wagons to be safe for the next lynch as well. So I rather take a look on who pushed that wagons the most or who started it, votecounts etc.

On June 09 2024 11:48 scott31337 wrote:


Who's your top three mafia?

On June 09 2024 11:48 scott31337 wrote:


I do get what you are saying,.

If rsoul mafia - then she knows both wagons are town
Rsoul in my experience plays well as both alignments (But this is eight years ago, never looked into other games)

I wouldn't say she was surefire convinced, but she was understanding where I was coming from. Mosata (sp) was at the beginning as well.

I'd rather spend more energy tomorrow though.

On June 09 2024 11:49 die_meatbaby wrote:


you are not the only drunk here.
I am a bit drunk
Vivax is even drunker
and you are probably the drunkest

On June 09 2024 11:51 Oatsmaster wrote:

I don’t really like how alphazero seems to hard hard townread me then get sketched out by me voting for kel especially because it seems like he really agrees with my reads

On June 09 2024 11:52 scott31337 wrote:


Why would town marv say this?

On June 09 2024 11:53 Vivax wrote:


Scott being scum wouldn’t exclude rsoul being scum, how do you get to think that ?

On June 09 2024 11:54 Oatsmaster wrote:

I’m not getting night killed

On June 09 2024 11:52 scott31337 wrote:


Why would town marv say this?