EPTSurvivor is dumb because it's boring, best play is just to claim survivor and afk for the rest of the game as neither faction really gains anything from lynching you (especially town), which is dumb. It's like someone gave you a role where you cannot post at all, only vote - and only once / day. What's the point?
[N] TL Mafia LXXV - Page 5
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
Survivor is dumb because it's boring, best play is just to claim survivor and afk for the rest of the game as neither faction really gains anything from lynching you (especially town), which is dumb. It's like someone gave you a role where you cannot post at all, only vote - and only once / day. What's the point? | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38799 Posts
The role survivor is fine. It isn't the most flashy of roles but it's a fine role. Maybe it should come back green or black to checks. Or town should get a role cop. I am sure there are setups in which a survivor has its place. But maybe more in themed games in which there is also a SK. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22634 Posts
On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: If this is a closed standard setup. I am going to suggest some things. Cuz I can. And shall. Yay, koshi! On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - Count out the game but favor the town numbers a bit by adding extra vanilla's. And then modkill for inactivity till the end of N2. Another option is to not modkill for inactivity and give town the KP to deal with it. I think only extreme inactivity should be modkillable. If someone is making 2-3 posts per cycle town needs to have the time and tools to deal with him. On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - Make roles soft. Parity cop/tracker/watcher over cop. Vengeful/mad bomber over Vigi, or vigis that only shoot on even nights. Jailkeepers over docs if kp isn't delivered, otherwise docs over jailers. Avenger is probably actually townfavored (the vigi role that can only shoot if a townie was lynched) but is also a really good role. I actually have a pretty long list of custom roles in my storm mafia games that are weakened versions of other roles. Operator: Masons two people for the next cycle (not himself), useful to give a cop a mouthpiece, but also risky. Reanimator: Doctor that instead of saving someone, only prolongs their life one cycle Avenger: see above Combat Medic: Doctor who saves, but if he makes a save he has to stay with the wounded or they die. If they choose to save someone else, the initial target dies. if medic dies, target dies. "Doctor": A cop that takes a patient in, roleblocks him that night, then receives the alignment on day 3. Works as an odd night roleblocker/even night cop, with the caveat that it's always the same person on 1,2 and 3,4 etc The theme is generally to reduce the massive impact of blue roles, so the game is less swingy (in storm I do it because the game has like 8 blues usually). My doctors tend to prolong life instead of right out denying the mafia kp. My vigis tend to have limitations, my cops tend to get less than average amount of checks. Doing this also helps with not having to use many of the strongest mafia roles (framer, roleblocker, unaware miller etc) because they're not combating super strong blues. I agree with koshi, soft roles are great. On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - Fuck up "you-are-now-confirmed-town" night actions. Add unaware millers, add protective roles on mafia team (maybe jailer over rb, or just add a doc), give a framer/gf to the mafia team. The main thing is to add anti-claim roles. Mafia isn't fucked if one person becomes confirmed at night. The most difficult one to fight is a vigilante who can usually kinda confirm himself by making the extra nk. Adding mafia vigis or variations is often good for this reason. Main thing is, adding a role with the same name as town and mafia is a good idea, even if they don't even do the same thing. The "Doctor" above was the town role, while the mafia Doctor was literally just a normal doc. I don't really have a problem with a cop check being fairly reliable, especially if by day 4 or something town only has one or two of them. On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - If there are many blue roles, punish claiming by giving mafia an extra kp that only shoots blues, but only hits if that person claimed a blue role and is actually a blue role. It's a bit of a "dirty" role but should work. Claiming any blue role should make you eligible to get shot, but you only die if you are actually blue. Witch/Shitty Witch is an excellent role: Witch matches a player and a role and if correct, kills the player. Works better in setups with known role options. Shitty witch is the same but loses powers after night 0/1. It's exclusively to counter early blue claiming. Witch kills could be unblockable. On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - Mafia kp should start high and end low. Town kp should be 2 each cycle on average. Yes, it's super duper important to plan out mafia kp and game progression. Always do best case (all vigis shoot scum, all lynches on scum), worst case (same in the other direction) and realistic (most kills are town, but some hit mafia) case math to figure out if the game is close to balanced. Things I personally like but aren't standard: On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - Never modkill a person with +3 pages of content and who was active for 2 cycles. Even if he is mia for 4 cycles. Agree, just never modkill for inactivity really. On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - Do something during D3 to spike activity again. It should be known beforehand so there is no backseat modding ofc. Like mayor elections with double lynch or something. Dnu what. This is a great idea (and probably even more needed on like day 5, when mafia has killed all the townies who care and only people who don't try remain). However I'm not entirely sure what either. It's a difficult balance to strike (you can't just turn the game into another game like I did in Palmar's Purge...) On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: Assassins are usually better, but the trick is to remember they're essentially suicidal vanilla townies, so don't reduce mafia numbers for them. They do little to harm town (they want to look town so they scumhunt like a VT, they only have a single bullet so they won't shoot town, most likely). The only harm to town is that when they leave the game they reduce "town" numbers. They do harm mafia because they actually genuinely try to kill mafia with lynches, and they tend to deny mafia nks if targeted.- Assassins are stupid. SK and survivors are fine. The problem with SKs is that they become kingmakers way too often, massively favoring one side or the other. if an SK randomly shoots your roleblocker as scum you're so often fucked, not to mention if he eats up a NK too. Survivor is a stupid role. On June 07 2017 22:01 Koshi wrote: - Somehow force people to type 60 posts within the first 2 cycles. 5-10 posts (assuming they're at least 3-4 lines each) per cycle is fine for low activity players. It's not so much the amount, but rather that they're actually posting something other than "lol hi guys" into the thread. | ||
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Grackaroni
United States9857 Posts
Sorry that post was really long can we get a TLDR? | ||
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disformation
Germany8352 Posts
On June 08 2017 18:54 Grackaroni wrote: lol hi guys. Sorry that post was really long can we get a TLDR? 10/10 post I really like the ideas hoshi and plamar are discussing. so i would like it if 1eg/hats would take a look at those. like it get that the game is somewhat build around roles, but often times blues have a huge impact, which can be frustrating for both scum or the blue players. that being said I hope i just roll my fav. role of being a vt. game is way more interesting/frustrating if you have 0 clue wtf is going on. | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On June 08 2017 19:41 disformation wrote: I really like the ideas hoshi and plamar are discussing. so i would like it if 1eg/hats would take a look at those. like it get that the game is somewhat build around roles, but often times blues have a huge impact, which can be frustrating for both scum or the blue players. that being said I hope i just roll my fav. role of being a vt. game is way more interesting/frustrating if you have 0 clue wtf is going on. Like I haven't been lurking this thread already  I believe Onegu is closing signups soon, so I've been paying close attention. Koshi is using some sort of black magic to get inside of my mind on what a large normal setup should be + Show Spoiler + Well not really, we just have very similar views on game balance tbf. We'll obv take all ideas thrown up into consideration though, keep them coming. It's been ages since a large normal so we want to make this a good one. | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
I should also add that the more who join, the more room we have to work with things. If only I could magically teleport whiskey or wine to new signups... | ||
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annul
United States2841 Posts
On June 08 2017 20:31 Half the Sky wrote: It's been ages since a large normal so we want to make this a good one. 20 is large? what happened to TL mafia =( | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
SC2 ded gaem, no TL traffic? + Show Spoiler + At least I visited TL a lot more often when I still played SC2. | ||
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annul
United States2841 Posts
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ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
It's been far too long. | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On June 09 2017 07:01 ruXxar wrote: /in It's been far too long. Nice. Welcome back! | ||
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ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
Thank you ^^. Nice to still see some of the old gang hanging out  | ||
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Onegu
United States9699 Posts
Get more people in here! | ||
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Vivax
22407 Posts
When times are dire and TL doesn't get sign ups, I resort to town of salem to quench the thirst. It has massive flaws since it doesn't have the concept of a VT from the start meaning that mafia and NK always have to cc someone (ideally), and you need to play against a limited time so it mostly comes down to claim wars. Also town roles are hilariously overpowered. The jailkeeper can execute people at night and interrogate you. These are screenshots from one game where I was werewolf and killed the entire town on N2, but also myself cause my target got transported into the veteran along with the rest of the town. D3 the only survivors were : The 3 mafia, the survivor, and the veteran who they lynched, winning the game. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xOGElcc.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/CjJmJOn.jpg) | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
On June 09 2017 15:20 Vivax wrote: There are many funny role ideas for big games. When times are dire and TL doesn't get sign ups, I resort to town of salem to quench the thirst. It has massive flaws since it doesn't have the concept of a VT from the start meaning that mafia and NK always have to cc someone (ideally), and you need to play against a limited time so it mostly comes down to claim wars. Also town roles are hilariously overpowered. The jailkeeper can execute people at night and interrogate you. These are screenshots from one game where I was werewolf and killed the entire town on N2, but also myself cause my target got transported into the veteran along with the rest of the town. D3 the only survivors were : The 3 mafia, the survivor, and the veteran who they lynched, winning the game. Ah yeah, Town of Salem can be fun, although it's often pretty random (just like SC2 Mafia where it originally came from) (tbh it's really more like poker than forum Mafia...) | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
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Onegu
United States9699 Posts
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darthfoley
United States8004 Posts
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Erfolgsgarant
19 Posts
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