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[M][N] Unoriginal Name Mini Mafia

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
December 29 2015 21:18 GMT
#12
/in
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 08 2016 23:07 GMT
#82
Howdy all, how are you guys on this fine Friday evening?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 00:56 GMT
#119
Hey rayn could you walk me through your GiygaS read?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 01:59 GMT
#125
On January 09 2016 10:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 09:56 slOosh wrote:
Hey rayn could you walk me through your GiygaS read?

I believe the first thing mafia does here is to read the possible setups and see what roles they have in scum QT. Depending on if they have GF or Framer they can poe the setup down to two possibilities, right?

Now GiygaS knows -- definitely, that there is a named VT in one of the setups, that is proven by the fact he talks about it. But the wording "vanilla town" instead of "named VT" is careless. I find it way more likely to come from a town -- because scum tend to carefully choose their wording when they talk about something specific, as miswording stuff makes you possibly being questioned about a "fuckup" (like we see here happening).

So based on GiygaS post about if the named VT should claim or not, i think it far more likely it comes from a townie based on above.

Hmm I see, makes sense.

On January 09 2016 10:52 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Hi everyone! I'm town. In previous forum games I go too HAM for my own good and end up defending my early-reads for half the game so I'm going to try to keep it more toned-down here

I want to lock-town rayn for his red bull joke but I do townread his more comic demeanor the last time I played with him he was a very aggressive mafia player. I like his reason for townreading gigyas too.

I also feel pretty good about koshi being town I just like his style it seems very natural and honest which is difficult to replicate as mafia

Hello there GGTeMpLaR! Could I ask about your "defending my early-reads"? Do they tend to be scum or town or both?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 03:13 GMT
#146
On January 09 2016 11:11 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 10:59 slOosh wrote:

On January 09 2016 10:52 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Hi everyone! I'm town. In previous forum games I go too HAM for my own good and end up defending my early-reads for half the game so I'm going to try to keep it more toned-down here

I want to lock-town rayn for his red bull joke but I do townread his more comic demeanor the last time I played with him he was a very aggressive mafia player. I like his reason for townreading gigyas too.

I also feel pretty good about koshi being town I just like his style it seems very natural and honest which is difficult to replicate as mafia

Hello there GGTeMpLaR! Could I ask about your "defending my early-reads"? Do they tend to be scum or town or both?


How is me going into further detail about my previous meta going to help you solve my alignment when I am intentionally going to be attempting to stray from it this game?

Honestly the content was irrelevant, I just wanted to hear you talk more to get a sense of your general tone.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 03:14 GMT
#147
On January 09 2016 12:12 VayneAuthority wrote:
just sloosh's weird comments and nitpicking completely useless things and telling others to do the work

He's struggling to create a filter

most likely mafia

Kind of a stretch don't you think?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 03:25 GMT
#150
Hmm big things are you as strong town for picking up on similar things to me + more.

GGTeMpLaR I also noticed his first post was kinda awkward, but I felt like he could very well be those townies that if you pressure they just ... react poorly? I'm not sure how to phrase it, but I don't think a direct pressure approach would work out. So I wanted him to post on something else to figure out if he is nervous b/c scum or nervous b/c newer player.

Vayne ... I feel like he is reading me slightly more scum than someone reasonably could? Either that or his style of playing is very different to mine, almost like Oatsmaster or something if he is still around.

No one else has too much for me.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 03:35 GMT
#155
On January 09 2016 12:32 Koshi wrote:
You really look like mafia not knowing what read he should represent and then just give 17 possibilities to everything.

Do you think I should have a stronger read on the players I mentioned / the ones I didn't? Can you provide one?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 03:40 GMT
#157
On January 09 2016 12:35 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Okay so... I guess you asked me about GiygaS based on this post here:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 09:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I have tentative townreads on kush, mderg, GiygaS and maybe Koshi.

What makes you ask about GiygaS and not about any other reads of mine? I mean, why did you single out GiygaS over all the other people in this post? Also if you agree with my townread on GiygaS whay isn't he your townread atm?

I asked specifically about GiygaS because I took his initial wording as more scum vibe. It's really awkward that a VT would say "vanilla town" and not differentiate that he is talking about the Named VT, and I think blue roles are somewhat unlikely to want to talk about role claiming and whatnot, which leaves perhaps a careless scum post.

I don't agree with the conclusion of your townread but I understand it and find it logical.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 03:44 GMT
#159
On January 09 2016 12:39 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 12:35 slOosh wrote:
On January 09 2016 12:32 Koshi wrote:
You really look like mafia not knowing what read he should represent and then just give 17 possibilities to everything.

Do you think I should have a stronger read on the players I mentioned / the ones I didn't? Can you provide one?

Only the green would be townie. Adding the red makes it more mafia.
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 12:25 slOosh wrote:
Vayne ... I feel like he is reading me slightly more scum than someone reasonably could? Either that or his style of playing is very different to mine, almost like Oatsmaster or something if he is still around.

I can see where you are coming from - I was merely giving my whole thinking process. The fact is I play (or at least I think I play) a more logical fashion, sometimes roundabout style. I was noting that some other playstyles hate this (and the player mentioned was just one that came to mind).
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 05:41 GMT
#190
Aight if people don't like the way I'm posting, I'll just cut the extra footage and post tl;drs.


On January 09 2016 10:52 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
I want to lock-town rayn for his red bull joke but I do townread his more comic demeanor the last time I played with him he was a very aggressive mafia player. I like his reason for townreading gigyas too.

Why the "but"? "I town read rayn b/c his joke" and "scum rayn played very aggressively last time I played with him" are two points that work together. This makes it look like your post was doctored and you forgot to fix this part, since scum take lots of time to craft proper posts while town just post what's on their mind.

Additionally, why the hesitation to vote me?


On January 09 2016 13:08 VayneAuthority wrote:
i suck at mafia but i have one of the best memories on this site. I remember playing mafia with sloosh. " he plays like oatsmaster" is so troll if he actually doesnt remember playing with me lol. Not like it was THAT long ago

How is this a read? Do you have a single scum read outside of me?


On January 09 2016 13:07 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 13:00 Koshi wrote:
On January 09 2016 12:57 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On January 09 2016 12:54 Koshi wrote:
On January 09 2016 12:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Koshi i don't think slOosh is scum.

sure. It is possible.

actually nevermind, i retract from the townread on him.
I totally misremembered what slOosh's scumplay looks like...

I agree that "Watch very closely" is a better status than "Don't think he is scum"

Yeah i like.. I remembered the game on top of my head, the game Ver hosted a couple of years ago (where i think was the last time i saw slOosh play scum) --Sicilian mafia style. There i felt like slOosh had really hard time giving any opinion on anything and didn't follow up on his posts at all, couldn't explain himself at all. Which was different from the game i played on with him later on where he was town. I felt the early activity, him explaining himself and seemingly trying to figure out things made way more sense from him as town.

Then i went to the database and looked his latest games. He's actually "nowadays" way more aggressive than he has been before, as town. And as scum... well not that much, but he still provides thoughts and shit.

I actually think your argument on him being scum is at least reasonable. Too early to tell imo, but yes, it makes sense.

I strongly recommend that you go back and properly consider the context of those games. The town one was like, some super setup themed game with all power roles and like a day 1 mayor esque thing. Additionally, consider that in that very game, you scum read me hard for something, but it was through thorough explanation of my reasoning that we got on the same page. You know what I'm worth as town - so it's pure win win since you either help clear me so I can focus on finding scum or you just take the ezpz scum slOosh lynch when you feel like it.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 05:43 GMT
#191
Like seriously, bring it on. If I'm scum, find something that I posted and force my reasoning behind it. Anyone who has actually played with me as scum know that I'm super timid and I have extreme difficulty posting since I can't actually back up statements with proper logic.

So instead of parroting everyone else and adding nothing to discussion saying "hey I too find slOosh weird", point out an exact contradiction or some logical fallacy, or shut up and move on.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 05:46 GMT
#192
GiygaS, thoughts on my interpretation of your "vanilla town" post (as opposed to rayns), and thoughts on the general town sentiment against me, esp. VayneAuthority?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 06:21 GMT
#194
What's wrong with locking him town for the joke?

Why not vote with the post where you say I look like mafia?

What is your opinion on Koshi?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 06:36 GMT
#196
For the record I was leaning scum on you for that post, unless you are referring to something else.

Could I have your current read on GGTeMpLaR and Koshi?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 06:43 GMT
#199
On January 09 2016 12:57 Koshi wrote:
##vote: Nooniansoong

I got reasons. But they are "terrible". I am also extremely tired so I can't promise I will remember them. But I think he might be biggest shot on mafia.

You don't think the way that he exited thread is weird? He spends a good chunk of posts swaying rayn's town read of me, and when rayn comes around he leaves with this?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 06:53 GMT
#203
I think there's more to it. If you had to guess what Koshi's read on me is (last time he posted), what would you say it is?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 07:07 GMT
#205
On January 09 2016 12:57 Koshi wrote:
##vote: Nooniansoong

I got reasons. But they are "terrible". I am also extremely tired so I can't promise I will remember them. But I think he might be biggest shot on mafia.

Scum read on me, leaves by voting someone else, stating vague reasons that are admittedly "terrible", and closing out with "I think he might be biggest shot on mafia".

Join me.
##Vote: Koshi
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 07:30 GMT
#206
Gonna go to sleep since no one wants to play with me right now.

I will wrap up my key points.

Koshi spends half his posts talking about some setup fluff.
Koshi spends the other half of his posts repeating the same post, telling me (his scum read), why I am scum, instead of telling others.
Koshi leaves the thread by placing a vote on someone other than me, without giving reasons, and also claims that they are best chance of being mafia.

Vote Koshi.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 16:47 GMT
#276
Doing a brief catch up and answering some questions, let me know if I missed anything.

@GGTeMpLaR
If it was self-apparent as to why you would lock someone town for a joke is wrong, then it highlights the fact that the "but" in your opening post seems out of place.

I'm not saying that is a scum tell, I was saying that it looked funny. Perhaps I asked the wrong question and went in a roundabout way of doing it, but that's what I did.

Right now I read GGTeMpLaR as more likely town for the confident demeanor and analysis of my approach.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 16:59 GMT
#283
@Eden
Contextually, I provided my reasoning to rayn because he asked me. Because I believe that you can discern alignment when someone shows good reasoning. To rayn, I gave my thinking process, because that was tremendously helpful last game we played together. It is true that my reads are very passive, because at that point I didn't have strong reads, so in lieu of that I gave my reasoning.

The alternative I could have posted was an honest "not much right now". But that wouldn't have generated discussion the way that me providing my reasoning has.

I didn't go ham on GGTemplar because I've gone ham day 1 on (newer) townies in the past and they weren't really able to recover from the pressure. So I took a roundabout approach.

Two town can absolutely look at the same thing and come to different conclusions. I picked out GiygaS out of rayn's inital list because he was the one that I came to a different conclusion on, so I asked rayn for his reasoning. The reasoning was good, even though I disagreed with the read.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 17:04 GMT
#286
@Eden concerning Koshi
  • Setup talk is easy as either alignment. In fact, it's easier for scum to dwell in setup talk because they don't have to make any reads but look like they are contributing to discussion.
  • If you take a look at Koshi's filter, he repeats the same post (not point, but actual post).
  • I think you misread something - I was saying that Koshi had a weird exit, not noonian.

Point 1 and 2 go together in saying that Koshi has been posting frequently, but the content of his filter is lacking.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 17:07 GMT
#288
On January 09 2016 17:30 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Although i wanna ask you something slOosh:

I understand the townie motive on the "makes sense" thingy Eden is questioning you about (although you can probably answer him on it yourself). What i don't understand is the following:

- You scumread GiygaS
- You ask me why i townread him.
- I tell you why i townread him.
- You say it makes sense but don't agree with the conclusion. (although you only state that later on, but it happens here)
- I ask you for your reads.
- You tell me one of the people who doesn't stand out is GiygaS



Now how do the red and the green part go together?
There should be nothing inbetween that makes you change your mind on GiygaS from "scum" --> "doesn't stand out" (no, the bolded part doesn't do that as you literally state that you don't agree with me).

Because I thought the point wasn't that alignment indicative either way, but it was interesting to see that you got a town feel from it when I was getting more a scum feel. In the followup post where I give some thoughts, I don't bother rehashing GiygaS because it was more or less null, and I had already given my reasoning just prior.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 17:32 GMT
#298
Yea just finished catching up, wondering how to format it all
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 17:46 GMT
#300
Ok so I think it's a fair assessment to say that thus far in this game, I have been receiving the most flak. There's been some other things here and there, but not quite the same level as the attention to me.

Additionally, I would say that the general vibe thus far is quite good. There is a good atmosphere for discussion, people are talking and explaining instead of shouting / attacking.

So I would say that I expect mafia playstyle (in this context right now) to look more laid back, non intrusive and perhaps adding some fuel to the slOosh lynch wagon to make sure it goes through.

Who fits this bill?

mderg - I read him as detached from thread. I'm one of the biggest topics at this point and he has yet to say anything about me. He only posted when prompted and doesn't look interested in helping people figure things out.

Tubesock - rayn pointed out his complaint of something that had not happened yet. Scum complain about things without doing anything to help. He is lurking hard so tough to say more, but in this context, scum would be more likely to lurk.

VayneAuthority - hasn't produced any posts outside of getting suspicion on me - fits the bill of getting the D1 mislynch secured without putting more effort than necessary

Will answer GGTemplar's list next.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 18:01 GMT
#301
On January 10 2016 02:00 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
I wasn't super impressed by what boxer had to say.

@sloOsh I would be most interested in your reads on darth, mderg, and boxer at this point.

Specifically mderg's read on darth.

I like darth's posting thus far. He engages in topics that are relevant to the thread at the time and gives fleshed out explanations.


I believe that mderg's read shows that he isn't reading the thread closely.
On January 09 2016 14:07 darthfoley wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 13:37 GiygaS wrote:
Currently feeling weird about mderg and sloosh. Sloosh for reasons other people are giving, and I find it weird that mderg showed up, talked about my question (NAI) then peaced out for no good reason.

darth, templar was talking about toning down defending his early reads late in to the game. That post is not going to mean anything d1 if you're just evaluating if he's staying true to it or not.


Oh yea I just reread that, that was dumb of me.

If he was, (or if he was at least reading darthfoley closely), he should have seen this post.
On January 09 2016 16:31 darthfoley wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 08:51 Koshi wrote:
I am also going to make it my policy to not lynch an active player on D1. Going to go for a scummy low amount poster. and if there isn't one, I ll take down the lowest filter.


Koshi trying to sway Rayne's town read on sloosh seems out of place to me, given that Sloosh has been a pretty active poster so far; it contradicts one of his first posts in the game.
I would also suspect that he should also have been able to point out darthfoley's mistake in time order, as Koshi posted what he did before my spurt of posting, before I was an "active poster".

Furthermore, I don't get the sense that he is actually trying to convince anyone. He is throwing out a read, explaining it, but that's it. Looks like he is trying to keep up appearances.


On January 10 2016 01:10 boxerfred wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 23:13 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Quick summary

koshi, eden, rayn

sloosh, mderg, darth

how is koshi green in your head

I liked this post from boxerfred. He thinks Koshi is scum, and first thing he does is question why other people have town reads on him. He actually looks engaged in wanting either others convinced to lynch Koshi or himself convinced that Koshi is town.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 18:06 GMT
#302
Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?

Please explain.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 19:01 GMT
#315
On January 10 2016 03:29 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 03:06 slOosh wrote:
Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?

Please explain.

Entrance to the thread seemed more likely to come from town than from mafia. Boils down to the fact I think he might check things better if he was mafia, and not have the chain of posts he had about the VT claim thing.

Could you answer my question? And in addition. Give your read on me? You haven't talked about me at all.

Oh I thought it was clear from my followup posts that it is currently mderg.

I like your "today" posting much more than your "yesterday" posting. I tend to move votes only when switching onto someone else, but if it will ease your mind

##Unvote Koshi
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 19:04 GMT
#318
rayn could you explain how VayneAuthority is town? How much does my alignment say in the matter?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 19:06 GMT
#319
On January 10 2016 04:04 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 04:01 slOosh wrote:
On January 10 2016 03:29 Koshi wrote:
On January 10 2016 03:06 slOosh wrote:
Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?

Please explain.

Entrance to the thread seemed more likely to come from town than from mafia. Boils down to the fact I think he might check things better if he was mafia, and not have the chain of posts he had about the VT claim thing.

Could you answer my question? And in addition. Give your read on me? You haven't talked about me at all.

Oh I thought it was clear from my followup posts that it is currently mderg.

I like your "today" posting much more than your "yesterday" posting. I tend to move votes only when switching onto someone else, but if it will ease your mind

##Unvote Koshi

So who is your nr 2 mafia read?

mderg, vayne, tubesock in that order
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 09 2016 19:18 GMT
#325
Vayne, apart from me, could I have your strongest scum read?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 07:27 GMT
#396
Koshi you here? I need someone to spitball against.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 07:30 GMT
#398
Eden, what do you think about Tubesock's point that GiygaS had more or less the same townreads as Tubesock, yet cites his townreads as the reason for voting Tubesock?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 07:45 GMT
#404
On January 10 2016 16:37 Eden1892 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 16:30 slOosh wrote:
Eden, what do you think about Tubesock's point that GiygaS had more or less the same townreads as Tubesock, yet cites his townreads as the reason for voting Tubesock?

It's interesting, a pretty reasonable read.

But I would still rather kill Tubesock, as that's the only thing he's posted (as of me typing this) that's left me willing to consider not killing him, and as I already thought GiygaS was pretty solidly town.

What do you think?

I think it is a decently a compelling point against GiygaS and am interested in his response.

At this point I would place mderg, vayne and kmatt as lynch preferences. I don't see how people are reading mderg town, and I've yet the time to properly read vayne's meta b/c I don't really see any content from him.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 08:15 GMT
#421
Bah I'm falling asleep so can't followup on Tubesock / GiygaS till tomorrow.

I will leave with my stronger preference on lynching Vayne. He is clearly not interested in engaging with town in any fashion. His best read after me is a total cop-out.
On January 10 2016 04:26 VayneAuthority wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 04:18 slOosh wrote:
Vayne, apart from me, could I have your strongest scum read?


If i really had to pick, mderg, but it is a very weak/generic read at this point

And I just found out that while he doesn't bother adding to town discussion at all, he does make sure he leaves a vote on me in the voting thread.
On January 10 2016 13:20 VayneAuthority wrote:
##vote: SLoosh


I think this is the best lynch right now.

##Vote VayneAuthority
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 08:20 GMT
#424
and rayn, if you could, please provide a game for me where vayne did nothing because I don't see one as either alignment and if it's a different playstyle than ever played, then meta doesn't count for much
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:02 GMT
#511
Someone please, please, please explain to me because I'm just to dense to understand how VA isn't somewhere at the top of everyone's scumlist. Please don't be half-assed about it and say "well rayn thinks he is town so he must be town".

On January 10 2016 18:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 17:20 slOosh wrote:
and rayn, if you could, please provide a game for me where vayne did nothing because I don't see one as either alignment and if it's a different playstyle than ever played, then meta doesn't count for much


[M][N] I Still Cant Believe its not Themed Mafia

[N] VII Titanic Mini Mafia: I Have a Cunning Plan...

that would be 2/3 of his last towngames where he has been vanilla...

Read the first page of filter for each game, and see how he talks about multiple people and is at least interacting with thread.

Then look at his filter in this game and show me a single read. Show me a single point of input.

Tell me people who have VA as town, why? Why why why? Rayn, why?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:14 GMT
#514
On January 10 2016 19:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:
slOosh at which point you start not scumreading Koshi anymore?
You said you didn't change your vote immediately after you changed your opinion on him here:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 04:01 slOosh wrote:
On January 10 2016 03:29 Koshi wrote:
On January 10 2016 03:06 slOosh wrote:
Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?

Please explain.

Entrance to the thread seemed more likely to come from town than from mafia. Boils down to the fact I think he might check things better if he was mafia, and not have the chain of posts he had about the VT claim thing.

Could you answer my question? And in addition. Give your read on me? You haven't talked about me at all.

Oh I thought it was clear from my followup posts that it is currently mderg.

I like your "today" posting much more than your "yesterday" posting. I tend to move votes only when switching onto someone else, but if it will ease your mind

##Unvote Koshi

What does this mean? Where does the read change, around which posts from Koshi?

When he just started posting things of content? You want something specific?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:16 GMT
#515
Yo Koshi, why not VA?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:21 GMT
#516
darth, join me voting for VA. I'm leading this now.

I'm still reading over the GiygaS / Tubesock thing but I don't think it's too incriminating on either side.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:28 GMT
#517
Yea I definitely don't think we should be lynching either GiygaS or Tubesock today. There's enough good things from each player but nothing so bad that you could lynch them with that much confidence (there might be and if you see something please share with the rest of class). It could easily be town vs town.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:32 GMT
#520
Excellent.

Koshi, you mentioned at the start of the game that you would prefer to lynch a low amount poster / low filter poster. Would you like to join me in lynching VA?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:33 GMT
#522
On January 11 2016 05:30 GiygaS wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 05:28 slOosh wrote:
Yea I definitely don't think we should be lynching either GiygaS or Tubesock today. There's enough good things from each player but nothing so bad that you could lynch them with that much confidence (there might be and if you see something please share with the rest of class). It could easily be town vs town.

ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME. HE CALLED HIMSELF SCUMMY HOW DO YOU NOT LYNCH THAT

First, could you please quote the post you are referring to. I just want to make sure we are looking at the same thing.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:39 GMT
#524
But in a more general sense, yes, absolutely you can be aware that you make posts that can be construed as scummy.

I mean think about it. If townies could only produce things that could be interpreted as towny, how would mafia ever win? I would not fault someone for having the meta cognition to admit that something they do can be construed as scummy.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:42 GMT
#525
At this point I'm also quite interested in seeing how rayn follows up on the Tubesock thing.

It felt somewhat dismissive and exaggerated.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:46 GMT
#531
On January 10 2016 20:33 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 15:26 Tubesock wrote:
##Vote: GiygaS

On January 10 2016 12:11 GiygaS wrote:
I'm gonna ladder a bit and come back, but before I do

##Vote tubesock

His last posts townreads were really odd. Basically My list is (roughly from scummy to less scummy)

tubesock: not much more to say on him that darth already hasn't + Show Spoiler [ Darthfoley's Tube Case] +
On January 10 2016 10:08 darthfoley wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 04:37 Tubesock wrote:
@Eden - I did think the thread was heading in the towning people for too dumb to be mafia reasons. Also I posted to post. At the time there really wasn't anything I felt compelled to respond to.

Easy town reads
Reyn, Eden, SloOsh, Nooniansoong

GGtemplar I didn't like his first like 5 posts but he looks a lot better this morning.
Koshi while gives me some weird scuzzies I am not willing to lynch him.
Vayne I am not willing to lynch either. I like his tone.

the rest haven't said anything I found interesting or memorable.

I have to work today and have Christmas dinner tonight but after that I'll be in thread.


This is Tubesock's only post of the day and I'm not a fan. Easy reads on sloosh, Noonian? None of these reads have any reasoning behind them. The vagueness with things like tone or "weird scuzzies" make me think scum


mderg: + Show Spoiler [ blah blah words] +
says easy things that are easy to say. his darth case is the only real content he has and it doesn't feel very substantial. Feels like he went looking around for something to read on, made the post and moved on. He's not pushing his read anymore, and hasn't even really talked about it again.

---- Line of scumminess ---

kmatt: baby come back
VA: I want to believe that his matter of fact tone makes him town, but I just can't given the things I'm reading about his reputation

---- Line of towniness ---

noon
boxer
koshi
ggtemp: If he was mafia he would have used his supposed inexperience as a shield.
sloosh

---- Line of more-towniness ---

darth
eden
rayn


There's very likely a mafia in my town reads as I'm really not sure about a lot of them, but I want to lynch mderg or tubesock as it stands now.


My TR's "were really odd". Yet compare them and notice GiygaS has the same ones. You can argue that I town VayneAuthority while GiygaS nulls him. But then I put VA in the same group as two others where I say something was bothering me about them yet I was not willing to lynch him. So, you can argue I null him instead. I don't care how you label it, "null", "slight/could be/ has a chance at being town", "I have no idea" whatever it isn't really relevant. It is clear it is not a strong read in either direction.

The point is GiygaS and my reads are essentially equal. As in we are reading hte same game. How can my reads possibly be "weird" in his eyes?

GiygaS cites Darthfoley's case on me. Darth's case is basically how the fuck can SloOsh and Noon be "easy town reads"? and my only commentary uses vagueness tone and he didn't like the phrase "weird scuzzies". BUT GiygaS goes with the "yeah weird town reads!"

Why? well because Rayne, Koshi and Eden already said they think I am mafia. Koshi I htink it was already pointed out what a good point (weird statement) the easy town reads of Sloosh and Noon are. So, GiygaS KNOWS he has support and won't be questioned about this weird reads thing.

GiygaS can give some reasons make it look like a case so he's doing something AND he knows he has the support of the 3 strongest thread presences. He won't have to fight them or do much to convince them.

GiygaS should be latching onto the vaqueness of tone and "weird scuzzies" statements that Darth made. His case if he were town would include things like how I scum claimed, bitched and whined about something that probably wasn't going to happen, and then when I was called out for it I bailed scummily. That I have 3 posts and that each one is the epitome of doing "just enough" to stay under the radar. That maybe I was trying to play up the too scummy to be scum vibe.

If you are going to make a case, it should be something like Tubesock's Tubesock is mafia case. Not, wow we have the same reads but Tubesocks town reads are so weird! There is plenty to case me on beyond just what Darth has said without needing to parrot the most active posters.

Basically this post comes down to:
- "My reads are essentially the same as GiygaS' yet he scumreads me for it."
- Rest of the post is inventing a narrative and then finding reasons to fit it.

Wrapping up the case but not really addressing the issue of the "easy" town read issue.
On January 10 2016 21:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 21:10 Tubesock wrote:
On January 10 2016 20:40 raynpelikoneet wrote:
You should be latching onto the vaqueness of tone and "weird scuzzies" statements that Darth made. Case should include things like scum claiming, bitching and whining about something that probably wasn't going to happen, and then when being called out for it bailing scummily. That the dude has only 3 posts and that each one is the epitome of doing "just enough" to stay under the radar. That maybe he was trying to play up the too scummy to be scum vibe.

There is plenty to case Tubesock on beyond just what Darth has said.

Tubesock what is your read on Tubesock?
Do you agree with the quote above?


Until this GiygaS bit, I would have Tubesock as a plynch candidate. In the past when I rolled town, I think there have only been 1 person to read me town in the first 24 hours of the game. Pretty much every other player on this site I've been with scum me. But I project town pretty well after N1. I have every confidence that will happen here as well.

The quote above is wrong, but I can see how you and other believe it.

If the quote above is wrong why did you write it?
I have a really really really really hard time seeing why someone.. anyone.. would EVER call himself, any of his posts, scummy. It just doesn't make any fucking sense at all because if you are town IT IS IMPOSSIBLE YOU CAN MAKE SCUMMY POSTS. Last time someone did this we lynched him and he flipped mafia.

Feels kinda exaggerated here.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:50 GMT
#532
On January 11 2016 05:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 05:14 slOosh wrote:
On January 10 2016 19:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:
slOosh at which point you start not scumreading Koshi anymore?
You said you didn't change your vote immediately after you changed your opinion on him here:
On January 10 2016 04:01 slOosh wrote:
On January 10 2016 03:29 Koshi wrote:
On January 10 2016 03:06 slOosh wrote:
Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?

Please explain.

Entrance to the thread seemed more likely to come from town than from mafia. Boils down to the fact I think he might check things better if he was mafia, and not have the chain of posts he had about the VT claim thing.

Could you answer my question? And in addition. Give your read on me? You haven't talked about me at all.

Oh I thought it was clear from my followup posts that it is currently mderg.

I like your "today" posting much more than your "yesterday" posting. I tend to move votes only when switching onto someone else, but if it will ease your mind

##Unvote Koshi

What does this mean? Where does the read change, around which posts from Koshi?

When he just started posting things of content? You want something specific?

Yes, i do want something specific.

Starting second page of his filter, January 09 2016 10:11 CST, post #268 and onward. I think it's more substantive than his posts prior.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:54 GMT
#534
+ Show Spoiler [I Still Can't Believe it'…] +

On June 06 2015 10:00 VayneAuthority wrote:
i think mig is still a good lynch tbh, all this confirmed is that the guy is town and giving a genuine opinion on mig.

On June 07 2015 05:47 VayneAuthority wrote:
Chezinu is a good lynch tbh if im going to actually try this game again. I don't think its feasible to make it happen today though perhaps next cycle

On June 07 2015 06:09 VayneAuthority wrote:
i dont think yamato is mafia but dont mind if he dies. hes basically just IamRobik except he doesnt ever get warned for behavior somehow even though every post he makes is a personal insult



+ Show Spoiler [VII Titanic Mini Mafia: I Have a Cunni…] +

On February 15 2015 01:26 VayneAuthority wrote:
Kelsier is tricky, I think he just likes making really bad posts that come across as forced scum posts. He did this last game too and he was town. He seems to do the same thing to me and reads my posts as scum every game

On February 15 2015 09:29 VayneAuthority wrote:
rayn when you read this tell me how similar you find BH to his persona as Old Partner in golden sun. when I read his posts I feel like he is talking to other people and having a laugh. Reminds me of that game with how forced he is pushing this agenda with these long awful posts

On February 16 2015 04:42 VayneAuthority wrote:
idk i actually think its a shitty read reading over his filter again but generally he has only asked for other people's scumreads and their opinions and stuff, lots of questions but nothing from him. He townreads various random people but I dont feel like he is exactly trying to solve the game here. African Horn Mafia he looked much different in from what I observed



+ Show Spoiler [Unoriginal Name Mafia] +

On January 09 2016 12:12 VayneAuthority wrote:
just sloosh's weird comments and nitpicking completely useless things and telling others to do the work

He's struggling to create a filter

most likely mafia

On January 10 2016 03:57 VayneAuthority wrote:
Maybe its meta, I honestly dont know many of these players. Guess I should look up Eden because his filter looks like a good scumplayer to me I don't know if that is true or not

On January 10 2016 04:26 VayneAuthority wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 04:18 slOosh wrote:
Vayne, apart from me, could I have your strongest scum read?


If i really had to pick, mderg, but it is a very weak/generic read at this point


Yes I do still think that he is putting even less effort into this game compared to the two mentioned.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:57 GMT
#537
268 not 286
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:58 GMT
#539
On January 11 2016 05:55 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 05:32 slOosh wrote:
Excellent.

Koshi, you mentioned at the start of the game that you would prefer to lynch a low amount poster / low filter poster. Would you like to join me in lynching VA?

I could. But I am still sitting pretty on boxerfred.

Ok. I'm ok with that too if we end up going that way.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 20:59 GMT
#540
On January 11 2016 05:58 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 05:57 slOosh wrote:
268 not 286

yeah you now said you started townreading Koshi at point A. But at point B (which is after A) you tell Edenwhy you think Koshi is mafia. So one of your statements must be a lie.

Starting second page of his filter, January 09 2016 10:11 CST, post #268 and onward. I think it's more substantive than his posts prior.
At point B I told Eden why I thought Koshi was mafia concerning posts prior to point A.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:01 GMT
#542
Did you not like Eden's approach to Tubesock / GiygaS? Or is the paranoia about something else?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:03 GMT
#546
On January 11 2016 06:02 GiygaS wrote:
The point that tubesock is self-aware is an understatement. The only real analysis he's done all game has been on himself and me purely based on my read of him.

I think this is a fair assessment.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:05 GMT
#549
Koshi, if Kmatt was actually mafia, would the team comps make more sense? I'm wondering if the game is somewhat difficult b/c he is in fact mafia and so we have less people to look at. (Not saying we should lynch him, just thinking out loud at why D1 feels this way)
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:07 GMT
#552
Alright rayn, if you feel this strongly about it, I'll relent for D1.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:14 GMT
#561
On January 11 2016 06:08 nooniansoong wrote:
I don't want to lynch tubesock.
I can't understand most of his posts. His scum game is still fresh in my mind and his posts were a lot easier to follow.
That's because his content this game is much closer to stream of thought.


Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 00:47 Tubesock wrote:
I'm onboard for the Boxerfred or Kmatt lynch. VA is an ok enough lynch. He'd be number 4 though.

Having a number 4 lynch on d1 is really townie. It shows a lot of thought is going into who might be scum.

On January 11 2016 00:33 Tubesock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 23:54 Koshi wrote:
I read everything once fast. Going to do some sports and come back.

Tubesock,
Explain to me how you are playing different than the last game in which you were scum?

If I recall, you were also afk for the longest time, and then you came out the gates swinging with a case on Rels. Bit the same like here with Giygas.

What is different?


Good question. And I'm taking it as a compliment since I think you towned me there.

These two games are pretty different situations for me though. Last game I was not ever really scum read until the end. At least not scum read enough to feel threatened. I'm also pretty sure I struck first on Rels. The case I made on him I really believed.

When I'm mafia I triple check every post and make sure there is a corresponding quote I can link for everything I say. I think you could argue that last game I was overexplainy (Ritoky made a post about someone being overexplainers anonymous so I started to focus on that too). I'd be shocked if you can find a post that contradicts itself in that game though. Or a read swap on someone without reasons showing transition. Early posts I made sure I didn't have too many tr's (how Rels caught and killed me in the game prior to that) without any scum reads and that I shouldn't go very long without throwing out a read.

I don't really know how or why you should differentiate my game here and the last one. My AFKness should be NAI. I do not have internet access while I work. And due to my schedule it explains why I only get to play a game every couple of months. Much of the time there is a very real mod kill threat. Which is part of why I conceded last game. I was going to be mod killed 3 days after I conceded and I needed 5 or something to win.

I guess a lot of this questioning I'm getting I don't understand.

My entire point is that GiygaS literally did something that town would NEVER do. It's more than just scumreading me. that's not what my point is. It's how and why he did. If he were town, he'd still scum me, but there is no fucking world that exists where town scums me with his reasonings and his world view. Tell me how that's possible?

Well there's somewhat consistency going on here.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:17 GMT
#562
LIke, town town makes sense, scum scum is kinda gutsy but makes sense, and town/scum or scum/town doesn't really make sense.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:17 GMT
#564
I'm leaning town town at this point if it wasn't clear.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:25 GMT
#569
On January 11 2016 06:20 raynpelikoneet wrote:
And yes slOosh, it is a fact that it is impossible for a townie to say scummy things.
If you are not purposefully throwing the game then every single thing you say has a townie agenda that you can explain. It must have, there is no other option. Telling people why they should reasonably scumread you is not an explanation -- because you already claim you are doing something that is not townie. It's really simple. Townies do townie things. Townies never do scummy things. Townies don't say the things they do are a reason to scumread them, they EXPLAIN why the things they do are townie.

I disagree but I guess we can discuss this post game in full.

I agree with the first point that everything you do has a townie agenda that you can explain.
However, intent =/= reception.

A town player can do things with town intent yet have bad reception by the group and be considered scum.
They can provide town intent and reasons for what they did, but it doesn't mean that the group will believe them.

Therefore, you can say that a townie can do things with town intent, and understand that you don't have to be scum to misunderstand their intentions.


As it relates to this game, I think what Tubesock said was that he could see how his actions could be construed as scummy. That isn't admitting what he did was scummy. That is saying that what he did could be construed by town as scummy.

Am I making sense?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:28 GMT
#571
E.g. suppose any game where mafia are playing lurk style, that is, they aren't actively muddling things up.

And let's suppose a town mislynch happens D1. How is this possible if townies only do townie things?

This is possible because townies may have townie-intent, but it doesn't equate to everyone else understanding and believing that intent.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:30 GMT
#574
On January 11 2016 06:27 GiygaS wrote:
That quote shows that he is aware of his meta. He could very easily be playing around it and using it as a shield

I agree this is a possibility. Noon has made a comment that "verify's" this. What is your interpretation of this?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:35 GMT
#578
On January 11 2016 06:32 GiygaS wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 06:30 slOosh wrote:
On January 11 2016 06:27 GiygaS wrote:
That quote shows that he is aware of his meta. He could very easily be playing around it and using it as a shield

I agree this is a possibility. Noon has made a comment that "verify's" this. What is your interpretation of this?

Noon cares a ton about meta, it's NAI for me in relation to him.

Um, I guess what I was getting at was,

Noon meta verifies that Tubesock is playing more to his town meta.

Do you think noon is town and wrong? Scum and buddying? Etc.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:44 GMT
#582
I want to make sure we are looking at the same thing. Rayn are you referring to these posts?
On January 10 2016 15:26 Tubesock wrote:
GiygaS should be latching onto the vaqueness of tone and "weird scuzzies" statements that Darth made. His case if he were town would include things like how I scum claimed, bitched and whined about something that probably wasn't going to happen, and then when I was called out for it I bailed scummily. That I have 3 posts and that each one is the epitome of doing "just enough" to stay under the radar. That maybe I was trying to play up the too scummy to be scum vibe.

On January 10 2016 15:39 Tubesock wrote:
Darth because I really liked his interaction with Eden, and I can absolutely see why he would think both VA and I are scum. To me whatever he is using for his heuristic is consistent and seems logical.

slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:47 GMT
#583
OHHHhhh

I see what you are getting at.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:49 GMT
#585
I understand what you are saying but I still think it's something a town could do.

It's like if you were playing town, and (b/c of active mafia mudslinging or something) people suspect you as mafia for a certain vote sequence.

Then some dude comes along and says "you know, I think rayn is mafia, because he didn't use as many exclamation marks in his posts that he usually does".

You would somewhat understand if people bandwagon for reasons that are out there, but it's really strange for someone to be bringing in reasons that don't make sense.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 21:52 GMT
#588
I guess I empathize with Tubesock because I could totally see myself doing the same thing.

But I don't think Tubesock did quite what you guys are saying.

He is highlighting the fact that the reason GiygaS joined the vote wagon was out of place - that GiygaS was citing easy townreads. The place where Tubesock says that he should have used other points about himself is to say that in contrast with what could have been said, GiygaS instead chose to say something really fishy.

Like a scum making up some lame excuse to join the bandwagon.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:02 GMT
#598
On January 11 2016 06:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 06:49 slOosh wrote:
I understand what you are saying but I still think it's something a town could do.

It's like if you were playing town, and (b/c of active mafia mudslinging or something) people suspect you as mafia for a certain vote sequence.

Then some dude comes along and says "you know, I think rayn is mafia, because he didn't use as many exclamation marks in his posts that he usually does".

You would somewhat understand if people bandwagon for reasons that are out there, but it's really strange for someone to be bringing in reasons that don't make sense.

Except that GiygaS' reasoning is very clear. Very very clear and makes sense, especially when taken his explanation and comparing it to how he presented the argument. You can't just do this:

- Well GiygaS is scum for A.
- But he didn't do A, he in fact did B.
- Well, GiygaS is scum for A.

The whole argument in itself is a misrepresentation of GiygaS posts and motivation behind them, and Tubesock doesn't even consider that when GiygaS and me BOTH explain why this is the case.. Instead he just keeps hammering the same point, which simply cannot be true as it is basically proven false (unless he wants to argue why the explanation does not make sense -- which he isn't doing either).

I don't think it was very clear at the time he said it.

Start on page 20 where GiygaS votes Tubesock. I didn't quite get it, neither did darthfoley, Eden on page 21 and Koshi on 26.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:04 GMT
#600
On January 11 2016 07:01 raynpelikoneet wrote:
There is simply fucking nothing wrong in asking why people townread the same people you do.

The point that Tubesock is making is that while there is nothing wrong with that, it's weird to vote for someone because of it.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:05 GMT
#602
I'm moving to boxerfred. I really don't think Tubesock is the lynch here.

##Vote boxerfred
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:07 GMT
#604
To be clear Tubesock, I don't think GiygaS is mafia either. I agree that it was strange how he presented it, but I think it was an issue of presentation, not of motive.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:41 GMT
#634
Tubesock, could you give some updated reads on people who are not GiygaS? I'm not sure if trying to rehash it is the best way forward.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:51 GMT
#647
rayn, just so you don't feel like you are talking to deaf ears:

I disagree with your initial noon case. The first quote he said that you thought was useless was like 1 hour into D1, giving a towntell to Koshi for being indifferent doesn't seem weird and being ok with lynching Vayne for various reasons doesn't seem that weird either.

I think it is a playstyle thing where you assume everyone should play a certain fashion and if they don't they are scum, but they could just be playing a different playstyle.

I will agree with you that he has low post count, but I think at least he is checking into thread ala. tubesock read.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:55 GMT
#653
Could people (beside rayn) explain their kush reads apart from meta?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 22:58 GMT
#658
On January 11 2016 07:55 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Also i am not gonna switch my vote, just that i can tell you "i told you so".
You can lynch me if bf flips scum. But he doesn't, because noone is clearly pushing another lynch except for me.

I'll switch if you can help me understand this part.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:01 GMT
#674
Oh deadline was now? Nice
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:02 GMT
#678
Don't worry rayn - I think you (and rest of town) are having a tough time b/c scum team is not an active one so it's hard to grasp onto stuff.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:03 GMT
#682
Ah dammit I missed out on the thrill of read flip
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:04 GMT
#683
On January 11 2016 08:02 scott31337 wrote:
Hi!
<3

I've read most of the thread already (or more like skim) and writing some notes down, but if anyone has any questions - that'd be great.

Hey scott31337,

Things we would like to see is your thoughts on the Tubesock / GiygaS interaction, and maybe some other scum reads. Probably want to process the scum flip though.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:10 GMT
#698
On January 11 2016 08:07 Koshi wrote:
People should totally read all my posts about how there are 5 people mafia and boxerfred fits all the scumteams.

For posterity
On January 10 2016 10:02 Koshi wrote:
Unless they outplay us really hard here the mafia team boils down to max(?) 5 names. (Sloosh, Tubesock, VA, Sloosh, Kmatt)

There is nothing VA is doing to incriminate these 4 others except for SloOsh. Which he adamantly claimed when I scumread but him and SloOsh, it isn't in his meta to do that indeed. But he could still be mafia with the 3 others. (2 of them obviously)

SloOsh on the other hand is putting himself in such a bad situation with the 4 others. He scumreads 1 of them as 3rd (Tubesock), hard townreads boxerfred, Kmatt is joker mafia, and then him and VA are distancing.


So therefore my conclusion was:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2016 09:50 Koshi wrote:
Tubesock, boxerfred and 1 out of Sloosh and VA.

Because I am hoping the joker is town.

Also I'm assuming you meant to put boxer in the list instead of my name twice :p
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:12 GMT
#702
They way that the lynch worked out, I wouldn't be surprised if the counter wagon of noonian was also scum. I still would like not-rayn people to help me understand not-meta reads. Because I don't / can't meta.'

Right now I have him null leaning scum for low post count. But I can't see how you can get totes mcgoats scum or totes mcgoats town without meta.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:13 GMT
#704
I would like to cash in my town chips and ask that we ease up on Tubesock, so that he can spend some time reading / posting instead of having to defend himself.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:16 GMT
#705
On January 09 2016 07:57 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
The game setup is one of the following four:
A: 8 VT, 1 Cop, 1 Named VT, 1 Framer, 1 Roleblocker, 1 Goon
B: 8 VT, 1 Cop, 1 Doctor, 1 Roleblocker, 1 Godfather, 1 Goon
C: 8 VT, 1 Vigi, 1 Doctor, 1 Roleblocker, 1 Godfather, 1 Goon
D: 8 VT, 1 Vigi, 1 Veteran, 1 Framer, 1 Roleblocker, 1 Goon

Just realized roleblocker is in all setups
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:19 GMT
#713
On January 11 2016 08:17 mderg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 08:12 slOosh wrote:
They way that the lynch worked out, I wouldn't be surprised if the counter wagon of noonian was also scum. I still would like not-rayn people to help me understand not-meta reads. Because I don't / can't meta.'

Right now I have him null leaning scum for low post count. But I can't see how you can get totes mcgoats scum or totes mcgoats town without meta.

I did end up voting kush but there was nothing totes mcgoats at all today. For me he was almost the same as boxerfred, "Don't know where I should place my vote and he has a chance to be scum"

That's definitely fair. I don't fault anyone voting kush / noon.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:21 GMT
#717
Hey rayn, I was wondering if you could help me understand what I should expect from town VA vs scum VA tomorrow. Because my current pool is noon, kmatt / scott and if its not both of them then VA.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:22 GMT
#718
Kk good night! (Just please post before Day 2 )
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:37 GMT
#723
Hey scott31337, could you please explain why Koshi is basically conf town and GG looks really good from the VCA?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 10 2016 23:44 GMT
#726
Kk peacing out of thread gonna play some Doto.

Anticipating a lil' dip in activity start of D2 but should be ok after that.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 00:57 GMT
#966
Uhh so I was skimming thread b/c I was curious of night action etc, and things looked spicy

And Koshi keeps yelling for it so I'll come forward and claim named vt

Will find time later to figure out what's going on
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 00:57 GMT
#967
I hope you know what you doing Koshi cause I really didn't read too much but I guess it was stopping you from doing something? I trust you anyhows do whatever
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 01:20 GMT
#969
We are setup A. I am named VT.
A: 8 VT, 1 Cop, 1 Named VT, 1 Framer, 1 Roleblocker, 1 Goon <--------- this one
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 01:24 GMT
#970
People who were potential lynch targets before the cop claim, please help make sense of this situation so we can set up our late game properly. I will try posting either later tonight or tomorrow morning
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 01:36 GMT
#972
>.< cmon guys - literally free town cred up for grabs

I want noon / scott / darthfoley / va to just come in and knock it out of the park
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 01:37 GMT
#973
kk dinner is over gtg

scott this is great opportunity for us to get a good read on you too so yea go grab those fruits
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 06:00 GMT
#991
On January 12 2016 09:02 Tubesock wrote:
Town has at least 3 mlynches right?

There are 5 questionable alive people. Me, Noon, Scott, VA, Darth.

Like everyone else is essentially confirmed right? So if we are lucky and 1 of them is named VT then we are in an even better situation. Like we can't lose.

We can just lynch in that order and town wins even if the last two mafia are VA and Darth.

Which of the pool do you think is most scummiest?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 06:01 GMT
#992
And could I also get your general thought progression from night -> rayn town flip -> giygas cop claim?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 06:06 GMT
#993
and darthfoley whenever you get back, please address the cases against you
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 06:13 GMT
#994
Nvm I'm still catching up and I missed lots of posts
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 06:52 GMT
#995
Alright ... I think I've fully caught up (and I realize I've been spamming it up a bit so I'll cut back).

I don't even know where to start this post .... uhhh warning stream of thought post coming up, feel free to skip to end for conclusion.

GiygaS is confirmed town cop.
+ Show Spoiler [just for rayn] +

Remember that very first GiygaS read? This was why. I read him blue / red for it but couldn't really flesh it out without accidentally outing myself as blue / him as blue.



I would have expected Tubesock to have a more ... knee jerk "GiygaS is full of BS dirty mafia fake claimer" given how firmly he believed that GiygaS was scum basically whole game till that point. That said, I could see him just take a step back and figure things out before posting, so null on the reaction point.

As GGTeMpLaR has pointed out, it is statistically unlikely that there is a false positive check. That means framer chose not to frame themselves and instead chose to target Tubesock. Although it isn't outside the realm of possibilities that scum team read GiygaS as cop (maybe taking this post as indication of check).
On January 12 2016 06:07 GiygaS wrote:
At work so can't talk much, but I think I'm starting to lay off Tubesock. Don't know who my next choice is though. Will have to go through filters when I get home.

And if we are heading in the right direction, it wouldn't surprise me if scum decided they needed to take some ballsy plays to get back into the game.


I've read the materials against darthfoley and it looks good. I agree with the general assessments, and find his D2 play has been more lackluster, perhaps showcasing that he has been more of a thread sentiment emulator rather than an independent poster.

I'm trying to wrap my head around possible teams, and I don't think both darthfoley and Tubesock would go in the same team. From Eden's nicely colored voting pattern post, darthfoley's switcharoonies are only incriminating if Tubesock is town. I really don't see how they can both be scum buddies by the way that they voted. Darthfoley's MO is basically follow the crowd (shadowing me or rayn or whoever) on possible lynches - notice he never jumps onto boxerfred, but is comfortable jumping on and off Tubesock. He most definitely had opportunity to change his votes and it wouldn't look inconsistent with his playstyle, and so it feels too gutsy to be parking your vote on a scum buddy like that.


Right now I'm thinking darthfoley scum Tubesock town. I could definitely still just be biased from defending Tubesock D1 so gonna sleep on it, but that's where I currently am.

I would very much appreciate if scott31337 and noonian could get in here and make sense of things too. Because if both of them aren't scum, then the last one is hiding somewhere else, and I'd like more info for when that time comes.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 18:35 GMT
#1050
On January 13 2016 01:06 Tubesock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 13 2016 01:01 Koshi wrote:
You do realize Sloosh is the named VT right?


uuuuhhhh yeah.

But I also totally think you'd think he's lying or something and go back to your original slOosh is scum idea.

Or maybe mafia might try some weird desparate counter claim that tries to fuck up town. I doubt anyone will do the work to really think about if slOosh is town. So at least they have something to look back on.

Plus, what else am I going to do today? the thread is basically already dead. Would be nice if there was something to talk about.

Probably a vote analysis from your perspective would be nice - Eden did some coloring in one of his posts (ctrl+f for "spoiler"). Maybe look at context of darthfoley's switches.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 18:45 GMT
#1051
On January 12 2016 19:58 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
If they're both hypothetically scum and darth sees tube is already getting lynched he could just want some towncred. Especially if Tube is the nilla mafia.

He changed votes 30 minutes prior to E.O.D.

I would relook at his filter to see how he was reading Tube throughout the game and if the vote at the time made sense.

I think darthfoley in general had Tubesock as his default lynch most of D1. He did some meandering around depending on what other people in town were saying, but it seems super gutsy to just park it there multiple times if they were scum buddies.

And (still hypothetically speaking), if going for a bus, I would be very surprised that scum would bus an active poster that has a good chance of arguing out of a lynch over an inactive poster, even if he had a powerrole. Lurker roleblocker with like 3 posts to his name or active goon who is churning out posts?

I really can't see a scum-scum team with the two.


I totally get VA's point of playing the percentages. But I think framer hitting a town Tubesock and him getting copchecked is more likely than darthfoley and Tubesock both being scum.

I'm leaning darthfoley first here.

##Vote darthfoley
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 18:49 GMT
#1053
Like, if we all agree that darthfoley is scum, then it seems like the right play to lynch him first. I think him flipping scum would be strong enough to exonerate Tubesock, despite the redcheck, given how D1 voting played out.

Am I making sense?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 19:07 GMT
#1063
On January 13 2016 03:54 nooniansoong wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote:
For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. He cites "terrible" reasons that he probably won't remember in the morning, which basically provides no information about anything at all. Why couldn't he include at least an outline of something relevant?

like just read that.. scum can't fake a thought process like that.

I dunno that post is weird because the timeline is actually
Koshi & others thought slOosh was weird --> slOosh gets annoyed and gets more active --> Koshi backs off after seeing this

Whereas darthfoley's interpretation is something like

Koshi & others thought slOosh was weird (but still active) --> Koshi should be backing off but isn't
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 19:08 GMT
#1065
I'd be more comfortable lynching something like this than Tubesock
On January 13 2016 01:57 scott31337 wrote:
So the way I see it is - if we don't lynch the red-check (which all the vet's in my mind are telling me you would) - he will always be doubtful - Look at Holyflare in http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/487093-mafia-in-the-himalayas?user=Holyflare - Unless Tubesock just completely dumps some major town rainbows, he's more of a liability that can bite us later.

If our conf's have a better plan - I'm willing to listen. I'm still three pages behind.

Meeting time - bbl.

slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 19:30 GMT
#1074
On January 11 2016 07:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Official Vote Count

boxerfred (4): GGTeMpLaR, mderg, slOosh, Koshi
Tubesock (2): GiygaS, darthfoley
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
nooniansoong (1): raynpelikoneet

Not voted (1): Kmatt


Currently, boxerfred is being lynched. You have until Sunday, Jan 10 11:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00), or to lynch someone. Voting is mandatory and done in this thread.


On January 11 2016 07:38 darthfoley wrote:
I still think Tubesock is the correct lynch right now

On January 11 2016 07:46 darthfoley wrote:
Unless i've missed it, Tubesock hasn't provided any reads on anyone outside of GiygaS, excluding the initial early "reads" who deemed to be scummy. He's spent the last day repeating the same argument for only one person.

Like what?

I don't know what darthfoley's read on Tubesock currently is. This concerns me. Thoughts noon?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 19:39 GMT
#1076
On January 13 2016 04:33 Koshi wrote:
I am going to let you guys play a bit.

Cool, just look into my darthfoley & Tubesock can't be scum scum team posts for later.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 12 2016 19:42 GMT
#1077
darthfoley > scott31337 > Tubesock current lynch preferences. Maybe I should do the Koshi and sit out a bit too.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 14 2016 00:27 GMT
#1202
Everyone take some time from thread and chill out. Yelling at each other isn't the way to go forward.

Only way we lose this is to let paranoia run rampant and lose focus.

I apologize that I couldn't post today; I was extremely busy.

I will be dropping formalized thoughts by end of night.

Thank you.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 14 2016 17:38 GMT
#1212
Koshi & GGTeMpLaR,

Could I have your top 3 lynch preferences and level of certainty?
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 14 2016 22:40 GMT
#1226
On January 15 2016 05:20 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 15 2016 02:38 slOosh wrote:
Koshi & GGTeMpLaR,

Could I have your top 3 lynch preferences and level of certainty?

We won't die. 2 confirmed towns in game.

I would go Kush into VA into Darth.

Kk we are sort of on the same page.

I'm quite certain that there is only 1 scum between VA and darthfoley, and I lean much more that VA is the scum - there's no culpability in his posts and if darthfoley is town, then he literally has nothing in his filter. I do not like how he said "I agree with Koshi Eden looks bad" right when Tubesock flipped.

I also think that the other scum is most likely between kush and scott, and I lean more toward scott. Partly because VA and noon aren't the same alignment and I think VA is scum. Partly because I like some of the things he has posted - for instance his analysis that mderg is sketchy b/c of the way he switched wagons.
On January 12 2016 03:30 nooniansoong wrote:
Anyway during lunch i went through some filters.

Mderg looking scummy.

- pressure on darthfoley that goes no where
- sheeped TS onto gigyas
- jumped ship on gigyas when wagon looked like it was going to falter. He gave no reason except that he thought about it more.
- left a scumlynch a the last second for me. Again without any reasoning, except my lack of content.
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2016 07:53 mderg wrote:
Well, kush is producing less content than the last game I've played with him. And even in that game he was not producing enough content for me. I can definitely see where you're coming from.

But boxerfred had even less content then me so I don't buy this reason to switch off boxerfred.


I don't know how much the rayn kill N1 is affecting your read of noon, but I find it more plausible that it was to disguise VA from rayn.

On January 11 2016 06:12 Koshi wrote:
Like. Typical scumplay would give a boxerfred/VA/Gmatt scumteam. That would be the easy solution.

The way that D1 worked out where wagons were closely tied and scum wasn't particularly active at all, this team makes more sense to me than boxer/darthfoley/noon.

slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 14 2016 22:43 GMT
#1227
On January 13 2016 13:31 scott31337 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 13 2016 04:08 slOosh wrote:
I'd be more comfortable lynching something like this than Tubesock
On January 13 2016 01:57 scott31337 wrote:
So the way I see it is - if we don't lynch the red-check (which all the vet's in my mind are telling me you would) - he will always be doubtful - Look at Holyflare in http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/487093-mafia-in-the-himalayas?user=Holyflare - Unless Tubesock just completely dumps some major town rainbows, he's more of a liability that can bite us later.

If our conf's have a better plan - I'm willing to listen. I'm still three pages behind.

Meeting time - bbl.


Your conf town which upsets me, that you have nothing behind it but "I'd lynch him instead" - I'll flip VT. I don't spam the fucking thread like the others do, I observe, post my thoughts, and go with it - You should find another. Did you even read what I said? What's the mafia motivation? To lynch our red-check? Did you even read the game? I've obs'ed games for almost two years.

This feels like fabricated anger to me. It doesn't flow at all, which you expect emotional posts to do.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 14 2016 22:46 GMT
#1228
darthfoley reads exactly as a newbie town to me. Hesitant at multiple points b/c he hasn't played forum mafia, sheeping people who he reads town (rayn / me D1), admitting faults in his play ...

Like, dude is new. And at the least he is making an effort to interact with thread and he looks like he is trying to follow what's going on (starting from D1). I definitely lean against lynching him - and especially moreso if VA/scott/noon aren't the ones pushing it.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 14 2016 22:49 GMT
#1229
That said, I respect GGTeMpLaR's read and Koshi your read on noon.

I would advise perhaps letting VA/scott start off the lynch tomorrow - no more letting them skate by. Make them put money where their mouth is (or isn't, who knows what they really think)
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 14 2016 23:01 GMT
#1233
Good luck have fun!
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
January 20 2016 02:37 GMT
#1465
Thanks to Artanis[Xp] and Rsoultin for hosting! It was a nice game.

I do think that if we didn't hit boxerfred D1 we very much could have been in a very poor spot (Probably catastrophic should mafia also net a correct frame).

But town did well to put to pieces together after the failed lynch. Well played.
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