Cell Mini Mafia - Page 7

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raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:23 GMT

#700

On April 02 2014 21:20 gumshoe wrote:

Show nested quote +

On April 02 2014 16:59 raynpelikonoshi wrote:

On April 02 2014 12:13 gumshoe wrote:+ Show Spoiler +

This is a few choice qoutes from Rayn's play in witchcraft 2, where he orchestrated a mislynch on me day 1.

Looking the playerlist you are the guy i can work with the best.
I can't read OO for shit.
I hope Cephiro does not do dumb stuff like he did in Hogwarts.
Lurk Sylencia = lynch, otherwise idk
Sn0dude played really well in Hogwarts, i except that from him here aswell.
gumshoe ....
thrawn i misread on Desert until he actually started making sense, hope he does that too here
Umasi was good in some game as town i think? Says nothing = lynch
Onegu is tricky, damn he was tricky in Hogwarts. A guy to read closely.
ET is town or scum at last N1, based purely on Hogwarts.
hzflank i can read.
Vanesco noob, no idea. contribute or die.

and yeah, that's it.

After second reading gumshoe's big post was really bad and could have been all said in 10 words. Apparently that was a fake post too..

I am also trying to be not pissed off with gumshoe but it's really hard..

Probably someone from gumshoe/Umasi/Onegu depending on what happens tomorrow. thrawn stared making sense.

##Vote: gumshoe
just because i do not like anything he has said this game.

bh no, i do not remember his play from Basterd. I remember he claimed on N1 but i don't even remember why.
After that he has been modkilled for inactivity or soht because i accidently outed him as blue (in a game i somehow thought everyone was blue) while he did pretty much nothing. 50% of my case on him is that i want him to actually say something uselful and 50% is that what he has said is either faked for no reason or useless contributions or something that makes no sense to me.

Pretty harsh on me in general, take a good look at that last qoute, notice how Rayn believes my meta works against me there? Next Compare all those lines to these ones that make up Rayn's current stance on me.

I read bla bla bla can't tell if true or false because impossilble to know if he went to sleep or not.

I dunno, why should i think something?
getmoript is mafia agreed or not?

~rayn

I am trying so hard to think about this post and what the fuck is the point of all this.
gumshoe what's the point of all this?
On April 02 2014 06:22 gumshoe wrote:
I'm just curios if you had thoughts on steve, or any history with him I should know of / :

I don't believe this. I don't believe this for one second.

~rayn

This next bit is one exchange between us.

Show nested quote +

That last quote here also has my meta working against me and in general theres an overall tone of disdain once again in Rayn's voice, just like in Witchcraft, another funny thing is that I actually lied in witchcraft as well to try and bait scum, just like I did this game. Rayn knows exactly what I'm capable of and how to exploit that and of course he hammers me for it in this game just like hes done before.

Witch

gumshoe's contributions in Basterd have a clear point, are transparent and every time they reach to a hard conclusion. None of those things happen in this game and half of his filter anyways is useless because it's about fake case that either serves no purpose if he is town or he just fucked up and is making stuff up if he is scum.

Cell

So instead of answering me you decided to lie because "you don't owe me anything"?
Do you realize i am supposed to have a read on you in this game and it's not looking quite townie atm.

Next up, look at this recent game where were both town for comparison.

gumshoe i am interested. Do you think Palmar is mafia?

see gumshoe here is my problem. I am a player who asks questions, obviously. When i ask questions, assuming i am not questioning something i do not understand, there are expected answers:
1) scummy type of answer, or townie type of answer, or both
2) answer i did not expect which leads to further investigation

Now i don't always expect people to understand why i do ask questions i do in the first place. That would defeat the purpose of my play in total. If you can tell what my question is going to achieve you know (as mafia) how you should be answering it. Right?

So, my question to you is:
I don't understand why do you assume Palmar should assume what i am thinking and why i ask what i do. How do you suggest town!Palmar should read me if he is not "allowed" to figure out my motives behind my posts? Or do you think it's reasonable to assume Palmar should have realized what i was after? Did you know what i expected town!gumshoe to answer when i asked you my question?

I think the confusing part here is that gumshoe assumes/says Palmar thought i was scummy for my question and therefore questioned me. Not that Palmar was trying to get a read on me.

gumshoe how do you ended up to this conclusion in the first place?

Anyways that smiley makes me see red every time i see it, except for when gumshoe does it. Just because gumshoe is so adorable.

Show nested quote +

I have been really really sure since i started telling him why i thought his case on Palmar was dumb and started explaining him what Palmar meant with his posts.

Take note of the last quote, he thinks I'm town here because of dumb stubborn play, whats different this game Rayn? Also the tone, while still inquisitive, is much lighter than that of the excerpts from the first two sets listed.

Scum like sure things, Rayn has had success beating me straight up before, he feels confident he can do it again. A good example of this kind of behaviour in scum is how Suki went after cav in cultured the same way she did in the first newbie game they played together. The prefer to tackle targets who they can beat, thats why from the get go Rayn has been spinning everything I say as scummy, watch how he twists what I say and do over and over again.

HE WANTS TO FUCKING LYNCH TOWNIES!! SERIOUSLY GUMSHOE????

Here he attacks me for defending "confirmed scum" geript, of course Geript is not 100 percent scum and Rayn admits as much himself later on here,

Show nested quote +

but that didnt stop him from using a shitty read to attack me via association.

Heres another

Because there's a 50 percent chance your scum therefore I owe you no favours, and I didn't catch anything worth bringing up at that moment.

Show nested quote +

What I mean here is that I suspect hes scum, therefore why do I need to tell him anything that would worsen my odds of catching him. Of course he zeros in on the "you dont owe me anything" part because thats what his agenda calls for, he will tear apart all my statements and alter to them just to make me look bad.

Heres another example of Rayns twister skills.

gumshoe which players from the playerlist would you consider unreadable?

After I answer him honestly, Rayn comes back with this.

So i went to see if Holyflare is hard to read for gumshoe. Turns out he had a pretty clear read on him in World Heavyweight mafia game (where he was town) half past D1. I also found this:

Cause I'm not there yet : P and I disagree, bieng readable is a big part of bieng town, if you make your self unreadable you can't be trusted. I'm not going to argue with you about this because it's retarded to think otherwise.

To adress the bolded first, he completley disregards cultured mafia, the game where Holy bussed his team and completley blind sided me/town, I had this much to say to Holy afterwards

cant bilieve you massacred your team like that, dont listen to what anyone says (not that you would) that takes 3 testicles and no heart, wp sir. At the end of day I was willing to lynch every other person in the game (myself included probally) before you, and that sentiment carried through all the way to lylo. Hope we can play more games like this in the future ( :

Of course, Rayn pretends this game never happens because it doesn't fit his narrative, and thats what hes doing guys, hes crafting a narrative, telling us all a bedtime story so he can slit our throats and steal our shit while we sleep.

As for his point about me contradicting myself, first of all let me ask you, does inconsistency a scum make? No, motive and/or a lack of effort do and my actions suggest neither (I have contributed since games start and made suggestions that scum would pale at the mere thought of uttering). That said, hes twisting the truth here yet again.

"Mafia is about finding scum, period" your words not mine, why should I care about your read on me until I know what you are? You opinion is literally a coin flip away from worthless to me. If you can't read me, that's not my fault, I am playing the game as I see fit, your bieng shit at reads doesn't factor in to my play.

I care what town thinks of me and I'm trying to prove my alignment through contribution, I do not however give a shit what my top scum read thinks and I will lie all day to him until he flips red or reasonably proves himself to be green. He twists this into me not caring about what town thinks as a whole, when in reality anyone who actually reads what I'm saying for themselves can pretty much tell that my words are directed at Rayn and Rayn alone.

Ill end with the most damning bit of all, Rayn whole heartedly believes I am scum for false lackluster reasons, despite the fact that Steveling has yet to open his mouth. Thats because hes just accusing whoevers convinient for him, not trying to seriously consider whose scum. On paper I have a 50 percent chance of bieng scum to him, as he does to me, compare the two of our attempts at reading each other and see whose actually trying to figure out the others alignment and whose considering the possibility that Steveling might be the actual scummer. In both cases, that person is me, I am town, Rayn is 90 percent scum and steveling is 10 percent scum. The end.

gumshoe:
"The most daming thing is that rayn thinks I am scum while Steveling has yet to open his mouth, rayn and I should be 50/50 to each other, him pushing me as scum is scummy. But my conclusion is that rayn is 90% scum."

-ok then gumshoe-

I have considered that steve is scum at every point in this game, just because I made a play to try to read you early on doesn't mean I was 100 percent sure your scum out of the gates. In fact I backed off after your answer because it was fine. You came back after me because you were so sure my lie made me scum, even though you know I bait as town. I was just figuring out your alignment, like you should be doing instead of blindly considering me scum before Steve talks. Go ahead and call me a hypocrite but I have expressed fear that he might be scum throughout every point of this game, even at the time of my big post I said you were 90 percent, not 100.

Also I love how your team keeps poking away at this one bit because you can't deny your playing exactly the same as witchcraft. How is this game different Rayn? How are you scum reading me here for the same play you'd town read me in any other game? How does a mderg, gumshoe scum team fit? Do you honestly think mderg is scum when half the active players called him red? Even though we know he's capable of shit play and getting jumped for it?

Also have you rescinded you ez pz scum read on me? Because right now I'm fairly certain your scum, but no I'm not completely sure and have never been, because I'm town. Show me evidence instead of generically calling me a hypocrite, you will not find anything as damning as "ezpz confirmed scum" your point is mute rayn / : what bullshit do you offer next?

Also gonna say this, Mderg is 100 percent town, I don't like the other people in his group, his play is in line with what I imagine of him as town and theres been too much gleeful drive on him. Even if I'm scum, he's town, consider his alignment a gift regardless of mine.

fairly certain I am scum. Why? Explain pls.

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:24 GMT

#701

A couple lines is fine. Koshi doesn't need cases.

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:26 GMT

#702

On April 02 2014 21:11 Palmar wrote:

Show nested quote +

No, but do explain.

Look at the games when mderg starts posting. There is actually two games of his:

Werewolves Invade Teamliquid II (Town): at the time mderg starts posting there is content of 5 pages (game starts at page 5 - mderg's post is on page 10).

Normal Mini Mafia I (Town): at the time mderg starts posting there is content of 2 pages (game starts at page 4 - mderg first post on page 6).

Then there is this game. There is content of 2 pages when mderg starts posting, a lot more when he stops.
I guarantee you in this game, when mderg leaves the thread there is more content and scumreads than in both of those games. There are things to discuss (mainly getmoripts reads on me, prpl, my scumreads, etc).

In both of those earlier games mderg jumps straight to important content -> starts calling people out etc when there is something to work with!!. In this game he does not, he comments on irrelevant things while there is content in thread. The point is not if the game is 24h into the game or 1000h into the game. The point is in all of these three games there is content to comment on, mderg does it in BOTH of his earlier town games, in this game he does not do it.

Therefore Holyflare's meta read is not bullshit. I agree it does not make mderg 100% mafia because the sample size is small and there is no mafia sample. But the fact is mderg IS playing differently than his earlier town games. He is more passive and only comments on non-alignment indicative stuff. Also i know Holyflare does these reads as town. It does not make him mafia, it's not even scummy for him. There is no reason for Holyflare to make a bullshit meta read as scum. Even if HF is scum there is proof behind the read because he does not make shit up. He's too good for that.

And i agree with HF's statements on mderg this game.

He is commenting on useless stuff while there is real content to comment on. That's a fact. It's also a fact that in earlier games he did not comment on useless stuff once there was content in thread. Instead he tried to form reads and called people out.

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:30 GMT

#704

On April 02 2014 21:27 Holyflare wrote:
Gumshoe thought rayn was scum in heavyweight so i take everything he says about rayn with a pinch of salt.

gumshoe is also scum, that's another reason to not believe what he says.

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:37 GMT

#706

On April 02 2014 21:34 Palmar wrote:
If you think there's a parallel between 5 pages in 3 hours and 5 pages in 24 hours you're insane rayn. There is much more time to actually re-read and form opinions which is exactly what HF is accusing mderg of not doing.

But okay, as I pointed out even if HF's meta is faulty no one else noticed it so either everyone is mafia or it's a reasonable mistake to make.

Do you believe mderg used more than max 2 hours in those games to play the game on D1?
If you don't, then my point stands. He was in thread for 2 hours in this game and failed to make a single conclusion.

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:43 GMT

#709

On April 02 2014 21:40 Palmar wrote:
Right now rayn, who would you lynch out of HF's group?

what a question....

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:46 GMT

#710

On April 02 2014 21:40 Palmar wrote:
Right now rayn, who would you lynch out of HF's group?

mderg. But we'll see him posting more. I have a townread on Holyflare and i am a bit unsure of poofer. I don't see anything particularly scummy from him but i don't know what Koshi is up to or we are not 100% on the same page with him on poofer. I tried to poke Koshi about it in our QT but he is at work so we'll talk more about it tonight.

In the meantime, what's your take on this:

On April 02 2014 19:50 raynpelikonoshi wrote:

Show nested quote +

I'll give the thread all the issues:

My #1 issue with you is your flip-flopping on your reads. At the start of the game you are sure Slam is scum. Very very reasonable. However when other people (mainly me) agree with it you start defending him. You should be even more sure of the read, even if you think i am mafia, because if i am mafia and i "incorrectly read" Slam's alignment there is a high chance that backfires on me. At the start of the game you say HF should be policy lynched because he is either right or bussing. Now you say HF is pushing town wrong direction. Contradiction. You don't comment on my reads. You just say you disagree with them for no reason, you just say i am wrong without telling me why i am wrong. + Cavalinho has no reads all he has talked about is some mayor crap.

My #2 issue with you is that your tone changes in ungeript-y manner. At the start of the game you say things. We disagree.. I call you scum. You yell at me and you tell the thread i am scum. Then you say more things. I say more things. You disagree with me again. However you are not aggressive any more. You don't comment on why you disagree with me on what we disagree. Instead you are defensive and passive. Normally as town geript, if he disagrees with someone, comes to a conclusion that person is mafia, or he voices his argument vocally and tries to convince the other person in a way or another. Here you just give up but you still disagree and noone even knows why.

My #3 issue with you is that you and Cavalinho are not on the same page in this game. Cavalinho has no idea why your reads are what they are and i find it incredibly unlike that would be the case if you were town. On top of that Cavalinho is scared to voice his opinions on everything that's going on in thread. The only thing he comments on is setup talk. He has no opinions on anything and he doesn't even know why you think what you do. It seems like you guys don't even talk about your reads with each other.

~rayn

????

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:49 GMT

#712

On April 02 2014 21:47 gumshoe wrote:

Show nested quote +

On April 02 2014 18:45 Palmar wrote:

On April 02 2014 12:22 Balla24 wrote:
Gumshoe that case is all over the place :/ it's hard to follow (what alignments was rayn in these quotes?) but on the ending:

On April 02 2014 12:13 gumshoe wrote:
Ill end with the most damning bit of all, Rayn whole heartedly believes I am scum for false lackluster reasons, despite the fact that Steveling has yet to open his mouth. Thats because hes just accusing whoevers convinient for him, not trying to seriously consider whose scum. On paper I have a 50 percent chance of bieng scum to him, as he does to me, compare the two of our attempts at reading each other and see whose actually trying to figure out the others alignment and whose considering the possibility that Steveling might be the actual scummer. In both cases, that person is me, I am town, Rayn is 90 percent scum and steveling is 10 percent scum. The end.

How can you say this is the most damning bit of all yet you literally just did the same thing and went 90% scum on rayn when Steveling has still "yet to open his mouth"?

This is the best post in the thread so far.

On April 02 2014 12:24 gumshoe wrote:

On April 02 2014 10:29 raynpelikonoshi wrote:

On April 02 2014 10:25 Holyflare wrote:
Regardless of the poofter read, mderg is just stating things and asking for explanation rather than pointing out and elaborating his own opinions and forming reads.

I noticed this too. I asked Koshi what does he think of this mderg guy and he said it seemed strage how he came in straight up defending the one dude in our group. Too crazy that he instant defended a scumbuddy out of nowhere so if mderg guy ends up being scum gumshoe can die in a fire.

It all fits!

~rayn

It all fits huh?

I attacked Steveling at the start to bait you, Mderg went in to defend Steveling against me.

I´m not Rayn... but Steveling really likes to watch champions league and I know it can be taxing to watch close and exciting games. So there´s probably not much to tell from this.

Why would my scum buddy come in to disagree with me? Wouldnt mderg bieng scum implicate Steveling, not me?

And why would I press him back?

Whats your relation to Steveling, whats your general impression of his play and why did you feel the need to answer a question intended for someone else. Do you think Rayn is scum?

How does any of this fit? Do you think me and mderg are scum together?

What was your bait supposed to accomplish gumshoe? Did you catch rayn? I

Please explain what your bait accomplished gumshoe. I don't see the benefit. All I see is you making a bullshit post and mderg disgreeing with it in quit a natural manner. Also if mderg is scum it says nothing about Steveling's alignment.

Does every play ever work? No, it didn't and they don't. I wanted to see if he'd jump on Steve for something small, he didn't, I moved on, thats literally it. Rayn knows I do this as town, he knows I play this way, he always green reads me when were together for doing shit like this. Yet this game everything I say is scummy BECAUSE IT HAS TO BE, Rayn has not liked a single thing I said because he literally can't.

literally can't? Because?

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 12:54 GMT

#714

On April 02 2014 19:28 Steveling wrote:

Show nested quote +

Will do.

When are you going to follow up on this Steveling?

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:07 GMT

#721

On April 02 2014 21:55 gumshoe wrote:

Show nested quote +

On April 02 2014 21:49 raynpelikonoshi wrote:

On April 02 2014 21:47 gumshoe wrote:

On April 02 2014 18:45 Palmar wrote:

On April 02 2014 12:22 Balla24 wrote:
Gumshoe that case is all over the place :/ it's hard to follow (what alignments was rayn in these quotes?) but on the ending:

How can you say this is the most damning bit of all yet you literally just did the same thing and went 90% scum on rayn when Steveling has still "yet to open his mouth"?

This is the best post in the thread so far.

On April 02 2014 12:24 gumshoe wrote:

On April 02 2014 10:29 raynpelikonoshi wrote:

It all fits huh?

I attacked Steveling at the start to bait you, Mderg went in to defend Steveling against me.

I´m not Rayn... but Steveling really likes to watch champions league and I know it can be taxing to watch close and exciting games. So there´s probably not much to tell from this.

Why would my scum buddy come in to disagree with me? Wouldnt mderg bieng scum implicate Steveling, not me?

And why would I press him back?

Whats your relation to Steveling, whats your general impression of his play and why did you feel the need to answer a question intended for someone else. Do you think Rayn is scum?

How does any of this fit? Do you think me and mderg are scum together?

literally can't? Because?

Because you need to get me or Steve lynched, Steve wasn't around and you cant bank on wether or not you can make his play out to be scummy. But you pretty much know for a fact that you can frame me ( : you've done it before in the exact same manner. Thats why every time you talk about me its like a tidal wave of confirmation bias, not a tide that rises and falls with evidence. From your view, you can't afford giving me a single townie point because it does nothing but weaken your odds of winning. Even though town Rayn would just give me the lot of them this game : P

k. So you are holding strong on this "meta" thing.
I haven't see you make 1 post about Steveling. How does he look to you?

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:10 GMT

#723

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:13 GMT

#725

Palmar:

On point #1: His reads change unnaturally. Also geript wanting to policy lynch Holyflare is 100% not a joke.
On point #2: scum geript is more passive than town geript. Also see the context, it's me who he is talking to. He thinks i might be mafia!!! geript is not passive towards people he thinks are mafia, especially me, rofl.

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:16 GMT

#730

The fact that you have no town motivation to lie in that situation.

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:17 GMT

#731

gumshoe
You still haven't commented on Steveling. Can you do so?

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:17 GMT

#733

The fact that me calling you out for lying in a situation you should not lie as town is not scummy and you paint it out to be.

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:18 GMT

#735

The fact that you cannot possibly believe the fucking shit that spews out of your mouth. Therefore you cannot be town.

~rayn

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:27 GMT

#740

On April 02 2014 22:18 gumshoe wrote:

Show nested quote +

You first, I've been waiting on your thoughts before I post mine ( : do me the curtesy?

I like his filterdive on you because he touches the same points as I do, and he did that before he filterdives us. I noticed that he didn't take a hard stance on which of us is scum after his dive even though he sees you way scummier than us. But I have no problem with that because reading his filterdive of you makes it very hard for him to not take a stance later. He clearly isn't hiding and letting rayn and you fight.

I am confident that in our group the lynch will be quite easy because you are digging yourself into such a deep tunnel and Steve seems to be quite rational & townie, making it quite easy to townread Steve and really just see your tunnel as a scum shitting up the thread rather than a townie really really being on the wrong track.

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:38 GMT

#746

On April 02 2014 22:29 gumshoe wrote:

Show nested quote +

Lol, at least we can agree on one thing XD dat timing

I would seriously suggest to start reading into other cells. Because you stopped doing that to tunnel rayn.

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:46 GMT

#754

On April 02 2014 22:42 gumshoe wrote:

Show nested quote +

I know you are but what am I : P your literally doing the exact same thing as me, but worse, also I made my case and moved on to give other reads, I'm just responding to every lie you spout about me because I know you love to say shit over and over as scum till everyone thinks its true.

If you wanna put this on the back burner so we can focus on other reads, I'm cool with that. It's up to you ( :

You know you are talking to Koshi and not rayn right? There is a distinct difference.

Anyway, Koshi is also quite convinced you are the scum. I am currently wondering if you can make insightful posts, as that is the only thing that might make me revisit my read on you.

So pls make them.

raynpelikonoshi

Cayman Islands1087 Posts

April 02 2014 13:50 GMT

#758

On April 02 2014 22:49 gumshoe wrote:

Show nested quote +

Wrong, I am talking to scum, there is no difference and I find this hydra shield pretty shitty because scum hydras always take advantage of thier dynamic because it somehow always works in their favour.

What do you think of Balla?

hmm k. w.evs.

Town.

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