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A Quiet Game of Mini Mafia - Page 4

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:10 GMT
#978
On January 09 2014 05:08 thrawn2112 wrote:
also if you were town i think you'd be a lot meaner to everyone accusing you

I would use stronger words, but I'm trying not to be belligerent and make this thread any worse than it is.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:13 GMT
#979
On January 09 2014 05:08 Corazon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2014 05:05 yamato77 wrote:
WBG, I gauge reactions of the thread as town before voting. Your point is not alignment indicative.

Then why did you make a giant post and vote Iamp straight away? No one had really talked about him before you made that post, and then you just voted for Iamp without doing your "town thing" of gauging reactions from the thread. That doesn't make sense.

I don't always do it. Jesus you're thick.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:16 GMT
#982
On January 09 2014 05:15 Corazon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2014 05:13 yamato77 wrote:
On January 09 2014 05:08 Corazon wrote:
On January 09 2014 05:05 yamato77 wrote:
WBG, I gauge reactions of the thread as town before voting. Your point is not alignment indicative.

Then why did you make a giant post and vote Iamp straight away? No one had really talked about him before you made that post, and then you just voted for Iamp without doing your "town thing" of gauging reactions from the thread. That doesn't make sense.

I don't always do it. Jesus you're thick.

You're not helping my theory that you did not really believe in your Iamp lynch and just wrote it because people were asking for activity from you.

I also wrote two other things that you're ignoring, instead choosing to focus on the one thing I've actually said I was wrong about.

Go away.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:20 GMT
#986
Don't act like you're actually reading the thread.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:20 GMT
#987
On January 09 2014 05:19 Corazon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2014 05:16 yamato77 wrote:
On January 09 2014 05:15 Corazon wrote:
On January 09 2014 05:13 yamato77 wrote:
On January 09 2014 05:08 Corazon wrote:
On January 09 2014 05:05 yamato77 wrote:
WBG, I gauge reactions of the thread as town before voting. Your point is not alignment indicative.

Then why did you make a giant post and vote Iamp straight away? No one had really talked about him before you made that post, and then you just voted for Iamp without doing your "town thing" of gauging reactions from the thread. That doesn't make sense.

I don't always do it. Jesus you're thick.

You're not helping my theory that you did not really believe in your Iamp lynch and just wrote it because people were asking for activity from you.

I also wrote two other things that you're ignoring, instead choosing to focus on the one thing I've actually said I was wrong about.

Go away.

My problem is that you failed to mention your 180 on Iamp until you just sheeped everyone else and voted for me. That's what I find scummy.

I mentioned it before.

Also, it's not sheeping when I make a fucking case on you myself.

Again, read the damn game.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:22 GMT
#989
On January 09 2014 05:21 Corazon wrote:
Everyone talks about how I'm scummy
Yamato makes a case and votes on me

That's sheeping

whatever
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:28 GMT
#996
On January 09 2014 05:24 wherebugsgo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2014 05:05 yamato77 wrote:
WBG, I gauge reactions of the thread as town before voting. Your point is not alignment indicative.


Sure, everyone gauges reactions, but the manner matters.

Most townies will often confidently push their lynch, even if sometimes they are not truly completely confident, because if their argument is persuasive, then it will gain momentum on its own merits. I do not believe that you are an exception to this.

You pushed a weak case on a player who was obviously not being suspected by many players, if any at all. That he was unsuspected was pretty obvious even though no one actually outright said so. As town, if I had a dissenting opinion and I thought it was important enough to vote the target more than 24 hours into the day I'd probably come back yelling at people to not become complacent and let someone like iamp slip through the cracks as "towny enough". Yet, you didn't do that. You even knew the vote wasn't valid and you didn't bother reaffirming it.

A person's vote in the game is pretty much the only thing we can truly hold them accountable for, because regardless of what they say the vote is what ultimately matters. This is just basics, anyone who has played the game as much as you should know it. I don't think you're a bad player and thus the avenue you took regarding iamp is really scummy.

For anyone who is interested, try reading these following posts and try to guess Yamato's alignment in each. I've pulled almost all of these from day 1s of games in an attempt to keep them mostly homogeneous, though they may come from games of different sizes and types.

+ Show Spoiler +

yamato77 wrote:
I'm really only interested in figuring out the alignments of Marv and Hapa, because if they are town they will figure the rest of you out and we'll win the game. If they are scum we lynch them and the game becomes far easier to figure out. So forgive me for ignoring everyone else, my posts will be focused on them.

First of all, the way Marv entered the thread earlier today acting superior is a "holier than thou" attitude that I would not expect from town Marv towards two players he has played with so much in the past (Oats and myself). Mind you, his interactions with us basically served no purpose other than to establish his early activity, discredit my early vote, and to shit up the thread with Oats. He doesn't think either of us are mafia. Plenty of mafia motivation in his actions there. Since then, of course, he's been pro-town, but I know he's more than capable of that for at least a few hours.

What is even more perplexing to me is that Hapa, when questioned about the alignment of Marv, specifically said that this did not look like a "holier-than-thou" scum-Marv. If Hapa was town and Marv scum, he may be the only one well-versed enough in the wiles of mafia Marvellosity to truly push his lynch, but this shows that he's either not reading Marv very closely or has pre-decided what he thinks of Marv with some information from out of the thread. Either way, this is what a mafia Hapa would be like regarding Marv as either alignment. I may yet be wrong and this could be attributable to Hapa being up late and tired from all the awesome DotA we played, but it's something to note.

Aside from those interactions, I've yet to be particularly impressed by the scumhunting efforts of either player, but it is still in the first half of D1 and there is time yet to do better. Hapa going after debears was not what I usually see out of him as town.

If anyone wants to talk about the alignment of these two, feel free to respond. I will be on thread later.



+ Show Spoiler +

yamato77 wrote:
Mattchew, what exactly is a "sandroba type player" to you?

And how does he differ from Marv in the early game?

I agree that catching Marv early is hard, but I don't know how that makes him different from Sandro. Is sandro easy to catch as mafia or something?

Also, I don't understand how you think playing with the assumption that marv = town is a good idea. While he's often pro-town as mafia or scum, wouldn't you not want to let yourself be influenced by marv's opinions on the alignments of players if he is mafia?



+ Show Spoiler +

On February 15 2013 16:20 yamato77 wrote:
Let me walk you through my thought process on Zess, since that seems to be what people think I'm not explaining.

When someone starts the game as he did, voting a player under "random" pretensions, I immediately am inclined to think they're mafia. It's a very dumb way to look like you're playing around and being funny with the rest of town, when in reality you're starting what sometimes becomes a trend, establishing an early atmosphere of voting people on a whim, for almost no reason at all. It is in these types of environments that mafia thrive.

And indeed, it did turn into a trend as soon as he threw his vote on me for something completely townie, and barely justifying it. How is me trying to figure out people's alignments scummy? To be clear, when I "insinuated" that Mattchew/Syllo were mafia, I was in the process of attempting to get information that would lead me toward their alignment. i consider the possibility that they are mafia, because in some way, what they're doing could come from a mafia perspective. In fact, since that time, the information I've been able to ascertain has told me the opposite, they seem town.

Why does he want to paint me scum so quick for this? And indeed, when I indirectly ask about his read, he says he hasn't called me scum. What sense does this make? If anything, it only serves to strengthen my bias against him, that he's not playing to figure out my alignment, he's playing to stir shit up with me and fuck off with his reads. His other "reads" have been very noncommittal, especially with regards to Marv, where he says he "agrees with Toad" (who has voted for Marv) and then lists a whole bunch of reasons he isn't jumping on it. Waiting for the opportune moment, I presume?

Perhaps I haven't really explained myself thoroughly up to this point, but when you look at him from my perspective, Zess' play makes no sense for a townie. The fact that he's continued to be spammy and contentless since my early vote on him only serves to steel my resolve. Dude is mafia.



Many of them only really make sense in context, though (the previous one might be one of those)

With that said, check out his filter from this game as well:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=373946&user=yamato77&view=all

Notice the tone, try to put yourself in the shoes of the player from both alignments. What makes more sense? The timestamps are also helpful, as they give an insight into activity level.



Look dude, I made the vote to see what he'd do. If he did nothing else in response, I would have been fine lynching him. But he didn't, and his response was townish, and I dropped a case I admittedly didn't think was that strong after seeing how the thread responded to it.

End of story.

Meta comparisons are not strong here. I am not playing like I have as town in the past.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:29 GMT
#998
If I make it to D2 I'll probably actually try harder.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:46 GMT
#1022
@WoS

Did you read Extractor?

That's why I'm demoralized.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 08 2014 20:47 GMT
#1024
Look, if people other than Corazon disagree with my case on Corazon, or have reasons to think he's town, we're at the eleventh hour, so lets sort this out so I can not get mislynched in two consecutive games.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:19 GMT
#1118
NAILED HIM

SSSSSSKKKKKKIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:22 GMT
#1120
My faith in humanity is restored. Someone accusing me for really stupid things for once is ACTUALLY MAFIA

WHAT THE HELL GUYS, WHO KNEW THAT COULD HAPPEN
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:26 GMT
#1121
So, my thought is that AT LEAST ONE scum was probably accusing me trying to get my lynched right up until a certain point where Cora told his scumbuddies he was giving up, or it became painfully obvious that he would be lynched over me. I almost guarantee that one of the late switchers is mafia.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:28 GMT
#1124
Also, unless you think our (theoretical) plan as scum was to hard bus each other and be the only real wagons D1, I consider myself confirmed town from this point forward. Not that I am going to stop solving the game, but that I expect people to stop accusing me and actually converse with me about my reads until such time as I am shot by mafia.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:35 GMT
#1127
On January 09 2014 09:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2014 09:28 yamato77 wrote:
Also, unless you think our (theoretical) plan as scum was to hard bus each other and be the only real wagons D1, I consider myself confirmed town from this point forward. Not that I am going to stop solving the game, but that I expect people to stop accusing me and actually converse with me about my reads until such time as I am shot by mafia.


stfu you're confirmed nothing at this point.

If the vote was between two scum yesterday the incentive to bus would have been incredibly strong. So no, your alignment is completely divorced from corazon and the fact that you would dare try to use his flip in such a manner without actually having done anything is incredibly scummy.

whatever dude, we're not lynching me

you don't lynch the counterwagon to scum the day after you lynch scum.

plus, he called me mafia extremely early on and voted me. like I said, for this to be the case, we would literally have had to have planned it from the beginning.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:36 GMT
#1128
On January 09 2014 09:34 wherebugsgo wrote:
also you didn't push him until it was amply clear that your case on iamperfection wasn't going to fly.

Don't try to pretend that us pressuring you into providing a corazon vote was actually you pushing corazon independently. I'm sure had anyone been dumb enough to agree with you on iamperfection you would never have bothered switching to Cora.

iamp was the reason I switched off iamp

but whatever, just don't go into D2 thinking you're going to lynch me and let me play the game independent of all of you yelling at me.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:46 GMT
#1131
On January 09 2014 09:39 wherebugsgo wrote:
no, you're just wrong. I honestly can't tell if you truly believe that, because I for a fact know how bad scum players are so readily willing to bus their teammates at the hint of weakness. This happens even early in games, simply because certain players are too bad to understand how omniscience taints their ability to understand the strength of a townie's read.

whatever

if you REALLY still think I could be scum after that flip, you're seriously paranoid
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 00:53 GMT
#1134
Thrawn's vote sitting there next to Cora's is pretty hilarious.
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 05:57 GMT
#1219
On January 09 2014 14:54 thrawn2112 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
(few weeks back) Corazon: Hey man hows life hey you wanna never accuse each other in future mafia games?

(few weeks back - 1 day) Thrawn: yea sounds good esp if they are hosted by aquanim

^^ Proof that Corazon has reason to not attack me


Anyway I've decided gumshoe isn't mafia because I finally think he's serious about this.

rofl
Writer@WriterYamato
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
January 09 2014 06:04 GMT
#1224
I'll do stuff.
Writer@WriterYamato
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