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Alakaslam
United States17323 Posts
Ppl, srsly I live in California. Raynepelikoneet have you read Hopeless1der's filter? Do you know that I openly admitted to the hypocrisy of what I was doing in my case? However! It also was a "for lack of alternative" vote, through a townread/non-read on others at the time, so I am going to filter Yamato and Kush now. I still claim Alakaslam cannot read Coagulation. First I'm going to reread others cases/suspicions. | ||
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
Anyway, the one overarching problem with Kush's reads, is that if everyone is scum (barring yamato because kush "ran out of space"), then it's kush that has the problem, not the targets. I could see a kush/yam scumteam. | ||
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Alakaslam
United States17323 Posts
On January 05 2014 20:35 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alakaslam i want you to clarify a couple of things: You made a case on Hopeless based on him proposing a random lynch and his voting behavior. 1) The random lynch is in fact a random lynch so how is that alignment indicative? Why does proposing a random lynch at the start of the game make Hopeless mafia? 2) Where exactly is Hopeless soft-defending gumshoe on D1, i can't see it? 3) If you are stanfding behind your accusation of Hopeless soft-defending gumshoe, how can you say you were not doing the same thing? In my opinion you (using your terms and logic) are "soft-defending" gumshoe just as much as Hopeless as your voting behavior and stance on random lynch matches exactly Hopeless' on D1. 4) Who is the other mafia in your opinion besides Hopeless? Seeing this again I believe you will want a point by point defense. 1)The fact that the lynch is random means he can actually control it- I.E. Lie that he ran it through RNG because if it is truly random we wouldn't even expect to get the same result and if it isn't truly random he can game the math. HOWEVER THIS DOESNT FORCE HIM TO BE MAFIA. I think you jump to conclusions really fast Rayne, what makes him Mafia is the points I made in tandem, and a lack of other full reads at the time- I admit it was probably rash but I stand by my perception that he is scummy- even still. 2) he keeps being correct- saying that stuff you accused him of doesn't mean he is scum (which we now know was true). Being correct on alignments is not impossible as scum, on the contrary it is significantly easier. I wouldn't use it to cry scum by itself- if town, it's just proper town play. Which segways into my answer for 3) I actually agreed with him on both counts at the time- I wasn't sure gumshoe was scum, it took my epic failure read on you to make me decide I really should let better hunters make the decisions. Finally, the answer to 4) I would like to find out now. Going to read others cases and probably Yamato and Kush contain the other scum. DISCLAIMER: this is me stating the opinions of others and trusting that for a bit. I will develop my own reads and post them in the evening since my relatives are visiting to- I mean, because I will be eating dinner  Blazinghand May even post pictures for proof- so please don't hammer someone questionable till I get back? Make sure it is totes scum before you pull such shenannies. ... Eh what do I know. If my not all that reliable anyway scum hunting doesn't make it before lynch, do what you see as right. But there is no need to rush. | ||
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Alakaslam
United States17323 Posts
Seems like a lot of people think Kush Yamato, I will now find out why. | ||
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Alakaslam
United States17323 Posts
On January 06 2014 02:39 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Yamato is at L-1. If he flips green then I want hopeless to die. Because fuck 2 mafia being inside kush/coag/slam--that's just cruel by BH. Real quick I want to agree but point out not because setup speculation but because hopeless is already a scum read who is pushing Yamato. So if Yamato is green it is another peripheral to hopeless being scum. | ||
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Alakaslam
United States17323 Posts
On January 06 2014 02:40 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: If Yamato is red then Hopeless super town and we pretty much win the game. This is a great reason to plynch Yamato, ASSUMING THAT IS TRUE- can you back your statement up Cheesecake? However, I will read Yamato for myself now. | ||
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kushm4sta
United States8878 Posts
On January 06 2014 03:39 Alakaslam wrote: This is a great reason to plynch Yamato, ASSUMING THAT IS TRUE- can you back your statement up Cheesecake? However, I will read Yamato for myself now. a great reason to lynch yamato is some half baked connection theory??? ok.. Sometimes I can't even believe the scummy shit that comes out of people's mouths and no one else notices it. Yamato said he was busy. He said his activity would pick up soon. Give him time to return and do something for jesus sakes. | ||
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
On January 06 2014 03:51 kushm4sta wrote: a great reason to lynch yamato is some half baked connection theory??? ok.. Sometimes I can't even believe the scummy shit that comes out of people's mouths and no one else notices it. Yamato said he was busy. He said his activity would pick up soon. Give him time to return and do something for jesus sakes. We've given him way more than 8 hours On January 05 2014 05:21 yamato77 wrote: this is still a possibility, by the way. I'll be back later (in about 8 hours). DON'T LYNCH ANYONE WHILE I AM GONE. After my shift today, I am off for two days and can totally devote the time to solving this game for certain. He promised he would be solving this game by now? | ||
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
On January 06 2014 04:35 yamato77 wrote: I have the time today. Take your votes off me and give me time to work. No explanation, no unvote. | ||
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On December 31 2013 02:49 Blazinghand wrote: 5. This game follows an instant simple majority lynch. The instant a player has the majority of votes on him, the day ends. So if there are 8 players you need 5 to lynch, if there are 7 players you need 4 to lynch. Looks like there's a discrepancy. According to the OP yamato is at L-2 | ||
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phagga
Switzerland2194 Posts
Hopeless1der (2) - Yamato77, Alakaslam Alakaslam (1) - kushm4sta Yamato77 (3) - Hopeless1der, Mr. Cheesecake, [UoN]Sentinel With 8 alive it takes 5 to lynch | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On January 06 2014 02:49 raynpelikoneet wrote: Doesn't it take 5 to lynch when there is 8 alive? by 4 i obviously meant 5 get with the program | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On January 06 2014 03:59 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: We've given him way more than 8 hours He promised he would be solving this game by now? I did have to sleep last night at some point after staying up until 5AM. | ||
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Mr. Cheesecake
United States3756 Posts
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Mr. Cheesecake
United States3756 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On January 05 2014 19:47 raynpelikoneet wrote: Well you are mafia because the only post where you give any sort of reads is a post where you doubt all the players in the game. Including the blue claims, which means there must be more blues or your post is completely useless. If there are no more blues than the climed ones it cannot be possible that the claims are mafia. You are not trying to resolve this situation by asking the real blues to claim (which would solve the game since we have a mislynch), therefore your only real post in this game is completely bullshity. You, yamato, are one of the most obvious town players there is on the planet. You have opinions as town, at least when the game is on D2 and there are two flips which one of them is mafia, and night actions to analyze. The only thing you can come up with is a bullshit theory about scum shooting their own and all the blues in the game fakeclaiming with no counter claims. This is like the most obvioius mafia catch in the game. I doubted the blue claims because instantly believing claims in a semi-open setup is pretty silly. I had not yet thought about any of them seriously when I posted at the start of the day. The reads I posted then were, as I said before, formed mostly overnight during the silent phase, and done hastily mostly as my own notes. As you can see later on, I did consider the claims and came to the conclusion that of the three, I trusted you the least because of how you have been playing today and the unconfirmed nature of your claim. However, I also very clearly came to the conclusion that it wasn't worth lynching you today, rather that I should focus on the unconfirmed players. Of those four, Slam is the towniest. Other people disagree, but he is obviously trying this game and appears to be thinking things through in a clear manner. I have explained this at length, so it's not worth discussing further, we are not lynching him today. Kush is the next towniest. I had no read before today, but he's put in real effort today and actually seems to be thinking about my alignment. I don't think scum kush fights my lynch at all, let alone as hard as he has today.He simply has no reason to. Between Hopeless/Coag, Coag is actually townier, but not by much. Both of them could definitely be mafia, but I feel like lynching Hopeless more. I'll explain my Hopeless read at length later on. On January 05 2014 21:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: So this is what yamato is suggesting. There are three blue claims. Me, Mr.SexyCake, and Sentinel can't all be mafia, so there are 2 scenarios he is considering: 1) Mr.CC and Sentinel are both fake-claiming and i am telling the truth. This can't possibly be true because that would mean there would be another blue claim and they would have shot their own scumbuddy. Town mislynched on D1 so instead of trying to mislynch on D2 they are giving town a mislynch by shooting their scumbuddy and instantly losing the game if someone claims blue on D2 (if someone claims we lynch one of Sent/CC or the blue claim - if the blue claim turns up blue, scum lose). This is ridiculosu to even consider. 2) I decided to fakeclaim parity cop 1h into the game instead of just not claiming. This makes no sense given that yamato knows how confident i am at my scumplay. Let's entertain a scenario that i did something very stupid (which i would never do) as mafia. The only reason i would do that as mafia is to assume there is no parity cop in the game - because one-one trade is ridiculous in a game where i can just mislynch 2 townies and win the game. There is no counter-claim. I have gained the town credit i was looking for. Good. What's my next move. I decide to buss my teammate thrawn by asking a vigilante to shoot him on N1. I already know there is no parity cop in the game because noone counter-claimed me, so the reasonable assumption is that there is a vigilante in the game. So i made a stupid and a risky claim that could end up in a 1-1 trade, when it worked, i make a stupid move that risks my scumbuddy being shot or lynched on D2 for town-credit i have already gained from my fake claim. In addition to all this stupidness thrawn, my scumbuddy, does not give me the town credit from my fake claim (which was the point of my scumteam in the first place) but instead attacks me and we go 1vs1 with him ensuring we pretty much tunnel each other on D2 - that will most likely end up in one of us getting lynched. So me, raynpelikoneet, did this as mafia, instead of... just lynching townies and playing scum as i normally do, by controlling the thread. Ridiculous. Based purely on yamato even considering something this stupid he is mafia, 100%. I've addressed the claim situation, you're taking this a bit far. You fakeclaim often as both alignments, I do not trust you at all in any situation involving claims. On January 05 2014 22:38 Hopeless1der wrote: This post is from TL LXIII where BH tried to use an RNG lynch as his mayoral campaign. From that same game, here is yamato's reactions to NOT getting made mayor and being subsequently shot N1. hiss gg post Also, yamato's general opinion of me, again from LXIII This is thin. Many people have used my extremely good town games against me when I have a slow start. I don't always play the same and I don't always have the time to devote to being super town. I know the difference between when I've been playing well and look townie and a game like this where I am under fire most of the time. Look at D1 of Thug Life, for an example of a town game similar to this one. As for my opinion of you, yes, you are often useless, HOWEVER, you are tunneling me blindly on ridiculously thin grounds based on ONE GAME of meta. You are not this bad of a town player. Plus, as was pointed out by Kush, you were fishy with your opinion of gumshoe D1 and have also sheeped Rayn hard today in calling me mafia, which is a sharp turn away from your early posts where you say I deserve time. It just doesn't add up unless you are mafia. On January 05 2014 22:52 Hopeless1der wrote: If you have time, or happen to remember LXIII, yamato is absolutely capable of providing a compelling and eloquent argument. He has multiple large posts that arent simply a summary they are brief analyses of players that demonstrate critical thought and scrutiny. In this game, his list posts are lacking in this regard. I especially have a problem with the fact that he has a documented history of thinking I'm generally useless and has found sufficient reasoning in "my filter" to say I should be lynched with fire. As rayn already noted, Yamato has been trying to cast doubt on the blueclaims There are no counterclaims, that is evidence by itself. Unless yamato is counterclaiming (and he hasnt to my knowledge) then the simple answer is that all the night action claims are legit. Rayn's needs to be scrutinized at this point, but imo his claim also checks out. Ergo 3 confirmed town for the sake of limiting our scope of analysis unless there are counterclaims. Where does yamato fall on this list of townliness? No one else thinks its strange that he doesn't consider himself a viable shot? Especially after the points I pulled from LXIII about him knowing he was about to die before he was shot? This is unnecessary fluff rayn has covered this beautifully already here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=20533299 coag, kush, hopeless as possible mafia. convenient that slams missing. I guess he's being readable this game and the 3 of us aren't? You don't need to be scummy to be mafia in yamato's game, you just need to be lurk or troll and that is sufficient. . I had explained my read on Slam multiple times by now, so that is not a point against me. You other three are the only other players worth looking at today, and I've talked about that at length earlier in this post. Does anyone else feel the need for me to respond to anything else? If not, I'll be working through exactly why Hopeless is mafia in a subsequent post. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On January 06 2014 05:09 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Also: Why did your "night reads" list have thrawn as red? I don't understand why, if you were town and had a scumread on him, you wouldnt explain it during your post when day broke. You couldnt have known thrawn would die so some explanation of this read would have been necessary I did explain the read, he was low activity and Sentinel did point out the terribad vote. Classic scum thrawn. | ||
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