On August 09 2013 22:58 iamperfection wrote: why are you busy vivax?
I just came to my hometown in Austria from Rome (2 days ago) after some gipsies stole my wallet in the metro the day of departure, now I had to replace all the cards I had in it, driver licence mainly. My passport runs out the 19th of August and I need to renew it, I also need to deliver some shit for a transfer to uni here, I'm seeing all my old friends again and one of them has birthday today.Tomorrow and the day after we'll probably go camping if the weather allows it.
Jokes aside, gut says town, but forgetting about the people you wanna lynch didn't impress me.
Reminds me of johhnywup. His answers to my enquiry seemed okayish (except that I didn't see his "sort-of" reads he talked about, but when the pressure was off he made a nice summary list of houses and fucked off without scumhunting. I'd put him on the hitlist for now.
Sharrant posted zero but is active in PMs? Anyone who's in pm contact with him, please post a read immediately and everything he's done so far that's worth of notice. Sharrant is usually a very active and talkative player and if he didn't contribute anything meaningful yet he should be killed.
I am seriously underwhelmed by Sharrant's entrance. The quantity seems fine, the quality sucks. All that talk to give an almost psychoanalytic townread on kush? Cool, now we know he calls people fags, what the fuck does that even have to do with anything?
I'm actually interested into knowing Sharrant's read on Acrofales rather than having his question answered before he does that cause it rather looks like he's trying to steer discussion into a direction without giving his own opinion first. Not to mention that Oberyn already talked about Acrofales. Sharrant could simply look it up.
On August 10 2013 02:44 Oatsmaster wrote: koshi too dick to be scum. MY FINAL READ ON KOSHI.
I've actually come to the conclusion that lords should kill Koshi today.
- He becomes resigned when people meta townread Oats, he doesn't fight for his read. - He seems to ignore any other options for scummers, as if Oats was the only possible scum in the game. - He posts few and not derpy/confident/i don't give a fuck like he usually did as town in the last few games.
I also endorse a Sharrant kill so far for reasons mentioned. I'd have expected much more from a guy who didn't do jack all game except in PM-land, posting a rather questionable meta-read on kush isn't what we're exactly in need of, and he should know that if he was town. We need targets.
On August 10 2013 01:25 raynpelikoneet wrote: Okay, we need to start deciding stuff soon.
iamp, i am okay with your proposed shot. Lord KP should be used to vig lurkers, at least on N1. How many of the lords do we want to vig a single target? 2? more? For me 2 seems fine.
As for lynch targets, so far i think:
Solstice - I called his thought process fishy earlier. This is what i meant. Solstice does not want Dandel to be a lord. He says, when Dandel is town, he probably does good stuff as a lord. When he is scum, he will most likely out himself. Then he doesn´t want to elect Dandel, because he can´t be sure if he is town. I don´t like that, at all. By Solstice´s thinking, he should definitely elect Dandel and noone else. It will give him a near 100% read on Dandel, as he himself said. Why does he not want to immediately figure out Dandel´s alignment? Later on he says that "Dandel will out him either way". Has he? I see no mention of Dandel´s alignment by Solstice after that.
johnnywup - There are two things why i think johnnywup is mafia. The first one is his overly defensive stance on his 3p thing. When being questioned about that in thread, his first comment is "other people did not find that scummy". That´s really going overboard if you are town, why would you be more interested to tell people that other people did not find you scummy rather than if they thought you were right or wrong and how did you end up in the conclusion? Another thing that stands out is johnnywup´s house member list. In itself list posts are bad, but this is worse. He hasn´t even put a single bit off thought into the lise (notice him not realizing in which house Vivax/Gumshoe are). Scummy as fuck.
Onegu - Onegu has not done anything. Lika anything at all. If you look at his posts he is entering rendom discussions for what? To have nothing to say. Look at when he tells he has already given his thoughts about Solstice & Clarity. His conclusion on Solstice is "we need to hear from him". Right. On Clarity he redacted from his town read because he was not willing find out about role names. So his whole discussion & conclusion is worthless. Now he is trying to figure out FirmTofu. Nothing on that front. scum.
For the record, noone in my house has had any contact with me on D1. I have been PMing the other lords all the time i have been online, and i would expect if they have something to ask, they will. I am not going to try to do everything and i have had pretty much nothing to say to them. So FT/Risen/nachodude if you got something to ask or something you want to discuss feel free to PM me.
Vivax, when i asked you about my scumreads, why didn´t you answer me and asked me about someone else instead?
Didn't read them at the time. I just read you and noticed that you called s0lstice fishy earlier but then only mentioned those three guys, then you said it's cause they're scummier. Thought it was obvious already why I asked it?
Is Sharrant still on your vigi list or do you have something more to go with at this point than just considering him as a policy lynch?
Hey, Vivax, you're the perfect one to answer this. You actually hydra'ed with Kush. The question was whether Kush says 'fags' normally. Does he? You would know much better than I.
I can only tell you that Kush likes the word ANAL. I prefer not having to draw conclusions from someone using specific derogative terms. You could let him do a IAT with town-scum categories and have him post the results here, that would be serious shit.
Is there anyone specific you're trying to present to your lord for lynching?
jrkirby hasn't set off any red flags yet in PMs, though similar to Acro, I question how they come to the both town conclusion so easily. In this case, I'd be more suspicious of Acro, rather than kirby due to experience. Kirby is going to find himself shot if he's not posting in the thread more though.
On August 10 2013 03:13 Xatalos wrote: Is jrkirby really scum?
I'd be opposed to his lynch right now.
He did not post more. You don't want to shoot him.
I know of him that he's a newbie and as such he might not know how to play most efficiently, and what the game's "meta" is, but I don't really like how you argue about his alignment.
When you don't know how they reach the conclusion, you simply base it on their experience if it's scummy or not. Then you only try to judge kirby on the amount of his posts, but also say "he's going to find himself shot". You make it sound as if you wouldn't want to be the guy pulling the trigger but could understand if someone did.
He didn't post more, but now you openly oppose it.
If you got any extended read from your PMs with him it would be the time to share it, and an opinion from you on his in-thread post would help as well.
If you had to shoot someone right now, who would it be?
On a side note, I mentioned to Acro that I was going to make a case against yamato and was wondering if he would be willing to support me. After being afk in PMs for the first 48 hours, yamato suddenly opens up and is interested in talking. He also feels necessary to call me town and post in the thread explaining his inactivity. I don't want to make a connection read without either player flipped, but it is something to consider later on.
Oberyn, can you tell me more about this yammo stuff? What's his explanation of inactivity we don't see in the thread? What do you think makes yammo scum exactly? Cause you wanna shoot him but I see no case, which you announced you would make.
I'm mainly curious about it cause both yammo and kirby seem to have rl reasons for their inactivity and you present jkirby's reasons and buy them but keep the yammo matter rather under the rug.
On August 10 2013 08:49 johnnywup wrote: thats not what i said
and i never said its a meaningful contribution but making a list and not knowing which house two people are in doesn't make me look mafia
i'm not saying i'm contributing from that post but someone asked for a list and I wanted it put into a post for convenience sake so i made it. it's just something i thought would be nice and people could refer back to if they needed. i don't understand how that makes me look like mafia?
Go more in depth about your FT scumread please, you give me the impression you aren't reading the thread properly and only throw in some half-assed scumread to calm down the waters. If you're defensive, town and know it, you could try to change that and actually show some interest into finding out who's scum.
Instead you don't seem to show any interest whatsoever into covnincing the lords to get to the right lynch, only to survive, and that seems a lot like scum play.
Most of my house seems interested into lynching Onegu, although I still need to get a clearer picture from PMs. Oats is like disappeared currently, still waiting for a few replies. I'm kinda unsure on the choice but I can't find any particular reason for assuming Onegu is town at this point either.
I feel that some of the points brought up against him are also similar to stuff that others are similarly guilty of: Lack of sharing scumreads, and lack of interest, I can't tell if he's genuinely busy though and would argue that someone like johnny has a similar style but doesn't have an excuse.
I think the currently most viable options for the lords to consolidate are Onegu, yammo and johnnywup. I don't think I got them too convinced on Koshi.
Of those available I endorse both a yammo and a johnnywup lynch. Oberyn's points from his pm traffic seem very strong and so far I don't recall yammo fighting back to those properly, which is not townie from someone I would expect to be more headstrong.
Johnny is scummy for reasons that I hopefully clarified for everyone.
Onegu is an okayish lynch but not the best in my opinion, I'd give him some time to see if his claim of being busy is legit. In that case his activity should pick up.
On August 10 2013 09:44 raynpelikoneet wrote: Vivax what's your read on FT?
He's unusually inactive and I still have some unanswered questions. Seems like another solid lynch, unless he shows up with some bombastic posts before deadline. On theother hand, similarly to Onegu though we still don't have reaction to the current developments, whereas johnnywup keeps shining through lack of scumhunting even in his activity.
There's still the matter of houses handing out KP, this isn't just about the lynch, it's also about lords deciding who should be a prime choice for house kp. Thing is, after deadline the other suspects can't post, only talk to their house members.
I'd say consolidate on someone who is more actively scummy for the lynch, and leave inactives to be scrutinized during the night by their respective houses, when they might have had the chance to catch up from inactivity.
So Oberyn fakeclaimed watcher and Onegu fakeclaimed medic in an attempt to lure out the scum roleblocker? Fine idea, risky play. You also had the potential to scare a potential town jailkeeper into claiming.
Xatalos, Onegu points out in an answer to Grack that the latter knew of Onegu's PM activity without being supposed to know. He could only know if Oberyn passed that information to you, and you to Grackaroni. Did this exchange happen?
On August 09 2013 18:00 Grackaroni wrote: Finally read the thread, I am most suspicious of Jrkirby. First off Nobody in House Martell has gotten a good read off of him because nobody in House Martell really talked to each. The best contribution in thread he made was calling out S0lstice for not electing his town read and naming 2 people town who the majority of town has already agreed were town.
After that he started making posts such
On August 09 2013 06:35 jrkirby wrote: Finally, why have all the houses not posted a list of their members yet?
I think that it's actually beneficial to town to post these lists, and here's why:
1) Once scum have a list of 5 of the houses, they have a list of every house.
2) in a 24 player game, scum almost guaranteed have 4-6 members. Scum are spread out (I think it's random or something, right?) so they already know probably 3-4 houses at the start.
3) 2 (or is it 3?) houses have already posted their list. There's a good chance this fills in the missing info for scum.
4) All the house lists will probably be posted by day 2 anyway. Scum will only be missing this info for a short time.
5) Scum know all the lords already. This further helps them fill in the gaps.
6) Knowing the houses is not too beneficial to scum. Scum are more likely to want to eliminate every non-scum player in a house than an entire house (based off my possibly flawed logic - they can use this to WIFOM, be careful).
7) Knowing the houses is beneficial to town. We can help predict who will be lord in later days, we can help predict who is likely to be shot. We know who can PM a certain player, so it's easier to find people with reads on them. We don't think two people are on a scumteam together when they're just house buddies. Things are simpler, we don't get confused when REDACTED is posted. The list goes on.
8) Displaying all houses gives more info to town than it gives to scum.
9) Transparency is beneficial to town, and giving out house lists helps with transparency.
I can think of one good reason why we might not want to give out house lists:
1) There might be 3P that wants to eliminate a house, or secondary objectives for scum to eliminate a house. This is entirely speculation though, so I don't put too much weight into it.
This is a post that I would be ok with if it was in the start of the game, but he chose to talk about this during a time when scumhunting was actually taking place and he could actually participate in conversation.
On August 09 2013 06:41 jrkirby wrote: One question I would like to ask the thread: Does anyone KNOW how much HP they have? I do not know how much HP I have. If you know, obviously I'm not asking you to announce how much HP you have to the thread. Actually, don't even say that you know how much HP you have. I just want to announce that I do not know how much HP I have.
This could be beneficial to town because then they can do better speculation on what people's roles are like.
Choosing to talk about setup rather than scumhunting and he has already disappeared without really pressuring or conversing with anybody
Everyone else has seemed engaged in the current conversations and actively scumhunting and these posts just didn't fit in with what I think a townie would be posting about during the time of the thread. He seems like he is more interested in blending into town than scumhunting.
There was an exchange between Oats and Yamato at the start of the game that rubbed me the wrong way. It was so disruptive and anti-town, that I have trouble believing that it came from 2 town players. It didn't seem normal to me and I even got a little bit of a staged feeling (as in they could be both scum randomly attacking each other at the start of the game). I think remember someone claiming they were probably town for being aggressive but some scum are more comfortable getting in arguments with people to help buff up their post count and mask their lack of contributions.
@Xata/Clarity/anyone awake. Is there anybody you would like me to comment on before i go to bed?
I wanted to point out this post, first how does he know we havent talked to jrkirby much, actually at this point in time I had actually started to PM more often than I had been, graken isnt a lord and we didnt say to much in post about our pms with jrkirby, it was yamato we hadnt talked to much. He also talks about blending in but thats not what jrkirby did he brought up points that werent being talked about. Jrkirby always looks scummy and is a very easy target for scum to pick up on and make it look like they are searching scum when they are just going after a weaker player.
He then goes on with a bunch of short posts agreeing with random things and basicly dropping kirby. And stays talking about the DI s0l thing alot. Then once he sees a bandwagon starting he jumps on it saying I should be voted. And he goes back and forth on the gumshoe kill and what happened alot. I have a slight scum read on him.
On August 09 2013 18:00 Grackaroni wrote: Finally read the thread, I am most suspicious of Jrkirby. First off Nobody in House Martell has gotten a good read off of him because nobody in House Martell really talked to each. The best contribution in thread he made was calling out S0lstice for not electing his town read and naming 2 people town who the majority of town has already agreed were town.
After that he started making posts such
On August 09 2013 06:35 jrkirby wrote: Finally, why have all the houses not posted a list of their members yet?
I think that it's actually beneficial to town to post these lists, and here's why:
1) Once scum have a list of 5 of the houses, they have a list of every house.
2) in a 24 player game, scum almost guaranteed have 4-6 members. Scum are spread out (I think it's random or something, right?) so they already know probably 3-4 houses at the start.
3) 2 (or is it 3?) houses have already posted their list. There's a good chance this fills in the missing info for scum.
4) All the house lists will probably be posted by day 2 anyway. Scum will only be missing this info for a short time.
5) Scum know all the lords already. This further helps them fill in the gaps.
6) Knowing the houses is not too beneficial to scum. Scum are more likely to want to eliminate every non-scum player in a house than an entire house (based off my possibly flawed logic - they can use this to WIFOM, be careful).
7) Knowing the houses is beneficial to town. We can help predict who will be lord in later days, we can help predict who is likely to be shot. We know who can PM a certain player, so it's easier to find people with reads on them. We don't think two people are on a scumteam together when they're just house buddies. Things are simpler, we don't get confused when REDACTED is posted. The list goes on.
8) Displaying all houses gives more info to town than it gives to scum.
9) Transparency is beneficial to town, and giving out house lists helps with transparency.
I can think of one good reason why we might not want to give out house lists:
1) There might be 3P that wants to eliminate a house, or secondary objectives for scum to eliminate a house. This is entirely speculation though, so I don't put too much weight into it.
This is a post that I would be ok with if it was in the start of the game, but he chose to talk about this during a time when scumhunting was actually taking place and he could actually participate in conversation.
On August 09 2013 06:41 jrkirby wrote: One question I would like to ask the thread: Does anyone KNOW how much HP they have? I do not know how much HP I have. If you know, obviously I'm not asking you to announce how much HP you have to the thread. Actually, don't even say that you know how much HP you have. I just want to announce that I do not know how much HP I have.
This could be beneficial to town because then they can do better speculation on what people's roles are like.
Choosing to talk about setup rather than scumhunting and he has already disappeared without really pressuring or conversing with anybody
Everyone else has seemed engaged in the current conversations and actively scumhunting and these posts just didn't fit in with what I think a townie would be posting about during the time of the thread. He seems like he is more interested in blending into town than scumhunting.
There was an exchange between Oats and Yamato at the start of the game that rubbed me the wrong way. It was so disruptive and anti-town, that I have trouble believing that it came from 2 town players. It didn't seem normal to me and I even got a little bit of a staged feeling (as in they could be both scum randomly attacking each other at the start of the game). I think remember someone claiming they were probably town for being aggressive but some scum are more comfortable getting in arguments with people to help buff up their post count and mask their lack of contributions.
@Xata/Clarity/anyone awake. Is there anybody you would like me to comment on before i go to bed?
I wanted to point out this post, first how does he know we havent talked to jrkirby much, actually at this point in time I had actually started to PM more often than I had been, graken isnt a lord and we didnt say to much in post about our pms with jrkirby, it was yamato we hadnt talked to much. He also talks about blending in but thats not what jrkirby did he brought up points that werent being talked about. Jrkirby always looks scummy and is a very easy target for scum to pick up on and make it look like they are searching scum when they are just going after a weaker player.
He then goes on with a bunch of short posts agreeing with random things and basicly dropping kirby. And stays talking about the DI s0l thing alot. Then once he sees a bandwagon starting he jumps on it saying I should be voted. And he goes back and forth on the gumshoe kill and what happened alot. I have a slight scum read on him.
Xatalos has not been a lord once this game...
My bad, I thought Oberyn bolded the lords in his houses list lol. It was iamp. Basically, same question for iamp. Grackaroni himself didn't answer that question yet, how did he get informed of the exchange in PMs Onegu was having (to the point of saying he talked with a specific dude).
If the lords didn't tell him, then he wasn't supposed to know that, and hence is scum.
Hey Koshi, shouldn't you find it strange that Oats got elected lord of our house? Wasn't he your scumread?
There's something I want to bring to thread's attention. S & B was extraordinarily malleable in his role as lord during N1. I had to leave that day already and decided I would put my vote onto him again cause he actually agreed on yamato being a viable target. The points he mentioned for him being scummy was
1. The way we (?) have to drag everything out of him and 2. The bad push on S & B himself, but he added that he might be biased cause he was being pushed.
Initially, S & B got convinced by Calrity to vote Onegu without much resistance, he quickly agreed with clarity's arguments and I asked S & B what he liked about those reasons, then I asked clarity what he said to him.
Their arguments:
Clarity:
- Mainly: Onegu soft-defended people too quickly. - Simply doesn't seem interested, more posts in pregame
S & B:
- Agrees that pre-game banter was too much compared to in-game. - Added that he only posted a clarity townread at the time. - Sees himself as example for being soft-defended too quickly.
While being afk, S & B sent me a PM where he said he was going along with a plan from iamp and Rayn to shoot gumshoe. I can't help but feel that S & B might be scum for his low activity, I don't see much case making from him, and it looked to me like he subjectively felt uncomfortable in the lord role.
What iamp and Rayn can now do is give me more insight into S & B's decision making process and if he mentioned yamato and Onegu in the conversation with you too. I'm interested into knowing how much dedication he put into proposing them as night kills. Given yamato's likely red flip I am suspicious of the way S & B agreed with me on yamato, possibly not doing anything about it afterwards.
On August 12 2013 23:54 Vivax wrote: Hey Koshi, shouldn't you find it strange that Oats got elected lord of our house? Wasn't he your scumread?
There's something I want to bring to thread's attention. S & B was extraordinarily malleable in his role as lord during N1. I had to leave that day already and decided I would put my vote onto him again cause he actually agreed on yamato being a viable target. The points he mentioned for him being scummy was
1. The way we (?) have to drag everything out of him and 2. The bad push on S & B himself, but he added that he might be biased cause he was being pushed.
Initially, S & B got convinced by Calrity to vote Onegu without much resistance, he quickly agreed with clarity's arguments and I asked S & B what he liked about those reasons, then I asked clarity what he said to him.
Their arguments:
Clarity:
- Mainly: Onegu soft-defended people too quickly. - Simply doesn't seem interested, more posts in pregame
S & B:
- Agrees that pre-game banter was too much compared to in-game. - Added that he only posted a clarity townread at the time. - Sees himself as example for being soft-defended too quickly.
While being afk, S & B sent me a PM where he said he was going along with a plan from iamp and Rayn to shoot gumshoe. I can't help but feel that S & B might be scum for his low activity, I don't see much case making from him, and it looked to me like he subjectively felt uncomfortable in the lord role.
What iamp and Rayn can now do is give me more insight into S & B's decision making process and if he mentioned yamato and Onegu in the conversation with you too. I'm interested into knowing how much dedication he put into proposing them as night kills. Given yamato's likely red flip I am suspicious of the way S & B agreed with me on yamato, possibly not doing anything about it afterwards.
On August 12 2013 23:54 Vivax wrote: Hey Koshi, shouldn't you find it strange that Oats got elected lord of our house? Wasn't he your scumread?
Hey Vivax, wasn't I your scumread and I suggest you stop trying to get me lynched? I thought we were bros after Sicilian and that you would have my back. Like in Titanic.
Our friendship is coming to an end like this. Unless you are scum, then I can forgive you. + Show Spoiler +
If you claim now, baby seals is the way to go.
If yamato flips town Oats is my nr 1 lynch for tomorrow. But chances are pretty low.
Also, I have read the rest of your message 3 times now and I don't understand what you are saying. Who is scum?
I'll reveal my scumreads when it matters, today yamato's getting lynched. I find it interesting that you didn't show much interest when Oats was elected
On August 10 2013 09:35 raynpelikoneet wrote: johnnywup can you start making them? Who do you think is mafia?
im not pretending i have lol but that doesn't make me scum
and i can start making them but im not really motivated to atm.
if i were to pick one from every house it would be sharrant ft oats gumshoe koshi onegu i haven't been paying as much attention this game tbh and im losing interest as people continue thinking im scum. it's too much effort to prove my inoccence. if you guys think it's a good idea to kill me just night kill me and don't waste any discussion on me and try to find actual scum. im really close to not giving a shit anymore
This post shows a really defeatist attitude. Johnny isn't even under THAT much pressure, people ask him questions and he complains that everyone thinks he's scum. The only read he explains is FT, and he doesn't even push it properly. Johnny has to get in here and explain how he formed those reads at the time, if he's town he should remember.
Acro, stop insulting people please. Since you claimed that one scumread of yours is dead and the other now not suspicious anymore, I have not seen any efforts from you in figuring out who else could be scum.
EPT
