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Newbie Mini Mafia XLV - Page 2

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Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 18:08 GMT
#392
On August 01 2013 02:44 reps)squishy wrote:
I was about to vote RDaneelOlivaw, But people think Umasi and I have a alliance and to assure you I think it's kind of scummy for bandwagoning with me. So I decided ##vote Umasi

On August 01 2013 02:45 reps)squishy wrote:
sc_a.M has not posted since the game has started.
RDaneelOlivaw posted one fluff since the game started.



Just going to say he copied exactly what I have said and has no insight into anything, I am keeping my vote on reps for obvious reasons now.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 18:57 GMT
#398
On August 01 2013 03:35 Umasi wrote:
hey I'm around. I still like deus for scum, and by transition not sold on reps being scum.
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2013 17:47 infii wrote:
Unfortunately I can't be as active as I would like to be, but I'll try to post as often as I can.
So I'll go ahead and tell you my thoughts up until now after reading all the posts.

Umasi is at the top of my suspicious-list right now, because it seems he tries to stir things up and doesn't act neutral in any way. (e.g. anti deus - pro reps).
However that is not enough for me to vote on him... it's still the first day, right?

DeusXmachina took an early stance which backfired at him so now he tries to get clear of it. Seems legit aka town.

Holyflare is pretty neutral until now, which is good.

reps)squishy has stirred up some suspicion but that seemed to be unintentional, also I liked his defense.

Nightcat99 is nr. 2 on the suspicious-list. Not many posts but the few ones have a chaotic flavor to them as in trying to confuse people.

StiMaDDict acts generally neutral, seems like town.

Alakaslam's last posts were totally bonkers. No idea what he is up to.

Again, this were just my thoughts about everyone active in this discussion up until now, there are no facts that I can claim to be true or false.


Infii, why do you leave a backdoor for yourself? Why is neutrality a good thing? It's actually good to stir up discussion.
I dislike the formatting of your list, but that can wait for another day.

Show nested quote +
On July 31 2013 19:51 Holyflare wrote:
On July 31 2013 14:53 Umasi wrote:
reps, I'll tell you two useful things~
A:
If you post and want to edit the post, you can use the handy acronym EBWOP (edit by way of post) and add/rephrase whatever you want to.
B:
there's a handy quote button, use it.

Regardless~
fuck
I'm not sold on that response at all, reps. Maybe Deus actually fucking nailed you early on.
Who are your top scum reads and who are your top town reads?



I'm not sure we should be discussing peoples town reads this early on, it can be left to a later day.
It tells mafia who to kill, if they eliminate the people that people are leaning towards in town then we are still back to square one.

Mafia reads on the other hand are the things we do need to discuss;

On July 31 2013 15:53 reps)squishy wrote:
[image loading]



Stuff like this when the guy was under suspicion to begin with makes me think that he thinks he's clear after the Deus accusation and thus can afford to not fully contribute and mess around. Reps I want to hear some analysis;

1. Who do you think is mafia?
2. Are there any people that seem in collaboration?

I want some actual analysis please, not some half hearted responses.


What's wrong with discussing town reads early on? The more opinions there are out there the better. And why do you say "townreads this early are silly" and then IMMEDIATELY ask him for possible scum teams?
That felt like you were telling me my question was stupid, and immediately asking the same question. That didn't contribute anything, but it sure as shit looked like he did. And remember, general noncontributions are scummy, that's why everyone hates reps~he hasn't actually talked at all.



Town reads and scum reads are two totally different kettle of fish. If you have a solid scum read that scum is forced to behave more and more like a pro town or face the eventual lynch, this is 100% pro town as a mafia that acts pro town is more likely to slip up as he has information that we do not. A pro town mafia is better than a dodgy town especially on day 1.

As the game progresses you can garner information with your potential town reads, if you announce who your town reads are this early they will either be targets for the mafia to frame you as suspicious or narrow your circle of trust down and thus make it harder to progress with the elimination of scum.

Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 19:22 GMT
#401
Well that is where I disagree with your thought logic, everyone is a blank slate. Everyone should put 100% into proving to other townies that they are town, this means analysing posts, posting their scum reads and circles. We are the team with imperfect knowledge compared to the scum that knows who the town are and therefore have the upperhand in guiding the logic of the town.

Having a verbal waterfall while it can be useful in the early stages at getting the ball rolling does not contribute as much as you may think. It is hard to determine if someone who says everything on their mind is just doing it to fit into a town perspective and seem like a town or if they are doing it to throw people off their scum trail. I would much rather believe someone who has done a thought out analytical filtered post than somebody who is just saying what is on their mind. This is why both you and alakaslam seemed suspicious to both me and a few others earlier on.

A town read can give people a false perspective, especially post day 1 lynching, if you have posted one of your town reads that gets lynched and it flips to a scum who do you think the suspicion is drawn to? If you are a town it is better to keep these things to yourself and later on in the game you can announce who you think would be in your town circle as well as who is scum.

This video WATCH THIS TOWNIES explains some of the reasoning that I am getting behind (only 30 mins) and is also helpful for newer players who want to know how to play town.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 19:54 GMT
#409
On July 31 2013 17:47 infii wrote:
Unfortunately I can't be as active as I would like to be, but I'll try to post as often as I can.
So I'll go ahead and tell you my thoughts up until now after reading all the posts.

Umasi is at the top of my suspicious-list right now, because it seems he tries to stir things up and doesn't act neutral in any way. (e.g. anti deus - pro reps).
However that is not enough for me to vote on him... it's still the first day, right?

DeusXmachina took an early stance which backfired at him so now he tries to get clear of it. Seems legit aka town.

Holyflare is pretty neutral until now, which is good.

reps)squishy has stirred up some suspicion but that seemed to be unintentional, also I liked his defense.

Nightcat99 is nr. 2 on the suspicious-list. Not many posts but the few ones have a chaotic flavor to them as in trying to confuse people.

StiMaDDict acts generally neutral, seems like town.

Alakaslam's last posts were totally bonkers. No idea what he is up to.

Again, this were just my thoughts about everyone active in this discussion up until now, there are no facts that I can claim to be true or false.


This is his only noteworthy contribution so far, it is weak at best and is somewhere on my radar, however, it is more contribution than others have put forward. It is hard to get a read on him and I'd like some more indepth analysis from him before I make my decision.

I am also very interested to hear from Deus right now on his opinion of things.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 21:45 GMT
#422
On August 01 2013 06:22 DeusXmachina wrote:
I am back. A lot has gone on, and there is a lot I want to talk about so this is going to be a long post. The focus of this post will still be on reps, however I wanted to address a couple things first.

Alakaslam votes me because of the Kenpachi rule. Lol. That is just stupid. I never attacked a VT claim. Asking if Alakaslam can be trusted because he claimed VT super early is hardly an attack.

There is some talk on people who are being neutral and others who are not contributing that much. Honestly, I think we should wait to target these people. If they are persistently neutral or lurking throughout multiple days then we have more reason to be suspicious. That being said, why would you even want to stay neutral? Being a vocal townie is not a bad thing. Just imagine if every legit townie was trying to be extremely pro town. Scum couldn't target one specific individual, and town would have a great basis for analyzing potential scum posts, i.e. a post that was trying to appear pro town.

Okay, I still want to focus on reps. If reps is scum and he gets lynched, WOOT good job townies. If reps is a bad townie and he gets lynched, WOOT good job townies. Has anyone actually disagreed that reps is either scum or a bad townie?

Show nested quote +
On July 31 2013 07:59 reps)squishy wrote:
So I have read a few TL Mafia games to try to get a grasp of the game. People love lynching people who don't post. What do you guys think of non-posters? Should we lynch them and hang them in the entrance of the town to let them all see that scums are not allowed here?


Honestly this didn't contribute much at all. In fact most of his posts are pointless. But here is what Interests me. Reps says he has been reading up on a few TL Mafia games and expresses his interest in non posters. He hasn't posted that much, at time he has been a complete lurker, and again non of his posts are actually that meaningful. For someone who has been reading TL Mafia games your doing a really shitty job so far reps, no offense. Furthermore, if he has been reading TL Mafia games why the hell does he appear so newbie still?

Evidence of pointless posts: (I am not going to quote them because there is a lot)
1. Welcome Nightcat you have missed just about nothing.
2. Yeah just use the edit button and that thing.
3. Quotes me and says, "Meaningless fluff is awesome! But I guess that is not something to do."
4. oh (are you kidding me reps....)
5. Quotes and then says, "Happy?" (seriously............)
6. sc_a.M has not posted since the game has started. RDaneelOlivaw posted one fluff since the game started.
7. A picture (my favorite)

Okay a lot of pointless posts there. He has not contributed much. That seems scummy to me.

Furthermore, his defense of my accusation was poor.

Show nested quote +
On July 31 2013 14:48 reps)squishy wrote:
My response to skeptics.
He said he is a newbie multiple times!
Pff, oops I said I was a newbie to many times that does not decide what role I am.

He didnt edit his post, he found out he cant edit his post at the middle of him posting and decided to tell us about it. There is just something fishy about that.
scroll up there is another post that I almost edited. Almost looks exactly the same scrubby mistake.

My mistakes have made me look pretty scummy. But assure me saying I was new was me being truthful. Me claiming I was a noob should not decide if I am scum or not.


He doesn't even thwart any suspicion here, instead he actually claims his actions were scummy, which means that accusation was warranted.

Couple more things. Ill be brief.
Why would he vote Umasi? That makes little sense. He votes Umasi because Umasi came under recent suspicion. That seem like he is trying to blend in to me. Furthermore he presses his attack against Umasi, saying that anyone who defends him, like Umasi did, should appear suspicious? WAT? Yeah maybe if you are scum than anyone who defends you should appear suspicious. But if your townie why do you care? Furthermore, that is certanly not a reason to vote Umasi.

In conclusion, At best he is a bad townie and we should lynch him. However, he seems very scummy to me.





This is much of what I was saying about reps and that's why I voted for him. I'm interested to hear your reads on infii and gotard though.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 21:48 GMT
#425
I would also like your reads on infii and gotard
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 23:13 GMT
#448
I have also asked him several times for proper reads (others have too) and he has yet to contribute. Quite frankly the fact that he is drawing this much discussion to himself and away from the real scum (if he is a so called townsman) is grounds enough for me to vote him off. We have the ability to mislynch a few times anyway and so his flip could be useful or it could not, but it eliminates a volatile bad town/scum from the game.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 23:50 GMT
#458
On August 01 2013 08:44 reps)squishy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2013 08:25 DeusXmachina wrote:
On August 01 2013 08:13 Holyflare wrote:
I have also asked him several times for proper reads (others have too) and he has yet to contribute. Quite frankly the fact that he is drawing this much discussion to himself and away from the real scum (if he is a so called townsman) is grounds enough for me to vote him off. We have the ability to mislynch a few times anyway and so his flip could be useful or it could not, but it eliminates a volatile bad town/scum from the game.


That is such a good point holy. A lynch day 1 is important. If we are going to lynch anyone day 1 lets make it reps. Even if he is not scum he is only hurting us at this point. We need to play to win not to coddle reps' feelings.


The fact that he thinks I am hurting the town. The feelings are not hurt if I am lynched. But this is a Salem Witch hunt he was first to point I guess I am going to be first to die. "Even if he is not scum he is only hurting us at this point." This shows how little he cares if a townie is lynched. If he does not care that a townie is lynched now why do you think he is going to change in the future?



You have not driven any of your insights into us at all so we cannot be certain whether you are just playing a bad town or not. The mafia meta video that you claimed to watch explains that you have to prove to town beyond all reasonable doubt that you are a townie otherwise you just become a bad person to read and can be scum or detremental to town. As we can afford to mislynch people a few times in a row it is often best to get rid of the people that would hinder you in the later stages of the game off early; lurkers, obvious scum, bad towns.


If you truly want to reconcile your town worthyness now I want you to go through every filter and point out to me who you think are the most suspicious people so far. I want you to quote your reasoning and explain logically your choices. Only then will I believe that lynching you MAY be the wrong idea. Click this for the list of player names - click each name for a filter of their typing only
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
July 31 2013 23:56 GMT
#460
Well yes, maybe I should have just done that
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 00:17 GMT
#461
Very interested to hear from StiMaDDict, he was pressing me hard yesterday and said he had some info on infii earlier but was at work.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 00:28 GMT
#464
On August 01 2013 09:27 reps)squishy wrote:
My vote against Usami was to insure that we did not have an alliance now that he has voted against me I will unvote him.
and vote for ##Vote infii


It's like you've ignored every attempt we've tried to save you....... just vote this guy out.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 01:18 GMT
#474
On August 01 2013 10:03 Nightcat99 wrote:
Infil voting for you would prove absolutely NOTHING, at this point i wont be surprise if everyone votes for you. You can not put a vote on someone and expect them to vote you back , and if they did it wont be a read.

Gotard needs to explain the vote on infil.

@infil, neutral is not pro town, as a town you need to push everyone, go after every lead because that is the only way we can get reads. If we are netural and shakes hands the only thing that happens is someone dies each night, if you find anyone scummy, push them and ask them to defend themselves. Well i guess, i can see why you got a lot of fingers point at you now.



he already did here although somewhat lackingly: + Show Spoiler +
On August 01 2013 03:00 Gotard wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2013 00:58 Holyflare wrote:
I agree with your Gotard read, he straight out voted for infii mid discussion about other peoples suspicious activities after infii posted some reasonable claims. He is either trying to draw the conversation away from other people who are suspicious (ie. scum move) or he is playing very bad town.

Gotard, I'd like to hear your defence for this action by the way, and I also want to know your suspicions on everyone else to this point. Your posts have been slightly lacking in the evidence basis and your straight up call out on infii raises you to the top of my suspicions list right now.

Look at his 1st post. This is a useless list. Almost everyone is neutral. His argumentation is super weak. Zero quotes. Nothing. If you think someone is scummy put some effort into it. Posting like that is an easy way to fake some contribution which is scumy.

Show nested quote +
On August 01 2013 02:15 infii wrote:
Then why don't you just lynch everyone e.g. in alphabetical order? Every lynch will give you crucial information, right?
We are awaiting your defense btw.

Because it doesn't make much sense to lynch people randomly...

Do you really expect that you will be 100% sure that someone is mafia before lynching that person?

Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 01:27 GMT
#478
Please also refer to my previous point that as you can see he is dragging our discussion on and on about him and if he is in fact town it has wasted a whole day of discussion because of it and thus he is a good lynch either way.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 09:18 GMT
#523
On August 01 2013 08:50 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 01 2013 08:44 reps)squishy wrote:
On August 01 2013 08:25 DeusXmachina wrote:
On August 01 2013 08:13 Holyflare wrote:
I have also asked him several times for proper reads (others have too) and he has yet to contribute. Quite frankly the fact that he is drawing this much discussion to himself and away from the real scum (if he is a so called townsman) is grounds enough for me to vote him off. We have the ability to mislynch a few times anyway and so his flip could be useful or it could not, but it eliminates a volatile bad town/scum from the game.


That is such a good point holy. A lynch day 1 is important. If we are going to lynch anyone day 1 lets make it reps. Even if he is not scum he is only hurting us at this point. We need to play to win not to coddle reps' feelings.


The fact that he thinks I am hurting the town. The feelings are not hurt if I am lynched. But this is a Salem Witch hunt he was first to point I guess I am going to be first to die. "Even if he is not scum he is only hurting us at this point." This shows how little he cares if a townie is lynched. If he does not care that a townie is lynched now why do you think he is going to change in the future?



You have not driven any of your insights into us at all so we cannot be certain whether you are just playing a bad town or not. The mafia meta video that you claimed to watch explains that you have to prove to town beyond all reasonable doubt that you are a townie otherwise you just become a bad person to read and can be scum or detremental to town. As we can afford to mislynch people a few times in a row it is often best to get rid of the people that would hinder you in the later stages of the game off early; lurkers, obvious scum, bad towns.


If you truly want to reconcile your town worthyness now I want you to go through every filter and point out to me who you think are the most suspicious people so far. I want you to quote your reasoning and explain logically your choices. Only then will I believe that lynching you MAY be the wrong idea. Click this for the list of player names - click each name for a filter of their typing only




I don't know why people are ignoring how many times I've given reps the chance to redeem himself and he replies with one accusation on infii that people are already talking about or some random. I even tell him how to go about the analysis, but no he doesn't do it. Don't be stupid town and just lynch him off.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 15:44 GMT
#537
I'm out at the moment guys and can't formulate posts on my phone that well but the fact that infii is not voting reps unless he needs to despite the rest of the townbandwagoning him is suspicious, if reps does flip mafia look to infii as a possible. cohort. reps reasons for infii were weak and he could have thought he was saving a fellow as he was going down anyway, his accusations also picked up after he was told to get coaching... A mafia coach may have told him to press infii harder to save him
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 15:49 GMT
#538
however if he reveals town on flip then everything infii is saying makes sense, either way this knowledge only comes from his lynch flip so infii to clear yourself you need to swap now, you said so yourself you have little time so I'm not taking i was out as an excuse not to switch to reps for the vote right now
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 16:34 GMT
#549
On August 02 2013 01:12 Alakaslam wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 02 2013 00:44 Holyflare wrote:
I'm out at the moment guys and can't formulate posts on my phone that well but the fact that infii is not voting reps unless he needs to despite the rest of the townbandwagoning him is suspicious, if reps does flip mafia look to infii as a possible. cohort. reps reasons for infii were weak and he could have thought he was saving a fellow as he was going down anyway, his accusations also picked up after he was told to get coaching... A mafia coach may have told him to press infii harder to save him

Holy flare you have caused me to expect better from you before this.

So bandwagoning isn't scummy anymore I read.



I wanted to get my 2 cents in before the night begins in case I was killed off and yes I am ashamed that the post is nothing like my usual well thought out replies, however, my phone is shit and I cannot quote more than one person at a time. Bandwagoning at this point of time is the only logical town move, you just agreed with me how obvious the lynch on reps is, so why did infii not just do the same? There is no point to leaving your vote on the person who won't get lynched. Obviously bandwagons in the course of the game can ve detrimental but this one is all about information and alliance revealing.

He may have left his vote off knowingpy as mafia so it also looks like he was the one defending him.
Slam there are also things that I want to quote you on when I get back to my computer later that you said last night while i was asleep about your apprehension to lynching reps.

Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 19:24 GMT
#590
slam umasi and reps seem to be circling, coming up with all this crap to lynch other people instead of reps right now with like an hour left is ridiculous a no lynch will hurt us more and obviously not enough people are around to swing the vote
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 01 2013 23:57 GMT
#662
Does 3/3 problems mean 3 mafia or any assortment ie 2 mafia and 1 neutral?

Mega analysis post coming up by the way, I shall also try and vindicate myself within it for your peace of mind slam.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
August 02 2013 00:45 GMT
#699
I'd appreciate if you cut the pointless fluff posts please, I'm trying to formulate my post and updating it with new information from these night posts as I go along and you are just adding more confusion right now.
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