|
On July 03 2013 03:17 Lazermonkey wrote:
Hi everyone, first off I'd like to say I'm quite demoralized after yesterday. I really felt I did a decent job at playing but apparantly not. I'm generally not someone who gets misslynched. Only happend twice (my very first game and a game where I had way too little time to play, and that was D4. This game, time was not really much of an issue) and I would've got lynched for sure had it not been for the fact that I roled cop, a role that is basically useless now). I will try to comment on some stuff but I'd rather not spend too much time playing mafia this day and instead try to do my best tomorrow instead, when I will have alot of free time! Enough with that though, I'll save the discussion on why my play sucked to postgame.
I will not get shot today, not in a million years, so the fact that I'm holding some reads isn't really going to affect the game too much.
If anyone got some questions, feel free to ask!
I would think if anything since you're not being shot you can easily post reads whenever you want (ie well before deadline) but as long as we get something out of you sooner rather than later.
Lazer who is scum?
|
|
|
On July 03 2013 03:23 raynpelikoneet wrote:
WoS would you doubt an uncc'd cop claim for a second if you were miller?
This is a weird question that I doubt I can answer; I already don't doubt his claim and that's coming from me earlier thinking he's actually scum. If I was miller I can't see myself thinking any differently but I don't know for sure ofc.
Oh for the record, I agree that it's unlikely but it's entirely possible to have millers without a cop. I've seen scum framer with no cop before.
|
On July 03 2013 03:25 iGrok wrote:Smalltown is the best haha. All that you don't know is alignment. You have games like town framer/roleblocker,vigi, Scum Cop/Medic
Next game, k?
|
Rayn what do you think of my points regarding a scum Stutters? Who would you imagine 3rd scum to be in your case of LM/marv scumteam?
|
On July 03 2013 03:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2013 03:51 WaveofShadow wrote:
Rayn what do you think of my points regarding a scum Stutters? Who would you imagine 3rd scum to be in your case of LM/marv scumteam? atm you. Stutters agreed with me instantly when i laid my evidence on marv, i don't think he is scum.
I think you're going to have to come up with something better than "people who agree with me instantly aren't scum."
First of all I do agree with you in that I find marv to be the most likely to be scum atm, but I always consider other options as well---considering that there have been games where presence of roles that can mess with cop do not necessarily indicate cop does not mean I disagree with you.
Second of all if you find Stutters town and me scum, do you have any other reasoning for this?
|
No Rayn, what is your reasoning for thinking I'm scum? I brought up suspicion of my own towards marv before you showed up and I agreed with you at the same time as he did, I just didn't act the same way Stutters has been acting all game and riding a suspected townplayer's dick.
If my not licking your boots for coming up with what you did is why you think I'm scum then good luck.
|
On July 03 2013 04:13 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2013 04:04 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 03 2013 04:03 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I don't see anything scummy in Solstice's posts. His interactions with marv make me think he is even more townier than before. But aren't you basing everything on that Marv is scum then? Drawing conclusions between unflipped players are dangerous...If you disregard Marv what do you think of him? His action during teh lynch etc? My solstice read (or any other read) has not been in connection with marv. I had a hard time finding mafia, and at the start of N1 my scum reads were fuba/you, which i have already said in thread. gumshoe was null, and everyone else more or less town. Now gumshoe has claimed, i am sure marv is scum, i am semi-sure Lazer is scum, i am not sure of you and fuba. I don't know how you usually treat situations like this (when you need to think from some other person's point of view with a different role you actually are) but i am shocked you (and Lazer, but that was kinda expected) can't see what i see here.
WTF Rayn? Why do you think I don't see what you do? I've said multiple times I agree that your scenario is more likely, I just don't want to completely exclude other possibilities. Mafia is a game of likelihoods and since your scenario is most likely in the case of marv, I would be voting him during the day (or Stutters, though I don't think I'm getting much support for that).
|
On July 03 2013 04:16 Lazermonkey wrote:
Am I the only one who find it insanely ironic that Rayn is getting shit stormed like mad D1 because he didn't react to the miller claim from "the PoV that town should have done", yet he is all over marv becuase he didn't react to the cop claim from "the PoV that miller should have"?
Seriously Rayn, pull your shit together...
I didn't even bother with all that shit D1 honestly.
Should I go back and try to sift through it? I doubt Rayn is scum.
|
On July 03 2013 04:42 mkfuba07 wrote:So this post was a whole progression of realizations, and it's probably going to be confusing, but I hope it'll clarify everything eventually. The stuff collapsed in the quotes was my original post. The next layer is when I realized I screwed up something that could have affected my read greatly. The outer later is the conclusion I came to. Show nested quote +Fucking fuck. Was in the process of answering the questions directed at me when I realized why I've been so confusing. I left what I already wrote, because it shows when I realized my screw-up, and hopefully at least shows some of my reasoning while I was confused. On July 02 2013 21:47 Oatsmaster wrote:
whos scum At the moment, stutters is #1. Aside from him, gumshoe is a possibility. I really didn't like that one interaction with JJD. Town says that they'll lynch someone else if it will avoid a lynch on themselves all the time. The fact that gumshoe insinuated scumminess based on that post is really weird if he's town. It's a complete null tell, and I liked the way JJD responded to it. I'm pretty confident laser can't be scum unless marv also is, which would mean that they had laser claim cop in response to no legit miller claim. So to vote for lazer I'd have to be convinced that marv's also scum, which I'm not atm. Everyone else you'll get a read on before the daypost. On July 02 2013 21:51 marvellosity wrote:On July 02 2013 21:48 mkfuba07 wrote:On July 02 2013 08:00 Stutters695 wrote:
Well I'm off work.
Catching up since I missed multiple pages. Oh, and before I forget, is this another promise of action that you've neglected? Given I can think of at least one example you've played with Stutters before (LIX) and I know in that game it was brought up that Stutters does this as town all the time, why are you bringing this up here? Because I don't remember everything everyone's said about everyone else I've ever played with? What I remember about stutters is that I rarely have many thoughts on him D1, and he doesn't really post all that much. Does he normally post cases on people and then completely ignore their responses to them? Does he normally say posts are scummy as fuck and then only provide a part of the reasoning? It's really weird to say a post is scummy as fuck but only talk about a small portion of it, have the person respond to it, ignore the response completely, and then make another case using the same exact post, but now in a way that the makes my... Holy fuck, what is wrong with me. So here's what's happened... I posted my response to his first post with this post. I then continued reading the thread, and got to his case, where my stupid mind stored it after my previous response to him. So every time I was considering him, it was from the mindset that he completely ignored my response and kept accusing me without cause, which kept increasing my suspicion of him. The early "vayne-like" post was regarding his aggression to rayn, his indecision regarding laser, and his interpretation of WoS's early french posts as suspicious, when I found them to just be random, fun, early game posts. I actually assumed they were irrelevant, so I really still haven't translated them. The "vayne-like" post added in stutters being pretty defensive, as well as suggesting that we look elsewhere but not actually suggesting someone else, really. And actually, look at his unwillingness to take stances up until his vote on me. It's a whole lot of just saying that one person's comments about another person aren't accurate. Again, could be scummy, but I've seen it all done as town. It's not until his first case and vote against me that he feels reasonably scummy. He calls it scummy as fuck and then comments only on the part about him (which was either misinterpreted (scum or town) or misconstrued (scum)). He goes on to make another case the next day using the same exact post, which is really, really weird as town. If you think a post is scummy as fuck, and you have reasons to find every aspect of it scummy, why would you not write it all up the first time? It's like he realized his mistake, then tried to correct it after the fact by showing how scummy the entire thing is, when most of the points he makes are just as much useless fluff as my post about marv was. Even if the "vayn-like" confusion was truly a misunderstanding, adding in the rest of it shows he was uncomfortable with the original case. And finally, trying to ignore the ordering of posts I convinced myself was the case, he *still* hasn't actually responded to any of my posts. He apparently doesn't care about the answers to his questions, and hasn't answered any of the ones I've asked (even if my ordering was all garbled up, there was still no response). Therefore, I still think stutters is scum. I also see that rayn's had exactly the same thoughts about marv's response to WoS's question as I did. Feeling really confident about my change of heart about him now. I had this written out in notepad, and it's actually pretty hilarious how perfectly marv's response fits into it: ============================== Facts: marv miller claim, laser cop claim marv and laser both town: legit marv lying and laser cop: legit marv miller and laser lying: Doesn't make sense to fakeclaim cop after a legit miller claim. both lying: legit Laser can be scum only if marv is lying. ============================== Narrowed it down to the what I found to be the most basic statement you could make given the four scenarios, and the end result was the bottom line. Since it's highly likely to be suicide to fakeclaim cop after a legitimate miller claim, marv shouldn't be suspicious of laser if he was, in fact, miller.
Why is this true if scum got fakeclaims like marv suggested?
|
On July 03 2013 05:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Like you are suggesting that we have a semi-open setup, but scum do have an open setup?
Now how stupid is that?
I don't think it's stupid at all, unless like I mentioned earlier, iGrok is completely fine with us breaking his game.
|
On July 03 2013 05:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2013 05:02 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 03 2013 04:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 03 2013 04:51 Lazermonkey wrote:On July 03 2013 04:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 03 2013 04:45 Lazermonkey wrote:
Rayn, I'm done. You are very likely town at this point. But your arguments are really crappy at this point and you are suffering from an insane amount of confirmation bias. Marv could be scum but not because of the things you say. Good thing is that you are probably getting shot soon so I don't have to deal with this BS anymore... What's wrong with my thought process? Also what do you see in the set of quotes i posted? Nothing wrong in marv's behaviour? I'm guessing you say that marv swayed the lynch away from the main candidates? am I correct? Tell me what do you see and then i'll tell what i see. I'm sorry, I may be retarded and missing something but what I see is marv swaying the lynch from me/fuba to Vayne and me buddying marv for doing so. This is what i see. - marv is not caught up and wants to know who he should be looking into - i tell him to look into lazer/fuba/wos - he puts his vote on wos because "everything else is fucking dense" - you come in with a last minute case on vayne - marv does not comment on fuba/you in any way, but instead tells us to lynch vayne. wtf? why is he even looking in there as the case is presented by one of the people town currently think is scum, and why did he not look into those town's suspects instead?
If you'll remember in my posts last night I brought up the fact that Marv and Vivax were both content to relegate the lynch to those who weren't able to defend themselves at the time.
I remember Marv's vote on me looking particularly awful.
|
I notice fuba hasn't responded to my question.
Lazer would you like to comment on the conversation currently happening between Rayn and I?
|
I've got about an hour left before I have to go and I don't like that there are still a ton of people I haven't been able to interact with or who left when I was trying to.
|
On July 03 2013 05:27 iGrok wrote:
Hey guys, caught in some nasty traffic on the first leg of a 2 hour drive. Push it back one extra hour.
Isn't this why you have cohosts?
|
Rayn do you think a scum Lazer would be so willing to back-and-forth with you for that whole period of time?
|
On July 03 2013 05:40 raynpelikoneet wrote:
WoS what do you think of Lazer's hard-defence on marv and him rejection to interact with you?
I think it's scummy as fuck but I've had problems with this kind of play before. Vayne's play in I Swear for example, in which he played like shit and really scummy but he claimed cop real early and we were forced to believe him.
Turns out he really was the cop.
To me it seems more likely that Lazer's claim is real. Hell, if you're negating the possibility of fakeclaims why wouldn't you agree with me? If anything a fakeclaim makes the idea that Lazer's claim is fake MORE likely!
|
On July 03 2013 05:47 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2013 05:43 WaveofShadow wrote:On July 03 2013 05:40 raynpelikoneet wrote:
WoS what do you think of Lazer's hard-defence on marv and him rejection to interact with you? I think it's scummy as fuck but I've had problems with this kind of play before. Vayne's play in I Swear for example, in which he played like shit and really scummy but he claimed cop real early and we were forced to believe him. Turns out he really was the cop. To me it seems more likely that Lazer's claim is real. Hell, if you're negating the possibility of fakeclaims why wouldn't you agree with me? If anything a fakeclaim makes the idea that Lazer's claim is fake MORE likely! I am not negating the the possibility of fakeclaim in this particular situation. I am not sure Lazer is scum and that's why i wanted to question him as much as possible. His answers and his defence on marv make no sense, because whether or not he is real cop marv's post about doubting his claim makes zero sense from town PoV. He should be the one most suspicious of marv because he thinks from a cop-PoV. Keep in mind that if marv is not hiding in scum QT atm, he is away, and scum need to defend him in case of vigi shot.
This I can get behind.
It seems a little at odds with your thinking earlier today but whatever. What do you make of Fuba's latest post-and-fuck-off?
|
On July 03 2013 05:49 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Vayne is different player than Lazer and i remember Vivax (or someone) saying Lazer's scumplay is good.
But see it would be his townplay that I think is bad and makes him look like scum, a la Vayne.
|
And where the fuck is the rest of the thread?
Is everyone waiting for me to leave or some shit before they show up?
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
