EPTThat's what I thought it was called until I recently went to past the role pm. Like I said, I'm not familiar with Dr. Who. Though I did make a comment about blinking, which matches with the lore from what I've gathered on the wiki page. :p
PTP IV - Demon's Run - Page 11
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kitaman27
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That's what I thought it was called until I recently went to past the role pm. Like I said, I'm not familiar with Dr. Who. Though I did make a comment about blinking, which matches with the lore from what I've gathered on the wiki page. :p | ||
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On July 02 2013 12:09 Crossfire99 wrote: So kita, riddle me this. You posted everything you ever said to geript, yet geript knows all about your star crossed lovers after 144 hours bit even though you never told him about it. You're lying. The only way geript could have known about your role is if he had prior knowledge, i.e. you told him or you're scum buddies. Right now I'm leaning toward scum buddies cause that makes the most sense. You still die today. I sent a pm to deconduo asking if my role informs him about the lover aspect when he is masoned. I 100% never mentioned the lover part of my role to him. If you are seriously getting stuck on a single detail like this, then I'm pretty much lost for words. The fact that you can possibly think that I am mafia blows my mind. You do realize that if austin and I are scum buddies that the chat logs he just posted would be fake. So I decided to incriminate myself in my own set of fake logs? That is seriously beyond belief. | ||
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On June 24 2013 06:04 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: votecount for reference Votes: BC (0) - WoS (0) - Dandel Ion (0) - Kurumi (0) - SnB (2) - Acrofales (0) - austin (7) - geript (0) - Zephirdd (2) - austinmcc, Sk8rguy (4) - Acrofales, Bubbas not voting: strongandbig, WoS austinmcc is the leading bubba with 7 votes. 8 votes are needed to lynch a bubba. Tell me if I missed anyone. Only votes in the voting thread count! CUNTDOWN: On June 24 2013 06:21 geript wrote: Look guys, you don't understand the situation. So after the D&D game I went to Mcdonalds to have wifi because I thought the deadline was at 4 pm EDT (not 5 pm EDT). I ate a late lunch. I had to shit because I don't have a gallbladder anymore and wasn't going to use the crappy McDee's bathrooms so I sheeped Gonzaw and drove home thinking I'd have enough time to spare. However, I forgot that I needed to put gas into my car and practically shat myself while waiting. Once I got home, I just saw Sent's solstice kill on my phone and went to vote who I figured the switch would be to at the limit without time to go forward. Do what you will. On June 24 2013 06:26 geript wrote: Didn't bother to look because I saw on my phone I was cutting it close to deadline. It's my bad. On June 24 2013 06:12 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Ok wtf, I leave 10 mins before the lynch and then we all go austin? Why the fuck didn't we kill zephrid? Gonzaw I'm getting suspicious of you, your push for austin seems very half assed an apologetic as if preparing for him flipping town. Not only that, you completly ignored zephrid who you had already called out. I really liked your play until like the last two hours of the day. Bro that looks really bad. On June 24 2013 06:57 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Oh and to all the idiots talking about my "disapearence", I am on my phone, I was watching indycar and assumed that, with ten minutes left nothing was gonna happen and decided to come back after the day post. Also sk8 makes a good point about mafia motivation behind killing solstice, what did they gain by doing so. On June 24 2013 10:09 austinmcc wrote: NOW ONTO MORE IMPORTANT MATTERS JEEBUS STOP LYNCHING ME. If you think you can usually read me and you haven't been able to do so this game, that might be because I'm not normally this absent. As EITHER alignment. Go read my stupid scum games, I'm always trying to plot and direct things and getting shot down when I try to get the scum team to engage in stupid plans, except for CT mafia maybe cuz I replaced in there. To those who actually think I'm scummy, you guys should knock it off as well. I don't bring presents to people who think I'm scummy except maybe I do. Ugh. Also, not scum. Gonna sort through the rest of this tomorrow at work. Does this honestly look planned to you and if so, what was the payoff because in my eyes it would have to be in the running for worst mafia play 2013 if you think we planned this. | ||
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On July 02 2013 12:18 Crossfire99 wrote: I know. Me being hung up on scum knowing something they couldn't have possibly known about unless you're scum isn't important at all... Well I guess we wait to hear back from the hosts, but I don't see why it would be unreasonable for the lover information to be mentioned in the mason pm. | ||
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 Anyways, gnight. | ||
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On June 26 2013 00:13 austinmcc wrote: As for me, again, stop lynching me. Go lynch someone else. There are still bears for me to get rid of, and I need to get rid of all the bears, for serious. Instead, I propose lynching the dude who's asking for the TARDIS, indicating that he knows something we don't know (or I didn't know), saying that he needs it AND protection so he can win the game for town, saying that he GOT the TARDIS, and then promptly...oh right, we don't know. We have no idea what's going on over there. People who want specific items for specific reasons in games like this generally don't want them for happy reasons, imo. As a bonus, this is the weirdest single exchange since meapak got shot: That exchange is entirely ridiculous. Pretty much urrbody and their mothers says use vigi shots to kill unknowns, because lynching pure question marks gets you very little. I can't find it with 30 seconds of searching, but I'm pretty sure I remember Ace telling people to vig unknowns. As well as a couple other guides. It's not at all a "wrong" thing to do, and kita getting so touchy about it really rubs me the wrong way, as does the way he's phrasing it. This is not a vig shot in the dark at a random dude. This is a dude who has not been playing, therefore we dont' have much to read him off of. Those are good vig targets, and pretty much consensus good vig targets. Gut read is that kita just doesn't want snb shot, and the two are connected. ##vote: kitaman27 On June 26 2013 05:43 austinmcc wrote: Knowing that he didn't know he was a vet makes him look slightly better. Didn't understand him not revealing that. But his response to pressure today doesn't ring true to me. He had the big posts during the night with the pictures, GIMME THE TARDIS GIMME GIMME. And apparently he got it. But he didn't claim at that point, the point at which, according to him, he became a pure survivor (having satisfied the other bit of his win-con). He waits, because:(1) kita is super worried about NKs, despite their being players who look far more townie / are doing more pro-town stuff with their activity. He's been around a long time, but so have other players this game, so it's not a case of him just getting popped for being veteran-y (2) kita was going to wait and claim N2 because ... he didn't want to be NKed. He could have claimed immediately if that's his only concern. Again, according to him, once he got the TARDIS, all he does is try to survive. No reason to wait 48 hours before saying "Oh hey guys, I'm a survivor, mafia please don't kill me." (3) I still actually really dislike the not vigging snb comments. They don't jive AT ALL with what I understand to be conventional wisdom held by respected players. They read as an attempt to cover snb, which doesn't fit with kita being a lone survivor. This is important. Kita has said he's a survivor, 3P, all he has to do is survive. He's got NO REASON to not want snb shot in that position. Hey hey, again, important. Kita as 3P survivor has no reason to care whether or not snb gets shot. No matter who is vigged, kita is 1 person closer to fulfilling his wincon. But he picks a fight over that, like, seriously responds to your comments. His response there is no a 3P survivor response. It's the response of someone concerned with what happens to other players. He's not a survivor. He didn't claim the moment he could have, for a bad reason. He expressed interest in things that a survivor wouldn't care about. On June 23 2013 18:50 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Kita is troubling, I'm gonna call FoS on him. In particular, this post right here reeks: Firstly he FoS's acro for a really dumb reason, then he goes and votes austin without much more than "he commented on something popular" which is very weak. He asks kinda pointless questions and then apologizes for inactivity when no one had even called him out. I really expect a lot more out of town kita. On June 24 2013 06:25 kitaman27 wrote: FoS Meapak for conveniently disappearing around the same time a new lynch had to be decided so that his vote wasn't available. On June 25 2013 09:00 kitaman27 wrote: -_- Suspicious as in, I don't buy his excuse for being afk, implicating austin. On June 25 2013 08:50 kitaman27 wrote: I find this post really fishy from Meapak. He states that he assumed that nothing was going to happen with 10 minutes left, yet with that much time left the lynch hadn't been decided, sol just role claimed doctor, and we were obviously looking to consolidate to a player. I find it hard to believe that a scum veteran like Meapak would simply walk away at a time where we are scrambling for a lynch target. Only 2 minutes before the sol flip Meapak made a post, so its pretty convenient that he disappeared. When he returns, he makes no attempt to call the last minute austin bandwagon scummy nor does he return with a strong town read on austin, which makes me think he is positioning himself for the worst if we were to go after austin today. Also, I would think that the mafia would have 2 kp in a game of this size. With only Acro flipping and WoS coming from Zeph, it seems that either Acro was double stacked, a hit is missing, or mafia only has 1 kp. On June 26 2013 03:27 kitaman27 wrote: austinmcc Re-posting on how Meapak's actions likely implicated austin: He claims to want to push off the sk8r lynch because people he trust are reading sk8r differently. Why does it matter if someone like BC or Acro. A town austin would come to his own conclusions and then attempt to convince the person that disagrees with him to vote together. You don't push the lynch off because of a disagreement. Take a look at this post about events of the end of day one: post This post may look long and impressive, but it is 100% a summary. He hardly draws any conclusions or analysis based on the events. He doesn't call players scummy for voting him last minute, he doesn't call Meapak or geript town for not being around to hammer. Instead, he asks a few questions about crossfire, without really sharing an opinion about that either. He was all aboard the Zeph lynch yesterday, but wasn't around to push it at the end of the day. Today he hasn't even mentioned Zeph. He hasn't mentioned if his read changed or anything. He votes me for weak reasoning. Like look at our interactions. What does a super three way bus accomplish other then ending up with a bunch of dead mafia? I'm a survivor. I bread crumbed it from the start of the game. | ||
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Why I am not and cannot be a Serial Killer 1) The wording of the win conditions: The Alliance You win when all Anti-Town forces are dead. The Church You win when all Town forces are dead. The mafia team wins when all Town forces are dead. If you need to, confirm with the hosts that this is not a typo because this is really important. By definition, Serial Killers win when they are the only player remaining in the game. Suppose it is 2 mafia, 1 town, and 1 serial killer. Everyone lynches the town player and it is 2 mafia, 1 serial killer. There are no town remaining so the game ends in a mafia victory. This is a 100% conflict with the Serial Killer win condition of being the sole survivor. As I said earlier, I am a survivor who must feed to the TARDIS to achieve my win condition. I am not anti-town because I can win with either faction as long as I'm alive and have met my win condition. 2) I have no factional KP and I have no bulletproof vest. Serial killers always have factional kp. Yes, I have my role, but the mafia team still has their roles plus they get their factional kp on top of that. A bullet every other day is hardly enough. Roles can be roleblocked, while factional kp cannot, meaning that in a 1v1 situation with a roleblocker, a serial killer wouldn't even be able to win. Furthermore, I have no protection role, outside of the D2 TARDIS that I had to out myself as survivor to receive. The moment I'm hit with a town or mafia kp I lose the game. Suppose a serial killer were to shoot mafia early in the game. Are they supposed to just ask nicely that the mafia team does not shoot them in return? Suppose I was hit by that random vig from gonzaw...well serial killer, you played a perfect game, but unfortunately you got randomly hit and lose. Sorry! Without a factional kp and a bulletproof vest, a serial killer would have next to no chance of winning this game. 3) My role had a lover aspect. " If you and your maid survive for two straight cycles(day and night, or 144 real-life hours), you become lovers, which means that if one dies, the other suicides." The win condition of a Serial Killer is to be the sole remaining player. If the lover part of my role were to ever go into effect, I would suicide upon their death. That means that it would be impossible to win the game. As a survivor, my lover can still be around as long as the other faction is eliminated. While I technically could be a serial killer that has a lover role, but is forced not to ever have it activated if I want to win, that would be incredibly lame. 4) I claimed third party survivor in my first post, night one, and day two. I claimed third party from the start of the game and pointed out my breadcrumb after requesting the TARDIS. A serial killer operates from the shadows and wants to keep his identity hidden for as long as possible. Suppose we lynched austin D2, rather than Sk8r. The mafia team is eliminated and who do you think the town is going to go after next? Obviously the claimed third party player. There was no reason for me to claim for the TARDIS as a serial killer, but it would be completely reasonable for the Survivor who needs to feed on the TARDIS to claim for the TARDIS. On July 02 2013 15:00 Crossfire99 wrote: What fits kita's actions most this game? I argue SK. He knew who was scum pretty early in this game and he has quoted the numerous posts where he was suspicious of austin and geript. What doesn't make sense is this. Meapak dies and pretty much confirms austin as scum for kita. Kita claims survivor because he got too trolly and obvious. Important note here is that he is spamming up the thread with nonsense and playing antitown even though he now knows who scum are and has KP that can deal with them. He know geript and austin are scum. Geript challenges him to mortal combat but kita has the TARDIS and can do whatever he wants with it. He could have used the TARDIS to hit austin because he knows geript's ability only protects at night. This would prove that he's 3rd party working with town by killing scum. Now put yourself in my shoes. Geript tries to kill me, I bus the shot to austin instead. I've shared my suspicion of geript, austin, and Meapak. The mafia have a strong suspicoin that I have a day vig as well. Guess who is getting shot at night? That would be survivor suicide and make it essentially impossible to to ever win with mafia. I suppose I could have asked for protection from a potential town role, but what townie is going to protect the claimed third party over someone like BC, gonzaw, or kurumi the inventor. On July 02 2013 15:00 Crossfire99 wrote: Day 3 comes along and he attempts to work with mafia!? Why if he is just a survivor does he need to work with mafia? He can just dayvig austin thus proving he is 3rd party working with town. Like I explained before, mafia almost certainly had the TARDIS. geript had his protection ability so austin would be the only player that makes sense as being protected. I shoot austin, nothing happens, geript gets lynched, I get lynched the next cycle and austin wins. On July 02 2013 15:00 Crossfire99 wrote: Kita then skates along and never will get nk or lynched because it isn't in scum or town's best interest to do either. I don't understand why this doesn't point to survivor. This points 100% to survivor. What more does a survivor want than to never be night killed and never be lynched? It means he wins. I killed Dandel because he was a threat to myself. What survivor wants to keep around a player that wants to kill him? | ||
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On July 02 2013 22:17 Crossfire99 wrote: 1. I'll ask the hosts about this. That is really the deal breaker. A serial killer cannot exist in this setup and that trumps all other points. On July 02 2013 22:17 Crossfire99 wrote: I don't know if you're bulletproof or not. Maybe getting the TARDIS made you a vet because you fed on its energy. You don't know if I'm bulletproof, but if I am, there is no reason to claim survivor in the thread so the mafia wouldn't hit me. There is no reason to think the game is over when BC fake shot me. On July 02 2013 22:17 Crossfire99 wrote: 3. You have a dayvig to kill your partner off. You also don't have to use your mason abilities. I can dayvig, but I'll only have 1 chance to do so. If the shot is roleblocked, the TARDIS stops the shot, or the player has a protective ability, the shot doesn't go through and I lose the game because I cannot be the sole survivor. Sure, I could never use the mason ability, but that is pretty lame. Notice how I chose geript as my lover and attempted to save him from the lynch. If he didn't get lynched, I wouldn't be able to day vig him (I knew so when I created my role), so if he was still around on d5, I wouldn't be able to win the game as a serial killer lover. However, I am a survivor, I knew that if geript was around by d5, I'd be able to win with mafia, so it didn't matter. Sure, I could never use the mason, but like I said, that would be pretty lame from a setup perspective. On July 02 2013 22:17 Crossfire99 wrote: 4. You breadcrumb survivor in case you ever need to claim something. You ask for the TARDIS because it powers you up in some way. I claimed on day two because a mafia night hit would end the game for me. On July 02 2013 22:17 Crossfire99 wrote: So scum shoot a "survivor" because they think you are "confirmed." That makes no sense. If you are a survivor, they should want to keep you alive because you can still win with them. They wouldn't know my alignment, other than trusting my word of being a survivor. They would have 1 player remaining against like 9 town and a third party player. The game would be essentially over and a revenge shot wouldn't be out of the question. The easiest way for me to lose this game is a mafia kp and I tried my best to not get on their bad side, while still keeping the option of a town victory open. On July 02 2013 22:17 Crossfire99 wrote: You don't have to shoot anyone if you are truly a survivor you know. If I have a chance to kill a player like dandel who wants me dead before lylo, there is no reason not to kill him. Plus, it ends the game quicker which is good for me. | ||
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On July 02 2013 23:20 austinmcc wrote: This argument is bs. DI didn't just "want kita dead." He wanted kita dead because he thought kita was mafia/anti-town. - + Show Spoiler + On June 28 2013 23:15 Dandel Ion wrote: Well good thing you decided to play for scum after they allegedly tried to kill you. makes sense. On June 29 2013 02:37 Dandel Ion wrote: He's scum-aligned survivor even if he is that, so it doesn't matter. On June 29 2013 02:41 Dandel Ion wrote: We could win faster, but risk a lot of shit relying on kita not playing anti-town as fuck, which we can't rely on. He needs to die. We can slow-roll this game, no problem. I see no need to rush it. On June 29 2013 03:45 Dandel Ion wrote: Yeah or it's simply geript-Xata-MZ-kita scum team On June 29 2013 07:52 Dandel Ion wrote: It'll be 4-3 kita is scum. AS I'VE SAID At this point, kita has options. He doesn't HAVE to kill DI. (1) He kills DI. Now DI is off his back, and there are less dudes, and maybe he can save geript. (2) He shoots me, lets geript get killed, AND POSTS THE LOGS HE HAS WHERE SOMEONE CLAIMS MAFIA AND TELLS HIM WHERE TO SHOOT/NOT SHOOT. I don't care if DI is the most stubborn person in the world. If kita SHOOTS SCUM, and then POSTS LOGS WHERE SCUM TALKS TARGETING, DI is going to have to take that new information into account. Kita didn't kill DI's family and burn his village, causing DI to swear some kind of vendetta. Kita just looked scummy. If he shoots me, geript gets lynched, and he posts logs, then absolutely no way in hell is town going to lynch him. If he's really a neutral survivor, he just won himself the game. Town is NOT going to kill that dude, and mafia just lost two players. They don't have time to be NKing third parties in that case, they have to use everything just not to die to town. lol you know just as well as I do that geript was bulletproof and you were TARDIS protected. | ||
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On July 03 2013 00:43 Crossfire99 wrote: What all of this says to me is that there are 2 options for 3rd party this game:
In the history of teamliquid mafia, or any other mafia site as far as I've witnessed, there has never been a third party "serial killer", or whatever anti-town third party role you want to call it, than can win with one faction, but not the other. That's hundreds and hundreds of games where this has never happened once. Survivors are extremely common, you see them all the time. You're looking for a scenario that is possible in theory, but not even close to likely. It's possible that gonzaw is a anti-town third party serial killer than can win with mafia, but that isn't the likely scenario. You have to look at what is probably, not what is possible. I help balance theme games all the time and the role simply doesn't make sense and would have like a 5% chance of winning at best without a bulletproof role or a factional kp. On July 03 2013 00:43 Crossfire99 wrote: I've already described your play this game. It doesn't match up with a neutral survivor mentality. What it does match up with is an anti-town survivor that can win with mafia. For all I know you could be a "traitor" in the sense that you work with mafia and can't communicate, but you can actually win by yourself if all mafia are dead and you eliminate town. It would make sense for you to be a pro-mafia 3rd party and use your mason to communicate with scum like you did. You readily admitted that you were trying to win with scum and become lovers with geript. If I'm the traitor, there is no way that I waste 10 hour on this game to argue why austin should be lynched and I should not, if I just win with mafia anways. There is no way that I make the mafia team look so terrible on day one when I need to win with them. "You readily admitted that you were trying to win with scum" I'm a survivor. Of course I tried to win the game when the win was offered to me. I understand you are upset about the fact that I shot dandel and tried to win with geript. You can hold a grudge, but the fact is that an austin lynch ends the game. You can't seriously let the claimed mafia survive going into a 2v1 night, while he likely has a tardis. That is 50% at best and a lot lower at worst. The point of the game is to play to win, not to play to lose because I'm holding a grudge against the survivor that tried to meet his win condition with a party that isn't mine, so I'm going to punish him by throwing the game out the window and flipping a coin. | ||
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When I voted with geript, it was 2 mafia, 3 town, 1 survivor. With the lynch and night hit, we would go into today 1 mafia, 2 town, 1 survivor. With neither the town, nor the mafia, controlling the vote in this scenario, it put me in a king maker situation. I could side with town, we lynch austin, I win. I could side with austin, we lynch town and night hit, I win. The last thing I was thinking about was a scenario where I would be forced to vote for myself in a 2v1v1 situation. I took a situation where I was going to survive no matter which faction was lynched. If I didn't shoot dandel and shot a protected austin, its 3v1v1, you guys could lynch me like Dandel would want. He was the person pushing that I should be lynched before endgame. it would be 3v1, then 2v1 after the night hit and town wins without a survivor win. Don't punish me for playing to my win condition by keeping both routes of victory open. A 50/50 coinflip tonight is complete garbage compared to a guaranteed victory. | ||
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On July 03 2013 02:23 austinmcc wrote: ---HEY HEY HEY--- Kita keeps saying he didn't want to shoot at me D3 because he thinks I had the TARDIS and was protected. Kita's shot is SILENT. We didn't know who killed solstice D1. He didn't type anything in thread. All that happens is that someone dies. You knew that there was a day vig role that is refreshed every other day. Your options are: 1) Use the self protection role to ensure a day vig cannot kill you 2) Do not use the self protection role because you want to allow the day vig to kill you. On July 03 2013 02:23 austinmcc wrote: EVEN IF I had the TARDIS (and I didn't and don't), how was I going to protect myself from a silent shot? I would never know it's coming. Again, DI wanted to lynch you because you thought he was mafia. Posting your logs with geript, shooting me, not trying to save geript goes a long way towards convincing DI not to lynch you. In fact, posting the logs, having geript flip scum, pretty much guarantees that I am the D4 lynch today in a 3-1-1 situation, not you. In your version of events, DI is so pissed at you that in the 3-1-1 situation he goes after you, who just helped town big time, rather than me, who geript has basically confirmed as mafia. That is ridiculous. That's incorrect. DI said, even if Kita is a survivor, we have to lynch him before LYLO. Would would have 2 lynches in a 3-1-1 situation and I couldn't guarantee that austin would be first if town wanted to remove my day vig from the game. | ||
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I just know that if I were in your position, I would not pick the option that leaves the claimed mafia alive and forces us to pull off a night action save to survive. | ||
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On July 03 2013 02:45 austinmcc wrote: What? Of course I knew there was a day vig role. The day vig was talking to my mafia buddy, claiming mafia traitor, trying to scheme out a way to get a mafia win. Why am I using the TARDIS to just-in-case protect myself from that guy? Especially when using it means I probably pass it to geript, who was clear mafia and getting lynched/killed. That means it goes from me (mafia) to him (mafia), and would likely go to town after he died, making it much harder for us to win the game. This whole thing about me maybe being protected is silly. I couldn't have seen a shot coming. It would have been dumb of me to use the TARDIS just in case a guy who claimed mafia traitor was going to shoot me. You didn't shoot me on D3 because you can't win with town. I didn't claim traitor and even if I did, your fake logs indicate that you wouldn't have believed me. I can win with town. You're making this statement as if it is fact, even though you said yourself that you have no clue. My death means that you probably win, but lying to push my death doesn't make your statement true. Anyways, I'm sure we're accomplishing much arguing with each other :p | ||
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On July 03 2013 02:51 austinmcc wrote: The other option is actually doing work at work Maybe go back to the bears thing. I think we all enjoyed that. | ||
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On July 03 2013 04:05 Crossfire99 wrote: Gonzaw, I don't think he is a SK. I think he is an anti-town 3rd party. There is also something in role pm mentioning the TARDIS. I agree that's why he shot Solstice. But I disagree saying why would he do that if it hurt mafia. It is day 1, he doesn't know who scum were day 1. In fact he figured it out because of what he did with his shot. Look at what he did from Day 2 on and tell me how that comes from a neutral survivor and not scum-aligned survivor. An anti-town 3rd party that you are describing based on the win conditions listed in the OP has never existed in team liquid mafia history. It doesn't make sense from a game perspective and it doesn't make sense from a balance perspective. You're confusing what a neutral survivor actually means. A neutral survivor isn't neutral to both factions. He is going to pick one faction to win with and one faction to back stab. He win condition is surviving. I had an opportunity at 2v1v1 and I took it. It was an anti-town action to take a join mafia win, but a survivor is not an anti-town alignment and I can still win with town. | ||
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