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On April 26 2013 09:54 getmoript wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 09:47 VisceraEyes wrote:
What's your read of Palmar and why geript? Town. I see no reason to question the roleblock/jail. If he was roleblocked by town, then odds are he was the second NK. If he was roleblocked by scum, then he's almost certainly town.
Or he lied about the RB entirely. Also hai guise my activity has been pretty abysmal, but finishing 8 finals in 13 days will do that (along with a kickass afterparty). I'm ready to devote what time I've got to the game now; I am more likely to be active in the evenings but I will check up sporadically during the days.
Up until tube flipped I was pretty damn sure of ShiaoPi being scum, but that one post of his requesting we kill him is making me question it. It's also possible they knew he was getting modkilled I suppose---easy towncred there---but ShiaoPi hasn't cared about much this game; I'm not sure how likely it is that he'd be looking for easy towncred. The case on Palmar looks really good to me right now, though I'm still leaning on lynching ShiaoPi over him. I don't want to lynch VE (still town to me) or Clarity. Is there anyone else under scrutiny I should comment on in basic form?
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Oh I just thought of something else regarding the dual RB claims. In The Game the scum RB the 1st night was hidden and geript used it against me the entire game (to decent effect? It was mostly geript himself bringing it up constantly but it kept others guessing). It's entirely possible they stacked it on Vivax or didn't use it at all to avoid it being 'outed' later on in the game when they actually need/want to use it.
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On April 26 2013 11:45 Bill Murray wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 10:30 VisceraEyes wrote:On April 26 2013 10:20 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Well what do you think then BM calling Tube town for "wanting to get rid of inactives like Drazak" then? BM is ever a mystery to me. I'll have to look into his filter to answer this sufficiently. Being wrong doesn't mean that he's scum...and Palmar wasn't "wrong" about tube, he said "I find inactivity exceptionally scummy in this setup" and proceeded to ignore an inactive. That IS scummy. im not sure tube is town 100% it was a specific question about him... i wouldnt EVER bring up tube... hes mainly null from me... havent seen much out of him
This is so stupid. Can't tell if didn't read the last 10 pages at all or trying to pretend he didn't read last 10 pages at all. Either way looks awful.
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Posting from phone: like your analysis of kush, BM.
This is one of those things to me that seems to be only one of two possibilities:
BM is either extremely right about this, or this is one of those massive fabricated cases by scum in order to achieve a mislynch (like the one kita attempted on me in The Game before I claimed).
I'm not going to be around until later but ill check up every so often. Still unsure as to where to throw my vote right now, there are a lot of scumspects flying around and many of them don't coincide with my reads necessarily. If things continue as they are I will probably vote Shiao (despite what Sharrant says---still believe Sharrant is town but don't always agree with his analysis) but I don't want to contribute to a lynch I won't necessarily be around for as I'd like to contribute more to discussion.
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I already did; easy towncred since they knew he was getting modkilled. Gonna wait to hear what else he has to say right now though since he's apparently catching up.
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On April 27 2013 00:24 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm null on Clarity...there's just too many other more scummy people to me.
This. I think I have a little time now so I'll re-look into him and I want to look at Giygas as well; I know one thing many people have mentioned in post-game analyses recently that people don't look into dead people enough and Oats did want to lynch Giygas real early. I remember his reasoning being dumb or non_existent but worth looking at I guess.
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On April 27 2013 00:34 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2013 00:32 WaveofShadow wrote:On April 27 2013 00:24 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm null on Clarity...there's just too many other more scummy people to me. This. I think I have a little time now so I'll re-look into him and I want to look at Giygas as well; I know one thing many people have mentioned in post-game analyses recently that people don't look into dead people enough and Oats did want to lynch Giygas real early. I remember his reasoning being dumb or non_existent but worth looking at I guess. Well when people say "dead people" I'm assuming they mean "dead people who mafia killed" because that's actual information you can use to find mafia. Looking into dead Oats' posts isn't going to help you find scum because we lynched him.
On the one hand I see your point, but also remember mafia were completely content with us lynching Oats and quite possibly had a hand in it, which essentially amounts to almost the same thing. VE what are you thoughts on CC?
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Alright I read through Clarity; I have to ask, is he a new player or has he been around a while?
His play of 'posting something so I get something in before the hammer' seems like the kind of thing I did when I was knew; self preservation when none was necessary at all, and I was called scum for it multiple times when in fact I was town.
Like...his posting is awful and after having been around a little while I see exactly why now:
On April 24 2013 00:09 Clarity_nl wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 23:49 Vivax wrote:On April 23 2013 11:39 Clarity_nl wrote:On April 23 2013 11:34 Bill Murray wrote:On April 23 2013 10:34 Clarity_nl wrote:
I am here now and catching up, did not expect this game to start so soon, sorry. one hour later has read the entire game and made a case on sharrant? his case is really tunnely, and reaching, as well FoS Clarity Yeah okay I might have started reading and then figured I would read the last two pages and see palmar talking about possibly being the hammervote so figured I'd show my face. interested why you think my case is reaching, though. I find this quote interesting. Clarity apparently was afraid of not posting anything before the hammer fell, and here he is admitting that his case on Sharrant was something done in haste, and to "show his face", not cause he found the reasons good enough to post them so quickly. Hi Vivax. When you say interesting, what do you mean? Because pointing out something as interesting and seeing if anyone else jumps on it is interesting. Erm, yes I wanted to get a couple of posts in before day 1 ended, and I didn't just want it to be "I'm here guys", I do possess some self preservation. I figured if I showed my face maybe people would hold off on hammering and give me a chance to catch up. Turns out palmar wasn't even close to hammering but w/e, I wasn't sure. And I did find reasons, maybe the case isn't well worded or convincing but it is in essence why I believe he's scum.
Just weak as hell case which I called him out on to start and he admits at the same time he did it 'self-preserve' but also to prevent people from hammering? Just seems so fishy but knowing my own play I can't necessarily call it scummy per se.
On April 23 2013 16:02 Clarity_nl wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 13:18 WaveofShadow wrote:On April 23 2013 12:16 Clarity_nl wrote:On April 23 2013 12:06 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Why is there a case on Sharrant by some guy that randomly got into the thread.... Why not? Maybe instead of asking a question that has no answer you could comment on the case I made? I'll comment on it. I already forget who said it but it screams to me of reaching. I have a very strong townread on Sharrant right now and nothing you bring up in your case on him strikes me as scummy at all---how is providing 'easy outs' as you call them an anti-town thing to do? What is inherently scummy about the way he has presented himself? I will agree that his methodology isn't necessarily great but it certainly doesn't look scummy. For example in the first example you gave he provides Rayn with an out because they had already been arguing for fucking ages and shitting up the thread; it's entirely possible that he wants the argument to end as well and just wants to get a clear read, which certainly seems likely as he encourages Rayn to continue the discussion on another subject. I don't see anything wrong with his asking questions of others; everybody in here does that and you're really reaching with his talking about how he has to go eat makes him look insecure. You say that he just asks shallow questions to look involved? He's been plenty involved and has had plenty opportunity as scum to just blend it or let something go and make it seem as though he has contributed. Your case is bad and I urge you to look over something else if YOU want to make it seem like you're contributing. Providing easy outs isn't anti-town so much as it is pro-scum. It's very easy to say "do this or I'll lynch you!!!!" because your target will do what you ask. This is fine if you are asking for something that may result in anything but when you ask a question with only one possible answer regardless of your targets alignment then it is just a waste of space. If you are town and you are scumhunting you do NOT want to give whoever you're pressuring the "how-to-get-rid-of-me guide" Asking questions is fine, it generates discussion even when you do it as scum, but when there is no clear motivation NOR follow-up behind the questions then I begin to wonder why the question was asked at all, and I can only see it as feigning to contribute which is obviously a scum trait. Although I don't agree with defending a townread day 1 at all unless they are at risk of being lynched (which he is clearly not) you do make a valid point concerning the first post I addressed. I still believe I am on to something but I can see with the current thread sentiment and the fact that I am in no strong position (showing up way late >.<) that this lynch isn't happening. A weak case is still a case and it could have sparked some discussion that's not centered around oats and yamato which are as far as I'm concerned both policy lynches at best.
He calls this rebuttal to his case a hard defense of Sharrant later on (which it may well have been) but aren't hard defenses in general seen as a little bit scummy? Why just accept it not call me out on it? Why back down so feebly in the end if he believes in it so strongly? It just screams to me of my play in like the first couple games I ever played where anyone could make me back down from my own cases and I was completely unsure of myself.
Again, objectively his posting looks awful and somewhat scummy, but knowing the kind of stuff other people called me out for in the past when I was town I just don't know if I can see it as such. Including the stuff BM thinks Clarity is flat-out lying about. The post where he says "I don't care" seems more out of frustration than anything else....ugh.
I REALLY want to hear more from him and don't like the idea of a Clarity lynch....yet.
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EBWOP:
the kind of thing I did when I was NEW, not knew.
Also I referred to my rebuttal of his case; the last quote linked above is his response to that rebuttal if it wasn't clear.
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What is it people find scummy about Giygas again? That he's opportunistic or something? I dunno once again I don't think I have enough to go on here...in fact probably even less than Clarity because many of Giygas's reads and thoughts coincide somewhat with mine. He said he was going to look into me though so I'm interested to hear what he comes up with. Also looking through his filter I saw CC's massive reads list post.
CC still think I'm scum, breh? If so, why? Hell, if not, why?
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Sorry for the million posts; I'm going out for a bit so there's plenty for people to read into me here and respond to I hope, but before I go:
##Vote: ShiaoPi
I doubt in the few hours I'm gone anyone is getting lynched and I don't personally see any better candidates for today, especially considering the idea that it's better to start lynching into vets tomorrow.
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Uh, so stutters, I appreciate a ninjavote on my scumread as much as the next person, but for a guy who professes to find someone scummy for not interacting with their scumread, you're certainly looking mighty hypocritical right now.
What's up, guy?
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Ace you make an interesting point but I just don't feel good about a Clarity lynch. How many of those 6 matching voters would you say are scum, and what would it mean if Shiao does turn out to be scum?
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You guys are heading into preflip assumption territory and its not good.
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On April 27 2013 07:08 yamato77 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2013 07:08 WaveofShadow wrote:
You guys are heading into preflip assumption territory and its not good. Yeah, they're being bad. Ignore it.
Well to be fair I didn't exactly agree with your tunneling of VE. Who is your lynch of choice atm? Clarity/Shiao or someone else and why?
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On April 27 2013 07:13 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2013 07:12 yamato77 wrote:On April 27 2013 07:10 VisceraEyes wrote:On April 27 2013 07:08 yamato77 wrote:On April 27 2013 07:08 WaveofShadow wrote:
You guys are heading into preflip assumption territory and its not good. Yeah, they're being bad. Ignore it. You know you're accusing BC of shitting all over town atmosphere yamato. JUST SAYIN. I'm no longer accusing BC of anything. I'm just saying, this voting analysis of wagons is inconclusive at best. Mafia vote for mafia, town vote for town, and his list of "confirmed" players may not even be accurate, lol. Ugh this is like exactly the problem I have with the approach as well. :/
And this is why I asked Ace my question earlier. I want to find out what he thinks it means specifically, otherwise it just looks like a derailing attempt.
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On April 27 2013 07:18 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2013 07:06 WaveofShadow wrote:
Ace you make an interesting point but I just don't feel good about a Clarity lynch. How many of those 6 matching voters would you say are scum, and what would it mean if Shiao does turn out to be scum? *nods at the conclusion BC has drawn WoS I honestly don't know yet. I've got a few players I'm leaning Scum on but I won't say because I'm not 100% sure and it doesn't make sense to start more wagons and finger pointing. Lets solve one thing at a time. if Shiao does turn out to be Scum AND clarity doesn't then the matching voters look real townish and I'm just wrong. Why does a clarity lynch feel uneasy to you?
For reasons I explained here:
On April 27 2013 01:06 WaveofShadow wrote:Alright I read through Clarity; I have to ask, is he a new player or has he been around a while? His play of 'posting something so I get something in before the hammer' seems like the kind of thing I did when I was knew; self preservation when none was necessary at all, and I was called scum for it multiple times when in fact I was town. Like...his posting is awful and after having been around a little while I see exactly why now: Show nested quote +On April 24 2013 00:09 Clarity_nl wrote:On April 23 2013 23:49 Vivax wrote:On April 23 2013 11:39 Clarity_nl wrote:On April 23 2013 11:34 Bill Murray wrote:On April 23 2013 10:34 Clarity_nl wrote:
I am here now and catching up, did not expect this game to start so soon, sorry. one hour later has read the entire game and made a case on sharrant? his case is really tunnely, and reaching, as well FoS Clarity Yeah okay I might have started reading and then figured I would read the last two pages and see palmar talking about possibly being the hammervote so figured I'd show my face. interested why you think my case is reaching, though. I find this quote interesting. Clarity apparently was afraid of not posting anything before the hammer fell, and here he is admitting that his case on Sharrant was something done in haste, and to "show his face", not cause he found the reasons good enough to post them so quickly. Hi Vivax. When you say interesting, what do you mean? Because pointing out something as interesting and seeing if anyone else jumps on it is interesting. Erm, yes I wanted to get a couple of posts in before day 1 ended, and I didn't just want it to be "I'm here guys", I do possess some self preservation. I figured if I showed my face maybe people would hold off on hammering and give me a chance to catch up. Turns out palmar wasn't even close to hammering but w/e, I wasn't sure. And I did find reasons, maybe the case isn't well worded or convincing but it is in essence why I believe he's scum. Just weak as hell case which I called him out on to start and he admits at the same time he did it 'self-preserve' but also to prevent people from hammering? Just seems so fishy but knowing my own play I can't necessarily call it scummy per se. Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 16:02 Clarity_nl wrote:On April 23 2013 13:18 WaveofShadow wrote:On April 23 2013 12:16 Clarity_nl wrote:On April 23 2013 12:06 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Why is there a case on Sharrant by some guy that randomly got into the thread.... Why not? Maybe instead of asking a question that has no answer you could comment on the case I made? I'll comment on it. I already forget who said it but it screams to me of reaching. I have a very strong townread on Sharrant right now and nothing you bring up in your case on him strikes me as scummy at all---how is providing 'easy outs' as you call them an anti-town thing to do? What is inherently scummy about the way he has presented himself? I will agree that his methodology isn't necessarily great but it certainly doesn't look scummy. For example in the first example you gave he provides Rayn with an out because they had already been arguing for fucking ages and shitting up the thread; it's entirely possible that he wants the argument to end as well and just wants to get a clear read, which certainly seems likely as he encourages Rayn to continue the discussion on another subject. I don't see anything wrong with his asking questions of others; everybody in here does that and you're really reaching with his talking about how he has to go eat makes him look insecure. You say that he just asks shallow questions to look involved? He's been plenty involved and has had plenty opportunity as scum to just blend it or let something go and make it seem as though he has contributed. Your case is bad and I urge you to look over something else if YOU want to make it seem like you're contributing. Providing easy outs isn't anti-town so much as it is pro-scum. It's very easy to say "do this or I'll lynch you!!!!" because your target will do what you ask. This is fine if you are asking for something that may result in anything but when you ask a question with only one possible answer regardless of your targets alignment then it is just a waste of space. If you are town and you are scumhunting you do NOT want to give whoever you're pressuring the "how-to-get-rid-of-me guide" Asking questions is fine, it generates discussion even when you do it as scum, but when there is no clear motivation NOR follow-up behind the questions then I begin to wonder why the question was asked at all, and I can only see it as feigning to contribute which is obviously a scum trait. Although I don't agree with defending a townread day 1 at all unless they are at risk of being lynched (which he is clearly not) you do make a valid point concerning the first post I addressed. I still believe I am on to something but I can see with the current thread sentiment and the fact that I am in no strong position (showing up way late >.<) that this lynch isn't happening. A weak case is still a case and it could have sparked some discussion that's not centered around oats and yamato which are as far as I'm concerned both policy lynches at best. He calls this rebuttal to his case a hard defense of Sharrant later on (which it may well have been) but aren't hard defenses in general seen as a little bit scummy? Why just accept it not call me out on it? Why back down so feebly in the end if he believes in it so strongly? It just screams to me of my play in like the first couple games I ever played where anyone could make me back down from my own cases and I was completely unsure of myself. Again, objectively his posting looks awful and somewhat scummy, but knowing the kind of stuff other people called me out for in the past when I was town I just don't know if I can see it as such. Including the stuff BM thinks Clarity is flat-out lying about. The post where he says "I don't care" seems more out of frustration than anything else....ugh. I REALLY want to hear more from him and don't like the idea of a Clarity lynch....yet.
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lulz@BM
I agree that it's entirely possible Shiao is bad town, but Clarity does not look worse to me. But if I were to switch over to Clarity for any reason (I don't want to right now) I'd definitely have to hear from him first. The fact that Shiao came back and his response to being under the gun makes him kinda look worse than a guy who has fucked off after being active in this thread once says something to me.
I am in no hurry to end this day, btw; VE I am fine with the people who haven't voted holding off for now as long as they make their intentions clear.
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On April 27 2013 07:28 raynpelikoneet wrote:
My question remains. Why does ShiaoPi think Palmar is supertown and VE is scum when his reasons for VE being scum point at least as much, if not even more, to Palmar being scum.
Lazy town could very well answer that question, which is think the best overall countercase to Shiao's scumminess thus far, but it's not enough to convince me. Would be nice to hear more from Shiao himself or again, Clarity.
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If I were a lazy/clueless townie, I don't think I would have come in with the hammer, btw. If you're clueless or lazy how can you be so confident as to drop the hammer if you have no idea what's been going on?
That's not lazy or clueless, it's reckless/scummy/bad.
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EPT
