EPTTL Mafia LXI - Page 301
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Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
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GiygaS
Canada1043 Posts
On May 21 2013 01:32 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Even Vivax calls him giggles now. Beautiful. It appears that it will be my name for every game from now on  | ||
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Promethelax
Canada7089 Posts
On May 21 2013 00:16 geript wrote: I agree that the situation shouldn't have occurred, but the teams should be balanced as well. Neither should mod killed players have flipped until the end of day/night. Neither should anyone have gotten a free pass to post after the hammer. Neither should the teams have been so imbalanced from the start. Palmar, BC, Dr H, VE, Yamato vs 1/2 Marv is not fair especially in instant majority. Scum getting 1 "confirmed town" in exchange for losing their vet is not a great exchange. Town lost because they were lazy. Palmar, you were lazy and lost because of it. Hosting did not make you lazy; if you want to win, then play to win. You had 8 days to lynch me and never put forth effort to do so. Don't blame the hosts for your actions. You NEED to stop whining about vet-balance. There are many games where vet town teams got toasted by newbie scum teams. Dessert is a great example: me/bugs/supersoft/Imp/thrawn vs two first time scums and Hapa who is notoriously bad at scum. The game is what it is, some players are better than others and some are worse. If every game was vet-balanced it would become boring. Vets wouldn't matter because you'd wait for scum to shoot two of them and lynch the third. Boring. And look at your vet list, Yamato was terribad for a while but he got better. He got better by playing in unbalanced games and learning from people better than him. In perfectly vet-balanced games you have to play to host wifom, not to the game. Host wifom is terrible as was proven in this very game. Play the game, not the set-up, not vet-balance, the game. An issue I had with the modkill confirmation and why I argued for leaving geript in the game: I know and like both BH and Marv (egotistical bastards though they are) and both have very particular qt desires. Marv has private qts with various players he has played with in the past and likes to use those for any private interaction between himself and that player no matter if they are scum/town/shadowing/hydra'd whatever and BH likes people to use qts he creates in games so that he can keep an eye on what is going on behind the scenes. I have a qt which fits into both of these categories (a private one with marv that we have used for various things and a qt set-up by bh for a game he was hosting when I was being shadowed by Warbaby in BE:2). Because I knew that such things were intrinsically true for these two guys I did not believe that there was any alignment indicative information in marv's post modkill post. Because of that I argued for geript being left alive and allowing him to continue to play the game. Should bh have modkilled marv? Probably not. Should marv have posted after his modkill? No. Did what bh/marv did in any way actually confirm geript as town? not at all. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
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Promethelax
Canada7089 Posts
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iamperfection
United States9639 Posts
On May 21 2013 03:43 Promethelax wrote: You aren't that special, here, look. to bad acro got lazy at the end could have had 50 | ||
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Promethelax
Canada7089 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Mr. Cheesecake
United States3756 Posts
It didnt confirm anything. But it fucked with peoples mentalities regardless, which led to a terribly altered game. Just leave it in the past. | ||
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geript
10024 Posts
On May 21 2013 05:11 Ace wrote: Agree with Prome. That "vet" shit is so ridiculous just play the fucking game. It's very hard to have a voice to actually push bad lynches without having a vet or two. Had palmar played this game on a smurf account and not ever been revealed, he would've easily been lynched at any number of points for his ridiculous play. Reputation had far more effect on this game than anything else. @Vivax Nothing in Marv's post said anything that people pointed towards in 'mod-confirming' me. Everyone's reason for mod-confirming me was only and solely based off of the terrible reasoning that using the hydra QT instead of a scum QT made me mod-confirmed town. Posting in a private QT is not alignment indicative because as scum I may be asking specific questions, talking shit, or anything. Hell, as 'mod-confirmed' town every single cop should've been using me to check sanity and what not. Not a single cop even thought to do that; VE didn't use me as 'confirmed town' to check against other players; CC and Palmar didn't use me as a sanity check. Town played bad; scum played bad; Ace played well. The 'mod-confirm' only affected things because town decided to play bad for no reason. If you want to be a sore loser, then please go ahead and be a sore loser. Even at many points in the mid-late game the 'mod-confirm' didn't protect me from being lynched, town just assumed that it did for no reason whatsoever. There was no reason to think me town in this game just as there was no reason to think me town in The Game; the difference between this game and that game is that scum played very well in The Game and very poorly in this one. People didn't want to lynch an obviously scummy player who 'managed' to avoid scum NKs while maintaining 'mod-confirmed' status. That's town's fault not the mods. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
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BloodyC0bbler
Canada7875 Posts
I should have realized when I wasn't shot and WoS was that palmar was a setup to misslynch given how WoS said he was seeing things kinda from Palmars view. But with 2 minutes to decide a vote I just said fuck it and voted. I realize with slightly more time to work with I could have read the posts that I hadn't seen / spend more time thinking about how the NK worked out. I think I would have changed my vote given those circumstances but potentially could have still fucked up. As a note, regardless of the whole bit of "geript confirmed town" When Marv posted after being removed from the game with 0 real fall back from the host and the thread either correctly or not mod confirms a player because of it you have to realize it stacks the game in favour of whatever alignment said player was. Geript living so long is "suspect" but given how inactive mafia was / having dts to deal with and other blues, its not unreasonable to expect him to live as long as he did. A ton of players this game for town played like complete ass. Mainly people like me, Palmar, Kush, and a few others. I think the cop setup in this game(personally) was horrendously fucked giving us one useless blue role, and 3 other roles that fuck with the two useful ones (one still has to prove sanity, and the other can still fuck the town over) thus giving mafia a huge edge imo. However I think the biggest thing that hurt the town this game was that days could span on for ages and a majority had to be garnered. When games become inactive because of dt checks being lynched and no one posts because of it you really have a hard time pushing anyone who wasn't checked as people just move into the "herp derp sheep" mode. Factor in days that could span a huge amount of time and people who play around work schedules and time zones and games very quickly turn dull. I think there was a ton of fun here, but I think general sentiment near the end was "i just want the game to end" regardless of turnout. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On May 21 2013 06:59 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Sorry Palmar/town. I had all of 2 minutes to decide my vote and couldn't even read anything past the night post to decide given the situation I was in. I also didn't want to risk not voting thus turning it into a NL day as I had no clue when Id have net access again. I should have realized when I wasn't shot and WoS was that palmar was a setup to misslynch given how WoS said he was seeing things kinda from Palmars view. But with 2 minutes to decide a vote I just said fuck it and voted. I realize with slightly more time to work with I could have read the posts that I hadn't seen / spend more time thinking about how the NK worked out. I think I would have changed my vote given those circumstances but potentially could have still fucked up. As a note, regardless of the whole bit of "geript confirmed town" When Marv posted after being removed from the game with 0 real fall back from the host and the thread either correctly or not mod confirms a player because of it you have to realize it stacks the game in favour of whatever alignment said player was. Geript living so long is "suspect" but given how inactive mafia was / having dts to deal with and other blues, its not unreasonable to expect him to live as long as he did. A ton of players this game for town played like complete ass. Mainly people like me, Palmar, Kush, and a few others. I think the cop setup in this game(personally) was horrendously fucked giving us one useless blue role, and 3 other roles that fuck with the two useful ones (one still has to prove sanity, and the other can still fuck the town over) thus giving mafia a huge edge imo. However I think the biggest thing that hurt the town this game was that days could span on for ages and a majority had to be garnered. When games become inactive because of dt checks being lynched and no one posts because of it you really have a hard time pushing anyone who wasn't checked as people just move into the "herp derp sheep" mode. Factor in days that could span a huge amount of time and people who play around work schedules and time zones and games very quickly turn dull. I think there was a ton of fun here, but I think general sentiment near the end was "i just want the game to end" regardless of turnout. Good post imo. In the end I think we've all learned a few lessons from this game that we can take and improve upon in the future. | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On May 21 2013 07:01 WaveofShadow wrote: Good post imo. In the end I think we've all learned a few lessons from this game that we can take and improve upon in the future. Yup, I've learned that my last min pre-death guesses are always correct and that people should sheep them. On May 12 2013 06:26 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Well that's annoying. I'm good with flipping geript tomorrow for now. In other news I just beat my PB in GTA VC \o/ | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On May 21 2013 06:33 geript wrote: It's very hard to have a voice to actually push bad lynches without having a vet or two. Had palmar played this game on a smurf account and not ever been revealed, he would've easily been lynched at any number of points for his ridiculous play. Reputation had far more effect on this game than anything else. 1.) To the bolded - and it shouldn't. I commented on this too but reputation gets people much further than it should. Town should lynch people for bad play and stop worrying about what some guy promises in the future because he's caught scum before. Just bad logic in many ways. I said it numerous times in game about yamato: assuming that me/BC/Palmar/VE must be scum because of "vet" status shows that he isn't reading the game and merely lost and grasping at straws. I've always had a problem with the vet label though as with many things in this forum it is constantly misused. 2.) I don't fully agree that you need a vet voice to push bad lynches. There are many dimensions to this answer, and I know where you are coming from: Collectively the Town is dumb, and will appeal to perceived authority over someone making solid posts. There are ways to spot a bad lynch but for the sake of argument I'm going to assume you mean Scum driven lynches on Town. Thing is townies fuck up all the time and make anti-town decisions and posts. It's your job to get them strung up on it while making a case that includes scum motivation. As difficult as it may be keep doing it as it will make you a better all around player in the future. There is something I should get around to posting, some backroom conversations with many players, that kind of goes into this. Bottom line is keep doing the actions that have higher value and you'll eventually succeed. Bad players stay bad because they don't think and unfortunately you only have limited control in helping them improve. | ||
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