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Witchcraft Mini Mafia - Page 159

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 28 2012 23:16 GMT
#3161
Hm, okay so I want masonry to be an option. What could make it strong enough to make it worthwhile? Perhaps making it last longer, or having it give you two independent masonries when you use it? Like if you chose masonry, you pick two targets and can either create a 3-person Mason QT for 48 hours, or if you want you can create 2 1-on-1 Mason QTs for 48 hours.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
Dandel Ion
Profile Joined November 2010
Austria17960 Posts
December 28 2012 23:17 GMT
#3162
My suggestion:
A scum getting witchcraft refreshes one page
Mason page is useless since there are like no situations where town would mason somebody -> you can keep it in there if you want, but it's not gonna be used ever
Maybe give RB page a cap of 2 but either 1) start off with only one page 2) restrict use to only 1 RB/night

_____

Dividing the bullets is imo just as "risky", you have twice the chance to lose the KP, but only lose half.
It's less extreme though, so it might be better. Dunno.
A backwards poet writes inverse.
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 28 2012 23:17 GMT
#3163
Oh, it occurs to me that if as town you mason a scum player you'll just get shot with a silver bullet, won't you.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
Dandel Ion
Profile Joined November 2010
Austria17960 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-28 23:20:22
December 28 2012 23:19 GMT
#3164
From a town perspective, masoning just doesn't make much sense unless there's somehow a confirmed town to plan with or something. Which will only happen around LYLO, where JK/vet powers are 10000x better anyways.

€: yeah what you sniped me with
A backwards poet writes inverse.
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 28 2012 23:20 GMT
#3165
On December 29 2012 08:17 Blazinghand wrote:
Oh, it occurs to me that if as town you mason a scum player you'll just get shot with a silver bullet, won't you.


yes, and that's why I would have never used this as town ^^
DoYouHas
Profile Joined November 2008
United States1140 Posts
December 28 2012 23:20 GMT
#3166
The problem I have with the mason ability is that it is really underpowered in the setup as is. No town would pick it with the other powerful roles in the pool. And no scum would pick it because it potentially works against you. But here is the trick, if you remove scum's ability to mason people, the role becomes absurdly powerful. Just masoning the most townie person in the game confirms you as town to them.
Guts? Determination? $5?
Dandel Ion
Profile Joined November 2010
Austria17960 Posts
December 28 2012 23:22 GMT
#3167
I feel like 50% of the power the mason role usually has is simply that it confirms another townie.

If you choose them yourself, you don't have that guarantee, making it an undesireable option.
A backwards poet writes inverse.
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 28 2012 23:22 GMT
#3168
Okay, what if Masonry works differently? If you use Masonry, you don't specify a target and at daybreak you're randomly masoned with another town player (alternative: two random town players are masoned with each other, not necessarily including you).

This would give it some detection power, but because you can't really aim it it's not always as useful as a DT check. Might make sense to make masonry with a godfather possible so it's detection power is strictly worse than scrying.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 28 2012 23:35 GMT
#3169
On December 29 2012 08:22 Blazinghand wrote:
Okay, what if Masonry works differently? If you use Masonry, you don't specify a target and at daybreak you're randomly masoned with another town player (alternative: two random town players are masoned with each other, not necessarily including you).

This would give it some detection power, but because you can't really aim it it's not always as useful as a DT check. Might make sense to make masonry with a godfather possible so it's detection power is strictly worse than scrying.


So what is mafia counterbalancing masonery power in that case ?
Just chosing a mason ?
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 28 2012 23:36 GMT
#3170
The mafia power would be a 1-shot masonry between a mafia player and a target of their choice. This way, if you initiate a masonry, you know your target is town, but if you are the recipient of a masonry, you're not sure.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
December 28 2012 23:45 GMT
#3171
how necessary is masonry?

it sounds like there were 2 powers that basically weren't used or considered this game. And that the choices of what was left was enough. As a general feel it seems like that adding one more as a serious option is enough, rather than 2. Simply considering how long a game of mafia is.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
DoYouHas
Profile Joined November 2008
United States1140 Posts
December 28 2012 23:45 GMT
#3172
What if, instead of making Masonry an option, making it a much more common part of the game.

1. Give scum witchcraft votes (they don't actually work towards electing anyone, but they are necessary for #2.)
2. Each person elected gets randomly masoned with 1 of the people that voted them.

I'm not sure how you would balance this with scum having 2 silver bullets, because this would increase the chances of scum knowing who got elected.
Guts? Determination? $5?
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 28 2012 23:46 GMT
#3173
On December 29 2012 08:36 Blazinghand wrote:
The mafia power would be a 1-shot masonry between a mafia player and a target of their choice. This way, if you initiate a masonry, you know your target is town, but if you are the recipient of a masonry, you're not sure.


But you have good chances to initiate a town/town masonery. The problem I see here is that you don't have as much control as you have when you use the other powers. There is no real incentive to use this power as town over the others...
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 28 2012 23:49 GMT
#3174
Also I'm welcoming any comment on my scum play during this game, except for the part where I should try to forgive and play with my teammates, even if I feel like they are gamethrowing ^^
DoYouHas
Profile Joined November 2008
United States1140 Posts
December 28 2012 23:56 GMT
#3175
Your scum play in thread was pretty good, the amount of genuine effort you put into the game read as townie. Sometimes your attitude got in your way, and your priorities for night actions were a bit off (wasting the shot, killing MrZ instead of Hapa).
Guts? Determination? $5?
DoYouHas
Profile Joined November 2008
United States1140 Posts
December 29 2012 00:00 GMT
#3176
On December 29 2012 08:45 DoYouHas wrote:
What if, instead of making Masonry an option, making it a much more common part of the game.

1. Give scum witchcraft votes (they don't actually work towards electing anyone, but they are necessary for #2.)
2. Each person elected gets randomly masoned with 1 of the people that voted them.

I'm not sure how you would balance this with scum having 2 silver bullets, because this would increase the chances of scum knowing who got elected.


Maybe you make it so that silver bullets are resolved with the day/night post, instead of instantly. That would make it so that the masonry could be used for scumhunting, and also allow time for breadcrumbing who you got masoned with and all sorts of shinanigans.
Guts? Determination? $5?
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25551 Posts
December 29 2012 00:02 GMT
#3177
On December 29 2012 09:00 DoYouHas wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 29 2012 08:45 DoYouHas wrote:
What if, instead of making Masonry an option, making it a much more common part of the game.

1. Give scum witchcraft votes (they don't actually work towards electing anyone, but they are necessary for #2.)
2. Each person elected gets randomly masoned with 1 of the people that voted them.

I'm not sure how you would balance this with scum having 2 silver bullets, because this would increase the chances of scum knowing who got elected.


Maybe you make it so that silver bullets are resolved with the day/night post, instead of instantly. That would make it so that the masonry could be used for scumhunting, and also allow time for breadcrumbing who you got masoned with and all sorts of shinanigans.


This might actually be good. It would still mean that as a mason you'd die if you masoned a scum player, but you'd die at the end of the day rather than immediately.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 29 2012 00:04 GMT
#3178
On December 29 2012 08:56 DoYouHas wrote:
Your scum play in thread was pretty good, the amount of genuine effort you put into the game read as townie. Sometimes your attitude got in your way, and your priorities for night actions were a bit off (wasting the shot, killing MrZ instead of Hapa).


I don't know about Hapa. It kept JieXian really focused on the fact that he was still alive. I think it could have won us the game if the CC kill would have gone through.

And for my attitude, I was really exhausted and about to take my plane when kush finally posted his case against me ^^
Also I got less involved cause I'm in France now.
DoYouHas
Profile Joined November 2008
United States1140 Posts
December 29 2012 00:09 GMT
#3179
On December 29 2012 09:04 Djodref wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 29 2012 08:56 DoYouHas wrote:
Your scum play in thread was pretty good, the amount of genuine effort you put into the game read as townie. Sometimes your attitude got in your way, and your priorities for night actions were a bit off (wasting the shot, killing MrZ instead of Hapa).


I don't know about Hapa. It kept JieXian really focused on the fact that he was still alive. I think it could have won us the game if the CC kill would have gone through.

And for my attitude, I was really exhausted and about to take my plane when kush finally posted his case against me ^^
Also I got less involved cause I'm in France now.


This is what I mean about your priorities being off. Hapa was essentially confirmed, had ridiculous influence on lynch decisions, was clearly doing a better job scumhunting than any other townie, and was likely elected. Getting rid of him is an incredibly better choice than preoccupying a non-influential townie & getting rid of MrZ. Also, with no silver bullet, and no RB (after MrZ died), hapa became almost unkillable, or at least much more of a coinflip kill than I generally like.
Guts? Determination? $5?
DoYouHas
Profile Joined November 2008
United States1140 Posts
December 29 2012 01:23 GMT
#3180
@BH - I think that sort of forced masonry could add an interesting level of strategy to the game. On one hand, it gives town an extra avenue to scumhunt through, possibly promoting more town unity. On the other, scum could try and use the masonry to find elected people. Spreading their votes over likely candidates to increase the chances they get masoned with a blue, or piling onto the most likely to be elected, or a combination of both. The possibility of elected scum makes things even more complicated.

It would be a pretty drastic change in the setup, but the more I'm thinking about it, the more it intrigues me.
Guts? Determination? $5?
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