EPTTL Mafia LVII - Page 88
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
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Forumite
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On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. Show nested quote + On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: Show nested quote + On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? Show nested quote + On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler +  Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. | ||
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? 2) I can't do anything if your spider-sense is tingling. I've given good reasons to vote for BM, I've given good reasons to vote for maverick. You claim you don't have good reasons to vote on me and do so nevertheless. We are in day three. If you aren't scum, you gotta do better than this, man. Do me a favor, and go carefully through BM's filter. Pay attention to the key posts I've mentioned, and pay attention to the number of things that can be interpreted as "crumbs". Also, try to find crumbs on austin. The thread is large, but at least focus on the key players. Also, you mentioned you don't want to attack him based on a lie, but it's not just that. Read my case again, preferably in a "let's see if he makes sense" state of mind, and not a "this guy is scum, he's trying to trick us all" one. | ||
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Kreb
4834 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. | ||
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Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following: 1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths | ||
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. That's because his vote is on me. | ||
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. | ||
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:21 Mementoss wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following: 1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths WOW Dafuq yourself 1) How am I confusing town?? I'm clear on my reads. I'm not going like two thirds of the people here going with: I think XXX looks suspicious. Vote XXX. How the fuck am I confusing people? I'm giving you arguments and you choose what you want with them. Don't act like I'm manipulating anybody, I'm stating facts and drawing conclusions. You can agree with the conclusions or not, but that's another matter. 2) Ok, this is ridiculous. I'm not making anyone looking guilty. I'm stating FACTS and implying conclusions. 3) Yea, nice idea of how town should behave. I'm giving you decent arguments that don't rely on "this guy looks suspicious, let's all vote for him, hooray!", and you somehow think this is scum-motivated? You cannot deny that I am clear on my reads. What part of "I want to lynch BM" do you not understand? You're just acting like a scared little sheep that can't think for yourself. It's not like I have mind powers and am manipulating you all to do as I plan and thus I'm scum. Now I want to hear it. What do you propose? What's is your idea of scumhunting, hmm? If I'm making arguments that don't exist on the BM case, let's hear it. Express your thoughts, sheep. | ||
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
On September 11 2012 22:12 Mementoss wrote: I am at work and don't have much time. Catching up is hard, from my reading so far I think Maverick is scum and will vote him I read the most recent case on forumite but I just don't see it. Hopefully I can finish filling in the gaps of reading tonight and actually post a worthy post of why maverick is scum. I'm hoping I can make deadline today busy day. | ||
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Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:30 Z-BosoN wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:21 Mementoss wrote: On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following: 1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths WOW Dafuq yourself 1) How am I confusing town?? I'm clear on my reads. I'm not going like two thirds of the people here going with: I think XXX looks suspicious. Vote XXX. How the fuck am I confusing people? I'm giving you arguments and you choose what you want with them. Don't act like I'm manipulating anybody, I'm stating facts and drawing conclusions. You can agree with the conclusions or not, but that's another matter. 2) Ok, this is ridiculous. I'm not making anyone looking guilty. I'm stating FACTS and implying conclusions. 3) Yea, nice idea of how town should behave. I'm giving you decent arguments that don't rely on "this guy looks suspicious, let's all vote for him, hooray!", and you somehow think this is scum-motivated? You cannot deny that I am clear on my reads. What part of "I want to lynch BM" do you not understand? You're just acting like a scared little sheep that can't think for yourself. It's not like I have mind powers and am manipulating you all to do as I plan and thus I'm scum. Now I want to hear it. What do you propose? What's is your idea of scumhunting, hmm? If I'm making arguments that don't exist on the BM case, let's hear it. Express your thoughts, sheep. What. Why so defensive? This wasn't anything against/towards you, it was towards Kreb, I never said I thought you were putting words into peoples mouths. My post was about Kreb saying you putting words in peoples mouths is another reason he thinks your town, which makes no fucking sense at all. But this hardcore defensive reaction you gave me is kinda weird. | ||
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Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:35 Z-BosoN wrote: Also, eagerly awaiting your case on mav: Show nested quote + On September 11 2012 22:12 Mementoss wrote: I am at work and don't have much time. Catching up is hard, from my reading so far I think Maverick is scum and will vote him I read the most recent case on forumite but I just don't see it. Hopefully I can finish filling in the gaps of reading tonight and actually post a worthy post of why maverick is scum. I'm hoping I can make deadline today busy day. When I posted this I was at page 40. I'm at page 59 now. So I still have half the game to catch up on. At this point it won't change whose going to get lynched, but I still have to find out who is scum so I can be helpful day4 | ||
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:21 Mementoss wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following: 1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths I felt it was implied. I think you went a bit overboard on the semantics of "Putting words into peoples mouths". He means I'm giving people arguments to work with. I understood this, because if you have read the game, that's exactly what I'm doing. You, for some reason, think that means 1) 2) and 3). Since I cannot fathom how it could POSSIBLY mean 1) 2) and 3) granted how I've been posting, I felt that this was implied, granted kreb's statement was entirely towards me. So the only conclusion I can draw from your comment is that you have not yet read the game carefully enough. Please do so, and share your thoughts on mav. Sorry for the aggressiveness, I'm pissed at how some people are behaving here and how that's going unnoticed. | ||
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Gravan
59 Posts
Bill Murray is still suspicious, but, really, who the fuck knows? Z-Boson is highly suspicious. Forumite is highly suspicious, and very shifty. For somebody who is posting somewhat regularily, he hasn't done too much to defend himself other than point as many fingers as he can as quickly as he can - something that seems really scummy. I wish we had another day to talk about this, heh. ##Vote Forumite. | ||
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Gravan
59 Posts
Bill Murray's posting is very difficult to read, and he claims to have had more knowledge than he really ought to have had. That said, he has apparently been playing mafia for a while so he could also have just made a good read. Z-Boson is far too defensive for my liking - it seems like he thinks that every post that isn't in agreement with him, or that pulls the discussion away from his posts, is targeted at him. | ||
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Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://techspce.com/home/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/obey-hypnotoad-3.png) | ||
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mkfuba07
United States1151 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:46 Z-BosoN wrote: Oh, nothing against me, huh? Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:21 Mementoss wrote: On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following: 1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths I felt it was implied. I think you went a bit overboard on the semantics of "Putting words into peoples mouths". He means I'm giving people arguments to work with. I understood this, because if you have read the game, that's exactly what I'm doing. You, for some reason, think that means 1) 2) and 3). Since I cannot fathom how it could POSSIBLY mean 1) 2) and 3) granted how I've been posting, I felt that this was implied, granted kreb's statement was entirely towards me. So the only conclusion I can draw from your comment is that you have not yet read the game carefully enough. Please do so, and share your thoughts on mav. Sorry for the aggressiveness, I'm pissed at how some people are behaving here and how that's going unnoticed. If - as Kreb said - you were putting words into peoples' mouths, then momentoss's reaction is completely justified. Putting words into peoples' mouths IS used by scum in all the ways he mentioned. He never once said that you were doing so, he only said that if Kreb thinks you're doing so, then he's interpreting it in the completely wrong way. I agree with him entirely. This is the second time you've reacted over-defensively to something rather inconsequential. The first was when two people voted for you and you claimed there were five. This was in the middle of the massive wagon building onto Forumite. 8 people vote Forumite, 2 vote you, suddenly it's "OMG where are these votes coming from? This wagon on me is so big and sudden without a case!" Why so defensive? | ||
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
On September 12 2012 04:54 Gravan wrote: At this point, my viewpoint is as follows (on the big topics): Bill Murray is still suspicious, but, really, who the fuck knows? Z-Boson is highly suspicious. Forumite is highly suspicious, and very shifty. For somebody who is posting somewhat regularily, he hasn't done too much to defend himself other than point as many fingers as he can as quickly as he can - something that seems really scummy. I wish we had another day to talk about this, heh. ##Vote Forumite. This is exactly why I'm defensive, not about posts that disagree with me, but about posts like this. You sheep don't bother making real cases, don't bother commenting on the real cases, and just follow along the trend. Forumite's suspicious? Yes I very much think so. He's made few cases and has been, like you, very casual about his votes. I fail to see how, at the moment, BM doesn't seem more suspicious than him, however. And I'm bothered by the fact that no one has bothered giving me any reasons as to why they think my case on BM sucks and doesn't deserve merit. Aside from imallinson, all we are getting is two-liner "this guy is suspicious" posts, and this makes scum feel comfortable blending in, because they don't have to bother scumhunting. Why is this bad? Because scum can't genuinely scumhunt and are bound to make mistakes. Thus, I strongly feel they must be forced to scumhunt, but that's not gonna happen with these kind of posts. Anyways, I'm done ranting. I hope people can agree with me here... | ||
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Z-BosoN
Brazil2590 Posts
On September 12 2012 05:02 mkfuba07 wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:46 Z-BosoN wrote: Oh, nothing against me, huh? On September 12 2012 04:21 Mementoss wrote: On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following: 1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths I felt it was implied. I think you went a bit overboard on the semantics of "Putting words into peoples mouths". He means I'm giving people arguments to work with. I understood this, because if you have read the game, that's exactly what I'm doing. You, for some reason, think that means 1) 2) and 3). Since I cannot fathom how it could POSSIBLY mean 1) 2) and 3) granted how I've been posting, I felt that this was implied, granted kreb's statement was entirely towards me. So the only conclusion I can draw from your comment is that you have not yet read the game carefully enough. Please do so, and share your thoughts on mav. Sorry for the aggressiveness, I'm pissed at how some people are behaving here and how that's going unnoticed. If - as Kreb said - you were putting words into peoples' mouths, then momentoss's reaction is completely justified. Putting words into peoples' mouths IS used by scum in all the ways he mentioned. He never once said that you were doing so, he only said that if Kreb thinks you're doing so, then he's interpreting it in the completely wrong way. I agree with him entirely. This is the second time you've reacted over-defensively to something rather inconsequential. The first was when two people voted for you and you claimed there were five. This was in the middle of the massive wagon building onto Forumite. 8 people vote Forumite, 2 vote you, suddenly it's "OMG where are these votes coming from? This wagon on me is so big and sudden without a case!" Why so defensive? Refer to the above post I answered Gravan with. Because they were completely unjustified. I had two votes, but there were 3-5 people saying "Z-BosoN is my top scumread" and that's it. This is shit, we are in day three and we were better off in day one with the cases being made. Also because I took the time to make the BM case and few people have even responded. Look at my answer to imallinson's case on me to confirm this - I'm not defensive. I am, however, trying to make people stop this hardcore sheeping. Like I said, this is the best environment scum can thrive in, because they don't need to bother themselves making real scumreads and thus not needing to risk making mistakes. | ||
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On September 12 2012 05:10 Z-BosoN wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 04:54 Gravan wrote: At this point, my viewpoint is as follows (on the big topics): Bill Murray is still suspicious, but, really, who the fuck knows? Z-Boson is highly suspicious. Forumite is highly suspicious, and very shifty. For somebody who is posting somewhat regularily, he hasn't done too much to defend himself other than point as many fingers as he can as quickly as he can - something that seems really scummy. I wish we had another day to talk about this, heh. ##Vote Forumite. This is exactly why I'm defensive, not about posts that disagree with me, but about posts like this. You sheep don't bother making real cases, don't bother commenting on the real cases, and just follow along the trend. Forumite's suspicious? Yes I very much think so. He's made few cases and has been, like you, very casual about his votes. I fail to see how, at the moment, BM doesn't seem more suspicious than him, however. And I'm bothered by the fact that no one has bothered giving me any reasons as to why they think my case on BM sucks and doesn't deserve merit. Aside from imallinson, all we are getting is two-liner "this guy is suspicious" posts, and this makes scum feel comfortable blending in, because they don't have to bother scumhunting. Why is this bad? Because scum can't genuinely scumhunt and are bound to make mistakes. Thus, I strongly feel they must be forced to scumhunt, but that's not gonna happen with these kind of posts. Anyways, I'm done ranting. I hope people can agree with me here... See, all I did was say that you're "highly suspicious". No case, nothing. It could, maybe, just be that I am fishing around a little - hoping to get a line or two from you in response or whatever. What I get, instead, is a full paragraph using phrasing like "I fail to see how, at the moment, BM doesn't seem more suspicious than him, however." - this isn't something I said or even implied. As for "I'm bothered by the fact that no one has bothered giving me any reasons as to why they think my case on BM sucks...", haha, welcome to the club champ . I wonder if this could be because BM is scum, that the cases/words against him are being downplayed by scum? In any case, I really think the reads on BM (including mine, as stated) are all over the place.On September 12 2012 05:17 Z-BosoN wrote: Show nested quote + On September 12 2012 05:02 mkfuba07 wrote: On September 12 2012 04:46 Z-BosoN wrote: Oh, nothing against me, huh? On September 12 2012 04:21 Mementoss wrote: On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote: On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote: On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote: - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote: I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth. The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote: And there goes D3. Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote: Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now? Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson? Why do you want me to die? Make an effort to explain yourself. For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler + On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote: First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler + On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote: Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote + As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote: It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase:I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote: Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote: On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote: Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum? Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him. I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote: Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. Hello folks ^^ I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone. A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker. Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite + Show Spoiler + Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote: There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote + On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote: Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep. For now: ##Vote: Mattchew He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BM Show nested quote + I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote + One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote: Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me: We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads. But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment? I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote + It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote: On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote: On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote: Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well. The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day. That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote + On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote: One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me. In the next post:+ Show Spoiler + On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote: Show nested quote + Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote: Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched. What can we conclude if he flips scum or town? In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch? My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum. If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched. Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game. @Shiaopi Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote + Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote: No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following: 1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths I felt it was implied. I think you went a bit overboard on the semantics of "Putting words into peoples mouths". He means I'm giving people arguments to work with. I understood this, because if you have read the game, that's exactly what I'm doing. You, for some reason, think that means 1) 2) and 3). Since I cannot fathom how it could POSSIBLY mean 1) 2) and 3) granted how I've been posting, I felt that this was implied, granted kreb's statement was entirely towards me. So the only conclusion I can draw from your comment is that you have not yet read the game carefully enough. Please do so, and share your thoughts on mav. Sorry for the aggressiveness, I'm pissed at how some people are behaving here and how that's going unnoticed. If - as Kreb said - you were putting words into peoples' mouths, then momentoss's reaction is completely justified. Putting words into peoples' mouths IS used by scum in all the ways he mentioned. He never once said that you were doing so, he only said that if Kreb thinks you're doing so, then he's interpreting it in the completely wrong way. I agree with him entirely. This is the second time you've reacted over-defensively to something rather inconsequential. The first was when two people voted for you and you claimed there were five. This was in the middle of the massive wagon building onto Forumite. 8 people vote Forumite, 2 vote you, suddenly it's "OMG where are these votes coming from? This wagon on me is so big and sudden without a case!" Why so defensive? Refer to the above post I answered Gravan with. Because they were completely unjustified. I had two votes, but there were 3-5 people saying "Z-BosoN is my top scumread" and that's it. This is shit, we are in day three and we were better off in day one with the cases being made. Also because I took the time to make the BM case and few people have even responded. Look at my answer to imallinson's case on me to confirm this - I'm not defensive. I am, however, trying to make people stop this hardcore sheeping. Like I said, this is the best environment scum can thrive in, because they don't need to bother themselves making real scumreads and thus not needing to risk making mistakes. As for this, I think we can all agree (even those guilty of it, including me today) that we really need to stop this. Regardless of how anybody's read on Z-Boson we do need to start actively and individually scumhunting for the reasons he stated. | ||
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