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Newbie Mini XV - Page 28

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
June 07 2012 18:43 GMT
#541
@austin:

I agree with your suspicions on unforgiven, but his play is so ridiculously erratic that I have no clue about his alignment. The obvious thing going for him is the d1 lynch on suki and I would be really surprised if scum actually decided to bus/sacrifice their roleblocker without being sure that we do not have blue roles... That's pretty much the only thing that stops me from voting him off.
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
June 07 2012 18:49 GMT
#542
My case on Xatalos in short:

-Not much content despite being pretty active in thread
-Wants to look contributing (lists) but actually does not much.
-Easily swayed from his own opinion
-Soft-defense of suki during the d1-lynch and trying to deflect attention onto unforgiven
-Always going with the flow of the thread, never going against it.
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
austinmcc
Profile Joined October 2010
United States6737 Posts
June 07 2012 18:50 GMT
#543
The roleblocker thing is a good point, and it's one I hadn't considered. That does seem out of place.

I get that his play is erratic, but here's what keeps tripping me up. It's all over the place except helpful. Think...ohh...Anacletus? From our other newbie game. Really erratic posting. Yet it was a mix of scummy stuff and townie stuff constantly. Making ridiculous cases on people, being defensive, getting pissed off at being ignored, etc. (I know you got shot early but I think you read that one out iirc from obsQT).

I don't get that from Unforgiven. I don't ever see him flailing around on the townie side of things after that suki case which didn't even seem like a case.

Gotta think on the roleblocker bit, and WILL be reading over you and Xatalos, and some other stuff.

Fe fi fo fum.
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
June 07 2012 18:53 GMT
#544
uuh do not wake nightmares from Anacletus >_>

You are right on the lack of helpful townie seeming stuff. Especially paired up with the lack of activity/interest he shows, it does warrant suspicion. But for now I would much rather go after Xatalos.
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Unforgiven_ve
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Venezuela1232 Posts
June 07 2012 18:58 GMT
#545
Lol austin, you are surpasing yourself at making lame and mistaken acussations.
Vote for heist, then vote for Xatalos and we will win. trust me.

The reason my lasts post are so short is because im posting
from my phone.
:)
Unforgiven_ve
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Venezuela1232 Posts
June 07 2012 19:00 GMT
#546
Shiaopi, change your vote for heist too plz.
:)
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
June 07 2012 19:00 GMT
#547
Congratz Unforgiven on keeping up your pattern...at least someone else is still online and kind of caring about this game
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Unforgiven_ve
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Venezuela1232 Posts
June 07 2012 19:01 GMT
#548
Also, the last game we played was simple mayority right? if someone got a higher number of
votes he would get lynchedm this system is different, you need half+1
:)
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
June 07 2012 19:01 GMT
#549
On June 08 2012 04:00 Unforgiven_ve wrote:
Shiaopi, change your vote for heist too plz.


Give me good reasons to do this
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Unforgiven_ve
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Venezuela1232 Posts
June 07 2012 19:15 GMT
#550
Read my filter and see my post accusing him, his first post
he wanted to guide me and kindly told me how the town need it to know my reads
When me and soltice got it right, he went apeshit agressive (as far as i remember).

Unlike the super-detectives we have in here (lolz metagame) i want you to read for yourself
his filter and his behavior in all the game. Also, Xatalos wants to gain town credit voting for heist,
maybe heist doesnt have time to play and he would gladly sacrifice for the team, seeing the game is ending
Xatalos wants to assure N2-N3 kill, D3-D4 misslynch
:)
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
June 07 2012 19:17 GMT
#551
his first post seemed totally normal and as far as I know he did not went apeshit aggressive...

Seriously why don't you just put some effort behind it instead of just saying "I'm right, yay me!"
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Unforgiven_ve
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Venezuela1232 Posts
June 07 2012 19:20 GMT
#552
I'll do (try?) when i can...for the time on, i'm right yay me! lol
:)
austinmcc
Profile Joined October 2010
United States6737 Posts
June 07 2012 19:20 GMT
#553
On heist
I found his voting scummy. However, I found it odd because he swapped to Unforgiven and that seemed like a play to have a non-Suki candidate in the mix now that Ange was back and did not seem like a legitimate target. However, given that I now feel like I do about Unforgiven, and given that Ange found him scummy while pushing suki (I feel like as her replacement I should try and put myself in her shoes for D1), I'm willing to believe that town could find both suki and unforgiven scummy. Ange happened to find suki scummier at first, voted her, FoSed unforgiven. Heist happened to find Unforgiven scummier early, voted him, then later suki.

I don't find that bussing comment scummy, as I've said.

Therefore, I don't want to vote heist today (However, I'd like for him to, you know, contribute here). However, I sought some non-tunneling coaching, and after considering that, I need to consider a heist lynch. Can you guys give me like...your number 1 reason besides the voting pattern and the bussing comment that you find Heist scummy?

On golden/ShiaoPi
Starting with Xatalos's initial post - + Show Spoiler +
On June 05 2012 22:02 Xatalos wrote:
ShiaoPi

Nothing that would really make me think he's town (except his recent activity), but plenty to make me think he's Mafia:

- Vaguely defensive of suki (a confirmed Mafia) and also quite defensive of heist (another pretty likely Mafia at this point)
- Comfortable with voting Vivax for the whole Day 2... Then suddenly he's a neutral read just before deadline?? What the heck? How does self-voting make him look townish? Looks more like he was already planning for an escape route from the flip's fallout than actually reading Vivax as neutral all of a sudden.
- Suspecting Eishi_Ki with pretty flimsy reasoning (just suki saying he's town?)
- Suspecting me for having too little content, although if he had bothered to look at my previous newbie game (as vanilla townie), I had much less content compared to "filler" in that game - I think I've done a MUCH better job this time around on avoiding spam/filler, but it's just my nature, I like to write even if there's not too much to say

I'll be voting for heist or ShiaoPi on Day 3, unless something very drastic happens.

and sciberbia's last post + Show Spoiler +
On June 06 2012 06:59 sciberbia wrote:
I think it's likely I die tonight, so here are my (possible) last words

+ Show Spoiler +

I understand you weren't all convinced about heist based on my arguments yesterday, but hopefully seeing the flips of Vivax, superouman and (possibly) me, you'll now be willing to lynch him. I don't really have anything new to say about him; just reread my filter. No amount of defense will convince me he's not mafia.

Given that heist flips red, I think shiaopi is very likely the last mafia and I'd request that you lynch him. Here are some points against him:
- golden's behavior toward me in the beginning was suspicious. He said that he wasn't really expecting a bandwagon to form, but he seemed really ready & willing to cast a vote on me if my defense wasn't good.
- golden said he'd be willing to lynch 4 people, all of which I think are town
- golden's defense of suki was really scummy
- shiaopi is defensive of heist, who I'm pretty sure is mafia
- shiaopi's stance on vivax went from "maybe there is a slight chance of him being a bad townie" to "wtf no idea" pretty quickly

If heist/shiaopi are not both mafia, I'm not really sure who is. I'm leaning at least slightly town on eveybody else, but I'd probably go with either miltonkram or eishi_ki.




Golden's posts: Sorry Shiao, you're stuck with them. You/Golden are the same alignment, Ange/I am the same alignment. You got dealt the crappier hand there. Golden DID lightly defend suki early on. However, when I look at the timing, he did so before the convincing cases had been made. I'm going to give him a little credit for that, because he didn't defend suki after suki was really taking a pounding.

ShiaoPi's vote on Vivax: I did the same thing, but didn't publicize it. Heck, I did the same thing in my last newbie game every time I pushed someone that ended up town. Sinking feeling 5-10 minutes before lynch, but telling yourself there's no time to do anything, and if you were sure yesterday, and sure that morning, shouldn't you just listen to past self? At the very least, I don't get anything from this. YES, Shiao could be mafia trying to get cred. OR, Shiao is town and had doubts. Either is plausible.

Suspecting Eishi_Ki - Suki soft defended Eishi_Ki like crazy earlier. One of the more surprising things I found while rereading. Like...3 times or so? Frankly, Eishi_Ki hasn't done much. If his filter was full, Suki's posts wouldn't stand out like they do. With so little to work with on Eishi_Ki, I agree with Shiao that the Suki posts make him look bad. So, I'm not finding Shiao scummy off of that.

Suspecting Xatalos: Your filter is baaaaaaad on that count Xatalos. I haven't checked old game yet. But you're constantly moderating. Constantly asking people for thoughts, giving someone a gold star for a good post. It looked bad to me as well, before I really read through you and Shiao's stuff today. So again, I saw the same thing, not finding it scummy.

sciberbia's points were mostly the same - the suki defense, the vivax vote/doubts, the defense of heist. Not really finding ShiaoPi scummy right now.



Again, I wasted too much time this game day, so I'm going ahead and posting these two. Post on the case against xatalos coming soon.
Fe fi fo fum.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
June 07 2012 19:37 GMT
#554
Votecount so far:


heist ( 3 ): Xatalos, unforgiven_ve, Miltonkram
Xatalos ( 1 ): ShiaoPi,
unforgiven_ve ( 1 ): austinmcc,

It's Day3. With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch!
About 2.5 hours left to vote, voting is mandatory!
People who haven't voted yet (2):
Eishi_Ki, Heist



Deadline is 22:30 GMT (+00:00)

<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
austinmcc
Profile Joined October 2010
United States6737 Posts
June 07 2012 19:49 GMT
#555
Holy balls. We need 4 to lynch and we've got 2 inactive and 2 mafia.

Also, unforgiven, you are right and I am wrong. Our last newbie game was plurality. We were NOT extended majority and I'm imagining things.

Right now, and maybe it's a bad reason, but the voting itself makes me not like the heist vote. IF both mafia members have voted, that means (because i know I'm town, therefore 2 of the other 4 votes in the game are mafia, yada yada) that there is mafia on heist. If one or both mafia are heist/eishi, then that doesn't hold true.

With extended majority and two players not voting/posting yet, can we ask how the lynch/majority/modkills will work?
Fe fi fo fum.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
June 07 2012 19:54 GMT
#556
Right now I am hoping that both come back in time. Really can't say what I'm going to do in what case right now.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
austinmcc
Profile Joined October 2010
United States6737 Posts
June 07 2012 20:01 GMT
#557
Okay. Doesn't seem like a fun situation to host in. But if you could come up with anything, whatever you think is the best way to handle this, it would be most appreciated and helpful.
Out of the Xatalos/Shiao cases, I like the case on Xatalos better. Sorry man, you don't look good.

Leaving work now. Right now I am very, very worried about heist and eishi_ki. I don't like early suki/eishi_ki bits. Others think heist is scummy. The door is so wide open for mafia to come in at the last moment and push a townie over the edge, even if just one lurker is mafia. There are so many situations where IF we mislynch, we lose, because 1-2 players could get modkilled.

In light of that, right now I am leaning towards no-lynching. Yes, it's normally suboptimal, but if: (1) one/neither of our no-shows is mafia, (2) anyone other than a mafia member has 2 votes, then (3) it could be game over. Mafia both drop the hammer on the 2-vote player, he has 4, lynched. One or both no-shows get modkilled, maybe. Then the NK. Poof. 2/2 or 1/2, we lose.

If we no lynch and both lurkers are townies, we could still lose. Both could be modkilled, then NK, now it's 2/2, This is awful.
Fe fi fo fum.
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
June 07 2012 20:04 GMT
#558
The way the votes are right now, we will have a no-lynch either way...
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Unforgiven_ve
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Venezuela1232 Posts
June 07 2012 20:16 GMT
#559
my god, we need to lynch heist!
that way we get information, and i dont think mod will kill 2 players at once, we have 1 game day left (2 tops)...he should le them live and see if they comeback
:)
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
June 07 2012 20:16 GMT
#560
Seriously, this is why I hate lurkers/inactives -.- They just ruin the game for everyone. Why even join if you can't afford the time to post once every 3 days? With so many lurkers, there's simply no way to know who is actively lurking and who is simply being inactive.

I'm still for lynching heist, because he might be just waiting for his time to vote at the last minute. Then again, if he'll just get modkilled, it wouldn't make a difference either way.

If we assume that Eishi_Ki is town and getting modkilled (so inactive, I don't have my hopes up for him appearing...):

A) heist is Mafia and waiting to vote just before the deadline: in this case we should definitely lynch him
B) heist is town/Mafia and simply not online: in this case it doesn't matter either way, he'll just get modkilled

Looking at these two options, I see absolutely no harm in lynching heist. He already has 3 votes, and we agreed to lynch every day at the start. austinmcc, your vote for Unforgiven_ve is basically a vote for no-lynch at this point. So why not vote for heist in case situation A happened to be true? A no-lynch would lead to the same result as voting for heist in situation B, but a no-lynch would lead to Mafia victory in case A.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
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