EPTTL Mafia 'Area' LIII
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Mattchew
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Mattchew
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![[image loading]](http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs1/1779840_o.gif) | ||
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Mattchew
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On April 21 2012 09:07 VisceraEyes wrote: ##Vote: Mattchew Scum were going to win sir. WE WERE GOING TO WIN!!! yeah, you were. sorry im MKP and you Parting. | ||
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a. he is scum in like 99% of his recent games b. he gets away with everything "because he's Bill Murray" | ||
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On April 21 2012 09:17 johnnywup wrote: No, because he's Bill Murray. Seriously though, Policy Lynches should be a last resort. This is stated at the beginning of every game by one player or another, I don't get how people still want policy lynches. why so serious, why not let the idea breathe? maybe even have it force BM to post, maybe let some scummy mofo's bandwagon it? Are you going to shoot down anyone pressure voting too cause thats gonna make you cover up for a lot of peoples reactions | ||
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On April 21 2012 10:49 PaqMan wrote: I like Gonzaw's idea of the vig's claiming. Only problem with that is that Scum will have a list of vig's and won't have to do any sniping.. So now that I think about it, I don't really like that idea at all lol. Town can't keep assuming things this game. It'll make an ass out of u and me. We don't know how many of what roles there are and continuous speculation isn't going to help at all. This reads to me as "i don't want to take a side, i want to look like i like both sides to the argument" also, lets change subject (but wait, read on) On April 21 2012 11:43 PaqMan wrote: Woops, I'm sorry! Scarface is on tv and I'm trying to multitask. It isn't working out obviously, so I'll be back in about three hours. apology post and leave to get away from being wrong. On April 21 2012 11:49 PaqMan wrote: I'm not convinced that he made a scum slip. When he said "our" he could have been referring to whoever agreed with his points. I want to see what Gonzaw has to say about your accusation. Interestingly filmsy opinion again, to me this just feels like he has more information than I do On April 21 2012 12:01 PaqMan wrote: But I do agree with you VE. Giving scum any more info puts them in an even greater advantage over us. A mass vig claim would be the same as handing them a hit list. some of gonzaw's points however are pretty valid (no late-game chaos with vig claiming before lynch, etc etc). Either way, I can't see a vig following either one of y'alls policies. He claims, town lynches him and nothing is gained. He claims, chance of mafia taking him out or keeps him alive, either way there's chaos. I suggest that our vigilante (if we have one) doesn't claim at all. If he's about to be lynched then he needs to defend himself as a normal townie because claiming vig is going to create a shitstorm for us, which gives scum the upper hand. If he's going to use his kp one someone, he doesn't need to claim before or after the kill. It's going to create too much confusion and WIFOM and finger-pointing and shit. So I think that vigilantes should not make any claims this game. I know how much we love the 3rd and 4th person to jump on an opinion and now that he knows people will agree with him, he can be firm in his assertion | ||
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 and johnny care to elaborate on what you agree or disagree with about paq, and maybe shed some new light to me. bedtime... i'll be up in like 9 hours back at it again so you euros can play with me too | ||
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also gonzaw this is noted We were discussing Paqman's behaviour, and Matt's suspicious behaviour too (for instance). Why is paqman's only behaviour and mine suspicious? Do you find me to actually be more suspicious than paqman? layabout what exactly about the marvel case do you like? also; On April 21 2012 23:32 layabout wrote: The Paqman case is forced as all hells. + Show Spoiler + I know how much we love the 3rd and 4th person to jump on an opinion and now that he knows people will agree with him, he can be firm in his assertion Because people are giving opinions there will inevitably be people who give opinions that other already have. Paqman was the 2nd to say that vigilantes should not claim + Show Spoiler + (after VE, johnny also seems to support the idea but didn't take this stance Sentinel doesn't count because he didn't read the OP and his opinion cannot have had much grounding). I was saying that he did this after he had tried to post a middle of the road opinion. Then 2 or 3 others came in shooting down gonzaw's plan and he all of a sudden becomes much firmer in his stance (its like a bandwagon opinion instead of a bandwagon vote) + Show Spoiler + Interestingly filmsy opinion again, to me this just feels like he has more information than I do Paqman's comment is reasonable. VE's vote is dependent on a particular interpretation of the use of the word "our". Nobody should be convinced by it!Not being convinced is reasonable. Wanting to see how a player reacts to an accusation before judging them is reasonable I am wondering how mattchew ended up "feeling" like this comment in any way indicated that Paqman had more information than him. I got that feeling because its context can be read that he is basically telling VE that he is wrong, but doesn't want blantantly tell him that. Also, I never commented on the vig plans cause I don't care about blues, as I have said a lot in coaching, they are a nice to have not a need to have. What a town needs to have is scum hunting and clear townies, this will support our blues more than any amount of direction. I don't think Gonzaw's plan is scummy, however I don't agree with scum being forced into acting the way he thinks they will. His entire plan, I feel, revolves around vigs getting their shots right, which will be hard enough in this game. I am null on VE, I am hoping that whatever he is doing will become more evident as the day goes on, cause right now he just looks like he is tunneling a little. Layabout just mentioned all the lurkers, I have already said I'm down with a BM lynch (a little less now that Paqman said that too). I would also be willing to lynch anyone else on that lynch that doesn't come out to play | ||
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On April 22 2012 02:31 Mattchew wrote: I find it funny that paqman decides to attack me for lurking when I posted that I was going to sleep. Then votes me because I made a case against him? That makes sense, vote the guy thats actively looking for scum then accuse him of shit he isn't doing! also gonzaw this is noted Why is paqman's only behaviour and mine suspicious? Do you find me to actually be more suspicious than paqman? layabout what exactly about the marvel case do you like? also; Also, I never commented on the vig plans cause I don't care about blues, as I have said a lot in coaching, they are a nice to have not a need to have. What a town needs to have is scum hunting and clear townies, this will support our blues more than any amount of direction. I don't think Gonzaw's plan is scummy, however I don't agree with scum being forced into acting the way he thinks they will. His entire plan, I feel, revolves around vigs getting their shots right, which will be hard enough in this game. I am null on VE, I am hoping that whatever he is doing will become more evident as the day goes on, cause right now he just looks like he is tunneling a little. Layabout just mentioned all the lurkers, I have already said I'm down with a BM lynch (a little less now that Paqman said that too). I would also be willing to lynch anyone else on that lynch that doesn't come out to play | ||
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On April 22 2012 02:31 Mattchew wrote: I find it funny that paqman decides to attack me for lurking when I posted that I was going to sleep. Then votes me because I made a case against him? That makes sense, vote the guy thats actively looking for scum then accuse him of shit he isn't doing! also gonzaw this is noted Why is paqman's only behaviour and mine suspicious? Do you find me to actually be more suspicious than paqman? layabout what exactly about the marvel case do you like? also; Also, I never commented on the vig plans cause I don't care about blues, as I have said a lot in coaching, they are a nice to have not a need to have. What a town needs to have is scum hunting and clear townies, this will support our blues more than any amount of direction. I don't think Gonzaw's plan is scummy, however I don't agree with scum being forced into acting the way he thinks they will. His entire plan, I feel, revolves around vigs getting their shots right, which will be hard enough in this game. I am null on VE, I am hoping that whatever he is doing will become more evident as the day goes on, cause right now he just looks like he is tunneling a little. Layabout just mentioned all the lurkers, I have already said I'm down with a BM lynch (a little less now that Paqman said that too). I would also be willing to lynch anyone else on that lynch that doesn't come out to play | ||
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On April 22 2012 04:02 St.Daniel wrote: It's so fucking hard to keep up with everything when you are at a camp with a crappy internet connection XD I've read everything and I can't conclude anything with a confident, but I do have some ideas based on my observation so far. I'll post again as soon as I put some of pieces together. And there is no need to be hostile at each this early in game, because thst's EXACTLY what they (scum) want. As long as we keep expressing ideas without trying to bite each other's head off. Remember, keep it simple and clear. <3 TL. what the fuck? | ||
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On April 22 2012 05:59 gonzaw wrote: + Show Spoiler + About the plan: On April 22 2012 01:28 Mementoss wrote: Despite myself making a plan for vigs im starting to think its going to be impossible to get everyone to agree to one plan, and none of the plans work unless all vigs on on board. Vigs just keep your actions beneficial to the town and think about the consequences. I still really think vigs should play like vets and try to soak up night kills, confirming themselves not real GFs. Sadly I have to agree with this. (I was going to comment about layabout's points and other people, but it will only clogg up the thread, so I'll leave it be). If some people agree with my plan, while others don't, then it's possible the real vigs are the ones opposed to my plan, meaning even if a majority agrees with it (which is not the case) it won't do any good. You know, I'm pretty sure if we ever lynch a GF he WILL claim vigilante beforehand, and will make sure to do it at the last minute (so we can't switch the lynch to someone else, or if we do scum control who gets lynched). Let's see if we can agree on something at least:
At least this will buffer the chaos a GF lynch flip would make by making us redirect our focus somewhere else before that happens. To VE: On April 22 2012 00:46 VisceraEyes wrote: gonzaw's response to my vote was terribad. Everyone should be voting for him or explaining why he's town plz. For anyone who's all like "Hey I don't think scum would stick their neck out with some plan", I say only "OH REALLY FOOL? You don't think scum would be willing to trade a modicum of suspicion on them for the identities of all of our vigs?" He's pushing a scum agenda in trying to fish for claims, and I for one will NOT ALLOW IT! You keep ignoring my case, and you don't really state why my plan has a scum agenda behind it. Remember the vigs hurt town this game, outing them before they hurt town is the opposite of a "scum agenda" (PRE EDIT: Now that Mementos (I think) pointed it out, I realise that if X vigs claim, scum will know how many trackers/JKs are around, and if scum fake-claim vig then we won't know how many other blues are around yet scum will. I didn't really think of this, and even though it's not that big of a deal in comparison to the other benefits from my plan, it's a significant con) I'm scumhunting as well, I'm not ROL on Purgatory Mafia that just discussed his "bad" plan and never did shit. I'm trying to contribute to the game too. Are you saying I'm scum and I'm faking to scumhunt as well? And again, you IGNORE everything else going on in the thread. You ignore the Paqman dilemma. You ignore the Mattchew one. You ignore the marvellosity one as well You know, kind of how you acted in LI, not caring about the game. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt because you are acting quite aggressively, not like your meta from that game, but if you want to convince me you are town you have to care about the game. To Mattchew: You ignored all that was happening in the thread to make a half-assed FoS on Paqman It reminded me of how Toad played on LI (not caring shit about what happened in the thread and FoSing someone completely different to disrupt town). So yeah, I found that suspicious, even more so than Paqman at that point (I think he's most likely town at this point). + Show Spoiler + I have to agree with you on something though: About Daniel: On April 22 2012 04:02 St.Daniel wrote: It's so fucking hard to keep up with everything when you are at a camp with a crappy internet connection XD I've read everything and I can't conclude anything with a confident, but I do have some ideas based on my observation so far. I'll post again as soon as I put some of pieces together. And there is no need to be hostile at each this early in game, because thst's EXACTLY what they (scum) want. As long as we keep expressing ideas without trying to bite each other's head off. Remember, keep it simple and clear. <3 TL. I don't really like this post either. Too "neutral" and kind of apologetic, without contributing at all. For instance the bolded part is all fluff and irrelevant (specially since nobody was that "hostile" to each other). I'll wait till you "post again soon and put some pieces together"; hopefully it's very soon To Risen On April 22 2012 03:04 Risen wrote: I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me. ##vote layabout I'm done for now. I'll change my vote if someone does something scummy but I don't see anything and I think someone trying to push a wagon at this point is our best bet. I'll vote for the hydra too. Okay, so you don't find "anyone" scummy by now? So, tell me this then: What do you find not scummy about VE? What do you find not scummy about Paqman? What do you find not scummy about Mattchew? What do you find not scummy about marv? If you don't think someone is scummy, while other people in the thread do, then you ought to post your reasoning and thoughts about said player and why you don't think he's scummy, because that player is a major point of discussion in the thread and it's your duty as town (if you are) to contribute to the thread regarding the major points of discussion. Again, not caring about the game, or just saying "Meh, I don't think all the people being discussed are scummy, here I'll vote a completely irrelevant dude and FoS him and put all my attention to him" is exactly what Toad did in LI, and I find that sort of behaviour very suspicious. Also, what do you mean by the bolded bit? And why would you vote the hydra? You think he's scum? Why? @Jitsu: Hey Jitsu-part-of-the-hydra, would you mind posting your thoughts on the game so far? @sloosh: You are also making a whole lotta effort in ignoring everything that's happening in the thread. Care to contribute something else? About Ottoxlul: I didn't find his posting suspicious, at least when this thread was at the "plans" stage. I'd want him to take stances on these past few issues. About Paqman, marv, Matt, Risen, etc. About marv: I don't like his somewhat lack of effort in the beginning of this day, yet I don't find him that suspicious as some people have said. He's got quite a few votes very fast too, which always makes me nervous about the legitimacy of wagons. However, I don't really see him as town, and I could see him being scum, so he wouldn't be a bad lynch candidate. As I said before in the thread I don't like to discuss or direct blues. Why would i partake in a conversation that I don't care at all about? Instead I am actively trying to find scum, not yelling at everyone that disagrees with me and calling them scummy like you, VE, Risen, and Paqman. I care what is happening in the thread, just not for the actual vig conversation. I am a suspicious of VE because he seems to be convinced by very little that you are scum. I am still suspicious of Paqman because he has seemed to tunnel me because he was pressured. I am suspicous of St Daniel because that first post was fucking terrible. I'm less suspicous of marv but I do like the players pushing him (laya and blazing) as they seem townie to me. I am now going out to dinner a movie with the girlfriend... I might be back on in like 6 - 7 hours if she falls asleep before me. | ||
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Mattchew
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Paqman your either scum or stupid | ||
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There is a large correalation between calling bh annoying and being town... Also, aside from tunneling me (I believe mostly cause I called him out) he hasn't been too scummy since my case on him. Paq just cause i don't care for gonzaws plan doesn't mean i think he's scum.. I don't know why you insist I connect the two... Can we please get more opinions on st Daniel kthx | ||
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do you actually think before you post? You have tried to call me out for not taking a stance, yet in this game I immediately took a stance on something I cared about, finding scum. On April 22 2012 07:33 PaqMan wrote: Then what do you agree on? You're doing exactly what you accused me of, the "middle of the road opinion". This is where I read you saying that I couldn't disagree with gonzaws plan and not call him scummy. Its really simple, I don't care about his plan, I care about his alignment. and just because you gave the excuse of me being scummy (with literally no support) doesn't mean I don't think you are tunneling me because I made a case on you. It happens to me like every fucking game that im town and its always jubjubs (most of the time scum jubjubs). Stop being annoying and help us (including you! cause I honestly think you are annoyed with BH which IMO is a townie trait) find actual scum, like St. Daniel | ||
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Gonzaw you've given a list of like 5 to lynch today, 2 of which I agree with VE and St Daniel, 1 of which I haven't read enough into (sent, I'm still on my phone and he's been posting a lot) and 2 which I dont agree with (myself, duh, and risen, cause of meta). You asked people to look into paqman's case on me which revolves around me not talking about your plan in the thread and then he calls me actively lurking less than like 24 hours into the game. do you actualy believe this crap? | ||
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I refused to discuss the vig claims because I DONT CARE, i'll let people read me on other things like my scum reads and my other discussions. I don't care if vigs claim or not, I care about lynching scum, if thats anti town in your mind, fine. I "avoided" the discussion to push my scum read and give an opinion on someone - remind me how thats anti-town? You keep cutting my quotes out of context, like my do believe this crap, was based on me dispelling your obviously bad "case" in the same paragraph | ||
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If you stop being stupid you will do yourself and town a favor. since when do cases have to be 3 pages long. I have said why I think those players are scummy and who I would be ok lynching day 1... STOP BM ninja voted VE Fuck that ##vote Bill Murray | ||
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instead, i just recommend you switch to BM | ||
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Its VE becoming more evident, proving my I am null on VE, I am hoping that whatever he is doing will become more evident as the day goes on, cause right now he just looks like he is tunneling a little. statement correct | ||
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On April 22 2012 13:52 VisceraEyes wrote: Do we lynch BM or Mattchew? Do we lynch scum or town? | ||
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On April 22 2012 13:56 VisceraEyes wrote: I gave reasoning for my vote, and I'm sorry you disagree with my reasoning. Surely he'll prove himself one way or the other. BM however, is lurking and ninja-voted me for the crime of disagreeing with a mass-claim plain. He's attempting to ride town sentiment and I think if we lynch him we'll hit scum. who are you talking to | ||
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I never contradicted anything... why do I let people get under my skin every game. your my new Mrzentor | ||
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On April 22 2012 14:13 PaqMan wrote: what the hell are you talking about. You went from having a null claim on VE, to scummy. And somehow you were right? My vote's going back to Mattchew. I'm sure once the rest of town wakes up most will vote for BM but I am absolutely confident that Mattchew is scum. i am talking about how i said that I was wary of VE but I was not convinced he was scum (AKA NULL). As time went on he slide further and further towards scum to me. How is this that hard to understand? | ||
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time goes on with no explanation i get asked my opinion on him and call him scummy cause of this time that has past VE JK claims ???? Connect 1 and 4 for correct answer | ||
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vote BM | ||
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If you want to vote for VE because he is not playing Jailkeeper the way you would, you are a jubjub. If you can think of a good reason that a scum VE would logically claim there, or at all on day 1, please present that. | ||
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ok. the other thread, claimed it. This one confirmed it | ||
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On April 21 2012 09:15 Mattchew wrote: So anyway should we policy lynch Bill Murray because b. he gets away with everything "because he's Bill Murray" please don't let him get away with a ninja vote and literally no additions to the thread except 1 liners. He doesn't even try his imma be the best townie ever routine | ||
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My scum picks so far are BM, Risen, Daniel and I would like to lynch/vig them in that order | ||
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On April 23 2012 04:05 BlazingJitsu wrote: Yes. I am entirely objective. If you have an objection to one of the statements in my case, make it. Pussyfooting around the issue isn't a legitimate objection, it is called "soft defending" and is unhelpful to both myself and Marv. -Blazinghand I know what soft defending is. I have never had a scum read on marv and I don't think his posts have been useless. This is why I think you are seeing his posts through clouded lenses. I think he has done a pretty decent job of showing his thought process and seems relatively open to posting (much more so of recent than in the beginning). I don't see him as having something to hide and I see a lot better candidates for todays lynch. I see you trying too hard and tunneling someone and seeing everything they do as scummy regardless of what it is. This makes you a bad townie imo | ||
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On April 23 2012 06:32 marvellosity wrote: Sadly this sounds like Risen's town meta. "Anyone who disagrees with me is scum". It's a recurring theme, he did it in LI too. exactly why we should vote for BM | ||
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On April 23 2012 07:36 johnnywup wrote: why are you defending VE so much, telling people to get off his ass? Personally I think he's town because in LI he was scum and he worked his ass off to clear his name for like 2 days straight. This is the polar opposite. And exactly: BM Has done NOTHING. Will lynching him give us any information if he's town OR scum? No. He'll be dead and we'll be back at square one. I'm not really lurking. Everyones shouting at everyone and I don't want to add to the shouting. I'd lynch Risen or BM if it came down to it. lynching scum is always good i dont care about information. i just wanna lynch 4 scum (or 3 if someone wants to shoot one) | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:18 Mementoss wrote: It's not but does disagreeing to directing blues, a day 1 blue claim, and ragequitting, give you enough confidence that he is scum, to go about lynching our possible JK, when there are other scummy suspects? Also BJ, I don't think the marv is gunna happen at this point TBH. The fact that he took his vote off VE, his main competition for getting lynched makes me think he is indeed looking out for the towns interests. (unless you think VE and marv is scum which I doubt) SO LETS VOTE BM | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:27 johnnywup wrote: Yeah I'll just go ahead and vote ##vote BillMurray noted | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:34 Risen wrote: I am master and commander of the jub jubs. Onto BM we go! Choo choo! Yo BM I'll get off you if you make a post explaining yourself. Oh wait, you signed up for mafia and decided not to play... I wish VE hadn't claimed. none of this would have happened. Then again, ve was being stupid and it's probably correct that the only thing that can save him is his claim. yeah you've totally lead this charge | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:35 Mementoss wrote: Mattchew what are your thoughts other than BM: aka, VE Risen Marv. I believe VE Risen is aggressive and thats his town meta Marv is being tunneled and yelled at by BJ a lot. I think he's been pretty town since his not great start so I wouldn't want to lynch him. I would like to lynch or have vigs shoot BM and St. Daniel | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:36 MidnightGladius wrote: johnny stills seems like scum to me, and his above voteswitch to BM doesn't help in the slightest I agree with this... but not your stance on BM. BM's scum meta is strictly this and he doesnt care about the game. He ninja voted which is him basically claiming scum | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:41 marvellosity wrote: Mattchew, you too - what do we do about an inactive VE tomorrow? If's and buts candys and nuts.. we will judge the situation as it comes. I would really hope that if VE was not lynched he would start participating. I'll put it this way, if you re-read VE's argument with Gonzaw thinking he is the JK, it makes perfect sense. He didn't lie and he gave his opinion straight. Also, scum VE would probably be way more defensive | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:46 marvellosity wrote: This is frustrating to me. So we're going to lynch BM just because he's a lurker, and we're gonna save a rage-quitting VE just because he claimed blue? Does town genuinely believes this to be the best play? If you don't believe VE's claim (idk why you wouldn't given the timing) then vote for him because that means you think he is scum. I believe his claim and his ragequit. | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:48 Zephirdd wrote: Now for instance, were VE really JK, this would make marvellosity look incredibly and extremely bad. Why? because fuck yes. Waiwaiwiaitiaw WAIT. How the fuck is his timing for his claim okay? What was he achieving with his claim? The plan wasn't following through, and that's his reason for claiming. Enlighten me how did his claim make any sense. enlighten me how it makes ANY sense as scum. and it explains the suspicions held by others of his earlier posts | ||
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On April 23 2012 08:50 marvellosity wrote: As I don't really have time to trawl the thread and read the filters right now: could anybody quickly tell me whether at the time of VE's claim it looked like he was under serious pressure of a lynch? he was in the top 2 (might have been leading) and the bandwagon was getting stronger and stronger with him not posting | ||
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and there was less pressure than i thought on VE, making him even more townie in my eyes | ||
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On April 23 2012 09:16 Zephirdd wrote: Okay, whoever thinks what he did was reasonable should also rethink a little. I"m not taking blame for that either; it was VE's own play that did that. His claim made no sense and he did us the favor of not posting the freaking case against him. I'm all into a marv. lynch for the next day given how bad he wanted VE dead. I mean seriously, his latest posts were like a dog drooling at a piece of meat. I can see you never re-read VE's filter in this post lol you either super bad town or super bad scum | ||
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On April 23 2012 09:27 PaqMan wrote: + Show Spoiler + On April 22 2012 22:06 VisceraEyes wrote: My vote on BM is not random. It's based on the fact that he was semi-active leading up to the game started and he's made 3 in-game posts, all of which are devoid of content and completely neutral...yet he jumps on a VE vote based on nothing but "he doesn't like gonzaw's plan!" My claim isn't "an appalling move" or "a bad move"...it's not a move at all. It's a claim, because it explains my reasoning for gonzaw's mass-claim idea, and because I don't give a shit about my role. Roles aren't going to find scum, scumhunting and logic are going to find scum. I think Bill Murray is scum, I don't think he's a "random lurker" and I've made that abundantly clear. The scum are Bill Murray, gonzaw, MidnightGladius, layabout as far as I can see. I want to kill BM first. Viscera's last scumread^^ VE did screw himself on this. He wanted to get himself lynched. so how do you feel about these 4 BM gonzaw midnightglad and layabout? | ||
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shooting BM or st. daniel would be fantastic BM why do you join these games? | ||
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/kUoLq.jpg) | ||
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On April 24 2012 09:05 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Wait... how the hell do you brand Risen green because of "town meta"? I think his aggressive-defensive bipolarity kinda ruined that aspect. If anything makes him green is that he backed VE till the end. i should have said that i only colored it for you all so that was done in haste. he is a very very light green as you can see because of meta. My read on him will evolve deeper as the game continues. also some people aren't colored exactly as i would like them to be but w.e idc | ||
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On April 24 2012 09:32 layabout wrote: lynch BM fixed that for you | ||
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On April 24 2012 10:21 Zephirdd wrote: Let me just place a palm in my face in the hopes that you realize how much of a bad logic that was. the more you tell me what to think about your vote and how you did nothing wrong (with and even without pressure about it) the scummier you look. | ||
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On April 24 2012 10:27 gonzaw wrote: Whatever, Sentinel should be lynched first though. If Zephirdd were to be town (he's my weakest scum read from the Daniel/Sentinel/Zephirdd combo), then scum will have a field day lynching him tomorrow. So no, Sentinel goes down tomorrow, so people go back and reread my case. Just in case you guys missed them, these are all my posts from tonight (the important ones): The Risen conundrum: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=44#876 Case against Sentinel: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=47#925 Thoughts on other players: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=47#935 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=47#937 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=47#940 So we don't punish ninja voters? fuck this shit. lynch fucking BM | ||
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##vote Bill Murray... and you should too | ||
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On April 24 2012 11:01 johnnywup wrote: There hasn't been a day post yet ;_; lol i know | ||
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On April 24 2012 12:26 gonzaw wrote: Ehmm, I don't want anybody to be a dbag to anybody, I just want people to post thoughts and shit before they are (potentially) killed. But okay, if it goes against the spirit of the game then I guess it's fine (but to be honest it gets kind of boring >_> ). Will Day 2 end 48 hours from the Day post, or 48 hours from when the Day post should have been posted? (as in, will it end 44 hours from now or more than 48?) i was referring to all the swearing and name calling (mostly in day 1) | ||
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and you should too | ||
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Scum lynch me... And he hasn't said anything of value if you think he has you are reading something I'm not | ||
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I posted my reads on Everyone... Zeph has gotten worse since the flip big time. But ottox is trying to play the "I'm a newb and can't make a case" card... This screams scum to me louder than zeph trying to tell us what to think about his ve vote and trying to deflect the backlash of ve flipping blue. Sent is non existent but not as scummy as bm or Ottox or zeph | ||
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Scum-reads - Zeph, Ottox (will probably post more about this later today or tomorrow) Also, Risen has not improved in a way that allows me to use meta anymore to defend him. He did adamantly try and protect he best townie (and a blue) from lynch however. I can't see a reason for scum doing this, but then again that might be EXACTLY why he did it. idk, but he is probably the scummiest after the other 6. | ||
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On April 25 2012 00:42 Ottoxlol wrote: How's the first post any better then the second? Its not, I am not basing my read on you on your reads or 1 post in particular, I am basing it off of how you have posted. | ||
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I am trying to decipher if he is ignorant (town) or arrogant (scum) with his read on VE. He originally posted this on VE's stance on Gonzaw's plan First: Almost every point he makes is only working if JK's cooperate, I don't see how did you miss that (point 6). He clearly states that JKs should work with the claims and then you try to confute his plan with this. Second: VE you havent responded to why did you tried to argue the plan away with the JK stuff Third: I still find it amazing that VE missed the point about JKs and still not responding directly why wouldn't the JKs not follow the plan. Then he posted this as his case On April 22 2012 06:46 Ottoxlol wrote: Yeah sure. VE + Show Spoiler + marvellosity said: One thing I didn't like about the whole gonzaw - VE exchange was VE's pretty bad breakdown of gonzaw's plan. It seemed to amount to this - if JK doesn't agree with the plan, then the plan is bad. But... the whole idea of the plan was that everyone agreed to it, so the JK was obviously on board, it was a terrible criticism. Looking further into VE's filter, I didn't see any further substantial objection, and he went forward to accusing gonzaw for his 'scumslip', which was at best minor, and can generally be read as unimportant. I asked him 3 times about this and no response. + Show Spoiler + ANYONE PUSHING A MASS-VIG-CLAIM IS DOING SO ALONGSIDE CLAIMED SCUM After failing to comprehend the plan, he tried this shouting-tunneling on gonzaw, i found it rather amusing. His posts are also very non-constructive. + Show Spoiler + Anyway, my vote on gonzaw stands - especially now that he thinks I'm scum because I disagree with a mass-claim plan. Unbelievable. He's playing 1v1 with gonzaw, doesnt care about anyone else. The funny thing is, once VE claimed JK, it should have been like an epiphany to ottox, because his case hinged on VE not understanding that the JK's will play ball, but VE was the JK. Instead he continues to push him using this logic On April 22 2012 15:10 Ottoxlol wrote: VE, why did u claim? + Show Spoiler + I was going to die N1 anyway - this way we don't waste today wondering if I'm town or not. If you are indeed town and JK, you shouldn't have claimed. This is super bad logic IMO but a TON of people made this mistake of saying "he didn't play a role like I would, he must be scum" so this doesn't really have an alignment On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote: He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6. Is he a good player? He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK. If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes. This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum. ##Vote: VisceraEyes This is a forced contradiction IMO. and he speculates on scum kills. he also does the previous "not playing role like i thought he would, he must be scum" again. This equals newb scum to me. His recent posting hasn't really said anything so its pointless to look into other then from a multi-post view that he is posting to appear active but not really saying anything | ||
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On April 25 2012 03:14 Mementoss wrote: Tryimg-Not to tunnel who we lynch early in the day. All options/cases should be expressed fully/responded to (or to note, a lack of response) before ultimately decided the lynch target. I personally am a fan of people putting there reads out first half of the day along with votes, so we can see a hard solid stance of where everyone stands/have lots of time to discuss and consolidate the best option for killing a scum looking ma facka. We should still be lynching BM | ||
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On April 24 2012 21:35 Mattchew wrote: He ninja voted the most well known scum hunter in the game... To me that's like saying hi I'm Scum lynch me... And he hasn't said anything of value if you think he has you are reading something I'm not | ||
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On April 25 2012 05:28 Ottoxlol wrote: Sorry ghost I didn't get it, who do you want to get lynched today and tomorrow? why are you worried its you? | ||
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On April 25 2012 05:21 MidnightGladius wrote: Well, that's that. Nice knowing you, scum. ##Unvote: johnnywup ##Vote: ghost_403 literally nothing scummy about that considering the context of the game. Why do you think its scummy? | ||
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On April 25 2012 05:38 MidnightGladius wrote: And I think that that's presumptuous and downright misleading, considering that you're discounting an entire Day/Night's worth of information. The only reason you would want to start tomorrow's lynch train today would be to try and minimize discussion tomorrow, which is incredibly scummy, considering that with BJ's modkill, we could be at LYLO very quickly. so you can predict the future? You know that ghost is unwilling to discuss this tonight and tomorrow and will not re-evaluate? i said we should lynch BM today and Ottox/zeph tomorrow. am i killing discussion? + Show Spoiler [ Answer] + no, I am trying to lynch scum ps if you wanna call this buddying or soft/hard defense, idc DO IT | ||
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Mementoss MidnightGladius Ghost_403 Marvellosity johnnywup Mattchew layabout [UoN]Sentinel PaqMan Zephirdd That leaves these players with no reads (including you ottox) Do you see the difference between you and them? Janaan - hasn't been posting Risen - hasn't been posting Broodkingexe - hasn't been posting St.Daniel - hasn't been posting Ottoxlol - has been posting actively Bill Murray - lurker scum | ||
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On April 25 2012 06:20 Ottoxlol wrote: I am posting actively because every hour someone comes and asks the same questions since BJ's case. Should I retreat till I can post a case? Defending myself is the only useful thing I can do atm (something VE did not do). Do you actually think self defense does anything pro-town? You have a completely skewed view of yourself, your posts, and your actions as scum or town. | ||
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On April 25 2012 06:28 Ottoxlol wrote: Of course defending myself is pro-town, what is this question i don't even. The second part is very nice of your post. Maybe I am the helicopter! Maybe, if instead of defending yourself, you just scum hunt and let your play in the game do the defending for you? Instead you ignore the message of my post and just critique it like you have any idea what you are talking about. You have firmly upgraded yourself from maybe ignorant to just arrogant, thus making you scum. | ||
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On April 25 2012 06:33 Ottoxlol wrote: So you would rather have me not posting then try to prevent a misslynch? you have 2 votes on you with over 24 hours before the lynch and you think your preventing a mislynch? This is a new height of paranoia | ||
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On April 25 2012 06:38 Ottoxlol wrote: I tried I came up with nothing. I posted it 10 times at least. I wouldn't get on any case just for the sake of having a case. so you could, you know, read others cases and posts your thoughts about them (the ones that don't pertain to you) instead of pretending they don't exist. | ||
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On April 25 2012 06:39 marvellosity wrote: the soft defences were on BM/Sentinel I meant badly as in reasoning/logic. On zephirdd, picking up on his pre-day 1 lynch behaviour, which as i made clear in my post was irrelevant. Followed by quoting half of my subsequent case where i was simply laying things out. the problem I have is i don't disagree with what layabout wrote about BM/Sentinel. I don't know about zeph cause thats more of a you and him issue, but his other 2 posts seem to not be soft defenses as much as his reason for disagreeing. I don't find them scummy | ||
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On April 25 2012 06:40 layabout wrote: If that is the evolution of your case, then i think that your case is about to become a victim of natural selection + Show Spoiler + Anyone? In all seriousness The ninja vote in that context is not alignment indicative. Letting VE get lynch is something that only the people on BM did anything to stop. Terrible posting is a vague criticism and depending on the critic could be misapplied or applied to nearly anyone in the game. As far as i am aware he didn't yell at others for lynching VE, the closest post is here: He says he put the vote on VE (which was before the claim) He says he was busy and was unable to come back and change his vote. The questionable part (unless you think he is a liar) is why he would put his place holder vote on a player that he thinks should never be lynched day1 one. But when do we stop saying "oh its BM" and say "lynch that scum" | ||
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On April 25 2012 06:44 marvellosity wrote: Alright, I'm willing to be wrong on this one. I'm going to keep it in my mind though because it jumped out at me. At this point I think layabout has posted generally strongly, and he's not one of my scumreads. I just found what I posted to be odd. I have this problem as well where I can't tell the difference between soft defense and (idk the term lets call it) "thread logic protection" and i also cant tell the difference between buddying and townies banding together to push a lynch | ||
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On April 25 2012 08:53 PaqMan wrote: ninja'd. I didn't write that post in 4 minutes. Woah I actually got the quote button first try gosu touch screening... Yeah that was just super weird | ||
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On April 25 2012 18:47 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Here are the current standings: Bill Murray - 2 votes Mattchew [UoN]Sentinel Risen - 1 Vote Paqman johnnywup - 1 Vote Ottoxlol Zephirdd - 2 Vote johnnywup Janaan Ottoxlol - 4 Votes Mementoss Risen Bill Murray Zephirdd [UoN]Sentinel - 1 Vote ghost_403 Ottoxlol is currently to be lynched (and I'll switch back my vote to him if we can agree on it) We should consolidate to 2 lynch candidates. Personally I believe those 2 should be BM and BM, but out of respect to the rest of town, I might consider promoting Ottox and Zeph/Sent, consolidation. | ||
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On April 25 2012 08:53 Risen wrote: Done reading now. I looked at everyone and I think Ottoxlol has somehow managed to slip his way out of votes with the exception of mt. He'll be receiving my vote for now and this is why. + Show Spoiler + On April 21 2012 14:41 Ottoxlol wrote: I haven't played mafia on tl To the question you addressed to Paqman, I have some suspicions because some people doesnt like logic, but i think its too early to decide its their limitations or theyre scums. First thing that caught my eye. Tbh it's no biggie. It's a small thing, but I absolutely hate people who go "I'm noob". He's implying that he's played before, just somewhere else, so why does he need to say anything at all? On April 22 2012 06:52 Ottoxlol wrote: About marvel, i think he's not a scum just had no time to post, I would like to see him defend himself. He had 2 bad questions then he afked, I don't believe that's enough for my vote. He will post later, so I think it's useless to discuss. That's not enough for your vote but you put your vote on gonzaw b/c he FoSd you? On April 22 2012 07:38 Ottoxlol wrote: [UoN] Sentinel had two real posts, the first + Show Spoiler + Just wondering, what's the chance gonzaw's not mafia but just making an extremely retarded point? At any rate, what I don't get is number 6. If I was GF pretending to be vig, I'd shoot as many of the other vigs as I could. And if I was JK, I'd protect those vigs who I trust to be either town vigs or some other blues. He doesnt know that GFs cant shoot.. Nuf said, very bad post, calling out gonzaw but not making a case against his plan + Show Spoiler + I'm starting to think all of you people purposely post when I sleep Let's do it like this - everyone just do whatever the fuck they want as long as it's beneficial in some way to town. If it's not beneficial in some way to town, then lynch them. If there's one thing I know, it's that voting/lynching/etc. plans always benefit mafia because they can pull them to their advantage (and also you get lynched when your plan especially sucks). Keeping in mind with this train of thought, I will proceed to do whatever the fuck I want as long as it's beneficial in some way to town. When I get back, I'll read filters and try and put more on the table. I would wait till he put more on the table before we jump to conclusions, I disagree with that plans always benefiting mafia. He's talkin more in general terms, so maybe if he states his case more clearly we'll get more information. Sentinel, if you would be so kind to tell us your opinion about who's benefiting the town right now and who's not, i would like to read what do you think who should we lynch. The first half of his response can be taken two ways. One, he isn't catching onto the fact that sentinel means the godfathers having goons shoot them. The other, is that he knows this and is simply trying to make a post where he looks useful. The second half is fine, but he's asking for Sentinels thoughts without really doing much himself. On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote: He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6. Is he a good player? He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK. If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes. This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum. ##Vote: VisceraEyes This is where some serious bells and whistles should be going off for anyone who spots it. Can't find it? "So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum" What horrible justification for a vote. I'm aware he made a few posts asking VE questions, and finding him a little suspicious, but it feels like he's trying to shift the blame away from himself before VE even flips. Oh well, you guys say he's good and no one good would play like this so imma vote him. On April 22 2012 22:43 Ottoxlol wrote: Forget the plan, we already discussed it too much. I don't just disagree with your claim, I wrote it down why is it a bad play. You still did not respond Why does he edit his quote in his further responses to remove the part where he justifies his vote saying VE wouldn't play like this? Why not just quote it? It's small, but small things add up. I absolutely HATE people who edit the things they're quoting. On April 24 2012 15:52 Ottoxlol wrote: I havent finished reading everything, but so far I had an idea I thought I will write down the VE voters relationships maybe we can figure something out. Sentinel attacked BM Ottox did not attack anyone from this grp marv attacked Zeph BM defending Zeph and marv laya attacking marv, defending zeph Zeph attacking BM, and marv I think this will not make a strong read, but I try If Sentinel is scummy, we should investigate Zeph and vice versa If laya is scummy we should investigate Zeph and vice versa If marv is scummy we should investigate BM and vice versa . So my read is there are 0 or 2 scums in the VE voter group, maybe we can use this later What is this? It's the worst defined list I've ever seen. My mind is trying to wrap itself around the logic here but can't because it's intentionally confusing FOR NO REASON. On April 24 2012 16:57 Ottoxlol wrote: I don't get the sloosh kill btw, he contributed scarce, voted on VE. If not lynched he would have been pressured a lot today. Risen was the only one they both suspected to be scum, since sloosh kill has no other explanation then defending Risen I think he is town. Why are you buddying me here? By the logic in this post it sounds like you're accusing me of offing the people who were suspicious of me. Instead, you end with the conclusion that Risen is town. What? Also, the sloosh kill DOES have another explanation and it was already posted in the thread by someone else, blue-hunting. That's not a defense. That a useless post in which you bolded one part of his entire case. On April 24 2012 19:45 Ottoxlol wrote: You did not make a good enough case against Marv and you did not defend VE. So you were not that confident. Continuing his 1v1 fest after harping on the gonzaw/VE 1v1. Standard, but what sticks out here is that he's telling BJ he didn't make a strong enough case against marv and didn't defend VE. Yeah, his case on marv was too weak, but saying he didn't defend VE is a lie. On April 24 2012 20:37 Ottoxlol wrote: LOL I don't understand your case. You say the reason I'm scum because the way i voted VE. First I made a case about why VE is playing badly about the massvigclaim plan, then when he claimed, I stated my reasoning why he shouldn't have, and because you guys said he's the best player ever it's obvious that he is scum. I stated why a scum VE would claim and asked him why did he think the claim was good play. He did not respond, started accusing every second player and yelling, then rqd. I blame my vote on VE's bad play and lack of interest. You still did not respond why is this strong enough to switch from tunneling marv. Stating my posts are worthless, when you did not help town at all (not defending VE when you claim it was obv he's town, not stating a single good case that would rally ppl from VE), is the nail in your coffin. #vote BlazingJitsu Votes BJ after their OMGUS mud-flinging. The end result of this argument is BJ's modkill b/c he couldn't keep his cool when trying to argue with someone who was clearly being willfully absurd. On April 24 2012 21:48 Ottoxlol wrote: + Show Spoiler + On April 24 2012 21:29 Mementoss wrote: + Show Spoiler + On April 23 2012 10:38 Ottoxlol wrote: It seems like the ppl doesnt read the whole thread. My case against VE was simple. He told us never give up any information to the scum, then proceed to a bad claim that ensures his early death as a blue. This is bad play, hes the best player ever so he would not do that if he is indeed town JK. I tried to ask him about this decision tell me what did I miss or what was his idea what would happen, no answer. He ignored my 6 posts directed towards him, then after the votes started to pile up on him he tried defending himself, I told him what am i interested in, he talked about the massvigclaim after we already closed it and had nothing to do with his lynch. He did not read my posts, failed to comprehend them and when I asked him to explain his play he start writing in all caps, and ragequitting. Like a scum VE. The timing was strange too, the claim was around the time BM ninja voted. I did not vote on him because of his bad play, I voted him because he did not answer to my accusations or questions just gave up like a little girl. He says statements that have the potential to explain why it could have been scummy actions but he never explains why its scummy. Such as: "The timing was strange", wait what, how? Also, you did not vote on him based on bad play? Then why the fuck did you talk about it so much in all your posts directed to him? It musta had somewhat of a good influence on your voting towards him. My other posts explained why the timing was strange. If scum VE wants to claim he claims when he's pressured and an easy wagon appears. I said the bad play can mean 2 things, either he's town or a scum (wow that was surprising). If he would have answered why he thought it was good as townie or at least not give up I would have considered that he's not trying to escape the lynch with a fakeclaim, but he tried something that was not optimal. If you look at my filter you can see, I asked about him because before his claim I had only a little suspicion on him + Show Spoiler + On April 22 2012 23:27 Ottoxlol wrote: Scum VE failed at logic at the plan discussion phase, then proceeded to avoid answering to my questions 5 times in a row. Since he still did not explained why it is good for us that he claimed, I don't see how can this be anything but anti-town. Scum would claim this if they want to avoid a d1 lynch and a nice wagon appears that not too suspicious to jump on. Like the BM train. I wonder how many scums are on that. If i were a vig i would definitely shoot there. Well you dodged matthews question. So that makes you scum by your own logic? You say its anti-town, or bad town, you don't say its scummy, or why its scummy. Just its bad for town. You note that scum would do this to avoid a day 1 lynch, but wait, VE didn't do that, he had barely any pressure on him when he claimed, he had 3 votes to Marvs 6. So this is just wrong. Also you say that scum would want to jump on the BM wagon, well at the time BM wagon as you call it was barely even moving. I think it had 2-3 votes. What? I did not say why is it scummy? Reread. I was arguing if he's playing a bad townie play or a scummy scum play, this choice of words further proves my previous reply that I wanted him to respond, to explain his play.VE had 5 votes against marv's 6. This is also in one of my posts, this was why I argued he shouldnt have claimed because scum was very unlikely to night kill the second highest vote. He claimed right after BM voted for him -> ninja vote ez wagon. Basically your avoiding giving a detailed opinion on who is scum and why they are scum at all costs. You give handy suggestions like vigs shoot into BM voters. Or your little WIFOM earlier, but that is it. I don't, I had a case d1 about VE, I pushed it. It was a big fail. If I have a strong read I will post it. You really didn't have that much of a case on d1. What you did have was everyone else making points and you jumping onto those points pushing it as your case. You proceeded to hide behind your defense that VE was playing bad and therefor scum. On April 24 2012 22:21 Ottoxlol wrote: I believe that there is at least one scum on that list, I read them all. I couldn't come up with a case that's strong. Bm contributed zero, it is really hard to analyse someone with zero posts. Marvellosity been attacked d1 with a very weak case, I did not find anything suspicious there layabout he was on my d1 list because I felt his opinion switches were a bit suspicious but d2 he's been posting some very good things, i think he's town Sentinel wasn't too involved in the debates, the case against him is semi decent, but if we punish someone because he did not got involved it should be the one with the least contribution Zephridd's defense is that he was afk too. We have 3 players who did some afking Sent BM Zeph from the VE crowd, Sentinel and Zeph tried contributing so I would vote rather BM then those other 2. He's getting votes and called out why don't he post and he's still just lurking around. BM please get into the game and show us you are town, or else I feel you'll get lynched. WHAT?! You look at that entire list of people on VE and you can't come up with ANYONE? Earlier you had your Glenn Beck twisted logic post saying 0 or 2 people on your list were probably scum... or something. Now you're saying you can't find anyone, anyone out of the list of people who voted for VE scummy? BM was lurking all day 1, and you can't find that scummy? You find nothing suspicious about marv's play? I don't think marv is scum, and I can point out some suspicios things no problem. There is no one who is above suspicion until they flip green. Layabout goes from being a little scummy to you to not being scummy at all simply because he's "posting better"? Sentinel is scummy as sin! You even pointed out DAY ONE that you thought Sentinel could possibly be acting scummy. It hasn't gotten better for him in my eyes. How can you not make a case? Are you protecting a scumbuddy here? You pointed out that 0 or 2 people on VE might be scum. I'm leaning towards you knowing the number of scum on him. You can't make a case on Zeph? CMON. The guy's defense is that he was lurking! Ahem... I mean afk. You're saying Sentinel and Zeph are in the clear for you, but BM has to go? I will be the first one to hate on BM, but to say BM is your scum read but not zeph/sent is outrageous. BM start posting or you have feelings that he will be lynched. Where were you yesterday when I was shouting for his lynch. Now that sent/zeph are under suspicion, though, lynch the lurker. What remains after that post is one liner after one liner and then this. On April 25 2012 08:03 Ottoxlol wrote: Risen gonzaws case against him He tried to defend VE, but with not the best tools After that he starts to rally people to other candidates (marv/bm). He explained that he did FoS these people only because they had votes on them so it would have been easier to get ahead of VE. I think his reasoning is clear, I find him town. BM He doesnt post, ninja-votes. There is no real case against him because he doesn't post. I can't wrap my head around him, some say scummy, some say don't I can't really decide. If people want to lynch him I will have no objection at all. Sentinel He did not provide any reasoning on his vote for VE or get into the debate about it. A bit scummy. I would vote for him too Marv. From the beginning I felt like BJ is tunneling him too much, he answered his accusations but BJ couldn't understand them, I can relate to that. I am neutral towards him Zephirdd he defended himself with stating he afked, he's still not active enough, hard to judge. Daniel One real post, he votes BM but then promise us a case on marv and that he'll post, we are still waiting. Brood Two posts, he votes marv, I point out some inconsistency in his post but he did not respond. No posts, no case johnnywup I missed this case before, I think a couple of ppl too because no one really talked about this. I am feeling confident voting for johnny. ##Vote: johnnywup More buddying of me and a post containing your "feelings" culminating in a complete swap to voting johnny b/c he's being a little indecisive. Ottoxlol is scum and I will be voting for him. ##vote: Ottoxlol I agree with this case. If BM has no chance of being lynched and there is another candidate for getting lynched I will vote Ottox to ensure that either him or BM gets lynched today | ||
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On April 25 2012 21:14 Ottoxlol wrote: I agree with this case, it looks like no one commenting on it. So MG made a case and voted jhonny, then he voted ghost for After that he withdrew his vote on ghost, but did not put it back on jhonny. kind a scummy Why is this kinda scummy? | ||
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On April 25 2012 21:30 marvellosity wrote: Hey Mattchew, when I posted my thoughts on layabout's defences you said he had a valid point on BM. Not valid enough that you don't think he's 100% scum then? Or? I think that he had a valid reason for him not voting BM (his "defense"). I disagree with it (adamantly) but I can see where he is coming from. I still think he's the scummiest player in the game, but being that he has next to nothing in his filter it is still a risk (especially to people that don't see this being his scum meta) and I can't really argue that. You either see through his lurking and ninja voting as scum or you just see him being someone you cant read (aka a risky lynch) He should have been lynched day 1 and always should be when he lurks and ninja votes | ||
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On April 25 2012 21:28 Ottoxlol wrote: He had a case, he changed his vote but he withdrew it shortly after and did not put it back on jhony what about this is scummy? Like why do you think this is the trait of scum? | ||
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There are always going to be arguments and hold ups to a lynch hence why nothing is absolute. I just feel right now the BM and Ottox have the highest chance of flipping scum due to their play. | ||
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On April 25 2012 22:43 Ottoxlol wrote: When I made a post like this I was attacked on the grounds that I don't make a stance  . BJ came up with that I'm noob since then whatever I post no one reads it, Mementoss had a case against me that was reasonable all the other bs I replied to a lot of times.a. smilies set off a huge alarm with me. They are usually a subconscious scum tell of you trying to be "cute" and buddy the thread. b. I look at your posts. I find nothing scummy about Johnny. I don't feel the need to defend him because he is not at risk of being lynched. c. I don't really care about your defense (I do read it I just don't respond to it) because you will skew the case and your answer to put you in the best most townie light as town or scum, so your personal defense is pretty much meaningless in my eyes. I will judge you off your cases, interactions with others, opinions, and overall gameplay, not your self-defense | ||
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On April 26 2012 02:50 Risen wrote: Is there a reason you haven't responded to my case against you ottoxlol? Went to sleep expecting a response by the time I woke up... It's on page 62 if you somehow missed people talking about it... cause its pointless. as i have pointed out a bunch of times before | ||
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why do you care if he is blue or not when he isn't up for lynching also, I have posted reads on ottox throughout the day. I will vote for him to be lynched over zeph | ||
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On April 26 2012 08:13 PaqMan wrote: lol yeah i did. You still fail to actually explain yourself. You were telling Town on D1 to push Zeph hard. D2's about to be over, zeph's at high risk at being lynched and then you're saying that you didn't see anything scummy in his filter until just recently. wassup with dat? from what i read, he says he was pushing cause of lurking d1 pushing a lurker hard is MUCH different than pushing a scum candidate. When you push a lurker you cant be like "im just pushing you to get you to talk" because then it means nothing cause you don't actually want to lynch them. You have to force them into talking by threatening their lynch. That said i don't agree that there is nothing scummy in Zeph's filter, his reaction to VE flipping blue was total bullshit and was an attempt to muscle town into alleviating any suspicions of him because he helped lynch a blue. I didn't and still don't like that. Ottoxlol is so scummy though. He constantly tries to buddy town and play passively. If you look at the context of his posts instead of the content you would see that he is pretty much only posting to defend himself or to make the rest of town happy. He is afraid of the spotlight, aggression and sharing his opinions. This is why I will vote Ottox over Zeph in the end (ANNOUNCING MY LAST HOUR SWITCH), even though we should be lynching BM ##unvote Bill Murray ##vote Ottoxlol | ||
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On April 26 2012 08:36 layabout wrote: ##unvote MignightGladius ##vote ottoxlol uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh | ||
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On April 26 2012 10:55 johnnywup wrote: you said "can we lynch BM now?" i was just poking fun that you cant vote at night time, since you said "now". jeez o.o thought you were srs. meh | ||
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On April 27 2012 00:31 layabout wrote: Well we know we don't have a vig reckless enough to make a sub-optimal shot night 1. Or that they did and BM is a gf or one of the two were jailed. or they shot somebody else who was a GF or one of them was jailed. It's as if all we actually know is that no shot went through. Guys can you please stop all of this blue discussion. Unless you have some sort of ingenious plan for the blues that is vastly superior to them making their own decisions which are relatively straightforward then cut it out. I was going to say that Risen is a better shot but after thinking about it i think that Ottoxlol is a better shot but we should actually shoot/lynch neither. My thoughts on the implications of yesterdays lynch: It is true that if ottoxlol flips red then risen's switch would have been so beneficial to mafia that he likely is too. Shooting risen we have a similar impact since the switch made him a target and he would have no good reason to put himself in the spotlight for being anti-town unless it was to save a teammate. If Risen flips mafia then it is highly likely that his switch was to save a team-mate, which would be ottoxlol. If Risen flips town then we can't really infer anything about ottoxlol's alignment since Risen didn't know it and would have vote switched for the reasons he gave. If ottoxlol flips mafia then it's clear that Risen's switch did save mafia and the most reasonable explanation for this would be that he too is mafia. If ottoxlol flips town then Risen would have switched a lynch that mafia had no real reason to change and we can infer that Risen is very likely town. If we assume that nothing outlandish is happening then the following flips will lead to this: Flip: Risen => Risen Ottoxlol Risen => Risen Ottoxlol Ottoxlol => Risen Ottoxlol Ottoxlol => Risen Ottoxlol This means that if we are trying to be objective, ottoxlol's flip is the mosts valuable.. I believe that ottoxlol is town and that we are likely dealing with two town therefore we should not flip either. Am I correct in inferring that you believe we should lynch ottox then risen (if ottox is red) or MG (if ottox is green)? | ||
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On April 27 2012 03:38 Ottoxlol wrote: Matt and laya said they will vote for me a lot before they did, if I am scum and Brood wanted to save me he could have voted sooner so Risen's swap is not required to save me. Lets say for a second, that you actually are town and you either get shot or lynched this very moment, how do you think that fares for brood and Risen? | ||
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On April 27 2012 03:57 ghost_403 wrote: @Ottoxlol: No. Risen is not townie due to the fact that he screwed up the vote last night by swapping around his vote. He is scum due to the fact that he scewed up his vote last night by swapping around his vote. His vote minutes before the deadline got a townie lynched. He is scum. you are working completely under the assumption that ottox is scum | ||
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On April 27 2012 03:53 ghost_403 wrote: Addendum: Vig shots don't kill GF. Shoot Ottoxlol. not kill = detective red check, so uh its ok to shoot risen too | ||
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On April 27 2012 04:29 layabout wrote: You don't think that scum would deliberately change the lynch target at the last second? Or you don't think that they would try to pass it off as a mistake? scum have done in the past, most notably + Show Spoiler [here] + In my first game of mafia TL Mafia XLVII The scumteam commit a huge voteswitch at the end of the day to kill Palmer and BC. A voting update was posted during the switch and as a consequence of that bumatlarge who had been part of the switch accused hum teammates of claiming scum in the thread. Some of them then did claim scum in the thread. this game was a travesty and should be never be used as an example of anything. Plus we did that to try and kill a mayor and sheriff that were both veterens | ||
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On April 27 2012 04:34 ghost_403 wrote: @mattchew: Yes I am. That's because I think Ottoxlol is scum. I've made my position clear on that, and nothing has happened since then that would make me reconsider my position. In fact, the fact that we were so close to lynching him, and mislynched a townie instead makes me even more sure of that position. My position on Ottoxlol makes what happened last night make sense. @Ottoxlol: Easy. You're not a townie. @Marv: They didn't, which necessitated drastic measures. WIFOM warning: Perhaps they were preparing to let the town lynch Otto, and wanted to buy some townie credit through the exchange. Later on in the day, the Zeph movement picked up steam, allowing them the option of sacking Risen for Otto. @johnny: There is a lot better chance of Risen arguing his way out of the lynch as "I'm a stupid townie" than "I voted in such a way that a townie was lynched". Makes sense to me. Also, you're ignoring the fact that there's no reason for a townie to do something so foolish as to switch his vote back after his vote caused a lynch. That's something scum would do. well then that makes sense. Lets hope ottox is shot, and if not we flip him and get 1 or 2 other scum ez mode when he flips red | ||
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those are the 2 I would consider lynching today | ||
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If he flips scum, we get almost confirmed scum in Risen and like 75% scum in Brood. If he flips town, Risen is confirmed as being confused townie or REALLY REALLY stupid scum. Idk what this means for brood. Either way, we kinda direct the scum team with this and I firmly believe we also have a high chance of hitting a goon in Ottox if he is scum. This is our best course of action. ##vote: Ottoxlol | ||
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On April 28 2012 04:19 johnnywup wrote: Stop trying to put blame on me. That quote isn't scummy at all. I'm unsure about his alignment so I don't think his lynch will be good today. The statements aren't contradictory at all. I meant it in the sense that he may or may not be scum, not the matter-of-fact saying "even though he's scum". If you think ottox is scum, prove it. as far as i'm concerned your vote is super scummy, with no argument at all. Have you been reading the thread? | ||
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On April 28 2012 04:26 johnnywup wrote: yes, i don't like his vote without an argument though. am i not allowed to have opinions? sorry guys i'll just sheep all game and the scum will win. no, i won't let a sheepy vote go through without sufficient argument for me On April 25 2012 05:29 ghost_403 wrote: This post is what did if for me. I would push for an Ottoxlol lynch today, but I'm going to give him some time to convince me that this isn't the case. Immediately after that post, I posted which is the first time that I began to push for an Ottoxlol lynch. | ||
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To build on what ghost is saying, Ottox and Risen and Brood to an extent is a HUGE distraction for the thread that needs to be sort out first because I believe that there are and are going to be townies on the Ottox lynch thus shifting the power of town's votes and the consolidation of getting all townies together to vote on scum. I believe Ottox is scum, I believe Risen is his teammate, and Brood might be as well. | ||
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Ottox Risen Brood BM MG St.Daniel | ||
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On April 28 2012 05:40 BroodKingEXE wrote: @johnny If we lynch him noe we have a 50% chance of lynching a goon or GF. I'd rather we take the chance than lynch another townie. Great if it he is a goon as they lose a KP, if not we take out a GF which is fine too. In terms of information, people having been defending and accusing him why dont we look at that? If this was day 1 I would lynch St. Daniel in a heartbeat If this was day 2 I would hesitate and take outside factors into consideration but I would lynch St. Daniel This is day 3, 1 lynch from lylo. We need to get rid of scum and confusion, both of which ottox falls into that category. Also there is way more action evidence (which can't be faked) for Ottox and crew than just St. Daniel | ||
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On April 28 2012 09:45 marvellosity wrote: Ottoxlol's posting has been annoyingly pro-town recently so martyring is pro-town? and janaan is scummy. There is nothing unusually scummy about his posts, but his style matches the only full game he ever played scum. Janaan Scum Meta - Click Me! vs. Janaan as town getting shot N1 - Click Me! | ||
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On April 29 2012 01:15 BroodKingEXE wrote: Are you crazy?! Mementoss is dead why are talking to him!!! So you don't listening to the thoughts of confirmed townies? Interesting, another soft defense of ottox/risen | ||
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On April 29 2012 01:20 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I was about to say something like this but I accidentally hit the refresh button. And dead people's thoughts are important because it opens up the question "did they piss someone off and that person was gunning for them?" wrong and WIFOM dead peoples thoughts are important because we know their alignment, that is all | ||
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On April 28 2012 20:27 Bill Murray wrote: I disagree with you about Risen + Ottox not being scum together, and so did Mementoss. Guess where he is? Oh, yeah, dead. he is quoting mementoss cause he agrees with him, I am trying to play nice but you are making it really really hard to not be insulting | ||
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On April 30 2012 04:41 Ottoxlol wrote: + Show Spoiler + I don't know where to start, so many scum I can't believe it. I think I hit the jackpot! On April 30 2012 02:16 ghost_403 wrote: (1) His content is almost completely filler Aside from my cases, what else would you like to see? I posted my suspicions, plans I almost got lynched. On April 30 2012 02:16 ghost_403 wrote: (2) He almost completely ignores St.Daniels throughout the entire game. Just like everyone else, you softdefended him at least. On April 30 2012 02:16 ghost_403 wrote: (3) He makes stupidly scummy posts. On April 25 2012 05:19 ghost_403 wrote: Sentinel has two votes. I vote we lynch him today and Ottoxlol tomorrow. Sound good? On April 28 2012 00:56 ghost_403 wrote: Hey guys, let's lynch Ottoxlol. ##vote ottoxlol On April 28 2012 04:39 ghost_403 wrote: @ottoxlol: Scummy enough I would take a look at him if I hadn't already decided to lynch you today. I'm not willing to consider anyone else until this Ottoxlol and Risen thing is taken care of. After you post a case thats the copy of laya's post on the Risen lastminute vote issue and you decide that if Risen made a mistake he is a scum. Like VE, right? About Zeph and johnny On April 28 2012 08:32 Ottoxlol wrote: why is it strange that i change opinions? there was a lot going on between my vote on johny and the post where I suspect MG. "has to vote" yes. I waited a lot but in the end I had to vote Zeph. My strongest read was MG. If I vote MG I die. I felt Risen was scummy, but the case was weak. About MG lynch. we had a good case, he gave up, no one pushed anyone else but BK. If you are so sure that I am scum and MG isnt why did you left after voting? Why not push me? I tell you why, because you are scum and you were fine either way. Another empty post, all of the accusations which had been answered already, PaqMan: Ok, you did contributed, my bad. The case on me was already discussed to death and you did not add anything, BM detto. Why calling me out because I change opinions after a day? You had the same town and scumreads from the start? On April 27 2012 05:10 Ottoxlol wrote: I pointed out that is a mistake in his argument. I think BK is town. If JK/Tracker thinks I am scum, pointing out the uselessness of tracking or jailing BK is good. Nice bolding there, trying to skew my post? On April 27 2012 05:10 Ottoxlol wrote: I pointed out that is a mistake in his argument. I think BK is town. If JK/Tracker thinks I am scum, pointing out the uselessness of tracking or jailing BK is good. This part answers your question. On April 22 2012 13:41 PaqMan wrote: And it's blatantly idiotic of you to not vote for a dude who's been lurking the entire game and suddenly makes an unannounced vote without no explanation whatsoever. Have you not read my posts? I voted for Matt the second I started to think he's scummy. Calling out johnny for not voting the ninja voter. On April 23 2012 01:45 PaqMan wrote: Also, this is pure speculation, but what if BM is a GF? We're dismissing him and assuming our vigi (if we even have one) will shoot him. Pushing BM but not StD for the ninja vote On April 22 2012 13:39 PaqMan wrote: Mattchew's not off my site yet but wth wouldn't you vote for BM when the dude's been lurking the whole game and makes a quiet vote. This is why ottox should be lynched tomorrow. If you read this and agree with it you are scum or being influenced by scum. | ||
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##vote ottoxlol | ||
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On April 30 2012 09:53 johnnywup wrote: GFs are useless to scum though. If we can kill the goons we pretty much win since without a goon scum has to rely on mislynches and won't have a night kill. since ottox is not a goon, we shouldn't kill him today. IMO at least. im just saying this is making you look like you dont want to lynch scum | ||
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On April 30 2012 10:08 johnnywup wrote: I want to lynch scum. But look for other scum other than ottox because if he dies than scum still has the KP. We want to reduce the KP to 0. If we do that it's smooth sailing. Do you not understand what I'm saying? I understand exactly what you are saying, but the fact that ottox leads to other lynches, and the fact that with sent out (and I believe him) gf's flip = scum with no confusion, we should be lynching the scum team. If you can truly find me a goon, I am down but seeing how the lynches have gone thusfar, the odds are not in our favor to lynch a goon over a townie | ||
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On April 30 2012 10:18 Ottoxlol wrote: How's my lynch going to lead to other lynches? You mean to those who did not read my cases, just blindly voted me? Thats not good for you Matt. you really think ghost and paq are scum? lol | ||
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On April 30 2012 10:39 PaqMan wrote: Yepp yepp. Placing my vote on Ottox. Town's next best lynch after him would have to be BM, imo. noted. | ||
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He is so scummy he makes me pretty sure that 1 of risen/brood is not scum | ||
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On May 01 2012 23:08 johnnywup wrote: I don't like the feeling of a Ottox lynch. If I really have to ok but seriously theres 6 people on him including the 2 I think are scum. It could still be bussing but it makes me uncomfortable. We know he's not the goon so thats another reason I think it's not a good lynch. I'm the only one voting someone besides ottox (except for ottox voting ghost) so I feel this is a scum bandwagon or something. Just a feeling but its uneasing :\ You logic is ALMOST there. There are 2 options here. Option 1: This is a bus, and the goon is NOT BM, because scum would basically be forfeiting if BM is the goon and they are bussing their other teammate. This is why I don't believe BM to be the goon currently. Option 2: This is a mislynch. We get little to no info on who the goon is. | ||
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On May 01 2012 23:28 johnnywup wrote: Why does option 1 have to have BM not being Goon? He could still be goon with a bus because the scum team would basically be forfeiting. We are lynching BM after Risen if Ottox flips scum. No scum team would bus and have their goon be able to be roleblocked | ||
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On May 02 2012 08:41 Ottoxlol wrote: Nah, I am town allright. Sent on the other hand claims he did not jailed n1 because he was busy. He posted after nightpost and after daypost 5 min in. I doubt he was too busy. didnt you and your teammates give up by now? | ||
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and we should lynch BM tomorrow that is all goodnight | ||
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On May 03 2012 07:32 johnnywup wrote: I won't even be unhappy if you flip town wut | ||
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and this is what I expected. Gimme a little while I got type a ton of shit up | ||
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I shot Risen Night 3. He did not die. I shot Risen because of his vote switching fiasco with zeph and ottox. If he died and flipped town, it would save a mis-lynch on Ottox. If he died and flipped goon that would be fucking sweet. And what actually happened is Risen did not die, and is a Godfather. But why didn't I claim? I did not claim because I knew that Risen was scum, so I fucked up and used this as confirmation of Ottox being scum too. Seeing that Ottox was to be lynched yesterday, I figured that I did not need to make myself a target for scum shooting by confirming myself as the last blue. Also, with 2 out of 3 blues already dead, I knew that scum would eventually have to out themselves with a counter-claim at somepoint. My plan was working perfectly. Ottox was to be lynched, I knew Risen to be scum and then Sent claimed JK. I had the entire scum team lined up, all I had to do was wait for Ottox to flip scum, watch scum hold their kill, and then claim and watch them forfeit. Then ottox flipped town. Now I was confused. But I wanted to continue playing into sent's fake claim that he was the Jailkeeper. With this I could confirm my strongest scum read as town. I had a strong feeling that mafia would hold its kill in order to mislynch (and it pains me to say this) Bill Murray. So now we are in LYLO with 2 confirmed scum, [UoN]Sentinel and Risen I am pretty sure they are the 2 godfathers. But only Risen I am 100% sure this is. This is why we should vote Sentinel , cause there is the off-chance that he is the goon fake claiming, while there is 0% Risen is goon. TLDR; We are actually in LYLO, I am Vig, Risen and Sent are scum. Bill Murray is confirmed town. My breadcrumb + Show Spoiler + On April 22 2012 11:05 Mattchew wrote: Visceraeyes is still looking scummy too. he needs to start making sense of his nonsense case or I will vote him to be lynched. Gonzaw you've given a list of like 5 to lynch today, 2 of which I agree with VE and St Daniel, 1 of which I haven't read enough into (sent, I'm still on my phone and he's been posting a lot) and 2 which I dont agree with (myself, duh, and risen, cause of meta). You asked people to look into paqman's case on me which revolves around me not talking about your plan in the thread and then he calls me actively lurking less than like 24 hours into the game. do you actualy believe this crap? Some recent questions explained On May 02 2012 07:18 ghost_403 wrote: Mattchew's next, since he's been more or less behind me for quite some time now. The thing I find most scummy about him is he's not dead yet. ghost stops to ponder... I am not dead because the only people I have actually tried to lynch are townies aka BM and Ottox. On May 02 2012 08:43 johnnywup wrote: mattchew do you have anything productive to say? I thought I had found the entire scum team. I figured after Ottox was lynched we would win. I was just trying to get to the night post without any hitch in the plans. | ||
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##vote [UoN]Sentinel and we need to keep talking to find the 3rd scum | ||
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On May 02 2012 08:51 Ottoxlol wrote: +2 posts around this time He was busy, right. | ||
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On May 03 2012 09:53 PaqMan wrote: I don't believe Mattchew's claim. His bread crumb is so weak. The way he did it, I can go back quote myself and make it look like I was a tracker. I haven't delivered so my apologies. Basically my case was going to consist of going through Mattchew's filter and point out how his posting quality has increasingly dropped ever since he slipped out of the spot light. I'm still going to post it. You don't believe me because of a weak breadcrumb? Did you not read the rest of the post? Do you have any actual questions or are you going to pick out only one part of the post you didn't like? Are you about to lynch someone for not playing like you would play... again? (hi VE) (and by lynch someone I mean me or BM because if you don't believe me you should be voting him) | ||
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On May 03 2012 09:55 PaqMan wrote: If Mattchew is vig then wtf is up with this post. playing into sents role claim... I thought I found the scum team of ottox/risen/sent and all i needed to do was claim after ottox flipped scum | ||
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On May 03 2012 10:24 johnnywup wrote: Explain this Matt. + Show Spoiler + On April 30 2012 09:24 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Now that's interesting. Jailkeeper here. I jailed Otto, because, as I said, it felt more likely I could stop the shot. Although I still think Otto is red, he is not a goon, and as you can see, one of ours died last night. What do we do now? On April 30 2012 09:28 Mattchew wrote: We lynch scum. ##vote ottoxlol 4 minutes later, Mattchew shows no sign of not believing. He responds as if he was unsurprised even. The fact of the matter is that he votes OTTOX right after the day begins. If you have a confirmed scum then you fucking vote him. I don't give a shit if you think he's connected to someone else. You lynch a 100% confirmed scum 100% of the time no matter what. And Matt didn't do that. Not to mention that Sentinels pre-day post posting made way more sense with the claim than yours. They make sense leading up to his jailing of Ottox. On April 27 2012 02:45 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Layabout's post w/ the timeframe seems to clear everything up for me. I still believe Monsieur Otto is scum, so I'll have an easy time believing all 3 of them are mafias. I could see some logic behind Brood being a townie and deliberately pressed for time, but unlikely. The question is, if Otto is town, what would be the motives of Brood and Risen? I don't see any clear ones for now, so I'll go about believing Otto is scum. On April 27 2012 02:46 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Also, concering saving Otto, perhaps one of the two is GF and they're saving Otto who is a goon and has KP? but the most telling thing IMO is the moment that Mattchew says that he's not sure if Sentinel is fakeclaiming he starts pushing (if you can even call it that) Risen. Up until that point he mentioned Risen as a possible scum but didn't push. This leads me to believe that this is the time that Matt came up with his fake claim. This, not so coincidentally, is the time when I started feeling matt wasn't contributing and was acting scummy... But let the posts do the talking. On May 02 2012 08:28 Mattchew wrote: what if sent is fake claiming and the real blue is just waiting for the right opportunity. I believe sent but idk On May 02 2012 08:30 Mattchew wrote: meh fuck it.. sent you need to jail BM and we need to lynch Ottox. We are doing all the right things to come back from this travesty of a game On May 02 2012 08:35 Mattchew wrote: lol @ risen trying to confuse the thread On May 02 2012 08:40 Mattchew wrote: if you dont pay attention to risen... you wont pay attention to scum On May 02 2012 08:45 Mattchew wrote: johnny i am being productive... i am telling you not to listen to scum On May 02 2012 08:48 Mattchew wrote: Risen is trying to get us off his scum teammate On May 02 2012 09:05 Mattchew wrote: lol johnny risen is scum On May 02 2012 09:07 Mattchew wrote: ill post more at the end of the night On May 02 2012 10:26 Mattchew wrote: sent should jail BM and we should lynch BM tomorrow that is all goodnight In my mind Risen/Ottox were confirmed scum. Ottox to me was the goon. Sent claiming just made him the other GF to me. I wanted to lynch the goon then the GF's. It makes a lot of sense to me now that Sent claimed with Ottox not being scum. He counters my claim if I make it (mislynch FTW) or just gets everyone to mislynch BM by saying he is goon cause he blocked him. Basically, I thought the game was won. I was posting like I had already won. | ||
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On May 03 2012 10:36 johnnywup wrote: also, if your claim were to be true, going along with sentinel is not what you would do. You would have 2 confirmed scum, out of 3 left, and yet you chose to vote for neither of them. No townie would do that. ##unvote ##vote mattchew ? I voted Ottox, cause Risen being scum confirmed him to me. This is not illogical at all seeing the last minute vote switch of day 2. | ||
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On May 03 2012 10:44 johnnywup wrote: I meant yesterdays lynch, where he voted for ottox... After Sent claimed, Matt would have 2 confirmed scum out of 3 total (Sent and Risen). BUT HE VOTED FOR OTTOX. Does that make sense as town? Once again, I believed I had won the game and had all 3. In retrospect if Ottox had flipped town day3 I would NOT have shot Risen and would have shot BM night 3. | ||
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On May 03 2012 10:47 johnnywup wrote: I don't buy it matt. If you have 2 confirmed scum you vote for a confirmed scum. I don't care what role you think they are, if you have 2 confirmed scum you vote for them. The last minute switch didn't confirm shit and you know it. hence why i didn't shoot night 2 .. | ||
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On May 03 2012 10:54 johnnywup wrote: you JUST said that you thought that risen being scum confirmed ottox to you because of the switch you are rushing your posts. I am saying that it is NOT ILLogical to think ottox is scum because of the last minute switch... | ||
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More serious note: The reason not to claim was posted in every guide ever, you keep town on a need to know basis. If ottox was to about to not get lynched again, I would have claimed immediately and ensured his lynch. He was to be lynched and me not claiming actually worked to the benefit of town. By waiting on my claim, I confirmed someone many (including myself) thought was scum and was an easy mislynch in BM. If I had claimed earlier, scum would have just shot me at night and we would have been left lynching only sent and risen and probably mislynching BM. Actually as scum, the timing of my claim would probably make more sense if I were to post it closer towards the end of the day so that people don't have as much time to read my filter, discuss whether or not its true and discuss the 3rd scum option. A question I have for you, is why are you so quick to believe Sent's claim with basically no argument, even though ottox posted a completely logical reason for you not to believe him? | ||
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On May 03 2012 11:20 PaqMan wrote: BM is Scum. Mafia didn't use their KP to make it look like Sentinel jailed BM , gaining him town cred. Assuming Mattchew's claim is true then that's the most likely scenario. What I don't like is why would Sentinel fake-claim. scum knew they would have to fake claim at somepoint cause of there only being 1 blue left and having the shot hit risen. the useless JK that all of a sudden jails everyone's scum read and he turns out to be goon probably seemed the most believable | ||
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On May 03 2012 11:38 johnnywup wrote: I'll actually look into ottox's argument, i didn't really put much thought into it. as for the first part, claiming at the end of the day would make you look waaaaaay scummier, and we'd end up lynching a "town". anyways, if we mislynch today, we're at lylo, 5v3 yes? that means that lynching BM is the best course of action for both of your claims, believe it or not. Let me explain. If BM flips goon, then we lynch you, as it confirms Sent as a Jailkeeper and you as a liar. This means we get 2 scum without losing without fail. We won't be at lylo tomorrow in this situation. If BM flips town, we lynch Risen and Sentinel, as it confirms Matt as a vig and Sent as a liar. This means we also get 2 scum without losing without fail. We will be at lylo tomorrow, but that doesn't really matter since we get 2 scum either and it'll be favorable for town from there. If BM flips GF, we act the same as if he flipped town, except we catch all 3 scum without fail. So there we have it. Any objections to this plan? johnny we are at 5 - 3 now. We are in lylo because we DONT ACTUALLY HAVE A JAILKEEPER. We have to lynch scum today On May 03 2012 11:37 PaqMan wrote: How can you explain BM's behavior the entire game? No reaction to the fact that Town wants him lynched, he's not even trying to defend himself or anything. Yeah i don't buy your claim that he's town. On May 03 2012 11:38 PaqMan wrote: Yeah if he's town why is he shitting all over us. Read this post and thread for why BM would do this and then read how I wanted to policy lynch him. He is known for being batshit as both town and scum. It is almost impossible to read him as scum and it is ALWAYS impossible to read him as town. This is why I said that him and St. Daniel made good day 1 day 2 lynches cause they are impossible to read. (BM for being crazy, St. Dan for not posting) | ||
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Mattchew Janaan Risen Bill Murray [UoN]Sentinel PaqMan this is who is left... its 8 people... stop being dense johnny... 3 scum 5 town, a mislynch and no JK = scum wins | ||
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On May 03 2012 12:00 johnnywup wrote: yeah, i was being stupid there...but it may still work but we have to go all-in, in sorts. If BM flips town, town will be tied with scum, with 3:3. If town can get 3 on risen or sent before scum gets a lynch on a town, then the tie rule will lynch the scum. If its a GF it's 2:2 and we gotta do the same thing again the next day. If its Goon we are 3:2, and there shouldn't be a way to lose because scum is forced to reveal themselves in order to try and lynch a townie the previous day, and since we have majority we get the lynch unless a townie is being an idiot. This will be really risky though, as everyone has to be f5ing the thread hardcore in order to get their votes in first. I understand if town feels like this is too much of a risk and we don't go through with it, but if we do it right we should win 100% if BM flips scum we should be able to win ezpz however. scum usually win if the # of scum = # of town right mods? | ||
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On May 03 2012 12:00 johnnywup wrote: yeah, i was being stupid there...but it may still work but we have to go all-in, in sorts. If BM flips town, town will be tied with scum, with 3:3. If town can get 3 on risen or sent before scum gets a lynch on a town, then the tie rule will lynch the scum. If its a GF it's 2:2 and we gotta do the same thing again the next day. If its Goon we are 3:2, and there shouldn't be a way to lose because scum is forced to reveal themselves in order to try and lynch a townie the previous day, and since we have majority we get the lynch unless a townie is being an idiot. This will be really risky though, as everyone has to be f5ing the thread hardcore in order to get their votes in first. I understand if town feels like this is too much of a risk and we don't go through with it, but if we do it right we should win 100% if BM flips scum we should be able to win ezpz however. 2 more things. if/when BM flips town, if we didn't lose right there and then, we don't know the 3rd scum member, only sent/risen. You seem to be trying to take the super lazy and easy way out of this game. you also seem to be trying to sell the easy win to everyone else. your posting has earned my FOS as the third scum | ||
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if sent flips town, you lynch BM (taking out what would be scum KP) and me and then find 3rd scum when sent flips scum, you go up 5 - 2, might lynch scum KP, and then you guarantee the next day lynch of Risen, and then you go up at least 4 - 1, at best 5 - 1 if sent is goon | ||
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On May 03 2012 12:11 PaqMan wrote: Yes. I thought it was really hilarious, lol. I still want him dead. That doesn't clear him of being scum and it doesn't justify him as town. it doesn't make it right, but it explains why it happens. please find me a game where BM played town and didn't play batshit insane | ||
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On May 03 2012 12:15 johnnywup wrote: same issue with my plan with sent, it would end up being 3:3 tomorrow if sent flips town. I even got a FoS from that, so why are you suggesting the same thing with a different person? because you either lynch scum today, or guarantee lynching goon the next day. you lynch BM and he flips town, then you just have sent and risen, and I dont think either are goon | ||
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and I love how you completely ignore Sentinel in all of your reasoning. by voting BM you are saying you believe Sent and are willing the bet the entire game on a scum read on the craziest player in the game. Do you think that I would have pushed BM's lynch (and push away from a VE lynch) as hard as I did day 1 if he was my teammate? You are literally taking the laziest way out with this situation | ||
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it's also the smartest, IMO. if there's facts that people can find and present that heavily incriminate either you or sent, I'd definitely reconsider. How about the fact that sent says he didn't jail anyone night 1 because he had no one else that makes sense for him to fake claim jailing Hm, yeah I would. But it's not completely up to me, others have to agree. I noticed that there hasn't been a big bandwagon to lynch BM right as the day started, which makes me feel like BM is indeed scum. Let's call it the same gut feeling that told me ottox was town Most people hadn't posted before I claimed. This means nothing. (funny how that statement can hurt you later on huh?). I fail to see how this hurts me now. Because I wanted to lynch and actively pushed to lynch the person you are now trying to lynch, that makes me scummy? You don't think my pushing of Bill Murray was genuine? | ||
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Interesting play today johnny, very interesting | ||
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Johnny you realize you are voting with this scum (risen) right? | ||
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On May 03 2012 13:14 johnnywup wrote: if bm flips goon that makes risen green imo. but i'm gonna have to look through a lot of things before I come to a final decision, since 3:3 is auto scum win i'm gonna have to really think about this. thank you. I will answer any questions you have for me about any issue, but I think for now its bed time ps. + Show Spoiler + fuck the rangers | ||
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On May 03 2012 13:18 Mattchew wrote: paqman, why risen (who is confirmed GF due to my vig shot) over Sent, who could be goon i want this answered i gtg to sleep ill be on occasionally throughout tomorrow and all day friday | ||
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On May 03 2012 19:17 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: This. Now: Did anyone read my explanation on why this is a bad idea on mafia's part? Anyways, here's something I found interesting + Show Spoiler [Shitload of Quotes] + On April 22 2012 14:31 Mattchew wrote: sleep might be back on in like 9 - 12 hours vote BM On April 23 2012 01:05 Mattchew wrote: we should lynch BM cause he claimed scum in thread by ninja voting On April 23 2012 02:11 Mattchew wrote: BM ninja voted, Daniel didn't.. he atleast attempted to explain his vote (albeit scummily as fuck) . When someone ninja votes you lynch them. Its basically a red check My scum picks so far are BM, Risen, Daniel and I would like to lynch/vig them in that order Skip a few pages: On April 27 2012 12:05 Mattchew wrote: ottox or BM those are the 2 I would consider lynching today On April 30 2012 16:23 Mattchew wrote: We lynch BM after we sort out Ottox/risen/brood He is so scummy he makes me pretty sure that 1 of risen/brood is not scum But then here we have this: On May 01 2012 21:35 Mattchew wrote: I have my doubts about BM being the last goon. I think he's scum, but not goon. I think someone that has fallen off the radar more (AHEM Janaan) could be playing a perfect goon in this setup So I think it's safe to say Mattchew has been consistently pushing for Bill Murray's death. Alright. So back to Matt's vig claim. Why, oh why, does a player that has been wanting desperately to lynch Bill Murray since Day 1 make this post? So apparently you think I'm scum, because I jailed your number one read, following your orders, and that mafia would choose not to seize an excellent opportunity of lynching me or, if you wanted to keep that bullshit going, a good town like Paqman. Your argument is more invalid than Stephen Hawking. Your argument is that I am admitting I was wrong about BM after pushing him all game? Thats it? You didn't know I was the vig, but you did know that I was actively pushing BM, this made him the perfect candidate, cause if you claim to jail BM and no kill occurs, you know that I will push for BM's death as hard as anyone. Your plan failed because I know you are not Jailkeeper therefore scum held their kill on purpose to mislynch BM and win. BM is being painted red by scum because he was the easiest mislynch target. | ||
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We need to lynch Sent then Risen | ||
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On May 03 2012 22:20 PaqMan wrote: Just a quick thought as I'm in a rush. If Sentinel is telling the truth then we let him jail BM tonight, and we lynch someone else like Risen. If you believe Sent is telling the truth, BM is basically confirmed goon and you should lynch him. At worst you lynch me for not believing my claim. I believe that people should be between voting for either Sent today then Risen Or Bill Murray today then Mattchew | ||
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On May 03 2012 22:55 johnnywup wrote: I'm not sure If I'll be able to be here around deadline. I'm gonna vote for my biggest scumread. I was getting too emotional yesterday with my posts. I don't know who's telling the truth between you two but I'm going to vote for my biggest scumread, BM. ##vote Bill Murray this is terrible reasoning and super scummy. I believe you or Janaan to be the 3rd scum team member, but that is for a future day after we dont LOSE today | ||
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On May 01 2012 10:57 johnnywup wrote: Ok, first off theres Bill Murray. Verdict: Goon. Meta-reason: Compare his filter to his DFM2 posting (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=324050&user=54241). He wasn't very active there either, but he made reads and took sides and made substantial posts. Here he tells people that they're wrong. That's it. He doesn't make a case or say anything unless he's directly responding to accusations against him. There are some examples of him responding to posts not about him, but they're still small and not relevant. He's scraping by lynches by not taking stances and that's unacceptable. He's scum. I'm not quoting him to point out certain points in his posting because all his posts are very similar. There's not too much for me to say about BM because he hasn't posted much. I think he's Goon because he's staying out of the spotlight as much as often. This makes him look more goon than GF because without Goon there isn't any KP left for mafia. Same concept for vigs (which we dont have anyways). The others are Godfather by default of me thinking that BM is Goon (since theres 1 left) and because they're not afraid to put themselves out in the open as much as BM. This is your entire case on BM, its based off meta of 1 game, where he most of his posting is almost exactly the same as this game. Once again, lazy johnny | ||
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On May 03 2012 23:19 ghost_403 wrote: I'm more inclined to believe Mattchew over Sentinel at this point. Looking back through his filter, he was pushing for, or at least suggesting, a StDaniels lynch through most of the game. I can't see scum pushing to lynch their KP for towncred. In addition to that, Risen has been playing scummy as fuck all game long. I doubt I could find a single page in his filter where he doesn't say something that doesn't make him look like either a terrible townie or scum. Mattchew's claim is consistent with my read on Risen. The decrease in scumminess that I saw from Sentinel was mostly due to him actually being moderately aggressive in pushing for an Ottoxlol lynch. Now that we know that Ottoxlol was a townie, this can very easily be attributed to scum being called out and forced to do something in the game. I would propose lynching Risen first, and taking it from there. @mattchew: That's the worst breadcrumb I've ever seen. I don't usually do any bread crumbing. Why give scum a chance to find it? and if you believe me, we should be lynching Sent, the possible goon, not Risen, the confirmed GF | ||
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On May 03 2012 23:22 johnnywup wrote: matt im not gonna have you sit there and insult my play. seriously. not cool. for some reason, i thought lynch was today, so yeah, i'll be back. my bad. this post contradicts itself. I never insulted your play, i said you were wrong and lazy. if i wanted to insult your play i would have brought up your LYLO record. | ||
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On May 03 2012 23:28 johnnywup wrote: it contradicts itself? It may not look like it but I've been putting a shit ton of time into this game and you downplaying it just to make me look bad isn't cool dude. ffs I know you are putting a lot of time in. Thats not what I am saying. I am saying that your scumhunting is lazy and you are looking for the easy road out (full proof plans, shaky meta reads). To me, in this situation, you should analyze every person involved (BM, Me, Risen, Sent) and then come to a conclusion. Instead you are just vote BM because he and only he is your strongest scum read, and that read is based off very little. You didn't even re-post your case or add to it. I am not accusing you of not putting effort into this game. I am accusing you of not letting others see the effort you are putting in and letting others see your thought process for how you are assessing the situation. | ||
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On May 04 2012 03:55 Janaan wrote: Sorry for not posting recently, my computer is screwed up and can't get internet. I can only be on while I'm in a computer lab at school, which means I won't be able to post again 4 hours from now. There's a lot here to go over. Some things about Mattchew's claim ring true, while other things make me think Sentinel was telling the truth. The biggest thing against Mattchew's claim for me is if Risen and Sentinel are scum buddies then what reason would Risen have had to even suggest that Sentinel's claim was false? As it was, everyone else was going along with it. Also what reason would Sentinel have had to say that he didn't jail someone Night 1? He could have thrown out the name of any town or scummy looking player no problem. It just doesn't make any sense to me. On the other hand, I've had this nagging feeling about BM that he's just been a bad townie the whole time, even though his play looks scummy. I don't quite know what it is, but I just have a hunch. Matt has also been the greenest townie to me so far. I'm not sure who to believe right now, and that's what it comes down to. The only clear thing to me is that if I believe Sentinel, I will vote BM. If I believe Matt, I will vote Risen. I have some thinking to do, and I don't expect to vote for another 20 hours or so. By then I will have made up my mind. Distancing for this, Risen has looked scummy as fuck and Sent knows that. Why risen, the he is confirmed GF, instead of sent, who could be the goon. I want to lynch the goon if thats possible | ||
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On May 04 2012 12:36 johnnywup wrote: are you really making a case based around psychology? this is super ironic considering your reasoning for your vote on BM I just got home from the devils game, I am not 100% sober. Ask me anything. Remember that time that Sent said that he's ok with a Risen lynch? If you believe him, he is OK with lynching someone he does not know to be scum. A town jailkeeper that "blocked" the KP would be pushing BM and only BM. This is why I have said that the choice is between BM and Sent for today's lynch. | ||
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On May 04 2012 13:44 johnnywup wrote: I'm relooking into my other 2 scum but I'm pretty confident in Ghost scum. ghost_403 + Show Spoiler + Before I get into the actual case, I'd like to address something. Ghost supported lynching a lot of people that flipped Green. But it's not only that. He consistently either says BM or St.Daniel are bad lynches, or avoids talking about them altogether. On April 23 2012 01:28 ghost_403 wrote: I think a BM lynch is a terrible idea (vig shout would be fine though). I don't think I've ever seen a case where a ninja vote was due to someone being scum. There's too much risk and no reward for scum in this situation. I think he's just insane. I really don't like the fact that Sentinel immediately jumped on the lynch BM bandwagon. Trying to lynch insane players is scummy in my book. Same goes for you Mattchew. Why would scum even try to ninja vote? It makes way more sense to sheep instead. No one would have thought twice if BM had shown up in thread and said "lol VE scum ##vote VE". VE's claim is bad. He's doing the same thing that he did in TLM LI in claiming when there's no reason to. I can't imagine scum VE doing the same thing twice, but now we're into WIFOM territory. In addition, JK is the only nonconfirmable role in the game. A vig shot shows up in the day post, and a tracker can confirm where someone went that night. It only makes sense that scum VE would claim JK. On April 23 2012 02:17 ghost_403 wrote: @mattchew: But hes cahrazy, don't vote him. Bill Murray is playing a game that's insane, but he's doing it over there and leaving the town alone. VE is playing a game that's insane, but he's doing it in such a way that the town cannot function efficiently. Disruptive insane play is far more lynch worthy than weird incomprehensible im-gonna-do-whatever-the-fuck-i-want play. @paqman: If a vig shoots BM and he doesn't die, it makes sense that the vig would claim it in thread. A jail keeper would be forced to admit to jailing BM in thread, but I can't see that happening. If the vig claim is true, we lynch BM and he flips GF. If it's not, BM flips town, and the next day we lynch the counterclaiming scum. Win-win. On April 24 2012 21:05 ghost_403 wrote: Haha, chainsaw defense. I've been giving Ottoxlol a noob pass since Day 1, but perhaps BJ is right. I'd be down with a Ottoxlol lynch. The other thing that I don't like about Ottoxlol is the fact that he's not hunting scum at all. If you take a look through his filter, his suggestions for lynches are all lurkers. There's 50 pages in this thread, and he can't find any scum who are posting? I assumed it was due to the fact that he's a newb, but newbs roll scum too. @ottoxlol: If you don't want me to try and get you lynched today, start hunting some scum. You want to suggest someone who isn't lurking and/or insane? On April 24 2012 23:29 ghost_403 wrote: StDaniel is en route to being modkilled. If he comes back and does nothing, I will discuss him as a possible lynch candidate. Since he's not even playing, there's no point in pushing for his lynch. @marv: Ottoxlol's posting history shows him posting outside the TLMafia subforum, so I'm leaning newbie on him. However, some of the stuff that I've seen him do in thread has made me think he's "newbie scum" as opposed to "newbie town". BJ's (lol) case addresses some of that. I really need to work on reading newbie towns, so that is something I think I would like to work on. On April 28 2012 00:56 ghost_403 wrote: Hey guys, let's lynch Ottoxlol. ##vote ottoxlol On April 30 2012 02:16 ghost_403 wrote: This post ended up orders of magnitudes longer than I intended. I have no idea how Ottoxlol has gotten away with being so scummy in this game for so long. Spoilers for your convenience and easy referencing. (1) His content is almost completely filler. + Show Spoiler + First of all, I would like to address the glaring fact that his filter has nothing of content in it. 7 pages. 7 pages, and I have almost nothing to say about them. They are mostly one liners and him giving excuses for everything that he does. It would be so much easier to prove that he was scum if he would just do something, anything. Unfortunately for him, at this point his lack of content now paints him as scum. 7 pages, and no content? Scum trying to pass off as useful without actually helping the town. (2) He almost completely ignores St.Daniels throughout the entire game. + Show Spoiler + It's interesting that now he claims that I soft defended StDaniels. It's the fourth time this game he's mentioned him. When were the first three?
I'm soft defending him by stating that I'm ignoring someone en route to being modkilled? No, I'm not going to even discuss someone who's not playing. It's a waste of time. What's your excuse for ignoring him literally the entire game? (3) He makes stupidly scummy posts. + Show Spoiler + On April 25 2012 00:57 Ottoxlol wrote: Ok, post it when you got it drawn. I feel like the pressure is on me because I did not make any useful post d2, and i feel its really unfair when no one really did so. I am thinking on the line of who should we lynch that gives us info. VE wagon seemed like a good start to look at, I made 3 pairs who seems to defend each other/attack the same persons. If we lynch anyone from that we can get information about the other half of the pair. This post is so scummy that any veteran player would have been immediately lynched. I was pretty happy to give him the n00b pass, but I don't think that's a good idea. In this post,
How gloriously scummy. How did we get here? On April 25 2012 08:03 Ottoxlol wrote: [...] johnnywup I missed this case before, I think a couple of ppl too because no one really talked about this. I am feeling confident voting for johnny. ##Vote: johnnywup You think Johnny is kinda sorta maybe sheeping because he doesn't give out any strong reads one way or the other (which is, ironically, the same thing that you're doing), and therefore he's scum. So what made you change your mind? On April 26 2012 05:29 Ottoxlol wrote: Because if he would be scum he wouldn't try to sway ppl from my vote (if zeph or sent is scum). Johnny was sheeping away from you. Hey, isn't that why you wanted to lynch him in the first place? On April 26 2012 05:33 Ottoxlol wrote: My vote was wasted on him anyways because no one is voting for him. Since I am the vote leader atm, I have to vote for the 2nd guy, even if I feel like someone is more likely to be scum. "Don't blame me if the guy we flip isn't scum, because I'm just voting for not-me." This is such a terribly scummy post, it's not even funny. Mafia pro-tip: vote to lynch scum. (4) He has completely sheeped on the last two lynches. + Show Spoiler + This segues nicely into my next problem with Ottoxlol: His voting patterns.
But why he voted the way he did was much more interesting. His reasons for voting VE have been beaten to death, so I'm not going to discuss it too much here. For voting Zeph: On April 26 2012 07:25 Ottoxlol wrote: I have to ##vote Zephirdd The Risen case is weak in my opinion, I can understand that points 1 and 4 can be suspicious but 2-3 doesnt seem scummy to me. He tried to defend VE, but not with the best tools, he tried to defend himself but not with the best tools. But wait! That doesn't say anything about why he's voting Zeph! You are an astute reader! I can't find it. Ottoxlol has no reason to vote Zeph, other than to sheep with the town. For voting MG: On April 28 2012 07:19 Ottoxlol wrote: BM on MG also this post I have no idea why would anyone trust you because you say so. Excuses also doesnt help the scumhunt, I think no one cares about food poisoning or cat funerals. ##vote MidnightGladius BK started posting some weird stuff, hes voting St. Daniel for ninjavoting, but BM ninjavoted d1 too and he did not mention it at all. ghost and Sentinel doesnt want to engage in the debate of other possibilities then I am a scum. no one can be 100% sure so the discussion must be on even if they vote me, so when I flip green we will have information Another sheeping! "Here's someone else's case I found moderately compelling, and here's something that is kinda scummy." Well, MG flipped green and he's right. We found scum pushing for his lynch today. Frankly, it's embarassing that the town has let Ottoxlol live this long in the game. As soon as tomorrow hits, I'm voting to lynch him for the third day in a row, and I hope this time, we can get a sucessful lynch and get this scum out of the game. On April 30 2012 10:56 ghost_403 wrote: ##vote ottoxlol I buy Sentinel's claim, lest someone else would like to counterclaim. Too bad, I was sure ottoxlol was a goon. This means I have to reconsider the whole Risen conspiracy  It was such an elegant plan. I'll rephrase all this: "Anyone down for lynching Townies and not lynching BM or St.Daniel?" + Show Spoiler + Now, onto to the actual case. First, a trip down memory lane, where we have ghost's response to my previous case. I dismissed it as a good defense, but after the ottox lynch it makes him look even scummier than before. Since it's not a bus, pushing ottox so hard makes sense as scum. It's not "constantly bussing your scum mate for a week non stop to gain towncred", it's simply "lynching a townie". If Ottox did indeed flip scum, this would make ghost look a lot more townie. But now, it's looking likely once again for Ghost being scum. + Show Spoiler + On May 01 2012 23:45 ghost_403 wrote: Okay, so let's see what terrible things people have been saying about me. For reference, the case by johnnywup and the case by BroodKingEXE. Johnny's case against me boils down to four points.
All of these points are easily addressed.
Now, I'm assuming you've read my previous case. Now we can continue on that case from where we left off. On May 02 2012 10:04 ghost_403 wrote: Well, I wish you had come up with a better reason for not lynching him than "My gut tells me this is wrong." Maybe then we could have avoided it for the third day in a row. Previous to this, he was criticizing me for having a town(ish) read on Ottox, who flipped town. He then attempts to brush this off as "I wish you made better cases". As if you made any good ones either Ghost. On May 03 2012 23:19 ghost_403 wrote: I'm more inclined to believe Mattchew over Sentinel at this point. Looking back through his filter, he was pushing for, or at least suggesting, a StDaniels lynch through most of the game. I can't see scum pushing to lynch their KP for towncred. In addition to that, Risen has been playing scummy as fuck all game long. I doubt I could find a single page in his filter where he doesn't say something that doesn't make him look like either a terrible townie or scum. Mattchew's claim is consistent with my read on Risen. The decrease in scumminess that I saw from Sentinel was mostly due to him actually being moderately aggressive in pushing for an Ottoxlol lynch. Now that we know that Ottoxlol was a townie, this can very easily be attributed to scum being called out and forced to do something in the game. I would propose lynching Risen first, and taking it from there. @mattchew: That's the worst breadcrumb I've ever seen. If you think Mattchew is telling the truth, you lynch Sentinel. The only reason you wouldn't is if you think the person you're voting for is goon, which he is not if you believe Matt's claim. Not to mention suggesting st.daniels is scum is scummy. Actually pushing it is townie. Matt suggested it, making it look like he was scumhunting. But that will come later with the Mattchew Case. And as I've pointed out, Matt didn't actually push Risen until quite a bit after he "shot Risen". On May 04 2012 07:54 ghost_403 wrote: @paqman: I fully support this, and honestly, I need another couple of days to figure out which one of them is town. Sent's town game has been lackluster and scummy the whole time. Mattchew spends a lot of time advising the vig to shoot, which is thinking outloud if you believe his claim. I dunno what to make of it, but I think Risen is obviously scummy, and would be very happy with that lynch. We have Sent 'jail' BM again, which regardless of his claim leaves us in a pretty good location. I think lynching Risen is the best option. Sent, Mattchew, does this sound like a decent compromise to you both? Also, we need everyone in the town in on this, or the scum are just going to ninja vote this away from us. Do you actually think we have a few days? We are at LyLO. That means if we mislynch we lose. We can't afford compromises in LyLO. You're asking for all towns votes on neither Sent nor Matt. As far as I'm concerned, if we lynch today we should have a 50% chance at least. Asking for a smaller chance (as town) doesn't make sense. If you know Risen is town, it makes sense though. On May 04 2012 08:14 ghost_403 wrote: I've had a scum read on you all game, Risen. Don't believe me? Check my filter. Today, I am voting to lynch scum. As a bonus, it gives me more time to figure out which one of them is lying. The reason that I want a compromise is this. This is lylo, which means that if the town doesn't work together, it loses. I want a compromise so that the scum agree to work with us, and can't screw up our lynch at the last possible moment. Also, you're right. That post looks scummy as fuck. Don't blame you for pointing that out. as pointed out, lol. that's basically a scum claim imo. i hate scum claims but really? Saying "oh yeah that post was scummy, sorry bout that!" isn't townie. That's scum trying to cover up their mistakes. Town would say their mindset in saying those things, scum wouldn't. On May 04 2012 08:42 ghost_403 wrote: What I find most interesting is the fact that Risen isn't really pushing us to lynch either Sentinel or Mattchew. If he was really town, wouldn't he say "You two are stupid, obviously this one is scum"? After all, lynching a town Risen would lose the town the game. We have to get this lynch right, and Risen's not helping us do that. You aren't pushing either Sent or Matt either.... All this boils down to Ghost lynching every possible town and he is trying to lynch one now. Guess who he's voting now? Risen. PS we're at mylo, not lylo, so why don't we no-lynch? we'll have a smaller pool of players to choose scum from and it gives sent another chance to prove his claim true I can get down with a no lynch but I would bet almost everything that scum would hold their kill again leaving us in the exact same spot tomorrow | ||
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
On May 04 2012 13:53 johnnywup wrote: then we keep doing that until we have enough information to make an extremely well informed lynch, if scum keeps holding their lynch/being blocked. also i'd like sent to jail someone other than BM, assuming your claim is true, and don't tell anyone until the day post. so yeah, i'm down w/ a no-lynch ##unvote ##vote no-lynch so you want sent to set up a diff townie to be mislynched? this is a bad strategy | ||
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Mattchew
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Literally you learn nothing from wanting to see what sent does. I am down with a no-lynch to extend the conversation... in reality a no-lynch affords us no new info | ||
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i am going to sleep be back tommorrow | ||
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I will try to get home before the deadline, but I can't make any promises. Any questions you want me to answer, now would be the time | ||
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Mattchew
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this game has a shade of similarity to im a cop you idiot, because the set number of blues makes a scum counterclaim seemingly inevitable | ||
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Mattchew
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The mere fact you know this shows that they are meaningless towards alignment. Votes should be based on content of play, not on breadcrumbs Ghost you said you were pouring over the filters, and your only reason ends up being breadcrumbs. Thats weird | ||
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
On May 05 2012 06:12 ghost_403 wrote: In this game, there was really only one thing that stood out in Mattchew's filter. That fact was the fact that he spent a lot of the first two or three days directing the vigilante. If he really was the vig, why didn't he shoot earlier? He tells the town plenty of people to shoot, but never does until Night 3. He shot Risen for the scummy behavior that happend Day 2, no less. The wait here is also curious. I treated me being a vig in this game as if I was a 1 shot detective, because even if I hit scum, there was only a 50% chance of actually killing them. This is why I waited on using my shot, and also if mementoss was a JK and I shot who he jailed that would screw up everything as well. My reason for shooting risen was to (in my mind) confirm 2 players, (ottox and risen) as either scum or town. Turns out I played like an idiot and figured Risen being scum = Ottox being scum. Also, I waited on claiming because ottox was being lynched and my claim would just support this lynch. I wanted to make scum uncomfortable knowing that someone had shot Risen and them needing to act on this. Sent's roleclaim is actually really smart cause he can say that he jailed ottox, and then get town cred for ottox not flipping goon (or scum at all). I think I actually found some Risen breadcrumbing Vig, and I would bet the third member breadcrumbed something as well (maybe tracker or jk too). What could be Risen breadcrumbs + Show Spoiler + On April 23 2012 07:09 Risen wrote: No you twat. I'm not voting johnnywup because I'm not an idiot who thinks we can organize idiot townies like you onto him with so little time left. I'm forced to pick from a small pool of people who we can get votes on. I'm very intense, god... Don't know why I even came back to this. I'm just getting heated again and I'm going to get banned. and On April 26 2012 07:58 Risen wrote: EBWOP: See the deadline is in an hour. How many people do we really have that can vote right now? I just noticed stdaniel's ninja vote. I'm trying to figure out if he just quit the game and is doing the bare minimum to avoid modkill or he's just being lurker scum. To me it almost doesn't matter, though. I mean, very ill great... but he doesn't sound like he's ill anymore. I can't stand lurkers and I'm 100% willing to lynch him tomorrow. They're useless and we can't afford people lurking at this point. This applies to BKExe as well, though he didn't lurk vote so +1 for you big guy. If by day 3 your filter isn't filling 2 pages something is wrong. | ||
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thanks igrok for putting up with my bitching and not telling me to go fuck myself (which woulda been totally acceptable) thanks bluelightz for co-hosting this was the hardest game to play in ever | ||
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Mattchew
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On April 23 2012 02:11 Mattchew wrote: BM ninja voted, Daniel didn't.. he atleast attempted to explain his vote (albeit scummily as fuck) . When someone ninja votes you lynch them. Its basically a red check My scum picks so far are BM, Risen, Daniel and I would like to lynch/vig them in that order I was Town MVP | ||
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On May 05 2012 09:20 marvellosity wrote: You guys should be fucking ashamed of yourselves for believing matt's claim. Seriously, that's fucking awful. lol... you have no idea what your talking about. | ||
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On May 05 2012 09:28 marvellosity wrote: Just read the obsQT, I think no-one was in any doubt by about half an hour max after you claimed read the obsQT your thoughts are completely blinded by the fact that bluelightz told you guys that sent was JK when sent claimed. Also, if you can find 1 hole in my claim go ahead | ||
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On May 05 2012 09:29 marvellosity wrote: Except this one had a shit-ton of context surrounding it. lol no, you suck for voting VE | ||
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Mattchew
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please quote and ill show you that you are wrong | ||
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You can argue that I shoulda/coulda/woulda shot earlier but thats just you putting your own thoughts into my head. | ||
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On May 05 2012 09:37 marvellosity wrote: you would never shoot n3 -why because you would never shoot n3? It woulda either prevented a mislynch or provided the next 2 lynches. for a whole bunch of reasons sentinel would never have claimed when he did if he was mafia -Actually, if I was vig and had shot Risen and sent was scum his claim woulda been good scum play. it affords him town cred when ottox flips town and allows him to get the next day mislynch by holding KP and saying he jailed someone. you would never as townie haev allowed ottoxlol lynch when you had 2 confirmed scum, no matter how much you thought he was scum -wrong again... if I saw someone get last minute vote switch saved by scum, and wiggle out of a day 3 lynch, that would confirm them as scum to me.. I don't care how good you think you are at mafia, this would be the strongest "read" you would ever have Everything points to it being fake | ||
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Mattchew
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On May 05 2012 09:41 gonzaw wrote: Even if your claim "makes sense" if you were town, it also makes even more sense if you were mafia. Also Sent's claim doesn't make sense if he was mafia (I've already explained the reasons in the obs QT), therefore he was town and you were not. Also, I've said it before, but I had a feeling Risen made the last-minute switch to incriminate Ottox once he was lynched... ...not that he'd make the switch to gain more cred once Ottox was lynched. Still that was mindfucking. I think in reality because it made sense as town people should have just been looking at filters to make their reads. I should have been called out for soft defending against a St. Daniel Lynch but that never happened. In reality I think it was terrible scum hunting that killed town more than anything. also, risen's move was so stupid at the time, but worked out great | ||
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Mattchew
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On May 05 2012 09:44 marvellosity wrote: you would've shot earlier if you really felt that about risen gonzaw already explained if i'm wrong on point 3 you're bad, strongest read is irrelevant when you have 100% confirmed scum As town, I would assume that ottox was to be lynched day3 after a day2 last minute switch saved him. Ottox should have been lynched day3. I can't believe he wasn't. If I think someone is going to be lynched, why would I shoot them? edit* in this setup lynching goon is way more important than lynching GF's. It wasn't lylo so lynching a 99.9% scum read that could be goon > 100% confirmed GF.... The GF's really just add a number to mafia, keeping them alive in this setup doesn't actually do too much negative to town | ||
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Sureeee ^^ | ||
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Lynch me earlier d1 were super flimsy and bad (or they are gonna mislynch me as Town in the future)... Until day 3 I played more protown than any townie | ||
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On April 24 2012 09:39 gonzaw wrote: Final thoughts: Oh, and I don't think Mattchew is scum anymore, and I'd say you should treat these players as town: -Paqman -Mattchew -layabout -Janaan -Mementoss -Maybe ghost Of course put them under scrutiny every once in a while (specially if they survive til late-game), but I don't want any of them lynched soon AT ALL. Okay, I think that's all Sorry I meant cycle 1 | ||
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