EPTHi TL Mafia Forum
Newbie Mini Mafia IX
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Hi TL Mafia Forum | ||
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I think it's important to remember that this is a newbie game. From my observing of the last few newbie games, it seems everyone is quick to jump on newbie townie mistakes and make a scum read, and this gives the mafia a good chance to capitalise on the confusion and get an easy town lynch. I think it's important to bare this in mind when building cases, especially in the early stages where we have very little information to work with. @Nova, I agree with lurker lynch on Day 1, and am looking forward to seeing some posting activity. | ||
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On April 14 2012 23:55 Nova_Terra wrote: Yeah so thats pretty much what i said with more fluff. If you are going to agree with someone agree with them and move onto something else instead of posting a 1 paragraph flufffest like the above post. It's day 1, only a few posts in. I don't think jumping on people for what you consider fluff at this point is a good way to get the communication flowing. Give people a chance to see the day has started, let them get their initial thoughts and positions out there and then we might have something to work with. There is likely to be some repetition early on, but it's all we have to work with right now. If it continues, by all means I think you should call it out. | ||
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I think you should focus on your own contributions at this stage rather than repeating the same fluff line over and over, as all I see is someone creating a prescence for themselves without actually contributing. | ||
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@BlueyD - As it's been 24 hours with no post yet, I agree with your vote on era. ##Vote:era @era - What do you think of Nova's posts so far? | ||
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I do think it's odd that he wouldn't have read the rules (it's clearly stated on the front page). I'd like to see him add more to his very short filter. @Solohan - how do you respond to Nova reading your first post to be scummy? | ||
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Those that have posted and contributed very little so far, and who really need to add something asap in order to not fall under suspicion: Macheji Therapist. oneplus And, era. Era still hasn't posted, and is looking likely to be modkilled/replaced at this stage. I'll see if there is anything from him later in the day, and if not will remove my vote on him as no point wasting a vote on someone who is going to be modkilled. | ||
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I may be missing something, but I don't see how no lynches are possible? Voting is mandatory, and everyone must vote. That's how I interpret the rules anyway. Hopefully this can be clarified after Lazer's question. @oneplus - you have been lurking for quite some time now. What do you think about TheRavensName's stance on possibly lynching one of the people who've called for a no lynch vote? We need to hear from you. ##Vote: oneplus @Nova - Who is your most suspicious read so far? @Therapist. There is a lot that can be learned from a day 1 lynch. It just might take another day or two for the pieces to fit together. The more discussion we have from everyone, the more we can learn from a day 1 lynch. Which is why we need to put as much pressure as possible on the lurkers. So far I'm only getting the slightest scum reads from two people, and have nothing to base a case on. I'm hoping the activity will improve now after a quiet patch - it seems most people have checked in recently which is a good start. | ||
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## Unvote The case against Nova_Terra: - Nova_Terra's overly emphasised townie position: The case begins prior to the game even starting. Nova (who has been scum in previous games - I'd recommend a review of Newbie Mini Mafia VII ) is quick to distance himself and reinforce his town stance prior to the game even starting: Im awful town, so i need to work at it during my last newbie game (aka this one) He's telling us he's awful town, and that he will be working on it during this game. He is trying to reinforce his town position before the game has even started. One the game starts, his first post includes this line: Okay, thank god, not mafia :D This immediately made me suspicious, as I don't understand why someone who had received a town role would need to state this. The only motive I can determine for stating this is scummy. Nova said the following in response to Daymor who questioned this: I said that because ive been mafia the past two games and i didnt feel like dealing with the stress this time around. Again you try to distance yourself from the fact you were mafia in previous games ("you didn't feel like dealing with the stress this time around") however you have no choice over that. You may or may not have been given a role as mafia or town. I find the wording you used here to be very strange and is not the response I would've expected to Daymor's question. - Nova_Terra's posting without contributing: On its own I wouldn't say this means anything, and it's something I posted about earlier. But in combination with a few other things it becomes more significant. When you do a review of Nova_Terra's early filter, essentially he repeats the same stance he has on fluff posting, complains about lack of activity and votes/unvotes a few times. This is done over 14 posts, and makes him look like the most active person in the thread, but if you actually looks at what is included in all those posts, he is actually contributing very little. I find this to be mildly suspicious and it felt like he was trying to position himself as a town leader without actually contributing. - Nova_Terra's baseless accusation of Solohan50: I must admit I didn't look into this when it was initially posted, and it was only after a complete filter review that I really began questioning Nova's behaviour here. Nova stated the following: Also I find Solohan50s first post to be scummy. Interesting. Ok, what else does Nova say about this? Also I'm going to let Solohan50 find out what i find scummy about his own post and do something about it. If a vanilla townie looks at someones post and finds it scummy, theoretically another vanilla townie should be able to do the same. Im not gonna tell you how to defend yourself. So if I read this correctly, Nova finds Solohan50s first post scummy, and that because he's a vanilla townie and finds it scummy, another vanilla townie should be able to do the same. Right. I'm a vanilla townie, so let's look at Solohan50's first post for the smoking gun. On April 15 2012 00:46 Solohan50 wrote: Yeah, lynching lurkers isn't a terrible idea (it's not spectacular either though), especially if you make it known ahead of time. That (should) inspire everyone to post at least a little bit, giving us more information on Day 1 and hopefully leading to better lynches. With any luck though, everyone will be active and we can avoid having to lynch a lurker. If the lurker that gets lynched Day 1 is Town, then we gain almost no information, because they haven't posted anything. tl:dr Post, people! My read on Solohan50's first post. He has stated his thoughts on lurker lynching (not a terrible idea, but doesn't really love it either). He likes the fact you can use it to put pressure on people to post day 1, which will hopefully lead to a better (which I read as more informed) lynch. He then goes on to say lynching a townie that hasn't posted anything provides almost no information. Ok, so that's my read on his post. I've gone through it several times and don't feel like I'm missing anything here. It seems like a positive townie approach to me for a first post. What is it that Nova sees that I don't? What is his motivation for calling Solohan50 out based on this? I don't see a townie motivation for this, further increasing my suspicion. Nova also said the following: EBWOP: Same with His second post which pretty much is in the middle of the discussion and just asks a question instead od adding to said discussion Solohan50's second post asked a question on No Lynches. He also asked this question pre-game so doesn't look like it's something he decided on bringing up after he received his role PM. There has obviously been some confusion around no lynch since this game started (I felt like the rules were clear but I guess since it wasn't explicitly stated it has caused confusion), and based on that (and the subsequent discussions and clarification) I don't think his question is suspicious. *** I will add in relation to this that Solohan50 hasn't contributed a lot since, but in terms of this case against Nova_Terra it doesn't apply, as I'm referring to Nova's on Solohan50's first posts. Solohan50's lurky behaviour should be looked at seperately. Continuing on.... - Nova_Terra's very defensive responses to oneplus: This has happened since I did my filter review, and I haven't had a chance to go through this in as much detail as I'd like, but I have work to be done. I may re-visit this later if I see anything more after a further review. Nova claims an OMGUS reaction reaction to oneplus, which I don't really see. Oneplus has his suspicions of Nova based on his own read, and it would be good for him to elaborate more on this. However the point I focused on was the way Nova reacted. The defensive tone of his responses definitely do not sound like town, and the only motivation I can see for him posting that way is scummy. - Nova_Terra's possible accomplices: Based on my filter review, the two most likely accomplices to Nova_Terra: Lazermonkey and Crossfire99. The case against these two isn't strong, but I would recommend reading through their filter and looking at the way they support Nova on Solohan50. Also, if you look at the interaction between Nova and Lazer against oneplus, it is also very defensive and nature and shows them supporting each other once again. I think this adds to my suspicion of Lazer who, other than his blind support of Nova's stance against Solohan, has seemed like a good contributing townie. - Final thoughts on Nova_Terra: After going through all this, and reviewing Nova's filter looking at him posting as a townie, and posting as scum, the only motivation I can see for his approach thus far (on areas where he has contributed) is scum. This makes me as confident as I can be that he is a good target to vote on for day 1. ## Vote: Nova_Terra Final thoughts on oneplus - I agree on him being a bad townie, and he has certainly been targeted by Nova_Terra, which seems to be a good motivation for scum to target him and in a sense, further backs up my suspicions on Nova. So what do you all think? If you don't agree, where do you think my reasoning is wrong? How do you read Nova_Terra based on your own review of his behaviour and filter? | ||
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The fact that he continues in the same way once the game has started is why I pointed this out (and not that I think he knew prior to the game starting that he was going to roll mafia). | ||
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Minimal contributors at this stage, and they are either absent, or heavily lurking: Solohan Macheji TheRavensName If you don't see any merit in my case against Nova_Terra (and by association, Lazermonkey and Crossfire99 - and please explain why, and what you think of my reads), then voting on one of the above is as good an alternative for a day 1 lynch vote in my opinion. | ||
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On April 16 2012 21:20 Daymor wrote: EBWOP: @ Pure-SC2 I probably should have included this in my last post also. But another post from Nova that is bugging me is; First of all I have no idea as to who this post was aimed at, maybe Therapist? But to me this post gives me a bad vibe. It seems like quite an aggressive defense (in particular the first two lines), and the tone seems that of exasperation or aggression. I don't think you mentioned the post in your case, but what kind of impression does that post leave you with? Thanks for highlighting this Daymor, I did read the post when I did my filter review, but as I wasn't reading it "in-line" with the thread, I didn't look at the context, just the tone. And the tone is very defensive. After a review, I believe this post was in response to TheRavensName, who pointed out that he thought Nova was rather lynch happy - which at that point was 100% true as he was "pressure" voting without actually adding anything himself (part of the 14 initial posts he made which I commented on in my initial case against Nova). His response to this doesn't calmly state the nature of his pressure voting, but is a very defensive post and again he relates it back to the fact that he was scum in a previous game and how he's playing it different this time. This just adds to my initial suspicions. | ||
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The comments I made about your posts before the game started were expanded on in my EBWOP. They are applicable because you were already trying to distance yourself from your previous mafia roles, which is fine. But, then you continued using that same approach once the game started which immediately rang scummy to me. You haven't claimed to be a town leader, but from the outset of the day you placed yourself as the post monitor, telling us who was posting fluff, and how hard you were going to be on them, re-iterating the lack of activity (without contributing). That comes across to me as someone who is trying a little too hard to appear active. You already have my thoughts on that. Regarding your comment towards oneplus: Oneplus posted no real reason to suspect me that was good. That sounds a lot like you in regards to your suspicious of Solohan50, don't you think? We're still waiting for this insightful explanation as to why his first post was scummy. I've re-read oneplus's filter and agree with the assessment made by Lorant, that oneplus obviously doesn't speak english natively and as such his posts take a bit more reading. Even so, I can see that he does provide some reasoning as to why he suspects you: - Notes that Lazer and Nova are very firm to lynch someone - Picks up on the fact that Nova constantly refers to mafia role in previous games - Highlights Novas over reactive defensive posting to his suspicions - Picks up on the association between Nova and Lazer that I noticed also. * This is significantly more reasoning than you've given for your suspicions against Solohan50. Also, sick connection case. Nothing quite like suspecting people because they share a similar view in early game. It's not just a similar view, Lazer (and to a lesser extent Crossfire) supported you in your suspicions of Solohan50 without one shred of reasoning, just like you. Rather than offer any reasoning as to why you think there is no association between you, or even offering your reasoning for suspicions on Solohan, you take a further defensive stance without offering anything. At this stage, I don't have a scum read on Crossfire, only noted the association. I'll be looking at Lazer more closely as he has several things in his filter now that tend towards scum. Also, When did this go from lynching Lurkers to voting for people who actually contribute and provoke discussion? because you cant disagree that voting for someone who is creating discussion is a terrible idea with the state of the current town. For me, this occurred when I was able to build a case I had a reasonably high level of confidence in. Which is quite a sensible approach if you think about it. And voting for someone who is suspicious (for several reasons) is a great idea if you have that read on day 1. Using the fact that you've created discussion as a reason not to lynch you is not a defence. Also i love how everyone is jumping on the sick bandwagon. really good play This just sounds anti-town to me. I reviewed everyone's filter, and when I looked at my notes afterwards, I had you as the most suspicious based on the reasons already stated. I noticed that in the time I'd put that together, Oneplus and Daymor has posted a similar read. | ||
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Nova's made two comments regarding Solohan's second post. EBWOP: Same with His second post which pretty much is in the middle of the discussion and just asks a question instead od adding to said discussion My point about the second post is that he was here, and instead of adding to the discussion he just asks a question (that he had already asked in beginning). Solohan's second post: Are No Lynches even allowed in this game? If they're not, it's a bit of a moot point. - This was in direct response to Crossfire99's post before his, which was talking about no lynches on day 1. His post does add to what was being discussed at that very moment. It doesn't seem scummy in the slightest. @Nova_Terra - I've reviewed your analysis of Solohan50's first post. I don't understand your reasoning, it's his first post, he's stating his opinion, why is having an opinion that someone else has had bad? He seems to get across quite clearly to me what he thinks, and I provided my interpretation of that in my original case against you. @BlueyD - I notice in your analysis of my case against Nova you didn't mention his aggresively defensive stance, which has been used against three people at least so far. This is not generally considered townie behaviour and was a key part of what led me to raising a case against Nova. When you add all the elements together, I asked myself what the motivation for his posts were. Based on my review, and subsequent case, if Nova is town, he is a terrible townie (3 people finding suspicious behaviour for different reasons in the space of a day). I believe he's scum, and unless anything more comes to light will keep my vote on him. | ||
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In the space of 12 hours, Nova's tone has changed completely. From aggressive defense (when he was only aware oneplus suspected him), to a long period of silence and then muted responses to my initial case, to a reasonably patient defense that seemed reasonable but didn't really cover off or satisfy my case against him, but definitely won some people over. I still have him pegged as scum, especially after his classic scum slip. Here is his quote: At this point, can i ask all non me voters and me voters to switch over to either Crossfire or Solohan50? otherwise, im dead for sure and its damn hard to read anhing from a bunch of 1 votes. - What he meant to say was "switch over to either oneplus or Solohan50", but for some reason said Crossfire instead. Why would he have said Crossfire? Because Crossfire is his scum ally, and he was in discussions with Crossfire at the time he posted. This is the most classic case of a scum slip possible. Now how did Nova respond to this? Did he say a correction straight away? Nope. He didn't say a thing until TheRavensName commented on it, saying it was strange. Nova's response: Yep it looks hella weird. probably because my mood changed from pissed to hopeful in a space of like 30 seconds That is a damning as it gets. Crossfire was around at this time as well, because he was posting in the thread also. I stand by my case against Nova, and I add what I've posted above to it. In addition to this, in my initial case I commented that I believed his accomplises were Lazermonkey and Crossfire. I'm even more convinced of this now. Look at Lazermonkeys filter around the time I made my case against Nova and linked him to Lazer. Lazer vote flips in an absolutely classic attempt to distance himself from his scum partner. They then go into a back and forth about it, further attempting to distance themselves, but what do you know - they both have their votes on oneplus. As does Crossfire. When it looked safe to bandwagon oneplus, they did it. I want to go into Lazer's posts in more detail, and I will if I get the chance tomorrow. But the filter is there for you to read it, and I encourage you to. I've had a brief read through Crossfire's filter and the last bunch of posts are an absolute mess. He seems the least scummy of the three, but Nova's scum slip convinced me I was on the right track. oneplus is town. I'm convinced of it, and you've bandwagoned onto it and played right into the mafia's hand. | ||
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On April 16 2012 18:51 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm convinced that oneplus is a townie atm. His posts are far too stupid in order to be a scum. He might not understand it himself, but he is actually screaming to get lynched atm. Please think about what you piost in the future, if you really are a townie. ... However, now he's voting to lynch him. I want to go through Lazers posts in more detail but don't really have the time so I'm just going to quote the most telling parts right now. | ||
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On April 17 2012 06:41 TheRavensName wrote: Now I find your vote strange. You haven't posted anything aside from this really. Any explanation for the vote? Completely agree with you here TheRavensName. @Macheji - you need to explain why you voted for Nova. You have been absent, and turn up right before the deadline so you had better speak up. | ||
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It's a sad night, knowing an innocent townie was lynced and that it could have been prevented. I've spent some time reviewing how oneplus ended up getting lynched and have the following analysis. The initial pressure vote on oneplus - voted in order to get more post activity: - Pure-SC2 (Pressure vote - removed later when I made my case against Nova and voted for him) - BlueyD (Pressure vote - removed but stated he was still suspicious, moved vote to TheRavensName as he was lurking) ======= Following these votes, oneplus identifies a link between Lazermonkey and Nova which provokes a strong reaction from them both and a very interesting back and forth conversation occurs here. I'd recommend everyone re-read this knowing now that oneplus is a townie. It was after this exchange that I posted my case against Nova, and had independently identified a link between Lazer and Nova. Once the dust settled on Lazermonkeys quick vote flip onto Nova (following my case and association between Nova and Lazer), he initiates the vote that leads to oneplus's lynching. ======= The votes on oneplus that lead to his lynching: - Lazermonkey (April 17 2012 04:04): This is the initial vote on oneplus following the pressure vote. Summary of his reasoning is: - Oneplus gets super mad accusing both him and Nova with no reasoning (Ed: he quotes oneplus saying that Nova's defending doesn't make sense at all, something I agree with. KEYNOTE: In Lazer's post he responds to this quote as if oneplus said it to him, when he actually said it to Nova. Why is he responding to something said to Nova? This post needs further analysis). - That oneplus will think of him and Nova as scum regardless of what they say - Quotes FourFace/Lorant's bizarre purposefully silly post (which was from his smurf account) as evidence that other people think oneplus is strange. (Ed. Lorant, did you think oneplus was strange?) - Concludes that he is not sure whether oneplus is bad or scum, makes an association between oneplus and Lorant and states that lynching oneplus would give info about Lorant (though calls him durant which is confusing). - TheRavensName (April 17 2012 05:17): Little over an hour after Lazermonkeys vote described above, TheRavensName votes oneplus. His reasoning: - "Sorry One... You seem to be the more likely of a scum then the others with votes in my eyes... and at least Nova has contributed enough to warrant being spared the first lynch in my opinion." - Therapist (April 17 2012 05:25): Less than 10 minutes later, Therapist adds his vote to Oneplus. His reasoning: - He does not wish Nova to be lynched because he is bringing out information and is good for town. - Oneplus has contributed nothing but a bandwagon on Nova Terra (Ed: Did you even read his posts? He suspected Nova before I posted my case and identified a link between Nova and Lazer) - Nova_Terra (April 17 2012 05:28): Three minutes later, Nova adds his vote to oneplus. His reasoning: - "okay, i will relent on solohan for now to consolidate a decent vote." - Crossfire99 (April 17 2012 05:45): 17 minutes later, Crossfire adds his vote to oneplus (it's not bold, but obviously he's voting for oneplus. His reasoning: - He doesn't think oneplus is scum, but he also doesn't think Nova is scum. Since Nova has been actively contributing, he is going to vote oneplus to save Nova. (Ed: Interesting choice of words if you read his post. He is voting for someone he doesn't believe is scum to save Nova). - BlueyD (April 17 2012 05:49): 4 minutes later, BlueyD provides a vote count, and adds his vote to oneplus. His reasoning: - It's between Nova and oneplus (useless keeping his vote on anyone else), and he's got more suspicions on oneplus than Nova. - Daymor (April 17 2012 05:58): 9 minutes later, Daymor adds his vote to oneplus. His reasoning: - He has his suspicions on Nova, but thinks he's contributed enough to spare him from a day 1 lynch. - He consolidates the vote on oneplus to prevent any last minute switching. (Ed. He doesn't say he has any suspicions on oneplus). - Crossfire99 (April 17 2012 06:00): 2 minutes later Crossfire unvotes oneplus, and then votes him again in the same post. - What on earth is this? His vote is already on oneplus and I can't for the life of me work out what this means, other than it looks very odd to me. I'd be interested in what anyone else thinks on this. Note: The time of this post was right at the expected deadline at the time it was made - the mods clarified that it was actually another 2 hours until the deadline. - TheRavensName (April 17 2012 07:47): 13 minutes before the deadline, TheRavensName removes his vote from oneplus, and votes Nova. His reasoning: - At this point he believes Lazer and Nova are working together, and changes his vote unless something else can convince him in the next 15 minutes. The day ends, and innocent townie oneplus is lynched with 6 votes. Of the 6 people that voted for him: - Four have stated no scum related reason for voting oneplus (Daymor, Crossfire, Nova, Therapist) - One is not sure whether he is scum or bad town (Lazermonkey) - One is more suspicious of him than of Nova (BlueyD) Of the 6 people that voted for him, 4 of them did not have any scum related reasons for voting oneplus. That is a very disappointing realisation. He certainly wasn't a lurker when you consider his input over the 59 (?) hour day. Of the 6 people that voted for him, I have strong town leanings towards 2 of them, mild town leanings towards 1 of them, mild scum leanings on 1 of them and strong scum readings on 2 of them. That's my analysis of what happened that led to oneplus's lynch. He was an easy target because of his poor English. Please go and re-read his posts, look at his interactions with others and do your own analysis, then post it for everyone to see. | ||
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On April 17 2012 20:17 TheRavensName wrote: I gotta say.. personally I didn't think his English was that bad in my opinion. I never had that much trouble understanding what he said anyways. Maybe my grasp is weak enough for that though. It did feel a lot like it was just a very crutch excuse when I voted for him at the time, like it was: well I can't post that much cause I'm not very good at English... but I know several people commented it wasn't that bad and had no issue understanding him. Its part of the reason I had those initial scum readings on him. Yes, but your scum readings were wrong - he was innocent town. Also, you didn't make any comments at all about the voting on oneplus. Is that really all you have to add following the day 1 lynch? | ||
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Where is everyone else? Why has no-one else spoken up about the events of the night? | ||
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The key lurkers right now based on my filter review: Therapist Macheji Lazermonkey (since his vote on oneplus) Crossfire (since the night post) Also TheRavensName, Lorant and BlueyD. You really need to contribute more, including some of your own analysis and scum reads. Spend the time to read peoples filters and make your own opinions. | ||
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My case against Nova: I still believe in it, but he has done a good job defending himself once he changed his approach, and has enough support that he's not likely to get lynched at this point. I will be highlighting any further suspicious behaviour from Nova as I see it. Qudos to Nova for adjusting his approach. Putting my case against Nova aside for now.... The case against Lazermonkey I won't be as detailed with this as I was in my case against Nova. However I will state the main reasons why I find him suspicious. Soft support of Nova with no stated reasoning - Agrees with Nova's stance on Solohan without stating any reasoning. This in itself isn't condemning, but was what initially had me noting him as suspicious. Lazermonkey's vote flip following my case against Nova (which included a link to him): - This ia stereotypical scum behaviour. Once a link to Nova was raised (regardless of whether Nova is scum or town), Lazer flipped on him very quickly, going from supporting him, to voting for him to be lynched. - During the post he made where he switched vote to Nova, he stated he thought Nova's early game was good - then why is he voting for him? - He made sure to state the possibility that I might be scum, even though he liked my case against Nova. He is positioning himself to be able to play this out either way, which I find suspicious. - What is his motivation for this statement? Atm I think the most interesting lynch would in fact be Nova. Not because he is confirmed scum in any way, but because of the possible information we could be given. If he flips town, we really need to think about Pure intention with his post. - If you are looking for scum like behaviour, this is it. It's not some random read based on gut feel, this is based on how he reacted when the pressure of being linked to someone who had a case made against them. Leads a lynch vote against oneplus, even after stating he thinks he is a townie - Some quotes from Lazer about oneplus: I'm convinced that oneplus is a townie atm. His posts are far too stupid in order to be a scum. I wasn't even pushing the lynch against him. I even said that I only thought he was a bad townie - He then leads the vote against oneplus anyway. - Also makes a connection between oneplus and Lorant as "imo both him and durant is acting really strange" (Durant actually meaning Lorant). This was because Lorant offered to help with oneplus's english, which actually seemed townie to me. Other than a comment to the admins, his filter has remained completely silent since voting for oneplus. Lazermonkey has moved to number 1 on my scumlist. Nova is still leaning strong scum for me, and would be my second choice to lynch. | ||
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Crossfire is 3rd on my scum read at this time, and of the three is my least strongest read. However there are a few things that stand out, so I'm putting them out there. Switched vote to oneplus to "save" Nova - This essentially relates to Nova, but I found Crossfire's choice of words suspicious when he flipped his vote to oneplus. Ugh...this really sucks. I don't think oneplus is scum, but I also don't think nova is scum. Since you have been actively contributing Nova, I am going to vote for oneplus to save you. Sorry, oneplus. Crossfire's phantom vote at the "original" deadline for day 1 - I found this extremely odd. Right at the original deadline (before the admin realised the mistake and added 2 hours), Crossfire made a post Unvoting and Voting oneplus. (please review this yourself) - This is after he already has a perfectly formatted, bold post voting for oneplus (made at 5:47 - i.e., 13 minutes earlier) - Why is this post made? Is it a mistake? Was he meant to unvote oneplus and move it to someone else but messed it up? While I can't make a solid read here it does ring suspicious to me. What do you think? His filter has been silent since the end of day 1. | ||
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On April 17 2012 14:21 Nova_Terra wrote: Apologies for clutter but i need a third post before school. At this point i would urge a medic or jailkeeper to think about protecting Pure. As it stands, there are high chances of his death that stem from him making cases, and him tunneling me. This post is scummy, all it does is add confusion while trying to make it look like you actually care about my fate (regardless of what alignment you are or what you actually think). If town has a medic or jailkeeper, they will base their decisions on their own reads as they should. No one should be trying to direct them and doing so is a scum tell. This is scummy and adds confusion because: - If the medic/jailkeeper read you as scummy (and let's say you are town), that means they would not follow your advice and look to protect someone else so it's achieved nothing other than adding a whole bunch of confusion. - If the medic/jailkeeper read you as scummy (and you are scummy), that means they would not follow your advice and look to protect someone else so it's achieved nothing other than adding a whole bunch of confusion. - If the medic/jailkeeper read you as town (and you're actually scum), they will follow your advice while you/mafia take down someone else. - If the medic/jailkeeper read you as town (and you are town), they will follow your advice while the mafia know you aren't mafia and hit someone else So what is your motivation for this post? | ||
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My scum reads: Lazermonkey Nova_Terra (Needs to post more) Crossfire (Needs to post more) My null reads: Therapist (needs to post more) Macheji (needs to post more) Solohan50 (needs to post more) TheRavensName (needs to post more) My town reads: Daymor BlueyD (needs to post more) Other notes: I had Lorant leaning town but I'm just not sure about his latest posts. Needs analyisis and we need more people posting. There is so much lurky behaviour right now. It's a real shame. | ||
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My scum reads: Lazermonkey (Needs to post more) Nova_Terra Crossfire (Needs to post more) | ||
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I agree with you on the lurker problem we have, though it's good to see Solohan's input today and think he had some good analysis there. Of the three other lurkers (Macheji, Therapist, TheRavensName), the only one I have a slight read on is TheRavensName. I haven't looked at this closely, but am aware he switched votes out late when it didn't make a difference, and voted Nova while not being sure of me - which seems like a strange thing to do. I'm really not sure about a lurker vote right now, as we have several other actual leads to go on. We are into day2, we've lost 2 town and I'm not sure we are in a position to lynch someone we don't have a read on. I've not included Lazer there, but he hasn't posted since his oneplus vote, and is lurking hard right now. It makes me think someone has told him to stop posting in order to get out of the spotlight which further adds to my suspicion. Nova stated he thought that this made him seem more town. @Nova, why is this? | ||
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One thing we know, he is not a newbie and is playing under a smurf account (as he was previously FourFace). The FourFace post looks accidental, but I think we have to keep in mind that he might have had some reason for intentionally posting from that account and outing his "smurf". Either way, he is not a newbie. I don't know anything about his history as "FourFace", but Nova seemed to know the name and have some association with it. Is this relevant? No idea. @Nova, maybe you could tell us what your feel is towards FourFace? Lorants initial posts: - Nothing much going on here, favours a lurker lynch, recommends keeping a journal, kinda fluffy really. Makes a good point on Nova's stance on Solohan which I didn't register prior to this review Contributes to day 1 vote: - First post of real substance is a vote for Crossfire. Mainly based on gut feel, and due to Crossfires number of posts on the no-lynch policy and sheeping Nova on Solohan. Says he will remove his vote if Crossfire adds a single valid argument about Solo being scummy. He then makes his FourFace post (which he doesn't realise until Nova points it out) - This post raises the left field suggestion of the council, and he drops the names of who he sees in this council and again he's essentially attempting to lead this here as he states "Our" first order if business shall be to review his suspicions of Crossfire. - I've gotta admit, I didn't take this post seriously as I thought it was just a ridiculous throw away post to provoke some reaction and only revisited it once I realised he was actually serious. I really don't know how to read it. - His explanation for smurfing is that he wanted to move away from his FourFace meta (doing crazy stuff to make people believe he's town). He then contributes some analysis and response to my case on Nova, and fingers Lazer early on - This is after Daymar and I had posted suspicions on Lazer - Advises all players to not follow someone who posts a lot as a leader - Condemns Lazer for calling Solohan scummy without having gathered enough evidence to help town make an opinion on him. Recommends everyone to prepare a statement and post it 2-3 minutes before daybreak - Good advice I think, but this is quite an interesting post to note based on what occurs later Personally states me as Scummy, doesn't elaborate and states it could be just a gut feeling. - Implies that while he finds me scummy, he thinks the way I post should be encouraged so he is willing to compromise his personal option of me for the sake of empowering discussion. No further details provided on why he finds me scummy. @Lorant, what do you find me scummy? Lorant gets into a back and forth with Nova - and this back and forth needs further analysis I think. - Some interesting points here, but he comes across quite melodramatic and is set on his council idea, and arbitrarily adjusts who is/isn't in it. - Seems to be trying to lead people into the council idea (while stating he doesn't want Nova to be considered a leader anymore). Interesting to remember here that he advised everyone earlier to not follow someone who posts a lot as a leader. - Blames Nova/Lazer for the lynch on oneplus. This is reasonable to me based on what happened. Lorant provides his night statement - This is a joke and a poor joke at that. I'm really not sure how to take this, and even more so I'm not sure how he intended it to be taken, - After requesting everyone to prepare a statement, and stating himself he is preparing his own statement, this is an insult to the town I feel. Lorant provides some analysis - I found this interesting, as he had some different angles for looking at things. - His points on why Crossfire was taken out were good, specifically the bluesniping section. - Adds more confusion though with his comments about how he made a case against Crossfire and how that looks bad for him, then goes on to say how because he's pointing this out that he could have masterminded it all to trick us. - Fingers Solohan Finally - a strange post about the council - Again trying to lead into the council (he's set on this idea), offering a be in or be out stance. Overall, I find there is way too much smoke and mirrors around Lorant right now and it makes me feel suspicious towards him. I definitely had an early town reading against him but I don't any more. His council idea actually has some merit for me, and can see why doing something like this may provide a clearer way to lead voting, but its based on the assumption that even if a scum member is in there, there will be more town members making the scum element less influential. But what if it includes 2 scum? or 3? It sets up a chance for them to lead the voting under the guise of the council and as such I don't think it's the right approach. Lorant, for me, you need to cut the smoke and mirrors, stop messing us around and play straight. I'll be keeping a closer eye on your filter.smurf | ||
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On April 18 2012 20:59 Macheji wrote: Oh man, 9 pages in and i have a full paper of notes. Most of them on Nova_Terra and Lazermonkey. I saw an obvious connection between the two of them. Share briefly with Pure-Sc2 , but tbh i find Pure-SC2 very ''town'' atm , not sure what that was about ( ganging on solohan w/o any evidence ) . I have to decide if i should make a list with everybody or just post my scum conclusion and post a case vs 1,2 people. What do you guys prefer ? Go through it all and make your own decision. That should be based on what you think would be most beneficial to town. | ||
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Solohan, what do you have to say towards the suspicions against you? | ||
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I never accused Solohan of being scum, I asked him what he thought of Nova saying his first post sounded scummy. Also, I voted for oneplus as a pressure vote (as he was lurking at the time), which I removed when I made my case against Nova. You'll need to get going on your reading, as things have moved on a long way from where you're up to. | ||
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Of the 6 people that voted for him: - Four stated no scum related reason for voting oneplus (Daymor, Crossfire, Nova, Therapist) - One is not sure whether he is scum or bad town (Lazermonkey) - One is more suspicious of him than of Nova (BlueyD) Of these 6, one was confirmed town (Crossfire), and two I have leaning town (Daymor and BlueyD). Including TheRavensName (who vote switched off Oneplus 13 minutes before the deadline), that leaves 4 others who voted for him leading to his lynch, and I believe likely includes at least 2 mafia. These 4 are: Lazer, Nova, Therapist and TheRavensName. I note that Solohan (who is generating heat at the moment for his mostly lurkerish behaviour) was never part of the vote on Oneplus - he voted for Nova and kept it on him. | ||
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The voting rules on the front page are very clear to me. 4. You may not vote for yourself. You may not vote for anyone dead or outside the game. 5. This game uses Plurality Lynch. Whomever has the most votes at the end of the day is lynched. In the event of a tie, the player who received the most votes first will be lynched. 6. Voting is mandatory. You may NOT abstain. There is no mention of an option to vote no lynch, so there is not much more to say here. I stated what I believed to be true and I stand by it. Regarding the night post, I wanted to get my analysis of oneplus's lynching across so that town had as much information to work with as possible. I figured I was a good target for a mafia kill so it made sense to me. And yes, I wanted people posting. I wanted to get as much info out there as possible for the towns benefit, not to purposefully put everyone in danger like you assumed in your post. | ||
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My comments on your case against Macheji: - I think if we take him at his word regarding his laptop issues (which true to his word he's posting more now), then it looks pretty similar to his Bastard mafia filter. - Your second point focuses on his contribution in this game so far, and I don't get much from your analysis here. He has a scum read on Nova and sticks with it, and asks a question about what he should post. I agree with you that he shouldn't be asking what to contribute, and I stated that to him pretty soon after he posted, which he subsequently followed so no issue for me there. - His analysis post about his reads was a bit frustrating for me, because it was only based on the first 10 pages and the thread had moved on a lot from that point. The biggest notes I had from this is that he made some factual errors in his review, but felt to me like it came from rushing things and not looking into things properly, rather than scummy. - It looks like you misread the quotes under your Alarm Bells section - do you see that? @Macheji - My comments to you would be to take a bit more time over your posts, and only state something that you know is true (and can back it up with quotes). There are a few things you've stated so far that are flat out wrong and it really affects your credibility. I think you've raised some good points regarding Nova, specifically about the agreeable nature of his posts, something Nova himself considered scummy in Solohan's first post. Also, your mention of him taking credit for "saving" me was interesting to point out. His whole attitude about directing blues and his response to my reading of it didn't satisfy me, and you rightly highlighted his smug response once it was revealed Crossfire was killed. @Nova - You keep making these veiled threats about how defending yourself is preventing yourself from making longer analysis posts. Well, you keep doing things that raise peoples suspicions of you, so it's your own fault really. And if you genuinely are town, you should be focused on scumhunting anyway and posting your own analysis of your scum reads as a matter of priority! The fact that you are so focused on your own defence (while holding back on your own analysis) is suspicious in itself. I've got a lot more to say, but am going to take some time to process a few of the other posts. A quick note on the Therapist: His only real statements this game was to vote for Oneplus, to say he thinks Nova is bringing out a lot of information, and that he doesn't like the council idea. He hasn't posted a single read on anyone else, nor any analysis. | ||
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There is so much confusion, trolling and general chaos in Lorants posts. I had a town leaning read on him prior to the FourFace disclosure, and from there it's just gone weird. What is the motivation behind his posts? I think he gets his enjoyment from throwing our curve balls and confusion. At the moment I feel we are all some mild amusement for Lorant and he doesn't seem to really care either way. Could be town, could be scum. I don't know. Definitely a person of suspicion for me, purely due to the chaos. Did anyone actually check out the play list he linked which meant "I didn't really have anything to post at that time as I was busy with my audio mixing and other stuff that seemed more interesting at that time." ? I did. It included 5 songs, the original diablo town theme song overlayed with another song (which together sounded terrible by the way), and then 4 other songs, one I recognised from my commodore 64 days. I feel like this is one big troll. | ||
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Lazermonkey remains my most suspicious read, and as such I will add to my original case on Lazermonkey, the details of which can be found here: + Show Spoiler + On April 18 2012 07:59 Pure-SC2 wrote: I'm not sure what is going to happen as we flip into the next day, so I'm going get my reads out there so everyone is clear on my stance and they can do what they want with it. My case against Nova: I still believe in it, but he has done a good job defending himself once he changed his approach, and has enough support that he's not likely to get lynched at this point. I will be highlighting any further suspicious behaviour from Nova as I see it. Qudos to Nova for adjusting his approach. Putting my case against Nova aside for now.... The case against Lazermonkey I won't be as detailed with this as I was in my case against Nova. However I will state the main reasons why I find him suspicious. Soft support of Nova with no stated reasoning - Agrees with Nova's stance on Solohan without stating any reasoning. This in itself isn't condemning, but was what initially had me noting him as suspicious. Lazermonkey's vote flip following my case against Nova (which included a link to him): - This ia stereotypical scum behaviour. Once a link to Nova was raised (regardless of whether Nova is scum or town), Lazer flipped on him very quickly, going from supporting him, to voting for him to be lynched. - During the post he made where he switched vote to Nova, he stated he thought Nova's early game was good - then why is he voting for him? - He made sure to state the possibility that I might be scum, even though he liked my case against Nova. He is positioning himself to be able to play this out either way, which I find suspicious. - What is his motivation for this statement? - If you are looking for scum like behaviour, this is it. It's not some random read based on gut feel, this is based on how he reacted when the pressure of being linked to someone who had a case made against them. Leads a lynch vote against oneplus, even after stating he thinks he is a townie - Some quotes from Lazer about oneplus: - He then leads the vote against oneplus anyway. - Also makes a connection between oneplus and Lorant as "imo both him and durant is acting really strange" (Durant actually meaning Lorant). This was because Lorant offered to help with oneplus's english, which actually seemed townie to me. Other than a comment to the admins, his filter has remained completely silent since voting for oneplus. Lazermonkey has moved to number 1 on my scumlist. Nova is still leaning strong scum for me, and would be my second choice to lynch. BlueyD added the following additional analysis on Lazermonkey: + Show Spoiler + Pure’s case on Lazer is very good in my opinion. Just want to add something on the whole Nova-Lazer connection: - Nova is the first of the Nova-Lazer pair to agree to lurker lynch - Nova is the first to call Solo scummy - Nova has his vote on macheji when Lazer puts his on the same player - Nova asks Solohan to find his own suspicious behavior, Lazer says Solo should respond - When oneplus calls them out, Lazer is the one who first turns on the other. These aren’t really buddies. This is Lazer trying to ride on Nova’s wave, and he gets off the wave right as Nova gets suspicious in some people’s eyes. This is not something we can really hold against Nova in my opinion. This is certainly something that makes Lazer suspicious. Lazermonkey has made one posting contribution since leading the lynch vote on Oneplus, I've included this here: + Show Spoiler + On April 19 2012 04:59 Lazermonkey wrote: Sorry for inactive for some time now. First of, I realise that my play have been quite suspicious up untill this point. I don't really know how to response to this tho. Some of you may not like that I blame my inexperience, but it does play a factor in here. This is in fact my first game ever of forum mafia. As for my voteswitch on oneplus, after Pure's post about Nova I was overwhelmed. I thought there was a very big chance of Nova being scum at that point. But I really liked his defense and he had been contributing as oposed to oneplus. At the same time oneplus never failed to amaze me with loads of scummy posts. I still wasn't quite sure whether he was a bad town or actually scum and at that point where I voteswitched, I was basically fliping a coin in order in order to decide which one I would go for. I also didn't like the way everyone seemed to bandwagon Nova so easy, althought admittedly I was one of thoose who voted for in the beginning. Now as for my own scumreads, here we go: Macheji - started the game out as a lurker, has a couple of posts which doesn't contribute at all(which doesn't tell to much because it was just a few hours into the game). Then he doesn't say anything for a long time. Obviously this was due to his computer, as a don't really think you would lurk so hardcore that you are basically minutes from being replaced. He then puts his vote on Nova, which doesn't have an impact at all as it made the vote go from 6-3 to 6-4. His resoning behind this vote was that he didn't like the way Nova pressured with his votes in the early game, found in this post:+ Show Spoiler + On April 17 2012 09:46 Macheji wrote: Fine, i'll post my reasons for the vote. Didn't really want to because the night is comming and the last time i accused somebody at the start of the night i got killed. Here is what i wrote earlier but wanted to keep it to myself until the end of the night I'll catch up on everything and start making cases. I voted for Terra because in my opionion he seems to be trying to hard. The vote/unvote thing bothered me from the start. The matter of fact is that in the beggining it had a positive effect, but in time that kind of posts only start turning people against eachother. I noticed that at a point almost everybody was accusing eachother for various reasons and the conversation went nowhere. More than this people started forming small groups. And i find this a very unhealthy behavior town-wise. In my opinion this was all caused by Nova_Terra. I don't know if it was on purpose or not, but the effect was negative nonetheless. More than this, i saw a post in wich he said ( correct me if i'm wrong here, i went thru everything kinda fast ), that in the last game he got killed for beeing to silent as a mafia. Now his behavior is not closer to normal, but it's the exact same opposite. I think he got mafia again and he tries to act compl different expecting a tottaly different reaction from the people. From what i've noticed, he is not really scum-hunting, he is not thinking on building a case and going after someone that he really belives is mafia, but rather he goes after everybody managing to only create dubt against everybody. Now, that was the reasoning behind my vote. But now that i've read your case-post i am alot more sure of my vote. If i don't die tonight, i am voting for him again. Some strange things are found in this post such as: Now, that was the reasoning behind my vote. But now that i've read your case-post i am alot more sure of my vote. If i don't die tonight, i am voting for him again. Not sure what to think about this. "if I don't die tonight" could be a possible scumslip. And the fact that he was so willing to vote against Nova again seems strange, why would you decide who to vote for now, when it is almost 72h before next lynch? Another pearl I found in this post was this Small line: More than this, i saw a post in wich he said ( correct me if i'm wrong here, i went thru everything kinda fast ), that in the last game he got killed for beeing to silent as a mafia. Very instresting post. Nova even himself claimed that he is spamming alot as mafia, which is easily confirmed if you check his post history. I guess It's possible that he actually was going through everything very fast and missed this. But another possibility is that this post was a way of trying to spread false rumors about Nova with the possibilty of falling back by saying: "Oh, I must have missread that". Not to long ago he posted a long post about most in this game. This post was good in the way that it did show his opinions on several persons. However, it was more of a summary than anything else and didn't add much to the discussion. Also I think his logic was flawed for in some ways, for example giving Therapist (++) only for saying he didn't want to misslynch. And I'm not just saying that cuz I'm mad that I got (----) : ). As you may have noticed I have been refering to Nova in alot of cases. Say what you want about him, he does create some good discussions. As for other honorobel mentions: Therapist - lurking like a boss atm. Said he liked long posts, but is yet to post one himself. Only playing safe cards, could be because he his scum, could be because he is scared townie. Nova - I'm leaing towards town in him. I think he is contributing alot. I also liked Fourfaces/Durants post on that the kill on Crossfire somewhat proves that Nova is innocent because Cross unsure of whether Nova was scum or townie. The following is my take on his post here: - Apologises for inactivity - Confesses that his play has been suspicious, and blames it on inexperience. - Didn't like the way everyone bandwagon'd Nova even though he did it himself * These points are essentially his response to all the suspicion against him at this stage, and I don't believe they go near addressing those suspicions against him. Provides his scumreads: - Mostly focused on Macheji, and how he doesnt like Macheji's case against Nova. Does quote the point where Macheji was wrong about Nova's previous - Highlights Therapists lurky behaviour (something I very much agree with) - States he is leaning town on Nova, though I don't get his statement where he says that Lorants post on the Crossfire kill somewhat proves Nova is innocent. I believe this is a miss-read, as Lorant was saying that he believed the mafia led kill on Crossfire was done in part because Crossfire potentially provided a subtle confirmation that one of the Mafia (Nova in this instance) was town - which is the opposite of what Lazer thought it meant. * He references Nova many times in this post. There is a chance that he is just terrible town, who panicked when he got linked with Nova and reacted to it, then inadvertently led a lynch on someone he considered town before disappearing due to the heat he was under. I have made note of Therapists lurky behaviour earlier today, he is flying way under the radar, so I do agree with Lazers comments on him. But, in terms of my scum reads to date, he rates highest and I feel that in lynching Lazer, we'd be lynching based on a solid set of reasoning - which seems logical to me. So, based on that I'm voting for him. ##Vote: Lazermonkey | ||
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Not a lot to take from it, other than he brings up the fact I did (and continue to) find Nova suspicious. This doesn't affect my vote on him. | ||
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Solohan then Lazer. Then right before the night post you state: 1. Lazer 2. TheRavensName 3. BlueyD/Lorant. You say a lazer lynch would be the best option if you died during the night. Then at the start of this day you voted Solohan. Now you make a case and switch to BlueyD. So, what happened to your suspicions of Lazer (your previous number 1) and Solohan (who you've been on since his first post)? Especially when a vote for Lazer is already well established? Why are you now more suspicious of BlueyD than you are of Lazer? | ||
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I'm not sure what we do with this right now. What does everyone think? | ||
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It's hard to disagree with the fact he vote switched the moment he was linked with you and a good case was made against you. It's hard to disagree with the fact he led the vote on oneplus, even after stating several times he thought he was town. It's hard to disagree with the fact that he disappeared after making the vote against oneplus, and that he didn't offer any real defence to the suspicious against him when he re-appeared. And you're now reading him as town I take it? Based on this quote that seems to be the case: They're going for the easy townie. Interesting. | ||
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On April 20 2012 01:12 Nova_Terra wrote: Yes, as i said, These are such bad moves i cant actually comprehend that a mafia would choose to do that. Well, call me crazy, but I want to push for a vote on the person with the most suspicious behaviour so far. | ||
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You don't have to agree with my case on him, but I'm basing it on what I can establish from everything I've read so far. It's a solid, tangible lead based on his behaviour. You seem to imply that because he was dumb enough to act so scum like, that he couldn't possibly be scum. This is the same opinion voiced by Nova. Of course you can have stupid scum, and I believe that's what we have here. | ||
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On April 20 2012 06:17 Lazermonkey wrote: Going to bed now, hope that I survive the night. Don't think so tho :S. Pure seems to act strange at this point, doesn't answer my post even tho he is accusing me etc. Will keep my vote on Solohan tho. Hope to see you tomorrow ^^ Sorry, but there isn't much to say. You can't change the actions that led me to vote for you, and claiming inexperience as a reason just doesn't cut it for me. We're all inexperienced, it's why this is a newbie game. You've had the most suspicious behaviour to date, and at this stage with the information available, I made my vote based on that. | ||
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On April 20 2012 06:26 Lorant wrote: Pure, tell me why you think Lazer is scummy from a scum agenda POV. Be creative and for the love of God just find something. It's not about the overall scum agenda, so I don't think you can find what you are looking for from me. He made a mistake on day 1 with his switch on Nova, he then initiated an unsubstantiated lynch vote onto oneplus, dissapeared, and then returned with weak cases on first Mechiji and then Solohan. The case notes and my reasoning are there to see. Am I 100% certain that he is mafia? No. But he is my strongest mafia read so far and I haven't identified with any other cases at this time. For what it's worth, Nova is still high on my list but see no point pushing that yet. | ||
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On April 20 2012 06:48 Nova_Terra wrote: ahh sry FF said 25 mins and i freaked out Where did he say this? I don't see a post from him stating this? | ||
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I'm sorry Lazermonkey  | ||
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How I see it, the only real information we have right now is who voted for who, and seeing if that tells us anything, and trying to find the motivation. In my initial analysis of Oneplus's lynch, I excluded my suspicions from people I read as town, and to a certain extent didn't put much weight into cases made against them. Based on last nights lynch result, it's time I stopped leaning anyone as town and look at everything as objectively as possible. So for starters, the voting. Day 1: Voted for OnePlus: Daymor, Crossfire, Nova_Terra, Therapist, Lazermonkey, BlueyD, (TheRavensName as well, but he switched off 13 minutes prior to deadline) Voted for others: Pure-SC2, Solohan50, Macheji, TheRavensName, OnePlus voted for Nova_Terra Lorant voted for Crossfire Day 2: Voted for Lazermonkey: BlueyD, Pure-SC2, Solohan50, Daymore Voted for others: Nova_Terra, Lorant and Therapist voted for Pure-SC2 Macheji voted for Nova_Terra Lazermonkey voted for Solohan50 TheRavensName - missed the voting window I think that at least 2 mafia voted for Oneplus, and at least 1 voted for Lazermonkey. Interestingly, BlueyD and Daymore voted for both. I also think that the mafia team wouldn't all be voting on the same target. Therapist: Turns up 40 minutes before deadline (after 2 days absence) and puts an unsubstantiated vote on Pure-SC2 (me), due to "fairly blind faith in Nova". He is the ultimate non-contributing lurker at the moment. @Lorant - I think getting a hit on blue Crossfire was luck. I don't think he was targeted specifically because he was blue, but of course I could be wrong. My WIFOM thoughts at the time was that he was hit to discredit me, as I had fingered Nova->Lazer->Crossfire as suspicious. Now that we know Lazer was town, this seems even more likely to me. One thing I don't understand, why did Daymore post a link to his whole google doc of notes? On my initial read through I thought it was great as I could see he had very similar reads to me, and considered me town, etc etc. But later on I thought it seemed a little strange to link the doc like that. | ||
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On April 20 2012 06:49 Nova_Terra wrote: Pure, one thing that is continuing to concern me is the fact that you refuse to mention or aknowledge other cases, and you continue to tunnel. Are they inferior to your own? why do you have this stance? The longer you keep this up the more i think you are scum. This is a fair question Nova. I've read everyone's cases and found many of them to be quite weak, some have contained plain incorrect information and some are based purely on WIFOM and past game meta. I didn't find anything in them that convinced me that there was someone better to vote for than Lazer. You are right, in that I've tunnelled both yourself and Lazer quite strongly since the beginning and in hindsight can see the problems with this. In the lead up to the deadline last night I became more and more convinced that Lazer was going to flip town, but couldn't see anyone I would rather vote for in his place. At the least I felt that we would have 2 days of voting behaviour to look at in order to learn something from and develop leads. I'm revisiting everyone's cases today to see if I missed anything on my first read through, plus am planning to look into some of my own leads and see if anything lines up. | ||
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
Looking back at the voting patterns, one thing came to mind. I'm starting to get a stronger town leaning on Nova (he's flipped around so much), and I'm wondering if the mafia is hiding behind us both, i.e., they spread their sheeping across us both since we seem to be the most vocal and can support us when then know we suspecting townies in order to lend weight to our suspicions. | ||
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
Therapist is either very suspicious or just highly inactive town who loves Nova. I'm leaning suspicious. Nova I'm leaning town on, but damn he has said a lot of scummy things. Lorant, keep the scum analysis coming. Daymor's my strongest town read, but thats just based on the fact he seems to think like me. TheRavensName, slight town read. | ||
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
BlueyD's filter reads like someone playing the pro-town sheep mafia style. His comments on Therapist throw me a bit though. | ||
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
Day 1: Voted for OnePlus: Daymor, Crossfire, Nova_Terra, Therapist, Lazermonkey, BlueyD, (TheRavensName as well, but he switched off 13 minutes prior to deadline) Voted for others: Pure-SC2, Solohan50, Macheji, TheRavensName, OnePlus voted for Nova_Terra Lorant voted for Crossfire Day 2: Voted for Lazermonkey: BlueyD, Pure-SC2, Solohan50, Daymor Voted for others: Nova_Terra, Lorant and Therapist voted for Pure-SC2 Macheji voted for Nova_Terra Lazermonkey voted for Solohan50 TheRavensName - missed the voting window | ||
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
Backed up with the breadcrumbing and your check on me and I'm on board. | ||
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
After finally getting confident of Nova's cop stance, That was my three, which I hinted at last night. Hehehe, shame it ended early, but think we woulda had it. My big question mark was Lorant, but I did think he was town. I had this fear that Nova had pulled the ultimate fake on me with the breadcrumbing, calling Lazer town and then his read on me, but felt stronger that he was what he said. I was going to push for BlueyD and saw the anti-connection between him and Solohan, and Therapist was just suspicious. So it was BlueyD, see how Solohan responded, and move onto Therapost. That was my first mafia game and wow was it interesting. Was a bit dissapointing we didn't get more discussion going, and I completely misread things at first. It was actually Lorants posts that changed the way I was looking at this, as well as watching Newbie VIII from the start, and seeing that finish yesterday and reading my first scum QT, it was like ahhhhhhhhhh, I see what I'm doing wrong. Can't believe how exciting these games get GG all. | ||
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Pure-SC2
United Kingdom1440 Posts
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