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Oops, didn't finish the YM point.
YM merely opposed his candidacy. Not a sure reason to call scum.
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I agree with YM+Lemonwalrus, I disagree on Risen.
I think Risen is just a new player who seems to be doing what a lot of other people are doing. Other people are calling out scum without saying why as well (I'm guilty of it myself, in fact).
What do you think of deconduo? Have you seen him play before?
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On November 27 2011 08:28 wherebugsgo wrote:
I agree with YM+Lemonwalrus, I disagree on Risen.
I think Risen is just a new player who seems to be doing what a lot of other people are doing. Other people are calling out scum without saying why as well (I'm guilty of it myself, in fact).
What do you think of deconduo? Have you seen him play before?
Decon and I tend to instantly clash in games. I need at least 1 more day to get a read im comfortable with. As for now I am leaning more towards the scum side, but I always tend to think he plays scumlike.
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On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz
I think this guy is a good bet to be scum.
Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town.
There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town.
He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular?
prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl.
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On November 27 2011 08:35 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz I think this guy is a good bet to be scum. Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town. There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town. He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular? prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl.
Well GreYMisT and prplz are/were in the election campaign. Duh......
Syllo I found often to be there with Sandro, but did not quite have enough to say at the time. I was busy in the last 24 hours; just finished reading like 35 pages, I'll dump more posts as time moves.
Sandro: I happened to agree with his criticisms of your strategy. Not much to say.
Would you call me scum right off the bat if I did the opposite; if I had one liners about you and Palmar and an essay about Sandro? This is a legitimate question, answer it.
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+ Show Spoiler +On November 27 2011 07:51 wherebugsgo wrote:
syllogism is quite experienced, BloodyC0bbler is quite experienced, Palmar, kitaman, sandroba, all of these players.
Of these players I don't know much about BC but I understand he's very good at scum and quite good as town as well, Palmar is quite good at both alignments, kita often makes people believe he is town when he is scum, sandro is good at both but considerably better as town.
There are some other vets in this game as well;
decon, who is, IMO decent but really obvious as scum. This game, he is incredibly scummy. Good choice for lynch IMO.
annul, who I don't personally know but he's making some rather weird statements right now.
LSB, who again I don't personally know and I don't know much about.
Kenpachi, great vig but often doesn't do anything
Lemonwalrus, don't know much about this guy
prplhz, doing really well recently
Jackal58, has really bad day 1 reads but apparently he gets better later. I've never played with him as town beyond day 1 but generally I never trust anything he says day 1. He's pretty damn good as scum too.
GreYMisT, decent town player, bad scum player (I think?) about as new as I am (so like 3 months)
Drazerk, almost always scummy. Self-proclaimed bad
bumatlarge, pretty decent town, and his scum is good although I feel like I can catch his scum play more easily than some others
Coagulation-heard he's good, son of Jackal, tends to lurk I guess. not much here as well
supersoft-generally makes pretty logical calls as town and the only time I saw his scum play he was really obvious scum
Erandorr-he started playing mafia with the same game I did, XLIV, (so about 3 months) and he's generally pretty good as town, tends to lurk and fly under the radar as scum
Kurumi-resident troll, tends to lurk as both alignments.
tnkted-pretty decent as town, never seen him play scum but he actually tends to get suspicion when he is town for some reason. Never figured out why. I think I've played one or two games with him (one of which I was a very late replacement and dead within 2 hours)
sinani206-just useless
nisani201-marginally less useless
that's about all the names I recognize.
I think ym is town. His scumplay in arkham was far more conservative. His townplay is known for being rash (ptp2 he shot day 1 as a vig). I just can't see how anything he's done is scum motivated.
Kitaman is one of the most underrated players on this site and I think he's town, he should be sheriff.
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On November 27 2011 08:44 Hier wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 08:35 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz I think this guy is a good bet to be scum. Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town. There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town. He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular? prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl. Well GreYMisT and prplz are/were in the election campaign. Duh...... Syllo I found often to be there with Sandro, but did not quite have enough to say at the time. I was busy in the last 24 hours; just finished reading like 35 pages, I'll dump more posts as time moves. Sandro: I happened to agree with his criticisms of your strategy. Not much to say. Would you call me scum right off the bat if I did the opposite; if I had one liners about you and Palmar and an essay about Sandro? This is a legitimate question, answer it.
Yes, actually.
I generally am critical of players who make contradictions in their play. If a player is hypocritical or makes logical contradictions, then I generally hone in on them and tunnel and pressure them repeatedly.
If someone says things that show discrepancies or inordinate bias toward one side of an issue they are not involved in, then I also am suspicious, because I then wonder if they have a non-town agenda.
If a player is not directly involved in an issue (such as this DT palmar/BC/me and syllo/sandro business) then I expect the amount of effort put into analyzing both sides to be roughly equal. If it isn't, then there is likely to be something hidden going on.
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On November 27 2011 08:54 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 08:44 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:35 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz I think this guy is a good bet to be scum. Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town. There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town. He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular? prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl. Well GreYMisT and prplz are/were in the election campaign. Duh...... Syllo I found often to be there with Sandro, but did not quite have enough to say at the time. I was busy in the last 24 hours; just finished reading like 35 pages, I'll dump more posts as time moves. Sandro: I happened to agree with his criticisms of your strategy. Not much to say. Would you call me scum right off the bat if I did the opposite; if I had one liners about you and Palmar and an essay about Sandro? This is a legitimate question, answer it. Yes, actually. I generally am critical of players who make contradictions in their play. If a player is hypocritical or makes logical contradictions, then I generally hone in on them and tunnel and pressure them repeatedly. If someone says things that show discrepancies or inordinate bias toward one side of an issue they are not involved in, then I also am suspicious, because I then wonder if they have a non-town agenda. If a player is not directly involved in an issue (such as this DT palmar/BC/me and syllo/sandro business) then I expect the amount of effort put into analyzing both sides to be roughly equal. If it isn't, then there is likely to be something hidden going on.
It is advantageous for town to identify mafia as soon as possible and to provide large amounts of argument to accuse a player of being scum.
It is advantageous for mafia to falsely accuse a townie of being mafia and to provide large amounts of argument for it to alleviate suspicion off of actual mafia members and to waste lynches.
Sandro isn't being lynched after breakfast; I'm not in a particular rush to convince everyone he isn't scum. However, I do not believe he is mafia based on his argument against your DT policy. So it actually turns out that the paragraph under your name has relation to Sandro's case.
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On November 27 2011 09:06 Hier wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 08:54 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:44 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:35 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz I think this guy is a good bet to be scum. Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town. There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town. He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular? prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl. Well GreYMisT and prplz are/were in the election campaign. Duh...... Syllo I found often to be there with Sandro, but did not quite have enough to say at the time. I was busy in the last 24 hours; just finished reading like 35 pages, I'll dump more posts as time moves. Sandro: I happened to agree with his criticisms of your strategy. Not much to say. Would you call me scum right off the bat if I did the opposite; if I had one liners about you and Palmar and an essay about Sandro? This is a legitimate question, answer it. Yes, actually. I generally am critical of players who make contradictions in their play. If a player is hypocritical or makes logical contradictions, then I generally hone in on them and tunnel and pressure them repeatedly. If someone says things that show discrepancies or inordinate bias toward one side of an issue they are not involved in, then I also am suspicious, because I then wonder if they have a non-town agenda. If a player is not directly involved in an issue (such as this DT palmar/BC/me and syllo/sandro business) then I expect the amount of effort put into analyzing both sides to be roughly equal. If it isn't, then there is likely to be something hidden going on. It is advantageous for town to identify mafia as soon as possible and to provide large amounts of argument to accuse a player of being scum. It is advantageous for mafia to falsely accuse a townie of being mafia and to provide large amounts of argument for it to alleviate suspicion off of actual mafia members and to waste lynches. Sandro isn't being lynched after breakfast; I'm not in a particular rush to convince everyone he isn't scum. However, I do not believe he is mafia based on his argument against your DT policy. So it actually turns out that the paragraph under your name has relation to Sandro's case.
So you just admitted that what you posted about scum could be taken from both alignment perspectives.
Thank you, you pretty much just proved my point for me.
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On November 27 2011 09:09 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 09:06 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:54 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:44 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:35 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz I think this guy is a good bet to be scum. Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town. There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town. He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular? prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl. Well GreYMisT and prplz are/were in the election campaign. Duh...... Syllo I found often to be there with Sandro, but did not quite have enough to say at the time. I was busy in the last 24 hours; just finished reading like 35 pages, I'll dump more posts as time moves. Sandro: I happened to agree with his criticisms of your strategy. Not much to say. Would you call me scum right off the bat if I did the opposite; if I had one liners about you and Palmar and an essay about Sandro? This is a legitimate question, answer it. Yes, actually. I generally am critical of players who make contradictions in their play. If a player is hypocritical or makes logical contradictions, then I generally hone in on them and tunnel and pressure them repeatedly. If someone says things that show discrepancies or inordinate bias toward one side of an issue they are not involved in, then I also am suspicious, because I then wonder if they have a non-town agenda. If a player is not directly involved in an issue (such as this DT palmar/BC/me and syllo/sandro business) then I expect the amount of effort put into analyzing both sides to be roughly equal. If it isn't, then there is likely to be something hidden going on. It is advantageous for town to identify mafia as soon as possible and to provide large amounts of argument to accuse a player of being scum. It is advantageous for mafia to falsely accuse a townie of being mafia and to provide large amounts of argument for it to alleviate suspicion off of actual mafia members and to waste lynches. Sandro isn't being lynched after breakfast; I'm not in a particular rush to convince everyone he isn't scum. However, I do not believe he is mafia based on his argument against your DT policy. So it actually turns out that the paragraph under your name has relation to Sandro's case. So you just admitted that what you posted about scum could be taken from both alignment perspectives. Thank you, you pretty much just proved my point for me.
What? You agreed that what I said could be interpreted as mafia or town equally. Then you said that just proved I'm scum.
Excellent logic.
You are rather desperate to have me out of the picture, are you not? Am I a threat to your scum campaign?
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Changed my vote to BC upon further review. Yeah, I know I should have posted that I was going to be busy early, but I didn't know about most of it then. If you kill me for it you'll find a townie corpse hanging from the rope. If I survive long enough I hope to aid the town in hunting down the scum. And for the record I don't like breadcrumbing.
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On November 27 2011 09:12 Hier wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 09:09 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 09:06 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:54 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:44 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:35 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz I think this guy is a good bet to be scum. Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town. There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town. He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular? prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl. Well GreYMisT and prplz are/were in the election campaign. Duh...... Syllo I found often to be there with Sandro, but did not quite have enough to say at the time. I was busy in the last 24 hours; just finished reading like 35 pages, I'll dump more posts as time moves. Sandro: I happened to agree with his criticisms of your strategy. Not much to say. Would you call me scum right off the bat if I did the opposite; if I had one liners about you and Palmar and an essay about Sandro? This is a legitimate question, answer it. Yes, actually. I generally am critical of players who make contradictions in their play. If a player is hypocritical or makes logical contradictions, then I generally hone in on them and tunnel and pressure them repeatedly. If someone says things that show discrepancies or inordinate bias toward one side of an issue they are not involved in, then I also am suspicious, because I then wonder if they have a non-town agenda. If a player is not directly involved in an issue (such as this DT palmar/BC/me and syllo/sandro business) then I expect the amount of effort put into analyzing both sides to be roughly equal. If it isn't, then there is likely to be something hidden going on. It is advantageous for town to identify mafia as soon as possible and to provide large amounts of argument to accuse a player of being scum. It is advantageous for mafia to falsely accuse a townie of being mafia and to provide large amounts of argument for it to alleviate suspicion off of actual mafia members and to waste lynches. Sandro isn't being lynched after breakfast; I'm not in a particular rush to convince everyone he isn't scum. However, I do not believe he is mafia based on his argument against your DT policy. So it actually turns out that the paragraph under your name has relation to Sandro's case. So you just admitted that what you posted about scum could be taken from both alignment perspectives. Thank you, you pretty much just proved my point for me. What? You agreed that what I said could be interpreted as mafia or town equally. Then you said that just proved I'm scum. Excellent logic. You are rather desperate to have me out of the picture, are you not? Am I a threat to your scum campaign?
Let me clarify.
My logic has to do with how scum operate. They want to be unreadable.
So, the entire focus of your post was on your scumreads, with literally no effort put in to convincing anyone that sandro is town. You also strangely included three other players, two of which you say are included because they are mayoral candidates.
Yet, you don't talk about other mayoral candidates, such as sinani, annul, Erandorr, or kitaman. You could've easily said you were null on all of these (each with a campaign about as strong as GreYMisT's or prpl's) and I probably would believe you that you were mentioning those players based on their campaigns. But, you didn't.
Now, if you look at only your scumreads, and omit the rest of your post, we see that your post can be made from either alignment. That's point number 1.
If you instead eliminate only the first half, and include the town/null, you again can probably make that post from either alignment, but it's more likely to be a scum-aligned post because of the total lack of effort. This is point #2.
Put them together, and the disconnect makes sense far more from a scum perspective than a town one. Scum are completely fine with destroying the credibility of town players. Early in the game, when there are so many of them, they are also fine in supporting certain players who are furthering their agenda; either townies they think will help them achieve their wincon, or their scumbuddies.
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also you are a hypocrite, and have contradicted yourself, since you incorrectly say that I call sandro scum only because he called for the lynch of sinani (this is not true) but you call BC scum for this reason:
On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
.
Entirely because he created the DT plan and you think it's bad.
So, you accuse me of being scum because I apparently only had one reason for attacking sandro, but then you attack BC for only one reason.
Nice logical contradiction.
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On November 27 2011 06:00 Serejai wrote:MY NAME IS SEREJAI AND I AM RUNNING FOR MAYOR You should vote for me because I'm the only candidate that's guaranteed to be town. If I were mafia I would be modkilled/banned from this game by now. This is how you know you can trust me. I'm not a veteran player but I will actively listen to the town and use my lynches accordingly. My election lynch will be used on supersoft for obvious reasons SEREJAI FOR MAYOR ##Unvote sinani206
##Vote SerejaiTo facilitate the switching of your votes to me I have included blow, free of charge, a template that you can use. [b]##Unvote <yourformercandidatehere>
##Vote Serejai[/b]
NEW PLAYERS, IT IS NOT TOO LATE TO SAVE THE TOWN!
Your other candidates are:
Palmar
Sandroba
Greymist
kitaman
Bloodyc0bbler
Needless to say if you vote for a mafia then you are also a mafia. The only other candidate is BloodyC0bbler and he needs a second town to run with!
Don't be taken in by this mafia-ran mayoral campaign. They are preying on the fact that you're new and don't know their playstyles. DO NOT BE FOOLED - THESE PEOPLE ARE ALL MAFIA.
Secure your votes in me, the only candidate that is 100% confirmed as town based on the fact I'm still in the game at this point, and help town achieve victory with a day one lynch of supersoft the mafia scum. I will then lynch two mafia a day from then out, starting with the trolls/lurkers like intrigue and kurumi.
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On November 27 2011 09:26 Serejai wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 06:00 Serejai wrote:MY NAME IS SEREJAI AND I AM RUNNING FOR MAYOR You should vote for me because I'm the only candidate that's guaranteed to be town. If I were mafia I would be modkilled/banned from this game by now. This is how you know you can trust me. I'm not a veteran player but I will actively listen to the town and use my lynches accordingly. My election lynch will be used on supersoft for obvious reasons SEREJAI FOR MAYOR ##Unvote sinani206
##Vote SerejaiTo facilitate the switching of your votes to me I have included blow, free of charge, a template that you can use. [b]##Unvote <yourformercandidatehere>
##Vote Serejai[/b] NEW PLAYERS, IT IS NOT TOO LATE TO SAVE THE TOWN!Your other candidates are: Palmar
Sandroba
Greymist
kitamanBloodyc0bblerNeedless to say if you vote for a mafia then you are also a mafia. The only other candidate is BloodyC0bbler and he needs a second town to run with! Don't be taken in by this mafia-ran mayoral campaign. They are preying on the fact that you're new and don't know their playstyles. DO NOT BE FOOLED - THESE PEOPLE ARE ALL MAFIA. Secure your votes in me, the only candidate that is 100% confirmed as town based on the fact I'm still in the game at this point, and help town achieve victory with a day one lynch of supersoft the mafia scum. I will then lynch two mafia a day from then out, starting with the trolls/lurkers like intrigue and kurumi.
You're a lunatic.
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On November 27 2011 09:31 Kurumi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 09:26 Serejai wrote:On November 27 2011 06:00 Serejai wrote:MY NAME IS SEREJAI AND I AM RUNNING FOR MAYOR You should vote for me because I'm the only candidate that's guaranteed to be town. If I were mafia I would be modkilled/banned from this game by now. This is how you know you can trust me. I'm not a veteran player but I will actively listen to the town and use my lynches accordingly. My election lynch will be used on supersoft for obvious reasons SEREJAI FOR MAYOR ##Unvote sinani206
##Vote SerejaiTo facilitate the switching of your votes to me I have included blow, free of charge, a template that you can use. [b]##Unvote <yourformercandidatehere>
##Vote Serejai[/b] NEW PLAYERS, IT IS NOT TOO LATE TO SAVE THE TOWN!Your other candidates are: Palmar
Sandroba
Greymist
kitamanBloodyc0bblerNeedless to say if you vote for a mafia then you are also a mafia. The only other candidate is BloodyC0bbler and he needs a second town to run with! Don't be taken in by this mafia-ran mayoral campaign. They are preying on the fact that you're new and don't know their playstyles. DO NOT BE FOOLED - THESE PEOPLE ARE ALL MAFIA. Secure your votes in me, the only candidate that is 100% confirmed as town based on the fact I'm still in the game at this point, and help town achieve victory with a day one lynch of supersoft the mafia scum. I will then lynch two mafia a day from then out, starting with the trolls/lurkers like intrigue and kurumi. You're a lunatic.
Says the mafia scum trying to derail my campaign so mafia wins mayor+sheriff positions. Typical.
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On November 27 2011 09:35 Serejai wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 09:31 Kurumi wrote:On November 27 2011 09:26 Serejai wrote:On November 27 2011 06:00 Serejai wrote:MY NAME IS SEREJAI AND I AM RUNNING FOR MAYOR You should vote for me because I'm the only candidate that's guaranteed to be town. If I were mafia I would be modkilled/banned from this game by now. This is how you know you can trust me. I'm not a veteran player but I will actively listen to the town and use my lynches accordingly. My election lynch will be used on supersoft for obvious reasons SEREJAI FOR MAYOR ##Unvote sinani206
##Vote SerejaiTo facilitate the switching of your votes to me I have included blow, free of charge, a template that you can use. [b]##Unvote <yourformercandidatehere>
##Vote Serejai[/b] NEW PLAYERS, IT IS NOT TOO LATE TO SAVE THE TOWN!Your other candidates are: Palmar
Sandroba
Greymist
kitamanBloodyc0bblerNeedless to say if you vote for a mafia then you are also a mafia. The only other candidate is BloodyC0bbler and he needs a second town to run with! Don't be taken in by this mafia-ran mayoral campaign. They are preying on the fact that you're new and don't know their playstyles. DO NOT BE FOOLED - THESE PEOPLE ARE ALL MAFIA. Secure your votes in me, the only candidate that is 100% confirmed as town based on the fact I'm still in the game at this point, and help town achieve victory with a day one lynch of supersoft the mafia scum. I will then lynch two mafia a day from then out, starting with the trolls/lurkers like intrigue and kurumi. You're a lunatic. Says the mafia scum trying to derail my campaign so mafia wins mayor+sheriff positions. Typical.
You're shitting up the thread with nonsense. Post a case... oh wait, You won't because You're scum, together with annul and sinani. Oh well.
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On November 27 2011 09:19 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 09:12 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 09:09 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 09:06 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:54 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:44 Hier wrote:On November 27 2011 08:35 wherebugsgo wrote:On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
Here are some of my thoughts so far.
Mafia
Palmar
-Way too many people announcing their vote for him, with the official vote tag and everything. Claiming they love his plan, even though there REALLY wasn't any plan Palmar offered to begin with. Typical propaganda by the mafia.
-Most of his campaign relies on him proclaiming he is good as town, and bad as mafia.
-Already started working on his "people with ability to veto" list to veto people ending up on the suspect list. That includes himself. lol wut? Note that he wants 3 veto votes to prevent a person to be on the suspect list for DTs. That means there are at least 3 mafia members on that list Palmar proposed.
-Slightly suspicious about his adamant urge to kill YM. YM merely
WBG
-I'm not a fan of his DT plan. Unless prevented by an ability, mafia will get a kill every night. Meanwhile, the town's lynches are semi-blind and can be manipulated by the mafia. We are meant to follow a list, which itself can be manipulated through propaganda, waste our player resources (forced kills), and waste our vigilante shots all to slightly help out our detective(s) to figure out their sanity, the attempts of which can be all for naught by GF, Millers, and framers. If mafia gets a slightly favorable population ratio within the first few days, the game is over. No thanks. I'd rather have our DTs work independently, even if it is a gamble on them being competent.
-His claim that sandroba is mafia hangs entirely on his first lynch target, sinani206. Though I admit questionable, he puts way too much weight on that point alone.
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
Town
sandroba
-Is against WBG's plan, with which I agree with; it is far too prone to manipulation and errors by DTs.
Can't Quite Tell
syllogism
GreYMisT
prplhz I think this guy is a good bet to be scum. Look at how detailed his cases are on the players he thinks are scum, and then look at his case for sandro being town. There's a huge sense of disconnect here between the amount of effort he put in to calling myself, Palmar, and BC scum and the amount of effort he put into calling sandro town. He also lists 3 null reads at the end for no particular reason. Why those 3, in particular? prpl I thought was scum, syllo I think is also likely to be scum. GreYMisT could be anything at this point. It's perhaps not so strange he picked syllo, since he focused on syllo+sandro and me+Palmar+BC, but it is indeed strange he chose to comment on GreYMisT and prpl. Well GreYMisT and prplz are/were in the election campaign. Duh...... Syllo I found often to be there with Sandro, but did not quite have enough to say at the time. I was busy in the last 24 hours; just finished reading like 35 pages, I'll dump more posts as time moves. Sandro: I happened to agree with his criticisms of your strategy. Not much to say. Would you call me scum right off the bat if I did the opposite; if I had one liners about you and Palmar and an essay about Sandro? This is a legitimate question, answer it. Yes, actually. I generally am critical of players who make contradictions in their play. If a player is hypocritical or makes logical contradictions, then I generally hone in on them and tunnel and pressure them repeatedly. If someone says things that show discrepancies or inordinate bias toward one side of an issue they are not involved in, then I also am suspicious, because I then wonder if they have a non-town agenda. If a player is not directly involved in an issue (such as this DT palmar/BC/me and syllo/sandro business) then I expect the amount of effort put into analyzing both sides to be roughly equal. If it isn't, then there is likely to be something hidden going on. It is advantageous for town to identify mafia as soon as possible and to provide large amounts of argument to accuse a player of being scum. It is advantageous for mafia to falsely accuse a townie of being mafia and to provide large amounts of argument for it to alleviate suspicion off of actual mafia members and to waste lynches. Sandro isn't being lynched after breakfast; I'm not in a particular rush to convince everyone he isn't scum. However, I do not believe he is mafia based on his argument against your DT policy. So it actually turns out that the paragraph under your name has relation to Sandro's case. So you just admitted that what you posted about scum could be taken from both alignment perspectives. Thank you, you pretty much just proved my point for me. What? You agreed that what I said could be interpreted as mafia or town equally. Then you said that just proved I'm scum. Excellent logic. You are rather desperate to have me out of the picture, are you not? Am I a threat to your scum campaign? Let me clarify. My logic has to do with how scum operate. They want to be unreadable. So, the entire focus of your post was on your scumreads, with literally no effort put in to convincing anyone that sandro is town. You also strangely included three other players, two of which you say are included because they are mayoral candidates. Yet, you don't talk about other mayoral candidates, such as sinani, annul, Erandorr, or kitaman. You could've easily said you were null on all of these (each with a campaign about as strong as GreYMisT's or prpl's) and I probably would believe you that you were mentioning those players based on their campaigns. But, you didn't. Now, if you look at only your scumreads, and omit the rest of your post, we see that your post can be made from either alignment. That's point number 1. If you instead eliminate only the first half, and include the town/null, you again can probably make that post from either alignment, but it's more likely to be a scum-aligned post because of the total lack of effort. This is point #2. Put them together, and the disconnect makes sense far more from a scum perspective than a town one. Scum are completely fine with destroying the credibility of town players. Early in the game, when there are so many of them, they are also fine in supporting certain players who are furthering their agenda; either townies they think will help them achieve their wincon, or their scumbuddies.
Prplhz, I think, was the first campaign to get started, with a picture of a planet, or something. It stuck in memory because it was a post typed out before he received his role, hence very neutral. Greymist's campaign, I think, was the most recent to be talked about, hence why it also got stuck in memory. As I said, I had to go through something like 35 pages in one go. I couldn't bring myself to go digging through that again to find quotes and whatnot. I did not deliberately forget to mention some candidates because a lot of people announced they would run much later in the thread, and their candidacies weren't the center of attention... like some other campaigns.
My Sandro's case did not need a lot of text. It was an opposition to your campaign, which I supported. Did you want me to cut and paste the explanation of why I thought your plan was scummy into Sandro's section? In that case would you not have answered me because then the text sizes would look similar?
Could you please safely direct me to a post in this thread vigorously defending someone's town alignment, as opposed to accusing someone of being scum? Is everybody in this thread scum? Oh, and speaking of scum...
Do I have the potential of ruining your mafia plans in the future? No, really, I want you to answer this. Do I?
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On November 27 2011 09:23 wherebugsgo wrote:also you are a hypocrite, and have contradicted yourself, since you incorrectly say that I call sandro scum only because he called for the lynch of sinani (this is not true) but you call BC scum for this reason: Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 08:20 Hier wrote:
BC
-The original creator of the DT plan. It is likely WBG modified it, as opposed to advising BC behind the curtains to fix it, because they wanted to create an extra face to compete in the elections, diluting the suspicions.
. Entirely because he created the DT plan and you think it's bad. So, you accuse me of being scum because I apparently only had one reason for attacking sandro, but then you attack BC for only one reason. Nice logical contradiction.
Do you actually know the meaning of the word "hypocrite"? My main point... the one that's several lines long, had to do with your campaign. After that I accused your reason (only reason) for calling Sandro scum of being shallow.
I am not the first person to call BC's DT plan prone to manipulation b the mafia. Specifically BC's, not yours.
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On November 27 2011 09:43 Kurumi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2011 09:35 Serejai wrote:On November 27 2011 09:31 Kurumi wrote:On November 27 2011 09:26 Serejai wrote:On November 27 2011 06:00 Serejai wrote:MY NAME IS SEREJAI AND I AM RUNNING FOR MAYOR You should vote for me because I'm the only candidate that's guaranteed to be town. If I were mafia I would be modkilled/banned from this game by now. This is how you know you can trust me. I'm not a veteran player but I will actively listen to the town and use my lynches accordingly. My election lynch will be used on supersoft for obvious reasons SEREJAI FOR MAYOR ##Unvote sinani206
##Vote SerejaiTo facilitate the switching of your votes to me I have included blow, free of charge, a template that you can use. [b]##Unvote <yourformercandidatehere>
##Vote Serejai[/b] NEW PLAYERS, IT IS NOT TOO LATE TO SAVE THE TOWN!Your other candidates are: Palmar
Sandroba
Greymist
kitamanBloodyc0bblerNeedless to say if you vote for a mafia then you are also a mafia. The only other candidate is BloodyC0bbler and he needs a second town to run with! Don't be taken in by this mafia-ran mayoral campaign. They are preying on the fact that you're new and don't know their playstyles. DO NOT BE FOOLED - THESE PEOPLE ARE ALL MAFIA. Secure your votes in me, the only candidate that is 100% confirmed as town based on the fact I'm still in the game at this point, and help town achieve victory with a day one lynch of supersoft the mafia scum. I will then lynch two mafia a day from then out, starting with the trolls/lurkers like intrigue and kurumi. You're a lunatic. Says the mafia scum trying to derail my campaign so mafia wins mayor+sheriff positions. Typical. You're shitting up the thread with nonsense. Post a case... oh wait, You won't because You're scum, together with annul and sinani. Oh well.
I've already posted why the other candidates, and people like you and intrigue, are mafia. Your only response seems to be whining and trolling. It's clear you have no real defense.
Kurumi
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EPT
