EPTResurrection Mafia - Page 25
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redFF
United States3910 Posts
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
On September 04 2011 09:42 redFF wrote: you only get lynched as town if your bad, not your attacker's fault you played scummy. meh ima go now, i've said everything ive needed to say. It also takes some pretty dumb townies to then bandwagon a bad townie. This is why I'm not voting you, because I genuinely think you're playing badly. At least by tomorrow we'll know for sure whether you're mafia or not, and whether we should take the claim seriously. | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
On September 04 2011 09:30 wherebugsgo wrote: How many bodies can the coroner check per day? As noted in the OP, some role descriptions are incomplete. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On September 04 2011 09:31 redFF wrote: i assume coroner has more checks than me, but can probably also use two a day. :/ Coroner Can look at a corpse and determine alignment and role. May be used any time, and will instantly return the information (as soon as I get the pm). The OP explicitly says A corpse per day. Your claim isn't looking believable. On September 04 2011 09:36 wherebugsgo wrote: The circular reasoning this creates should suggest to you that we should keep this guy alive for now. Bum and ON are definitely more scummy. Bum avoided lynch, has not really contributed anything, and sandroba claimed RB (when he was one of the players who voted bum). ON threw his vote on Kenpachi and then purposely left it there while he was STILL AROUND at the end of the day. Now again he's still pursuing Kenpachi when it's clear he's definitely not going to get lynched today. There's too much weird shit going on with red thanks to his shitty play that I'd rather leave him alive at least till tomorrow. With ON and Bum hopefully out of action tomorrow we can lynch red and someone else. There is no circular reasoning here - this is pretty simple to follow. Try and keep up. redFF checks Sinani and Varp and by his own admission: On September 04 2011 09:37 redFF wrote: and yes ace that was the original intention to see they were scum because i figured just checking the nightkilled players would be less useful then checking the lynches. He checked to see if they were Scum but found them to be Town. If he outs them as being Town then he'd also have no problem checking the 3 Night Killed people. HOWEVER, he is the BACKUP coroner right? That means he is the last one. Why the hell would he out himself just for Sinani when he just saw 3 people get Night Killed. He'll die by Day 3 and the Town will have no Coroners left. The game is essentially over at that point. Think about this for more than 5 seconds. As for your bolded that doesn't even make any sense. Bum avoiding a lynch doesn't make him Scummy, and it has no relation to sandroba's alleged role block. Even if sandroba voted for Bum, assuming bum is Scum why would that give him cause to RB sandroba? That doesn't add up at all. Faulty logic there. Your second point also makes no sense. Most votes wins, not majority. ON leaving his vote anywhere when there are low vote counts to die and a role that has double voting power means this tells you nothing unless Kenpachi dies by low vote count. If red is playing like shit (very high possibility) and weird stuff is going on it makes sense to lynch him. An unconfirmed claim that is an automatic game over if he dies? Why are you even thinking about bum and ON? you yourself said that they probably wouldnt be a backup coroner, so if coroner died you know they would stay silent and sinani would probably be resurrected. Did you take a dead coroner into account when you made your post? Yes, and even if I didn't why would it matter? If the Coroner dies and never says anything then we just take the chance and revive Sinani. You still can't explain why a backup role thats pretty important to the Town in a no flip game would out himself on Day 2, knowing the original role died and saw 3 people get NK'd the previous night. Add in that there is nothing in the OP that says we have protective roles. Your claim also can't be confirmed, and you brought up some bullshit scenario about Counter Claiming that took 3 seconds of brain power to dismiss. Every scenario I look at your claim comes off as a high risk, low reward play. Even worse your insistence on reviving Sinani OVER Varpulis, if they are both indeed Town tells me, and any Mafia with half a brain that killing you and Sinani at tonight ends the game for the Town. You can't be THIS stupid. You are lying. | ||
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
Now I think Ace needs to come back and switch his vote off redFF. Ace come in and weigh in on this revelation we have here! | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On September 04 2011 09:42 redFF wrote: you only get lynched as town if your bad, not your attacker's fault you played scummy. meh ima go now, i've said everything ive needed to say. You deserve a refund for whoever sold you that. Town players get lynched for all kinds of reasons and some of the time it isn't their fault. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On September 04 2011 10:24 wherebugsgo wrote: BOOM. Now I think Ace needs to come back and switch his vote off redFF. Ace come in and weigh in on this revelation we have here! doesn't change anything. iGrok hasn't confirmed or denied anything about redFF's role. It still doesn't help explain why a backup role would out himself. No one can play this badly. I'm not buying it and my vote is staying where it is. Go talk to someone else because your wasting my time. | ||
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redFF
United States3910 Posts
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
It is circular reasoning. redFF plays dumbly and makes a dumb claim, without thinking about the consequences that it could have, i.e. he dies in like two days. Either he's mafia, or he's dumb. He made a dumb claim because he found no other way to communicate to our high priest that he should revive Sinani over reviving a night kill. Does the HP take the risk that sinani is not the coroner, and revive someone else? We die even faster if that's the case, because after 48 hours a dead person becomes unrevivable. A dumb townie won't find any way to communicate to us that sinani was coroner without outing himself. | ||
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redFF
United States3910 Posts
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bumatlarge
United States4567 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On September 04 2011 07:05 redFF wrote: im secret coroners apprentice, i can check twice a day. On September 04 2011 09:24 redFF wrote: lol... im a back up coroner, i have 2 checks, and i can use them both at any time. thats it. why did i check the lynches???? because i'm fairly sure no townies shot last night, so all i would be checking is town players, whereas the lynched players have a sense of uncertainty to them, while im fairly sure all night deaths were town. why did i reveal my checks??? because i only have 2 and used them both. Do you really need to know their roles ace? all that seems like is role fishing, revive sinani. i feel like i've answered your questions, don't you think the regular coroner would have counterclaimed me??? i go back to vt if the coroner returns to life. On September 04 2011 09:34 redFF wrote: 2 checks i can use both during a day. i was trying to reveal as little as possible but then i decided full disclosure was best option. On September 04 2011 10:29 redFF wrote: i have no more checks after i used my 2. I really feel that you shouldn't be contradicting yourself. You have two checks per day, but you only have two checks! Wooooo yeah makes sense... You also keep saying that varp and sinani got lynched because they played stupidly and got themselves lynched. You're being a total hypocrite. Ace is right, if your claim truly is correct, you will have lost the game for town by giving up "both" of the coroners. You've already gone full retard mode, doubt you can work your way out of it. ##vote redFF I see no reason to hold my vote until tomorrow. | ||
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bumatlarge
United States4567 Posts
If redff is scum that can make the claim he did because of some role he has, rather then a blind scum claim, he's going to be much more confidently using his claim to try and control the game. He would have to be absurdly smart if sinani is actually mafia and he couldn't get people off the sinani wagon. In fact I don't see any reason why he would block sandroba and save me rather then sinani, unless sandroba is mafia and they have no blocker? Sandroba + redff seems a very unlikely team with their correlations, but it's possible and the plays they have made would win them the game. if they continued like this. As much fun as this speculation is, it seems rather complicated, but I'll check their posts and be back in a bit. There is definitely something suspicious about redff checking lynches, claiming, and then telling us to revive the lynches rather then the kills which are almost certainly townies. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
1.) no flips on death 2.) people do ridiculous things anyway Look at it this way: On death no one flips roles or alignment. When a player is revived from what we know, they dont flip then either. So the Mafia has every incentive to claim Coroner. The real Coroner can not counter claim them. Even if the Mafia Coroner got killed, the real Coroner dies by NK and no one would ever know the difference. The Mafia Coroner already knows who is Town and who is not. The only thing that separates him from the actual Coroner is the ability to find out a Role. But then the Mafia Coroner can just hide behind the fact that he doesn't want to reveal any roles to the Mafia. I dont know if the Scum are this smart, but if they are and banned redFF from the QT I could see them coming up with this idea. | ||
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
Anyway, to clarify, I'm not necessarily saying redFF is certainly town. His alignment is up in the air. I just think it wouldn't be the greatest idea to split our votes like this when bum escaped lynch yesterday and ON is flying under the radar just by throwing votes on people. On September 04 2011 10:28 Ace wrote: doesn't change anything. iGrok hasn't confirmed or denied anything about redFF's role. It still doesn't help explain why a backup role would out himself. No one can play this badly. I'm not buying it and my vote is staying where it is. Go talk to someone else because your wasting my time. Yeah it does, it takes away some of the certainty of your accusation. Part of your feeling is based on the fact that you think the coroner can only check 1 person per day. If you're stuck on this part of the mechanics then you wouldn't be able to move on from there to accept that redFF could POSSIBLY be able to check two people in a day. If red only has two checks, and he used both of them, I can see why he might want to claim, because he knows that, even alive, he isn't much use. If we go another day without lynching ON/bum we might be in some trouble. Your vote on red is one of the things that is preventing us from getting a majority. I'm not saying I necessarily disagree with your vote, since I can understand where you're coming from. But there are still other possibilities you haven't seemed to explore and you really haven't weighed in on bum/ON at all. On September 04 2011 10:28 Ace wrote:HOWEVER, he is the BACKUP coroner right? That means he is the last one. Why the hell would he out himself just for Sinani when he just saw 3 people get Night Killed. He'll die by Day 3 and the Town will have no Coroners left. The game is essentially over at that point. Think about this for more than 5 seconds. He would do this because we don't have 5 high priests. Reviving the coroner is obviously the best option for a HP, not blindly reviving into the pool. If we know the coroner died then we need him to be revived the day after he dies, because after one cycle the coroner will be gone for good. So, let's say redFF is legitimately the backup coroner or whatever, and what he's saying about having limited checks is true. Then, he gives the HP information about who to revive. He chose a very retarded way to do it (by outing himself) but he put the information out there nonetheless. If you accept that redFF's claim is stupid and it'd get him killed if it was true, then why don't you lynch someone else today and let him eat a mafia bullet? If red is alive tomorrow then we can safely lynch him tomorrow! This is the primary reason I want to lynch ON and bum, because I have a very strong read on both of them and I think that, if red's claim is fake we can just lynch his ass tomorrow when he ends up dead. On September 04 2011 10:28 Ace wrote: As for your bolded that doesn't even make any sense. Bum avoiding a lynch doesn't make him Scummy, and it has no relation to sandroba's alleged role block. Even if sandroba voted for Bum, assuming bum is Scum why would that give him cause to RB sandroba? That doesn't add up at all. Faulty logic there. It's not faulty logic. The first person to get three people to vote on him was bum. Palmar, sandroba, and sinani all voted bum. He had those 3 votes until the daypost. Varpulis had like 1 vote at the time bum had 3, and sinani got 3 sometime after as well. If I remember correctly, if we just base this solely on how the votes panned out, the ONLY way that bum would've survived WITHOUT a roleblock is if there was a pious voter on both sinani AND varpulis. I find this highly unlikely. Sandroba's roleblock claim has not been counterclaimed. This suggests we should take it seriously. If he was roleblocked, his vote didn't count. This means that bum would've had only 2 votes on him, and Varp and sinani both had 3 or 4 (depending on pious)=varp and sinani got lynched. Remember that in the case of a tie, the first person to achieve that number of votes will die. Bum was the first of all 3 to achieve 3 votes. Thus, it's HIGHLY unlikely he escaped lynch by luck alone. On September 04 2011 10:28 Ace wrote: Your second point also makes no sense. Most votes wins, not majority. ON leaving his vote anywhere when there are low vote counts to die and a role that has double voting power means this tells you nothing unless Kenpachi dies by low vote count. Again, we don't know who's pious, and who's not. In the current situation, we have this: Person A with 3 (+/-1) votes. Person B with 2 (+/-1) votes. Person C with 2 (+/-1) votes. Person D with 2 (+/-1) votes. We should EXPECT Persons A and B to get lynched. Let's say Person B is mafia. Then, mafia roleblocks one voter on person B and then A+C die. Why is this important? Well, if we have 5/4 votes on persons A and B, there's no way that mafia can fuck with our votes. This is why ON throwing his vote on kenpachi/red in this case, when Person D had 1 vote, is really scummy. This prevents persons A and B from actually getting enough votes to be lynchable even with roleblock. On September 04 2011 10:28 Ace wrote: If red is playing like shit (very high possibility) and weird stuff is going on it makes sense to lynch him. An unconfirmed claim that is an automatic game over if he dies? Why are you even thinking about bum and ON? No, again, it doesn't make sense to lynch him today. It makes sense to lynch him tomorrow, because if he's actually the reserve coroner then we're wasting a lynch on him. If we leave him alive then we force the mafia to deal with him until at least tomorrow. As you say, if it's automatic game over if he dies, and he's clearly playing like shit, then why lynch him? | ||
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
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wherebugsgo
Japan10647 Posts
EBWOP, in red is a substitution: If you accept that redFF's claim is stupid and it'd get him killed if it was true, then why don't you lynch someone else today and let him eat a mafia bullet? If red is alive tomorrow then we can safely lynch him tomorrow! This is the primary reason I want to lynch ON and bum, because I have a very strong read on both of them and I think that, if red's claim is fake we can just lynch his ass tomorrow when he shows up alive. | ||
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