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Done catching up with the thread. So far:
-mandatory electionposts by various people.
-people wanting to hang certain veterans just because they are veterans
-30 pages on BC's mason claim.
-people posting screenshots
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and re. I'll be voting BM right now. d1 (like RL-d1) I thought it's the most horrible thing possible but he gives me townvibes.
There's no way I will vote for sandro, bc or bum because I think either 1 or 2 out of them is scum and the mafia out of those is trying to screw with me / us.
I just don't want to vote into that triangle of I-don't-know.
wbg would be an alternative but I've got more of an stubborn-palmar read than a useless-palmar read and I'd like to lynch someone else d1. If possible someone who's not a vet and leave palmar for d2.
Wiggles and kita didn't say a lot lately so although I (somehow) got a townfeeling out of that much nothing I'd much rather vote someone else.
Mattchew and VE a re both town but I'd rather have someone else in that position imo.
Oh and everyone who got no mention either is hard to judge for me or is not worth a mention. Deal with it :p
Still catching up. I'm reading the last 2 pages, I'm eating and I will post a little bit more if needed.
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Oh and that I've been promoting Mattchew a lot, should stand by itself. Not exactly a good scum move.
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On January 15 2012 03:44 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 03:29 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 15 2012 03:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 15 2012 03:00 VisceraEyes wrote:
How does the fact that I pulled out of the elections make me more suspicious?
And did you completely ignore my plea for help regarding my mason situation? Or do you not care because now I'm suspicious? You as a former candidate go out of your way to encourage people to withdraw votes based on a lie. You can say you misread my post which potentially believable due to its length I find unlikely. If people were actively waiting for a piece of information then my large posts theoretically should be read carefully for said information. You are not like jay who has been on my nuts all game. Had you chosen to encourage people to not vote for me as I claimed mason and had solid reasons behind it then I would see you as more townlike, as it would also be discrediting another player with the same claim. By opting to instead cherry pick one candidate over the other I see an inconsistancy. I say this as you made mention before in thread that you had reservations of electing me before as my alignment with my role was not provable (minus a lynching obviously), however this issue would be near identical to another mason and had you kept with that line of thinking as two masons were in the running I would have understood. Singling me out however, via incorrect information, is why you are on my list. sup? first of all, I want to say sorry for saying the unvote thing. Regardless of what my read is of you, people should've unvoted you, if you didn't name your mason buddy. Which you did and therefore my statement was wront. I missed it, sorry! But it was well hidden. Normally such an anouncement is bold and on top of a post. But I guess, you have your reasons. Then, I was not on your nuts all game long. In the beginning, I actually was your biggest stan and saying your campaign is the best. Enter your roleclaim. As I stated like a billion times the motives behind it is still unclear to me. If you can describe me the upsides of your roleclaim, I will not think of you as scum again. Even more so, If you convince me your really town favoured, I will vote you again, since your campaign was the best and you're a good player. But since you kind of just nourished the discussion, but never thematized the timing of the roleclaim, you're scummy to me. The Hydra's case on you is pretty good IMO and is in line of what I believe. I try to be constructive, not just choose a player and piss him off. Using the phrase "has been on my nuts all game" is more or less accurate. You are really the only person who has been against me for a decent period of time. You also have said your reasons why. Do i agree with them? No. I do understand them however. If you compare what you were doing to what VE did you would understand why he is on a radar now and you are currently not. However, as for the upsides of my claim. Look at the specific post Incog (the hydra) quoted of mine from my town analysis thread that I believe i linked in a previous post. (if i didnt i can dig it up, its also somewhere on page 4-6 i believe of the mafia forum). I stress that most people don't use pm's correctly. In a situation where only a few specific players have access to that domain, it gives the mafia an advantage. They will have 10 people able to work on manipulating a player. You can say "i am going to look for manipulation so it won't happen" but again. Ask what I did to VE. It was subtle and vile. All I did was plant an idea that I knew he would think on and run with, and he did it in a way I knew he would. Manipulation is not obvious and a good player will know exactly how to do it without being caught. Mafia will have 10 people making sure its done right. I know that I can freely romp in pm land, but no smart mafia is going to talk to me seriously if i mason them. Why? Because i could do to them what they would do to another player. As such I had to think. How likely is it that only top players got the mason role? Unlikely as fw rng's roles. We are also a gimped mason as we lose contact with who we target after each cycle and can never use it on them again. This is inherently not helpful to town. Why? Because a townie benefits from bouncing ideas off one another in pms. However you need the time to build up a "trust" of sorts with the person to actually get a serious discussion on reads. People will naturally always suspect you at first when mason'd or at least they should. That is not alot of time to get by the distrust and have a discussion of who x and y think is scum. Then you have to go over all those pms and see if there is a hidden agenda there. PM's in the way we traditionally use them to "bounce ideas" or find scum are used over long periods of time with people mulling over information. As your ability to get reads is so short term they are unreliable and far more useful to manipulate or mislead which takes far less effort, and is doable in a much faster span of time. As such I opted to want to discuss the role. However, I also knew that based on my decision to heavily push this point, I would be forced to claim my role as there would be no way I would be able to hide that fact for the game while pushing heavy on its discussion. Even if I could, it could lead masons to out and out claim and would look extremely bad if I didn't while essentially outing people in thread. As such I did right from the get go.
If you feel like the role is gimped and less helpful for town in this fashion, what is there to discuss? How we should handle people who mason us? What was the conclusion that we've drawn from all this discussion that's been generated BC? NONE! Know how I know? Because I've been masoned and I specifically appealed to town for help in deciding how to handle it and NO ONE HAS EVEN ACKNOWLEDGED IT! Even you when I specifically asked you about it! So what good did the discussion you generated yesterday really do?
But you know, fuck all because now I'm suspicious right? I don't deserve help, answers or even acknowledgment.
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Ugh, I lead the poor guy into that mod-kill... I'm going to take a break and mull over the game, maybe sleep...
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See Mattchew....NOW you're confirmed. 
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oh Mattchew was modkilled? 
Oh at least I was right there. That at least gives me a little confidence in my reads because that triangle of doom is still stupid as it can get to judge and something is not making sense there
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ok whatever here I go.
Look at this little post made by yours truely (there are more in my filter):
On January 14 2012 21:45 Jayjay54 wrote:Hi friends! Up and awake. Spending my time at a Starbucks in order to stay on track. Sorry if I cover older posts in my analysis, I was asleep. Topics to discuss: A) Mattchew Let’s analyze his post. Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 10:46 Mattchew wrote:
I am running for Mayor.
I believe you should vote for me because I am confirmed town. How? Let me explain. I am a mason who used my first "masoning" on Foolishness. In the past I have proven not great at this game both as mafia and as town. I also have not been a good listener to scum team advice when it is given to me. So the odds of a scum team picking me to be their mason is slim to none. Not really an argument. A variance of the usual “I suck at scum”. Nothing special.Also, the fact that I pm'd arguably the best townie player in the game should prove in itself that I am town. I am not a vet or a well regarded player, why would any scum team even consider the thought of letting me either a. (if foolishness is also scum) claim to PM one of their best players and spotlight him or b. (if foolishness is town) let me PM one of the best townies and maybe get myself caught. This is logic. This make sense. Why would mafia PM the best town player straight away? After he already started a campaign for BM. There is no real perspective for scum here. And the idea that both are scum is strange, too. The BM campaign wouldn’t make sense. There’s no chance that all 3 are scum.Why should we vote you if you are bad?A. I am confirmed town. This is by far the best reason to elect me. Not really confirmed. But by logic he’s likely town.B. I would become a roleblock immune, mason, with either 3 votes (mayor) or a jailing ability. Masons can’t get roleblock! They have a day action. So B is not really an issue. The townish vibes make the difference here. C. The fact that I am a mason allows me to solicit advice on my actions behind closed doors from veteran players. While I obviously will be extremely skeptical in everything they tell me, it is better than a Mayor acting purely on his own. I will not be manipulated because I will present the options and ask their opinions on them. I will not be asking broad questions, yet specific questions to leave little to no room for scum influence. Makes sense to me. That is why the BC claim timing was so odd to me. He would have had a great chance to become mayor. What is your stance on Mayoral Issues.I will be active. I can read and respond while at work. Monday - Friday I should be on and reading from 13:30 GMT (+00:00) to 04:00 GMT (+00:00). Saturday and sunday I will be reading and responding while watching football but as the day progresses I will probably be getting more and more drunk, around 03:00 GMT (+00:00). The standard obligatory "I suck at scum" I currently am looking at 3 candidates for the day 1 lynch and will be open to discussion on all 3. Those 3 are (in no particular order) Ciryandor, Mapco, Chaosquo is also good. The mayor downside of his post . I agree with WBG here, these candidates suck. Would like to see Echelot or Palmar here. Mapco is a new player, you can clearly see it. So why lynch him.I am now open for questions for the next half hour or so before company arrives at my house and I will be offline until 16:00 GMT (+00:00) That being said, before he was roleclaiming, he already posted some really townish posts to back him up like this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=31#605http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=31#612http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=35#682He is clearly applying logic to help town. Passionately fighting for the right townplay. Thinking ahead and providing opinions and information. I like this. A lot. In the bigger picture, his playstyle alongside masoning foolishness doesn’t make sense as a scum play. The PM log seems consistent to other stuff they’ve been saying. E.g. foolishness attitude towards masons. It’s either well faked or real. Foolishness would never suggest his mafia buddy BM if he were scum only to proceed and claim another scum buddy. That’s way too risky. Therefore, I am convinced. And my townread clearly outweigh the disagreement in the lynch choices. So here it is: ##vote Mattchew [/b]
It's Mattchew as you now know.
Ask yourself. Is that a scum post? Is it? Really? REALLY? Didn't think so.
So, if you are scared of ending up with a scum mayor. Vote Jayjay for mayor. That's right. I put myself out there. Not because I am experienced. But I got good reads, am active (probably one of the most active ones), look beautiful and I am not really a scum as I've shown!
Just giving my town friends another option.
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Jayjay you're pushing yourself on the premise of "I've got good reads because I...correctly called out a townie"
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You know that scum know when someone's townie, right? Why don't you correctly call out someone as scum and THEN talk about how good your reads are. Seriously...
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On January 15 2012 04:01 Toadesstern wrote:
and re. I'll be voting BM right now. d1 (like RL-d1) I thought it's the most horrible thing possible but he gives me townvibes.
There's no way I will vote for sandro, bc or bum because I think either 1 or 2 out of them is scum and the mafia out of those is trying to screw with me / us.
I just don't want to vote into that triangle of I-don't-know.
wbg would be an alternative but I've got more of an stubborn-palmar read than a useless-palmar read and I'd like to lynch someone else d1. If possible someone who's not a vet and leave palmar for d2.
Wiggles and kita didn't say a lot lately so although I (somehow) got a townfeeling out of that much nothing I'd much rather vote someone else.
Mattchew and VE a re both town but I'd rather have someone else in that position imo.
Oh and everyone who got no mention either is hard to judge for me or is not worth a mention. Deal with it :p
Still catching up. I'm reading the last 2 pages, I'm eating and I will post a little bit more if needed.
I'll take that as me being too awesome for your judgement or something.
I'd like to hear from Foolishness now.
What made it seem like a good idea to make Mattchew run for mayor, over equally active people she had more history with? Why is she interested in controlling Bill Murray?
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On January 15 2012 04:13 VisceraEyes wrote:
Jayjay you're pushing yourself on the premise of "I've got good reads because I...correctly called out a townie"
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You know that scum know when someone's townie, right? Why don't you correctly call out someone as scum and THEN talk about how good your reads are. Seriously...
I did not say that because of my Mattchew read. That's not the point. I got confidence in my logic and in my game.
The real point is, that I am TOWN. And I think I did give proof for that.
People were already saying how bad it is to have a 25% chance of getting a scum mayor and that randomly giving it to somebody would be better because it's 20% then. Well guess what, I am 100% homegrown town and therefore a safe option.
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On January 15 2012 04:11 Jayjay54 wrote:ok whatever here I go. Look at this little post made by yours truely (there are more in my filter): Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 21:45 Jayjay54 wrote:Hi friends! Up and awake. Spending my time at a Starbucks in order to stay on track. Sorry if I cover older posts in my analysis, I was asleep. Topics to discuss: A) Mattchew Let’s analyze his post. On January 14 2012 10:46 Mattchew wrote:
I am running for Mayor.
I believe you should vote for me because I am confirmed town. How? Let me explain. I am a mason who used my first "masoning" on Foolishness. In the past I have proven not great at this game both as mafia and as town. I also have not been a good listener to scum team advice when it is given to me. So the odds of a scum team picking me to be their mason is slim to none. Not really an argument. A variance of the usual “I suck at scum”. Nothing special.Also, the fact that I pm'd arguably the best townie player in the game should prove in itself that I am town. I am not a vet or a well regarded player, why would any scum team even consider the thought of letting me either a. (if foolishness is also scum) claim to PM one of their best players and spotlight him or b. (if foolishness is town) let me PM one of the best townies and maybe get myself caught. This is logic. This make sense. Why would mafia PM the best town player straight away? After he already started a campaign for BM. There is no real perspective for scum here. And the idea that both are scum is strange, too. The BM campaign wouldn’t make sense. There’s no chance that all 3 are scum.Why should we vote you if you are bad?A. I am confirmed town. This is by far the best reason to elect me. Not really confirmed. But by logic he’s likely town.B. I would become a roleblock immune, mason, with either 3 votes (mayor) or a jailing ability. Masons can’t get roleblock! They have a day action. So B is not really an issue. The townish vibes make the difference here. C. The fact that I am a mason allows me to solicit advice on my actions behind closed doors from veteran players. While I obviously will be extremely skeptical in everything they tell me, it is better than a Mayor acting purely on his own. I will not be manipulated because I will present the options and ask their opinions on them. I will not be asking broad questions, yet specific questions to leave little to no room for scum influence. Makes sense to me. That is why the BC claim timing was so odd to me. He would have had a great chance to become mayor. What is your stance on Mayoral Issues.I will be active. I can read and respond while at work. Monday - Friday I should be on and reading from 13:30 GMT (+00:00) to 04:00 GMT (+00:00). Saturday and sunday I will be reading and responding while watching football but as the day progresses I will probably be getting more and more drunk, around 03:00 GMT (+00:00). The standard obligatory "I suck at scum" I currently am looking at 3 candidates for the day 1 lynch and will be open to discussion on all 3. Those 3 are (in no particular order) Ciryandor, Mapco, Chaosquo is also good. The mayor downside of his post . I agree with WBG here, these candidates suck. Would like to see Echelot or Palmar here. Mapco is a new player, you can clearly see it. So why lynch him.I am now open for questions for the next half hour or so before company arrives at my house and I will be offline until 16:00 GMT (+00:00) That being said, before he was roleclaiming, he already posted some really townish posts to back him up like this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=31#605http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=31#612http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=35#682He is clearly applying logic to help town. Passionately fighting for the right townplay. Thinking ahead and providing opinions and information. I like this. A lot. In the bigger picture, his playstyle alongside masoning foolishness doesn’t make sense as a scum play. The PM log seems consistent to other stuff they’ve been saying. E.g. foolishness attitude towards masons. It’s either well faked or real. Foolishness would never suggest his mafia buddy BM if he were scum only to proceed and claim another scum buddy. That’s way too risky. Therefore, I am convinced. And my townread clearly outweigh the disagreement in the lynch choices. So here it is: ##vote Mattchew It's Mattchew as you now know. Ask yourself. Is that a scum post? Is it? Really? REALLY? Didn't think so. So, if you are scared of ending up with a scum mayor. Vote Jayjay for mayor. That's right. I put myself out there. Not because I am experienced. But I got good reads, am active (probably one of the most active ones), look beautiful and I am not really a scum as I've shown! Just giving my town friends another option. [/b]
Mattchew seemed to be easy to control for the brief time he was here. I could theoretically have seen voting for him as scum agenda. Not only that, you're attempting to take town cred from the flip, and use it as the sole basis to start an entirely new wagon?
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On January 15 2012 04:04 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 03:44 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 15 2012 03:29 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 15 2012 03:08 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 15 2012 03:00 VisceraEyes wrote:
How does the fact that I pulled out of the elections make me more suspicious?
And did you completely ignore my plea for help regarding my mason situation? Or do you not care because now I'm suspicious? You as a former candidate go out of your way to encourage people to withdraw votes based on a lie. You can say you misread my post which potentially believable due to its length I find unlikely. If people were actively waiting for a piece of information then my large posts theoretically should be read carefully for said information. You are not like jay who has been on my nuts all game. Had you chosen to encourage people to not vote for me as I claimed mason and had solid reasons behind it then I would see you as more townlike, as it would also be discrediting another player with the same claim. By opting to instead cherry pick one candidate over the other I see an inconsistancy. I say this as you made mention before in thread that you had reservations of electing me before as my alignment with my role was not provable (minus a lynching obviously), however this issue would be near identical to another mason and had you kept with that line of thinking as two masons were in the running I would have understood. Singling me out however, via incorrect information, is why you are on my list. sup? first of all, I want to say sorry for saying the unvote thing. Regardless of what my read is of you, people should've unvoted you, if you didn't name your mason buddy. Which you did and therefore my statement was wront. I missed it, sorry! But it was well hidden. Normally such an anouncement is bold and on top of a post. But I guess, you have your reasons. Then, I was not on your nuts all game long. In the beginning, I actually was your biggest stan and saying your campaign is the best. Enter your roleclaim. As I stated like a billion times the motives behind it is still unclear to me. If you can describe me the upsides of your roleclaim, I will not think of you as scum again. Even more so, If you convince me your really town favoured, I will vote you again, since your campaign was the best and you're a good player. But since you kind of just nourished the discussion, but never thematized the timing of the roleclaim, you're scummy to me. The Hydra's case on you is pretty good IMO and is in line of what I believe. I try to be constructive, not just choose a player and piss him off. Using the phrase "has been on my nuts all game" is more or less accurate. You are really the only person who has been against me for a decent period of time. You also have said your reasons why. Do i agree with them? No. I do understand them however. If you compare what you were doing to what VE did you would understand why he is on a radar now and you are currently not. However, as for the upsides of my claim. Look at the specific post Incog (the hydra) quoted of mine from my town analysis thread that I believe i linked in a previous post. (if i didnt i can dig it up, its also somewhere on page 4-6 i believe of the mafia forum). I stress that most people don't use pm's correctly. In a situation where only a few specific players have access to that domain, it gives the mafia an advantage. They will have 10 people able to work on manipulating a player. You can say "i am going to look for manipulation so it won't happen" but again. Ask what I did to VE. It was subtle and vile. All I did was plant an idea that I knew he would think on and run with, and he did it in a way I knew he would. Manipulation is not obvious and a good player will know exactly how to do it without being caught. Mafia will have 10 people making sure its done right. I know that I can freely romp in pm land, but no smart mafia is going to talk to me seriously if i mason them. Why? Because i could do to them what they would do to another player. As such I had to think. How likely is it that only top players got the mason role? Unlikely as fw rng's roles. We are also a gimped mason as we lose contact with who we target after each cycle and can never use it on them again. This is inherently not helpful to town. Why? Because a townie benefits from bouncing ideas off one another in pms. However you need the time to build up a "trust" of sorts with the person to actually get a serious discussion on reads. People will naturally always suspect you at first when mason'd or at least they should. That is not alot of time to get by the distrust and have a discussion of who x and y think is scum. Then you have to go over all those pms and see if there is a hidden agenda there. PM's in the way we traditionally use them to "bounce ideas" or find scum are used over long periods of time with people mulling over information. As your ability to get reads is so short term they are unreliable and far more useful to manipulate or mislead which takes far less effort, and is doable in a much faster span of time. As such I opted to want to discuss the role. However, I also knew that based on my decision to heavily push this point, I would be forced to claim my role as there would be no way I would be able to hide that fact for the game while pushing heavy on its discussion. Even if I could, it could lead masons to out and out claim and would look extremely bad if I didn't while essentially outing people in thread. As such I did right from the get go. If you feel like the role is gimped and less helpful for town in this fashion, what is there to discuss? How we should handle people who mason us? What was the conclusion that we've drawn from all this discussion that's been generated BC? NONE! Know how I know? Because I've been masoned and I specifically appealed to town for help in deciding how to handle it and NO ONE HAS EVEN ACKNOWLEDGED IT! Even you when I specifically asked you about it! So what good did the discussion you generated yesterday really do? But you know, fuck all because now I'm suspicious right? I don't deserve help, answers or even acknowledgment.
You do realize I agreed with the all masons should roleclaim and if they don't where the town says they should we auto bus them (not doing something the town as a whole agrees to is inherently scummy regardless of how someone wants to spin it). If town doesn't agree to this then we all agree to ignore all masons and play the game solely in thread. It is a gimped town tool that in its design favours mafia.
Read my posts again, where I said IGNORE MY SPECIFIC CLAIM, and discuss how to deal with masons in general. I already knew the shitstorm would and tried to stop it then, people focus'd on one aspect of my post. Apparently I was wrong and should have claimed after I made discussion, most likely got elected and dealt with people harassing me then.
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On January 15 2012 04:14 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 04:01 Toadesstern wrote:
and re. I'll be voting BM right now. d1 (like RL-d1) I thought it's the most horrible thing possible but he gives me townvibes.
There's no way I will vote for sandro, bc or bum because I think either 1 or 2 out of them is scum and the mafia out of those is trying to screw with me / us.
I just don't want to vote into that triangle of I-don't-know.
wbg would be an alternative but I've got more of an stubborn-palmar read than a useless-palmar read and I'd like to lynch someone else d1. If possible someone who's not a vet and leave palmar for d2.
Wiggles and kita didn't say a lot lately so although I (somehow) got a townfeeling out of that much nothing I'd much rather vote someone else.
Mattchew and VE a re both town but I'd rather have someone else in that position imo.
Oh and everyone who got no mention either is hard to judge for me or is not worth a mention. Deal with it :p
Still catching up. I'm reading the last 2 pages, I'm eating and I will post a little bit more if needed. I'll take that as me being too awesome for your judgement or something. I'd like to hear from Foolishness now. What made it seem like a good idea to make Mattchew run for mayor, over equally active people she had more history with? Why is she interested in controlling Bill Murray?
actually yeah. I have no idea what you're up to at this point in time. I'm going to quote from my sheet:
7. Cyber_Cheese
I haven o idea
no idea at all
I tried several times to get something about you going but I never was able to put something into words. You're like THE nullread I have in this game and I don't know why I have so much trouble to figure you out. Want to to me a faver and tell me real fast who you want to lynch and who's the best mayor in your opinion (other than yourself) ?
I don't really want to read your filter again right now
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On January 15 2012 04:16 Jayjay54 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 04:13 VisceraEyes wrote:
Jayjay you're pushing yourself on the premise of "I've got good reads because I...correctly called out a townie"
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You know that scum know when someone's townie, right? Why don't you correctly call out someone as scum and THEN talk about how good your reads are. Seriously... I did not say that because of my Mattchew read. That's not the point. I got confidence in my logic and in my game. The real point is, that I am TOWN. And I think I did give proof for that. People were already saying how bad it is to have a 25% chance of getting a scum mayor and that randomly giving it to somebody would be better because it's 20% then. Well guess what, I am 100% homegrown town and therefore a safe option.
to be fair, the chances of electing scum is dependent on the scum to town ratio of candidates. As in, if 2 townies run and 3 mafia run there is a 60% chance of electing a scum.
That math is dependent on the amount of candidates for each alignment running.
Based on the modkill I want foolishness to speak up and stop lurking, also incog or mystlord has to make an appearance. 3 posts over the first game day when two people are on an account is inexcusable.
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On January 15 2012 04:19 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 04:11 Jayjay54 wrote:ok whatever here I go. Look at this little post made by yours truely (there are more in my filter): On January 14 2012 21:45 Jayjay54 wrote:Hi friends! Up and awake. Spending my time at a Starbucks in order to stay on track. Sorry if I cover older posts in my analysis, I was asleep. Topics to discuss: A) Mattchew Let’s analyze his post. On January 14 2012 10:46 Mattchew wrote:
I am running for Mayor.
I believe you should vote for me because I am confirmed town. How? Let me explain. I am a mason who used my first "masoning" on Foolishness. In the past I have proven not great at this game both as mafia and as town. I also have not been a good listener to scum team advice when it is given to me. So the odds of a scum team picking me to be their mason is slim to none. Not really an argument. A variance of the usual “I suck at scum”. Nothing special.Also, the fact that I pm'd arguably the best townie player in the game should prove in itself that I am town. I am not a vet or a well regarded player, why would any scum team even consider the thought of letting me either a. (if foolishness is also scum) claim to PM one of their best players and spotlight him or b. (if foolishness is town) let me PM one of the best townies and maybe get myself caught. This is logic. This make sense. Why would mafia PM the best town player straight away? After he already started a campaign for BM. There is no real perspective for scum here. And the idea that both are scum is strange, too. The BM campaign wouldn’t make sense. There’s no chance that all 3 are scum.Why should we vote you if you are bad?A. I am confirmed town. This is by far the best reason to elect me. Not really confirmed. But by logic he’s likely town.B. I would become a roleblock immune, mason, with either 3 votes (mayor) or a jailing ability. Masons can’t get roleblock! They have a day action. So B is not really an issue. The townish vibes make the difference here. C. The fact that I am a mason allows me to solicit advice on my actions behind closed doors from veteran players. While I obviously will be extremely skeptical in everything they tell me, it is better than a Mayor acting purely on his own. I will not be manipulated because I will present the options and ask their opinions on them. I will not be asking broad questions, yet specific questions to leave little to no room for scum influence. Makes sense to me. That is why the BC claim timing was so odd to me. He would have had a great chance to become mayor. What is your stance on Mayoral Issues.I will be active. I can read and respond while at work. Monday - Friday I should be on and reading from 13:30 GMT (+00:00) to 04:00 GMT (+00:00). Saturday and sunday I will be reading and responding while watching football but as the day progresses I will probably be getting more and more drunk, around 03:00 GMT (+00:00). The standard obligatory "I suck at scum" I currently am looking at 3 candidates for the day 1 lynch and will be open to discussion on all 3. Those 3 are (in no particular order) Ciryandor, Mapco, Chaosquo is also good. The mayor downside of his post . I agree with WBG here, these candidates suck. Would like to see Echelot or Palmar here. Mapco is a new player, you can clearly see it. So why lynch him.I am now open for questions for the next half hour or so before company arrives at my house and I will be offline until 16:00 GMT (+00:00) That being said, before he was roleclaiming, he already posted some really townish posts to back him up like this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=31#605http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=31#612http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=35#682He is clearly applying logic to help town. Passionately fighting for the right townplay. Thinking ahead and providing opinions and information. I like this. A lot. In the bigger picture, his playstyle alongside masoning foolishness doesn’t make sense as a scum play. The PM log seems consistent to other stuff they’ve been saying. E.g. foolishness attitude towards masons. It’s either well faked or real. Foolishness would never suggest his mafia buddy BM if he were scum only to proceed and claim another scum buddy. That’s way too risky. Therefore, I am convinced. And my townread clearly outweigh the disagreement in the lynch choices. So here it is: ##vote Mattchew It's Mattchew as you now know. Ask yourself. Is that a scum post? Is it? Really? REALLY? Didn't think so. So, if you are scared of ending up with a scum mayor. Vote Jayjay for mayor. That's right. I put myself out there. Not because I am experienced. But I got good reads, am active (probably one of the most active ones), look beautiful and I am not really a scum as I've shown! Just giving my town friends another option. Mattchew seemed to be easy to control for the brief time he was here. I could theoretically have seen voting for him as scum agenda. Not only that, you're attempting to take town cred from the flip, and use it as the sole basis to start an entirely new wagon? [/b]
Yes I do take town cred for that! If I would've been scum, why would I push so hardly for a town mayor? To gamble that I can control him? Why not push for a scum mayor? To gamble that the one I push for gets modkilled?
You look at the post and you seriously have doubt that I am town? You ask yourself, if my posts make sense as scum and answer with yes? Ok I guess I have to live with that. I hope most people see it as what it is. Post that show that I am town.
I don't want to start a new wagon (is there even one right now, I just see people randomly voting). I'm just saying, if the risk is really high to get a scum mayor, it might be better to get a townie.
Even if I don't get mayor, I think it's good for townies to know how incredebly towny I am.
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On January 15 2012 04:16 Jayjay54 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 04:13 VisceraEyes wrote:
Jayjay you're pushing yourself on the premise of "I've got good reads because I...correctly called out a townie"
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You know that scum know when someone's townie, right? Why don't you correctly call out someone as scum and THEN talk about how good your reads are. Seriously... I did not say that because of my Mattchew read. That's not the point. I got confidence in my logic and in my game. The real point is, that I am TOWN. And I think I did give proof for that. People were already saying how bad it is to have a 25% chance of getting a scum mayor and that randomly giving it to somebody would be better because it's 20% then. Well guess what, I am 100% homegrown town and therefore a safe option.
here's the point:
1) I don't like talking about that math bullshit. That's all talk about "what would happen if we make a true rnd vote". That's not going to happen. Never ever. Fine with me mentioning but I don't think we need it right now
2) I think you're town but I don't want you to be mayor because I don't thnk you're up to it. I don't go for mayor myself although I said mattchew is a townie and ended up being right because that call was easy as it can get.
3) I'll say it once more: I think you're townie, but you running for mayor is not going to help town right now. Not at all.
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On January 15 2012 04:24 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 04:14 Cyber_Cheese wrote:On January 15 2012 04:01 Toadesstern wrote:
and re. I'll be voting BM right now. d1 (like RL-d1) I thought it's the most horrible thing possible but he gives me townvibes.
There's no way I will vote for sandro, bc or bum because I think either 1 or 2 out of them is scum and the mafia out of those is trying to screw with me / us.
I just don't want to vote into that triangle of I-don't-know.
wbg would be an alternative but I've got more of an stubborn-palmar read than a useless-palmar read and I'd like to lynch someone else d1. If possible someone who's not a vet and leave palmar for d2.
Wiggles and kita didn't say a lot lately so although I (somehow) got a townfeeling out of that much nothing I'd much rather vote someone else.
Mattchew and VE a re both town but I'd rather have someone else in that position imo.
Oh and everyone who got no mention either is hard to judge for me or is not worth a mention. Deal with it :p
Still catching up. I'm reading the last 2 pages, I'm eating and I will post a little bit more if needed. I'll take that as me being too awesome for your judgement or something. I'd like to hear from Foolishness now. What made it seem like a good idea to make Mattchew run for mayor, over equally active people she had more history with? Why is she interested in controlling Bill Murray? actually yeah. I have no idea what you're up to at this point in time. I'm going to quote from my sheet: I tried several times to get something about you going but I never was able to put something into words. You're like THE nullread I have in this game and I don't know why I have so much trouble to figure you out. Want to to me a faver and tell me real fast who you want to lynch and who's the best mayor in your opinion (other than yourself) ? I don't really want to read your filter again right now
Mayor, I honestly have no idea. I was pretty close to going for Mattchew after he explained how he got to choosing Foolishness. I suppose BC doesn't seem like the bad choice people make him out to be, I feel like he's explained his plan enough.
Lynch... Probably VisceraEyes or Risk.Nuke, for starting a mayorial campaign and giving up on it.
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On January 15 2012 04:31 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 04:24 Toadesstern wrote:On January 15 2012 04:14 Cyber_Cheese wrote:On January 15 2012 04:01 Toadesstern wrote:
and re. I'll be voting BM right now. d1 (like RL-d1) I thought it's the most horrible thing possible but he gives me townvibes.
There's no way I will vote for sandro, bc or bum because I think either 1 or 2 out of them is scum and the mafia out of those is trying to screw with me / us.
I just don't want to vote into that triangle of I-don't-know.
wbg would be an alternative but I've got more of an stubborn-palmar read than a useless-palmar read and I'd like to lynch someone else d1. If possible someone who's not a vet and leave palmar for d2.
Wiggles and kita didn't say a lot lately so although I (somehow) got a townfeeling out of that much nothing I'd much rather vote someone else.
Mattchew and VE a re both town but I'd rather have someone else in that position imo.
Oh and everyone who got no mention either is hard to judge for me or is not worth a mention. Deal with it :p
Still catching up. I'm reading the last 2 pages, I'm eating and I will post a little bit more if needed. I'll take that as me being too awesome for your judgement or something. I'd like to hear from Foolishness now. What made it seem like a good idea to make Mattchew run for mayor, over equally active people she had more history with? Why is she interested in controlling Bill Murray? actually yeah. I have no idea what you're up to at this point in time. I'm going to quote from my sheet: 7. Cyber_Cheese
I haven o idea
no idea at all I tried several times to get something about you going but I never was able to put something into words. You're like THE nullread I have in this game and I don't know why I have so much trouble to figure you out. Want to to me a faver and tell me real fast who you want to lynch and who's the best mayor in your opinion (other than yourself) ? I don't really want to read your filter again right now Mayor, I honestly have no idea. I was pretty close to going for Mattchew after he explained how he got to choosing Foolishness. I suppose BC doesn't seem like the bad choice people make him out to be, I feel like he's explained his plan enough. Lynch... Probably VisceraEyes or Risk.Nuke, for starting a mayorial campaign and giving up on it.
To clarify the lynch. I want the scummiest person who ran for mayor. I'm just not sure who that is at the moment.
Sandroba seems like a decent option.
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EPT
