EPTTL Mafia XXXVI - Page 16
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Jackal58
United States4264 Posts
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Amber[LighT]
United States5078 Posts
(my bad) | ||
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BrownBear
United States6894 Posts
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Kavdragon
United States1251 Posts
On January 23 2011 16:25 kitaman27 wrote: I would like to announce my intention to run for Mayor on behalf of the Kavdragon sucks Party! Do not allow yourselves to be deceived by his well thought out posts and eagerness to lead the town to victory. I promise a campaign that delivers straight facts, rather than the propaganda spewing machine he has created. FACT: Kavdragon was mafia in Pokemafia. kitaman27 has never been mafia. FACT: Kavdragon has never correctly landed a vig hit. kitaman27 has never missed a vig hit* *while not being role blocked FACT: First is the worst. Second is the best. Third is the one with the treasure chest. Now allow me to uncover some shocking revelations: Using pro-town technology, I was able to uncover an additional hidden arrow. You heard it here first folks, kavdragon is a mod-confirmed scum. For those too lazy to translate here is what that means: I'm pretty sure I've seen similar symbols in a Call of Duty game in COMMUNIST RUSSIA! That's right, Kavdragon is a COMMUNIST. And what color do communists love? Red. What color is scum? Red. What color is the communist scum Kavdragon? Red + Show Spoiler [Text Endorsements] + On August 9 1974 11:63 VER wrote: Kav's the One. Kav for mayor. On January 20 1961 11:63 Node wrote: I Like Kav. Vote for Kav. On January 22 2011 11:24 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I'm Meapak_Ziphh and I approve this message. On January 22 2011 11:26 SiNiquity wrote: I'm SiNiquity and I approve this message. On January 21 2011 08:42 LSB wrote: KAV 4 MAYOR! I'll make you a mspaint poster!!!! Hey look, he was even kind enough to provide the entire scum team! As mayor, these would be my first 5 targets. In addition, as I predict to be the number one scum target as mayor, I nominate Kavdragon as my bodyguard to soak up all the bullets aimed in my direction. Has anyone noticed he never indicated which side would be victorious? How convenient. Let me fix that for you. Ok, so there are some blatant lies, and misleading statements here: 1) Using pro-town technology, I was able to uncover an additional hidden arrow. You heard it here first folks, kavdragon is a mod-confirmed scum. Hey! You just copy and pasted that arrow from a picture take during Pokemafia! It's true that my amazing transformation into a AWESOME MAFIA KILLING DRAGON OF DOOM takes a few games, that picture was simply taken a couple games too early. 2) Kavdragon has never correctly landed a vig hit. Arguably my role in Merc Mafia could be considred a "vig" role. So I have hit someone. 3) lolz this town is full of noobs. Unless a brave, handsome individual comes forth to oppose me, this game is already over. Brb, going to kill some puppies. -Kavdragon You mistranslated that last line, it should be: "Brb, going to go kill some kittens. --Father Kavdragon" + Show Spoiler + Not true. I love kittens. Please don't hurt me flamewheel. On January 23 2011 18:13 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: also why does everyone keep talking about Qatol? Hes not even in the game o.O? Do we really want a mayor who can't keep up? Is this the kind of question we want our mayor to ask? | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
On January 23 2011 18:13 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: also why does everyone keep talking about Qatol? Hes not even in the game o.O? Clearly it is because I'm so important I am a suspect even in games I'm not playing in.  | ||
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aidnai
United States1159 Posts
On January 23 2011 16:25 kitaman27 wrote: I would like to announce my intention to run for Mayor on behalf of the Kavdragon sucks Party! I support this message | ||
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BrownBear
United States6894 Posts
On January 24 2011 02:39 Qatol wrote: Clearly it is because I'm so important I am a suspect even in games I'm not playing in. Quiet, scum  | ||
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BrownBear
United States6894 Posts
On January 23 2011 23:52 Jackal58 wrote: So not having played in a game yet with an elected mayor and body guards isn't being selected as body guard a death sentence on night 1? The Bodyguard role is hidden, so nobody knows who's selected (except maybe the mayor? Pretty sure even he doesn't know, but not sure.) | ||
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SiNiquity
United States734 Posts
Mayor Elections will take place on day 1. When elected, you will publicly select two bodyguards to protect you for the rest of the game. While bodyguards are alive, you cannot be targeted by night hits or the roleblocker. | ||
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BrownBear
United States6894 Posts
Then yeah, I have a question: How is that balanced? | ||
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Amber[LighT]
United States5078 Posts
On January 24 2011 03:14 BrownBear wrote: Oh hey, look at that. Derp. I'm too used to standard play. Then yeah, I have a question: How is that balanced? If a pro-town mayor picks scum bodyguards then the mayor is pretty safe from mafia hits imo... | ||
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LSB
United States5171 Posts
On January 24 2011 03:14 BrownBear wrote: Oh hey, look at that. Derp. I'm too used to standard play. Then yeah, I have a question: How is that balanced? Publically? Well, remember, there is no role reveal. So if the bodyguards isn't public the Mayor is invincible. | ||
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BrownBear
United States6894 Posts
On January 24 2011 03:27 Amber[LighT] wrote: If a pro-town mayor picks scum bodyguards then the mayor is pretty safe from mafia hits imo... Interesting idea. I think the mayor would have to pick 2 scum as his bodyguards in that case - I'm not convinced mafia wouldn't just sacrifice a goon to take out a really powerful blue role. If the mayor can get the GF/roleblocker as his bodyguard, he's probably guaranteed safe for a little while. On the flipside, if he picks DTs/medics/whoever, he's screwing town over. So prospective mayors, take note: I want to see some theorycrafting on who you're going to pick as your bodyguards, and why. Before anyone really starts voting, we should start talking about bodyguard selection. | ||
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CubEdIn
Romania5359 Posts
Bodyguard You have been chosen by the mayor to protect their life at all costs. While you are alive, the mayor cannot be killed or roleblocked. [Mafia-aligned players chosen as bodyguards will not protect town-aligned mayors. So if mayor WILL pick scum bodyguards, they just won't be much of a body-guard. Sure it would reveal who they are if mayor turns up dead with no bodyguards dying pre-flop, but then again, it also gives a scum mayor great opportunities to: a) pick townie bodyguards and then 2-3 days later start whining that they're not dying, therefore they must be scum b) pick one townie, one scum, have their mafia buddies kill the townie and then ask for a medic to protect the other bodyguard ...etc. So, the only awesome scenario is when mayor picks BOTH bodyguards scum. And the chances of that are somewhat non-existent, since if we knew who scum were, then we might as well lynch them, not place them as bodyguards for trolling purposes. Admittedly, I do not have much experience playing in Bodyguard games with this rule, so I might be missing out on some alternatives. Also, a note for the census ability: I believe the order they should get information is: 1. Number of Mafia 2. Number of SKs 3. Number of Godfathers Being the mayor, this information can/should be posted in the thread after each night, as I believe it is useful information for everyone, correct? I can't really tell if number of godfathers is more/less important than number of mafia/sk. I am guessing less, since it's probably just 1/2 godfathers anyway. 4. Number of blues After finding out the number of blues, only share with the PM circle if you have been recruited, as it will help keeping track of the blues and the possibly-fake blues. I don't see why the entire town would need to know this, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. | ||
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Mr. Wiggles
Canada5894 Posts
1. How they will choose bodyguards. 2. How they will use the power of census 3. How they will use and release the information census gives them. Here are my thoughts on the matter: 1. Trying to pick scum. There is, in all reality, not very high chances of getting more than one scum, if any at all. By the time mayor will have to pick bodyguards, he will not be sure enough to reliably be able to pick scum, as there will be limited information available, and I foresee some part of the mafia team lying low for the first day/night. Also, while it would be advantageous if the mayor picked gf/roleblocker as one of his bodyguards, I almost feel it would not be to the towns advantage if he picked only one vanilla mafia. This means that mafia could kill the first bodyguard, then trade one of their team members for the powerful mayor role, as well as whatever other role the mayor may have. I'm not sure what the optimal solution here is, as picking scum allows us to get scum kills easily, but also gives mafia a lot of control over the mayor's life. RNG-ing bodyguards wouldn't be optimal either, as there would be a higher chance of hitting blues. I almost feel that mayoral candidates should threaten to recruit lurkers (not inactives going to be modkilled), as that would force them to begin posting a bit more. This could cause scum to slip up, and the mayor could go from there on who to choose, scum, lurker, vanilla townie. 2. The census is a powerful... power. I think the mayor should listen to suggestions by town on how to use the power, but the decision should not be based solely off what town says. Unless town comes to an independent majority, the final decision should rest on the mayor. What I mean by this, is that it may be very easy, with however many mafia in the game, to start some sort of bandwagon on what to census. This could give mafia a lot of control over the census, if we simply went off town votes for census use. The difference would be if confirmed townies later on started the push for certain census takes, or if a majority of town came up with the idea in parallel, not with one person leading the charge. Otherwise, I think it should be up to the mayor to do what he thinks is best for town. 3. This is a tricky part. When taking the census of mafia roles, the mayor should definitely release said information to the town, as mafia already knows their own role counts. However, I think information on blue roles should be kept confidential until some sort of town circle is established, and then only carefully released to them. If the mayor wants to release information about blues to the town, it should be something like "Yes, there are detectives", so that town can at least be assured, unlike TL Mafia XXXV, where the assumption of medics, mad hatters, and detectives made town rely on things that didn't exist. However, I'm not sure if Mayor should release if there are none of a certain role in the game, as this helps mafia as much as town. Also, once some sort of communication has been established between the mayor and others, the mayor could try to trick mafia by releasing fake census numbers, to fool roleblockers. I'm not sure how effective this is, as I've never seen a mayor played yet. In the case of a mafia mayor: 1. The mafia mayor would ideally want to pick town roles, if mafia plans on killing them. This is incredibly easy for the mayor to do, as he only need pick people not on his own team. However, the mayor could also pick teammates as bodyguards, particularly the godfather, to avoid DT checks. Then the mafia could just let the mayor be, if that were not too suspicious, for a while, to keep the power of census. 2. The mafia mayor isn't very useful for town when it comes to the census. He will have to give out some information on mafia numbers for the first few nights, though these can easily be faked. This means that the mayor can check the numbers of roles like DTs and Medics, and then release fake mafia numbers to the public. 3. The mafia mayor will release fake numbers into the thread. He can say whatever number of mafia he wants, so long as it is within the realm of possibility, as we do not know the Mafia KP formula. This also means that he can fake mafia death. Tell us there are, say 7 mafia one night, then after a lynch say there are 6. Frame a dead townie, easy, right? It also doesn't matter very much to the mafia mayor to release blue or even green numbers to the public. Mafia will already know this information, so its release can be used to appease town. A mafia mayor looks to be very bad for town, and so I believe the mayor should be kept under constant scrutiny, and should be very active in voicing his opinions on different matters, so that the public can continue to analyze him to verify his integrity. Those are my views mayoral candidates, now what are yours? Explain them to me in full, with good logic, and I may consider giving you my vote. And if you liked my views, vote for Mr. Wiggles, he's a bear. Signed, Mr. Wiggles. | ||
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BrownBear
United States6894 Posts
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darmousseh
United States3437 Posts
On January 24 2011 04:42 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Ok, so I have not decided who to vote for, as there seem to not be any candidates besides the Kavdragon Party, and the Not Kavdragon Party. I would like to hear more from potential candidates on: 1. How they will choose bodyguards. 2. How they will use the power of census 3. How they will use and release the information census gives them. Here are my thoughts on the matter: 1. Trying to pick scum. There is, in all reality, not very high chances of getting more than one scum, if any at all. By the time mayor will have to pick bodyguards, he will not be sure enough to reliably be able to pick scum, as there will be limited information available, and I foresee some part of the mafia team lying low for the first day/night. Also, while it would be advantageous if the mayor picked gf/roleblocker as one of his bodyguards, I almost feel it would not be to the towns advantage if he picked only one vanilla mafia. This means that mafia could kill the first bodyguard, then trade one of their team members for the powerful mayor role, as well as whatever other role the mayor may have. I'm not sure what the optimal solution here is, as picking scum allows us to get scum kills easily, but also gives mafia a lot of control over the mayor's life. RNG-ing bodyguards wouldn't be optimal either, as there would be a higher chance of hitting blues. I almost feel that mayoral candidates should threaten to recruit lurkers (not inactives going to be modkilled), as that would force them to begin posting a bit more. This could cause scum to slip up, and the mayor could go from there on who to choose, scum, lurker, vanilla townie. 2. The census is a powerful... power. I think the mayor should listen to suggestions by town on how to use the power, but the decision should not be based solely off what town says. Unless town comes to an independent majority, the final decision should rest on the mayor. What I mean by this, is that it may be very easy, with however many mafia in the game, to start some sort of bandwagon on what to census. This could give mafia a lot of control over the census, if we simply went off town votes for census use. The difference would be if confirmed townies later on started the push for certain census takes, or if a majority of town came up with the idea in parallel, not with one person leading the charge. Otherwise, I think it should be up to the mayor to do what he thinks is best for town. 3. This is a tricky part. When taking the census of mafia roles, the mayor should definitely release said information to the town, as mafia already knows their own role counts. However, I think information on blue roles should be kept confidential until some sort of town circle is established, and then only carefully released to them. If the mayor wants to release information about blues to the town, it should be something like "Yes, there are detectives", so that town can at least be assured, unlike TL Mafia XXXV, where the assumption of medics, mad hatters, and detectives made town rely on things that didn't exist. However, I'm not sure if Mayor should release if there are none of a certain role in the game, as this helps mafia as much as town. Also, once some sort of communication has been established between the mayor and others, the mayor could try to trick mafia by releasing fake census numbers, to fool roleblockers. I'm not sure how effective this is, as I've never seen a mayor played yet. In the case of a mafia mayor: 1. The mafia mayor would ideally want to pick town roles, if mafia plans on killing them. This is incredibly easy for the mayor to do, as he only need pick people not on his own team. However, the mayor could also pick teammates as bodyguards, particularly the godfather, to avoid DT checks. Then the mafia could just let the mayor be, if that were not too suspicious, for a while, to keep the power of census. 2. The mafia mayor isn't very useful for town when it comes to the census. He will have to give out some information on mafia numbers for the first few nights, though these can easily be faked. This means that the mayor can check the numbers of roles like DTs and Medics, and then release fake mafia numbers to the public. 3. The mafia mayor will release fake numbers into the thread. He can say whatever number of mafia he wants, so long as it is within the realm of possibility, as we do not know the Mafia KP formula. This also means that he can fake mafia death. Tell us there are, say 7 mafia one night, then after a lynch say there are 6. Frame a dead townie, easy, right? It also doesn't matter very much to the mafia mayor to release blue or even green numbers to the public. Mafia will already know this information, so its release can be used to appease town. A mafia mayor looks to be very bad for town, and so I believe the mayor should be kept under constant scrutiny, and should be very active in voicing his opinions on different matters, so that the public can continue to analyze him to verify his integrity. Those are my views mayoral candidates, now what are yours? Explain them to me in full, with good logic, and I may consider giving you my vote. And if you liked my views, vote for Mr. Wiggles, he's a bear. Signed, Mr. Wiggles. It's kinda scary that a ton of the information we will be gathering is directly a result of whether or not the mayor is lying or not. | ||
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CubEdIn
Romania5359 Posts
Since it's the very start of the game, we cannot be sure of the alignment of anyone. So, on the bodyguard selection issue, I would have to say that RnG-ing with the option of Veto would be my choice if I ran for mayor. It would work like this, mayor randomly chooses two people (out of everyone, or specially selected groups, like say... everyone else who ran for mayor). Post their name in the thread. If said people do not wish to be BG, they can veto. This will obviously put tremendous pressure on everyone who uses veto, but the reasons can be various: a) You're a townie but too scared to be a target b) You're a blue but your role is too important to risk being targeted early c) You're a mafia and if you get picked the mayor is imba! I know it sound scummy at first, but it can also gives town useful information. Here is why: a) A clever townie can say veto and then take a hit from Mafia because they think he is blue b) A blue player can hide in BG because mafia thinks he is green c) A mafia who has accepted being BG can easily be uncovered if he is role-checked (unless he is GF but in that case mayor will live for a long time anyway) I'm just putting it out there, if you think this is too helpful for scum, then please try to come up with another solution that is not completely random and has a high chance of picking scum/non-blues as BG on day one. | ||
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Amber[LighT]
United States5078 Posts
On January 24 2011 04:37 CubEdIn wrote: Here's the thing though: So if mayor WILL pick scum bodyguards, they just won't be much of a body-guard. Sure it would reveal who they are if mayor turns up dead with no bodyguards dying pre-flop, but then again, it also gives a scum mayor great opportunities to: a) pick townie bodyguards and then 2-3 days later start whining that they're not dying, therefore they must be scum b) pick one townie, one scum, have their mafia buddies kill the townie and then ask for a medic to protect the other bodyguard ...etc. So, the only awesome scenario is when mayor picks BOTH bodyguards scum. And the chances of that are somewhat non-existent, since if we knew who scum were, then we might as well lynch them, not place them as bodyguards for trolling purposes. Admittedly, I do not have much experience playing in Bodyguard games with this rule, so I might be missing out on some alternatives. Also, a note for the census ability: I believe the order they should get information is: 1. Number of Mafia 2. Number of SKs 3. Number of Godfathers Being the mayor, this information can/should be posted in the thread after each night, as I believe it is useful information for everyone, correct? I can't really tell if number of godfathers is more/less important than number of mafia/sk. I am guessing less, since it's probably just 1/2 godfathers anyway. 4. Number of blues After finding out the number of blues, only share with the PM circle if you have been recruited, as it will help keeping track of the blues and the possibly-fake blues. I don't see why the entire town would need to know this, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Good catch cubed! That means that picking bodyguards will be more difficult than I was hoping. The mayoral candidates should consider who they want protecting them. Since I think we should focus on utilizing the mayoral candidates for lynches we should try to decide for the mayor who should be good bodyguards. I would be more than happy to step up and protect the mayor as a bodyguard. I can't offer much to convince the town that I am indeed pro-town, but I think it would be really foolish for mafia to expose themselves since they will immediately be targets for lynches if the mayor falls. We can also play the mayor off as a baiting role to place 2 mafia members (how to do this would be tricky) as bodyguards. By doing this we are losing a valuable town asset, but it guarantees a mafia lynch. Is that a decent trade off? I don't think so.. I think I would rather throw shields in front of the mayor to utilize his power for at least 2 days before he is an open target. Also as you may have noticed I haven't touched the clues. Clue analysis is very tricky and is open to a lot of subjective interpretation. I know I'm not a good clue analyst so I will stick to the behavioral side of the game. | ||
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Mr. Wiggles
Canada5894 Posts
What if we chose the bodyguards based on volunteers? This could protect our blues from dying, as they only have to not volunteer. I'm also sure we won't get 24 people volunteering, as most people have some self-interest or sense of self-preservation. This would be most useful if we wanted two greens to be bodyguards. Anyone who volunteers will be put under instant scrutiny, so this would discourage mafia. Also, mafia would not put more than one member into the volunteer pool, or else there would be a high chance of picking two mafia bodyguards, which isn't really good for mafia, no matter mayoral alignment. The only problem is if we get a mafia mayor, he would have two townies protecting him. This set-up would rely heavily on DTs, as they would need to check and somehow release the information about the bodyguards right away, so that we knew they were town. This would force mafia to have to waste hits on the greens, or else make it look too much like the mayor is mafia. The problem arise though, when the mafia just leave the bodyguards, who are town, to try to get us to lynch our own mayor. What do you guys think? | ||
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