Pick Your Power Mafia 3!

On January 22 2011 16:53 Ace wrote:

My bad, I'll make that clear next time in the OP v_v

Yea Jimbo played one hell of an SK game. He NEVER used his Politician power the entire game which was amazing patience.

Your end game analysis was really wrong though. Jimbo was right - If he is an SK Vet or Town Vet lynching him gets you no where. Really you're just giving the SK another night to shoot. You won't get any information from wasting that lynch. With 5 (4) players and 48 hours if you can't decide then what will another 48 hours with no Town Night Actions do?

However, there WAS a way out. And this is one of the very few times I'd ever say a townie should do this - Kenpachi get himself lynched. This way you get TWO flips in one day as town. Kenpachi gets flipped innocent and if he doesn't want to die you might have your SK. If he's not SK he gets lynched and shoots the Scummiest person on the wagon when he flips Godfather - that being whoever you guys convince him it is. The only hiccup in this plan is that all of you have to agree that ONE person is confirmed innocent and they can't vote. The other 3 would all have to vote and then give Kenpachi a 33% chance of shooting the SK and winning the game.

Yeah I was so mad when you and kenpachi bandwagoned me right off the bat with that reasoning. I started thinking "maybe i should have kept BC alive. I'd rather lose to his ability and persuasion than this backwards logic."

I thought of that kenpachi thing too which would was an option but naturally I didn't want to suggest it lol. It could've been abused with politician though probably.

I'll post my thoughts tomorrow prolly but I just want to say that I am SO glad I was sk. As townie I would've gotten so sick of the garbage that was getting passed around and sheeped on, but as sk i could keep reminding myself 'its ok i dont care about that lousy town.' Seeing LSB's plan get so much credence and mine ignored was just...O_O

Even funnier was that the only two people who bothered to make plans were the SKs LMAO.

I'm glad to see a few people posted something substantial.

Guess people are bored with sk winning though. I'll post my thought process and comments as well on stuff ppl havent addressed.

When I got my role my immediate plan was to lynch mafia and shoot townies who had key roles. While only rolecop, doctors, day vigi, roleblocker, and especially bullet bill are serious threats, I wanted to keep both the town and mafia in the dark as long as possible. I picked politician since securing a role for sk is crucial, nobody is likely to pick it, it's the most powerful endgame role, and I was half considering pissing people off who annoyed me, eg LSB, by screwing with their vote. In the beginning I didn't think I had a real shot at winning cause its sk and wanted to play balls out and just have fun, as lurking last game as mafia was stupid and boring. I wanted to be proactive but the team didn't want nor need to. Wasn't going to let being SK stop me from being crazy.

However, that idea came to a rude halt in pregame and day 1 when, LSB's plan was favored over my own LOL, and my posts were overall just completed ignored. "Who cares about the godamn traitor guys find scum the traitor will reveal itself once people start dying." Then layoffrage gets lynched by the 'KILL DA TRAITOR' witch hunt even though its 100% certain hes not scum by how easily he got lynched. zzzzzz

+ Show Spoiler [plan] +

On January 08 2011 07:24 JimboSilvers wrote:
I lied. My plan isn't simple. But it is still effective

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JIMBOS PLAN

Here are the results from the past two PYP games.

Show nested quote +

I was thinking from the perspective of using past game drafting patterns to be able to put the important town roles in a certain area. However I did not consider what lsb is saying, in that I would have no way of proving myself to be town in that time and thus could just as easily be mafia trying to get my buddies what we want.

So we'll see how it goes right now though.

What I noticed in reading both past games - Thanks Ace for suggesting it!

- is that mafia has a very difficult time getting top a number of picks or do not want to for several reasons. As you can see both games they got in the top 2 slots but then their picks start jumping all over the place.

There are various reasons for that, as having top picks in these games wasn't always ideal, but it got me thinking. Say the mafia want to get most of the top picks. How do they do it?

The reason this is important is where the assigned roles are. We clearly need to have a few roles accountable. The previous plans, and current plan, followed the train of thought that KP boosting and important-to-deny-mafia roles needed to be picked first. What ended up happening was that the first 3 or more slots were sealed up, eg it didn't matter what alignment the people who got them were because they were held on accountability.EG If the prince of darkness acts, something's wrong and he must die. That meant that the best town roles got thrown into 4-something, where the majority of the mafia will be located. This doesn't make sense.

We want the pro town roles in the hands of the town and the anti town roles in the hands of ACCOUNTABLE mafia (or town or sk).

Superduper Town roles=

Jack
Bullet Bill
Bullet Proof
Parity Cop
Doctor
Veteran

In addition there are some solid to mediocre town roles.

Role Cop=
Mason
Tracker
Hider
Witch

Accountable Roles=

CPR Doc
vigi
Roleblocker
Copycat - because of the day vigi the infinite kp role point brought up earlier

Now you might object that there will be clashes. Yes, there will. And that is not actually that horrible. For one, mafia will clash too. They won't be able to get what they want as easily. And mafia clashing will make other roles better, namely Tracker. A roleblocking mafia gets followed to his roleblock target. A vanilla mafia gets followed to the kill

.

For two, it's more important that good townies get the really superduper roles and we get a few greens than the really superduper roles die right away because they are known and we're left with the shitty roles. Jack and Bullet Bill and infinitely better than Tracker or Mason.

It doesn't really matter what alignment comp vigi and CPR doc are as long as we know who they are. If their shots don't follow their assigned targets, then we know they're mafia.

So-

JIMBOS PROPOSAL

-Players 1-6 will pick a very pro town role. Preferably one of those I listed in blue but there are some others like witch that can prove useful too or hider to mess with hits going in the top 6.
-Players 7-10 will pick CPR doc, vigi, Roleblocker, and Copycat in that order. Town will vote during the night phase for the kp to use as a type of extra lynches. They don't follow orders, they die. Maybe we should assign Prince as #11? I'm not sure how bad this role actually is for the town? Janitor as #12? Might be nasty.
-Everyone else picks what they want.

Mafia can pretty much guarantee they will get 1 person in the top 6 somewhere, maybe two as they have 5 people. But that still leaves a 4-5 townies with very powerful roles. We need those roles to win.

What's better, the mafia cannot exploit this fact like they can an LSB list because of the bulletproof/veteran threat and the fact that the doctor will likely protect in that area.

The things I'm not certain on are should we do anything about the kinda mediocre pro scum roles? Or just tell townies not to pick them and have rolecop know if he gets scum by seeing that pop up? And is 6 the right number for the cutoff?

FEEDBACK PEOPLE LETS GOGOGOO

I honestly still think my plan is good and would have worked well . Yes it does help the SK -I had no idea there were two until after the 5 kill night one - in the sense that the SK ignores bulletproof and can fire into the top part of the list with impunity. But outside of that, it could have served the town superbly. As we notice, mafia picked numbers 1 2 3 4 5 lmao and got picks 1 10 11 14 20. Town could've had a great pick of roles in the sweetspot area. The fact that it was almost totally ignored is really sad.

Anyways after seeing what happened day 1 and how i was invisible I realized that unless I put a ton of effort into arguing, something I wasn't in the mood for as sk, I couldn't effectively get mafia lynched on my own. Thus I had to shoot mostly scum and hope scum would kill the good roles. Fortunately lsb took out the only key role bullet bill and after that it was all good and my scum picks were dead on.

Day 2 I cannot believe the town just sat there and let deconduo get away with a serial killer claim in the shadiest circumstances. I had extra information here - it was unlikely there was 3 sks - but the town has no reason to let the "sk" live. He isn't going to cooperate with you longer than he sees fit lol and there's a good chance he's scum bullshitting anyways, as was the case. Why the hell would serial killer just claim like that. As soon as he claims he has effectively a zero percent chance at victory, so he would only claim in the absolute most dire of situations, which I did not feel he was in when it happened. His foreshadowed drunk cc pick was perfect cover.

It was also clear by day 2 scum were not trying very hard to hide themselves because nobody was focusing on them. I think bloodycobbler also picked up on this? This realization helped narrow down targets considerably. Overall day 2 no lynch was awful when deconduo and fishball were both huge anti town players. After that bloodycobbler became more active and things started going in the right direction ending with the fishball lynch.

End of day 3 I actually was quite confused because both beneather and aidnai started looking incredibly scummy. So I take a hit and have been sporadically inactive but very pro town and am doing the right things and going for the right people, just getting ignored. I claim I take a hit and the town pieces things together and gets fishball lynched.

Then aidnai starts getting people to claim bulletproof and vet hoping to 'confirm my role' or something ridiculous, and of fucking course beneather has to respond within moments - after saying nothing the entire game - "yea im bulletproof". WTF? I mean, that is really anti town action. The biggest asset town has for roles is that scum/sk don't know who is proted by doctor, bulletproof, vet, or sk when a hit doesn't go through. That uncertainty is crucial to keep real town assets alive, which I was, and make scum second guess their hits. Beneather could have easily soaked up a hit and maybe even led scum into thinking he was sk until he claimed and made sure scum would just ignore him. But would scum be THAT obvious? I was seriously considering shooting one of them - especially aidnai for saving haplo in the scummiest circumstances - but figured amber's roleblock was too dangerous. I mean holy shit it doesn't really matter that much if you prove my role or not. If I was a town vet it would've been a disastrous move as I would've died when shot next and mafia wouldve had no qualms about doing so cause my role was in the open.

I don't think scum were in that bad of a position after fishball got lynched. While the other 3 were obvious, I thought aidnai was the last scum instead of pigsquirrel . It boggles me mind why they would use PoD that night instead of the next when the numbers clearly indicated it wouldn't bring them near victory. But using PoD basically wrecked their team.

I made a major mistake when I shot bum instead of well, anyone lol. I kept panicking and switching my target. Originally I was going to shoot bloodycobbler as he was the only real threat, but I had a few things to consider:

1- kitaman might shoot bloodycobbler AGAIN
2- Scum most likely would shoot bloodycobbler and kita instead of me and kita because he was being much more active and in their faces. I was simply trying to shadow him, prevent kita from being stupid, and get credit for slaughtering the scum team. Still not sure why they shot me.
3- Most importantly, if bloodycobbler dies, scum might actually convince town and i cant trust myself to sway the town after what happened early game.

That's why I shot bum, assuming kita or scum would shoot bloodycobbler. Instead I get shot and kita shoots another scum. Worst case scenario lol. Still I had a 100% chance of victory if everyone shot normally. When it didn't, I had to choose between shooting cob or one of his sheep. Should I tempt fate with misder's fixation on cob being sk and cobs dead on analysis of me, somehow. Or should I kill cob and try to outargue the remainder who have no idea whats going on but have this bizarre fixation on my role, use bad logic, and refuse to consider anyone else because of a worst case scenario possibility. Was quite the odd choice.

Other comments:

One thing I don't understand is how bloodycobbler was remotely suspicious, first to get shot twice by the town vigi, second when people thought he was sk lategame. The guy reeked of green from the moment he got lsb killed. Scum clearly don't need to do that and cob was putting way too much effort in for anything but a townie, given the circumstances.

eii should have come out the moment he didn't get parity cop. ZAP haplo lynch day 1. If he called out that he'd pick such a pro town role and someone took it without saying a word, that someone is very obviously scum trying to deny a powerful role. A townie would at least say something so eii wouldnt get screwed over.

Kenpachi picking GF was very poor, I have no idea why he would even consider it. Jack is the most powerful role in the game arguably and when he didn't take it, nobody would even try. Maybe for bullet bill veteran or bulletproof i could see it but godfather? Who cares lol.

Scum picks didn't make sense to me. Hiding the cpr is great sure, and I can understand denying parity cop and taking PoD, but mason? Copycat? Those are trash compared to stuff like Veteran, imo best role for scum, pardoner, bulletproof, roleblocker, and doctor. Maybe janitor, or hell, politician. If scum shoots bloodycobbler and use janitor, how does anyone know cob is actually town? And politician is a monster card in the endgame. Scum shouldn't have cared about fitting in with da plan or anything. When LSB's plans were so anti town its easy to say "shove it" and take what you want. Whatever the case, pigsquirrel should never EVER EVER have claimed PoD. Town had no way of knowing who it was. It was the best hidden spot one could have it and he just had to blow his top and then use it.

I thought LSB did a good job of appearing in day 1, at least to me, like a very very stubborn idiot who doesn't realize how stupid he is. I was simply content to just treat him as an invisible poster. Kudos to bloodycobbler for shutting down his nonsense. You got balls LSB lol. I would not have felt comfortable with such a risky plan at all. Im jealous at how much cooler your approach was than mine

.

Fishball did great I feel by just goading people into fights and attracting focus while not doing anything overtly suspicious that would get him lynched right away. He dominated the town's attention while still living 2 days. After he died no scum were on any townies radar besides bloodycobblers. The rest of the scum was content to just piggyback off of fishball which was a major mistake imo cause once he was gone they were wide out in the open.

And of course superb play by bloodycobbler. No way could I have put up with what you did as town without getting pissed and flaming excessively or something - if i would even have the time in the first place to post enough to outshout everyone else. This is why I'm probably not going to play for awhile - scum is no fun if you can win by lurking and having to put up with all this stupidity and the town's tendency to focus on the absolute wrong things and people, as addressed above, is not enjoyable.

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