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On August 09 2010 10:20 Ace wrote:
Tree stump is potentially one of the most broken roles in Mafia. There's a reason that his penalty is so ridiculous. In this setup though Tree Stump isn't really that great (based on what we know so far).
I'm still of the idea one of the town players has an insanely broken killing role. Also Pyrr is scum, leave Bill Murray for a DT to investigate.
What would an insanely broken killing role be like?
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On August 09 2010 10:41 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 10:39 LSB wrote:On August 09 2010 10:31 Ace wrote:
And if that's the penalty then the medic simply says my penalty is that I can only act on certain days. That doesn't tell you or anyone else that the role is medic. Did you READ when I first proposed this plan? We'll get your role later on in the game or upon death and then match it up with everything else we know. I know what I'm talking about and my logic is 100% on point, get off of wikipedia and use your head. What that tells the mafia is that the medic has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the medic is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. It sounds like your part of the mafia, trying to get a nice hit list. wrong. You don't know it's a medic. You've only seen the penalty. How does telling the town you can act on certain nights imply you're a medic? Explain, especially since any sane person's first thought would be Vigilante.
Did you read what LSB said? I think you did. Why would we be okay with giving away our vigilante? Vigi or medic, either way mafia knows it is someone to hit because they have a night action.
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On August 09 2010 10:49 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 10:44 LSB wrote:On August 09 2010 10:41 Ace wrote:On August 09 2010 10:39 LSB wrote:On August 09 2010 10:31 Ace wrote:
And if that's the penalty then the medic simply says my penalty is that I can only act on certain days. That doesn't tell you or anyone else that the role is medic. Did you READ when I first proposed this plan? We'll get your role later on in the game or upon death and then match it up with everything else we know. I know what I'm talking about and my logic is 100% on point, get off of wikipedia and use your head. What that tells the mafia is that the medic has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the medic is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. It sounds like your part of the mafia, trying to get a nice hit list. wrong. You don't know it's a medic. You've only seen the penalty. How does telling the town you can act on certain nights imply you're a medic? Explain, especially since any sane person's first thought would be Vigilante. What that tells the mafia is that the person has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the person is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. and how will they find said medic? They can't because they don't know who the medic is. They just know penalties. Once again penalties do not imply roles. If it does then tell me my role, and tell zeks his role if you believe this. And Pyrr is mafia. Stop voting for Bill Murray and deal with him tomorrow.
Not all penalties imply roles.
##vote Ace
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Bill Murray, get the fuck in here and say something.
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On August 09 2010 10:54 Divinek wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 10:49 Ace wrote:On August 09 2010 10:44 LSB wrote:On August 09 2010 10:41 Ace wrote:On August 09 2010 10:39 LSB wrote:On August 09 2010 10:31 Ace wrote:
And if that's the penalty then the medic simply says my penalty is that I can only act on certain days. That doesn't tell you or anyone else that the role is medic. Did you READ when I first proposed this plan? We'll get your role later on in the game or upon death and then match it up with everything else we know. I know what I'm talking about and my logic is 100% on point, get off of wikipedia and use your head. What that tells the mafia is that the medic has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the medic is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. It sounds like your part of the mafia, trying to get a nice hit list. wrong. You don't know it's a medic. You've only seen the penalty. How does telling the town you can act on certain nights imply you're a medic? Explain, especially since any sane person's first thought would be Vigilante. What that tells the mafia is that the person has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the person is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. and how will they find said medic? They can't because they don't know who the medic is. They just know penalties. Once again penalties do not imply roles. If it does then tell me my role, and tell zeks his role if you believe this. And Pyrr is mafia. Stop voting for Bill Murray and deal with him tomorrow. you didnt answer my question 
I'm scummy because I'm trying (and failing miserably) to keep the mafia from picking out blues.
Ace is clearly innocent because his plan is getting us no closer to identifying any scum and never will.
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On August 09 2010 10:55 chaoser wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 10:50 chaoser wrote:
People are not saying mafia will know the specific role of each player, just that they will know if the player is blue or not -_- please respond to this -_-
There's no response Ace can make because it is true.
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On August 09 2010 11:01 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 10:52 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:On August 09 2010 10:49 Ace wrote:On August 09 2010 10:44 LSB wrote:On August 09 2010 10:41 Ace wrote:On August 09 2010 10:39 LSB wrote:On August 09 2010 10:31 Ace wrote:
And if that's the penalty then the medic simply says my penalty is that I can only act on certain days. That doesn't tell you or anyone else that the role is medic. Did you READ when I first proposed this plan? We'll get your role later on in the game or upon death and then match it up with everything else we know. I know what I'm talking about and my logic is 100% on point, get off of wikipedia and use your head. What that tells the mafia is that the medic has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the medic is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. It sounds like your part of the mafia, trying to get a nice hit list. wrong. You don't know it's a medic. You've only seen the penalty. How does telling the town you can act on certain nights imply you're a medic? Explain, especially since any sane person's first thought would be Vigilante. What that tells the mafia is that the person has an ability that can be used at night. The mafia won't know if the person is a DT, or a Bus Driver, or a Vig, or a Medic. But all they will know is that they should kill the medic before night 2. and how will they find said medic? They can't because they don't know who the medic is. They just know penalties. Once again penalties do not imply roles. If it does then tell me my role, and tell zeks his role if you believe this. And Pyrr is mafia. Stop voting for Bill Murray and deal with him tomorrow. Not all penalties imply roles.##vote Ace Exactly. So if you know this to be true, why would you be against penalty claiming. You just admitted we can't figure out who's role is what based on penalties  Hi scum :D
Some of them imply blue. That's all mafia needs. Sure some blues might have penalties that don't hint that they are blue. How many people out there are green and have penalties that hint blue? So far only Divinek, who may be mafia. In any case hadn't heard otherwise and I'm sure the mafia like their odds based on how this conversation has played out (ie right into mafia hands) which is why I should have realized not to have the conversation in the first place but congrats for catching me playing like crap.
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On August 09 2010 11:30 citi.zen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 11:25 Divinek wrote:On August 09 2010 11:23 citi.zen wrote:On August 09 2010 11:11 Ace wrote:Not at all chaoser. Action doesn't imply night action or day action. It can be anything. Voting is an action. Talking to a certain player is an action. Action does not imply blue! Look at page 3 of this thread. Hessmyrr points out 2 such instances:
[Shy Townie]
You are Townie! however you are shy and likes to avoid a crowd. You cannot vote for player with highest number of votes at that moment (it is fine if the player you have once voted becomes the one with the highest vote).
The role is Townie. The action is you can't vote for a certain player. If I only told you that you can't vote(the action) for a certain player (the penalty) you have no idea that the role is Townie.
You are Townie! You are also terrified of mafia lurking in the night, so must choose one person to visit every night (it will be randomly determined in case no decision was given). If mafia targets you on that night, you will be intercepted on the way to your target and will die alone.
The role is Townie once again. The action is visiting a player at night. The penalty is if you're caught visiting someone by mafia you die. Looking at both penalties, how could you know whether the person is blue or green? You can't. The people coming up with this nonsense are bullshitting. Perhaps I am reading this too closely, but I don't see the word "action" in either of those descriptions. In fact, they are quite different from what you and bumatlarge described, but close to what zeks posted. At any rate what Bill did is against the rules unless he is red or knows something we don't. So I am still all for lynching him right now. what did he do that was against the rules? If he is not red, does not have additional information and has no restriction on speaking (as the OP says), he went for personal vendetta at the risk of screwing he town over. Usually there is a "play to win" rule.
I'm starting to think that if there was a meticulously enforced play to win rule, Bill Murray would have been on a permanent ban list long ago.
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On August 09 2010 12:00 citi.zen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 11:35 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:On August 09 2010 11:30 citi.zen wrote:On August 09 2010 11:25 Divinek wrote:On August 09 2010 11:23 citi.zen wrote:On August 09 2010 11:11 Ace wrote:Not at all chaoser. Action doesn't imply night action or day action. It can be anything. Voting is an action. Talking to a certain player is an action. Action does not imply blue! Look at page 3 of this thread. Hessmyrr points out 2 such instances:
[Shy Townie]
You are Townie! however you are shy and likes to avoid a crowd. You cannot vote for player with highest number of votes at that moment (it is fine if the player you have once voted becomes the one with the highest vote).
The role is Townie. The action is you can't vote for a certain player. If I only told you that you can't vote(the action) for a certain player (the penalty) you have no idea that the role is Townie.
You are Townie! You are also terrified of mafia lurking in the night, so must choose one person to visit every night (it will be randomly determined in case no decision was given). If mafia targets you on that night, you will be intercepted on the way to your target and will die alone.
The role is Townie once again. The action is visiting a player at night. The penalty is if you're caught visiting someone by mafia you die. Looking at both penalties, how could you know whether the person is blue or green? You can't. The people coming up with this nonsense are bullshitting. Perhaps I am reading this too closely, but I don't see the word "action" in either of those descriptions. In fact, they are quite different from what you and bumatlarge described, but close to what zeks posted. At any rate what Bill did is against the rules unless he is red or knows something we don't. So I am still all for lynching him right now. what did he do that was against the rules? If he is not red, does not have additional information and has no restriction on speaking (as the OP says), he went for personal vendetta at the risk of screwing he town over. Usually there is a "play to win" rule. I'm starting to think that if there was a meticulously enforced play to win rule, Bill Murray would have been on a permanent ban list long ago. he is banned in all of ace's games.
I think I might copy ace's playbook here depending on how these games turn out  .
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##vote Bill Murray
you don't get to fuck the town over all day, show up and claim its my fault
"I've been a treestump. I hated using it, but when you're near a lynch, it is a good ability. Wouldn't you rather be able to continue talking than have to sit on the sidelines watching? you can still do behavioral analysis and catch scum as a treestump."
He should not use that role. Is he even allowed to talk after using that? I'm not sure he is.
"See how he "isn't worried about me", because he is wanting this wagon to go on Ace. I really wouldn't be surprised if Pyrrhuloxia was the Godfather."
I wasn't as worried about you because I thought you might be blue BECAUSE YOU WERE FUCKING LYING, ASSHOLE.
"You are scum trying to go against a plan that puts pressure on you."
You're damn right it puts pressure on me. Pressure to reveal my role WHICH SHOULD NOT BE FORCED ON ANYONE at this point.
"So you're implying that he caught you on your scum slip? I wouldn't say you've been playing like crap if you're red, you have a wagon going on me, and you almost had a townie with a vendetta lynch a town aligned power role, which would have been some absolute awesomeness for you.
The only crappy part about your play is that you were too willing to bandwagon and have little slipups about the amount of information you have."
Little slipups about the information I had- we've been having that all over town thanks to Ace's plan here. I notice you don't specify any of these.
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You wanna know my penalty?
I can perform a certain action but it doesn't go through until two mornings later.
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"Surely if you thought it was a bad idea then you wouldn't have been trying to figure out what Bill Murray's penalty is."
That's because I figured the only way for him to use his ability to benefit town was through what I was trying to do.
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"Secondly you've done a very fast flip to vote on Bill Murray with no good reasoning."
I don't need good reasoning, I'm about to get killed when someone who has lied to town all day is getting off scott free and the guy he was trying to kill doesn't give a shit.
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"Er? So if you knowingly thought Bill Murray might be blue...but you were up in arms against my plan because you felt it would reveal blues...then why did you try to derive BM's penalty?"
I asked him whether he had a full list or just you. If it was just you, then we would have that info and could use it immediately. I guess he might have had some hidden ability to get more mafia later but even then it's already a good trade. If he has the whole list and gives it to us, kaching we win, Hesmyrr is a bad game designer. Maybe I should have respected him more but I thought one role was reasonable.
In fact, if you knew he was lying isn't that a very good cause to be worried? "
"Wait a sec - how did you know he was lying Pyrr?"
I dunno, maybe because he said he couldn't talk to town... AND THEN STARTED TALKING TO TOWN? I obviously didn't think he was lying when I thought he was blue. How would I know he was lying if I was mafia unless he was on my team? Because you don't seem to think he is. Maybe he's on your team?
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On August 09 2010 15:22 Jayme wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2010 14:21 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:
"Secondly you've done a very fast flip to vote on Bill Murray with no good reasoning."
I don't need good reasoning, I'm about to get killed when someone who has lied to town all day is getting off scott free and the guy he was trying to kill doesn't give a shit. This is the only point with you I'm willing to agree with. It's pretty much a cardinal rule that a townie is not to lie...ever. The thing is you basically pushed said blue rule on BM and he went with it. My penalty is that I look extremely guilty.
I didn't push it on him. I had an idea and Bill Murray lied to troll me and the rest of town.
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On August 10 2010 04:17 Korynne wrote:
Pyrr, do you have to be alive for your action to be carried out 2 mornings later? Because if not then we should just keep Pyrr around, let Pyrr claim what he did after it's going to go through, and then see if it happens (unless mafia roleblocks him, in which case he should know and then tell us whatever he wants accordingly). Doesn't clear him, but like, it's something more tangible than the other claims we've gotten.
I have to survive Night 2. :-/
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I am detective.
When I am dead, go after:
Ace: Mafia
Bill Murray: Mafia / Ass
Sorry to town for playing like shit this game. GJ Ace for defenestrating the town with a scummy plan that couldn't be argued against effectively without the blues giving themselves away. The greens will see it as harmless and jump in, isolating, identifying and FoSing the blues who will be hurt by it. Very clever.
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On August 10 2010 07:33 Bill Murray wrote:
at this point we need to really consolidate votes
this isnt like a typical mafiascum game in terms of day 1 lasting 3 weeks... so we need to consolidate votes FAST and speed up the pace so we can pressure people into slipping up
Yes, no time to think things through; town must be as mindless as possible.
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On August 10 2010 07:44 Ace wrote:
Yea I think that's the one. But the most damning thing about all of this is that not only have they argued with me, but not a single one of them has come up with a new idea or direction to go on. All this complaining about blue roles dying and no positive input on doing something to help. Do these sound like pro town moves to you?
You of all people should know that no blue confirmation plan is necessary for town to win.
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On August 10 2010 07:50 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2010 07:45 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:On August 10 2010 07:44 Ace wrote:
Yea I think that's the one. But the most damning thing about all of this is that not only have they argued with me, but not a single one of them has come up with a new idea or direction to go on. All this complaining about blue roles dying and no positive input on doing something to help. Do these sound like pro town moves to you? You of all people should know that no blue confirmation plan is necessary for town to win. And once again you're putting words in my mouth. Show me where I said I'm making a blue confirmation plan. Hell, show me ANYWHERE where I've said I'm valuing blue roles over green?
I'm not talking to you anymore, you haven't been responding to me honestly or straight forwardly all game long; everything I post, you answer to something I haven't said.
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EPT
