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On October 22 2009 11:42 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2009 07:23 redtooth wrote:On October 22 2009 04:15 Tricode wrote:
You shouldn't be trying to kill people based on past crap. also, this is absolutely wrong. i don't remember tricode's standard behavior but it seems to be the general consensus that he's a very bad player. he also doesn't seem to be taking the game very seriously at the moment so we can't rely on any drastic improvements from him. Ace, L, BC have established their usefulness whenever they were green. edit: took out one word ("in") to let the sentence actually make sense. I don't know why there is a seeming consensus to lynch Tricode here. He's clearly not mafia, and probably some important role. Does it make sense that the mafia got on an irc channel and said, "alright here's the plan, Tricode is going to go in there and get elected and draw lots of attention to himself"? Hell no it doesn't. The one thing I learned from being mafia is that hardly anyone does anything as mafia. The mafia strategy is always just sit back and hope things work out. There have been seldom games where the mafia actually were involved in the town affairs.
even if he has an important role he always plays like this. Can't really make any assumptions here. On the bright side, if he were blue, DTs would know blues when they find them, although not which blue it is (unless they're sane/whatever the other one is). Also I think we can safely assume that greens > blues so there would be a higher chance of DTs getting their other colored RC. If they don't get another color, at least they find a blue. Win win.
On October 22 2009 11:46 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2009 09:39 Incognito wrote:On October 22 2009 06:31 Vivi57 wrote:On October 22 2009 06:12 HeavOnEarth wrote:
because townie veterans won't help the town at all right? but a mafia vet does so much more damage. Without them, the mafia organization falls apart so much more than the town If we can pick off a mafia vet right away, the town will have a ridiculous advantage Foolishness is right, one vet atleast is mafia for sure. That gives us atleast a 20-25% chance on the first lynch, which is good, unless something amazing happens between then and now. Wanna take a guess at what our % chance for a red lynch is if we DONT hit a vet? Tada! Its also 20%! The point of the matter, as had been previously said, is that mafia without their vet leader equals gg mafia. The town without their leader doesn't mean anything. There have been games where some non vet took control of the town (heck even I did it). The mafia needs the vet players not the town. I find it odd that Pyrry has not been around at all this game. Usually he's good at helping the town, but I guess without clues he's about as useless as Aquaman.
Takes way too long to pinpoint your prized mafia vet. By that time, mafia's all up and organized and most if not all of your good town players are dead. I doubt a mafia is going to act completely irrationally even after the leader set their game plan up. Look at Ver in BCs (first game?) where he died day 1 (2?) but destroyed the town's blues. The game is about finding reds, not finding a single red. Because in the mean time you disregard all other reds in search for your red vet. Bad.
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On October 22 2009 12:08 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2009 11:59 Incognito wrote:On October 22 2009 11:42 Foolishness wrote:
I don't know why there is a seeming consensus to lynch Tricode here. He's clearly not mafia, and probably some important role. Does it make sense that the mafia got on an irc channel and said, "alright here's the plan, Tricode is going to go in there and get elected and draw lots of attention to himself"? Hell no it doesn't. The one thing I learned from being mafia is that hardly anyone does anything as mafia. The mafia strategy is always just sit back and hope things work out. There have been seldom games where the mafia actually were involved in the town affairs. even if he has an important role he always plays like this. Can't really make any assumptions here. On the bright side, if he were blue, DTs would know blues when they find them, although not which blue it is (unless they're sane/whatever the other one is). Also I think we can safely assume that greens > blues so there would be a higher chance of DTs getting their other colored RC. If they don't get another color, at least they find a blue. Win win. On October 22 2009 11:46 Foolishness wrote:
The point of the matter, as had been previously said, is that mafia without their vet leader equals gg mafia. The town without their leader doesn't mean anything. There have been games where some non vet took control of the town (heck even I did it). The mafia needs the vet players not the town.
I find it odd that Pyrry has not been around at all this game. Usually he's good at helping the town, but I guess without clues he's about as useless as Aquaman. Takes way too long to pinpoint your prized mafia vet. By that time, mafia's all up and organized and most if not all of your good town players are dead. I doubt a mafia is going to act completely irrationally even after the leader set their game plan up. Look at Ver in BCs (first game?) where he died day 1 (2?) but destroyed the town's blues. The game is about finding reds, not finding a single red. Because in the mean time you disregard all other reds in search for your red vet. Bad. That's fine and all and I'm not saying my plan is perfect. But honestly what else are we going to do now? As L said, nearly all the mayor candidates are mia and all we got now is a plan so DT's can figure out their situation. Tricode is obviously not red and wanting to lynch him based off of his not contributing attitude or whatever is hardly a justification at all. At the very least you could pick an inactive to lynch.
Non posting towny is approximately equal to garbage spewing townie, which is one argument. But it could go either way.
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On October 22 2009 12:48 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:
If there is a vet there may be no medic to prot him. What would that do to the plan?
I highly doubt there would be no medics. That would be imba considering DTs are already weak.
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On October 23 2009 09:42 L wrote:
I really don't want a shitty player protected by pardoner, so if people aren't going to vote for me, vote for ace. Sugidori midori or whatever's rational is fucking terrible.
Well there is merit in attempting to deny the mafia that position even if it does not lead to the ideal person being protected by the BGs.
Anyway, I think we should come up with some medic/DT lists. Assuming Pyrr/Tricode get office, we should probably split up the Medic/DT lists with 2/3 people. If we have two medics, 3 would be nice, but since we dont know the Medic numbers maybe we should just have 3 anyway. Thoughts on the player composition of the lists?
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gasp the last part doesnt rhyme!
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On October 23 2009 11:39 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 11:02 Qatol wrote:
Ummm nobody has PMed me yet.... I assume Pyrr is still lynching motbob? Ace are you pardoning? Mafia are you making anyone a bodyguard?
Yes in fact I am pardoning. Can you please make Judge and Vivi my bodyguards?
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On October 23 2009 11:45 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 11:42 Incognito wrote:On October 23 2009 11:39 Qatol wrote:On October 23 2009 11:02 Qatol wrote:
Ummm nobody has PMed me yet.... I assume Pyrr is still lynching motbob? Ace are you pardoning? Mafia are you making anyone a bodyguard? Yes in fact I am pardoning. Can you please make Judge and Vivi my bodyguards? Sorry. Priests and Elders can't be bodyguards.
Why not? Don't trust the pedophiles or old people to guard us?
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On October 23 2009 11:56 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 11:48 Incognito wrote:On October 23 2009 11:45 Qatol wrote:On October 23 2009 11:42 Incognito wrote:On October 23 2009 11:39 Qatol wrote:On October 23 2009 11:02 Qatol wrote:
Ummm nobody has PMed me yet.... I assume Pyrr is still lynching motbob? Ace are you pardoning? Mafia are you making anyone a bodyguard? Yes in fact I am pardoning. Can you please make Judge and Vivi my bodyguards? Sorry. Priests and Elders can't be bodyguards. Why not? Don't trust the pedophiles or old people to guard us? Would you? It seems like they would be a tad unreliable in the face of an attack, no?
A bodyguard is a bodyguard. A pedophile or old person could fill a casket just as well as any other body. Besides if I really needed to I could use the elder as a mace.
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On October 23 2009 12:46 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 12:44 Ace wrote:On October 23 2009 11:02 Qatol wrote:
Ummm nobody has PMed me yet.... I assume Pyrr is still lynching motbob? Ace are you pardoning? Mafia are you making anyone a bodyguard? assuming I'm not too late (I just started reading the thread) I pardon anyone who's going to be lynched today anyway. We don't have anything to go on and the DTs cant check them yet. Nope you aren't too late at all. Pyrr still hasn't told us who he was lynching. Also, we STILL haven't heard from the mafia.......
Maybe something you don't want to say?
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On October 23 2009 12:47 Ace wrote:
maybe they are planing their BG infiltration. Doesn't matter to me as the rapefest is going to start when Night 2 hits anyway
Which rapefest? The mafia rapefest ? :D
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On October 23 2009 13:10 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 12:48 Incognito wrote:On October 23 2009 12:46 Qatol wrote:On October 23 2009 12:44 Ace wrote:On October 23 2009 11:02 Qatol wrote:
Ummm nobody has PMed me yet.... I assume Pyrr is still lynching motbob? Ace are you pardoning? Mafia are you making anyone a bodyguard? assuming I'm not too late (I just started reading the thread) I pardon anyone who's going to be lynched today anyway. We don't have anything to go on and the DTs cant check them yet. Nope you aren't too late at all. Pyrr still hasn't told us who he was lynching. Also, we STILL haven't heard from the mafia....... Maybe something you don't want to say? Are you sure about that? 
Well I dont think it should be said regardless.
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On October 23 2009 13:14 L wrote:
I'm now glad I voted for Ace.
I dont see it.
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On October 23 2009 13:53 vx70GTOJudgexv wrote:
lol, so HeavOnEarth is banned for 2 weeks.
I guess a pardon could benefit us - we avoid a mislynch, but I dunno. I think we could still find a good lynch candidate.
Incognito - why do you NOT want to lynch motbob? Why waste the pardon right now?
Lol srsly? Im not the pardoner k.
So if HeavOnEarth is banned why dont we just flip him now? Since we are going to pardon anyway.
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On October 23 2009 13:50 Ace wrote:
Ok I just had a post but I'll wait a bit before unveiling it. However I have one thing to ask: Medics protect myself and Pyrr tonight.
Hold on I know you think I'm crazy. But there is a reason and HOPEFULLY I'm misreading the rules.
There are 2 BGs according the OP. Mafia can sub in their members for BGs. If they subbed in 2 members tonight both myself and Pyrr would be at risk of dying immediately. Pyrr can't trust me right now so he has no incentive to give me their names and I also can't confirm anything about him. The only way to avoid the death of both of us with 0 trace is for the Medics to prot us for the first night so if the Mafia do sub in BGs they are boned and I can continue with my plan.
You're not misreading the rules.
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On October 23 2009 14:03 L wrote:
The alternative is that pyrr can tell, or threaten to tell someone. If mafia go balls deep, they lose half their members and the game. in the event that pyrr tells a mafia member who the bgs are, when they die early, he can just tell us who he told and we have a kill right there.
Frankly, i'd rather not die on day 1-2 again, so i'm going to have to push the plan wherein i might get some sweet nursings instead of the one where my death clue involves impotence.
What if he tells a mafia member and both BGs are mafia?
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On October 23 2009 14:35 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 14:06 Incognito wrote:On October 23 2009 14:03 L wrote:
The alternative is that pyrr can tell, or threaten to tell someone. If mafia go balls deep, they lose half their members and the game. in the event that pyrr tells a mafia member who the bgs are, when they die early, he can just tell us who he told and we have a kill right there.
Frankly, i'd rather not die on day 1-2 again, so i'm going to have to push the plan wherein i might get some sweet nursings instead of the one where my death clue involves impotence. What if he tells a mafia member and both BGs are mafia? this too. Ah well this little BG replacement rule has kept me interested in the game so I guess it's a good thing.
Well what BC said is correct, He would have to announce who he gave the BG names to publically. That way if you both die we get two mafia BGs if the person he announced was innocent. If the person he passed the list to was mafia, then we only get one mafia, but its a mafia none the less. If Pyrr is mafia then if you die then Pyrr is mafia and so are the BGs. If Pyrr gave the list to a townie then thats 3 mafia gone, if he told an inno and LIED about it then thats one gone (pyrr) and if he told a fellow mafia member then thats 2 gone (pyrr + person with the list).
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^ So medics dont protect whoever you want. Protect not Ace or Pyrr, as stated by L. Should we begin the medic list?
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On October 23 2009 14:54 Ver wrote:
I'll be going to bed shortly, so I'm guessing the night will have to be delayed until I wake up.
Just to confirm, Ace you will pardon anyone Pyrr selects as his lynch choice?
Imo Ace shouldn't pardon HeavOnEarth if he's selected since he's banned. Would be useless to keep him around.
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On October 23 2009 15:05 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2009 14:48 L wrote:On October 23 2009 14:34 Ace wrote:On October 23 2009 14:03 L wrote:
The alternative is that pyrr can tell, or threaten to tell someone. If mafia go balls deep, they lose half their members and the game. in the event that pyrr tells a mafia member who the bgs are, when they die early, he can just tell us who he told and we have a kill right there.
Frankly, i'd rather not die on day 1-2 again, so i'm going to have to push the plan wherein i might get some sweet nursings instead of the one where my death clue involves impotence. But Pyrr can also be Mafia which is the only snag :/ Hence on Night 1 we have medics prot so just in case they pull a switch they are boned. If you really want to risk Pyrr releasing the names of the BGs to an outsider that assumes he has to be innocent - hence he can tell an innocent person fake BG names, or he can just keep it within the Mafia, or just give the list to the last remaining Mafia person. If neither of us die Night 1 whether they switched or not will become irrelevant once I can post the next part of my plan. If he's mafia and both bgs are mafia, your death is a pretty obvious sign that pyrr is mafia too. The fact that you suggest putting medics on protected targets actually gives him an out; a medic protected him. If he wants to be really fancy, the gf can claim medic and bam, the game's fucked. I was covering the fact that he could be framed if I happened to die and he didn't. Thats a clusterfuck no one wants to deal with. Even if both his BGs were Mafia and I died that doesn't automatically make him guilty.
No because if he was innocent he'd just reveal the BG names and bang two dead.
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So I'm back. And no, Ace's plan still requires someone to die to confirm his RCs if indeed he is a DT. If all Judge/2 BGs are all the same color, someone still needs to die to find out what "blue" is, which can be either BLUE or RED. If all three are different colors, then Judge is GREEN, but you know nothing about the other two BGs without one dying. If the BGs are both the same color but that color is not "blue", then even if you kill one BG you know nothing about "blue" is. Furthermore, if Judge and a BG share a color and the other BG does not, the same situation happens where you don't know what the other BG is even if you kill one. Conclusion: Ace's plan still requires a loss of life. His plan assumes mafia will do our dirty work for us and kill judge and perhaps even a bg. You can't find out sanity without people dying. Yes, using BGs as a check point does rule out GREEN as a possible outcome, but it still tells us nothing without a death.
In addition, proving your "alignment" doesn't prove that you're a DT, as Pyrr pointed out.
Using the "not enough evidence to kill XX" is a defense you used last game as mafia. Doesn't really say anything about your role. In this game, town gets 1 KP for every 2 mafia KP. This actually means that towns KP isn't as critical as in previous games, where town would get 1 lynch per 4-5 mafia KP. This is a huge difference. Which means that we can afford not to lynch people. However, we need information. And it won't come unless people die.
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EPT
