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On September 16 2013 16:00 Itsmedudeman wrote:
The koreans lost the early game in all 4 games. The fact that they were even able to come back in 2 of them was amazing. I highly doubt this will happen over and over for the rest of the group stage. Yes, you can beat the koreans and take a game, especially when things are so up in the air with the new patch and the koreans are the most studied team in the world. Their picks and bans were not strong either. However, the only time I think the koreans played particularly bad was in game 2 against Gambit.
The two games they came back were against two of the most inexperienced teams at this tournament though. No one, especially not the Koreans, should dismiss their early deficits against Vulcun and Lemondogs even though they won. I'm not sure if they just weren't expecting the competition to be so strong or if they just played badly but neither Korean team lived up to their hype in any of the four games they played today.
Also I kind of hope one of the Koreans gets matched against Royal Club. Seeing how much SKT struggled with OMG's early game aggression makes me wonder how in the world they plan on dealing with Royal Club's early game aggression...OMG is practically calm compared to Royal Club.
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On September 16 2013 16:04 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 16:03 Flakes wrote:On September 16 2013 15:58 overt wrote:On September 16 2013 15:48 Complete wrote:
also another question, I'll again mention this is my first time watching pro LoL so maybe I don't know the community well enough
but wtf is with this "disrespect" accusations towards the korean team that lost? From what I understand this is a big tournament that has the biggest prize pool of the year that everybody wants to win, do you guys really think they're picking things that are bad on purpose to disrespect the enemy? doesn't make any sense to me. Ozone picked a champion that no one uses anymore. Twice. No one uses him because he's really fucking bad and it showed when Dade didn't do anything both games. Most people see it as a disrespect pick since no one plays that champion anymore. In any region. It isn't even just fans looking at that as a diss, a pro player named scarra even tweeted about the pick being a bit disrespectful. It's possible that Ozone thought it was a good comp (it wasn't lol) but some people see it as disrespectful because that champion is not that great in the current meta. Almost positive Ozone wouldn't try that comp against SKT/OMG/Sword/Royal Club. This combined with the high opinion that the casters (and TL) have of the Korean progaming teams. It's "respect" used to mean "acknowledgement," e.g. not placing pink wards in lane could be a lack of respect for Eve's ganking power, but it could also have been a lack of respect for diamond's ability to gank with Eve (basically what the analysts were saying) I think it was more so because it would have just gotten dewarded considering that kogmaw and sona are much stronger than vayne zyra. However, I think not knowing where Diamond was all game was definitely the game changer. The koreans in general had a weak early level 1.
Yeah I think the analysts kinda jumped to conclusions about the respect thing, but hey that's their job
Sports commentators aren't supposed to waffle around on opinions 
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On September 16 2013 16:06 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 16:00 Itsmedudeman wrote:
The koreans lost the early game in all 4 games. The fact that they were even able to come back in 2 of them was amazing. I highly doubt this will happen over and over for the rest of the group stage. Yes, you can beat the koreans and take a game, especially when things are so up in the air with the new patch and the koreans are the most studied team in the world. Their picks and bans were not strong either. However, the only time I think the koreans played particularly bad was in game 2 against Gambit. The two games they came back were against two of the most inexperienced teams at this tournament though. No one, especially not the Koreans, should dismiss their early deficits against Vulcun and Lemondogs even though they won. I'm not sure if they just weren't expecting the competition to be so strong or if they just played badly but neither Korean team lived up to their hype in any of the four games they played today. Also I kind of hope one of the Koreans gets matched against Royal Club. Seeing how much SKT struggled with OMG's early game aggression makes me wonder how in the world they plan on dealing with Royal Club's early game aggression...OMG is practically calm compared to Royal Club.
Experience has little to do with this tournament. You can't just say experience matters for one team and then all of a sudden it doesn't matter for another to your favor. TSM has the most experience and got crushed by an inexperienced team in OMG. OMG didn't have much experience but closed out the game against SKT T1. Vulcan has far less experience than Fnatic but stomped them. SKT T1 are just as inexperienced as Lemondogs.
edit: Not saying they should dismiss it without analyzing it, but a lot of dumb things happened that shouldn't have had they been more prepared and not so tentative.
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On September 16 2013 15:59 billy5000 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 15:53 vthree wrote:On September 16 2013 15:51 billy5000 wrote:On September 16 2013 15:47 lilwisper wrote:On September 16 2013 15:45 billy5000 wrote:On September 16 2013 15:41 Disengaged wrote:On September 16 2013 15:40 billy5000 wrote:
Oh wow..I'm really disappointed by ozone showing not even the slightest respect to other teams, which could explain the dumb individual/small plays in laning phase thinking they could out power them like they're some no name team.And that cold shoulder. Especially that cold shoulder. I don't know, it's even worse since I'm korean as well. Damn did they lose so many fans tonight. Get over yourself and put your pitch fork away. Fair enough. Regardless, the lack of respect still holds true. Not knowing a custom isn't a lack of respect. I meant in-game. If you haven't watched their 2 games, they rarely ever stopped to think twice. Always over-committing themselves from the start. So I assume Vulcan was disrespecting Ozone as well when they got caught out left and right??? Sometimes players just play bad. Yes, even Koreans... Yes, that would be right. It did feel that vulcan got a bit cocky after getting the initial lead against a tough opponent. But I think the better expression would be that vulcan got too eager. Again, I already acknowledged the fact that I made a bitchy comment, but I still think ozone went into the games way too overconfident.
Saw the video on youtube again, and I deserve to be hanged for saying that. Plz forgive me TL :\ Ozone was my favorite to win, and I guess I got a bit too hot headed.
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I'm curious if the lack of starting pink wards set Ozone's bottom lane back a ton. IIRC, they fought bottom and Sona burned ignite where everyone ended up at around 50% and minions pushing towards Gambit. I was pretty surprised they recalled (I assume now is from the fear of an Evelyn gank).
This let Kog'maw get an edge early and it seemed as though Ozone's bot lane had no answer between Kog's poke and Sona's sustain.
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On September 16 2013 16:12 R11 wrote:
I'm curious if the lack of starting pink wards set Ozone's bottom lane back a ton. IIRC, they fought bottom and Sona burned ignite where everyone ended up at around 50% and minions pushing towards Gambit. I was pretty surprised they recalled (I assume now is from the fear of an Evelyn gank).
This let Kog'maw get an edge early and it seemed as though Ozone's bot lane had no answer between Kog's poke and Sona's sustain.
They recalled because they failed to all in and Sona was going to sustain kogmaw. Crazy to stay in that lane at 50% health when sona has a healthy mana pool. The lane is very favored towards kogmaw sona if you can't all in and win.
The thing is, because the korean teams don't know the foreign teams that well they chose not to invade and ward but played it really passively with 5 men fanned out on the map. There are lots of gank paths and if you don't ward inside their jungle it's hard to make a pink ward worth it at level 1.
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On September 16 2013 15:48 Navi wrote:
i'm so hyped for this tournament. i'm just upset that ggeu and mineski are competing from a gameplay perspective, their games are super mismatched. understandable from a PR / regional perspective, but if KTB or WE or EG or another powerhouse international team were here, i think the tournament would be that much more fun and the groupstages that much more tense.
We have to be realistic. If I got my wish I would send TPS, KTB, iG because I love those teams but they didn't win what they had to win to be there so I'm glad they didn't go.
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On September 16 2013 16:03 Flakes wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 15:58 overt wrote:On September 16 2013 15:48 Complete wrote:
also another question, I'll again mention this is my first time watching pro LoL so maybe I don't know the community well enough
but wtf is with this "disrespect" accusations towards the korean team that lost? From what I understand this is a big tournament that has the biggest prize pool of the year that everybody wants to win, do you guys really think they're picking things that are bad on purpose to disrespect the enemy? doesn't make any sense to me. Ozone picked a champion that no one uses anymore. Twice. No one uses him because he's really fucking bad and it showed when Dade didn't do anything both games. Most people see it as a disrespect pick since no one plays that champion anymore. In any region. It isn't even just fans looking at that as a diss, a pro player named scarra even tweeted about the pick being a bit disrespectful. It's possible that Ozone thought it was a good comp (it wasn't lol) but some people see it as disrespectful because that champion is not that great in the current meta. Almost positive Ozone wouldn't try that comp against SKT/OMG/Sword/Royal Club. This combined with the high opinion that the casters (and TL) have of the Korean progaming teams. It's "respect" used to mean "acknowledgement," e.g. not placing pink wards in lane could be a lack of respect for Eve's ganking power, but it could also have been a lack of respect for diamond's ability to gank with Eve (basically what the analysts were saying)
yes I agree there is a difference between the disrespect vs acknowledgement. but I saw a lot of people in this thread and i guess twitter about not respecting team x as soon as he picked ryze which I can only assume means people think he chose a trash champion on purpose at his biggest and most important tournament ever which seems like a bit of a ridiculous idea to me! but again I am new to this scene so maybe I am missing something!
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On September 16 2013 16:16 Complete wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 16:03 Flakes wrote:On September 16 2013 15:58 overt wrote:On September 16 2013 15:48 Complete wrote:
also another question, I'll again mention this is my first time watching pro LoL so maybe I don't know the community well enough
but wtf is with this "disrespect" accusations towards the korean team that lost? From what I understand this is a big tournament that has the biggest prize pool of the year that everybody wants to win, do you guys really think they're picking things that are bad on purpose to disrespect the enemy? doesn't make any sense to me. Ozone picked a champion that no one uses anymore. Twice. No one uses him because he's really fucking bad and it showed when Dade didn't do anything both games. Most people see it as a disrespect pick since no one plays that champion anymore. In any region. It isn't even just fans looking at that as a diss, a pro player named scarra even tweeted about the pick being a bit disrespectful. It's possible that Ozone thought it was a good comp (it wasn't lol) but some people see it as disrespectful because that champion is not that great in the current meta. Almost positive Ozone wouldn't try that comp against SKT/OMG/Sword/Royal Club. This combined with the high opinion that the casters (and TL) have of the Korean progaming teams. It's "respect" used to mean "acknowledgement," e.g. not placing pink wards in lane could be a lack of respect for Eve's ganking power, but it could also have been a lack of respect for diamond's ability to gank with Eve (basically what the analysts were saying) yes I agree there is a difference between the disrespect vs acknowledgement. but I saw a lot of people in this thread and i guess twitter about not respecting team x as soon as he picked ryze which I can only assume means people think he chose a trash champion on purpose at his biggest and most important tournament ever which seems like a bit of a ridiculous idea to me! but again I am new to this scene so maybe I am missing something!
I think what people think ozone are trying to do with the ryze pick is to hide any sort of secrets until quarters because they think they can get through groups with ease.
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On September 16 2013 16:16 Complete wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 16:03 Flakes wrote:On September 16 2013 15:58 overt wrote:On September 16 2013 15:48 Complete wrote:
also another question, I'll again mention this is my first time watching pro LoL so maybe I don't know the community well enough
but wtf is with this "disrespect" accusations towards the korean team that lost? From what I understand this is a big tournament that has the biggest prize pool of the year that everybody wants to win, do you guys really think they're picking things that are bad on purpose to disrespect the enemy? doesn't make any sense to me. Ozone picked a champion that no one uses anymore. Twice. No one uses him because he's really fucking bad and it showed when Dade didn't do anything both games. Most people see it as a disrespect pick since no one plays that champion anymore. In any region. It isn't even just fans looking at that as a diss, a pro player named scarra even tweeted about the pick being a bit disrespectful. It's possible that Ozone thought it was a good comp (it wasn't lol) but some people see it as disrespectful because that champion is not that great in the current meta. Almost positive Ozone wouldn't try that comp against SKT/OMG/Sword/Royal Club. This combined with the high opinion that the casters (and TL) have of the Korean progaming teams. It's "respect" used to mean "acknowledgement," e.g. not placing pink wards in lane could be a lack of respect for Eve's ganking power, but it could also have been a lack of respect for diamond's ability to gank with Eve (basically what the analysts were saying) yes I agree there is a difference between the disrespect vs acknowledgement. but I saw a lot of people in this thread and i guess twitter about not respecting team x as soon as he picked ryze which I can only assume means people think he chose a trash champion on purpose at his biggest and most important tournament ever which seems like a bit of a ridiculous idea to me! but again I am new to this scene so maybe I am missing something!
No, I don't think he picked a trash champion on purpose to make a point, but rather that dade's champion pool is really limited and he went back to a "comfort" pick which is terrible and thought he wouldn't get punished considering the level of their opponents.
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The only thing scarier than your opponents going Kog'maw + Evelynn in a bo1
Is when your opponents actually have a plan for going Kog'maw + Evelynn in a bo1
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what did Ozone ban against Gambit? I'm kinda surprised Darien got Shen and Diamond Eve which has been his "main" for like 4 months now
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I think when you're up against an evelyn you need strong lanes. Without strong lanes you will get pushed out and outpinked and you will never know where the evelyn is.
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On September 16 2013 16:20 AsnSensation wrote:
what did Ozone ban against Gambit? I'm kinda surprised Darien got Shen and Diamond Eve which has been his "main" for like 4 months now
Aatrox, Zed, Corki
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I'm starting to feel Samsung not having the breakdancing coach really fucked ozone over. They seem so unprepared.
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On September 16 2013 16:21 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 16:20 AsnSensation wrote:
what did Ozone ban against Gambit? I'm kinda surprised Darien got Shen and Diamond Eve which has been his "main" for like 4 months now Aatrox, Zed, Corki
Banning out your own best champion. Brilliant.
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On September 16 2013 16:22 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 16:21 vthree wrote:On September 16 2013 16:20 AsnSensation wrote:
what did Ozone ban against Gambit? I'm kinda surprised Darien got Shen and Diamond Eve which has been his "main" for like 4 months now Aatrox, Zed, Corki Banning out your own best champion. Brilliant.
I think purple side always has to ban out Zed, esp. considering when you're playing against Alex Ich, but even throughout all the games today, I think Zed has been banned almost EVERY game in purple side due to his strength. There is almost no team that will not first pick Zed on blue side.
edit: Just checked leaguepedia, zed was banned by purple side every game, and never on blue side except for gg.eu vs tsm where zed was unbanned and jarvan was 1st pick.
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You have to respect the Russian factor
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I wonder if pro player gunna be rotated out for tomorrow's desk? Really like dl and monte's input. Krepo was sort of long winded but was okay.
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On September 16 2013 16:33 Shiznick wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2013 16:22 Itsmedudeman wrote:On September 16 2013 16:21 vthree wrote:On September 16 2013 16:20 AsnSensation wrote:
what did Ozone ban against Gambit? I'm kinda surprised Darien got Shen and Diamond Eve which has been his "main" for like 4 months now Aatrox, Zed, Corki Banning out your own best champion. Brilliant. I think purple side always has to ban out Zed, esp. considering when you're playing against Alex Ich, but even throughout all the games today, I think Zed has been banned almost EVERY game in purple side due to his strength. There is almost no team that will not first pick Zed on blue side. edit: Just checked leaguepedia, zed was banned by purple side every game, and never on blue side except for gg.eu vs tsm where zed was unbanned and jarvan was 1st pick.
Yeah, it's pretty insane. I don't really understand it much though. I understand it puts a lot of pressure on their adc, but I don't think he necessarily wins lane in a lot of matchups and later on he kind of falls off when he can't 1 shot people. He's also ad so the other team generally only has to itemize for armor.
The koreans here were definitely hit the hardest by the trinity changes though. Well, the korean teams here anyway who don't really favor corki cause he's not really mechanically that difficult to play.
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EPT
