[MLG] Summer Arena Discussion - Page 38

On August 05 2012 08:51 Slusher wrote:
Dan makes an interesting point, every team in this tournament that has been swapped has not even bothered to counter swap, they've just accepted it every time.

On August 05 2012 08:54 era wrote:


You lose gold and xp swapping

On August 05 2012 08:57 BlackMagister wrote:
Dan Dinh too big, can't see teamfights with his head and arms

On August 05 2012 08:54 Slusher wrote:
the ward was for more autos but ok




it's a common counter stratagy in OGN, you shove in (like copp/elementz were doing anyway) then swap Copp had tp dyrus didn't, they didn't have to lose any xp.

On August 05 2012 08:58 MooMooMugi wrote:
I think SV regrets leaving CLG at this point

On August 05 2012 08:57 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:
To follow up on what I said about Saint earlier:

The biggest problem is that he is so predictable. If he has the choice of doing A, B or C, you know he is going to do B every single time. If you know how one player on a team is going to behave, and their shot-caller at that, it becomes incredibly easy to plan around them. SaintV hasn't changed his play enough to adapt to what everyone else is doing. When you watch Azubu Helios, he's incredibly flexible. He pull off these amazing counterganks because you can't tell what he's going. (Well, at least not until people analyse him much more)

Another thing with Saint is that he's very good if he can stick to his pre-planned routes and patterns. But push him into uncomfortable territory, and he's much less effective. In TSM v Crs, it kept reminding me of the IPL Finals CLG.NA v TSM Series 2. When Saint gets counterjungled at his starting location, he can't recover very well. Especially since you know what he's going to do, so you can shut him down even more.

His third problem is that he likes zerging the AD Carry too much. This was a major problem on CLG. He's far too aggressive and goes ballistic sometimes which leaves his backline exposed. And once the AD Carry goes down, it's all downhill from there. He's too impatient and greedy, trying to go for Buffs he knows are warded and delaying key skills to try and get maximum value when he just needs it now. It was fine back in CLG when the rest of his team was good enough to cover for his moves and outclassed most other teams in general. But the level of competition is much higher how. And he's got to carry Elementz support (who can't make plays).

Saint is still a good player. But he's being outclassed right now. Just as TOO had to adapt and learn to jungle again, SaintV is going to need to do the same to get back to his old form.

On August 05 2012 09:50 iCanada wrote:


I think a much bigger part of it is more his team has been getting outplayed in general recently.

All three of the games vs TSM not a single one of his lanes won, and in every single game atleast one of his lanes was upt to 50 CS behind.

Teams see Saint as the scariest part of Curse and they put all of their pressure there. TSM took every opportunity they had to deny saint resources and keep him out of the game. Every series in recent history in which even just one of Curse's lanes didn't fall severely behind on their own Curse usually wins.

In retrospect, I think the biggest factor in Oddones resurgence is just Regi stopped losing Mid every game, and Dyrus brought some mental stability to the team because whether Rainmain was really losing them games or not he was getting the blame every game and TSM went into games deciding TRM was going to lose top.