EPT[Ultimate Guide] Fizz, the Tidal Trickster - Page 8
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Sponkz
Denmark4564 Posts
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
Fish/pole to start combo, all your autos after that +1% damage. | ||
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imBLIND
United States2626 Posts
I would probably advise against butcher and feast for fizz...that stuff is next to useless for him. Just make it 21/9/0 if you like all-inning at lv2/3 or 21/0/9 if you play a more standard fizz | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
While +12 HP is going to look better on paper during an all-in, Feast is actually probably going to give you more HP for that all in against a competant player. You're going to be taking AA harass at level 1 and will get more than 12 HP from CS via Feast before the all in comes. That's a 1 point vs 1 point comparison though, what we're wondering is if Feast is worth 24 HP which for a level 2 fight it's probably not. So, maybe not as good as 21/9 if you intend to go super ham at level 2, but if you aren't expecting a level 2 kill and want more staying power to get to level 6 safely I think 23/7 is actually probably more defensive. | ||
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imBLIND
United States2626 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Three questions: 1) How do I deal with Kayle in lane? 2) What do you think of the nerfs to Fizz? 3) How do I not immediately explode in a teamfight? When everything is clumped together it is really hard to tell if a projectile / spell is coming my way and so really hard to predict when to Playful/Trickster. | ||
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AsnSensation
Germany24009 Posts
On February 06 2014 00:26 GrandInquisitor wrote: Played Fizz for the first time ever today in ranked. Went 18-4-7 thanks to this guide, but lost ... Three questions: 1) How do I deal with Kayle in lane? 2) What do you think of the nerfs to Fizz? 3) How do I not immediately explode in a teamfight? When everything is clumped together it is really hard to tell if a projectile / spell is coming my way and so really hard to predict when to Playful/Trickster. kayle is a hard lane but can be easily outplayed by using E so her Q projectile misses. A good kayle will just autoattack you until you use your E though. Nerfs were mainly to his early game and really reduced his lvl2/3 kill potential but imo he's still pretty good when you reach 3 items. (lichbane hourglass voidstaff) 3. is a matter of experience I guess and to time your E and hourglass right to dodge all the crucial skills. Never initiate a teamfight by using E to gapclose into W/Q unless you have hourglass to stall until your team joins. | ||
NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On February 06 2014 00:26 GrandInquisitor wrote: Played Fizz for the first time ever today in ranked. Went 18-4-7 thanks to this guide, but lost ... Three questions: 1) How do I deal with Kayle in lane? 2) What do you think of the nerfs to Fizz? 3) How do I not immediately explode in a teamfight? When everything is clumped together it is really hard to tell if a projectile / spell is coming my way and so really hard to predict when to Playful/Trickster. 1) Be aggressive, especially pre 6. You have to be able to Playful her Reckoning and it's obviously better if she's in range when you land so you can do the damage. If she can land a Reckoning on you and you're inside her max cast range with no escapes, you're going to be in a world of hurt. 2) Plz no nerfs. 3) Uh, get better? First and foremost, flank. You're not an initator. You're best as a backline assassin or clean up. If you trade your life for the enemy ADC, you're doing it right. Besides, you have Playful/Trickster and Zhonya's to bank on as well. Hopefully a GA as your 6th item as well. If all goes well, your team can keep the enemy team occupied long enough for you to do your business. If you're with your team and not flanking, then yeah, good luck dodging anything. | ||
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imBLIND
United States2626 Posts
Kayle is an annoying lane; its kinda like facing a ziggs but not as bad. She falls under one of those matchups where the only real way to win the lane is to engage immediately when they try and harass/push you out of lane (morde, ziggs, orianna sorta, syndra, cassiopia, ryze, etc). I don't even notice the fizz nerfs to be honest...the W nerf hurt a little when it comes to trading, but it doesn't really matter for the people who play fizz on a daily basis. Teamfighting with fizz is like the same as teamfighting with zed or ahri; come in at the most opportune time to kill off the adc, get out before the cc comes. If for some reason you're really behind the only one that can kill the tank, you throw your R out on their adc, let your tanks go for the carries, and peel for your adc. But most of the time I'm just hiding in a bush waiting for the adc to get into fish range and i just insta kill them. | ||
Atrioc
United States1865 Posts
If there is anything else you think may not stand the test of time please let me know since updating this thing is a real hassle with all the images haha and I would prefer to do it just once. As for S4 in general: My honest opinion of him this patch is that he is still a fully capable solo queue pick and incredibly fun/rewarding to learn, but he is definitely a low-tier character in this current meta. A lot of the hot mid lane picks right now (Ziggs, Gragas, Kayle, Ori) are favored against Fizz and make it hard for you to snowball, and supports being tankier has done nothing to help Fizz pick up easy snipes either. | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Atrioc
United States1865 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Other than that, I find building Fizz to be surprisingly tricky. He has so many "core" items that there isn't much room in his build: Lich Bane, Zhonya's, Rabadon's, Void Staff, and GA are 5 items already, so adding in something like a DFG or Abyssal Scepter requires you to either sell your boots or replace one of these seemingly irreplaceable items. Moreover, Sheen is the best first item for him, but it obviously doesn't build into Zhonya's, which you desperately need. I've been trying Sheen -> Zhonya's -> Lich Bane, but that means I don't fully complete an item for a while. | ||
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On October 30 2014 03:22 GrandInquisitor wrote: I've been playing Fizz a lot lately and thinking a lot about his build. I have found Flask/3 pots to generally be better than Doran's Ring/2 pots. I also have grown to prefer CDR boots over Sorcerer's Shoes, because many fights hinge on whether your E can come off cooldown in time or not, and Fizz otherwise has barely any room in his build for CDR. Other than that, I find building Fizz to be surprisingly tricky. He has so many "core" items that there isn't much room in his build: Lich Bane, Zhonya's, Rabadon's, Void Staff, and GA are 5 items already, so adding in something like a DFG or Abyssal Scepter requires you to either sell your boots or replace one of these seemingly irreplaceable items. Moreover, Sheen is the best first item for him, but it obviously doesn't build into Zhonya's, which you desperately need. I've been trying Sheen -> Zhonya's -> Lich Bane, but that means I don't fully complete an item for a while. Yeah I couldn't agree more that he does not have much room to deviate when it comes to builds. Nowadays I start flash 3 pots and buy 1 doran's ring, sometimes 2 on my first back. From there I like to rush fiendish Codex into either DFG or straight up zhonya's depending how the laning phase is. Lich Bane is usually my third big item and then void staff. I also opt for CDR shoes when i'm not snowballing. CDR shoes/DFG/cdr masteries/blue pot late game will put you at 40% cdr. This usually means I don't need to buy a GA since I can fully combo, zhonya's and then E out with a kill due to CDR. Typical order is something like 1-2 dorans--->DFG--->Zhonya's----->Liche----->Void or Cap(depending on enemy MR). I usually wait to upgrade to cdr boots until my second item is completed. | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Leveling Q increases the base magic damage 10 / 40 / 70 / 100 / 130 (+ 60% AP) and reduces cooldown 10 / 9 / 8 / 7 / 6 Leveling W increases the passive rend 30 / 40 / 50 / 60 / 70 (+ 35% AP) (+ 4 / 5 / 6 / 7 / 8% of target's missing health) and the active magic damage 10 / 15 / 20 / 25 / 30 (+ 25% AP) Damage-wise, each level in Q adds 30 damage while each level in W adds 15 damage per AA or Q + 1% of the target's missing health. In other words, leveling W always outdamages Q so long as you land a single AA on the target outside of your Q. So is it for the cooldown reduction that people max Q second instead of W? | ||
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AsnSensation
Germany24009 Posts
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Atrioc
United States1865 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/hHmLzUo.png) Check out my end of season run ! Flask + 3 pots is definitely #1 choice you have to SURVIVE 90% of lanes until a gank or level 6. I don't think the rest of the build path is very complicated though: Flask + 3 -> most expensive part of Lich Bane you can afford -> the other part of Lich Bane + boots usually -> finish Lich Bane -> Needlessly Large Rod if you can afford it, otherwise Boots 2 -> Rest of Zhonyas - > DCAP -> DFG Only hard part for me is figuring out whether I should get Sorc Boots or CDR Boots and that is the type of question that keeps me up at night. I feel like CDR is optimally better but Sorc Boots never lets me down so IDK. Fizz and Panth are both so damn good right now I want to just quit my job and play all day. | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On November 29 2014 20:06 Atrioc wrote: THE KID IS BACK Check out my end of season run ! Flask + 3 pots is definitely #1 choice you have to SURVIVE 90% of lanes until a gank or level 6. I don't think the rest of the build path is very complicated though: Flask + 3 -> most expensive part of Lich Bane you can afford -> the other part of Lich Bane + boots usually -> finish Lich Bane -> Needlessly Large Rod if you can afford it, otherwise Boots 2 -> Rest of Zhonyas - > DCAP -> DFG Only hard part for me is figuring out whether I should get Sorc Boots or CDR Boots and that is the type of question that keeps me up at night. I feel like CDR is optimally better but Sorc Boots never lets me down so IDK. Fizz and Panth are both so damn good right now I want to just quit my job and play all day. lololol, nice jokez Atrioc.  After watching a lot of FateFalls, I'm definitely on the CDR boat. I still don't feel proficient enough to go straight DFG first (still like double Rings, Sheen, Zhonya's/Lich Bane in some order). But the 15% CDR from Ionian boots is too good to pass on imo. Faster ultis and more trollpole in team fights. You're still going to build pretty much glass cannon, so some MPen lost is nothing to write home about. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
 Still playing Pantheon mid? I assume in s5 with later first ganks it's good for your lane aggro. Do you start flask on him too, or (as your history seems to suggest) long sword+3 pots and try to kill before you run oom? | ||
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Atrioc
United States1865 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.gyazo.com/b84d624f5adaf9d87abe3442542b9823.png) I watched some FateFalls too when I was getting back into Fizz. He's an absolute beast and I think his DFG first build is super sick, but coming from my TL background I will always believe in Korean superiority = P I think this guy is the best Fizz world (and he still runs Lich -> Zhonyas -> Void or Cap depending on situation.) | ||
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