EPT[Champion] Ryze - Page 7
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AsnSensation
Germany24009 Posts
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Plague1503
Croatia466 Posts
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h3r1n6
Iceland2039 Posts
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-Zoda-
France3578 Posts
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On December 23 2012 08:00 -Zoda- wrote: I tried by myself the gauntlet, it happends that it's not perfect indeed. When you already have to move between you Qs, you don't have much time to auto, you need to do something like EWQ to have some free time and auto... I like it to chase and clear waves but in the end some more resist from Frozen Heart may be useful. Yeah i think its better to go fh anyway. with 9/0/21 masteries, ur q and fh you'll have 40% cdr. Plus it helps make the enemy adc slightly less deadly. | ||
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h3r1n6
Iceland2039 Posts
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On December 29 2012 02:35 h3r1n6 wrote: Alright, made some updates to the op with what I know so far from Season 3. I still don't really have a whole lot of time to play and try out stuff. Has anyone tried Twin Shadows on Ryze? Tried it, didn't like it. The buildup is awkward, and that was my main complaint. For my first 700g, I usually want to get a tear, and if I am going to reach 765 gold after I got that, more often than not I would rather farm till I get Mana+Ruby instead of Kage's. The one time I did try it, it ended up working out really well though. I was duoing with a Jarvan jungle who happened to come mid every time the item was off cooldown, enabling his EQ and my W follow up. Afterwards, we would usually roam, and the extra MS comes in really handy. If you get Twin Shadows, 21 in utility, MS quints and boots2 with Alacrity, you are going to outrun basically everyone, but yeah. I still don't think it's much of a good item for him, considering Ryze doesn't really have the slots for another 2k gold item (assuming you are going to sit on boots, tear, cata, glacial before upgrading cata). BTW, you were obviously right about the starting item discussion. Flask is MUCH, MUCH superior to mana crystal, and I do see that now. Oh, some stuff for your OP: you linked the Twin Shadows Icon once, but you're actually discussing Abyssal. Also, I think you should add that most of the time, it is a really good idea to get Glacial before upgrading your cata. | ||
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h3r1n6
Iceland2039 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
I just always wanted to try Chalice on Ryze but couldn't convince myself to use Athene's because it's more AP oriented, and Crucible with its Mana and (sort of) tanky on-use seems like a decent fit. | ||
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imBLIND
United States2626 Posts
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-Zoda-
France3578 Posts
![[image loading]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/91558700/Ryze_Image.png) So basically, Muramana deals more damage on isolated targets, but with ult's AoE and E's bounces, you can probably deal more damage in teamfights. All of that not taking in account the fact that Seraph's gives you a shield and that Muramana's damage decreases over time because it's based on current mana. | ||
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h3r1n6
Iceland2039 Posts
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On January 07 2013 11:05 -Zoda- wrote: Hey I found that on league wiki, a guy calculating damage with Muramana or Seraph's. So basically, Muramana deals more damage on isolated targets, but with ult's AoE and E's bounces, you can probably deal more damage in teamfights. All of that not taking in account the fact that Seraph's gives you a shield and that Muramana's damage decreases over time because it's based on current mana. While it is true what you are saying, playing Ryze in order to maximize AoE damage seems to be the wrong approach. In order to fully utilize his ultimate, people would have to clump up and you had to actually be in range. I'd also rather have Annie, Brand or Cass in a situation like that. Especially since the release of Muramana, Ryze really lives up to his title, the rogue mage. Getting Muramana does not only mean a much smoother buildup (something you will crave if you tend to build RoA early), and using your tear basically RIGHT when it's stacked (usually that's the case roundabout when you have Tear/RoA/Glacial/Boots2), but it also means that if you ever catch someone off guard with a W, they are going to lose 50% HP. Getting Muramana means that if their ADC positions poorly, you can take him out within the duration of a single Rune Prison. I have tried both and there are situations (you're by far the most fed on your team, everyone focusses you, lots of disables) where Seraph's is a decent choice, but as of now, I got Muramana 24/25 games this season and still think it's the reason Ryze is currently broken. Oh, also, the dude's calculating his shit with an actual DPS rotation, something you will rarely get off in a teamfight. QWQEQ doesn't happen quite as much as QEWQ+Autoattack, a scenario which favors Muramana, too. | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On January 07 2013 22:25 sylverfyre wrote: Also, muramana helps shores up one of Ryze's other big weaknesses - that he does very little damage to towers. Not sure if that is an actual argument for getting it, though. You usually get it after spending about 5000 gold on other items, and then another 1400 on Muramana itself. At this point in the game, you should not be able to push turrets by yourself uncontested - usually, you will push as 5 after teamfights. I LIKE being able to deal some damage to turrets while my team is desperately diving for their Janna who survived the last teamfight, so I guess there's some value to being able to kill turrets on your own, but really, it's just icing on the cake. Oh, and Muramana incentivizes auto attacking, so against teams with lots of physical threats, I have had great success combining it with Iceborn Gauntlet, I know they don't actually synergyze together (other than the mana Iceborn Gauntlets gives), but the armor is neat against certain teams and the slow, especially when combined with Furor boots, is sooooo good. I'm really amazed by how different my Ryze builds are each and every game, and I'm not sure if that is relative inexperience (I started playing him more seriously this season as opposed to counterpick only material) or the fact there's LOTS of stuff that works on him these days. | ||
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Wetty
Australia419 Posts
On January 07 2013 22:31 Shiv. wrote: Not sure if that is an actual argument for getting it, though. You usually get it after spending about 5000 gold on other items, and then another 1400 on Muramana itself. At this point in the game, you should not be able to push turrets by yourself uncontested - usually, you will push as 5 after teamfights. I LIKE being able to deal some damage to turrets while my team is desperately diving for their Janna who survived the last teamfight, so I guess there's some value to being able to kill turrets on your own, but really, it's just icing on the cake. Oh, and Muramana incentivizes auto attacking, so against teams with lots of physical threats, I have had great success combining it with Iceborn Gauntlet, I know they don't actually synergyze together (other than the mana Iceborn Gauntlets gives), but the armor is neat against certain teams and the slow, especially when combined with Furor boots, is sooooo good. I'm really amazed by how different my Ryze builds are each and every game, and I'm not sure if that is relative inexperience (I started playing him more seriously this season as opposed to counterpick only material) or the fact there's LOTS of stuff that works on him these days. Lots of stuff seems to be the case - I find that's the case with a lot of AP picks actually, not a single build for every game. I like it. It's especially cool for Ryze, who was always very rigid in build previously. | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On January 07 2013 22:31 Shiv. wrote: Not sure if that is an actual argument for getting it, though. You usually get it after spending about 5000 gold on other items, and then another 1400 on Muramana itself. At this point in the game, you should not be able to push turrets by yourself uncontested - usually, you will push as 5 after teamfights. I LIKE being able to deal some damage to turrets while my team is desperately diving for their Janna who survived the last teamfight, so I guess there's some value to being able to kill turrets on your own, but really, it's just icing on the cake. Oh, and Muramana incentivizes auto attacking, so against teams with lots of physical threats, I have had great success combining it with Iceborn Gauntlet, I know they don't actually synergyze together (other than the mana Iceborn Gauntlets gives), but the armor is neat against certain teams and the slow, especially when combined with Furor boots, is sooooo good. I'm really amazed by how different my Ryze builds are each and every game, and I'm not sure if that is relative inexperience (I started playing him more seriously this season as opposed to counterpick only material) or the fact there's LOTS of stuff that works on him these days. Nah, it's just a bit more icing on an already delicious muramana cake. I still don't see how IBG can ever replace Frozen Heart, though, vs. physical threats. Less CDR, no AS reduction aura, Less armor, minimal mana difference, and a sheenproc which you really can't take much advantage of... why wouldn't you go with FH against the physical threats? | ||
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On January 08 2013 00:08 sylverfyre wrote: Nah, it's just a bit more icing on an already delicious muramana cake. I still don't see how IBG can ever replace Frozen Heart, though, vs. physical threats. Less CDR, no AS reduction aura, Less armor, minimal mana difference, and a sheenproc which you really can't take much advantage of... why wouldn't you go with FH against the physical threats? I would go FH with physical threats, I just tend to skip the BV in that case and don't mind the fact I'm overcapping CDR. Sometimes, I even go Boots/FH/BV/RoA/Muramana/IBG, just in case they're not stacking any MR or I feel the BV will benefit me more than WotA would. It all depends. At the moment though, I'm still experimenting a lot and luckily permanently running into people who don't know how to deal with Ryze. (brag brag brag) I also just realized I'm 5% away from being in the top 10 winrates. Too little time to actually spam games, yay. | ||
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