EPT[Champion] Taric - Page 4
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
like the way it is now, you actually want to go in less because you don't have all that heal from your ult. a mediocre pbaoe isn't alot of incentive to go in. | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On September 16 2011 07:40 TheYango wrote: The thing is, mass ally steroids are one of the most boring mechanics to have for a spell, because they're not very interactive and they don't create gameplay. You can't stop him from using it because it's instant-cast and not timing-dependent, and you can't really play around it because it applies to all 5 enemies, and lasts long enough and is weak enough that disengaging and waiting out the buff generally isn't worthwhile. So people end up just not doing anything about it, which is super disappointing when all 10 people in the game don't really change how they play with respect to his ultimate. So they replaced a mass ally steroid with... a mass ally steroid. At the very least Taric's old ultimate was interesting for him because he needed to actively consider how long he could afford to use it based on circumstances. As a no/low-CS support he couldn't (and really shouldn't) build enough mana regen to use it indiscriminately. I'm not going to claim that the old ultimate was a pinnacle of perfect game design, but I will argue that there's very little that the new ultimate does which is an improvement on the old one. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 16 2011 10:35 Seuss wrote: So they replaced a mass ally steroid with... a mass ally steroid. At the very least Taric's old ultimate was interesting for him because he needed to actively consider how long he could afford to use it based on circumstances. As a no/low-CS support he couldn't (and really shouldn't) build enough mana regen to use it indiscriminately. I'm not going to claim that the old ultimate was a pinnacle of perfect game design, but I will argue that there's very little that the new ultimate does which is an improvement on the old one. Right, I agree with you. I was just saying that they chose the most boring possible kind of spell to replace his old ulti. Incidentally, the old ultimate actually had more gameplay for the other 9 players in the game too, because instead of having a fixed duration, it lasted till Taric turned it off or died, so in theory you could disrupt the buff by killing him. | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
I have also always felt that taric not best used as a tank-initiator, and instead better as a counter-initiator, and have always (though this is strictly empirical evidence) had more success in the protection business compared to the initiation business (unless i start out 5-0, in which case i combo every1 for 3/4 hp, huehuehue). With the new ult setup, you can just camp near ur ranged dps and stun + ult anytime a bruiser gets near giving a huge advantage to the ranged ad vs bruiser fight to the ad, something that is very attractive for a support to have. If you look at all the supports, they are all about giving an advantage to the squishy people vs the melee bruisers. Some accomplish this by keeping those ppl away and kiting them, taric accomplishes this by stunning and murdering them. In that respect, taric now feels more like a bomb-ass sona than anything else, except that his cc is not only more reliable but also off cd more often. anyways, so ends the taric ramblings of the goldenbear | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 18 2011 02:03 barbsq wrote: honestly, i like the ult change quite a bit. It give taric true threat presence in lane @ lvl 6 that he never used to have, in fact it was often best to not even lvl it at 6, which i dont necessarily have a problem with, but w/e. In terms of taric's mid - lategame, you never even really used ur ult in teamfights because it simply burned mana too fast, it was almost strictly used for taking objectives. I learned this after about 4-5 games with taric, i found that teamfights where my ult was on ended with me not having enough mana to get that clutch stun or heal that allows cait to kill xin, instead of the other way around. 2 and sometimes even 3 stuns, at least 3 heals (making sure to auto a decent bit can increase this number a huge amount), and mybe 2 shatters is very feasible in a teamfight, but you wont get the 2nd round off if you're using the ult the whole time. Really? I've always felt Taric ulti to be rather useful in lane, particularly with a partner with strong AD scaling abilities. Flick it on and off for 2-3 seconds during their combo, and given that most AD casters have bonus AD ratios in their combo of about 5 to 6, you get way more damage out of it than another W or E rank would give you, at a very reasonable mana cost, because you're just toggling it quickly. On September 18 2011 02:03 barbsq wrote: With the new ult setup, you can just camp near ur ranged dps and stun + ult anytime a bruiser gets near giving a huge advantage to the ranged ad vs bruiser fight to the ad, something that is very attractive for a support to have. If you look at all the supports, they are all about giving an advantage to the squishy people vs the melee bruisers. Some accomplish this by keeping those ppl away and kiting them, taric accomplishes this by stunning and murdering them. In that respect, taric now feels more like a bomb-ass sona than anything else, except that his cc is not only more reliable but also off cd more often. The issue I have with the Taric changes isn't that they're not good (particularly with the changes to W range, I think the revamped Taric is quite strong), but that the new ultimate is less interesting gameplay-wise than the old one. No matter what role you have, a plain nuke + a mass ally steroid don't create gameplay that your opponents can respond to or are forced to play around. | ||
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topoulo
253 Posts
the reason is pretty simple , tarric has low dps and cc plus ZERO cc avoidance apart the occasional flash. With his old ulti and a tank ability build with his ulti he could sustain - at times - the burst , right now he cant do shit he just dies to any descent assist add the heal nerfs and qq hes worthless in meta game just like all healers and pure tanks | ||
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MoonBear
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
The old Taric had some interesting counter-intuitive play. For instance, his stun gets better the more you move away from the target. In fights, this means to maximise your stun you want to fire it and then walk away from the fight a bit. That's a little odd. When using you shatter, you also lost the armour aura. That means you don't want to be using it post level 11-ish since the loss of the aura for your team was worse than the gain in armour reduction on the enemies. You also probably only got one, maybe two, heals off in team fights. And R was pretty binary. If you're in a fight or pushing tower, pop it on for a few seconds, otherwise turn it off. That makes for a pretty bad gameplay since there's one skill you never want to use, one skill that requires you to want to move away from the fight, and two skills that you don't think too hard about using. You also suffered the problem of being tanky, but ignorable. This is the main problem for any tank, which is being ignorable. The new Taric changes try to counteract this in some way. Stun duration is now fixed at 1.5 seconds. This means that you still have the option of moving back for more damage, but if you don't you can still stay in the fight and get a decent stun off. Since Shatter preserves the armour aura, you can actually feel fine about using it in a fight if you feel it's worth losing your own armour bonus. It's now not an automatic decision to not use it compared to before. It instead encourages you to think and make a decision. Your Ult basically gives yourself a free Baron Buff in terms of AP+AD at level 11 and at max level it's a free Baron buff for your entire team. That's a lot of free gold in stats right there for everyone on your team, not just autoattackers. This also boosts your heal (from the free AP). This means in fights you have two option. You can hang back and babysit your carry as a tanky guy who can heal and stun and give free AP+AD. But you can also go in someone's face beating them over the head with your 191AD at level 18 which also lowers the CD on your heal to throw more of them around. Because the ult aura doesn't have a continuous mana cost, you can keep that 191 AD threat up for quite a while. Your Shatter reduces armour by 30 which is like a free double Brutaliser. So you can play aggressive which can also make you a legitimate target that isn't so ignorable. Thanks to standardised stun + AP/AD/Armour Aura and doing decent damage, he is now a more legitimate thread. In all, it's in line with Riots plans to move Support to the option where they can both babysit far back like before but also have the ability to get in someone's face and be a pain. It also fixes the problem of Taric having two skills that were rather counter-intuitive in their usage and two more skills and didn't have a major amount of thinking involved. (I understand R meant you had to keep thinking about your mana costs and how long you left it on, but when one of your top concerns is being an ult aura bot and being ignorable in team fights, that's a pretty bad design for a champion.) | ||
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VictorianPark
Canada15 Posts
I have concluded that it is quite good. Beat elementz couple days ago against his riven, have never lost a lane, and it absolutely crushes any AD they send up there. Does ok vs tanky AP sustain if you have the right build with a seperate rune page. | ||
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Niton
United States2395 Posts
Having tried Taric out a bit, on SR and Dominion, I think he's really missing the healing from his ultimate. One of his greatest strengths was his ability to stay in fights as long as he could power his healing, and much of the rest of his design was balanced around that fact. Without it, he's nowhere near as strong as he used to be, because his skillset is reliant on him being in melee combat, right down to his passive. Taric's ability to fight when ahead is better than it was, but he's got basically zero shot of being useful if he's even a little bit behind past laning now, and he lost almost all of his character-specific ultility to this change. To some extent, he's just a straight-up worse champion at doing what he did before the changes, and it doesn't feel like he's gained even half of that back with the Shatter buff and the Dazzle normalization. --- There used to be a time where you could rely on Radiance to restore a few hundred to a thousand health, and the potential increased burst from the New Radiance's 70 AP + 350 damage really doesn't cut it. Old Level 18 burst (max range stun): 80 (+.2) + 300 (+.5) = 380 (+.7) New Level 18 burst (max range stun): 160 (+.4) + 350 (+.6) + 240 (+28) (+.4) = 778 (+1.4) Don't get me wrong, the 400 (+.7) is a great burst increase. The new Radiance contributes to burst very well, but at the expense of simply removing strength from the character: - Taric's total self-benefit from Radiance is not as high as it should be for a replacement for a powerful ultimate. You're almost never going to be able to land Radiance's 400 radius AoE on a target without using Dazzle on them. Once you get in range, you'll be able to use Radiance - which doesn't get its own bonus AP. - Taric has long cooldowns. Even with 40% CDR, you'll only be able to get off 1 Shatter and 1 Dazzle with Radiance's aura - 2 Imbues, though, if you're hitting a champion constantly.. which brings me to my next point: - Taric can no longer stay in melee without significant itemization to do so. Radiance's healing allowed him to be tanky and to get into fights or take tower/baron hits for his team, differentiating him from other supports. Without Radiance's healing, he can be focused down or out of a fight way easier than some of the supports he's competing for a slot against. - Taric needed Radiance's heal to stay in combat. On a support's budget, he could build some MR/HP and then get AP, remaining useful until his single-target stun fell out of power. Now he needs to be tanky, and there's only one item which even gives the 3 stats he wants (HP, MR, CDR). He's become more reliant on doing well early game than before, because a Taric that can't get into melee range is about as useful as a support AD Sion (and offers less total healing!) --- Taric's always been compared to Sona, Soraka, Janna and Alistar, and while Alistar ate a pretty huge change to his ultimate, even he's still considered incredibly good on the strength of his other skills. Taric's lost ground compared to all of them, and he's easily the worst of the 5 in Dominion. So what needs to be changed? In my opinion, Radiance should give Taric the HoT it used to give, even if it means lowering the damage on the nuke. He desperately needs the self-healing to stay relevant in teamfights, the same way Alistar needs his ult to not die when he's in the thick of things. There are other, possibly better ideas, but given that they just changed Taric's ult, I don't think there's much of a chance of anything more complex being done. | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On September 18 2011 02:27 TheYango wrote: Really? I've always felt Taric ulti to be rather useful in lane, particularly with a partner with strong AD scaling abilities. Flick it on and off for 2-3 seconds during their combo, and given that most AD casters have bonus AD ratios in their combo of about 5 to 6, you get way more damage out of it than another W or E rank would give you, at a very reasonable mana cost, because you're just toggling it quickly. There are two skill leveling trains of thought I go by. 1 is my standard 'tryhard tournament' so to speak skilling where I basically get e lvl 1, and then max q and/or w depending on what's going on in the lane. Q if there's a lot of harass and I need to keep up in the sustain battle, W if it's more one-sided to our advantage, which provides a better armor aura for the counter-harass and minion dmg taken in lane. This is a pretty standard babysitting style of play, and in this situation, the purpose of r would really only be self-heal, since the goal of this style is to provide a long-term bonus that the ranged AD can use as an advantage to win the lane and be able to farm over the course of the laning phase. Furthermore, i'm not entirely sure I agree that his old radiance contributed more dmg than the armor reduction for an extra lvl of w, tho I have 0 math to back this up. This is also typically a mana-intensive lane since there is no down time between using skills, so an extra mana sink is not exactly ideal. 90% of the time, you're either being aggressive and using stun/w, or sitting back and spamming heal to build up hp for the next round of harass. Now, I dont always have treebeard in my lane to rely on, so the other style that I play is a more 'solo queue' style, where I only have 1 lvl of heal, and maxed e and w first. The goal of this style was to be an abusive, bursty, bully in lane and to have little to no reliance on my lane partner, who I simply assumed wouldn't contribute much. In this case, his old ult contributed little to no boosts to his own dmg, again it simply becomes a costly self-heal. Disclaimer: just in case it's not totally clear, my rule of thumb in these situations was to get ult either when we wanted to push the tower or take dragon, not to leave it until lvls 16-18. Furthermore, I actually didn't have a problem with not leveling ult at 6, in fact it becomes a fairly interesting sort of very situational sort of gameplay that I was actually ok with (if you can understand what I'm trying to say here  )On September 18 2011 02:27 TheYango wrote: The issue I have with the Taric changes isn't that they're not good (particularly with the changes to W range, I think the revamped Taric is quite strong), but that the new ultimate is less interesting gameplay-wise than the old one. No matter what role you have, a plain nuke + a mass ally steroid don't create gameplay that your opponents can respond to or are forced to play around. Fair enough, but in terms of strictly gameplay his ult was (to me) simply not satisfying to use. A) it didn't actually provide assists for kills on its own (tho this is more an annoying quirk than 'bad gameplay' so to speak). B) It's impact is about as obvious as sona's Q, thats not to say it wasn't a large one, it simply wasn't an easily perceptible one. The difference to me becomes more taric new ult -> i groundpound, make a huge sound, and my teammates get stronger, hooray!, vs turning on a lightbulb. Naturally gameplay is such a subjective quantity, that we are both 'right' from our own perspectives, but for me, the ult change made it far more 'interesting' to use compared to the old one. tl:dr, honestly if you dont want to read it, i dont care, because there isn't exactly much content in it Edit: On September 23 2011 17:30 VictorianPark wrote: I've been experimenting with going taric solo top. tried a lot of mastery/rune builds with various item experimenting. I have concluded that it is quite good. Beat elementz couple days ago against his riven, have never lost a lane, and it absolutely crushes any AD they send up there. Does ok vs tanky AP sustain if you have the right build with a seperate rune page. i feel the same way, except i literally have no idea how i would build him | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On September 24 2011 03:55 Niton wrote: MoonBear - Taric is not currently viable as a never-in-melee support, and he never has been Having tried Taric out a bit, on SR and Dominion, I think he's really missing the healing from his ultimate. One of his greatest strengths was his ability to stay in fights as long as he could power his healing, and much of the rest of his design was balanced around that fact. Without it, he's nowhere near as strong as he used to be, because his skillset is reliant on him being in melee combat, right down to his passive. he may be 'melee' so to speak, but he's a counter-initiator, which means he's primarily near the AD, and the only people who get near them are melee, so I don't see the issue. Taric's ability to fight when ahead is better than it was, but he's got basically zero shot of being useful if he's even a little bit behind past laning now, and he lost almost all of his character-specific ultility to this change. To some extent, he's just a straight-up worse champion at doing what he did before the changes, and it doesn't feel like he's gained even half of that back with the Shatter buff and the Dazzle normalization. Disagree completely, single target 1.5sec stun, armor aura, aoe armor reduction debuff, and AP/AD steroid aura is useful regardless of farm. There used to be a time where you could rely on Radiance to restore a few hundred to a thousand health, and the potential increased burst from the New Radiance's 70 AP + 350 damage really doesn't cut it. Old Level 18 burst (max range stun): 80 (+.2) + 300 (+.5) = 380 (+.7) New Level 18 burst (max range stun): 160 (+.4) + 350 (+.6) + 240 (+28) (+.4) = 778 (+1.4) Don't get me wrong, the 400 (+.7) is a great burst increase. The new Radiance contributes to burst very well, but at the expense of simply removing strength from the character: R was garbage as a self heal during a teamfight, it was simply waaay too much mana to sustain for any reasonable period of time. It was really only used to take dragon or towers, which you should be auto-attacking, which reduces cd on q, making r's self-heal a bit redundant. - Taric's total self-benefit from Radiance is not as high as it should be for a replacement for a powerful ultimate. You're almost never going to be able to land Radiance's 400 radius AoE on a target without using Dazzle on them. Once you get in range, you'll be able to use Radiance - which doesn't get its own bonus AP. nope, R's ap bonus actually does apply to the dmg, says so here: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Taric#Radiance, read the notes below the abilities not to mention taric's mid-lategame power has never been because he did dmg (though him having dmg certainly adds to it) - Taric has long cooldowns. Even with 40% CDR, you'll only be able to get off 1 Shatter and 1 Dazzle with Radiance's aura - 2 Imbues, though, if you're hitting a champion constantly.. which brings me to my next point: I think you overestimate his CD's a little, that may be true for small skirmishes, but large-scale 5v5's tend to be longer than what I think you estimate. In any case, you're typically only interested in stopping 1 person anyways, keeping their melee bruiser away from your carries, so again I don't really see the problem - Taric can no longer stay in melee without significant itemization to do so. Radiance's healing allowed him to be tanky and to get into fights or take tower/baron hits for his team, differentiating him from other supports. Without Radiance's healing, he can be focused down or out of a fight way easier than some of the supports he's competing for a slot against. muhhhh.. again radiance's heal/mana cost was kinda shit, sure you can tank more stuff by just pressing r, but then u cant really do anything else. In any case, again if you're in range of the enemy carries and taking dmg from them, then I see that as a problem, since i'm much more interested in protecting than assaulting, but w/e guess u can chalk that up to 'playstyle' or whatever - Taric needed Radiance's heal to stay in combat. On a support's budget, he could build some MR/HP and then get AP, remaining useful until his single-target stun fell out of power. Now he needs to be tanky, and there's only one item which even gives the 3 stats he wants (HP, MR, CDR). He's become more reliant on doing well early game than before, because a Taric that can't get into melee range is about as useful as a support AD Sion (and offers less total healing!) I really hope you're not referring to svisage, kus i hated that item on him. Anyways, aegis is still great on taric, not to mention that a single-target stun never really 'falls out of power'. I think that a lot of these problems are again solved by going for a more protective, counter initiating role than being an aggressor Taric's always been compared to Sona, Soraka, Janna and Alistar, and while Alistar ate a pretty huge change to his ultimate, even he's still considered incredibly good on the strength of his other skills. Taric's lost ground compared to all of them, and he's easily the worst of the 5 in Dominion. Taric's changes significantly upped his power level, i don't see how removing a redundant self-heal source made him shit. Also I would imagine taric would actually be much better in a pseudocarry role in dominion, and on a similar thread, i think it will take a much longer time to figure out champion's power levels in dominion than the 2 hours it's been up. So what needs to be changed? In my opinion, Radiance should give Taric the HoT it used to give, even if it means lowering the damage on the nuke. He desperately needs the self-healing to stay relevant in teamfights, the same way Alistar needs his ult to not die when he's in the thick of things. i kinda covered this earlier, but I have had the most success with taric as a counter-initiator, not as an initiator. You could say a lot of these things about sona, but she's played in a very similar way. Cow, on the other hand... well cow actually does fucking everything, but w/e | ||
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crate
United States2474 Posts
On September 24 2011 05:32 barbsq wrote: nope, R's ap bonus actually does apply to the dmg, says so here: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Taric#Radiance, read the notes below the abilities I just tested this in-game, Radiance does not get a boost from the +AP it gives you. At level 6 with no AP it deals 150 damage to 0 MR targets. | ||
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Niton
United States2395 Posts
On September 24 2011 05:32 barbsq wrote: he may be 'melee' so to speak, but he's a counter-initiator, which means he's primarily near the AD, and the only people who get near them are melee, so I don't see the issue. He's not ALWAYS a counter-initiator. Until somewhere between 30 and 40 minutes, depending on the game, Taric's capable of picking people off with his stun. Disagree completely, single target 1.5sec stun, armor aura, aoe armor reduction debuff, and AP/AD steroid aura is useful regardless of farm. The stun and a few seconds of aura are all Taric's going to be able to do for you in a losing game. Janna and Alistar do a way better job of retaining presence in a losing game, and they're also better counter-initiators, with fewer hoops to jump through. R was garbage as a self heal during a teamfight, it was simply waaay too much mana to sustain for any reasonable period of time. It was really only used to take dragon or towers, which you should be auto-attacking, which reduces cd on q, making r's self-heal a bit redundant. There was a 900g option that people were slow to latch on to that gave Taric as much mana as he could practically use, that doubled as an item which gave him his weakest defensive stat. Chalice was fucking amazing on old Taric. nope, R's ap bonus actually does apply to the dmg, says so here: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Taric#Radiance, read the notes below the abilities not to mention taric's mid-lategame power has never been because he did dmg (though him having dmg certainly adds to it) See crate's post. Taric is not a long game champion, his chance to win your team the game decreases for every second the game goes on once you get out of laning phase because he didn't (and still doesn't) have a game-changing presence in a large engage. I think you overestimate his CD's a little, that may be true for small skirmishes, but large-scale 5v5's tend to be longer than what I think you estimate. In any case, you're typically only interested in stopping 1 person anyways, keeping their melee bruiser away from your carries, so again I don't really see the problem I'm talking specifically about what you can get off with Radiance on. A 5v5 is usually between 15-20 seconds, but for half of that you no longer have his ult's buff. As far as defending carries goes, later in the game Dazzle starts to lose effectiveness pretty quickly because of BVeil + other CC immunity options, as well as the enemy bruisers being more tanky. muhhhh.. again radiance's heal/mana cost was kinda shit, sure you can tank more stuff by just pressing r, but then u cant really do anything else. In any case, again if you're in range of the enemy carries and taking dmg from them, then I see that as a problem, since i'm much more interested in protecting than assaulting, but w/e guess u can chalk that up to 'playstyle' or whatever Radiance + Chalice was an incredibly powerful underexplored combination that allowed Taric to run his ult for 10 or so seconds on a full mana bar and still have enough to use his other abilities for another half a minute. I really hope you're not referring to svisage, kus i hated that item on him. Anyways, aegis is still great on taric, not to mention that a single-target stun never really 'falls out of power'. I think that a lot of these problems are again solved by going for a more protective, counter initiating role than being an aggressor I was, but even though it's not very good, it IS the only option that offers all 3. There's not much that offers 2 of the 3 without armor, either - Aegis is great because of the aura, but the only other items that fit the criteria are Soul Shroud (HP/CDR) and Banshee's Veil (HP/MR). Taric's changes significantly upped his power level, i don't see how removing a redundant self-heal source made him shit. Also I would imagine taric would actually be much better in a pseudocarry role in dominion, and on a similar thread, i think it will take a much longer time to figure out champion's power levels in dominion than the 2 hours it's been up. I don't really agree with that - his healing is a LOT weaker than it is before, and he no longer has the same self-healing capabilities. I think if he's any better, it's a small amount and it changed the way he plays a lot. i kinda covered this earlier, but I have had the most success with taric as a counter-initiator, not as an initiator. You could say a lot of these things about sona, but she's played in a very similar way. Cow, on the other hand... well cow actually does fucking everything, but w/e Janna's also a better counter-initiator than Taric. Soraka's really the only one i'd consider 'worse' at counter-initiation, and her skillset is entirely dissimilar to the others' now. I think right now, i'd rank the supports like this: Alistar Sona (Gangplank) Janna Soraka Taric | ||
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CompX
Canada216 Posts
DISCUSS!! | ||
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Blixy213
United States360 Posts
On September 30 2011 05:41 CompX wrote: hey guys, I have been experiencing support taric with rally & ghost. In some way this is pretty good (I don't know, maybe I am in elo hell). Our team kept winning team fights and tt was literally one sided. I am just throwing this out there. DISCUSS!! I can understand where you are going with that, but once you get higher you'll find CV/Flash is the best (read:ONLY) way to go. Cv is obvious for support, and imo Taric should ONLY be played as a support hero. His Cooldowns just don't cut it to be an AP champ, it's just not worth it. You'll need CV to find where the jungle is, use to help your over extending top lane know he has a few more seconds to farm, etc etc. It's just a MUST. Flash is the other SS that is a must, Flashing in and out of battles to either live, or get a nice stun off really makes the difference. Ghost can be nice when chasing, but it doesn't offer the same utility of getting a clutch stun off to ace their team, or pull off a stun in bot lane from the bushes for 1st blood. I really see the thought you put into Rally, I mean, you're support, and you want to make your carries do more damage, etc etc. Back to higher ELO play, they will never engage you (Or fake engage) When you have planted the banner. It's too easy to be countered, and doesn't really fit will in my mind to replace Flash or CV. Back to CV, where your team should have it (Only 1 player with CV, the Cooldown on it is short enough) If you don't have it, you chance of getting caught off guard is highly increased. Just play around with it, learn when to use it. You'll love it. Just my 2 cents about that. TL;DR: Flash imba CV as support ALWAYS. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On September 30 2011 05:41 CompX wrote: hey guys, I have been experiencing support taric with rally & ghost. In some way this is pretty good (I don't know, maybe I am in elo hell). Our team kept winning team fights and tt was literally one sided. I am just throwing this out there. DISCUSS!! Rally is pretty cool considering how Taric can be built like an aurabot with his ulti and Shatter. The only problem with Rally is that CV is simply too strong to be ignored. You need a CV on your team and it's usually up to the support to take it 'cause AD carries (and sometimes bruisers) need exhaust to counter bruisers and assassins that will dive them+better damage output, AP carries (and sometimes bruisers) take ignite for maximum burst, teleport can be taken by top lane (sometimes mid) for more map control, and smite is a necessity on junglers. Flash/Ghost on everyone 'cause everyone needs an escape/positioning spell. Basically, this means supports will pretty much always have to go CV/Flash. Neither one is worth giving up for Rally no matter how good it is. | ||
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Niton
United States2395 Posts
Also, Heal is good now. Clarity might also be good now, but I really doubt it. | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
Damage on supports isn't terribly important outside of the laning phase. Alistar isn't a monster support because of his damage mid/late-game, but because of his initiation and peeling ability. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On November 29 2011 13:44 Niton wrote: Also, Heal is good now. Clarity might also be good now, but I really doubt it. I think anyone taking Heal over CV on a support is out of their minds, and Flash is too good on Taric. Heal is good to fit onto solo laners over Ignite/Exhaust/TP, but CV is still far too game-changing. | ||
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