EPT[Champion] Nidalee - Page 18
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
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Thereisnosaurus
Australia1822 Posts
Flask is still a very strong item if you buy it first. It's not super necessary but it gets you through levels 1-4 smoothly, at which point with two ranks in your E you pretty much become unshiftable so long as you're not retarded. | ||
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On January 29 2013 05:44 sylverfyre wrote: Hm. I hadn't yet tried manamune, but I could see it working. You'd retain some of AP nidalee's spear-poking power, too - interesting. Do you start faerie charm? Manamune/muramana are not cost efficient on nid. The amount of extra mana that it consumes only results in about 150 extra damage. That could be another spear thrown instead for potentially way more damage. Better off just building AA. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On February 13 2013 12:24 ReachTheSky wrote: Manamune/muramana are not cost efficient on nid. The amount of extra mana that it consumes only results in about 150 extra damage. That could be another spear thrown instead for potentially way more damage. Better off just building AA. I'd like to see how you came to this conclusion. Also Muramana works off your autoattacks. | ||
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krndandaman
Mozambique16569 Posts
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On February 13 2013 12:29 obesechicken13 wrote: I'd like to see how you came to this conclusion. Also Muramana works off your autoattacks. Bischu talks about it in his ap nidalee guide on lolking.net. He is pretty much the best ap nid player on na http://www.lolking.net/guides/15766 Check it out, definitely alot of useful information | ||
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Logrus
United States228 Posts
Spears DO receive bonus damage from Muramana, however you need to take into account why AP Nidalee works in the first place. Nidalee's spears scales from AP and the damage ramps up to 250%. Having around 3000 MP late game with Nidalee and landing a spear with Muramana active proc'd will give you around 150 ish additional damage at MAX mana depending on the MR and also it consumed 3% of your aman which is the main reason why Muramana is such a bad item on Nidalee. 3% on 3k mana pool is 90 which is exactly the same mana required to throw another spear. So you're spending the potential MP to do additional 150 damage when you could be chucking another spear. Anyways yeah don't get Manamune/Muramana." this makes sense if you're concerned about sustained dps and maximizing the dps for every point of mana... but seems to be obviously ignoring that the point is u are not going to get anywhere near burning through 3k mana throwing spears in a teamfight... u toggle the muramana on when u need more burst, who cares if it even takes 50% of ur mana if the extra burst dmg enables ur team to make a play or secure a kill that would have otherwise not been possible and INCREASES the efficiency of ur mana if u wouldnt have spent that mana during the fight anyway by actually making it do something for you. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On February 17 2013 03:36 ReachTheSky wrote: Bischu talks about it in his ap nidalee guide on lolking.net. He is pretty much the best ap nid player on na http://www.lolking.net/guides/15766 Check it out, definitely alot of useful information Oh he's worried about running out of mana. I'd still get it. Nid is a fast stacker of mana and gains the most from things like rageblade and tear. 150 damage on spears isn't exactly right. "Having around 3000 MP late game with Nidalee and landing a spear with Muramana active proc'd will give you around 150 ish additional damage at MAX mana depending on the MR and also it consumed 3% of your aman which is the main reason why Muramana is such a bad item on Nidalee." Well if you hit someone with a spear, regardless of range and MR, you'll do 180 magic damage if you had 3000 mana. That 180 can be reduced to 150, but it's still 180 magic damage and saying it's 150 is just not descriptive since you don't know their MR. It's also up to 240 magic damage on every auto attack. Bischu may not like muramana on Nid but I think it's ok. | ||
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Thereisnosaurus
Australia1822 Posts
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Mondeezy
United States1938 Posts
First, I never know whether to build Bruiser or AP. I feel like I play AP better endgame but bruiser better early. I'm also not sure about how to play either efficiently. For example, should I be harassing early with AP nid or solely focus on farming safely? Should I be team fighting with bruiser nid or solely focus on split pushing in solo queue? As far as builds, why do I see some Nids running 9/0/21 for AP? Any advice in regards to playstyle at different parts of the game would be appreciated  | ||
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PH
United States6173 Posts
As AP, you should focus entirely on farming early on. You can't even hope to be aggressive at all until you hit six anyway, and even then, you don't hit very hard until you actually get some AP from items (without support from a ganker, I think you'll lose trades against more heroes than not). | ||
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On February 21 2013 04:41 Mondeezy wrote: Alright guys, I'm starting to practice my Kitty top and I need some help. First, I never know whether to build Bruiser or AP. I feel like I play AP better endgame but bruiser better early. I'm also not sure about how to play either efficiently. For example, should I be harassing early with AP nid or solely focus on farming safely? Should I be team fighting with bruiser nid or solely focus on split pushing in solo queue? As far as builds, why do I see some Nids running 9/0/21 for AP? Any advice in regards to playstyle at different parts of the game would be appreciated Bruiser nid you should be harassing as much as possible with your trap/auto combo since you are running ad runes. As far as being aggressive with AP nid I'd recommend making sure you get all the creeps and throw occasional spears from the bushes. If you somehow manage to get them to 50% by the time you are level 6 you can go for an all in. 9-0-21 for AP nid is great for toplane because of the health regen masteries and movespeed masteries. Having the extra temp ward and biscuit are huge for top lane as well. You should always try to split push with nidalee since it is extremely hard to catch you because you are a cat with 9 lives, huehue. Group when your team needs you or when you plan to take bigger objectives aka baron/inhibs. | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
Bruiser nid has a more stable early game (imo?) so if you're against a really tough lane opponent, it may be the better option. Both builds can farm pretty safely, though. Edit: Hmm, rageblade has been mentioned. What are we going for here? I do like that nidalee can easily have the thing fully stacked at all times, but towards what goal? | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On February 17 2013 03:36 ReachTheSky wrote: Bischu talks about it in his ap nidalee guide on lolking.net. He is pretty much the best ap nid player on na http://www.lolking.net/guides/15766 Check it out, definitely alot of useful information Manamune isn't being suggested for AP nid (agree with you here, the multiplying on the spear throwing prefers real AP) but rather for a bruiser nid who still wants to be able to throw spears and not suck. Note how he talks about "Why AP nid works in the first place" when he debunks muramana. It has little to do with Bruiser Nidalee, who can benefit from muramana and use it to "fake" being an AP nid with scary poke power in an item that also lends power to her own build, which works because you harass with ranged autoattacks incessantly, splitpush, and burst low health targets down in cat form while keeping sustained with your base healing values (which have high mana costs) | ||
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Lmui
Canada6213 Posts
On February 21 2013 23:05 sylverfyre wrote: It depends not only on your lane opponent but also on your team. Some teams are going to benefit much more from an unstoppable splitpusher (bruiser nid) and some are going to benefit from a poke champ (AP nid) who CAN splitpush, but isn't exactly unstoppable. Bruiser nid has a more stable early game (imo?) so if you're against a really tough lane opponent, it may be the better option. Both builds can farm pretty safely, though. Edit: Hmm, rageblade has been mentioned. What are we going for here? I do like that nidalee can easily have the thing fully stacked at all times, but towards what goal? You utilize every stat on rageblade efficiently AND have an easy way of stacking it up to full. On bruiser nidalee, you fully utilize EVERY stat that it gives. AD/AS/AP are all useful and once the passive procs, you get almost as much sustain than a gunblade that you can keep going indefinitely just by pouncing along with even more AS that's useful while in human form. | ||
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Mondeezy
United States1938 Posts
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nanaoei
3358 Posts
On January 29 2013 05:37 Thereisnosaurus wrote: best top build for me these days seems to be manamune/iceborn/spirit visage. Absolutely terrifying sustain and dueling power, incredible turret pushing and pretty solid team fight cleanup. I have yet to lose a lane with nid in season 3 using that build, she's a fantastic champ for solo play. Also I really want to see how a duo elise/nid bot lane would work out, good for making setups, lane control and punishing the opposing ADC stupidly hard when you get to 6. funny you mentioned that combo, it's actually a cheese duo lane i use with a friend if we want to go 'fuck it, lets win lane and carry game'. we've even tried nashor's/ad/bruiser elise with nidalee as the support. i have no regular core for nidalee bot when she's the AD. generally though, manamune>muramana is not a good choice on nidalee from the games i've played around with it. the extra damage is unnecessary when her base values (and multipliers) are quite high already. Certainly, having the extra mana is more valuable for those oh-so-common prolonged nidalee fights, unless of course you're gosu enough to toggle it on and off constantly for mana control. i value being able to push the lane around with nidalee (in any lane) in order to get a exp/farm advantage. For actual items though, you can literally build anything offensive on nidalee as long as it adds to your performance in lane. I generally like brutalizer, cutlas, or rageblade start--those items listed would be dependant on the level of lane domination you're already asserting, starting at brutalizer for a poorer start, and ending at rageblade for simply killing the opposing players whenever they come to lane. pretty much the gimmick i've noticed is that the other duo bot don't clue into the strong level 6 that nid-elise have. it is generally an insta-kill once nidalee hits 6 and elise lands the stun. after the cheese kill, it's pretty much easy sailing lane control and zoning until tower-down. needless to say, the bush control is pretty brutal, and you've pretty much bullied whoever is laning against you into backing to fountain once you've nailed them to half. so far its been 11-0 so far in drafted/ranked games and i feel as bad about cheesing it as i would if i could still 4pool with a 150mineral spawning pool back in starcraft 1. i do have some replays if anyone's really interested. i'm gonna be honest, i have mained nidalee since season 1, and i'm looking forward to AD Lux (try it out some time!) more than i am nidalee bot. it really sucks if you're able to dominate lane and your team has a difficult time playing around a split-push style because of inexperience or hesitance, though it is still a learning experience. i have never had a "good" game as nidalee playing from absolute barren farm and from being pushed out of the lane i'm responsible for. a bad nidalee start is pretty disastrous, although redeemable if you're given plenty of time. i have not seen voyboy 2v1 as nidalee, but i would put that down as one of the potential reasons why he would start 9/0/21. the mana/5, cdr, faster exp gain to 6 are all strong for nidalee's sustain, mana-free waveclear, and level 5>6 allins also. the thing i'm most peeved about when playing nidalee is the change to her autoattack ever since the graphical revamp. there was an obvious change to the windup to her autoattack and it is much less responsive than it used to be (it *was* godly).... along with very tiny changes to her cougar form mechanics that i doubt anybody but a nidalee-holic would understand ;__; | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
On March 10 2013 16:02 Mondeezy wrote: Can someone explain to me why Voy runs 9/0/21 AP Nid, instead of 21/0/9? Feels like you lose a pretty big chunk of damage for some extra gold and and cdr, not sure if worth. 6% CDR, explorer ward and biscuit ain't ever bad, 3% MS for more mobility/positioning, and the Awareness mastery is really good whenever you need to hit a timing level earlier than your opponent. Voyboy plays AP Nid top, right? Since she's squishier it's even more important for her to hit 6 faster and get Pounce I think. | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
On February 21 2013 23:05 sylverfyre wrote: It depends not only on your lane opponent but also on your team. Some teams are going to benefit much more from an unstoppable splitpusher (bruiser nid) and some are going to benefit from a poke champ (AP nid) who CAN splitpush, but isn't exactly unstoppable. Bruiser nid has a more stable early game (imo?) so if you're against a really tough lane opponent, it may be the better option. Both builds can farm pretty safely, though. Edit: Hmm, rageblade has been mentioned. What are we going for here? I do like that nidalee can easily have the thing fully stacked at all times, but towards what goal? Isn't rageblade worth like 5000 gold in stats when fully stacked and you go under 50% healthy? Seems pretty insane. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
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