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On November 02 2015 08:58 HerrHorst wrote:
While I think that your post is well written and polite, do we really need another thread like this?
We had similiar discussions a million times before and in the end SC2 will never be as you want it to be.
with the state of lotv, and all theoretical hope that future expansions will fix the game lost, i sincerely hope that the community moves on to mods
i think the majority of the community knows that a community-made mod could be ten times better than this mess
thus, posts like this are interesting since they provide input for modders
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On November 02 2015 19:41 summerloud wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 08:58 HerrHorst wrote:
While I think that your post is well written and polite, do we really need another thread like this?
We had similiar discussions a million times before and in the end SC2 will never be as you want it to be.
with the state of lotv, and all theoretical hope that future expansions will fix the game lost, i sincerely hope that the community moves on to mods i think the majority of the community knows that a community-made mod could be ten times better than this mess
thus, posts like this are interesting since they provide input for modders
Oh please can we just start to do something about posts like these already.
You're contributing exactly zero to the discussion and are at best devaluing a very well written OP.
The same discussion over and over again.
And now that someone made a very elaborate and interesting post it's still just about "LotV ded guys, go home".
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On November 02 2015 09:45 ProMeTheus112 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 09:15 -NegativeZero- wrote:
TIL there are actually still people complaining about multiple building select yeah that's kinda controversial for BW veterans I guess.. personally I don't really agree with his conclusion about it I even think it would be great to test having MBS and automine in BW, and tbh even "UUS" unlimited unit selection, because this kind of things I think it really scares the slower players a lot, it even maybe makes speed a factor that counterbalances strategy a bit more than it needs to be for them I think, and in the end the better players in a game like BW I don't expect they would put all army in 1 group or anything like that you really want little squads and hotkeys to certain units and an easy way to split and position and flank with groups... but it's just not a bad thing to be able to select all units when you want to I think. I think saving up time from control without affecting the decision making is good because it allows for a little more breathing time for actually taking time to watch some things for a little longer than needed and think of what you want to do.. I would be really curious to have that tested in BW. We still do need the interface @bottom of screen imo to visualize units life/counts and select them sometimes. (especially for shift-clicking for deselecting units, or more rarely control-click)
As someone who always thought bw looked cool but not having MBS and UUS kindof put me off to bother learning it, it would be a nice thing to try out. Perhaps the game would be unbalanced then though.
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On November 02 2015 12:09 ZAiNs wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 11:39 Lexender wrote:
I really hope they adress mech play properly.
I was really excited when they announced LotV, but after a while I realized they just don't seem to want to make mech playable, just more strange changes, more bio, tanks still suck, cyclones (wich had so much potential) dont make sense now.
I really REALLY hope they do, I've hated TvP since WoL design wise and tought I could finally play a nice interesting mech style but nope.
I have to say the prospect of having to mass bio against protoss everygame is enough to make not want to play the game, I really hope they get it right this time. You don't have to play bio every game. Read this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/legacy-of-the-void/495925-tlo-on-macro-mechanics.
I have read it, and while I don't agree with what TLO says (most of it at least) its not so much about wanting to win everything (I'm not even super hardcore when it comes to SC2) I'm just talking about how fun it is, I have a lot of fun when I do it in TvZ and TvT (god I love TvT) but TvP is just so bad, I wouldn't even care about how balanced it is (hell I meched all through HotS) but its just so god damn awful to play I just want to deinstall every time I play a TvP.
But I guess that just means the game is not for me anymore 33% of all my games is quite a lot after all, I'm sure a lot of people (actually most people) enjoy bio every-single-game so theres that, anyway, so I'm minority so it doesn't really matters.
I'm sure nobody will miss me anyway.
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The way this is visually presented (every topic in spoilers, bad "paragraphing", bad formating...) makes it kinda bland and amateur looking.
Otherwise it would be a 10/10 post.
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I couldn't get past the first part of this, everything to me said this was a whine about game balance thread. Nothing here is new, just complaints about what an alternative version of the game could have been. I'm getting sick of people complaining about FF, PO, and WG. We already call protoss attacks all-ins because if they lose it they die, and harasses we call cheeses because they feel gimmicky and we always fail to scout them..
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On November 02 2015 19:41 summerloud wrote:i think the majority of the community knows that a community-made mod could be ten times better than this mess
I wonder, can you change and fix the pathing if you make a mod ? Can you remove autosurround and units making way for each other and generally add better collision ?
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On November 02 2015 22:35 ProMeTheus112 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 19:41 summerloud wrote:i think the majority of the community knows that a community-made mod could be ten times better than this mess I wonder, can you change and fix the pathing if you make a mod ? Can you remove autosurround and units making way for each other and generally add better collision ?
Here
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On November 02 2015 22:38 Lexender wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 22:35 ProMeTheus112 wrote:On November 02 2015 19:41 summerloud wrote:i think the majority of the community knows that a community-made mod could be ten times better than this mess I wonder, can you change and fix the pathing if you make a mod ? Can you remove autosurround and units making way for each other and generally add better collision ? Here
Right yes pathing/collision look fine in Starbow!
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I've overlooked fast, gonna read more in-depth latter.
There's multiple points, but I agree with most.
Sadly the post is ridden with factual errors that undermines the serious tone, like saying Valkyrie was seen often or that SC2 workers mine 4 per trip, saying BW doesn't have healer units (poor medic overshadowed by medevac, SCV, morphing and battery shield  ), not mentioning Ravens in the free units section...
Will finish reading soon though, well constructed overall.
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I still don't understand the necessity of introducing a unit such Liberator one month before the release of LotV. In general i think that new units aren't tested properly before launching the expansion...
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Russian Federation421 Posts
On November 02 2015 19:41 summerloud wrote:
i think the majority of the community knows that a community-made mod could be ten times better than this mess
You are delusional. At it's best Starbow (which was so BW-esque and obviously better than SC2 in view of TL people) had a population less than that of failed RTS like Grey Goo. No significant part of community wants to play mods.
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On November 02 2015 12:14 NewSunshine wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 10:14 GiveMeCake wrote:
I don't understand why you went through so much time/effort when LotV is done and there won't be any drastic changes... Is this like a fantasy you have or something? This post is important because it's the perfect answer to those ignorant people who say "Don't like it? Don't play it." When we criticize Blizzard's design decisions, it's not because we're just there to talk shit about the game and about Blizzard. I have better things to do with my time. We say these things because we know what potential the game has, and seeing that potential get wasted in light of poor design decisions is heart-wrenching. We're not complaining because we hate the game, we're complaining because we love it, and we're watching it get worse over time, not better. That hurts. Imagine one of your loved ones, your father, your son, your brother, somebody you care about is in the hands of a professional doctor, surgery falls easily to hand for this analogy. It could even be a female loved one. You expect a surgeon to know what he's doing, and for that person to get better, given the proper treatment and time to recover. You don't expect their condition to get worse, and if it does happen, you're sure going to raise hell with the doctors - they should know better. They are a group of professionals responsible for the care of your loved one. Only in the case of Blizzard and SC2 you don't have unexpected complications like you might get in surgery. Only Blizzard's decision-making. My analogy is generous but still apt.
No. Chrono boost is not going to literally kill your son. Holy hyperbole, Batman.
It's perfectly fine to criticize design, although this is the millionth time we've seen the same arguments that clearly aren't accepted or agreed by the design team in charge of SC2. It's a nice compilation of complaints, but I can't imagine it's going to get anywhere if it didn't get anywhere during WoL or HotS or LotV beta.
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Starcraft will always be hard work, for us the players cause we want to become better, and for thoose who design it want to make it better playable. So i think with time Lotv will become the game we want.
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On November 02 2015 19:54 KeksX wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 19:41 summerloud wrote:On November 02 2015 08:58 HerrHorst wrote:
While I think that your post is well written and polite, do we really need another thread like this?
We had similiar discussions a million times before and in the end SC2 will never be as you want it to be.
with the state of lotv, and all theoretical hope that future expansions will fix the game lost, i sincerely hope that the community moves on to mods i think the majority of the community knows that a community-made mod could be ten times better than this mess
thus, posts like this are interesting since they provide input for modders Oh please can we just start to do something about posts like these already. You're contributing exactly zero to the discussion and are at best devaluing a very well written OP. The same discussion over and over again. And now that someone made a very elaborate and interesting post it's still just about "LotV ded guys, go home".
I agree with your disdain regarding such bold claims. summerloud, you should play StarBow. It's an interesting community-made mod combining aspects of BW and SC2. It'll probably resonate with you. And that's awesome. (And if you don't like it, go make your own.) And for the other 99.99% of us who prefer to play SC2 over StarBow, you don't speak for us. You can't make everyone happy all the time. And there will always be issues anyone can nitpick over. But you (and the OP) are part of the vocal minority in terms of this level of hate.
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On November 02 2015 23:36 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:I agree with your disdain regarding such bold claims. summerloud, you should play StarBow. It's an interesting community-made mod combining aspects of BW and SC2. It'll probably resonate with you. And that's awesome. (And if you don't like it, go make your own.) And for the other 99.99% of us who prefer to play SC2 over StarBow, you don't speak for us. You can't make everyone happy all the time. And there will always be issues anyone can nitpick over. But you (and the OP) are part of the vocal minority in terms of this level of hate.
99.99% (lol) prefer SC2 over StarBow, nice made up stat, but I think a huge factor is that the "official" version of the game and most importantly where the community is already focused, and where the money is blown into cash prized tourneys and events by companies and sponsor, play a huge role in what people play and are interested in (they started up SC2 exactly from this, the Starcraft community + money blown into cashprizes tourneys and esports scenes, the game could have been almost anything). Because of how artificial it is, I doubt it will last long though. Telling someone who says a mod would be better than the game he considers not very good to go make his own mod is a bit like bullying lol.
Also "vocal minority" who don't like the game, I read that sometimes, you just state this like it's a fact or something. But in fact, a lot of people unhappy with the game they don't necessarily talk about it very much on forums before they stop playing. They only do when they are passionate about the game or already involved in the forum community or want to try to bring some change, send a message or something. How do you know how many there are ? When I stopped playing SC2 cause I didn't like it 2 months after WoL release, I didn't write nothing on forums, I just talked to my friends on bnet and was gone. Is "the vocal minority who don't like the game" an illusion to entertain the hype around SC2? So many people have stopped playing it. I could say "those who still praise the game are a vocal minority" and that would surely be much closer to what we see around here, and still, who knows ?
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On November 02 2015 23:48 ProMeTheus112 wrote:
Telling someone who says a mod would be better than the game he considers not very good to go make his own mod is a bit like bullying lol.
No it's not. It's telling him to put his money where his mouth is. It's telling him to provide evidence. It's telling him to take initiative on an issue that he's clearly passionate about (but also making unsubstantiated claims about). It's holding him accountable for his rhetoric.
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Basically, what you are doing is, after he states an opinion, tell him you don't want to hear it and instead he should go make an incredible amount of work and go away instead.
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On November 03 2015 00:17 ProMeTheus112 wrote:
Basically, what you are doing is, after he states an opinion, tell him you don't want to hear it and instead he should go make an incredible amount of work and go away instead.
I'm not telling him he should go away. I'm telling him to back up his opinion that we would prefer a community-made mod to SC2, since there's no such evidence yet. If he doesn't like that feedback, then maybe he shouldn't make baseless claims.
Anyways, this thread will probably die or get closed or moved to blogs like so many others, so I'm going to stop spamming comments here. Have a nice day 
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On November 02 2015 23:20 Gremio747 wrote: the necessity of introducing a unit such Liberator one month before the release of LotV. In general i think that new units aren't tested properly before launching the expansion...
Not sure where you got your information from. The Liberator has been a part of the beta far longer than a month. They did patch it within the last month.
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EPT
