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Aron Times
United States312 Posts
On August 29 2015 03:25 ohmylanta1003 wrote: Lol. Team Liquid for the win. Are the members of this forum ever happy with any of these changes? I am very happy with these changes. I'm very happy with Legacy of the Void in general. It feels like an entirely new game, and I love how early aggression is much more viable compared to the long, boring macro games that were the hallmark of WoL and HotS. | ||
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Tenks
United States3104 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:06 Linear wrote: The key to a fun macro/micro experience is that all three of those options are balanced. I don't want to put an opinion in your mouth but I completely agree with this statement. The problem is SC2 HotS is not a balanced experience. You macro or you die. Simple as that. I could be playing against someone with the best control in the world but if they can't hit their macro mechanics they will die. Plain and simple. I could be the absolute most shit tier controller on the planet. If the best macroer in the world played against the best controller in the world the macro player will always win. That is what Blizzard is trying to address. | ||
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TurboMaN
Germany925 Posts
On August 29 2015 03:17 Little-Chimp wrote: Autocast on everything now? This autocast shit is just blizzard not wanting to rebalance around the new macro and band aiding the shit out of old macro mechanics. This! Blizzard what are you doing to our beloved game? So many weird changes, you say you will remove them. Ok I didn't like it but I accepted it after a while. Now you bring them in again with strange changes and make them on autocast? There is no red line in the balance. Time is running out, not much is left until release. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16103 Posts
I always hope blizzard gets their shit together and makes LotV an awesome game but with every community update I'm getting more and more dissapointed | ||
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Cloak
United States816 Posts
I do not know what plans they have in store for the Liberator, but like the Adept, they are in a tenuous state of overpowered vs useless. They both act as linchpins to generalizing composition and enabling open ended build order diversity in it of themselves. The gas increase of the Adept failed because gas is Protoss' BO variety. Had Protoss more mineral heavy dumps, it would've worked, but that is not the environment we have. Species do not survive if they don't thrive in their environment. AtG has been discussed very thoroughly by various threads so I see it as the main point of contention because it reflects the nature of air which Depth of Micro heavily focused on. Liberators range and harass potential as a result of the AtG has led to a lot of frustration, so we must decide where to focus the Liberator's strength and how it will compare to Banshee. Perhaps Banshee's stealth nature could be reevaluated too. I also like this post because DK acknowledges how extra actives can sometimes not be productive to the game, e.g. the Tempest. Micro can be achieved through movement quirks (size/shape, accel/decel) and damage quirks (damage point, nature of DPS, range, armor type). I think the same can be said for the Immortal and Void Ray. Passives can make for very interesting dynamics, so I look forward to how the community draws upon precedented unit design in other games. And I look forward to what sort of damage natures can be added with Adept upgrade to further refine the role of the Adept. It would be best to focus on what gaps are left for Protoss as the game progresses. Speaking of which, the Zealot thing is more a concern of balance, even though I had wished the high mobility Bisu Zealot of old had panned out. Mostly because the only special micro interaction in SC2 the Zealot could achieve was stutter step against speedless Zerglings. Was it because of Concussive and Creep and Adept dominance? It's mostly just speculation on my end because Marauders have definitely dropped in prevalence from their nerf. A more mobile PO has potential but it's difficult for me to make any projections without seeing the games. There's been good arguments against its viability since it hinges on a very vulnerable building, how can you balance engagements around a Pylon? Unless some sort of shield mechanic comes into play. The shield battery is not dead yet! | ||
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Magnifico
1958 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:12 Charoisaur wrote: It's hard to give constructive feedback when the balance updates look like some trolls who never played sc2 rolled a dice and put some random changes in the game they thought would be "cool". I always hope blizzard gets their shit together and makes LotV an awesome game but with every community update I'm getting more and more dissapointed I'm so sad that you are not the lead designer. We sure would have a better game. | ||
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Linear
60 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:12 Charoisaur wrote: It's hard to give constructive feedback when the balance updates look like some trolls who never played sc2 rolled a dice and put some random changes in the game they thought would be "cool". I always hope blizzard gets their shit together and makes LotV an awesome game but with every community update I'm getting more and more dissapointed It's in part due to the fact that some of the most vocal people are gold leaguers or intermittent players. Another problem blizzard forget is that you only stay new for so long this is the final expansion the goal should be longevity of player enjoyment rather than a perceived short term gain because the game is now easier for newer players. I wish there was a weighted voting system which is based off the percentage of people in a league so a GM or Masters vote is valued more than a gold league player. | ||
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SetGuitarsToKill
Canada28396 Posts
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Tenks
United States3104 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:20 Linear wrote: It's in part due to the fact that some of the most vocal people are gold leaguers or intermittent players. Another problem blizzard forget is that you only stay new for so long this is the final expansion the goal should be longevity of player enjoyment rather than a perceived short term gain because the game is now easier for newer players. I wish there was a weighted voting system which is based off the percentage of people in a league so a GM or Masters vote is valued more than a gold league player. The arrogance of this community it honestly astounding at times | ||
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crown77
United States157 Posts
Currently if the Protoss player gets aggressive on one base -> Mech Terran expands defensively but requires marines and starport to defend everything if Mech terran made two factories he will be unable to hold certain proxies (proxy void ray stalker is unrealistic to hold without marines and bunkers.... it would be interesting if cyclones could kill voidrays as their main roll is AA or atleast be able to go kill the proxy starport) Currently if the Protoss player fast expands to two base -> 2 factory Mech Terran dies to starport tech so he expands defensively In conclusion, the overall changes are good but please consider giving cyclone its basic attack back ground to air and removing auto cast from the game. | ||
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Linear
60 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:22 Tenks wrote: The arrogance of this community it honestly astounding at times You gold league? It's not arrogant to view someone who has more knowledge in the game as a better voice/opinion. You think that a guy with 200 games knows more about how to send this game in a good direction that a player with 5k games? | ||
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Little-Chimp
Canada951 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:21 SetGuitarsToKill wrote: Even if you don't agree with all the autocast, I think we can all agree that this is a much better way to have MULES. Late game MULE bombs were the dumbest shit. Sure, it takes no "skill" but there wasn't really any skill in dropping MULES in the first place. Yes it is a much better way to have mules. Zealot charge is going to be fixed too, great. Now can we get this autocast trash out of sc2 please. It boggles my mind how people are talking about the infestor and cyclones when the core of the game keeps getting mangled week to week. None of the little details matter right now. | ||
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aRyuujin
United States5049 Posts
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starimk
106 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:25 Linear wrote: You gold league? It's not arrogant to view someone who has more knowledge in the game as a better voice/opinion. You think that a guy with 200 games knows more about how to send this game in a good direction that a player with 5k games? Um, that kinda is the definition of arrogant  Good ideas can come from anywhere. | ||
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Shuffleblade
Sweden1903 Posts
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coolman123123
146 Posts
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Aron Times
United States312 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:20 Linear wrote: It's in part due to the fact that some of the most vocal people are gold leaguers or intermittent players. Another problem blizzard forget is that you only stay new for so long this is the final expansion the goal should be longevity of player enjoyment rather than a perceived short term gain because the game is now easier for newer players. I wish there was a weighted voting system which is based off the percentage of people in a league so a GM or Masters vote is valued more than a gold league player. The vast majority of players ARE gold leaguers and intermittent players. You cannot build a game for the elite 1% alone. You cannot have a successful game that only casters to Masters and Grandmasters while leaving everyone below the best of the best frustrated and unsatisfied. I think you're forgetting that TL.net is made up of better-than-average players as well as actual progamers, outliers who are alright with the status quo. TL.net posters are the minority. A well-informed, highly-skilled minority, but a minority nevertheless. Making the game easier will not suddenly make gold scrubs like Eternal Dalek win games against players like you. You will still kick my ass 99% of the time, but the game will be much less frustrating for lesser-skilled players like me. Basically, you'll have much more people to play with if the game is much more accessible. Also, what they're really lowering is the skill floor, not the skill ceiling. The skill ceiling remains impossibly high. The skill floor is now much lower. This means that more people can play and enjoy the game, but the best of the best remains in their unassailable fortress of skill. I know a lot of people here confuse the skill floor with the skill ceiling; most of the time, when people say that Blizzard/Valve/Riot/whatever is dumbing down Starcraft/DotA/LoL and lowering the skill ceiling, what they really mean is that the skill floor is being lowered and the game is more accessible. | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
I really hope they consider keeping inject at 2larva/queen though. The game is much more interesting without the early ling-floods in ZvZ. | ||
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Shuffleblade
Sweden1903 Posts
On August 29 2015 04:25 Linear wrote: You gold league? It's not arrogant to view someone who has more knowledge in the game as a better voice/opinion. You think that a guy with 200 games knows more about how to send this game in a good direction that a player with 5k games? Obviously David Kim should know best then, he has worked on SC2 since the launch and developed the game. He obviously knows every single thing about how to send the game in a good direction so all the rest of us should just shut up and see his magic at work. (as the past has told us your reasoning isn't worth shit) | ||
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NeThZOR
South Africa7387 Posts
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