EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/HdybkOF.jpg)
I didn't zoom, when I go back to my vision it isn't zoomed out. But it seems like this guy has some zoom hack and LotV reproduces that somehow in the replay.
I did some digging in the new anticheat - Page 2
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
I didn't zoom, when I go back to my vision it isn't zoomed out. But it seems like this guy has some zoom hack and LotV reproduces that somehow in the replay. | ||
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Sogetsu
514 Posts
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R1CH
Netherlands10340 Posts
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RoomOfMush
1296 Posts
On July 29 2015 03:54 Dickbutt wrote: Micro and macro hacks are very obvious, especially split hacks. Although these are not obvious to the eye, they are obvious to the system in place to stop them when properly applied. CSGO trigger bots are the best example of this, since it emulates mouse clicks when you hover over an enemy. Changing things like this are a pain for hackers at first, but after a while they figure it out with programs that will pull this information or even find an alternative to reach their target. The micro and macro hacks that exist right now might be obvious, but you can not say that it is impossible to make better ones. Perhaps there are better ones but we just dont know yet because they are too good to be spotted. You have to keep in mind that hackers will always put plenty of work and effort into developing new hacks, simply because they have the manpower to do so. Getting information out of the program is not that trivial. It might be easy when you know what you are looking for, but a constantly changing API will make this very difficult because you have no point where you can start. For example lets look at a simple hack that tells you the mineral count of your opponent. You can play a game against yourself or against a friend, at several points during the game you pause, read the mineral value from the UI and then search your RAM for any position that holds the same value. For each time you do this you can narrow down the RAM adress that might be used to store the mineral count. After 3 - 5 tries you will probably have found the correct one and know where the mineral count of your opponent is stored in RAM and then you can write a hack that will read the value at this adress and print it on the screen for you to see. But what if there is obfuscation? Blizzard could implement it so that the mineral count saved in RAM is always the actual mineral count times 10, the UI would divide the value to display the correct mineral count and all calculations would also be updated to take this into account. Or perhaps the mineral count is stored in 2 different adresses and summed up. Or perhaps some other way to make it more complicated. As long as you know which kind of obfuscation is used it is easy to update the hack to still work, but when the obfuscation is changed every week to something completely different and you have no idea what it might be you will quickly realize that even this trivial hack has become something painful to create. | ||
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Lazo89
United States7 Posts
On July 29 2015 04:11 Big J wrote: So I was playing a game of LotV and since my opponent was obviously maphacking I went through the replay. This is what the game showed me when I went to his vision: I didn't zoom, when I go back to my vision it isn't zoomed out. But it seems like this guy has some zoom hack and LotV reproduces that somehow in the replay. Played the same guy, yeah it's obvious. Here's my replay http://bit.ly/1fEFkta | ||
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mishimaBeef
Canada2259 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On July 29 2015 05:37 Lazo89 wrote: Played the same guy, yeah it's obvious. Here's my replay http://bit.ly/1fEFkta Did you watch the replay and when switching to his view it was also zoomed out? | ||
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loft
United States344 Posts
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varsovie
Canada326 Posts
But other synchronous engine games that are popular have dealt with it way better than Blizzard did, and soem of 'em are even F2P (eg DOTA2). Be it by more stringent moderation, heck even outsourcing the witch-hunt to the community if needed, or directly attacking the hack-makers (hard to do in some jurisdictions) or trying to add more software protections (hard for already stated facts, but since the most popular hack has its sources on github there might be a way to throw few wrenches), Blizzard need to step-up it's anti-hack policies. A politic of weak reprisal against hackers only isn't working right now and surely isn't going to work. We are at the point where hackers are getting caught after winning or advancing in some pretty big online tournaments nowadays and Kr servers you're sure to be playing a hacker that doesn't even hide it well (like selecting YOUR building in FOW without prior scouting) a third of the games... But hey with archon mode now you can play with two totally different hacks at once.  | ||
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wUndertUnge
United States1125 Posts
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Dingobloo
Australia1903 Posts
On July 29 2015 07:28 varsovie wrote: I understand tat with an synchronous engine it's hard to make it (information)hack-proof since all information is available to all clients/server. And more so the more popular your game is, the higher the "demand" for hacks are and the challenge or reward to make some is, so there's more hacks/hackers. But other synchronous engine games that are popular have dealt with it way better than Blizzard did, and soem of 'em are even F2P (eg DOTA2). DOTA2 isn't synchronous as far as I'm aware, that's why you don't have to simulate up to a certain point to spectate or resume, because it's sending more complete data and not relying on deterministic deltas, that's why you have to download the replays from the server at the end of a game, because your client couldn't create the whole thing, that's why it's replays are massive in comparison (though there's a bit more info in there as well) and that's why one player lagging doesn't affect the other players. And occam's razor: when you're basing a game on the source engine it's easier to make the network architecture the same as all your other games, multiplayer shooters aren't synchronous or they would be a nightmare with the number of players. | ||
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bigbadgreen
United States142 Posts
Make hacking difficult for everybody who downloads hacks cheap, you'll never stop people who can do this themselves or are willing to pay a lot to get a hack. but you can stem the people who pay a few bucks and have an easy time at it. You just have to make it more annoying than most people are willing to put the time into it. | ||
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Dumbledore
Sweden725 Posts
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Dickbutt
Korea (North)129 Posts
On July 29 2015 11:12 Dumbledore wrote: I'm not sure about what you exactly did, I mean you wouldn't find the anti cheat code in the MPQ files. What? I tore apart the entire game, and anticheat data is scattered throughout the game and usually contained in files inside MPQ files when you properly decompress them. There is no single folder that says "I AM THE ANTICHEAT FOLDER" though, it's quite all over the place. | ||
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Dumbledore
Sweden725 Posts
On July 29 2015 11:18 Dickbutt wrote: I tore apart the entire game, and anticheat data is scattered throughout the game and usually contained in files inside MPQ files when you properly decompress them. There is no single folder that says "I AM THE ANTICHEAT FOLDER" though, it's quite all over the place. I'm doubtful that you would find things like D3D hooks, suspend thread checks and etc inside MPQ files. Can you show me an example of what exactly you found that belongs to the anti cheat? | ||
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TelecoM
United States10656 Posts
On July 29 2015 04:11 Big J wrote: So I was playing a game of LotV and since my opponent was obviously maphacking I went through the replay. This is what the game showed me when I went to his vision: I didn't zoom, when I go back to my vision it isn't zoomed out. But it seems like this guy has some zoom hack and LotV reproduces that somehow in the replay. The Zoom hack was in HOTS too, It was in the thread I posted months ago about the ladder system needing to be changed and on battle.net | ||
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TelecoM
United States10656 Posts
On July 29 2015 08:27 wUndertUnge wrote: Lawsuits from Blizzard against all hackers. Just spend the money to do it. That'll stop this shit real quick. Unfortunately Blizzard most likely will not do that as it costs them money and time, they can just keep randomly finding hackers through mass sweeps and banning them, and hackers buying more accounts. Which in the end is more profitable, and it proves to provide the line of least resistance for Blizzard. | ||
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Archiatrus
Germany64 Posts
To make it one level harder you could change the function names to random signs. The problem is that at some point the function has to be clear. If you press a hotkey the "hotkeyToFunction"-function needs to know what to do. You would not want your marines to manually detonate when you press stim;) So what you do is call the "hotkeyToFunction"-function with "[stim hotkey]" and monitor which function calls are made after this. Voila you know that 9q82(/&Hsjg& is in fact marine.stim(). So the plan is basically: poke it with a stick and see what exactly happens. Is this hard or tedious? Yes (depending on your hacking abilities). But after you have done it once you just write a script that replicates this very systematically poking and you just run it once per week. Like I said, I have no idea whether the assumption that you can "break" into the executable, make and monitor function calls and memory accesses is too far fetched. And I am quite sure it is not as easy as described above, but I am also convinced there is no way to prevent or even make it too complicated to hack. The only way is to try to detect hacks somehow when they are used. But this is a lot harder on the blizzard side without violating your privacy. (And then I would be f*cked since I use the MMR Rating Tool;) ) | ||
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weikor
Austria580 Posts
Does it really matter? Unless hes disrupting my game - drophack etc, or hes gaining an economical advantage - more minerals - the game is still winnable. Maphack really only punishes hidden expansions or cheesy builds you dont want scouted. Maphack basically provides the advantage of 1 scan in his base, and an SCV searching for hidden expos. Im not trying to defend it, but think of it this way - maphack boosts you up one league, but unless youre winning money it makes no difference . Imagine, You are diamond, Tony is Silver, and Bob is also diamond. The other 2 decide that hacking is the way to go. So bob now advances to master league, but faces mechanically superior opponents - hits a wall and can barely improve - hes still a bad player. Tony has special service on his hack, advances to diamond - but you still crush him because he makes 30% less SCVS and spends his time supply blocked while looking at the map. In any way, these players are still "Bad", and for 99% theres no other reason to play sc2 than self improvement. | ||
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deacon.frost
Czech Republic12128 Posts
On July 29 2015 16:19 weikor wrote: Ok, on the other hand - lets assume blizzard CANT fix the hacks. Does it really matter? Unless hes disrupting my game - drophack etc, or hes gaining an economical advantage - more minerals - the game is still winnable. Maphack really only punishes hidden expansions or cheesy builds you dont want scouted. Maphack basically provides the advantage of 1 scan in his base, and an SCV searching for hidden expos. Im not trying to defend it, but think of it this way - maphack boosts you up one league, but unless youre winning money it makes no difference . Imagine, You are diamond, Tony is Silver, and Bob is also diamond. The other 2 decide that hacking is the way to go. So bob now advances to master league, but faces mechanically superior opponents - hits a wall and can barely improve - hes still a bad player. Tony has special service on his hack, advances to diamond - but you still crush him because he makes 30% less SCVS and spends his time supply blocked while looking at the map. In any way, these players are still "Bad", and for 99% theres no other reason to play sc2 than self improvement. It's the frustration you get from losing against someone who is obviously worse player but has these aids and Blizzard is not doing anything, since the player was reported several times just by you personally. This is the problem in a nutshell. Also there are cheaters in online tourneys. A year ago it was mentioned as a big deal, but as I don't play these I don't care that much to remember details. And if you play for the fun - and usually fun is playing a good game with a chance of winning - you don't have fun playing a cheater. You cannot have. The outcome of the game is mostly not in yours hands. Fun, sure. Is playing against someone with cheat that shoots your head in CS fun? I wouldn't say so. And the "he's still bad" argument doesn't care the victims of his precise headshots... | ||
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