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Community Update - July 10th

Forum Index > Legacy of the Void
133 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Next All
c0ldfusion
Profile Joined October 2010
United States8293 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-07-11 03:05:02
July 10 2015 17:46 GMT
#1
From David Kim:
Before we get to this week’s topics, we wanted to let you know that the SC2 team is hard at work this week and are in the process of finalizing the changes for a balance update which will be coming next week. More info on the specific changes will be coming early next week, but some of the things we’re looking at for the next update are:

  • Disruptor
  • New ghost ability
  • Minimap improvements – icons for rocks/towers, and showing possible enemy spawn locations
  • Turret tracking for Siege Tanks and Immortals
  • Addressing the issue of making large numbers of air units difficult to micro.
  • Combining mech ground and air armor upgrades.
  • More balance changes throughout the game



Thank you again for your constructive discussions and help around this area. We’d like to point out once again that the majority of the changes in our beta balance updates couldn’t have happened without the collaboration with our community.

Now let’s talk about various topics that came up this week, and some of our next focus areas.

  • Map diversity in Season 3
    We have seen the many discussions both for and against pushing map diversity quite heavily in this new tournament and ladder season. Although there haven’t yet been many highest level games played on these maps, our team has also been keeping a close eye on the last Homestory Cup/Kespa Cup/GSL games that were using the new maps.

    Our initial thoughts agreed quite strongly with those of you who were pointing out the cool and unique strategies that players devised. The matches in Kespa Cup, for example, showed a wide array of varying build orders and strategies that we normally could not have seen if the map pool was standard.

    In terms of playing the game on these maps, our playing experience is also in alignment with those of you who are saying that it’s just really fun being able to explore, locate, learn, and execute new strategies on the ladder.

    Overall, we strongly believe in the direction of continuing map diversity in the future, but please also keep in mind if any of these maps do turn out harmful to the game, we will be taking measures to make fixes and/or remove the map mid-season in the more extreme cases. Compared to only using standard maps there’s just a higher risk of something like this happening, but we strongly believe the benefits of map diversity outweigh this potentially small risk.

  • Bridgehead PvZ Zerg all-in
    We saw a lot of players jumping to quick conclusions regarding how there is an all-in that Zerg can do that is unstoppable by Protoss. We saw the strategy performing well at Homestory Cup, but in Kespa Cup it was stopped by two different players both times the strategy was executed. We’re not trying to jump to any quick conclusions right now due to the strategy still being quite new, but from the games so far, it definitely doesn’t appear to be unstoppable.

    We’d like to remind everyone that because the cool factor of map diversity is so important to the longevity and fun factor of StarCraft II in terms of both watching and playing the game, it’s important to stay open-minded and not be too quick to jump to such extreme conclusions. We really need to give new and unique maps a fair chance before making conclusions on how good or bad a map is.

    However, one quick note regarding this topic is that the map creator wanted to make a change to the back door Line-of-sight blocker area to allow the defending player to see melee units attacking the rocks, so we’re currently looking to make the requested change and republish the map.

  • Cyclone
    The bad news here is that the direction we talked to you guys about last week turned out to be completely wrong when we play-tested the changes. Therefore, we will not be able to get out changes to the Cyclone for the next patch. The main reason this direction didn’t work out was due to the higher damage and same range in the late game. With these stats, the Cyclone was just countering too many things. We saw this especially against Protoss, who generally have higher cost units – a Terran who was just massing Cyclones took care of almost every unit Protoss could use.

    The good news here is that since then, we’ve been exploring a new direction internally and it’s looking more promising. Where we’re currently at is something like this:

    • Cast range is always 7, and max distance is always 15.
    • Lock on is broken if vision is lost.
    • There are 2 weapons now:
          • Ground weapon – Lower damage than current.
          • Air weapon- Much lower damage to start off with so that air harassment units can still come into play. From there, air harassment units could be shut down by Cyclones or they could be microed well to still deal a lot of damage.

    • New upgrade to the Cyclone is to add more damage to both types of attacks (other upgrades are now gone). Once completed:
          •Ground weapon is stronger than now.
          •Air weapon is similar to now.


    The general reasons here were:

    • Completely removing the anti-air capabilities was probably too big of a nerf.
    • We want to see the micro on both sides on both ground and air units, especially when the unit counts are smaller in the early/mid stages of the game.
    • Adding the vision requirement to the ability will make Cyclone’s interactions around ramps or zero ground vs. air units will be more interesting.
    • Require 2 Cyclones to kill air harassment units such as banshees, warp prisms, oracles, etc.
    • And the micro here will be for the air units to utilize zero ground area well to get away.


    Please keep in mind that thes changes are not final and we’d love to hear your thoughts in this area as well.

  • Medivac upgrade
    We agree with the majority of you in that the current Medivac upgrade isn’t the direction we should be pursuing. It’s a heavy combat add especially in cases where both ground and air units are chasing a bio army, because Terran players can lift up the whole army and land them on a different terrain level without much of a sacrifice. We believe that what we need here instead is something that encourages even more harassment play in the late game, but something that doesn’t buff the bio army in combat. Therefore, our current idea here is to change this upgrade to increase the speed boost duration.

  • Carrier Interceptor behavior improvement
    Thank you for your suggestion regarding how Interceptors behave. We agree with you guys that it might be more interesting if Interceptors on their way back to the Carrier can be more responsive when the player issues another attack order right at this moment. We have put this on our task to try it out internally sometime in the future.


We want to thank you guys once again for the continued engagement and support in both Heart of the Swarm and Legacy of the Void, and we’d like to also give a shoutout this week to all the pro players who have been exploring and executing new strategies in the new maps! Thank you.

source: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/18301002290
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ZergLingShepherd1
Profile Joined June 2015
404 Posts
July 10 2015 18:02 GMT
#2
More medivac harass, its already good enough. They dont need a buff.
The rest of the changes i agree.

But still no feedback on mass carrier and 4 gate adept that is shrecking Zerg and Terran.

Also no Zerg updates, the ravager, SH etc.
"The Fractured but Whole"
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23576 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-07-10 18:05:24
July 10 2015 18:04 GMT
#3
Nice update!

Please do not buff medivacs, they are arleady extremely powerful for harass.

Really nice to see tracking turrets, better air unit micro and possibly even the carrier adressed .

I hope you will throw in the Hydra damage point too!
Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
Topin
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Peru10116 Posts
July 10 2015 18:06 GMT
#4
medivac is alright! dont need any buff. still no love for Zerg?
i would define my style between a mix of ByuN, Maru and MKP
Ramiz1989
Profile Joined July 2012
12124 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-07-10 18:11:33
July 10 2015 18:08 GMT
#5
Finally a right changes to the Cyclone, love these constant updates. Can't wait to see what we will have next.

On July 11 2015 03:06 Topin wrote:
medivac is alright! dont need any buff. still no love for Zerg?


They have already said that they are going to make Ravagers have 6 range again, and combined with no-armored tag that is quite good buff in the early game where Zerg was lacking because of new Reapers, Adepts and timings. They can't do everything at once.

Also, I've stopped watching LOTV for past month, did something happen so Zerg became a lot weaker? It was probably the strongest and most flexible race last time I was watching.
"I've been to hell and back, and back to hell…and back. This time, I've brought Hell back with me."
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24238 Posts
July 10 2015 18:09 GMT
#6
MEDIVACS DO NOT NEED A BUFF.

Especially a speed boost duration, my God.
Topin
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Peru10116 Posts
July 10 2015 18:09 GMT
#7
On July 11 2015 03:09 [PkF] Wire wrote:
MEDIVACS DO NOT NEED A BUFF.

Especially a speed boost duration, my God.

tbh i dont see that upgrade being researched at all
i would define my style between a mix of ByuN, Maru and MKP
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24238 Posts
July 10 2015 18:10 GMT
#8
On July 11 2015 03:09 Topin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2015 03:09 [PkF] Wire wrote:
MEDIVACS DO NOT NEED A BUFF.

Especially a speed boost duration, my God.

tbh i dont see that upgrade being researched at all

So why add it in the first place and act like bio has been buffed ?
eviltomahawk
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States11135 Posts
July 10 2015 18:11 GMT
#9
Fantastic that they're looking at Interceptor AI. Considering how they're also implementing subtle micro stuff like turret tracking and air unit control, I have hopes that they'll do something about Carriers too.

Vision breaking the Cyclone lock-on has been something I've been wanting for a while. There are a lot of interesting micro situations that can come from wrestling for vision control, and they can balance the unit around that. We'll see how the damage nerf/upgrade plays out though.
ㅇㅅㅌㅅ
DoubleReed
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4130 Posts
July 10 2015 18:11 GMT
#10
Is the cyclone basically going to become a fancy version of the Goliath? That might round out mech pretty well.
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24238 Posts
July 10 2015 18:12 GMT
#11
By the way yeah vision breaking cyclone is long overdue and it's pretty good news. Same for interceptors AI.
Topin
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Peru10116 Posts
July 10 2015 18:13 GMT
#12
On July 11 2015 03:10 [PkF] Wire wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2015 03:09 Topin wrote:
On July 11 2015 03:09 [PkF] Wire wrote:
MEDIVACS DO NOT NEED A BUFF.

Especially a speed boost duration, my God.

tbh i dont see that upgrade being researched at all

So why add it in the first place and act like bio has been buffed ?

dunno i only hope it cost less that cloak to be able to fake it if going banshees
i would define my style between a mix of ByuN, Maru and MKP
Ovid
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
United Kingdom948 Posts
July 10 2015 18:13 GMT
#13
Well this is really promising but vague, assuming they correctly implement all the things.
So for starters, I hope they're adjusting the system so seperation distance doesn't screw with moving shot rather than just lowering the separation distance since the makes it very difficult to spread out if you wanted to engage a lone thor or something. If they implement the carrier suggested exactly how Lalush said in his blog post then that's also perfect.

I'm not sure on the cyclone adaption the requirement of vision is good but the increase in power just makes me think it will be mass-able again but since I can't think of anything better than to scrap the unit. I also think that they should change the health. It should be a power unit that's fragile and able to zone other high tech values out.
I will make Yogg Saron priest work...
jotmang-nojem
Profile Joined May 2015
39 Posts
July 10 2015 18:16 GMT
#14
David "Backdoor" Kim and his fetish for "rear guard action". If anything nerf the fucking medivac and buff mech

User was banned for this post.
IceBerrY
Profile Joined February 2012
Germany220 Posts
July 10 2015 18:16 GMT
#15
First of all, thanks a lot for the weekly update, i am really surprised they are actually keeping their word. Thumbs up.
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24238 Posts
July 10 2015 18:18 GMT
#16
I hope they adress the screen being hard to read when too many cyclones are in game (range indicators everywhere for both players) too.
eviltomahawk
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States11135 Posts
July 10 2015 18:18 GMT
#17
On July 11 2015 03:11 DoubleReed wrote:
Is the cyclone basically going to become a fancy version of the Goliath? That might round out mech pretty well.

I've been wanting Cyclones to be Goliath analogues for a while now, so I'd be very happy if they continued down this direction.
ㅇㅅㅌㅅ
Topin
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Peru10116 Posts
July 10 2015 18:19 GMT
#18
On July 11 2015 03:18 eviltomahawk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2015 03:11 DoubleReed wrote:
Is the cyclone basically going to become a fancy version of the Goliath? That might round out mech pretty well.

I've been wanting Cyclones to be Goliath analogues for a while now, so I'd be very happy if they continued down this direction.

it hey are doing that they could change their skin too, it sucks
i would define my style between a mix of ByuN, Maru and MKP
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24238 Posts
July 10 2015 18:20 GMT
#19
On July 11 2015 03:19 Topin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 11 2015 03:18 eviltomahawk wrote:
On July 11 2015 03:11 DoubleReed wrote:
Is the cyclone basically going to become a fancy version of the Goliath? That might round out mech pretty well.

I've been wanting Cyclones to be Goliath analogues for a while now, so I'd be very happy if they continued down this direction.

it hey are doing that they could change their skin too, it sucks

Well just add Goliath then
Sapphire.lux
Profile Joined July 2010
Romania2620 Posts
July 10 2015 18:25 GMT
#20
I don't really understand the Cyclone damage changes. With more dmg vs ground after upgrades, will mass Cyclone not be the go to composition for mid-late game mech? If so, this is rubbish! Mech is about the Tank and support, not mass mobile units.
Head Coach Park: "They should buff tanks!"
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