Welcome to this patch's General Discussion thread for the League of Legends subforum. This thread is for discussion around League of Legends. Free feel to talk about anything LoL related here that does not already have its own thread.
evilfatsh1t: i wish riot spent half as much time balancing the game properly as they did designing new champions. dont understand why we need to get 3 new champions a year. theyre actively diminishing the value of their existing champions by doing this -----------------------------------------------
You serious? Its 6 new champions per year for the next few years. Rell is the 6th for 2020. This is the officially stated Riot's position
we had 6 champions this year? i just went off memory and said 3 lol who came before yone seraphine and rell? drawing blanks without looking it up anyways that makes my point even more. less champions pls
On November 24 2020 22:25 M2 wrote: evilfatsh1t: i wish riot spent half as much time balancing the game properly as they did designing new champions. dont understand why we need to get 3 new champions a year. theyre actively diminishing the value of their existing champions by doing this -----------------------------------------------
You serious? Its 6 new champions per year for the next few years. Rell is the 6th for 2020. This is the officially stated Riot's position
I think Riot was going with focusing on reworks for a while but...they found out a lot of these champs had legacy/veteran players who dedicated their entire connection to League with this champ and were more likely to leave LoL after a dramatic rework. One of their YT videos/Riot plz - articles mentioned focusing on new champs over reworks for a while.
On November 24 2020 22:25 M2 wrote: evilfatsh1t: i wish riot spent half as much time balancing the game properly as they did designing new champions. dont understand why we need to get 3 new champions a year. theyre actively diminishing the value of their existing champions by doing this -----------------------------------------------
You serious? Its 6 new champions per year for the next few years. Rell is the 6th for 2020. This is the officially stated Riot's position
I think Riot was going with focusing on reworks for a while but...they found out a lot of these champs had legacy/veteran players who dedicated their entire connection to League with this champ and were more likely to leave LoL after a dramatic rework. One of their YT videos/Riot plz - articles mentioned focusing on new champs over reworks for a while.
Good. If we are being honest most reworks don't preserve champion feel, not do they encourage healthy balance. Its just them nerfing champs they want to rework to justify the rework.
That reminds me of the Urgot rework, they nerfed his previous kit into oblivion after he was meta for a full year, then he was overtuned as fuck and they were like, people love the redesign. As soon as he wasn't OP, his playrate went right back to the old play rate.
Like the champion is a flesh golom, it's going to be popular when OP and unpopular when not OP ( I know pudge is too but he's also a hook champ)
On November 26 2020 03:53 Slusher wrote: That reminds me of the Urgot rework, they nerfed his previous kit into oblivion after he was meta for a full year, then he was overtuned as fuck and they were like, people love the redesign. As soon as he wasn't OP, his playrate went right back to the old play rate.
Like the champion is a flesh golom, it's going to be popular when OP and unpopular when not OP ( I know pudge is too but he's also a hook champ)
His kit is super oppressive though, fairly hard to balance with just numbers. Either he does enough damage to bully everyone out of lane, or he doesn't, and then there's no reason to pick him. Imo right now he's in the best possible place, obscure and not meta but some people still find success with him.
The reworks have been very hit or miss. The juggernaut patch was stupid but if it happened now, we wouldn't really complain. Sion rework was a success, if only because his original kit was a mess. Akali/Aatrox made them viable again, although even 2 years later Riot is still struggling to balance them. If the news is true, and Riot is focusing on new champions over reworks, this spells bad news for Taliyah and Udyr (who's only viable because of insane numbers).
On November 24 2020 22:25 M2 wrote: evilfatsh1t: i wish riot spent half as much time balancing the game properly as they did designing new champions. dont understand why we need to get 3 new champions a year. theyre actively diminishing the value of their existing champions by doing this -----------------------------------------------
You serious? Its 6 new champions per year for the next few years. Rell is the 6th for 2020. This is the officially stated Riot's position
I think Riot was going with focusing on reworks for a while but...they found out a lot of these champs had legacy/veteran players who dedicated their entire connection to League with this champ and were more likely to leave LoL after a dramatic rework. One of their YT videos/Riot plz - articles mentioned focusing on new champs over reworks for a while.
About time,
Most of my favourite champs have been reworked over the years and I've hated most of them. They could have just made new champions instead and left the old ones alone.
On November 26 2020 03:53 Slusher wrote: That reminds me of the Urgot rework, they nerfed his previous kit into oblivion after he was meta for a full year, then he was overtuned as fuck and they were like, people love the redesign. As soon as he wasn't OP, his playrate went right back to the old play rate.
Like the champion is a flesh golom, it's going to be popular when OP and unpopular when not OP ( I know pudge is too but he's also a hook champ)
His kit is super oppressive though, fairly hard to balance with just numbers. Either he does enough damage to bully everyone out of lane, or he doesn't, and then there's no reason to pick him. Imo right now he's in the best possible place, obscure and not meta but some people still find success with him.
The reworks have been very hit or miss. The juggernaut patch was stupid but if it happened now, we wouldn't really complain. Sion rework was a success, if only because his original kit was a mess. Akali/Aatrox made them viable again, although even 2 years later Riot is still struggling to balance them. If the news is true, and Riot is focusing on new champions over reworks, this spells bad news for Taliyah and Udyr (who's only viable because of insane numbers).
I mean that description fits old Urgot basically perfectly as well, so in the end they solved nothing except to make old urgot players sad.
On November 26 2020 03:53 Slusher wrote: That reminds me of the Urgot rework, they nerfed his previous kit into oblivion after he was meta for a full year, then he was overtuned as fuck and they were like, people love the redesign. As soon as he wasn't OP, his playrate went right back to the old play rate.
Like the champion is a flesh golom, it's going to be popular when OP and unpopular when not OP ( I know pudge is too but he's also a hook champ)
His kit is super oppressive though, fairly hard to balance with just numbers. Either he does enough damage to bully everyone out of lane, or he doesn't, and then there's no reason to pick him. Imo right now he's in the best possible place, obscure and not meta but some people still find success with him.
The reworks have been very hit or miss. The juggernaut patch was stupid but if it happened now, we wouldn't really complain. Sion rework was a success, if only because his original kit was a mess. Akali/Aatrox made them viable again, although even 2 years later Riot is still struggling to balance them. If the news is true, and Riot is focusing on new champions over reworks, this spells bad news for Taliyah and Udyr (who's only viable because of insane numbers).
I mean that description fits old Urgot basically perfectly as well, so in the end they solved nothing except to make old urgot players sad.
Pretty much.
Also Akali is a disaster because she suffers from the same thing most other new champs do, a ridiculously bloated kit. The champ is fun to play because it has tools for dealing with everything, and frustrating to play against because the champ doesn't really have weaknesses until her numbers get tuned to a point where the people can just run at her and win.
On November 24 2020 22:25 M2 wrote: evilfatsh1t: i wish riot spent half as much time balancing the game properly as they did designing new champions. dont understand why we need to get 3 new champions a year. theyre actively diminishing the value of their existing champions by doing this -----------------------------------------------
You serious? Its 6 new champions per year for the next few years. Rell is the 6th for 2020. This is the officially stated Riot's position
I think Riot was going with focusing on reworks for a while but...they found out a lot of these champs had legacy/veteran players who dedicated their entire connection to League with this champ and were more likely to leave LoL after a dramatic rework. One of their YT videos/Riot plz - articles mentioned focusing on new champs over reworks for a while.
About time,
Most of my favourite champs have been reworked over the years and I've hated most of them. They could have just made new champions instead and left the old ones alone.
Yeah, like reworking a classic champ like Sona? That could've totally been a new champion!
Ryze is one that I really liked to play at one point, and now just don't. The new ult is not my style, neither is the spreading system. I liked the old bop and boop. The other ones i miss are Graves, Gragas, and Irelia. I preferred old olaf and maokai, but still think the new versions are fun.
On November 26 2020 13:11 cLutZ wrote: Ryze is one that I really liked to play at one point, and now just don't. The new ult is not my style, neither is the spreading system. I liked the old bop and boop. The other ones i miss are Graves, Gragas, and Irelia. I preferred old olaf and maokai, but still think the new versions are fun.
I miss old Graves the most. New Graves just doesn't have the same oomph as old Graves.
Everyone who played him misses old Graves. Can't believe people miss old Gragas though, such a bs champ. And Ryze is the textbook example of why it's hard to balance a champion that scales differently from the rest of the game, singlehandedly nerfed old Frozen Heart.
Old gragas is a weird one because only his W is new really, iirc(and maybe I don't) the detonation charge up was added to Q before the W rework. And yea his old W was some dumb shit 40% damage reduction with like a 60% uptime and it always healed because his passive was instant and had no cd, oh and it gave so much AD, it gave more damage to bodyslam that skilling body slam.
I love playing that champ, but I hated him to because he was a giga gatekeeper. But tbh I just think of new Gragas as nerfed Gragas because his old W made no sense
If you do consider Gragas a rework I think it's the Warwick tier of rework
On November 27 2020 00:04 Slusher wrote: Old gragas is a weird one because only his W is new really, iirc(and maybe I don't) the detonation charge up was added to Q before the W rework. And yea his old W was some dumb shit 40% damage reduction with like a 60% uptime and it always healed because his passive was instant and had no cd, oh and it gave so much AD, it gave more damage to bodyslam that skilling body slam.
I love playing that champ, but I hated him to because he was a giga gatekeeper. But tbh I just think of new Gragas as nerfed Gragas because his old W made no sense
If you do consider Gragas a rework I think it's the Warwick tier of rework
Old Gragas was a gatekeeper, in a good way. As a melee mage he improved the landscape.
On December 01 2020 10:33 ghrur wrote: First time playing on the new patch. Got to say, Galeforce -> Stormrazor -> IE Caitlyn feels really good. Super fun to play and outplay people with.
How much value do you get from the active on average? Or is it mostly for the MS advantage?
On December 01 2020 10:33 ghrur wrote: First time playing on the new patch. Got to say, Galeforce -> Stormrazor -> IE Caitlyn feels really good. Super fun to play and outplay people with.
How much value do you get from the active on average? Or is it mostly for the MS advantage?
Honestly, the active is as valuable or more so than Flash, so I find it pretty great. Allows for outplays on champs who need to hit a key skill (E or R) to kill you. Caitlyn, in particular, gets a huge bonus due to her combos, but I'm not even proficient enough in that. Combined with Stormrazor, it'll basically allow you to start picks from a screen away due to Caitlyn's long range.
MS advantage is nice too, and with it, I think zeal items aren't as necessary for kiting.
Can we put an official time of death on this forum or are there still people wanting to discuss in here? I feel like it's one of those awkward situations where it's been silent for too long and no one can say anything because it would just be to break the silence to get rid of that uncomfortable tension instead of actually saying something of value.
Anyway, Thresh is super strong again I think. I've rediscovered my passion for him kind of. His lantern is one of my favourite abilities in the game. Its always difficult knowing when NOT to go in on a hook though.
Also, AP Miss Fortune support is low key broken. 3 levels in Make it Rain chunks adcs out to the point of them being unable to cs under the turret.
On December 12 2020 21:45 Uldridge wrote: Can we put an official time of death on this forum or are there still people wanting to discuss in here? I feel like it's one of those awkward situations where it's been silent for too long and no one can say anything because it would just be to break the silence to get rid of that uncomfortable tension instead of actually saying something of value.
Anyway, Thresh is super strong again I think. I've rediscovered my passion for him kind of. His lantern is one of my favourite abilities in the game. Its always difficult knowing when NOT to go in on a hook though.
Also, AP Miss Fortune support is low key broken. 3 levels in Make it Rain chunks adcs out to the point of them being unable to cs under the turret.
Whats the difference between MF season 10 and preseason for the first few levels so you can claim that its broken now but it was ok or bad before?
Not much necessarily, except that I've tried it out because of the Liandries + Demonic helm combo. I seem to be getting away with. Maybe less propensity of engage supports? Don't know how it would pan out in higher levels.
whats everyones opinion on liandrys vs riftmaker? other than cases where i really want the lifesteal i dont see much use in getting riftmaker over liandries. both of them are supposed to shred high mr but how does the maths look?
The obvious advantage riftmaker has it that it gives magic pen to its following items. You do need 5s+ of hitting enemy champions before the true damage portion comes into effect so that's a downside. This item together with Void Staff would let you hit 60% magic pen + the flat pen you can get from boots + that other item seems quite a bit of MR shred lategame.
Idk about Liandries tbh. Feels great versus squishies, feels shit vs tanks is all I can say atm. Even with Void Staff it's felt lacking, but then, my sample size is low.
a bit off topic but what are Karma support win conditions in soloQ? Like I really dont understand this champ, what is she supposed to do to win the game? Is she expected to hard win most of the lanes or some kind of mid game power? What is it? Sometimes she appears in my games in either team and I really have no idea what she does (I mean I know her kit), but she kind of walks around do stuff that no one cares about.
She has the ability to control fights kind of I guess? The speed boost with shield can be quite powerful and then she can keep champs 1 to 2 relatively easily off the carries. Don't know how well she fares at the moment because I haven't seen her in forever.
Didn't play Karma after the item changes, but I think most of her power was in controlling the lane. It's not just the powerful poke, you can also help to quickly shove the lane when you need to, have great gank assist, and you have good mobility (shield speedboost) and antimobility (Q slow) to escape dangers while warding. As Karma, it's relatively easy to salvage bad lanes and hard win winning lanes.
Later you just do whatever and it's still helpful. It's also important to note her abilities have decent ranges so you don't have to handhold your adc like Lulu to be useful (Karma's shield has 800 range, Lulu's W and E 650).
Yesterday I've encountered one of the more innovative things I've seen over the years. I played against a Yuumi Soraka duo bot where the Yuumi got below a certain hp threshold to activate Soraka's passive and then got inside her so her speed buff was continuously activated. She was speeding in the lane at 500ms at lvl 1 lol. If they had taken better summoner spells and played it a bit better (because Soraka was showing off more her speed than actually laning lol), they would completely dominate. I think this mighte be one of the more busted thing around.
If the Yuumi buys staff of flowing water and crucible.. how do you pin down the Soraka?
On December 17 2020 22:26 Uldridge wrote: Yesterday I've encountered one of the more innovative things I've seen over the years. I played against a Yuumi Soraka duo bot where the Yuumi got below a certain hp threshold to activate Soraka's passive and then got inside her so her speed buff was continuously activated. She was speeding in the lane at 500ms at lvl 1 lol. If they had taken better summoner spells and played it a bit better (because Soraka was showing off more her speed than actually laning lol), they would completely dominate. I think this mighte be one of the more busted thing around.
If the Yuumi buys staff of flowing water and crucible.. how do you pin down the Soraka?
Riot said that they gonna fix this interaction. Otherwise you can't pin it down, it has 80 something win rate, completely broken
On December 17 2020 22:26 Uldridge wrote: Yesterday I've encountered one of the more innovative things I've seen over the years. I played against a Yuumi Soraka duo bot where the Yuumi got below a certain hp threshold to activate Soraka's passive and then got inside her so her speed buff was continuously activated. She was speeding in the lane at 500ms at lvl 1 lol. If they had taken better summoner spells and played it a bit better (because Soraka was showing off more her speed than actually laning lol), they would completely dominate. I think this mighte be one of the more busted thing around.
If the Yuumi buys staff of flowing water and crucible.. how do you pin down the Soraka?
yeah i played against it for the 1st time yesterday too and ive honestly never been more impressed by a duo combination. perfect combination of extremely fun to play, troll and strong. i got stomped in lane because i was aphelios but i wasnt even mad lol. just made me watch in awe
anyone else having client issues lately? i keep getting dropped out intermittently for seemingly no reason. its forced me to dodge 3 games now because when it happens during champ select the client just bugs and i cant lock anything in. not sure if this is my net or the client but i havent been able to catch my net going down when it says i dc in the client. frustrating as fuck
On December 19 2020 16:56 evilfatsh1t wrote: anyone else having client issues lately? i keep getting dropped out intermittently for seemingly no reason. its forced me to dodge 3 games now because when it happens during champ select the client just bugs and i cant lock anything in. not sure if this is my net or the client but i havent been able to catch my net going down when it says i dc in the client. frustrating as fuck
Yeah, not like you, but I got a new feature where twitch and youtube hard lag if the client is on. I mean even the auto-quality drops to the lowest and its still lagging and I thought its the i-net or something but when I exit the client, everything is fine again and I can watch smoothly on the highest quality
Are we going to see support Seraphine in pro play? I rarely watch streams, but when I do, there's always at least one support Seraphine in the game. Nemesis often complained about her. I don't watch him enough to be able to tell if he was honest about it or was just complaining about everything that kills him for show, like a regular twitch streamer.
Stopped playing rankeds after the lock, but she was rarely picked in my normals.
On December 27 2020 09:09 Sent. wrote: Are we going to see support Seraphine in pro play? I rarely watch streams, but when I do, there's always at least one support Seraphine in the game. Nemesis often complained about her. I don't watch him enough to be able to tell if he was honest about it or was just complaining about everything that kills him for show, like a regular twitch streamer.
Stopped playing rankeds after the lock, but she was rarely picked in my normals.
With her teamfighting presence and ability to gain lane priority I'm pretty sure we will see her in pro play. Personally I think she's best as the carry in botlane since she pairs so insanely well with an engage champion and it lets her just mindlessly shove waves without ruining her adcs farm.
EPT
