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On April 17 2015 21:01 Alaric wrote:
That'd mean getting more AP (around 20), some %MPen, and spellsword (or the weaving masteries) mainly, is it really worth it over 3% damage reduction from cc'd enemies, 26 armour/MR in teamfights, more tenacity and crit/magic AoE reduction?
Get both AP and AD, executioner and pen.
Your lategame is already godly, so this will provide a lot of help for the earlygame.
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On April 17 2015 17:57 RagequitBM wrote:
Played Garen mid today against Azir in gold elo, got my ass beat and was 0 - 2 by the time I hit 6, but after that I just demacia swagged all over him and his team. Ended like 18 - 7 or something, and then lost.
Which brings me to my question, how do you carry as Garen? I always have like 10+ kills but then just lose.
You buy wards and turn everywhere they are not into a dank dark place of Garen waiting in brushes. Garen's teamfighting isn't the best lategame unless you can ambush their AD or AP from some weird angle, so you have to play him as you would an assassin imo. Avoid the big pileups and create skirmishes where you just spin on people because of your insane stats/silence/execute.
Ofcourse, sometimes you get forced into bad 5v5's all the time and you do less then their Maokai or some such shit. Such is life.
Generally the way I win is through killing their jungler or some other fool alone and taking turrets off of it.
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On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick.
This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general.
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Yeah,also very frustating for the people who really want to win.
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On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general.
Here's where you draw the line:
Trolling champ select is a breach of the summoners code.
If you're a higher pick, you get the role. That's the rule. Whether or not its lustboy doesn't matter.
In fact, if it is lustboy, he is kind of contractually obligated to not do that.
I would have probably taken a screenshot and submitted it to riot and asked them to fine him. That sort of childish unprofessionalism should not be allowed.
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On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general.
With regard to trolling the line is very easily drawn, because trolling comes with the intention of harming/irritating (in a broad sense) other players. With regard to "bad" item choices the line is similarly drawn in the realm of intention. As soon as someone intends to offend/harm/irritate/etc anyone with his choice he/she acts morally wrong.
So if I pick a non-meta champ and have a non-standard build but I believe it works and is fun to play, it is my right to play it.
If I pick a 2nd jungler after someone already took the position just to piss that person of, I am in the wrong.
There are grey areas to the simple picture, but I suspect there is nothing that could not be solved by good old deontological ethics (i.e. Kantian ethics).
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In general I'd say normally a, versus Draven b.
Assuming that the opponent's used heal and you are even on gold you can force (and/or threaten) 2v2s with summoner advantage afterwards which gives you control of the lane.
Maybe it is different in some very snowbally matchups.
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On April 17 2015 22:15 krndandaman wrote:
hm I've been discussing this with my friend and I was wondering what others thought:
scenario: you pull off a successful 2v2 dive killing both enemies and your support dead but their jungler is coming.
you are taking tower aggro and bound to die unless you use heal. your flash was used during the dive. the adc was the last one to hit you.
do you
a) save heal? kill goes to their adc and assist goes to their support.
b) use heal? kill goes to their jungler and assist goes to their adc and support.
of course every situation will vary, but I think I would generally lean towards A.
my friend said he would go for B generally.
my 2 cents: it depends on who is the adc, who is the jungle and who are you
1) scaling adc (vayne) & snowball jungle (e.g. lee, zix) - give it to vayne
2) regular adc (graves) & snowball jungle - give it to adc
3) scaling adc (vayne, jinx) & regular jungle (nunu, amumu) - give it to jungle
4) regular adc & regular jungle - give it to adc if u have diving champs, give it to jungle if you feel they can peel you of their adc
of course i can go in more details and more elaboration, but I think you'll get my point without additional explanations
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On April 17 2015 22:08 Ketara wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general. Here's where you draw the line: Trolling champ select is a breach of the summoners code. If you're a higher pick, you get the role. That's the rule. Whether or not its lustboy doesn't matter.In fact, if it is lustboy, he is kind of contractually obligated to not do that. I would have probably taken a screenshot and submitted it to riot and asked them to fine him. That sort of childish unprofessionalism should not be allowed.
No it isn't.
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Pootie too good!4331 Posts
Hey, I am low gold/high silver and I am looking for a solid duo partner. If you don't rage, stay positive even through losses and are willing to put in some hours hit me up on NA: gaMESense. I usually play from 7pm-12am EST pretty much every night and then lots more on weekends.
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On April 17 2015 22:39 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 22:08 Ketara wrote:On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general. Here's where you draw the line: Trolling champ select is a breach of the summoners code. If you're a higher pick, you get the role. That's the rule. Whether or not its lustboy doesn't matter.In fact, if it is lustboy, he is kind of contractually obligated to not do that. I would have probably taken a screenshot and submitted it to riot and asked them to fine him. That sort of childish unprofessionalism should not be allowed. No it isn't.
If that isn't the rule there are no rules. And thus champ select trolling, the most insidious form of griefing in LoL, is not against the rules.
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On April 17 2015 22:39 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 22:08 Ketara wrote:On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general. Here's where you draw the line: Trolling champ select is a breach of the summoners code. If you're a higher pick, you get the role. That's the rule. Whether or not its lustboy doesn't matter.In fact, if it is lustboy, he is kind of contractually obligated to not do that. I would have probably taken a screenshot and submitted it to riot and asked them to fine him. That sort of childish unprofessionalism should not be allowed. No it isn't.
http://www.reignofgaming.net/redtracker/topic/94820-pick-order-vs-call-order
Yes it is.
In the second post they straight up say that not obeying it is trolling champ select, which is a breach of the summoners code and reportable.
Q: How will Riot be able to enforce this?
A: The short answer is it won't be strictly enforced. We want to create an environment that encourages collaboration when creating team comps. Strict enforcement here could potentially obstruct that. However, in the event that somebody is breaking the Summoner's Code in champ select, players can use the existing reporting tools like the tribunal.
There's still a difference between picking something suboptimal with the belief that it could actually work, and trying to ruin a game or get somebody to dodge on purpose.
But if somebody is trying to ruin a game or get somebody to dodge on purpose by picking a role that is already picked, they are trolling champ select, it IS reportable, and you should be reporting them.
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On April 17 2015 22:39 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 22:08 Ketara wrote:On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general. Here's where you draw the line: Trolling champ select is a breach of the summoners code. If you're a higher pick, you get the role. That's the rule. Whether or not its lustboy doesn't matter.In fact, if it is lustboy, he is kind of contractually obligated to not do that. I would have probably taken a screenshot and submitted it to riot and asked them to fine him. That sort of childish unprofessionalism should not be allowed. No it isn't.
It is.
About the 2v2 thingy it would only be worth to use heal and die to jungler if you look at his creepscore and giving kill to jungler would prevent the enemy from getting a bf or some sort of big item.Otherwise wasting heal is retarded.
But since the tribunal is in maintenance all you can get is chat restricted for reports so they are just pointless until it is up.Fun stuff.
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On April 17 2015 22:12 Prog wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general. With regard to trolling the line is very easily drawn, because trolling comes with the intention of harming/irritating (in a broad sense) other players. With regard to "bad" item choices the line is similarly drawn in the realm of intention. As soon as someone intends to offend/harm/irritate/etc anyone with his choice he/she acts morally wrong. So if I pick a non-meta champ and have a non-standard build but I believe it works and is fun to play, it is my right to play it. If I pick a 2nd jungler after someone already took the position just to piss that person of, I am in the wrong. There are grey areas to the simple picture, but I suspect there is nothing that could not be solved by good old deontological ethics (i.e. Kantian ethics). [You can't measure or quantify intent. So while the line is clear when you know what the other person's intentions are, it's much more grey when they're strangers (even public figures are still strangers in the end) over the internet.
Then there's also the issue that we don't know what Lustboy did here (the original poster didn't specify) and that intent while 'trolling' ingame is even harder to establish than trolling champ select.
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On April 17 2015 22:48 Ketara wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2015 22:39 Gahlo wrote:On April 17 2015 22:08 Ketara wrote:On April 17 2015 21:47 Mikau wrote:On April 17 2015 17:32 Prog wrote:On April 17 2015 16:41 Osmoses wrote:On April 17 2015 14:39 wei2coolman wrote:On April 17 2015 14:19 RaphaelSanzio wrote:
So I just got trolled by a certain support player that plays for TSM because I took support even though I was higher pick than him. It's not the first time I've seen something like this happen to me or other players.
After thinking about it some more I realized that all of the times these type of things have happened is when none of the players in the game are streaming. If any of the players are streaming it's like everyone is perfectly behaved. Kind of makes me wonder how much of a facade some players/teams put on in order to boost their PR. lmao, you make it sound as if the universe wronged you here. not saying, what he did wasn't a dick move, but aren't you also screwing over your teammates winrate by not giving the supposedly the best player on your team the role that they're the best at? On April 17 2015 15:46 AlreadyHere wrote:
If u are taking support from lustboy you are hurting your team more than he did. This is not a real argument. If you have firstpick you should play what you want to play. You have absolutely no obligation to anyone who might in theory be better at your role than you are, especially in challenger. This. Not everything is about maximising the teams chance to win. You have the right to play what you enjoy most if you are higher pick. This is a slippery slope. If not everything is about maximising the team's chance to win, where do we draw the line? With the same logic we can excuse everything from this to picking 'bad' (meaning non-meta) champions, to building 'bad' items, to trolling in general. Here's where you draw the line: Trolling champ select is a breach of the summoners code. If you're a higher pick, you get the role. That's the rule. Whether or not its lustboy doesn't matter.In fact, if it is lustboy, he is kind of contractually obligated to not do that. I would have probably taken a screenshot and submitted it to riot and asked them to fine him. That sort of childish unprofessionalism should not be allowed. No it isn't. http://www.reignofgaming.net/redtracker/topic/94820-pick-order-vs-call-orderYes it is. In the second post they straight up say that not obeying it is trolling champ select, which is a breach of the summoners code and reportable. Show nested quote +Q: How will Riot be able to enforce this?
A: The short answer is it won't be strictly enforced. We want to create an environment that encourages collaboration when creating team comps. Strict enforcement here could potentially obstruct that. However, in the event that somebody is breaking the Summoner's Code in champ select, players can use the existing reporting tools like the tribunal. There's still a difference between picking something suboptimal with the belief that it could actually work, and trying to ruin a game or get somebody to dodge on purpose. But if somebody is trying to ruin a game or get somebody to dodge on purpose by picking a role that is already picked, they are trolling champ select, it IS reportable, and you should be reporting them.
From the very same post you linked:
At this point we would like to stress, once again, that Pick Order should not be the first thing players turn to in determining who plays what role in ranked games. Pick Order is meant to be a last resort when settling discussions - this is why we are endorsing it and not mandating it.
So no, it isn't "the rule."
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It literally says if people don't agree on who plays what pick order decides.How is that not a rule?
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On April 17 2015 23:29 Gahlo wrote:
...are not mandating it.
from the same thread
Our stance isn't that the player who has first pick should ignore his team and auto lock. It's that players should try to collaborate to form a team. If for whatever reason players come to an impasse and disputes arise, we want players to have some generally agreed upon set of rules to resolve the dispute in a civil way.
Aka if like every champ select 2 people can't decide pick order is what decides.Just because someone is famous doesn't mean you have to fuck yourself over just for their sake.
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From that same section:
Our stance isn't that the player who has first pick should ignore his team and auto lock. It's that players should try to collaborate to form a team.
While Raph is pretty "fuck you, I'm picking support, lalalala" in this situation. Not that I'm quoting him.
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EPT
