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On July 22 2014 07:48 Ryuu314 wrote:champions with big sweeping changes always get disabled for at least two weeks in LCS. i'm more curious as to whether Shen is enabled now since the red tracker suggests that the guy behind the Shen bug fixing might've found a fix. Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 07:45 cLutZ wrote:On July 22 2014 07:08 kongoline wrote:On July 22 2014 06:54 cLutZ wrote:On July 22 2014 06:34 kongoline wrote:
so they keep nerfing every offensive jungler to power level of tanks whats the point of playing them ?every single pro jungler said they dont want farming junglers to be strong cuz games are uneventful and boring riot jsut insist on making it happen Honestly, why do they care what pro junglers LIKE to play? What is important is what is balanced for pros, but what is fun for regular players. erm the whole point its more fun to play offensive junglers For some, yes. For others maybe not. Plus, it's not even about just farming jungles being weak, it's about how only 1 kind of jungler is strong, which is boring to watch even if pros like it. Personally, I think the issue with junglers is that in pro play, jungles will almost always be relegated to a support/low farm role due to how farm is distributed on the pro level. This means farming jungles will imo never be a thing unless something drastic about the game is changed (ie. pre-nerf Feral Flare). Talking about what is "fun" for regular players is a moot point imo. Almost every champion is perfectly playable in solo queue with a few, rare exceptions. Rarely does Riot's balancing significantly impact a champion's solo queue playability.
That is actually a really silly attitude that just because things are viable that soloQ players shouldn't encourage Riot to make them optimal. I mean, there is really no reason junglers who prefer Hecarim/Maokai should be innately handicapped vs. Lee/Elise players regardless of rank. And, if Riot finds that the skill difference between the champions is so large that they cannot balance those champs for both pro and Diamond, then they need to redesign the champions.
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On July 22 2014 10:27 IMoperator wrote:
kogmaw got nerfed in the previous pbe patch(specifically his early game), so they were just adjusting some stuff. And they just nerfed kayle/twitch like a month ago, so it's not really a "buff" in the sense that they're still weaker than they were before lol.
Kog's early game got a small nerf, but he has more hp level 11 onwards.
secondly, I'm addressing golem saying it's a "nerf everything patch," when it's very clearly not.
On July 22 2014 10:31 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 07:48 Ryuu314 wrote:champions with big sweeping changes always get disabled for at least two weeks in LCS. i'm more curious as to whether Shen is enabled now since the red tracker suggests that the guy behind the Shen bug fixing might've found a fix. On July 22 2014 07:45 cLutZ wrote:On July 22 2014 07:08 kongoline wrote:On July 22 2014 06:54 cLutZ wrote:On July 22 2014 06:34 kongoline wrote:
so they keep nerfing every offensive jungler to power level of tanks whats the point of playing them ?every single pro jungler said they dont want farming junglers to be strong cuz games are uneventful and boring riot jsut insist on making it happen Honestly, why do they care what pro junglers LIKE to play? What is important is what is balanced for pros, but what is fun for regular players. erm the whole point its more fun to play offensive junglers For some, yes. For others maybe not. Plus, it's not even about just farming jungles being weak, it's about how only 1 kind of jungler is strong, which is boring to watch even if pros like it. Personally, I think the issue with junglers is that in pro play, jungles will almost always be relegated to a support/low farm role due to how farm is distributed on the pro level. This means farming jungles will imo never be a thing unless something drastic about the game is changed (ie. pre-nerf Feral Flare). Talking about what is "fun" for regular players is a moot point imo. Almost every champion is perfectly playable in solo queue with a few, rare exceptions. Rarely does Riot's balancing significantly impact a champion's solo queue playability. That is actually a really silly attitude that just because things are viable that soloQ players shouldn't encourage Riot to make them optimal. I mean, there is really no reason junglers who prefer Hecarim/Maokai should be innately handicapped vs. Lee/Elise players regardless of rank. And, if Riot finds that the skill difference between the champions is so large that they cannot balance those champs for both pro and Diamond, then they need to redesign the champions.
except in the context of solo queue, the stats suggest that players who prefer non-fotm champions are not handicapped. Lee/Elise and other fotm champions traditionally have horrendous solo queue win rates. Maokai, for example, is actually performing really well atm with 52% winrate according to LoLking.
I'm not saying that Riot shouldn't focus on making underused champions more optimal. Rather, I'm saying that using solo queue and what "regular players" want is a silly balancing metric, especially when it's been shown time and again that your "regular player" knows shit about balance.
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well there are a lot of nerfs lol.
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11589 Posts
On July 22 2014 10:31 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 07:48 Ryuu314 wrote:champions with big sweeping changes always get disabled for at least two weeks in LCS. i'm more curious as to whether Shen is enabled now since the red tracker suggests that the guy behind the Shen bug fixing might've found a fix. On July 22 2014 07:45 cLutZ wrote:On July 22 2014 07:08 kongoline wrote:On July 22 2014 06:54 cLutZ wrote:On July 22 2014 06:34 kongoline wrote:
so they keep nerfing every offensive jungler to power level of tanks whats the point of playing them ?every single pro jungler said they dont want farming junglers to be strong cuz games are uneventful and boring riot jsut insist on making it happen Honestly, why do they care what pro junglers LIKE to play? What is important is what is balanced for pros, but what is fun for regular players. erm the whole point its more fun to play offensive junglers For some, yes. For others maybe not. Plus, it's not even about just farming jungles being weak, it's about how only 1 kind of jungler is strong, which is boring to watch even if pros like it. Personally, I think the issue with junglers is that in pro play, jungles will almost always be relegated to a support/low farm role due to how farm is distributed on the pro level. This means farming jungles will imo never be a thing unless something drastic about the game is changed (ie. pre-nerf Feral Flare). Talking about what is "fun" for regular players is a moot point imo. Almost every champion is perfectly playable in solo queue with a few, rare exceptions. Rarely does Riot's balancing significantly impact a champion's solo queue playability. That is actually a really silly attitude that just because things are viable that soloQ players shouldn't encourage Riot to make them optimal. I mean, there is really no reason junglers who prefer Hecarim/Maokai should be innately handicapped vs. Lee/Elise players regardless of rank. And, if Riot finds that the skill difference between the champions is so large that they cannot balance those champs for both pro and Diamond, then they need to redesign the champions.
Different things will be strong in organized play vs. unorganized pugs. Balancing for both is impossible.
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wait are they are really removing W-Q on Cow?
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On July 22 2014 10:41 arb wrote:
wait are they are really removing W-Q on Cow?
they're not. but a Rioter doesn't like it, specifically Riot Statikk.
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On July 22 2014 10:46 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 10:41 arb wrote:
wait are they are really removing W-Q on Cow? they're not. but a Rioter doesn't like it, specifically Riot Statikk.
god forbid a champion have ranged stun potential in league of mobility
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On July 22 2014 10:15 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 09:42 Gorsameth wrote:On July 22 2014 09:36 Alaric wrote:From the Statikk Q&A regarding Alistar: 3) Alistar
The W+Q combo is something that we never intended to exist, but it's something that Alistar players have gotten used to and is honestly integral to his current balance and gameplay. If we were to revisit him in a Reworks style approach, I think there's a high likelihood that we would remove the combo and instead give him more ways to create situations where he can W enemies into walls to setup a follow-up Q. This is probably a healthier version of his combo, but it's not something we'd do unless we supplemented the kit with ways to function and succeed without the combo. Granted, it's not new, it's exactly they kind of thing they did with Pantheon's ult. But when they're so much about "player satisfaction", "high moments", etc. then why would they remove a combo with such high potential for big plays, initiations, all-ins, etc. on a champion like Alistar intended to be aggressive? They didnt intend W Q to exists yet it has for years and was a super important thing to master if you play Alister yet now after years we decided this was never suppose to happen and we will break it unlike you know, a patch after this bug was discovered... Riot being full of shit as so often is the case... Also, don't want to nerf Lee before Worlds so lets nerf everything instead. cause that cool and didn't get us yelled at last time right?... right? They did nerf Lee. The attack speed slow on E is removed and shield duration on W is halved. At least it was on the last iteration of PBE. ... Janna got buffed, Kayle got buffed, Kog'maw got buffed, Lux sorta got buffed, and Twitch got buffed.
Actually Kogmaw is getting nerfed, since his base HP is being lowered by 40, so he won't even break even until level 13. And his Q is nerfed early. Yes, I didn't mean that literally everything is getting nerfed. But a lot of stuff is, most noticeably the (arguably) top 3 picks for jungle, support and ADC.
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Sigh, playing like shit today.... 
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On July 22 2014 09:36 Alaric wrote:From the Statikk Q&A regarding Alistar: Show nested quote +3) Alistar
The W+Q combo is something that we never intended to exist, but it's something that Alistar players have gotten used to and is honestly integral to his current balance and gameplay. If we were to revisit him in a Reworks style approach, I think there's a high likelihood that we would remove the combo and instead give him more ways to create situations where he can W enemies into walls to setup a follow-up Q. This is probably a healthier version of his combo, but it's not something we'd do unless we supplemented the kit with ways to function and succeed without the combo. Granted, it's not new, it's exactly they kind of thing they did with Pantheon's ult. But when they're so much about "player satisfaction", "high moments", etc. then why would they remove a combo with such high potential for big plays, initiations, all-ins, etc. on a champion like Alistar intended to be aggressive?
It makes me so sad that he doesn't understand Alistar. W alone is for peel, you only use it to knock people away. W with a combo is for initiation(Ideally AoE). W with Q separately always should be Q first. If you can maneuver to W someone into a wall you can maneuver to Q someone into the air then W them into your team.
They did the same sort of thing when Morello was talking about Alistar changes ages ago. He was complaining about Alitar's heal when Alistar's heal is the only thing that keeps him relevant in lane against the majority of champions.
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On July 22 2014 08:24 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 08:20 Capped wrote:
Hey guys im not one for "unviable" champs (as in i think everything will work in yoloq) but how well does olaf fair in the current meta and recent buffs / nerfs to him? I know he saw some play a few months back, i just havent been following league / him very well. the biggest problem with Olaf is the fact that TP is so strong right now. Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost. Case in point, the last time Olaf was picked up reasonably often post-rework was when Sivir was also very popular and before Teleport got buffed. Baseless speculation: Now that more immobile carries are seeing more play (ie. Kog'maw), it's possible that Olaf will make a resurgence since his lack of a real gap closer isn't as punishing. Still, Sivir not being popular really really hurts him.
Two words, say it with me.
Ghost.
Blade.
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On July 22 2014 11:12 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 08:24 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 08:20 Capped wrote:
Hey guys im not one for "unviable" champs (as in i think everything will work in yoloq) but how well does olaf fair in the current meta and recent buffs / nerfs to him? I know he saw some play a few months back, i just havent been following league / him very well. the biggest problem with Olaf is the fact that TP is so strong right now. Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost. Case in point, the last time Olaf was picked up reasonably often post-rework was when Sivir was also very popular and before Teleport got buffed. Baseless speculation: Now that more immobile carries are seeing more play (ie. Kog'maw), it's possible that Olaf will make a resurgence since his lack of a real gap closer isn't as punishing. Still, Sivir not being popular really really hurts him. Two words, say it with me. Ghost. Blade.
so?
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On July 22 2014 11:16 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 11:12 Gahlo wrote:On July 22 2014 08:24 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 08:20 Capped wrote:
Hey guys im not one for "unviable" champs (as in i think everything will work in yoloq) but how well does olaf fair in the current meta and recent buffs / nerfs to him? I know he saw some play a few months back, i just havent been following league / him very well. the biggest problem with Olaf is the fact that TP is so strong right now. Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost. Case in point, the last time Olaf was picked up reasonably often post-rework was when Sivir was also very popular and before Teleport got buffed. Baseless speculation: Now that more immobile carries are seeing more play (ie. Kog'maw), it's possible that Olaf will make a resurgence since his lack of a real gap closer isn't as punishing. Still, Sivir not being popular really really hurts him. Two words, say it with me. Ghost. Blade. so?
Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost
Buy ghostblade. Have TP. Don't rely on Sivir.
Problem solved.
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On July 22 2014 11:29 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 11:16 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 11:12 Gahlo wrote:On July 22 2014 08:24 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 08:20 Capped wrote:
Hey guys im not one for "unviable" champs (as in i think everything will work in yoloq) but how well does olaf fair in the current meta and recent buffs / nerfs to him? I know he saw some play a few months back, i just havent been following league / him very well. the biggest problem with Olaf is the fact that TP is so strong right now. Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost. Case in point, the last time Olaf was picked up reasonably often post-rework was when Sivir was also very popular and before Teleport got buffed. Baseless speculation: Now that more immobile carries are seeing more play (ie. Kog'maw), it's possible that Olaf will make a resurgence since his lack of a real gap closer isn't as punishing. Still, Sivir not being popular really really hurts him. Two words, say it with me. Ghost. Blade. so? Show nested quote +Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost Buy ghostblade. Have TP. Don't rely on Sivir. Problem solved.
Except you're still gimped in comparison to other popular top laners. Good job, you spent 2.7k gold on an inferior Ghost in order to cover your weaknesses.* Meanwhile, the Jaxes and Shyvanas and Renektons are getting way tankier than you or building better offensive items like Triforce or Bork.
*Yes, ghostblade gives other stats/buffs besides the movespeed boost. But, those stats/buffs are generally inferior to stuff like Bork and Triforce when we're talking about a group of champions that only build 1~2 offensive items.
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When Olaf was kind of popular after the Sivir rework, wasn't he always played in the jungle anyway?
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On July 22 2014 11:40 GolemMadness wrote:
When Olaf was kind of popular after the Sivir rework, wasn't he always played in the jungle anyway?
I think it was a mix.
On July 22 2014 11:33 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 11:29 Gahlo wrote:On July 22 2014 11:16 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 11:12 Gahlo wrote:On July 22 2014 08:24 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 08:20 Capped wrote:
Hey guys im not one for "unviable" champs (as in i think everything will work in yoloq) but how well does olaf fair in the current meta and recent buffs / nerfs to him? I know he saw some play a few months back, i just havent been following league / him very well. the biggest problem with Olaf is the fact that TP is so strong right now. Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost. Case in point, the last time Olaf was picked up reasonably often post-rework was when Sivir was also very popular and before Teleport got buffed. Baseless speculation: Now that more immobile carries are seeing more play (ie. Kog'maw), it's possible that Olaf will make a resurgence since his lack of a real gap closer isn't as punishing. Still, Sivir not being popular really really hurts him. Two words, say it with me. Ghost. Blade. so? Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost Buy ghostblade. Have TP. Don't rely on Sivir. Problem solved. Except you're still gimped in comparison to other popular top laners. Good job, you spent 2.7k gold on an inferior Ghost in order to cover your weaknesses.* Meanwhile, the Jaxes and Shyvanas and Renektons are getting way tankier than you or building better offensive items like Triforce or Bork. *Yes, ghostblade gives other stats/buffs besides the movespeed boost. But, those stats/buffs are generally inferior to stuff like Bork and Triforce when we're talking about a group of champions that only build 1~2 offensive items.
Congrats, you spent 3k+ not fixing your biggest issue and made your champion reliant on a non-flash summoner spell or champion being favored by the meta.
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On July 22 2014 11:40 GolemMadness wrote:
When Olaf was kind of popular after the Sivir rework, wasn't he always played in the jungle anyway?
shurelya was core on him at the time, and you can't really buy it now
er, when he first came back post rework, not sure if he still got one when with Sivir
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How did Janna get buffed?
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On July 22 2014 11:45 Sufficiency wrote:
How did Janna get buffed?
Janna
Howling Gale ( Q ) has been reworded and now specifically mentions how powerful the spell gets as it charges.
Howling Gale ( Q ) maximum knock up time is now 1.25 seconds for full charge up from 1.
Howling Gale ( Q ) cooldown now starts as soon as it is cast.
Tailwind ( Passive ) range increased to 1000 from 800
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On July 22 2014 11:45 Sufficiency wrote:
How did Janna get buffed?
longer knockup time plus shorter cooldown since the cd starts from when the spell is cast, as opposed to when it's released.
On July 22 2014 11:41 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2014 11:33 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 11:29 Gahlo wrote:On July 22 2014 11:16 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 11:12 Gahlo wrote:On July 22 2014 08:24 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 22 2014 08:20 Capped wrote:
Hey guys im not one for "unviable" champs (as in i think everything will work in yoloq) but how well does olaf fair in the current meta and recent buffs / nerfs to him? I know he saw some play a few months back, i just havent been following league / him very well. the biggest problem with Olaf is the fact that TP is so strong right now. Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost. Case in point, the last time Olaf was picked up reasonably often post-rework was when Sivir was also very popular and before Teleport got buffed. Baseless speculation: Now that more immobile carries are seeing more play (ie. Kog'maw), it's possible that Olaf will make a resurgence since his lack of a real gap closer isn't as punishing. Still, Sivir not being popular really really hurts him. Two words, say it with me. Ghost. Blade. so? Olaf really wants to run ghost unless you have a Sivir on your team. The fact that virtually all top laners are forced to run TP means that Olaf loses out on the versatility of having Flash or the mobility he needs from Ghost Buy ghostblade. Have TP. Don't rely on Sivir. Problem solved. Except you're still gimped in comparison to other popular top laners. Good job, you spent 2.7k gold on an inferior Ghost in order to cover your weaknesses.* Meanwhile, the Jaxes and Shyvanas and Renektons are getting way tankier than you or building better offensive items like Triforce or Bork. *Yes, ghostblade gives other stats/buffs besides the movespeed boost. But, those stats/buffs are generally inferior to stuff like Bork and Triforce when we're talking about a group of champions that only build 1~2 offensive items. Congrats, you spent 3k+ not fixing your biggest issue and made your champion reliant on a non-flash summoner spell or champion being favored by the meta.
are you arguing against yourself?
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EPT
